Guild Wars 2

Procession of Blades

Well of Suffering

PoB has a shorter cooldown (by 10 seconds)
PoB can hit unlimited numebr of enemies (WoS only 5)
PoB has almost double the ticks
PoB has better scaling
Same AOE

It deals way more damage, has shorter cooldown, and is just better?

Am I missing something?

You conveniently forgot to mention that Well of Sufferring is unblockable.

Spartacus.3192:

You conveniently forgot to mention that Well of Sufferring is unblockable.

Lol yeah because WoS is completely deleting people all the time XD

Get real man.

Your type are why this game will never be balanced. The people who enjoy imbalance and abuse it.

There are enough differences between the two skills that I’d call this a false analogy (aka apples and oranges).

This is bad comparison, they are completely different mechanics besides being AoE. Real favoritism is thief/range traps vs DH traps comparison. But it is nothing new really – elite vs core zzzzz.

TheDevice.2751:

Spartacus.3192:

You conveniently forgot to mention that Well of Sufferring is unblockable.

Lol yeah because WoS is completely deleting people all the time XD

Get real man.

Your type are why this game will never be balanced. The people who enjoy imbalance and abuse it.

And if you are dying to Procession of Blades then its a L2P issue. Meta build doesnt even take that trap and hasn’t for a long time.

You’re the type of people that QQ everytime they die in pvp and want every other class nerfed except the one they play.

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

That comparing one skill in isolation is generally pretty meaningless, that is not how design / balance works.

And beyond that comparing something that got added as part of an elite to a vanilla skill is often going to be pretty pointless given the elite stuff seems to be powercreeped by design.

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Like saying Signet of

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

How is it apples and oranges?

You’re just using that saying as if it applies just because. Its two aoe skills with ticks that do damage.

Comparing like signet of the locust with pob is comparing apples and oranges. Do you know what the saying “apples and oranges” means?

By your example, nothing is comparable. At all. Ever.

Well of suffering is also a dark field, which can lead to either blinds or lifesteals making it a much stronger defensive option. Plus, it can be traited for support aspects like granting protection to allies. While PoB when traited is more control based with its daze.

What people are saying is true, you are definitely comparing the wrong skills to prove your point of favoritism for elite professions.

Who uses Well of Suffering?

Spartacus.3192:

And if you are dying to Procession of Blades then its a L2P issue. Meta build doesnt even take that trap and hasn’t for a long time.

You’re the type of people that QQ everytime they die in pvp and want every other class nerfed except the one they play.

1. That’s an irrelevant strawman. I never said anything about meta or it being overpowered or anything. Besides, if thats your argument, I can say the same for WoS. WoS is also not meta.

2. Whoever said anything about Guards getting nerfed. You obviously play guard and are the type of person who jumps to conclusions being overly defensive thinking any criticism involving their class means nerfs for their class.

DrEckers.2039:

Well of suffering is also a dark field, which can lead to either blinds or lifesteals making it a much stronger defensive option. Plus, it can be traited for support aspects like granting protection to allies. While PoB when traited is more control based with its daze.

What people are saying is true, you are definitely comparing the wrong skills to prove your point of favoritism for elite professions.

no. I don’t get how they are so different. They’re different skills, obviously, but they are similar enough to warrant comparison.

Does anyone know what “apples and oranges” means?

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Like saying Signet of

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

How is it apples and oranges?

You’re just using that saying as if it applies just because. Its two aoe skills with ticks that do damage.

Comparing like signet of the locust with pob is comparing apples and oranges. Do you know what the saying “apples and oranges” means?

By your example, nothing is comparable. At all. Ever.

Because Guardians and Necros are very different classes, so adding a skill of one type is very strong for them, while adding the exact same skill to another class makes no improvement.

By my example, you don’t balance a game or define balance by comparing tool tips, but you can compare classes when you consider the factors that make a class strong or weak. You just don’t make drastic oversimplifications and then dramatic overarching conclusions from them. You think critically and consider as much as you can to make a smart decision.

Guys come on we ALL know that Dragon Hunters are clearly the favorite class in this game, they are so unbelievably OP it’s stupid, zero counter play to this class they need to nerf all the damage by 20%.

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Like saying Signet of

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

How is it apples and oranges?

You’re just using that saying as if it applies just because. Its two aoe skills with ticks that do damage.

Comparing like signet of the locust with pob is comparing apples and oranges. Do you know what the saying “apples and oranges” means?

By your example, nothing is comparable. At all. Ever.

Because Guardians and Necros are very different classes, so adding a skill of one type is very strong for them, while adding the exact same skill to another class makes no improvement.

By my example, you don’t balance a game or define balance by comparing tool tips, but you can compare classes when you consider the factors that make a class strong or weak. You just don’t make drastic oversimplifications and then dramatic overarching conclusions from them. You think critically and consider as much as you can to make a smart decision.

Nope. I don;t get what you’re saying in this example. I get what you’re saying essentially and essentially its correct. You just don’t think I’ve thought that far.

Give necro a PoB skill. You think it wouln’t be better than WoS?

Thats ridiculous. Even reading up somebody asks, “who uses WoS, anyway.”

Exactly. Not even necro’s use it because its not good. It’s not that hard to think about. You’re making excuses just to make excuses.

PoB > WoS

A child could see which is better. A child.

And sure, take into account being traited. PoB is still better off.

TheDevice.2751:

Spartacus.3192:

And if you are dying to Procession of Blades then its a L2P issue. Meta build doesnt even take that trap and hasn’t for a long time.

You’re the type of people that QQ everytime they die in pvp and want every other class nerfed except the one they play.

2. Whoever said anything about Guards getting nerfed. You obviously play guard and are the type of person who jumps to conclusions being overly defensive thinking any criticism involving their class means nerfs for their class.

I actually play 4 different classes in pvp (Scrapper, Rev, War, DH). DH being the one i play the least especially Season 3. If one class gets nerfed i can always play one of the others. So sorry, try again.

dannyteo.5864:

Guys come on we ALL know that Dragon Hunters are clearly the favorite class in this game, they are so unbelievably OP it’s stupid, zero counter play to this class they need to nerf all the damage by 20%.

They also need their health and sustain reduced.

Spartacus.3192:

I actually play 4 different classes in pvp (Scrapper, Rev, War, DH). DH being the one i play the least especially Season 3. If one class gets nerfed i can always play one of the others. So sorry, try again.

Nothing I said didn’t make sense.
- You admit you play guard
- I never said anything about Gaurds getting nerfed.
- You claimed I want to see other classes (in this case guard) getting nerfed

The only one trying is you.

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Like saying Signet of

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

How is it apples and oranges?

You’re just using that saying as if it applies just because. Its two aoe skills with ticks that do damage.

Comparing like signet of the locust with pob is comparing apples and oranges. Do you know what the saying “apples and oranges” means?

By your example, nothing is comparable. At all. Ever.

Because Guardians and Necros are very different classes, so adding a skill of one type is very strong for them, while adding the exact same skill to another class makes no improvement.

By my example, you don’t balance a game or define balance by comparing tool tips, but you can compare classes when you consider the factors that make a class strong or weak. You just don’t make drastic oversimplifications and then dramatic overarching conclusions from them. You think critically and consider as much as you can to make a smart decision.

Nope. I don;t get what you’re saying in this example. I get what you’re saying essentially and essentially its correct. You just don’t think I’ve thought that far.

Give necro a PoB skill. You think it wouln’t be better than WoS?

Thats ridiculous. Even reading up somebody asks, “who uses WoS, anyway.”

Exactly. Not even necro’s use it because its not good. It’s not that hard to think about. You’re making excuses just to make excuses.

PoB > WoS

A child could see which is better. A child.

And sure, take into account being traited. PoB is still better off.

I think a lot of people have said enough, and that if you can’t grasp what others have said here than you are way too close-minded and immature to understand that your opinion is not always equivalent to fact. Yes, PoB may be better in isolation compared to WoS, but you need to take the entire context (that is, the rest of the profession) into account. How you even suggest that this indicates favouritism is just simply baffling.

Here’s an analogy that you’ll maybe understand. If you don’t, then I’m just lost:

You (let’s say you’re Bob) and Johnny are going to school one day and it’s lunch time. You both open your lunchboxes, eagerly awaiting to eat the juicy grapes that both your mothers packed in today. Unfortunately, Johnny has more grapes than you, and they appear a more luscious purple! How undeserving! But wait! Your mother has packed in a delicious turkey sandwich where Johnny only has a leftover lunchable. In addition , you have the batman lunchbox whereas Johnny has a paperbag. It all evens out!

Aeroxe.8140:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Like saying Signet of

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

How is it apples and oranges?

You’re just using that saying as if it applies just because. Its two aoe skills with ticks that do damage.

Comparing like signet of the locust with pob is comparing apples and oranges. Do you know what the saying “apples and oranges” means?

By your example, nothing is comparable. At all. Ever.

Because Guardians and Necros are very different classes, so adding a skill of one type is very strong for them, while adding the exact same skill to another class makes no improvement.

By my example, you don’t balance a game or define balance by comparing tool tips, but you can compare classes when you consider the factors that make a class strong or weak. You just don’t make drastic oversimplifications and then dramatic overarching conclusions from them. You think critically and consider as much as you can to make a smart decision.

Nope. I don;t get what you’re saying in this example. I get what you’re saying essentially and essentially its correct. You just don’t think I’ve thought that far.

Give necro a PoB skill. You think it wouln’t be better than WoS?

Thats ridiculous. Even reading up somebody asks, “who uses WoS, anyway.”

Exactly. Not even necro’s use it because its not good. It’s not that hard to think about. You’re making excuses just to make excuses.

PoB > WoS

A child could see which is better. A child.

And sure, take into account being traited. PoB is still better off.

I think a lot of people have said enough, and that if you can’t grasp what others have said here than you are way too close-minded and immature to understand that your opinion is not always equivalent to fact. Yes, PoB may be better in isolation compared to WoS, but you need to take the entire context (that is, the rest of the profession) into account. How you even suggest that this indicates favouritism is just simply baffling.

Here’s an analogy that you’ll maybe understand. If you don’t, then I’m just lost:

You (let’s say you’re Bob) and Johnny are going to school one day and it’s lunch time. You both open your lunchboxes, eagerly awaiting to eat the juicy grapes that both your mothers packed in today. Unfortunately, Johnny has more grapes than you, and they appear a more luscious purple! How undeserving! But wait! Your mother has packed in a delicious turkey sandwich where Johnny only has a leftover lunchable. In addition , you have the batman lunchbox whereas Johnny has a paperbag. It all evens out!

Okay fine. Good. All that is good stuff theoretically.

now, explain to me exactly how PoB is just as good as WoS.

In what ways are Necro’s benefiting from WoS as equally as Guards are benefiting from PoB?

TheDevice.2751:

Aeroxe.8140:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Like saying Signet of

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

How is it apples and oranges?

You’re just using that saying as if it applies just because. Its two aoe skills with ticks that do damage.

Comparing like signet of the locust with pob is comparing apples and oranges. Do you know what the saying “apples and oranges” means?

By your example, nothing is comparable. At all. Ever.

Because Guardians and Necros are very different classes, so adding a skill of one type is very strong for them, while adding the exact same skill to another class makes no improvement.

By my example, you don’t balance a game or define balance by comparing tool tips, but you can compare classes when you consider the factors that make a class strong or weak. You just don’t make drastic oversimplifications and then dramatic overarching conclusions from them. You think critically and consider as much as you can to make a smart decision.

Nope. I don;t get what you’re saying in this example. I get what you’re saying essentially and essentially its correct. You just don’t think I’ve thought that far.

Give necro a PoB skill. You think it wouln’t be better than WoS?

Thats ridiculous. Even reading up somebody asks, “who uses WoS, anyway.”

Exactly. Not even necro’s use it because its not good. It’s not that hard to think about. You’re making excuses just to make excuses.

PoB > WoS

A child could see which is better. A child.

And sure, take into account being traited. PoB is still better off.

I think a lot of people have said enough, and that if you can’t grasp what others have said here than you are way too close-minded and immature to understand that your opinion is not always equivalent to fact. Yes, PoB may be better in isolation compared to WoS, but you need to take the entire context (that is, the rest of the profession) into account. How you even suggest that this indicates favouritism is just simply baffling.

Here’s an analogy that you’ll maybe understand. If you don’t, then I’m just lost:

You (let’s say you’re Bob) and Johnny are going to school one day and it’s lunch time. You both open your lunchboxes, eagerly awaiting to eat the juicy grapes that both your mothers packed in today. Unfortunately, Johnny has more grapes than you, and they appear a more luscious purple! How undeserving! But wait! Your mother has packed in a delicious turkey sandwich where Johnny only has a leftover lunchable. In addition , you have the batman lunchbox whereas Johnny has a paperbag. It all evens out!

Okay fine. Good. All that is good stuff theoretically.

now, explain to me exactly how PoB is just as good as WoS.

In what ways are Necro’s benefiting from WoS as equally as Guards are benefiting from PoB?

You really don’t seem to get it and I think we’re all running out of ways to explain it to you.

It doesn’t kittening matter whether PoB or WoS are better than each other.

Keep asking bad questions and you’ll never find a good answer.

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Aeroxe.8140:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

TheDevice.2751:

Am I missing something?

Pretty much everything else involved in those two professions as well as how other professions affect them.

Like saying Signet of

Those skills aren’t used in a vacuum.

You’re blatantly comparing apples to oranges and even if this was the source of an imbalance (it’s not), then you’d still be making a really cynical stretch to assume the intentions of the developers behind such balance in claiming “favoritism”.

How is it apples and oranges?

You’re just using that saying as if it applies just because. Its two aoe skills with ticks that do damage.

Comparing like signet of the locust with pob is comparing apples and oranges. Do you know what the saying “apples and oranges” means?

By your example, nothing is comparable. At all. Ever.

Because Guardians and Necros are very different classes, so adding a skill of one type is very strong for them, while adding the exact same skill to another class makes no improvement.

By my example, you don’t balance a game or define balance by comparing tool tips, but you can compare classes when you consider the factors that make a class strong or weak. You just don’t make drastic oversimplifications and then dramatic overarching conclusions from them. You think critically and consider as much as you can to make a smart decision.

Nope. I don;t get what you’re saying in this example. I get what you’re saying essentially and essentially its correct. You just don’t think I’ve thought that far.

Give necro a PoB skill. You think it wouln’t be better than WoS?

Thats ridiculous. Even reading up somebody asks, “who uses WoS, anyway.”

Exactly. Not even necro’s use it because its not good. It’s not that hard to think about. You’re making excuses just to make excuses.

PoB > WoS

A child could see which is better. A child.

And sure, take into account being traited. PoB is still better off.

I think a lot of people have said enough, and that if you can’t grasp what others have said here than you are way too close-minded and immature to understand that your opinion is not always equivalent to fact. Yes, PoB may be better in isolation compared to WoS, but you need to take the entire context (that is, the rest of the profession) into account. How you even suggest that this indicates favouritism is just simply baffling.

Here’s an analogy that you’ll maybe understand. If you don’t, then I’m just lost:

You (let’s say you’re Bob) and Johnny are going to school one day and it’s lunch time. You both open your lunchboxes, eagerly awaiting to eat the juicy grapes that both your mothers packed in today. Unfortunately, Johnny has more grapes than you, and they appear a more luscious purple! How undeserving! But wait! Your mother has packed in a delicious turkey sandwich where Johnny only has a leftover lunchable. In addition , you have the batman lunchbox whereas Johnny has a paperbag. It all evens out!

Okay fine. Good. All that is good stuff theoretically.

now, explain to me exactly how PoB is just as good as WoS.

In what ways are Necro’s benefiting from WoS as equally as Guards are benefiting from PoB?

You really don’t seem to get it and I think we’re all running out of ways to explain it to you.

It doesn’t kittening matter whether PoB or WoS are better than each other.

Keep asking bad questions and you’ll never find a good answer.

Dahkeus.8243:

You really don’t seem to get it and I think we’re all running out of ways to explain it to you.

It doesn’t kittening matter whether PoB or WoS are better than each other.

Keep asking bad questions and you’ll never find a good answer.

If a necro had a skill that was a peanut and threw it on the ground and it did nothing it would still be balanced if the necro had another skill that killed every enemy on the map equally. This is the balance you speak of. Oh, I get it.

What I don’t get is why you can’t explain the specifics of how WoB is balanced in the Necromancer class compared to how PoB is balanced in the Guard/DH class.

Go ahead I’ll hear ya out.

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

You really don’t seem to get it and I think we’re all running out of ways to explain it to you.

It doesn’t kittening matter whether PoB or WoS are better than each other.

Keep asking bad questions and you’ll never find a good answer.

If a necro had a skill that was a peanut and threw it on the ground and it did nothing it would still be balanced if the necro had another skill that killed every enemy on the map equally. This is the balance you speak of. Oh, I get it.

What I don’t get is why you can’t explain the specifics of how WoB is balanced in the Necromancer class compared to how PoB is balanced in the Guard/DH class.

Go ahead I’ll hear ya out.

First, there are so many things that it would be impossible to compare everything. Essentially, what you’re asking is why guardian might be better than necro, or vice versa.
But let’s try this out.

PoB
-Massive animation, easy to see
-Is a trap, requires people to walk over it first and can only be put under your feet. Dragonhunter is a longrange class…contradiction.
-Traited traps requires losing much more powerful traits.

WoS
-Being unblockable is so freaking good. Like very good.
-Necro is much stronger in the meta right now than guardian (sustain, damage, mobility)
-Traited wells requires not much sacrifice in terms of traits, but why are you going death magic in the first place…?

TheDevice.2751:

Dahkeus.8243:

You really don’t seem to get it and I think we’re all running out of ways to explain it to you.

It doesn’t kittening matter whether PoB or WoS are better than each other.

Keep asking bad questions and you’ll never find a good answer.

If a necro had a skill that was a peanut and threw it on the ground and it did nothing it would still be balanced if the necro had another skill that killed every enemy on the map equally. This is the balance you speak of. Oh, I get it.

What I don’t get is why you can’t explain the specifics of how WoB is balanced in the Necromancer class compared to how PoB is balanced in the Guard/DH class.

Go ahead I’ll hear ya out.

Because a full zerker nec with 100% crit chance can unblockable bomb you from range while guard cant, for example. Nec and guardian have different mechanics, and so skills are balanced differently.

Ones big damage, the other is slightly less damage with a ton of utility behind it.

WoS gives us vul on the hostiles and a dark-field for allies.
Traited we also get oncall protection for allies and siphons for myself.
Unblockable
Ground Targeted

Compared to, big damage and fury… That’s it. And don’t forget you cast it at your feet, not at 900 range.

Assuming your enemies have half a brain cell and get out of both you leave a far more lasting effect with WoS. Vulnerability, a leftover dark field to spin in and protection on your allies.

Really not seeing the OP’s issue.

Aeroxe.8140:

PoB
-Massive animation, easy to see
-Is a trap, requires people to walk over it first and can only be put under your feet. Dragonhunter is a longrange class…contradiction.
-Traited traps requires losing much more powerful traits.

You seem to like to only bring up the negatives with PoB.. which reallly arent negatives to anyone who’s ever played this game. I’m sensing bias

PoB
- Massive animation, same as WoS
- Is a trap. It doesn’t require you to be there for activation
Dragonhunter is a longrange class…correlates (plus you’re not required to use elite spec weapon)
- Traited. Same goes for nearly every traited type

WoS
-Being unblockable is so freaking good. Like very good.
-Necro is much stronger in the meta right now than guardian (sustain, damage, mobility)
-Traited wells requires not much sacrifice in terms of traits, but why are you going death magic in the first place…?

Wow you sound like Donald Trump the way you boast about WoS. I can’t imagine there could be anything wrong with it.

- Unblockable is great. Its also easy to avoid like you said above. But its so good… nobody uses WoS.
- Necro is much stronger in the meta right now…. What? And are those meta necro builds all ploping out WoS? no? then why bring up meta?
- Traited wells. Why go death magic anyways right? A whole trait line apparently is garbage.

I fail to see how this helps your argument…

WereDragon.6083:

As a necro main since launch. Not seeing the issue here. PoB requires getting up nice and snuggly close, the only secondary benefit aside from the straight damage would be the fury.

A well-specced reaper is going to drop protection on his buddies, Siphon for me, apply vul for the entire team for extra damage, provide a dark field and to top it all off it’s a ground-target, meaning I can hover back, out of danger and pop wells all day!

Really not seeing the issue here ones big damage and not much else, the other has alot of utility and safety attached to it. If you’re focusing entirely on damage WoS is indeed lacking, but vul, siphon on call protection and targetable range, not even delving into the Dark Field honestly makes WoS more useful in my opinion.

I mean hell, in retrospec the on call protection can save allies from a PoB if I decide to drop it on an triggered PoB

Oooh, and I can life-siphon in it with reaper 4

And it’s unblockable.

Yeah honestly PoB looks like it needs a buff in comparison. XD

Do you know the actual life siphon numbers you get from dark fields? Are you just saying life siphon as if its the magic word of the day? That reaper 4 just bought you like.. 400 health. Congrats.

Seriously.

Btw. After you do your saving lives WoS onto the PoB (if your WoS is even up by then) The same guard will most likely be putting down another PoB 10 seconds before you’re WoS is back up. Hows that gonna end?

Vuln can be transferred, removed, and flipped.

PoB can only be blocked.

TheDevice.2751:

Aeroxe.8140:

PoB
-Massive animation, easy to see
-Is a trap, requires people to walk over it first and can only be put under your feet. Dragonhunter is a longrange class…contradiction.
-Traited traps requires losing much more powerful traits.

You seem to like to only bring up the negatives with PoB.. which reallly arent negatives to anyone who’s ever played this game. I’m sensing bias

PoB
- Massive animation, same as WoS
- Is a trap. It doesn’t require you to be there for activation
Dragonhunter is a longrange class…correlates (plus you’re not required to use elite spec weapon)
- Traited. Same goes for nearly every traited type

WoS
-Being unblockable is so freaking good. Like very good.
-Necro is much stronger in the meta right now than guardian (sustain, damage, mobility)
-Traited wells requires not much sacrifice in terms of traits, but why are you going death magic in the first place…?

Wow you sound like Donald Trump the way you boast about WoS. I can’t imagine there could be anything wrong with it.

- Unblockable is great. Its also easy to avoid like you said above. But its so good… nobody uses WoS.
- Necro is much stronger in the meta right now…. What? And are those meta necro builds all ploping out WoS? no? then why bring up meta?
- Traited wells. Why go death magic anyways right? A whole trait line apparently is garbage.

I fail to see how this helps your argument…

Please stop assuming that people are biased just because they disagree with you, which is a common pattern in your posts. The only reason why I went into the negatives of PoB was because your post already made it clear that you knew the advantages. In addition, it helps my argument, which is to state that skills need to be considered in the context of the professions as wholes.

I don’t see how I made any reference to any political views or figures. Stating that I sound like a political figure seems unnecesssary in objectively criticizing a post. It’s borderline insulting to some posters, and I advise that we stick to the game.

I literally just stated that there are negatives to PoB in that it is contradictory to the emphasis on long range of DH. Please read my posts clearly before hurriedly writing a post to counter mine.
You also mentioned “which reallly arent negatives to anyone who’s ever played this game. I’m sensing bias”. They are negatives, and stating that it’s obvious to anyone that’s ever played this game is offensive to those that really haven’t. I don’t mean to pull the esports card, but let me state that I’ve played this game since beta winning multiple tournaments and in both season 1 and 2 of proleague. You can google my esl account if my words are insufficient.

TheDevice.2751:

DrEckers.2039:

Well of suffering is also a dark field, which can lead to either blinds or lifesteals making it a much stronger defensive option. Plus, it can be traited for support aspects like granting protection to allies. While PoB when traited is more control based with its daze.

What people are saying is true, you are definitely comparing the wrong skills to prove your point of favoritism for elite professions.

no. I don’t get how they are so different. They’re different skills, obviously, but they are similar enough to warrant comparison.

Does anyone know what “apples and oranges” means?

It’s an analogy that most educated folk are familiar with. Point is you’re comparing two very different skills which serve different roles. Also, even IF your argument had a solid basis, you’re comparing a HoT skill to a non HoT skill. It’s already very apparent that elite specs are far more overturned than core and does not prove that ANET favors guard.

Better question why are you using wells in pvp?

I think the catalyst underneath the OP’s post is that he’s kittened off about Power Well Necromancers not working in meta and he perceives the issue as wells not having enough damage. I could be wrong! but when putting 2 & 2 together, it certainly appears as much.

If this is the case, lemme tell ya, the damage on the wells have little to do with why Power Well Necromancers don’t stand up in meta.

In addition to what other’s have explained to you already about “comparing apples & oranges” and “only looking at the single aspect of DPS while ignoring other aspects of the skill” I’d like to point out that a Berserker Reaper casting warhorn #5, laying down double wells and then spinning to win with reaper shroud #4 is far far more AoE DPS in a single spike than what the DH is capable of. Don’t believe me? Go run some tests on golems. At any rate, the point is that Necromancers are AoE DPS machines and don’t even need utility attacks to match or exceed the AoE DPS of a DH. DH’s were given strop traps because it’s kind of the only AoE DPS they even have anymore.

Let’s get this troll thread to page 2. Go go go.

On a more serious note, I think everyone in this thread has very nicely shown that comparing 2 skills while omitting outside factors and context to class is useless and misleading.

Now my question is, could it be that TC is practicing favorism himself? Just a couple of posts down we get this gem:

TheDevice.2751:

Each class has their disadvantages

Guards have low HP

“Virtues have been said to help balance the guardian; for example, they have a lower base health than the warrior profession but compensate for this with their higher health regeneration granted by Virtue of Resolve.” – from Gw2 wiki

Ele’s have low HP

“They also have the lowest base health in comparison to other professions, so they have to make up for their lack of durability under fire by managing their attunements and skills carefully and avoid putting themselves in dangerous situations. They also are very versatile, able to easily adopt a support or damage role.”

Mesmers have low HP

- They essentially make up for that with high mobiliy, stealth and clones.

Engineer has high recharge times on their skills

With an kitten nal of turrets and kits, the engineer can also become quite durable when properly prepared. However, this is somewhat offset by the long recharge times of their abilities.

And so on..

Now for the Necromancers it’s nothing but good news.

“Necromancers gather Life Force from nearby deaths that allows them to transform into Death Shroud which gives them access to different set of skills and enables them to use life force instead of their health.

Necromancers have more health than other scholars; they not only are able to extend that health through the use of the Death Shroud, but also possess a wide variety of life stealing abilities, meaning the necromancer can potentially be a very sturdy profession. The necromancer is also great at inflicting debilitating or damaging conditions on enemies as well as removing conditions from allies and boons from enemies.

Necromancers also prominently make use of fear — a removable condition that forces the enemy to flee directly away from the caster for a short period of time."

Overcompensating much?

The truth is, they let out two incredible important facts about the necromancer
1. They are only viable with conditions.
2. They are slow as the slowest things to ever be slow

Being slow is a HUGE drawback in pvp. We’re talking PvP here. Even in the “world of kungkitten speed determines the victor”.

The same can very easily be applied to this game or nearly any game out there.

Some say, “well necro’s have better sticking power. They’re able to keep their enemies near them longer”

In what world? As far as I can tell, every other class is well equipped to do just the exact opposite; avoid getting cc’d as much as possible.

So these perks cancel each other out. This means… Necro is left being slow.

Now again, not a huge problem if you’re just playing with your conditions. You just stand there in one spot just facerolling your keyboard until the enemy dies. Boring, unfun, and dull. All meaning the same thing but idc.

Its a sad way to play and a frustrating thing as well considering this game marketed itself has having dynamic professions. Letting you do you when it comes to building your character. Which, lets face it, is true. You can do you. However, again, they just so happened to leave out another little fact: you CAN play these builds… but they suck; which is pretty much anet consolidating the professions into very specific roles.

Necromancer = No mobility. Lots of conditions. Lots of health. The durr profession.
Mesmer = Lots of mobility. Lots of flashyness. Lots of utility. Lots of damage. Lots of love.
Elementalist = Lots of mobility. Lots of aoe damage. Lots of stun breaks and evasion. Lots of killing.
Engineer = Lots of sustain. Lots of durability. Lots of CC. Lots of damage. Plenty of mobility. Plenty of condition damage builds. Plenty of power builds. Plenty of plenty. High cooldowns on their 20 million abilities.

It just doesn’t seem right.

Why are necro’s forced to play such a boring role becuase their lack of mobility is not compensated for.

Why isn’t Necro littered with Quickness buffs to counterbalance their overly sluggish ways?

doesn’t make sense to me.

From his thread Why necro’s are not treated fairly. We get it, you feel your favorite class is being treated unfairly and are lashing out and grasping for weak comparisons. Unfortunately the one thing you are complaining about seems to be exactly the reason you are refusing to accept the arguments brought up in this thread.

I’ll explain why this comparison is stupid. And by the way I main necro and my team had scrimmaged and beat a few pro league teams, so consider me experienced.

This is like me asking why does thief dagger auto attacks deal more damage than necro dagger auto attacks? Why does ranger staff have a mobility skill? We should all have staff mobility skills. Why does mesmer staff have an aoe field? We should all have aoe fields.

“This game is all about favortism. I also have no idea what im talking about” this is what you sound like.

Necro wells are utility effects, typically used for the condis, boons, or life steal they apply not for their straight up damage potential.

Guardian traps only function in life is to hit things hard.

guys , why stop at two profesions ? lets compare all traps ! come one where are the thief and ranger players that play with traps ?! im sure you guys are not happy with your traps !

Is it too late to compare Guardian Spirit Weapons to Necromancer Minions?

dannyteo.5864:

Guys come on we ALL know that Dragon Hunters are clearly the favorite class in this game, they are so unbelievably OP it’s stupid, zero counter play to this class they need to nerf all the damage by 20%.

WTF???

They aren’t even meta, how can they be OP?

OP is a noob. Seriously, I’m not sure if he’s a noob, stupid or a troll. But based on his replies, pretty sure he’s stupid + noob.

Look, if you don’t get what the others are telling/explaining to you, go play some more and test some more.

When you #gitgud or once you #gitgud. Go back to this piece of trash thread that you made and laugh at your stupidity.

Shylock.4653:

dannyteo.5864:

Guys come on we ALL know that Dragon Hunters are clearly the favorite class in this game, they are so unbelievably OP it’s stupid, zero counter play to this class they need to nerf all the damage by 20%.

WTF???

They aren’t even meta, how can they be OP?

Shylock.4653, it was a joke, danny was being ironic .. Dh is the most easy class to be defeated.

WoS is also a target skill, and you don’t need to go into a specilization just to be able to run it.

This thread is basically the most kittened one I’ve read on gw2 in the past.
To sum everything up:
- WoS has 900 cast range and has a half of the cast time than PoB, making it almost impossible to interrupt
- PoB requires you to go vulnerable range, when not in defense
- WoS has the potential to pulse 12 Stacks of Vulnerability on 5 enemies
- PoB instead grants fury to the DH
- PoB does remarkable higher damage than WoS, but as every DH trap PoB is predictable and there are tons of skills to completly avoid it
- WoS can’t be blocked for that, can be avoided by standing outside
- WoS offers a Dark field for 6 seconds

As you can see and hardly deny, one is an AOE ranged utility, the other one is a close range trap with primary damage purpose.

You could have also asked why is hundred blades dealing 10 times more dmg than Death Spiral? Both are GS skills on the 3rd slot, must be huge balance problem!

necros have a shout that summons minions by every target affected

give guards a shout that summons 5 spirit hammers and we’ll talk about DH traps vs necro wells.