Dragonhunter isn't op, 4 of them are!
I would disagree. I’d rather see druid, scrapper and dragonhunter nerfed by a small amount at the same time. Would be more healthy for the whole game.
I have to say, I really don’t understand the complaining about DH at all. They are not OP at all and actually need a buff, not a nerf, to be competitive at pro level (which is what the game should be balance around in my opinion) because it is hardly ever used at the moment. I also have to say the class stacking is not a problem either. If I see 3+ guards in the enemy team I feel pretty confident that we are going to win because it really is not a good composition at all. Guard is fairly easy to play compared to thief, Rev or mes for example but when things are played to their maximum potential or close to it, guard is not brilliant (it’s good, but not fantastic) so I really would not appreciate a guard nerf next patch.
Things like Druid are in need of much more of a nerf than guard is in my honest opinion.
PvE- Grolex (Warrior)
PvP rank: 20 Rating: 1864 (season 7)
Druids are not bad at all.
I do not agree with above statement. Druid definitely needs looking at.
“Buff my main class, nerf everything else. "
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
For ranked pvp i think max 2 of a class is a better rule to compromise for queue times.
Kiting DH is easy? Are you actually serious? You can’t kite a 1200 range weapon with an AA that can sometimes cripple you, and if you aren’t crippled, it still hits way too hard. DHs keep forgetting that traps aren’t the only OP thing they have. True Shot was nerfed, but it still hits hard. The AA is a bigger problem though, just like other AA that’s came with HoT or were buffed because of HoT (looking at you Thieve). You must have LoS or a teleport to escape a DH. And LoS only works so long because the DH can still run up to you and force you out with traps and insane damage. And Longbow 5 also hits behind LoS too.
So you’re either a bad DH, or you’re fighting extremely good players.
Kiting DH is easy? Are you actually serious? You can’t kite a 1200 range weapon with an AA that can sometimes cripple you, and if you aren’t crippled, it still hits way too hard. DHs keep forgetting that traps aren’t the only OP thing they have. True Shot was nerfed, but it still hits hard. The AA is a bigger problem though, just like other AA that’s came with HoT or were buffed because of HoT (looking at you Thieve). You must have LoS or a teleport to escape a DH. And LoS only works so long because the DH can still run up to you and force you out with traps and insane damage. And Longbow 5 also hits behind LoS too.
So you’re either a bad DH, or you’re fighting extremely good players.
I’ve kited plenty of dragon hunters with no issues. If you learn what their weaknesses are then they go down fairly quickly.
Idk about you guys, but with the disagrements about if guardian is balanced or not, i think what it actually needs its a gameplay balance, get rid of the dh gameplay and give guardians another type of role, because overall everyone seems unhappy with just seeing a guardian in the match.
I have to say, I really don’t understand the complaining about DH at all. They are not OP at all and actually need a buff, not a nerf, to be competitive at pro level (which is what the game should be balance around in my opinion) because it is hardly ever used at the moment. I also have to say the class stacking is not a problem either. If I see 3+ guards in the enemy team I feel pretty confident that we are going to win because it really is not a good composition at all. Guard is fairly easy to play compared to thief, Rev or mes for example but when things are played to their maximum potential or close to it, guard is not brilliant (it’s good, but not fantastic) so I really would not appreciate a guard nerf next patch.
Things like Druid are in need of much more of a nerf than guard is in my honest opinion.
Said by the druid
https://www.reddit.com/r/GuildWars2PvPTeams/
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
I have to say, I really don’t understand the complaining about DH at all. They are not OP at all and actually need a buff, not a nerf, to be competitive at pro level (which is what the game should be balanced around in my opinion) because it is hardly ever used at the moment. I also have to say the class stacking is not a problem either. If I see 3+ guards on the enemy team I feel pretty confident that we are going to win because it really is not a good composition at all. Guard is fairly easy to play compared to a thief, Rev or mes for example but when things are played to their maximum potential or close to it, a guard is not brilliant (it’s good, but not fantastic) so I really would not appreciate a guard nerf next patch.
Things like Druid are in need of much more of a nerf than guard is in my honest opinion.
If your argument is sound, it should stand up to an analogy. What you’re basically saying is tax laws should be created and balanced based on the top 1% of income earners.
Kiting DH is easy? Are you actually serious? You can’t kite a 1200 range weapon with an AA that can sometimes cripple you, and if you aren’t crippled, it still hits way too hard. DHs keep forgetting that traps aren’t the only OP thing they have. True Shot was nerfed, but it still hits hard. The AA is a bigger problem though, just like other AA that’s came with HoT or were buffed because of HoT (looking at you Thieve). You must have LoS or a teleport to escape a DH. And LoS only works so long because the DH can still run up to you and force you out with traps and insane damage. And Longbow 5 also hits behind LoS too.
So you’re either a bad DH, or you’re fighting extremely good players.
I play power mesmer and in all honesty, dragon hunters are the easiest class for me to deal with. I usually just bait out the heal and run around them using clones to activate traps. My favorite is when the DH uses F3 with low health and I just counter it with a well placed mirror blade. Now 3 dragonhunters are impossible for me. Same goes with Druid. Druids, along with necros, are also pretty easy for me. I have the most trouble dealing with those warriors that just fart out boons and Endure Pain as well as scrappers. I’m saying this so that Anet doesn’t go the wrong route and nerf DH, Druid, or any other class to the ground because of PvP complaints.
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
That’s wrong. If you feel that the only counter is another similar composition then it’s simply a l2p issue. DH has plenty of weaknesses. Take advantage of them.
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
That’s wrong. If you feel that the only counter is another similar composition then it’s simply a l2p issue. DH has plenty of weaknesses. Take advantage of them.
The only weaknesses a DH has are low mobility and somewhat weak ranged damage.
Which means the natural counter is a high mobility, high ranged damage class with equal or better healing. IE, druid.
DH has good mobility what are you talking about. 1200 range teleport from anywhere+leaps. I can always reach far when or before my enemy does to give us an early start.
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
That’s wrong. If you feel that the only counter is another similar composition then it’s simply a l2p issue. DH has plenty of weaknesses. Take advantage of them.
The only weaknesses a DH has are low mobility and somewhat weak ranged damage.
Which means the natural counter is a high mobility, high ranged damage class with equal or better healing. IE, druid.
The typical build that they run with has low condition cleanse and stability. The bulk of their damage is from the traps.
DH has good mobility what are you talking about. 1200 range teleport from anywhere+leaps. I can always reach far when or before my enemy does to give us an early start.
That teleport requires an enemy to target, and as such is unreliable (though very very nice when it works, esp. since you can port through walls on coliseum).
The leap is short range (800) and on a 26sec cooldown. If you’re counting the greatsword charge’s 500 range as a second leap, sure, but it’s even shorter ranged.
In order to get “good” mobility you need to use trapper runes and run at least 2 traps (heal and ToF usually), but you sacrifice ALL your power in exchange for a small amount of condi damage when you’re a 95%+ power class, and thus are far far less viable at actually fighting.
DH’s are heavily reliant on another player giving us quickness.
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
That’s wrong. If you feel that the only counter is another similar composition then it’s simply a l2p issue. DH has plenty of weaknesses. Take advantage of them.
The only weaknesses a DH has are low mobility and somewhat weak ranged damage.
Which means the natural counter is a high mobility, high ranged damage class with equal or better healing. IE, druid.
The typical build that they run with has low condition cleanse and stability. The bulk of their damage is from the traps.
Most builds run Purification and Smite Condition. Coupled with the traited condi removal on Wings we actually have the second-highest condi counter of any class (beaten only by necros invested in condi transfer). All builds run at least Purification, giving us around 7-8 condis removed every 30 seconds just from Smiter’s Boon (remove 2 condi every time you heal yourself).
DH’s running more than 2 traps are generally bad, and are always sub-optimal builds. Though I’m not going to pretend they’re not prevalent.
Yes, we don’t have much in the way of stability, but we have excellent access to blocks which works almost as well.
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
That’s wrong. If you feel that the only counter is another similar composition then it’s simply a l2p issue. DH has plenty of weaknesses. Take advantage of them.
The only weaknesses a DH has are low mobility and somewhat weak ranged damage.
Which means the natural counter is a high mobility, high ranged damage class with equal or better healing. IE, druid.
The typical build that they run with has low condition cleanse and stability. The bulk of their damage is from the traps.
Most builds run Purification and Smite Condition. Coupled with the traited condi removal on Wings we actually have the second-highest condi counter of any class (beaten only by necros invested in condi transfer). All builds run at least Purification, giving us around 7-8 condis removed every 30 seconds just from Smiter’s Boon (remove 2 condi every time you heal yourself).
DH’s running more than 2 traps are generally bad, and are always sub-optimal builds. Though I’m not going to pretend they’re not prevalent.
Yes, we don’t have much in the way of stability, but we have excellent access to blocks which works almost as well.
Condition application is so easy and frequent on some classes that while they can clear 7-8 every 30 seconds, it won’t do them much good when their skills are on cool down. I’ve killed plenty of DH on necro simply by kiting them and using scepter auto attack.
The issue that many people have with is the frequent access to traps. Practically every complaint that I see on the forums and in game revolve around their traps. Every DH that I have seen runs at least 3 which includes the heal. Occasionally you’ll have one that uses the elite trap.
The DH trap build is just a gimmicky build that works on players that don’t know what they’re doing. Unfortunately there’s enough players like that where having 4 DH on the enemy team seems like an instant loss for them.
(edited by Ayrilana.1396)
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
That’s wrong. If you feel that the only counter is another similar composition then it’s simply a l2p issue. DH has plenty of weaknesses. Take advantage of them.
The only weaknesses a DH has are low mobility and somewhat weak ranged damage.
Which means the natural counter is a high mobility, high ranged damage class with equal or better healing. IE, druid.
The typical build that they run with has low condition cleanse and stability. The bulk of their damage is from the traps.
Most builds run Purification and Smite Condition. Coupled with the traited condi removal on Wings we actually have the second-highest condi counter of any class (beaten only by necros invested in condi transfer). All builds run at least Purification, giving us around 7-8 condis removed every 30 seconds just from Smiter’s Boon (remove 2 condi every time you heal yourself).
DH’s running more than 2 traps are generally bad, and are always sub-optimal builds. Though I’m not going to pretend they’re not prevalent.
Yes, we don’t have much in the way of stability, but we have excellent access to blocks which works almost as well.
Condition application is so easy and frequent on some classes that while they can clear 7-8 every 30 seconds, it won’t do them much good when their skills are on cool down. I’ve killed plenty of DH on necro simply by kiting them and using scepter auto attack.
The issue that many people have with is the frequent access to traps. Practically every complaint that I see on the forums and in game revolve around their traps. Every DH that I have seen runs at least 3 which includes the heal. Occasionally you’ll have one that uses the elite trap.
The DH trap build is just a gimmicky build that works on players that don’t know what they’re doing. Unfortunately there’s enough players like that where having 4 DH on the enemy team seems like an instant loss for them.
Yes, i agree condi is out of hand. But saying DH has “poor” access to condi cleanse when they have the second best in game is ridiculous.
If the other team knows how to counter DH then having four of them on a team is a handicap.
Right now the only counter for 4 DH is 4 (competent) druid+1 (good) powerhammer scrapper.
So, yeah, I guess if you have a team on voice comms that all have druids/scrappers to swap to that they’re actually decent with, I guess you can call that a counter.
That’s wrong. If you feel that the only counter is another similar composition then it’s simply a l2p issue. DH has plenty of weaknesses. Take advantage of them.
The only weaknesses a DH has are low mobility and somewhat weak ranged damage.
Which means the natural counter is a high mobility, high ranged damage class with equal or better healing. IE, druid.
The typical build that they run with has low condition cleanse and stability. The bulk of their damage is from the traps.
Most builds run Purification and Smite Condition. Coupled with the traited condi removal on Wings we actually have the second-highest condi counter of any class (beaten only by necros invested in condi transfer). All builds run at least Purification, giving us around 7-8 condis removed every 30 seconds just from Smiter’s Boon (remove 2 condi every time you heal yourself).
DH’s running more than 2 traps are generally bad, and are always sub-optimal builds. Though I’m not going to pretend they’re not prevalent.
Yes, we don’t have much in the way of stability, but we have excellent access to blocks which works almost as well.
Condition application is so easy and frequent on some classes that while they can clear 7-8 every 30 seconds, it won’t do them much good when their skills are on cool down. I’ve killed plenty of DH on necro simply by kiting them and using scepter auto attack.
The issue that many people have with is the frequent access to traps. Practically every complaint that I see on the forums and in game revolve around their traps. Every DH that I have seen runs at least 3 which includes the heal. Occasionally you’ll have one that uses the elite trap.
The DH trap build is just a gimmicky build that works on players that don’t know what they’re doing. Unfortunately there’s enough players like that where having 4 DH on the enemy team seems like an instant loss for them.
Yes, i agree condi is out of hand. But saying DH has “poor” access to condi cleanse when they have the second best in game is ridiculous.
I said the typical build that they tend to run with and not DH in general.
No stacking rule sounds great but ques…probably it might make everything worse.
In my opinion balance should look like this: skill=effectiveness.
It’s no brainer that people tend to take easiest class in season (skill<effectiveness). This year ranked looked like this:
s1: half of it DH – then was nerfed in mid of the season
s:2 necro
s:3 warrior
s:4 DH
How will anet fix this? Simply by hammer nerfing won’t solve things easy as many tend to think if there is no at least one class that can counter ,,to easy build". For example ele on cleric hard countered DH (that why it wasn’t in meta for so long) until season 4. Now only druid does that but not as effective like that time meta tempest was.
Kawaleria (KW)
I wouldn’t be against a rule that meant you couldn’t get paired up with more than two of one class on either team. People could still swap classes but it’s at least reduce the likelihood of getting a team with 4 thieves and nonw of them wanting to switch.
Every DH that I have seen runs at least 3 which includes the heal. Occasionally you’ll have one that uses the elite trap.
Heal, ToF and err…the stunbreak FoF?
Every DH that I have seen runs at least 3 which includes the heal. Occasionally you’ll have one that uses the elite trap.
Heal, ToF and err…the stunbreak FoF?
The blades one. Procession of Blades? Too lazy to look it up. The other utility slot is usually judges intervention from what I have seen.
Every DH that I have seen runs at least 3 which includes the heal. Occasionally you’ll have one that uses the elite trap.
Heal, ToF and err…the stunbreak FoF?
The blades one. Procession of Blades? Too lazy to look it up. The other utility slot is usually judges intervention from what I have seen.
Anyone running those utilities is going to have very poor sustain. I’m pretty sure the utility bar of any competant DH is: Purification, JI, ToF, Smite condi, RF. This only involves 2 traps and only 1 that maybe deals damage if you dont have stab or invulns (hence trap bombs aren’t even an issue here).
It is true, DHs become exponentially ridiculous when there are 2+ present. 1 being on a team is not a big deal.
I agree with removing class stacking from ranked.
Dragonhunter is op. Press F3 can block all attacks coming and strike enemies at same time.
It is not fair. Also, this class got so many healing way to go. Last time, we 5ppl fought with 3 DH. we died many times. Crazy.
Do you not sit in the same 5-10 minute ques I get?
DH does need a nerf, it’s why so many people are playing it and the reason why teams are over stacked with DH and not something like an Elementalist.
….. And Elementalist.
(edited by sephiroth.4217)
DH’s have bad mobility. they are very slow, and need a Rev or something to put swiftness on them to get around or a team with out 3 DH’s can just out rotate the team stacked with DH’s. people need to remember this game is a take and Hold game. if a team is too slow to react to the rotation of points, then it’s game over.
Having 3-4 guards camping middle and the other team just running in to die, has nothing to do with a DH being OP, it has to do with the players understanding of how PvP works. people seem to think that you haver to have the middle point to win a game. I’ve won plenty where middle was never held, we just rotated middle and far the other team spent most of there time trying to retake there home. instead of sending someone off to de-cap far then move to middle they just pilled in to middle or there home. also people not looking at the mini map to see where they are needed.
There are two things that make a PvP game hard, skill(someone is always going to be better than you, we all have to face it.) and the lack on knowledge/understanding of how the game modes/classes work.
|Seasonic S12G 650W|Win10 Pro X64| Corsair Spec 03 Case|
DH’s have bad mobility. they are very slow, and need a Rev or something to put swiftness on them to get around or a team with out 3 DH’s can just out rotate the team stacked with DH’s. people need to remember this game is a take and Hold game. if a team is too slow to react to the rotation of points, then it’s game over.
Having 3-4 guards camping middle and the other team just running in to die, has nothing to do with a DH being OP, it has to do with the players understanding of how PvP works. people seem to think that you haver to have the middle point to win a game. I’ve won plenty where middle was never held, we just rotated middle and far the other team spent most of there time trying to retake there home. instead of sending someone off to de-cap far then move to middle they just pilled in to middle or there home. also people not looking at the mini map to see where they are needed.
There are two things that make a PvP game hard, skill(someone is always going to be better than you, we all have to face it.) and the lack on knowledge/understanding of how the game modes/classes work.
DH’s have GOOD/CRAZY mobility. If you know how to use sword 2. lock target →leave target →sword 2 back.
DH’s have bad mobility. they are very slow, and need a Rev or something to put swiftness on them to get around or a team with out 3 DH’s can just out rotate the team stacked with DH’s. people need to remember this game is a take and Hold game. if a team is too slow to react to the rotation of points, then it’s game over.
Having 3-4 guards camping middle and the other team just running in to die, has nothing to do with a DH being OP, it has to do with the players understanding of how PvP works. people seem to think that you haver to have the middle point to win a game. I’ve won plenty where middle was never held, we just rotated middle and far the other team spent most of there time trying to retake there home. instead of sending someone off to de-cap far then move to middle they just pilled in to middle or there home. also people not looking at the mini map to see where they are needed.
There are two things that make a PvP game hard, skill(someone is always going to be better than you, we all have to face it.) and the lack on knowledge/understanding of how the game modes/classes work.
DH’s have GOOD/CRAZY mobility. If you know how to use sword 2. lock target ->leave target ->sword 2 back.
You need a target. This is what I am referring too.
|Seasonic S12G 650W|Win10 Pro X64| Corsair Spec 03 Case|
DH’s have bad mobility. they are very slow, and need a Rev or something to put swiftness on them to get around or a team with out 3 DH’s can just out rotate the team stacked with DH’s. people need to remember this game is a take and Hold game. if a team is too slow to react to the rotation of points, then it’s game over.
Having 3-4 guards camping middle and the other team just running in to die, has nothing to do with a DH being OP, it has to do with the players understanding of how PvP works. people seem to think that you haver to have the middle point to win a game. I’ve won plenty where middle was never held, we just rotated middle and far the other team spent most of there time trying to retake there home. instead of sending someone off to de-cap far then move to middle they just pilled in to middle or there home. also people not looking at the mini map to see where they are needed.
There are two things that make a PvP game hard, skill(someone is always going to be better than you, we all have to face it.) and the lack on knowledge/understanding of how the game modes/classes work.
DH’s have GOOD/CRAZY mobility. If you know how to use sword 2. lock target ->leave target ->sword 2 back.
You need a target. This is what I am referring too.
i cannot think of a single situation where your kiting a dh and he cant target you.
I have to say, I really don’t understand the complaining about DH at all. They are not OP at all and actually need a buff, not a nerf, to be competitive at pro level (which is what the game should be balance around in my opinion) because it is hardly ever used at the moment. I also have to say the class stacking is not a problem either. If I see 3+ guards in the enemy team I feel pretty confident that we are going to win because it really is not a good composition at all. Guard is fairly easy to play compared to thief, Rev or mes for example but when things are played to their maximum potential or close to it, guard is not brilliant (it’s good, but not fantastic) so I really would not appreciate a guard nerf next patch.
Things like Druid are in need of much more of a nerf than guard is in my honest opinion.
The problem is , and like u say " its too easy to play" and its true, on top if u play guard u dont need to have as good players as if u play thief or necro.
Like a thief cant roam anywhere if the whole team us always down, he also cant hold a node, same as necro atm that needs a babyssiter almost, cause hes so easy target with no blocks or anything.
If u play guard u dont have any of these problems.
This is why players complain.
Dh is so easy to play with almost no drawbacks, same as druid, the freaking pet does a ton of damage while the druid plays a sustain build.
Ofc players get upset, low risk wuth high reward.
engineer still op and boring to play
I have to say, I really don’t understand the complaining about DH at all. They are not OP at all and actually need a buff, not a nerf, to be competitive at pro level (which is what the game should be balanced around in my opinion) because it is hardly ever used at the moment. I also have to say the class stacking is not a problem either. If I see 3+ guards on the enemy team I feel pretty confident that we are going to win because it really is not a good composition at all. Guard is fairly easy to play compared to a thief, Rev or mes for example but when things are played to their maximum potential or close to it, a guard is not brilliant (it’s good, but not fantastic) so I really would not appreciate a guard nerf next patch.
Things like Druid are in need of much more of a nerf than guard is in my honest opinion.
If your argument is sound, it should stand up to an analogy. What you’re basically saying is tax laws should be created and balanced based on the top 1% of income earners.
this cracks me up. you can make up any analogy to fit your propaganda. lets see, " lets fund research for a mircale cure for the top 1% of the chronically sick." hmm sounds positive to me. you can make up anything to fit your agenda. secondly your comparing worldy situations with fantasy in game situations. every game should be balanced around the best players. they are the ones that generate the most income for the company. new players can still do well on meta builds created by top players and they will be mostly be matched with other players of like skill and will never know or quit the game because of it being balanced by the top players. yes lets base balance around people with mediocre knowledge of the classes they play. makes sense to me. thanks for your pointless analogy.
I know a person who got diamond by only playing DH, they have no idea how to rotate, or even check the map to see what’s happening. DH is anything but balanced.
No class should have range with huge cc’s & damage, 1 shot bursts with ultra low cool downs, & tons of survivability, oh and the ability to hold the whole point and pull people on top of it.
I know a person who got diamond by only playing DH, they have no idea how to rotate, or even check the map to see what’s happening. DH is anything but balanced.
No class should have range with huge cc’s & damage, 1 shot bursts with ultra low cool downs, & tons of survivability, oh and the ability to hold the whole point and pull people on top of it.
Any class could do that because the system rewards you for playing more, not better. That isn’t an argument against dh (even tho yes, it is very easy to play)
All we wanted was a GvG.