Guild Wars 2

My “main” is a necromancer. We have, 1/2sec fear to 1 character only.

Then I tried the Elementalist, and they can walk wherever they want for a short time… WTF?!
Another profession have an AOE stun(idk wich). Makes no sense.

I suggest that in sPvP, al the professions in downed state need to have the exact Skill Set because if this pretend to be an eSport, Balance is the most important thing.

The only problem I find with the ‘downed’ state in PvP (structured or otherwise) is that only ONE enemy has to die for multiple ‘downed’ players to rally.

It should be a 1 for 1 IMO

marianitten.1247:

My “main” is a necromancer. We have, 1/2sec fear to 1 character only.

Then I tried the Elementalist, and they can walk wherever they want for a short time… WTF?!

I suggest that in sPvP, al the professions in downed state need to have the exact Skill Set because if this pretend to be an eSport, Balance is the most important thing.

really… elementalist… ELEMENTALIST… they have the worst downstate E V E R… you could have picked like mesmer or thief

Random rallies at the last second seriously kitten me off, its the most anticlimactic mechanic in existance like omygod i just beat him and now im dying with no way to stop him why is this happening just because some heartseeker spammer ally glass cannon died instantly i want my glory so bad and now this happens i cant stand this anymore seriously.

Personally i want it removed..as it causes some weird and sometimes simply unfair situations and its wildly imbalanced between classes, in most cases a good downed only adding to an already strong class. But i guess its an anti-burst mechanic so it isnt going anywhere. I LOVE it in PvE.

Btw Ele has the worst downed, we’d choose a 1 person fear over what we have now trust me dude. But about everyone having the same downed abilities, im all for that for the sake of balance. Even though i’d rather just have it be gone.

oh and wtf quickness while stomping just no guys, NO. Bad Arenanet!

Sanis.1096:

really… elementalist… ELEMENTALIST… they have the worst downstate E V E R… you could have picked like mesmer or thief

Vapor Form -> Assume a mobile, vaporous form, returning to a downed state when the effect ends.

That may save your life if you are attacked by 2 or more enemies.

But we have:

Fear > Make your foe flee in fear.

One fear, to one foe. You are still exposed anyway. There is no way you could survive more than 1 attack.

If Ele have the worst downed stated.. idk what we have.

Thief dont have strong downstate skills lol… 1 teleport and 1 stealth (where he stay at same place). Most OP:

Mesmers- clones, teleporting, stealth… just wtf is this.
Warrior- knock down for 1 target, instant stand and 15s for kill target (before self death)
Guardian- mass AOE Push back, life drain

I have been bringing the same idea since beta. Neutral downed skills.

Kaim.7125:

Thief dont have strong downstate skills lol… 1 teleport and 1 stealth (where he stay at same place). Most OP:

Mesmers- clones, teleporting, stealth… just wtf is this.
Warrior- knock down for 1 target, instant stand and 15s for kill target (before self death)
Guardian- mass AOE Push back, life drain

Yes, but you have 1 stealth. That add seconds to your life, and is a HUGE difference.
There is no way that a necromancer survive if he is attacked more than 1 enemy. NO WAY.

marianitten.1247:

Sanis.1096:

really… elementalist… ELEMENTALIST… they have the worst downstate E V E R… you could have picked like mesmer or thief

Vapor Form -> Assume a mobile, vaporous form, returning to a downed state when the effect ends.

That may save your life if you are attacked by 2 or more enemies.

But we have:

Fear > Make your foe flee in fear.

One fear, to one foe. You are still exposed anyway. There is no way you could survive more than 1 attack.

If Ele have the worst downed stated.. idk what we have.

Check what nr ability they are. Check how long it takes for Mist form to come up, and your fear to come up.

I understand your confusion, as nobody plays ele in 8v8. And neither did you..

Ele’s take 9 sec before they can use vapor form. If someone can’t F-inish them within 9 sec they have bigger problems than downed states.

Thief and Mesmer downed state aren’t really all that either. They do basically what all downed states should do. Buy you a little time.

Vengeance is the only downed ability I have issue with. I just downed the kittener, why is he back up again? It’s counterintuitive to the entire mechanic.

edit: in regards to theif and mesmer downed states – it is a bit ridiculous when you’re teleport can put you on an entirely different z-axis. I was downed as a mesmer a couple times and used my #2 downed ability only to find myself on the other side of a wall on top of of hill well away from where anyone would find. I had a good laugh at that everytime it happened.

336862

Check what nr ability they are. Check how long it takes for Mist form to come up, and your fear to come up.
I understand your confusion, as nobody plays ele in 8v8.

The CD is not the problem. If you have the skill ready, and you are downed by 2 enemies. And you could be saved if you cand stand 2 seconds more.

Ele survives.
Thief survives.
Guardian survives.
Necro no.

That is not balanced.

hackks.3687:

Thief and Mesmer downed state aren’t really all that either. They do basically what all downed states should do. Buy you a little time.

Thats a good point actually. The problem is that it doesnt fit to give everyone a teleport. Even though i think that’d be the best and most fun solution. I think knockbacks are a little too lame, so are self resses (engis can do this too), and that necro’s single target and ele’s nothingatall.jpg needs to affect multiple people like teleports and knockbacks do.

GankSinatra.2653:

hackks.3687:

Thief and Mesmer downed state aren’t really all that either. They do basically what all downed states should do. Buy you a little time.

Thats a good point actually. The problem is that it doesnt fit to give everyone a teleport. Even though i think that’d be the best and most fun solution. I think knockbacks are a little too lame, so are self resses (engis can do this too), and that necro’s single target and ele’s nothingatall.jpg needs to affect multiple people like teleports and knockbacks do.

So.. we agree that in sPvP all the professions need the EXACT skill set?

So.. we agree that in sPvP all the professions need the EXACT skill set?

marianitten.1247:

336862

Check what nr ability they are. Check how long it takes for Mist form to come up, and your fear to come up.
I understand your confusion, as nobody plays ele in 8v8.

The CD is not the problem. If you have the skill ready, and you are downed by 2 enemies.
.

Im sorry but i cant make it any clearer than that. If you dont think the cooldown matters when it most certainly does, i dont know what to tell you.

I also already agreed with you if you would read more carefully.
You’re a bit…. i’ll just leave this thread now. Just got my posting priviliges back : D

Should make Fear from Necro AoE.

Ele should have an ice ability that freezes enemies or freezes themselves and makes them immune to being finished for a few seconds.

Thief’s Stealth and Teleport should be combined as one skill. Give them a detonating projectile move that damages and knocks down enemies.

Engineers and Rangers should remain untouched, they have Ults that revive them instantly if premeditated, and their down skills are not horrible.

Warriors success rate on Revenge’s revive should be higher.

That should balance things.

GankSinatra.2653:

marianitten.1247:

336862

Check what nr ability they are. Check how long it takes for Mist form to come up, and your fear to come up.
I understand your confusion, as nobody plays ele in 8v8.

The CD is not the problem. If you have the skill ready, and you are downed by 2 enemies.
.

Im sorry but i cant make it any clearer than that. If you dont think the cooldown matters when it most certainly does, i dont know what to tell you.

I also already agreed with you if you would read more carefully.
You’re a bit…. i’ll just leave this thread now. Just got my posting priviliges back : D

A bit what? I not that kind of people who report comments who doesn’t agree with me… never did that.. and i’m not going to do it

hackks.3687:

Ele’s take 9 sec before they can use vapor form. If someone can’t F-inish them within 9 sec they have bigger problems than downed states.

Thief and Mesmer downed state aren’t really all that either. They do basically what all downed states should do. Buy you a little time.

Vengeance is the only downed ability I have issue with. I just downed the kittener, why is he back up again? It’s counterintuitive to the entire mechanic.

edit: in regards to theif and mesmer downed states – it is a bit ridiculous when you’re teleport can put you on an entirely different z-axis. I was downed as a mesmer a couple times and used my #2 downed ability only to find myself on the other side of a wall on top of of hill well away from where anyone would find. I had a good laugh at that everytime it happened.

100% agree.
Im mesmer too and depending on luck 2 can puts me : same place (kthx), middle of the heat (ohnoooes), or completely out of the place (/laugh). It should only teleport in line of sight and maybe not same place too lol.
Vengeance yea i dont like either. I think its fun skill though but my main issue is it should NOT fully rez the warrior if he kills someone while in vengeance mode. Its just wrong imo. Vengeance ok but not this “out of jail card”. I know you dont get always a kill while in vengeance but still you should end dead no matter what like all other temporary rez skills

If Ele mist forms the other team scores points for it because the form downs the ele again… Yeah, thats OP lol. Atleast a necro can delay one stomp right after he is downed. Ele gets a root lol.

Honestly, there does need to be some balancing around them, I’ll give you that. But pick a better example next time 8P

Thieves and mesmers have it far better than any class I have played when it comes to downed abilities and escaping a stomp.

marianitten.1247:

GankSinatra.2653:

marianitten.1247:

336862

Check what nr ability they are. Check how long it takes for Mist form to come up, and your fear to come up.
I understand your confusion, as nobody plays ele in 8v8.

The CD is not the problem. If you have the skill ready, and you are downed by 2 enemies.
.

Im sorry but i cant make it any clearer than that. If you dont think the cooldown matters when it most certainly does, i dont know what to tell you.

I also already agreed with you if you would read more carefully.
You’re a bit…. i’ll just leave this thread now. Just got my posting priviliges back : D

A bit what? I not that kind of people who report comments who doesn’t agree with me… never did that.. and i’m not going to do it

I think he’s saying you’re not catching on.

The Necro fear in downstate is instantly available. You just have to hit the button and you interrupt anyone who is attempting to stomp you. The mist form that Elementalists get only activates once you’ve been downed for nine seconds.

During that NINE seconds someone has the opportunity to stomp you THREE times or just kill you. Either one is easily doable within that time frame. Elementalists have NO way to stop someone from stomping them for nine seconds versus the instant fear ability of Necros.

In my opinion the strongest down state abilities belong to Thieves, Warriors, and Rangers. In that order.

Why, you may ask?

Thieves can buy themselves a TON of time for someone to show up and save them. If you time your teleport right you’ll have enough time to smoke screen and keep them looking for you while you heal up. Often times I can teleport two or three times before I get stomped or saved. You can also teleport WHILE you’re healing without interrupting the heal.

If you don’t stomp a Warrior fast they can pop back up with vengeance and sometimes finish a person off. If they’re traited, they’re back up for good (until they get downed again).

Rangers, believe it or not, have a pretty strong downed state. You have the daze to stop opponents from stomping you immediately. If you survive long enough for Lick Wounds to come up you can get double the healing AND bring your pet back to life. If you have a wolf pet (which a lot of Rangers do) you get a second stomp interrupt with fear.

TL;DR: complaining about Elementalist downstate being OP is crazy.

nldixon.8514:

TL;DR: complaining about Elementalist downstate being OP is crazy.

Ok I get it… But being OP or UP is wrong anyway.

Mesmer down state. Want to know the secret? The real downed mesmer has the skull still over his head. It’s not so OP now is it.

Derps.7421:

Mesmer down state. Want to know the secret? The real downed mesmer has the skull still over his head. It’s not so OP now is it.

That’s why I don’t mind the Mesmer downstate so much.

Now if only that pesky target would stick to Mesmers that insist on disappearing every 5 seconds.

The only way the target gets off is when they use Blink and its a bug. Kinda like how sometimes thief’s stay invis even after their stealth is over.

Srsly if you think that Thief can buy TONS of time you justa fail game. 1 (very) short teleport, and stealth for 2s at SAME PLACE is no oppurtonity for mesmers telepots like crazy + making fake clones at grund and stealth.

Mesmers got most OP ground skills for now, I just cant count how many times we 2-3 try kill 1 grounded mesmer at middle of fight- its take AGES.

Other very strong ground skills have warrior, if you dont finish him fast- he just stand and kick ur kitten

^ Kaim did you read what i just said? LOOK ABOVE THE DOWNED MESMERS HEAD THEIR SHOULD BE A SKULL INDICATING THE REAL ONE i put it in caps for you so you can see it better <3

Kaim.7125:

Srsly if you think that Thief can buy TONS of time you justa fail game. 1 (very) short teleport, and stealth for 2s at SAME PLACE is no oppurtonity for mesmers telepots like crazy + making fake clones at grund and stealth.

Mesmers got most OP ground skills for now, I just cant count how many times we 2-3 try kill 1 grounded mesmer at middle of fight- its take AGES.

Other very strong ground skills have warrior, if you dont finish him fast- he just stand and kick ur kitten

The reason the Thief down state is so good is because most players are raging idiots. If you time your teleport or smoke screen so that it looks like they succeeded on their stomp (i.e., while they’re coming down on you from the air) they MIGHT turn around and look for you, but I can’t tell you how many times I’ve healed and gotten back up because they think they won and run off.

Also, as Derps already stated, Mesmers have a RED SKULL above the head of the real Mesmer. If you spend “ages” running around stomping on clones, I don’t know what to tell you.

I will say that if you get into a 1v1 downed fight with an Ele yer kinda screwed since Vapor form recharges their downed health. It’s small, but it has been a silver lining for me from time to time

Where are the engineers in all of this?

I don’t find my downstate abilities very usefull. Is that me, or aren’t they…?

No one even mentions engineers in this whole post, which sort of got me worried.

I hate complaining about a game I am loving, but I would love to see Downstate removed or reworked. It’s gimmicky and ruins a lot of close fights. I just want them to hurry up and down me so I can move on.

necros downstate is really good………… if your up skilled players they will pop stability when finishing. Necros are the only class that has a interrupt that goes through stability

marianitten.1247:

Sanis.1096:

really… elementalist… ELEMENTALIST… they have the worst downstate E V E R… you could have picked like mesmer or thief

Vapor Form -> Assume a mobile, vaporous form, returning to a downed state when the effect ends.

That may save your life if you are attacked by 2 or more enemies.

But we have:

Fear > Make your foe flee in fear.

One fear, to one foe. You are still exposed anyway. There is no way you could survive more than 1 attack.

If Ele have the worst downed stated.. idk what we have.

Except that you move at normal speeds, so anyone intent on stomping you is STILL going to stomp you. You also can’t be revived while in Vapor Form. At least as a Necro you can interrupt the first stomp (Vapor form has a long CD preventing it if stomping within 2 or 3 seconds) and you can be revived when you use fear.

Kaim.7125:

Thief dont have strong downstate skills lol… 1 teleport and 1 stealth (where he stay at same place). Most OP:

Mesmers- clones, teleporting, stealth… just wtf is this.
Warrior- knock down for 1 target, instant stand and 15s for kill target (before self death)
Guardian- mass AOE Push back, life drain

Really? Lets count together

Elementalist = no interupt at all = easy stomp
Warrior / Necro / engineer = Single interupt = 1 enemy can be interupted once
Guardian / Ranger = AOE interupt = AOE interupt – once

Mesmer = illusion = 1 interupt

And now Thief = teleport = 1 interupt. Stealth = Second interupt !! So in fact Thief is the only class that is able to interupt the stomp twice. And basically it can´t be negated in any way. While all professions except for Thief and mesmer can be negated by using stability / distorsion / Aegis / blind etc.

So if we trully compare the downed state

Thief has the best with ability to avoid stomp for at least 2 times and not counterable
Mesmer is second because it can interupt at least once without any counter

then there is nothing for a long time and after that other proffesions are following.. ending up with ele who has nothing but uselles imobilize (very usefull to imobilize foe who is standing next to you and stomping you.. )

Agreed that :

1. Downed state should be same for all
2. Should be 1 to 1 rally, and not the whole lot.

The way it is now, some classes are just super OP in downed state andothers are just fodder…i.e. Elementalist…and rangers go down hard too.

marianitten.1247:

My “main” is a necromancer. We have, 1/2sec fear to 1 character only.

Then I tried the Elementalist, and they can walk wherever they want for a short time… WTF?!
Another profession have an AOE stun(idk wich). Makes no sense.

I suggest that in sPvP, al the professions in downed state need to have the exact Skill Set because if this pretend to be an eSport, Balance is the most important thing.

with the same logic all characters should have the same weapon skills and utility skills … oh w8

Actually the engineer can interrupt twice, the #3 ability(aoe knockback) is on a 20 sec cooldown though so good luck getting that off before you die.

Another thing, the engineer #2 ability is a pull – why would you want to pull an enemy toward you when you are dead?!

I’ve been wishing for this since beta.

Downed State should be much closer for each class, they can still retain a bit of flavor, but 2nd skill should atleast be quite similar, the 3rd skill could retain flavor but be similar in power (Vengeance versus some others).

IMO downed state should have lower HP in spvp and it be more viable to just “attack” them to death as opposed to either, forcing them to bleed out, or having to stomp. Would make it alot less irritating and vital for stomps to go off, stomps could still be a faster way to finish and the bleeding out option would be less powerful as well.

Grizor.6543:

Actually the engineer can interrupt twice, the #3 ability(aoe knockback) is on a 20 sec cooldown though so good luck getting that off before you die.

Another thing, the engineer #2 ability is a pull – why would you want to pull an enemy toward you when you are dead?!

So they’re in range for your bomb..? Also, think just outside of yourself for a bit, even when downed, you can peel for your team.

OP, Necros are not the worst off, in fact Elementalists are. The fact that you’re comparing and saying how they’re better makes me /facepalm. While imbalances exist, you should properly research each of the class’ downed abilities before making claims.

Right now Mesmer and Thieves without a doubt are a league above everyone in downed, they have the most potential to stall and self bandage if given the chance.

Guardians have a AoE KB on their 2 skill making them one of the better ones too. Most others have a single target interrupt, with Elementalists having NONE of that and only a Myst form to stop stomps, usually by the time it comes off CD it’s too late. If you let them myst form, then it’s your fault.

Grizor.6543:

Actually the engineer can interrupt twice, the #3 ability(aoe knockback) is on a 20 sec cooldown though so good luck getting that off before you die.

Another thing, the engineer #2 ability is a pull – why would you want to pull an enemy toward you when you are dead?!

the pull is great for pve when you can pull the lowest health mob and kill it of.
In pvp however, that is indeed the last thing that comes to mind.

Dam, downed… let’s pull an enemy over here!

The knockback is the reverse of that, but how come it doesn’t always knock people of me in pvp?
It is supposed to work on all, isn’t it?

But I suppose stability negates that, so could be that.

"

The only problem I find with the ‘downed’ state in PvP (structured or otherwise) is that only ONE enemy has to die for multiple ‘downed’ players to rally.

It should be a 1 for 1 IMO"

This is a great idea.

“oh and wtf quickness while stomping just no guys, NO. Bad Arenanet!”

No worse than stomping whilst under exilir s or any other immunity spell, or stomping under stability, and marginally worse than stomping whilst stealthed.

Grizor.6543:

Actually the engineer can interrupt twice, the #3 ability(aoe knockback) is on a 20 sec cooldown though so good luck getting that off before you die.

Another thing, the engineer #2 ability is a pull – why would you want to pull an enemy toward you when you are dead?!

I thought that… until i discovered that its actually a small knockdown so acts as an interrupt as well. It also serves the major purpose of pulling someone in so you can knock em on their kitten with the downed #3 (especially in a team fight if its someone wailing on one of your buddies but in that case you only want to use it if #3 is available). I’ve actually held off for a while using 2 → 3 → 2

I firmly believe that there should only be 1 and 4 activated in sPvP. Fully open to better solutions but this seems to be the best one. Could only leave 1 on and I would be fine with it but I think that would be dumb in pugs.

marianitten.1247:

My “main” is a necromancer. We have, 1/2sec fear to 1 character only.

Then I tried the Elementalist, and they can walk wherever they want for a short time… WTF?!
Another profession have an AOE stun(idk wich). Makes no sense.

I suggest that in sPvP, al the professions in downed state need to have the exact Skill Set because if this pretend to be an eSport, Balance is the most important thing.

ya and while we are at it everyone needs to ahve the same skills and weapon sets because balance is the most important thing! wwooooot!

Derps.7421:

Mesmer down state. Want to know the secret? The real downed mesmer has the skull still over his head. It’s not so OP now is it.

zomg what an amazing tip, i didnt know that, thank you so much for your helpful posts!!

Here’s something you dont know: phantasms and illusions keep attacking 3-4k while the mesmer is downed.

We’re learning so much today.

Kimbald.2697:

Where are the engineers in all of this?

I don’t find my downstate abilities very usefull. Is that me, or aren’t they…?

No one even mentions engineers in this whole post, which sort of got me worried.

ummm

You get a single target knockdown while getting stomped, with an aoe knockback that is better than most other classes downed 3. For instance, i dont really care much when thiefs use their 3, as i’ll just aoe them down on the spot while they’re invis.

And you can also kind of res yourself lol. I think my engis downed’s are more than fine.

Problem 8v8 scrubs?

This isnt arenajunkies, people are simply stating and discussing their opinions. You will get infracted seriously fast if you keep trying to act so cool in most of your posts (and failing at it). I’ve been getting infracted a lot and i’m nowhere near an kitten like you, just so you know.

Kashou.6058:

Necro dies because stability, block, two people stomping or blind.
Ele dies because no downed state survivability.
Warrior dies because stability, block, two people stomping or blind.
Guardian dies because stability, block, shadowstep/portal stomping or blind.
Mesmer dies because one person start stomping, then second person start stomping mesmer when the other guy is 50% finished, killing the mesmer when he comes out of stealth.
Thief survives unless guy who stomps has an instant teleport like steal, infiltrators signet or judges intervention.
Engineer dies because stability, block, two people stomping or blind.
Ranger dies because stability, block or blind.

Problem 8v8 scrubs?

Different downed states add different strategies required to kill them, and it also affects target priority in matches. Killing thieves or mesmers first usually results in them getting ressed because they can just teleport to their guardian or get ressed while invis.

Quite honestly, you’re right. Stability along with quickness and so many other abilities guarantee a stomp 80%+ of the time. I run Stand Your Ground! on my Guard, Elixir S on my Engie, Mist Form on my Ele, Balanced Stance on my Warrior, and stealth on my Thief. Only class I can’t guarantee a down with is my condition ranger.

I just find that tournaments are so much chain rezzing that it’s a big reason why guardian is so popular right now. Either way, I really do believe that the downed states are pretty balanced and I wouldn’t care either way if they stayed the same. Definitely more important issues to get to involving PvP aside from downed states.

Sanis.1096:

really… elementalist… ELEMENTALIST… they have the worst downstate E V E R… you could have picked like mesmer or thief

^^^THIS^^^

Ele not only has the worst underwater skills for dmg in the game, but the worst downed state, bar none. OP is just…….wrong

Certain downstate abilities are better in certain situations.

As a thief player, when I am downed with another downed player I will always end up losing the downed fight. If they are not downed and try to stomp me I can delay that for a good while and maybe get rezzed.

You can’t say that this profession has better downstate abilities than that one, it just doesn’t work like that.

vitigis.4160:

Sanis.1096:

really… elementalist… ELEMENTALIST… they have the worst downstate E V E R… you could have picked like mesmer or thief

^^^THIS^^^

Ele not only has the worst underwater skills for dmg in the game, but the worst downed state, bar none. OP is just…….wrong

You are wrong, if an Elementalist is downed and a Thief is downed, the Elementalist will emerge victorious. It all depends on the situation.

Downed state…

- great in PvE
- fine in WvW
- kittens in sPvP

and this is coming form a Thief who has one of the most OP downed-states.

I’d wouldn’t be half as bad if the execute animation was twice as quick but NOOO, it’s just a bane on the game. I mean I’ve already seen teams that try to keep you “downed” rather than letting you respawn.