Guild Wars 2

Turret builds: stack boons and kill your opponents for you? The ultimate passive AI experience

Incendiary powder: So much counter play to the undodgeable 7 second burn from Balth engineers

Crate: The “I win” button

Elixir gun: Permanent weakness on autoattack??? wtf?

Over 1k healing per second… ok

Thief spotted

Yep, it sucks for you that those things counter you hard when you 1v1 an Engineer who’s in a defensive position.

When an Engi is being ganked properly by a Thief/Necro or Engi/Necro, there is nothing he can do to survive. It’s probably the fastest 2v1 in the game, is what my point is. There is enough interrupts to chain fear/daze/knockdown the Engineer to death in record time, and Elixir S is incapable of stopping the gank, merely delay it by 3 seconds.

Ask Caed, Backpack, or Nos. Their business in tPvP is pretty much hunting opportunities to overwhelm Engies in 5 seconds, and snowball the map. That strategy really just isn’t viable against professions who, when they use all their defensive cooldowns, you can be certain they arent’ going to still splat in under 10 seconds.

My point is not that ‘engi dies when outnumbered (like everything else, omg!).’ It’s that none of the Engineer’s tools are highly successful get out of jail cards. When focus fired in the above mentioned scenario, there’s usually not even the chance to get the Toss Elixir S stealth off – it’s .5s cast is prevented by the chain interrupts, and magnet counters the gear shield handily.

Chaith.8256:

Thief spotted

Yep, it sucks for you that those things counter you hard when you 1v1 an Engineer who’s in a defensive position.

Engineer is a great profession, but it dies in about ~5 seconds to a Thief/Necro, Mesmer/Thief, or Necro/Engi coordinated burst.

Oh yeah, because mesmer thief and thief necro takes AGES to kill other professions.

Engineer spotted defending his broken class.

Chaith please, Let’s be real here, Engineer is obscenely broken, regardless of the class it’s fighting against, the only thing that even remotely counters it is a decent terrormancer. When I get bored I roll around on engi in yolo-queue and faceroll with little to no practice.

Let’s play the “How do we know its broken game” All logical reasons aside (because I could make an obscenely large list of reasons), you can simply enter a yoloqueue and see 3+ engi’s per team, and you have your answer.

Arachnid.4062:

Engineer spotted defending his broken class.

^

It doesn’t have to be a decent Terrormancer. Just hitting the buttons is enough.

So you’re saying they’re broken because they have a low skill floor. Got it.

Where were all the Engineers when P/P Enhance Performance Tool/Nade was a thang…

Now everyone’s a Turret Engi…
Good thing though, running with inexperienced players using it makes them semi-reliable and usually unable to die until someone comes assist.
There are lots of problematic matchups for them though… Well of Suffering, Meteor Shower, Hambots, Terrormancers, Rabid Balth Engi’s…
Maybe it’s because of their prevalence that it’s slowly becoming Ranged Wars 2.

Lol, engineer is fine at the highest level. Which is where I believe the game should be balanced.

Konoha.4613:

Lol, engineer is fine at the highest level. Which is where I believe the game should be balanced.

Bingo

Konoha.4613:

Lol, engineer is fine at the highest level. Which is where I believe the game should be balanced.

Last time I checked both NA and EU ToL 2 winners had 2 engis. If stacking engineers is balanced then I don’t know what to say.

Class stacking = imbalance in my opinion. Because obviously nobody will use 2 of the same class if its garbage. People will stack the overpowered one.

@Steb.2571 your opinion is so irrelevant man you obviously have no idea what you’re talking about. complain about anything you want about engis you still died like 18times to a zerker 1shot engi as a thief in one match.

@glock.6590 EU winners didn’t have 2 of them.

QFT: Konoha.4613:
Lol, engineer is fine at the highest level. Which is where I believe the game should be balanced.

I’m an engi player who also plays thief on occasion and can defeat decent engineers in duels, learn how they function and play better. People love to complain instead of adjusting their playstyle. You should not waste your time dueling an engi as a thief anyway it isn’t worth it.

Steb.2571:

Chaith please, Let’s be real here, Engineer is obscenely broken, regardless of the class it’s fighting against, the only thing that even remotely counters it is a decent terrormancer. When I get bored I roll around on engi in yolo-queue and faceroll with little to no practice.

Let’s play the “How do we know its broken game” All logical reasons aside (because I could make an obscenely large list of reasons), you can simply enter a yoloqueue and see 3+ engi’s per team, and you have your answer.

Arachnid.4062:

Engineer spotted defending his broken class.

^

I’m with steb on this one. When an engineer can hit you with an auto attack that burns you as much as one of its harder to land skill shots (Blowtorch), you know something is wrong. After swapping around between cele, berserker, rabid, carrion, and assassin nades, I can definitely see anyone who players rabid as being carried a lot, especially if you run P/S. Not that they aren’t great players and not that there isn’t a fairly high skill ceiling, but the 1v1, 2v2 potential of that build is really strong while not really being that bad in a team fight either. You can make a few mistakes and survive. Not to mention the pressure you do just by auto attacking is insanity.

Whenever I fight a rabid, balthazar, p/s geomancy nades engi in a 1v1, I basically have to not get hit once and if I do, make a full retreat and come back to try again. My play needs to basically be perfect or I get condi loaded and die. If I get into melee range, I’m an idiot. They’ll swap kits and all of a sudden, I have 3 stacks of bleeding poison and possibly burning on me from nothing. It’s absolutely silly how much this can do with skill that are not hard to land.

Also, saying something dies to mes/thief combo quickly is kinda silly. Everything dies to that fast, even bunkers. That’s what they do. They spike.

As for turret engi, I still think it’s WAY too high of a skill floor. You can carry yourself to a pretty stupid level just by having those down, especially against berserker classes. There have been matches where I’ve run turrets, left the fight to get a popcicle and ate it in my right hand while fighting. It’s easy mode. There are teams that run literally 2 turret engis and then roamers. They take far and home and just rotate like crazy. It’s annoying because if you try to split off some berserker class to take out the one on a far point, the turrets are usually enough pressure to keep the spiking to a minimum so the engi doesn’t die.

I swap to turret/condi engi when I have given up on playing fair.

glock.6590:

Konoha.4613:

Lol, engineer is fine at the highest level. Which is where I believe the game should be balanced.

Last time I checked both NA and EU ToL 2 winners had 2 engis. If stacking engineers is balanced then I don’t know what to say.

Class stacking = imbalance in my opinion. Because obviously nobody will use 2 of the same class if its garbage. People will stack the overpowered one.

Source?

From what I saw NA didn’t stack anything and the EU finals saw 2 guardians stack and cheese mode’s 2 ele 2 war 1 engi comp

Incoming Engi response:

Yes engi wrecks thieves. You get to complain when I get to complain about the passive fear necros.

Yes in 1v1, 2v2 scenarios supply crate can be huge. So is lich, rampage, rangers elite spirit, moa, and a few others. Engi’s are the only profession who consistently takes the same ELITE skill. DUH.

Yes EG auto is strong. Last I checked ele earth staff auto does 3x that though. Warriors can spam weakness a lot as well.

IP has been looked at a ton. No one has yet to come up with a good replacement but let’s be honest whats worse a high duration burn (due to a rune set most engis no longer take) or a equally passive fear thats necros have more than 1.

Yes turret engis are completely silly. Want to know why turrets work as an AI build? They can’t be crit, cant receive condis, and do not stack at all so you can be a bunker.
Not engis fault that’s arena-nets.

Steb using solo q as ANY form of argument is hilarious. It provides 0 basis.

If you think engi> thief is bad look into necro> engi which has been around since beta. It is the most absurd match up as engi has a FAR harder time escaping a necro than a thief does vs an engi.

The hambow requires more skill than engi is a lol moment. Yes the current nade toolkit elix s engi build is pretty skill-less. None more so than hambow, passive necro, or perma evade thief. That is a balance issue.

We WANT a low skill floor. You want a lot of new players to pick up the class. But there needs to be a DIFFERENCE between a new player and experienced using the same build. This is missed due to balance decisions.

Don’t blame engineers. Don’t blame the professions/players. We all know who creates the balance in this game not our fault for playing whats effective.

TLDR: Quit your complaining. There are far worse things that still need fixed LONG before engineers.

nerf incendiary powder or make it an on swap effect that can be evaded! Counterplay yknow, ever heard of that?

except when you had 6 engis every match you kind of get fed up with them

also chaith, saying that you need 2 classes/players to beat 1 engi just says a lot about how broken engi is

they need to nerf IP, idc how
turrets need to be affected by condi and crit dmg
all AI, not just turrets should be affected by master stats, if you build full tank your AI may be tank but does 0 dmg
celestial/might stacking needs to go from pvp

Thief is at a disadvantage in a 1v1, because in a few seconds he can be across the map +1ing then back to decap the second you leave…. They have relatively similar damage, sacrificing sustain for mobility

As far as turrets.. yea it should get nerfed into the ground, but lets be real thats only a solo q problem, so who cares..

Saying that any build in this game is easy/hard is stupid… every single build in this game is easy to play….. just because your pressing more or less buttons doesnt mean its hard….. Cele ele, Hambo, Terrormancer, Cele engi, all the builds that make up the meta are generally easy to play with medium to low skill floors and very high skill caps(which is what makes them viable in high level play) there is a reason that turret engi isnt in tournaments… teh skill cap is so low…..

you all complain about a passive burn on a 10s Cd thats “undodgeable”
well—-
Steal- removes two boons, dazes 21s
DS fear-instant, 15s, 3k damage CC
Ele 2 in fire- u can dodge but you still get hit by the beginning or the end of the channel =5s burn every time , tbh eles have 10x more burn than cele engis, and while vs condi engi it might be similar, cele ele has way more sustain than condi engis, and can deal with condis (engis cant)

People who main engi are defending engi, who would have guessed.

All of pvp is a joke, so who cares.

Mike.4830:

Thief is at a disadvantage in a 1v1, because in a few seconds he can be across the map +1ing then back to decap the second you leave…. They have relatively similar damage, sacrificing sustain for mobility

It’s not really just about thief vs engi, it’s about engi vs almost anything besides terrormancer and the fact that it’s so easy to play.

Mike.4830:

As far as turrets.. yea it should get nerfed into the ground, but lets be real thats only a solo q problem, so who cares..

Still a problem.

Mike.4830:

Saying that any build in this game is easy/hard is stupid… every single build in this game is easy to play….. just because your pressing more or less buttons doesnt mean its hard….. Cele ele, Hambo, Terrormancer, Cele engi, all the builds that make up the meta are generally easy to play with medium to low skill floors and very high skill caps(which is what makes them viable in high level play) there is a reason that turret engi isnt in tournaments… teh skill cap is so low…..

Hambow and condi engi are in a different league of easiness. Builds shouldn’t start so incredibly high in the skill floor department.

Mike.4830:

you all complain about a passive burn on a 10s Cd thats “undodgeable”
well—-
Steal- removes two boons, dazes 21s
DS fear-instant, 15s, 3k damage CC
Ele 2 in fire- u can dodge but you still get hit by the beginning or the end of the channel =5s burn every time , tbh eles have 10x more burn than cele engis, and while vs condi engi it might be similar, cele ele has way more sustain than condi engis, and can deal with condis (engis cant)

No one is saying that Incendiary powder is literally the worst most OP thing in the game. There are plenty of things that do lots of damage instantly, and they’re all OP. The topic is just talking about Engis. I could make you a pretty silly long list about stuff that’s as stupid as incendiary powder.

The thing that really bugs me about incendiary powder is that it can make an otherwise weak auto attack into a huge hit.

Cynz.9437:

except when you had 6 engis every match you kind of get fed up with them

also chaith, saying that you need 2 classes/players to beat 1 engi just says a lot about how broken engi is

they need to nerf IP, idc how
turrets need to be affected by condi and crit dmg
all AI, not just turrets should be affected by master stats, if you build full tank your AI may be tank but does 0 dmg
celestial/might stacking needs to go from pvp

Majorly twisting my words. Engineers are the best target in team fights, at top end. Better then anything. Besides.. Eura’s power ranger….? This is because they’re quite rush-able and very susceptible immobilize and CC. Just to spell this out, with no way to pop conditions off, or very good stunbreaks, and no teleports, that makes a candidate for focus.

Mike.4830:

you all complain about a passive burn on a 10s Cd thats “undodgeable”
well—-
Steal- removes two boons, dazes 21s
DS fear-instant, 15s, 3k damage CC
Ele 2 in fire- u can dodge but you still get hit by the beginning or the end of the channel =5s burn every time , tbh eles have 10x more burn than cele engis, and while vs condi engi it might be similar, cele ele has way more sustain than condi engis, and can deal with condis (engis cant)

If you can’t differentiate between instant cast skills and entirely random procs, is that really my problem?

If I predict and dodge steal, it goes on full cooldown.
If I predict and dodge doom, it goes on full cooldown.
If I predict and dodge IP… Oh kittening wait, I can’t predict and dodge IP because I’ll be hit with it as soon as I’m done dodging.

And comparing Incendiary Powder to the highly telegraphed Fire attunement skills of Ele is even more ridiculous.

Ele might be just as, or more powerful than engineer, but at least it has counterplay and doesn’t rely on completely passive damage like IP, Incendiary powder, Shrapnel, etc for its damage.

See this is why pre-nerf Frenzy/Bull’s Charge/Hundred Blades from beta should never have been changed. Now there is nothing to suppress these cancerous, toxic cancers from running rampant.

A LOT of runes still have effects that can’t be counter played at all. Remember the Balthazar rune set 6th bonus bug? A lot of runes sets still are bugged the same way. IP may be the same but so are a ton of other skills and runes. Stop focusing on a profession, focus on the general game bugs/balance issues.

Lol no counterplay? For engi? I know you guys hate the condi meta… but come on its an obvious weakness. We lose to condi necros and condi warriors. Condi mesmers can be a pain 2. The issue is neither of those warrior nor mesmer are viable at high tier play. Nor are they needed like chaithh said one good immob/fear and we are dead. Hell necro death shroud 2 is a disaster for us. Rips our swiftness/vigor and chills us.

And for earlier chaith’s 1v2 scenario is a decent example.
A d/d cele ele can survive for longer than engi in nearly every 1v2 scenario.
A warrior can survive even longer in same situation. Both still do absurd damage.

We are strong right now but we have a weakness, just because your team chooses not to run a necro or high condition pressure its your fault.

#condi meta lol.

Sorry but I believe JinDaVikk has won this argument.

Chaith.8256:

Cynz.9437:

except when you had 6 engis every match you kind of get fed up with them

also chaith, saying that you need 2 classes/players to beat 1 engi just says a lot about how broken engi is

they need to nerf IP, idc how
turrets need to be affected by condi and crit dmg
all AI, not just turrets should be affected by master stats, if you build full tank your AI may be tank but does 0 dmg
celestial/might stacking needs to go from pvp

Majorly twisting my words. Engineers are the best target in team fights, at top end. Better then anything. Besides.. Eura’s power ranger….? This is because they’re quite rush-able and very susceptible immobilize and CC. Just to spell this out, with no way to pop conditions off, or very good stunbreaks, and no teleports, that makes a candidate for focus.

hahaha 3s block on 20s (16s traited) cd and kitten stealth and a 3s invuln and a 8k+ heal on a 20s cd and tons of spam damage while running away.
yeah totallyyyyy easiest target. tbh after playing medi guard and bunker guard for forever in q’s and then rolling engi for a few, I was SO surprised how EASY it was to stay alive just by using blocks off cd and kiting like a motherkittener with perma swiftness.

It is funny that people complain about Incendiary powder when fire and air can do more dmg in 10 secs and cant be condi cleared

Booms.2594:

Chaith.8256:

Cynz.9437:

except when you had 6 engis every match you kind of get fed up with them

also chaith, saying that you need 2 classes/players to beat 1 engi just says a lot about how broken engi is

they need to nerf IP, idc how
turrets need to be affected by condi and crit dmg
all AI, not just turrets should be affected by master stats, if you build full tank your AI may be tank but does 0 dmg
celestial/might stacking needs to go from pvp

Majorly twisting my words. Engineers are the best target in team fights, at top end. Better then anything. Besides.. Eura’s power ranger….? This is because they’re quite rush-able and very susceptible immobilize and CC. Just to spell this out, with no way to pop conditions off, or very good stunbreaks, and no teleports, that makes a candidate for focus.

hahaha 3s block on 20s (16s traited) cd and kitten stealth and a 3s invuln and a 8k+ heal on a 20s cd and tons of spam damage while running away.
yeah totallyyyyy easiest target. tbh after playing medi guard and bunker guard for forever in q’s and then rolling engi for a few, I was SO surprised how EASY it was to stay alive just by using blocks off cd and kiting like a motherkittener with perma swiftness.

If you’re coming from a (teamfight) garbage tier- setup like Medi Guard, at least when it comes to dealing with focus, yes, Engi is better off than Medi Guard with Elixir S/Toolkit.

Problem is, the stealth you have to spend the casting time, and when you get locked and rocked in high tier, it’s not even going to happen 80% of the time if a Necro is assist-training you.

Also, while Elixir S and Toolkit are indispensable for Engineers to navigate Teamfights, there is a drawback to using Elixir S and Toolkit block as your primary means for surviving. That weakness is that you’re just hobbling away towards the backline while you’re using the invuln frames. The enemy push can not be survived if you get caught in even a short immobilize after. You can’t easily reposition yourself on an Engineer, bad positioning is punishable by death.

It’s not the same as Blinking, Shadowstep & Hide in Shadows, Flesh Wurming. Only people that can counter-teleport can catch up or push for you.

Also please tell me more about the Engineers that counter-spam you with damage while they’re locked in invulnerability, stealth, and channelling blocks to run away.

Strong profession (with a turret engi brainless build) but not op, it’s weak at condition damage.

I like how none of the engineers replying to this thread do anything to contradict what i said about the broken/stupid mechanics in my OP. Thanks for proving my point guys.

Their arguments can be summed up in basically 2 sentences: " Oh but condi necros can beat us!!! So we must not be overpowered and Incendiary powder must be a good mechanic!!!"

If IP was changed in how it procs and blowtorch didn’t ignore LoS (not 100% sure if it does I could be getting hit from latency potentially) , I think people would be fine with counterplay for engineer burning.

Arachnid.4062:

I like how none of the engineers replying to this thread do anything to contradict what i said about the broken/stupid mechanics in my OP. Thanks for proving my point guys.

Their arguments can be summed up in basically 2 sentences: " Oh but condi necros can beat us!!! So we must not be overpowered and Incendiary powder must be a good mechanic!!!"

That’s because it’s a dead horse. And unhelpful. Yep, A.I, super insta procs, and hard to avoid mechanics are very capitalized on, in PvP. Too bad none of those categories are Engineer specific. That’s why it’s irrelevant to this thread. Everyone uses instant damage procs and attacks that are not able to be reactively avoided. Necro, Mesmer, Thief, Engineer, Warrior, Ranger, Ele.. and.. RIP Guardian.

Chaith.8256:

Arachnid.4062:

I like how none of the engineers replying to this thread do anything to contradict what i said about the broken/stupid mechanics in my OP. Thanks for proving my point guys.

Their arguments can be summed up in basically 2 sentences: " Oh but condi necros can beat us!!! So we must not be overpowered and Incendiary powder must be a good mechanic!!!"

That’s because it’s a dead horse. And unhelpful. Yep, A.I, super insta procs, and hard to avoid mechanics are very capitalized on, in PvP. Too bad none of those categories are Engineer specific. That’s why it’s irrelevant to this thread. Everyone uses instant damage procs and attacks that are not able to be reactively avoided. Necro, Mesmer, Thief, Engineer, Warrior, Ranger, Ele.. and.. RIP Guardian.

yup if u cant avoid:
mirror blade
earthshaker
burning speed
whirling wrath

then ur probably pretty trash

Booms.2594:

Chaith.8256:

Arachnid.4062:

I like how none of the engineers replying to this thread do anything to contradict what i said about the broken/stupid mechanics in my OP. Thanks for proving my point guys.

Their arguments can be summed up in basically 2 sentences: " Oh but condi necros can beat us!!! So we must not be overpowered and Incendiary powder must be a good mechanic!!!"

That’s because it’s a dead horse. And unhelpful. Yep, A.I, super insta procs, and hard to avoid mechanics are very capitalized on, in PvP. Too bad none of those categories are Engineer specific. That’s why it’s irrelevant to this thread. Everyone uses instant damage procs and attacks that are not able to be reactively avoided. Necro, Mesmer, Thief, Engineer, Warrior, Ranger, Ele.. and.. RIP Guardian.

yup if u cant avoid:
mirror blade
earthshaker
burning speed
whirling wrath

then ur probably pretty trash

Actually I was more referring to: Air Sigil, Fire Sigil, Steal, Doom, Nightmare Runes, Air Attunement & Lightning Strike, Point Blank Shot. Clearly I wasn’t talking about the extremely easy to dodge attacks, what are you smoking? I know you’re trying to make me sound ridiculous, but it doesn’t even make sense enough for a funny joke.

Hello frands! Vee Wee here, #1 Engi NA and world first rank 80!

You guys are all silly! Gadget Engi is the greatest build of all time! OF ALL TIME! Incendiary Powder, Turrets, Elixirs, Kits… all trash! POW! Right in the cranium!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Chaith.8256:

Booms.2594:

Chaith.8256:

Arachnid.4062:

I like how none of the engineers replying to this thread do anything to contradict what i said about the broken/stupid mechanics in my OP. Thanks for proving my point guys.

Their arguments can be summed up in basically 2 sentences: " Oh but condi necros can beat us!!! So we must not be overpowered and Incendiary powder must be a good mechanic!!!"

That’s because it’s a dead horse. And unhelpful. Yep, A.I, super insta procs, and hard to avoid mechanics are very capitalized on, in PvP. Too bad none of those categories are Engineer specific. That’s why it’s irrelevant to this thread. Everyone uses instant damage procs and attacks that are not able to be reactively avoided. Necro, Mesmer, Thief, Engineer, Warrior, Ranger, Ele.. and.. RIP Guardian.

yup if u cant avoid:
mirror blade
earthshaker
burning speed
whirling wrath

then ur probably pretty trash

Actually I was more referring to: Air Sigil, Fire Sigil, Steal, Doom, Nightmare Runes, Air Attunement & Lightning Strike, Point Blank Shot. Clearly I wasn’t talking about the extremely easy to dodge attacks, what are you smoking? I know you’re trying to make me sound ridiculous, but it doesn’t even make sense enough for a funny joke.

You should throw devourer venom and panic strike in here too. The triggering of the effects themselves are hard to counterplay.

There’s reasoning behind all the QQ for IP among all the instant abilities mentioned though. I’ll leave you to figure out why that is.

Booms.2594:

yup if u cant avoid:
mirror blade
earthshaker
burning speed
whirling wrath

then ur probably pretty trash

Shockwave.1230:

I’ll leave you to figure out why that is.

Snarkiest thread, NA, EU, China

I support a nerf to IP as long as all other classes have their bs passive abilities/sustain nerfed. This includes reapers protection, shared anguish, the entire elementalist water line, healing signet and ofc rocket turret.

engineer is the easiest profession in the game to play in spvp. it’s designed for it. i’ve been saying it’s a broken profession for ages and have specifically pointed out incendiary powder and crate for being the reasons why it’s so powerful.

• incendiary powder is stupid strong and over compensates for engie’s one supposed weakness (ranged kiting). there is zero counterplay to this and coupled with balthazaar runes it gives engie near 100% uptime on burning.
• crate shouldnt have an aoe stun. thief has thieves guild which is on the same cooldown, except it only spawns two thiefs that do mediocre damage, attempt to use the buggiest pull in the game (scorpion wire) once, and are easy to kill. it doesnt give aoe heals and it doesn’t inflict aoe stun like it’s engineer cousin. i dont see why two skills on the same cooldown should vary in their actual quality so much. one is either underpowered or one is overpowered.
• all turrets (from crate as well) should be easier to kill; make them susceptible to critical hits and condition damage like every other AI in the game and give them a bit more hp to bring make things even.

Chaith.8256:

Thief spotted

Yep, it sucks for you that those things counter you hard when you 1v1 an Engineer who’s in a defensive position.

Engineer is a great profession, but it dies in about ~5 seconds to a Thief/Necro, Mesmer/Thief, or Necro/Engi coordinated burst.

you know what else dies to a coodinated burst that fast?
everything else in the game

congrats on the great post man

edit: also thief’s steal skill from engie is the worst in the game. make it usable like mesmer’s or warriors.

I like how this discussion is going..so far what I have learnt is:

Is that one profession out of 8 (necromancer) running one specific set of runes (nightmare) That proc’s passively once every 90 seconds is the hard counter to turrets.

Yup. That sounds pretty well balanced. One specific build running very specific ‘passive fear’ runes hard counters one specific build that holds point the entire time while it’s superior hard counter build stands at it’s longest distance and pushes it off point whenever it can.

Whatever game your playing,..it truly doesn’t sound fun when you say it out loud. It really-really doesn’t sound fun to play or watch.

Keep up the good work with this discussion. It does in it’s own way explain why less than 2% of players even bother with PvP.

I would often wonder back when I was still playing what was the reasoning behind nerf-stomping dhuumfire, a GM trait, while completely ignoring its master level equivalent in the engi proffession line, which flatly outperformed said GM skill.

Hello frands! Vee Wee here, #1 Engi NA and world first rank 80!

Well that’s easy! Burning hurts much less from an Engineer than it does from a Necromancer! Anyway Vee Wee sees many noskillz in this thread qqing about turret Engis! Well that’s just sadness indeed! L2P frands!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Arachnid.4062:

Over 1k healing per second… ok

Lol NA and their double Engi comps.

Where does that 1k come from btw?

sinject.4607:

you know what else dies to a coodinated burst that fast?
everything else in the game

congrats on the great post man

No 2 professions is going to kill an Ele, Warrior, Guardian, a Thief with Shadowstep&Refuge, a Mesmer with blink/decoy, in 5 seconds. All these professions have multiple stunbreaks and o-kitten buttons that they can layer. Most professions can expend cooldowns and exit harm’s way, and will need to be hard swapped to LATER.

If it comes down to it, you can hit up to 3 stances. Up to 3 Cantrips. Stunbreak, Stunbreak/teleport, Shadow Refuge. You get the idea.

The point is, which you are being too kitten dense and trolly to observe, is that Engineer defensive CDs blow. They’re god awful. They don’t displace you, or drop you as a target / stop the pain train for more than 3 seconds. The only reactive ability that is capable of doing this is the Elixir S Stealth. The problem with this is that you get Steal/Doom on you as soon as you exit your Invuln, and the stealth is easily interrupted. In the first place, Elixir S is the only one that’s really capable of doing any of these things. What if you aren’t packing Elixir S and Toolkit? God forbid anything else be brought into PvP.

Engineer is the least of my concern,easy counter in large and small scale fights. people will not stop crying until some of them realise that it is the system. the lack of ability to recognize two class profession in a rated match.
people will do whatever it takes to win just to flash their name on leaderboard, weve already seen this in the past up until now and its already been proven that, leaderboard rank still stands for nothing. remember this game must be equal on a higher and lower level play (must be like this or ship will sink) if you play glass and want to test your skill against a class profession that can kill you in 4moves, and has the ability to play defense.
i just wanna quote the saying, i know a lot of you might already been said this and those pro`s before us, i say your doing it wrong we play conquest after all.

Isn’t it engineer is such a masterpiece? a moving sentinel/scourge fountain, ha! esports.

Chaith.8256:

Thief spotted

Yep, it sucks for you that those things counter you hard when you 1v1 an Engineer who’s in a defensive position.

Engineer is a great profession, but it dies in about ~5 seconds to a Thief/Necro, Mesmer/Thief, or Necro/Engi coordinated burst.

Yes because clearly there’s any class that’ll stand up to a coordinated burst from competent players? Rolleyes doesn’t do this little gem justice, goodness.

Chaith.8256:

sinject.4607:

you know what else dies to a coodinated burst that fast?
everything else in the game

congrats on the great post man

No 2 professions is going to kill an Ele, Warrior, Guardian, a Thief with Shadowstep&Refuge, a Mesmer with blink/decoy, in 5 seconds. All these professions have multiple stunbreaks and o-kitten buttons that they can layer. Most professions can expend cooldowns and exit harm’s way, and will need to be hard swapped to LATER.

If it comes down to it, you can hit up to 3 stances. Up to 3 Cantrips. Stunbreak, Stunbreak/teleport, Shadow Refuge. You get the idea.

The point is, which you are being too kitten dense and trolly to observe, is that Engineer defensive CDs blow. They’re god awful. They don’t displace you, or drop you as a target / stop the pain train for more than 3 seconds. The only reactive ability that is capable of doing this is the Elixir S Stealth. The problem with this is that you get Steal/Doom on you as soon as you exit your Invuln, and the stealth is easily interrupted. In the first place, Elixir S is the only one that’s really capable of doing any of these things. What if you aren’t packing Elixir S and Toolkit? God forbid anything else be brought into PvP.

Stop you are making to much sense most people won’t be able to take it.

hackks.3687:

It doesn’t have to be a decent Terrormancer. Just hitting the buttons is enough.

Necro’s take offense to that..
So don’t drag a necro’s fear in here talking about the passive .. (it’s one passive on 60s cd)

shimmerless.4560:

vincecontix.1264:

Chaith.8256:

sinject.4607:

you know what else dies to a coodinated burst that fast?
everything else in the game

congrats on the great post man

No 2 professions is going to kill an Ele, Warrior, Guardian, a Thief with Shadowstep&Refuge, a Mesmer with blink/decoy, in 5 seconds. All these professions have multiple stunbreaks and o-kitten buttons that they can layer. Most professions can expend cooldowns and exit harm’s way, and will need to be hard swapped to LATER.

If it comes down to it, you can hit up to 3 stances. Up to 3 Cantrips. Stunbreak, Stunbreak/teleport, Shadow Refuge. You get the idea.

The point is, which you are being too kitten dense and trolly to observe, is that Engineer defensive CDs blow. They’re god awful. They don’t displace you, or drop you as a target / stop the pain train for more than 3 seconds. The only reactive ability that is capable of doing this is the Elixir S Stealth. The problem with this is that you get Steal/Doom on you as soon as you exit your Invuln, and the stealth is easily interrupted. In the first place, Elixir S is the only one that’s really capable of doing any of these things. What if you aren’t packing Elixir S and Toolkit? God forbid anything else be brought into PvP.

Stop you are making to much sense most people won’t be able to take it.

It makes zero sense, Engineers have dozens of displacements and the class doesn’t even even need to be on point to put out tremendous pressure in the first place. The stealth is easily interrupted? Oh my tears, welcome to our world.

If you want to run triple kits/two kits + gun then suck it up and make do with what you’ve got. Two rootless blocks and a natural reflect (on sub-minute cooldowns), hp/s through the roof, permanent swiftness/vigor, every defensive condition under the sun, gosh it must be rough! There are classes that play with just two utilities as a sacrifice for the team effort, the solipsism when it comes to some of you is astonishing.

Thing is though compare to other class engi meta builds defenses suck. That’s what a few player are complaining about. Engi that is cc, stun or dazed can’t block, stealth or use heal/condi clear.

Though players don’t bare these things in mind when making there complaints.

Powerful, unavoidable condition damage in conjunction with poor defense doesn’t make for healthy balance. Both need addressed. But you have to reign in the former before you improve upon the latter.

Suggestion: Significantly tone down IP and make it an adept level trait again. Accelerant-Packed Turrets goes back to master level, which prevents turret engis from getting the knockback, boons, and increased turret damage all in one build.

I know Chaith, it must suck, having a shield on a lower CD than warriors who have to invest in an entire weapon slot, 0s Weapon swap cooldown, undodgeable long duration burn, a pull, a knockback, and a ranged immob, an insanely powerful elite, access to 3 weapon sets at a time (4 if you went triple kit), stealth personal or team, invuln, Every condi in the entire kittening game, except torment. Multi strike ranged attacks that bypass blind and aegis. A leap, Enough power to crit for 3k with prybar, and 1k ranged autos. A heal that aoe burns, a heal that clenses, and blasts a water field in an aoe healing yourself and allies on an insanely low cd, and gives regen with the highest Heal / s in the game. 18k Base health with medium armor.

All in one build.

Yeah, you’re right, the struggle is real bro.