Guild Wars 2

PowerBottom.5796:

okay, now ppl not only want 2v2 and 3v3 Arena, but also 10v10 and 20v20? GW1 never had an arena-mode, because it’s a bland and uninteresting and strategically boring game-mode, whether it’s in a 2v2 or 20v20…. -.-°

I sincerely hope ANet won’t waste it’s time by introducing a game-mode for WoW-fanboys.

And if you want large-scale battles, go WvWvW, do you really think they’ll make a 20v20 Arena for PvP? This would mean:

1) potentially splitting up playerbase for structured PvP even more. Although I doubt anyone would play it for anything else than a small distraction.
2) Ridiculous waiting-times in match-making or even worse match-making in terms of actually matching up teams of equal skill.
3) There would be almost no competetive Teams and eSport possibilities for it, simply because of logistics: It’s hard enough to coordinate schedules for 5 players to consistantly play together, but for 20?
4) Why would any sponsor pay for a 20-man team anything more than for a 5-man team when there is actually almost no more exposure for their brand?

and yes, if they plan on making an entirely new game-mode etc. I think the aspect of it potentially being watched and heavily played, like an eSport, should definitely be considered and it just makes no sense for what you want.

Wrong wrong wrong and wrong.

“We” are asking for ~20v20 arenas since.. beta weekends? headstart? I don’t know when was the first time, but it’s not a new thing.

In gw1, there was RA , TA , Codex is still something similar to a TDM arena.

This thread was started in the HoT subforum, then moved to sPvP subforum, but a lot of wvw players are asking for it as it’s not that easy to do it in wvw. Ppl are doing it of course, as you can see in videos.

And I believe we don’t even ask for a Queue-system. If you could just do it in Costum Arenas, that would solve a lot of problems (and could generate gem sales, if it’s a special costum arena which must be bought).

Maybe you can’t see the potential in it, but that doesn’t mean there is no benefit making it.

PowerBottom.5796:

okay, now ppl not only want 2v2 and 3v3 Arena, but also 10v10 and 20v20? GW1 never had an arena-mode, because it’s a bland and uninteresting and strategically boring game-mode, whether it’s in a 2v2 or 20v20…. -.-°

I sincerely hope ANet won’t waste it’s time by introducing a game-mode for WoW-fanboys.

And if you want large-scale battles, go WvWvW, do you really think they’ll make a 20v20 Arena for PvP? This would mean:

1) potentially splitting up playerbase for structured PvP even more. Although I doubt anyone would play it for anything else than a small distraction.
2) Ridiculous waiting-times in match-making or even worse match-making in terms of actually matching up teams of equal skill.
3) There would be almost no competetive Teams and eSport possibilities for it, simply because of logistics: It’s hard enough to coordinate schedules for 5 players to consistantly play together, but for 20?
4) Why would any sponsor pay for a 20-man team anything more than for a 5-man team when there is actually almost no more exposure for their brand?

and yes, if they plan on making an entirely new game-mode etc. I think the aspect of it potentially being watched and heavily played, like an eSport, should definitely be considered and it just makes no sense for what you want.

Plenty of people dont find arenas bland. There is a definitely a playerbase out there who enjoys pure combat compared to additional objectives. Look at how big WOW’s pvp scene is in its arena mode.

No one is asking or even thinks GvG should or could be an esport. There is too much focus on Esports from Arenanets POV, and I think its hurting their judgment. We want more support for arenas in this game because they are fun and there is an audience(as if this thread didn’t show that enough) for it, not because it has esports potential.

I think the biggest confusion with Arenas, small or large scale arenas, is how they should be implemented. I don’t think making a brand new mode with queues would be a good option at all. Maybe for smaller scale like 2v2’s or 3v3’s it would be fine but for 20’s and 15’s it makes no sense. For 20’s and 15’s, there simply needs to be an option for people to fight other groups of the same size in an instance.

The easiest way to do this is increase the player limit to 20 people on each side in custom arenas and make the Obsidian Sanctum GvG arena one of the maps as an option.

Bubi.5237:

Wrong wrong wrong and wrong.

Well, thats a nice start for an argument….

Bubi.5237:

“We” are asking for ~20v20 arenas since.. beta weekends? headstart? I don’t know when was the first time, but it’s not a new thing.

So? The competetive PvP-Community has been asking for true GvG with 8v8 (6v6 or 5v5 would be fine as well, since the more important part is the gamemode(maps) on maps similar to those in GW1, which means multiple objectives, NPC’s etc.
→ we get Stronghold soon…. years later

Asking for sth. for a long time isn’t really an argument….

Bubi.5237:

In gw1, there was RA , TA , Codex is still something similar to a TDM arena.

Really? You’re gonna go there and talk about RA and TA? I’ve played GW1 PvP for 5k+ hours, top-20 GvG-team, multiple bronze and silver-capes and the only thing GA/TA was good for is what the trainings-dummies in the mists are for now. :P

Bubi.5237:

This thread was started in the HoT subforum, then moved to sPvP subforum, but a lot of wvw players are asking for it as it’s not that easy to do it in wvw. Ppl are doing it of course, as you can see in videos.

And I believe we don’t even ask for a Queue-system. If you could just do it in Costum Arenas, that would solve a lot of problems (and could generate gem sales, if it’s a special costum arena which must be bought).

Maybe you can’t see the potential in it, but that doesn’t mean there is no benefir making it.

Well, I have no real problem with it then when the effort to doing it was pretty much non-existant.

so, here you go:

+1 to giving ppl an arena-space with 20 slots per team and a simple, traightforward map. This would also solve the dampen for 2v2’s and 3v3’s a bit.

PowerBottom.5796:

So? The competetive PvP-Community has been asking for true GvG with 8v8 (6v6 or 5v5 would be fine as well, since the more important part is the gamemode(maps) on maps similar to those in GW1, which means multiple objectives, NPC’s etc.
-> we get Stronghold soon…. years later

Asking for sth. for a long time isn’t really an argument….

Well, you said that “okay, now ppl not only want 2v2 and 3v3 Arena, but also 10v10 and 20v20?” and I said that it’s not a new thing.. right?

PowerBottom.5796:

Really? You’re gonna go there and talk about RA and TA? I’ve played GW1 PvP for 5k+ hours, top-20 GvG-team, multiple bronze and silver-capes and the only thing GA/TA was good for is what the trainings-dummies in the mists are for now. :P

You said that “GW1 never had an arena-mode, because it’s a bland and uninteresting”, but a lot of “casuals” were playing in RA/TA, having fun, enjoying it.. so it’s not “bland and uninteresting” for them.
And I believe we had training-dummies in GW1, isn’t that what’s the gw2 golems are for? Playing in RA/TA was a bit more than hitting them. ^^

Ohh, btw I’m arguing for the sake of arguing

+1 This. Very well written, my friend. Let’s hope they listen this time.

I agree OP, i think this should be made into a new sPvP game mode.

Picture something like 15vs15 or 20vs20 fighting over a single tower. One group on the defensive side one on the offensive. Ah one can dream i guess…

TDM would be great. Conquest is fun and all, but gets boring. Nice variety of play modes with epic scale competitive battles would be pretty fun.

I personally think this should have stayed in the previous forum as this thread will get lost Here and voiced not heard. This is change we won’t for heart of thorns. it’s not a game play in the game itself.

seems like lots of posts from a handful of guilds. kind of an echo chamber effect.

more ways to play is better, so can’t argue that. would think it’d be easier to slice n dice an arena for RA style matches than 20 v 20. have to wonder if theres enough 20+ sized guilds that want this kind of content to support it. or would it be the same 5-10 guilds fighting each other.

maybe devs can take obsidian sanctum arena area (never been there so don’t know its size) but cut taht up into a proper pvp arena that people can do this 20v20 stuff.

Great post OP, you have my support.

ANet please make this happen. Listen to the community!

Jaxom.7310:

seems like lots of posts from a handful of guilds. kind of an echo chamber effect.

more ways to play is better, so can’t argue that. would think it’d be easier to slice n dice an arena for RA style matches than 20 v 20. have to wonder if theres enough 20+ sized guilds that want this kind of content to support it. or would it be the same 5-10 guilds fighting each other.

maybe devs can take obsidian sanctum arena area (never been there so don’t know its size) but cut taht up into a proper pvp arena that people can do this 20v20 stuff.

The GvG community is pretty large, but different groups of guilds are isolated by the different tiers they find themselves in. There are 10 or so active GvG/Fight guilds in T2 NA alone (that’s 200-300 players!). T1 has it’s own scene. As does T3 and T4. I do believe there was also a bottom feeders GvG tournament going on in T8 as well.

So currently yes, there should be enough, but I think there will have to be a lot of brainstorming to do in order to be able to come up with an idea that really sticks and won’t get bland.

Current GvGs supplement WvW (or the other way around depending on perspective) but I don’t think standalone TDM GvGs is something with long legs considering how short rounds actually are.

On the other hand, developing a mode would probably shed light on the scene and community a lot and may get new comers to enter the fray, which would definitely be welcomed. The issue right now is that the scene is fairly underground and spread mainly by word of mouth. To break it open for everyone to witness would definitely be a great boon.

The thing about MMOs is that it should feel massive in terms of player interaction. 5v5 has its place, but MMOs have always created communities of players (that are larger than 5 people) but GW2 doesn’t have anything strictly supporting large scale content for large communities (PvE, or PvP). You have loose nudges in that direction through Group Events like Mega bosses, Teq, TT Wurm, WvW, and Guild Missions, but nothing really structured with a system in place.

+1, it’s nice to see the community coming together for a push again. Let’s hope they give us something this time boys.

We’d have better luck getting a 2v2/3v3 arena in Unranked than a 10v10/20v20 eu vs na type map.

I can already see Anet shaking their heads. As much as I want it, it’s probably never going to happen.

thats still only 10 groups. i’m all for them creating a big ol arena and then the community (all of u here saying +1) can org your own tourney’s, but anet structuring a whole mode around it isn’t feasible. there’s too many smaller guilds they need to try and keep in mind too.

and i kind of disagree that theres not any large scale content. wvw is the large scale pvp (and if they gave u a big arena u could organize ur fights better), and all those events u mentioned are the large scale pve. all the guild missions etc are there for you. my tiny guild has never even been able to try a guild mish because theres simply no way the 5-10 of us could do it. best we can do it try to sync up with a shard that is going at it and try to play that way.

i like gw2 cause they give almost everyone a way to play their way and still get rewards. altho, i can agree u should have some kind of large arena to org ur fights. but i also think theres lot of other things they could do for pvp in general. and pve for that.

best we can do is be reasonable w/ expectations and try to convince them to create ways for us to play our way. in the case of this thread, i mean, would a giant arena at least get you mostly towards the goal u want? i didn’t read this whole thing cause… thats a lot about stuff i’ll never be interested in doing but i can understand the roadblocks currently keeping u from playing the way u want

Jaxom.7310:

best we can do is be reasonable w/ expectations and try to convince them to create ways for us to play our way. in the case of this thread, i mean, would a giant arena at least get you mostly towards the goal u want?

Obsidian Sanctum helps, assuming the guild you want to GvG happens to be in your server’s matchup for WvW.

However, as has been mentioned in this thread, that is why some guilds purposefully coordinate which server will/won’t move up/down a tier (purposefully losing in WvW, or doing a 2v1), to control the potential for GvG matchups (counterintuitive to how WvW is meant to work). The group of players I’ve been with for awhile, we’ve switched servers 5 times, in attempts to land in a “stable” tier, for consistent GvG style fights.

In the case of some NA tiers (T2, for example) there are enough “fight guilds” that Obsidian Sanctum is often in use during the hours your guild is online, and you end up awkwardly taking turns vs. other guilds, as to not upset allied guilds on your own server.

Making Obsidian Sanctum an instance would help, with the ability to invite guilds from servers that aren’t in your tier. Also, being able to do GvG’s against guilds that are on the same WvW server.

Fallen.4317:

http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/

This is an unedited screenshot of a fight between players from NA servers and EU servers in our “made up game mode” we call GvG here in GW2.

While we may all agree that simple team deathmatch 20v20 in a flat surface can be bland and is hardly a game mode, I think that this picture shows you the real interest in large scale PvP. Keep in mind, this is a completely and totally unofficial game-mode, with very little publicity or advertisement. The viewers on this are kitten near what ESL got, with all the publicity and whatnot you guys had on that. Imagine if you had hyped this.

I just ask that you folks at ArenaNet reconsider what your true focus is as far as what the PvP in this game entails. I love PvP, I’m rank 80, play it a lot. I loved large scale WvW fighting as well.

But the lack of a true player versus player mode with a larger scale basis that focuses on the true mechanics of the game’s combat system is a huge business blunder and something I definitely believe could benefit your company.

I think we all understand that WvW is a bit more casual of a game mode – there is no true rewards or incentives to play. This is totally fine, but ANET, you’re missing a massive business opportunity sitting right under your nose by overlooking the community of players that are interested in larger scale COMPETITIVE PvP. You’re never going to compete with League of Legends with Stronghold. But you’re overlooking an entire market because it seems to me, from the outside, that from a business standpoint you’re trying to get a slice of the MOBA pie when you could have a whole pie all to yourself.

Your game has an amazing combat system and an amazing capability to have very intense, teamwork-oriented fights at a larger scale. To be completely honest, I legitimately don’t think I’ve ever seen a game come close to the ability that you have currently to create a PvP mode to support a mid-scale (10-20 vs. 10-20) competitive PvP scene with the success I believe you would have.

I am not asking for GvG. I am asking for you to consider the possibility of having “raid size” COMPETITIVE player versus player, as I believe there is an entire untapped market out there that you would be able to benefit from without having to compete with games like SMITE, League, or DotA.

Just food for thought.

What you and the other gvgers seem to miss is the lessons your own scene teaches.

Why do you think your scene is dead? Why do you think smaller scale pvp is preferable from a business perspective?

If I were to look at the player based mode as a dev, I would think gvgs (or whatever you want to use as a codeword) as a waste of time to invest in.

SobeSoul.6910:

Fallen.4317:

http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/

This is an unedited screenshot of a fight between players from NA servers and EU servers in our “made up game mode” we call GvG here in GW2.

While we may all agree that simple team deathmatch 20v20 in a flat surface can be bland and is hardly a game mode, I think that this picture shows you the real interest in large scale PvP. Keep in mind, this is a completely and totally unofficial game-mode, with very little publicity or advertisement. The viewers on this are kitten near what ESL got, with all the publicity and whatnot you guys had on that. Imagine if you had hyped this.

I just ask that you folks at ArenaNet reconsider what your true focus is as far as what the PvP in this game entails. I love PvP, I’m rank 80, play it a lot. I loved large scale WvW fighting as well.

But the lack of a true player versus player mode with a larger scale basis that focuses on the true mechanics of the game’s combat system is a huge business blunder and something I definitely believe could benefit your company.

I think we all understand that WvW is a bit more casual of a game mode – there is no true rewards or incentives to play. This is totally fine, but ANET, you’re missing a massive business opportunity sitting right under your nose by overlooking the community of players that are interested in larger scale COMPETITIVE PvP. You’re never going to compete with League of Legends with Stronghold. But you’re overlooking an entire market because it seems to me, from the outside, that from a business standpoint you’re trying to get a slice of the MOBA pie when you could have a whole pie all to yourself.

Your game has an amazing combat system and an amazing capability to have very intense, teamwork-oriented fights at a larger scale. To be completely honest, I legitimately don’t think I’ve ever seen a game come close to the ability that you have currently to create a PvP mode to support a mid-scale (10-20 vs. 10-20) competitive PvP scene with the success I believe you would have.

I am not asking for GvG. I am asking for you to consider the possibility of having “raid size” COMPETITIVE player versus player, as I believe there is an entire untapped market out there that you would be able to benefit from without having to compete with games like SMITE, League, or DotA.

Just food for thought.

What you and the other gvgers seem to miss is the lessons your own scene teaches.

Why do you think your scene is dead? Why do you think smaller scale pvp is preferable from a business perspective?

If I were to look at the player based mode as a dev, I would think gvgs (or whatever you want to use as a codeword) as a waste of time to invest in.

If you are going to shoot down an idea, put some facts up please.

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

Fallen.4317:

http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/

This is an unedited screenshot of a fight between players from NA servers and EU servers in our “made up game mode” we call GvG here in GW2.

While we may all agree that simple team deathmatch 20v20 in a flat surface can be bland and is hardly a game mode, I think that this picture shows you the real interest in large scale PvP. Keep in mind, this is a completely and totally unofficial game-mode, with very little publicity or advertisement. The viewers on this are kitten near what ESL got, with all the publicity and whatnot you guys had on that. Imagine if you had hyped this.

I just ask that you folks at ArenaNet reconsider what your true focus is as far as what the PvP in this game entails. I love PvP, I’m rank 80, play it a lot. I loved large scale WvW fighting as well.

But the lack of a true player versus player mode with a larger scale basis that focuses on the true mechanics of the game’s combat system is a huge business blunder and something I definitely believe could benefit your company.

I think we all understand that WvW is a bit more casual of a game mode – there is no true rewards or incentives to play. This is totally fine, but ANET, you’re missing a massive business opportunity sitting right under your nose by overlooking the community of players that are interested in larger scale COMPETITIVE PvP. You’re never going to compete with League of Legends with Stronghold. But you’re overlooking an entire market because it seems to me, from the outside, that from a business standpoint you’re trying to get a slice of the MOBA pie when you could have a whole pie all to yourself.

Your game has an amazing combat system and an amazing capability to have very intense, teamwork-oriented fights at a larger scale. To be completely honest, I legitimately don’t think I’ve ever seen a game come close to the ability that you have currently to create a PvP mode to support a mid-scale (10-20 vs. 10-20) competitive PvP scene with the success I believe you would have.

I am not asking for GvG. I am asking for you to consider the possibility of having “raid size” COMPETITIVE player versus player, as I believe there is an entire untapped market out there that you would be able to benefit from without having to compete with games like SMITE, League, or DotA.

Just food for thought.

What you and the other gvgers seem to miss is the lessons your own scene teaches.

Why do you think your scene is dead? Why do you think smaller scale pvp is preferable from a business perspective?

If I were to look at the player based mode as a dev, I would think gvgs (or whatever you want to use as a codeword) as a waste of time to invest in.

If you are going to shoot down an idea, put some facts up please.

Fact: your gvg guilds quit the game regularly.

Fact: small scale pvp is more watchable than the visual clusterkitten gvg would be and already is.

Fact: 20 pvp teams could form from the same number of people it would take to make 5 20-man gvg guilds.

It’s a waste of resources for a scene that doesn’t even have guilds playing consistently.

To reiterate the said cons: It’s already a hastle to coordinate the same 5man teams together. It would be near impossible to do that with 20. Let alone getting 20 guild members together for a queue wait time of 30m. Simply put, we have 0 player base for this.
Smaller scale 2v2/3v3 teams are 10x more likely to happen.

SobeSoul.6910:

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

Fallen.4317:

http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/

This is an unedited screenshot of a fight between players from NA servers and EU servers in our “made up game mode” we call GvG here in GW2.

While we may all agree that simple team deathmatch 20v20 in a flat surface can be bland and is hardly a game mode, I think that this picture shows you the real interest in large scale PvP. Keep in mind, this is a completely and totally unofficial game-mode, with very little publicity or advertisement. The viewers on this are kitten near what ESL got, with all the publicity and whatnot you guys had on that. Imagine if you had hyped this.

I just ask that you folks at ArenaNet reconsider what your true focus is as far as what the PvP in this game entails. I love PvP, I’m rank 80, play it a lot. I loved large scale WvW fighting as well.

But the lack of a true player versus player mode with a larger scale basis that focuses on the true mechanics of the game’s combat system is a huge business blunder and something I definitely believe could benefit your company.

I think we all understand that WvW is a bit more casual of a game mode – there is no true rewards or incentives to play. This is totally fine, but ANET, you’re missing a massive business opportunity sitting right under your nose by overlooking the community of players that are interested in larger scale COMPETITIVE PvP. You’re never going to compete with League of Legends with Stronghold. But you’re overlooking an entire market because it seems to me, from the outside, that from a business standpoint you’re trying to get a slice of the MOBA pie when you could have a whole pie all to yourself.

Your game has an amazing combat system and an amazing capability to have very intense, teamwork-oriented fights at a larger scale. To be completely honest, I legitimately don’t think I’ve ever seen a game come close to the ability that you have currently to create a PvP mode to support a mid-scale (10-20 vs. 10-20) competitive PvP scene with the success I believe you would have.

I am not asking for GvG. I am asking for you to consider the possibility of having “raid size” COMPETITIVE player versus player, as I believe there is an entire untapped market out there that you would be able to benefit from without having to compete with games like SMITE, League, or DotA.

Just food for thought.

What you and the other gvgers seem to miss is the lessons your own scene teaches.

Why do you think your scene is dead? Why do you think smaller scale pvp is preferable from a business perspective?

If I were to look at the player based mode as a dev, I would think gvgs (or whatever you want to use as a codeword) as a waste of time to invest in.

If you are going to shoot down an idea, put some facts up please.

Fact: your gvg guilds quit the game regularly.

Fact: small scale pvp is more watchable than the visual clusterkitten gvg would be and already is.

Fact: 20 pvp teams could form from the same number of people it would take to make 5 20-man gvg guilds.

It’s a waste of resources for a scene that doesn’t even have guilds playing consistently.

They do not play consistently because there’s zero support. Many of them stated that they would come back permanently if it is supported.

Your fact about watchable? That’s an opinion not a fact. I do not find it pleasurable to watch 1v1 or 2v1 for a point. Not interesting to me. I love the teamwork it takes to do a Gvg battle and is much more interesting for me to watch.

I’m not sure what statement you were making wiTh your last fact.

Saiyan.1704:

To reiterate the said cons: It’s already a hastle to coordinate the same 5man teams together. It would be near impossible to do that with 20. Let alone getting 20 guild members together for a queue wait time of 30m. Simply put, we have 0 player base for this.
Smaller scale 2v2/3v3 teams are 10x more likely to happen.

We don’t want queues. There wouldn’t be a queue system with this. And 15 to 20 people are pretty coordinated. Just take a look at what happens now with the gvg fights. Happens no problem minus disconnects. But that happens is spvp too.

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

Fallen.4317:

http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/

This is an unedited screenshot of a fight between players from NA servers and EU servers in our “made up game mode” we call GvG here in GW2.

While we may all agree that simple team deathmatch 20v20 in a flat surface can be bland and is hardly a game mode, I think that this picture shows you the real interest in large scale PvP. Keep in mind, this is a completely and totally unofficial game-mode, with very little publicity or advertisement. The viewers on this are kitten near what ESL got, with all the publicity and whatnot you guys had on that. Imagine if you had hyped this.

I just ask that you folks at ArenaNet reconsider what your true focus is as far as what the PvP in this game entails. I love PvP, I’m rank 80, play it a lot. I loved large scale WvW fighting as well.

But the lack of a true player versus player mode with a larger scale basis that focuses on the true mechanics of the game’s combat system is a huge business blunder and something I definitely believe could benefit your company.

I think we all understand that WvW is a bit more casual of a game mode – there is no true rewards or incentives to play. This is totally fine, but ANET, you’re missing a massive business opportunity sitting right under your nose by overlooking the community of players that are interested in larger scale COMPETITIVE PvP. You’re never going to compete with League of Legends with Stronghold. But you’re overlooking an entire market because it seems to me, from the outside, that from a business standpoint you’re trying to get a slice of the MOBA pie when you could have a whole pie all to yourself.

Your game has an amazing combat system and an amazing capability to have very intense, teamwork-oriented fights at a larger scale. To be completely honest, I legitimately don’t think I’ve ever seen a game come close to the ability that you have currently to create a PvP mode to support a mid-scale (10-20 vs. 10-20) competitive PvP scene with the success I believe you would have.

I am not asking for GvG. I am asking for you to consider the possibility of having “raid size” COMPETITIVE player versus player, as I believe there is an entire untapped market out there that you would be able to benefit from without having to compete with games like SMITE, League, or DotA.

Just food for thought.

What you and the other gvgers seem to miss is the lessons your own scene teaches.

Why do you think your scene is dead? Why do you think smaller scale pvp is preferable from a business perspective?

If I were to look at the player based mode as a dev, I would think gvgs (or whatever you want to use as a codeword) as a waste of time to invest in.

If you are going to shoot down an idea, put some facts up please.

Fact: your gvg guilds quit the game regularly.

Fact: small scale pvp is more watchable than the visual clusterkitten gvg would be and already is.

Fact: 20 pvp teams could form from the same number of people it would take to make 5 20-man gvg guilds.

It’s a waste of resources for a scene that doesn’t even have guilds playing consistently.

They do not play consistently because there’s zero support. Many of them stated that they would come back permanently if it is supported.

Your fact about watchable? That’s an opinion not a fact. I do not find it pleasurable to watch 1v1 or 2v1 for a point. Not interesting to me. I love the teamwork it takes to do a Gvg battle and is much more interesting for me to watch.

I’m not sure what statement you were making wiTh your last fact.

Who cares what their reasoning is behind leaving? If I’m a developer, there’s no chance I’m designing a game mode for a wishy washy crowd.

GvG being unwatchable is not an opinion. It is a fact. There’s no camera that can cover the entire thing or single out intricate play. If you showed it to someone outside of the GW2 player base, they wouldn’t be able to distinguish much from it.

Why sink resources into a mode that you couldn’t promote on Twitch or where ever? It would be silly.

You gvg guys can scream for the mode you all want, but you need to take a healthy and honest look at why the chances of it happening is less than 2% in the next few years.

PowerBottom.5796:

GW1 never had an arena-mode, because it’s a bland and uninteresting and strategically boring game-mode

?

I guess all that time I spent in team arenas / randumb arenas getting up to r9 gladiator was a dream. A lot of GW1 players enjoyed both TA and GvG until the TA meta became permanently terrible from balance trickle-down. A more interesting question is why 4v4 in GW1 was so much fun, while 5v5 in in GW2 is not.

I agree though with larger teams there needs to be other game mechanics than kill, but not necessarily cap points that artificially force constant splits and fights at a specific spot. Here again I think GW1 provides some guidance with how Hero’s Ascent and GvG worked. Any group of idiots in HA could play gimmicky 8v8 builds for the first two maps that were death match, but they became disadvantaged to balanced builds on relic run / cap point / king of the hill maps. Same with GvG. Low end GvG was most frequently determined by 7v7 or 8v8 at the flag stand, but in higher end play there was much more strategy with splitting or controlling splits.

Doesn’t really matter though. The NA GvG scene has proved itself to be completely idiotic at every turn. EU seems to have a more healthy scene, but the only thing keeping a lid on gimmicks or trash builds is the difficulty of re-rolling a whole team, and what seems to be a gentleman’s agreement to play a certain way.

Lastly, for reasons we will probably never know, Anet has no interest in this. Most developers would jump on anything their player base is enthusiastic about trying to create, but for whatever reason there has been an awkward silence whenever the topic comes up. Maybe they just don’t want to commit resources to it, or see the PvP player base get too fragmented. Player base already is fragmented though between PvP and different tiers of the WvW ladder becoming de facto spots for different types of fighting.

SobeSoul.6910:

GvG being unwatchable is not an opinion. It is a fact. There’s no camera that can cover the entire thing or single out intricate play. If you showed it to someone outside of the GW2 player base, they wouldn’t be able to distinguish much from it.

Why sink resources into a mode that you couldn’t promote on Twitch or where ever? It would be silly.

If you don’t understand whats going on while watching, that’s fine. However, there are plenty of people that do. Admittedly it’s harder to see whats going on from a players PoV (which is how most fights are recorded and shared), a spectate-style camera would do just fine capturing the best moments of a fight.

And it can certainly be promoted on Twitch. Guilds fighting guilds in Guild Wars 2? Easy enough. And the fact that an -unpromoted- GvG that Fallen screenshotted (http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/) had nearly the same number of viewers as the ESL tournament is a good sign. The demand is there.

SobeSoul.6910:

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

Fallen.4317:

http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/

This is an unedited screenshot of a fight between players from NA servers and EU servers in our “made up game mode” we call GvG here in GW2.

While we may all agree that simple team deathmatch 20v20 in a flat surface can be bland and is hardly a game mode, I think that this picture shows you the real interest in large scale PvP. Keep in mind, this is a completely and totally unofficial game-mode, with very little publicity or advertisement. The viewers on this are kitten near what ESL got, with all the publicity and whatnot you guys had on that. Imagine if you had hyped this.

I just ask that you folks at ArenaNet reconsider what your true focus is as far as what the PvP in this game entails. I love PvP, I’m rank 80, play it a lot. I loved large scale WvW fighting as well.

But the lack of a true player versus player mode with a larger scale basis that focuses on the true mechanics of the game’s combat system is a huge business blunder and something I definitely believe could benefit your company.

I think we all understand that WvW is a bit more casual of a game mode – there is no true rewards or incentives to play. This is totally fine, but ANET, you’re missing a massive business opportunity sitting right under your nose by overlooking the community of players that are interested in larger scale COMPETITIVE PvP. You’re never going to compete with League of Legends with Stronghold. But you’re overlooking an entire market because it seems to me, from the outside, that from a business standpoint you’re trying to get a slice of the MOBA pie when you could have a whole pie all to yourself.

Your game has an amazing combat system and an amazing capability to have very intense, teamwork-oriented fights at a larger scale. To be completely honest, I legitimately don’t think I’ve ever seen a game come close to the ability that you have currently to create a PvP mode to support a mid-scale (10-20 vs. 10-20) competitive PvP scene with the success I believe you would have.

I am not asking for GvG. I am asking for you to consider the possibility of having “raid size” COMPETITIVE player versus player, as I believe there is an entire untapped market out there that you would be able to benefit from without having to compete with games like SMITE, League, or DotA.

Just food for thought.

What you and the other gvgers seem to miss is the lessons your own scene teaches.

Why do you think your scene is dead? Why do you think smaller scale pvp is preferable from a business perspective?

If I were to look at the player based mode as a dev, I would think gvgs (or whatever you want to use as a codeword) as a waste of time to invest in.

If you are going to shoot down an idea, put some facts up please.

Fact: your gvg guilds quit the game regularly.

Fact: small scale pvp is more watchable than the visual clusterkitten gvg would be and already is.

Fact: 20 pvp teams could form from the same number of people it would take to make 5 20-man gvg guilds.

It’s a waste of resources for a scene that doesn’t even have guilds playing consistently.

They do not play consistently because there’s zero support. Many of them stated that they would come back permanently if it is supported.

Your fact about watchable? That’s an opinion not a fact. I do not find it pleasurable to watch 1v1 or 2v1 for a point. Not interesting to me. I love the teamwork it takes to do a Gvg battle and is much more interesting for me to watch.

I’m not sure what statement you were making wiTh your last fact.

Who cares what their reasoning is behind leaving? If I’m a developer, there’s no chance I’m designing a game mode for a wishy washy crowd.

GvG being unwatchable is not an opinion. It is a fact. There’s no camera that can cover the entire thing or single out intricate play. If you showed it to someone outside of the GW2 player base, they wouldn’t be able to distinguish much from it.

Why sink resources into a mode that you couldn’t promote on Twitch or where ever? It would be silly.

You gvg guys can scream for the mode you all want, but you need to take a healthy and honest look at why the chances of it happening is less than 2% in the next few years.

The fact is that the OP linked a screenshot to a gvg having 800+ viewers. What are you even saying?

Ogre.3124:

SobeSoul.6910:

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

tluv.5821:

SobeSoul.6910:

Fallen.4317:

http://postimg.org/image/z4husdh3j/full/

This is an unedited screenshot of a fight between players from NA servers and EU servers in our “made up game mode” we call GvG here in GW2.

While we may all agree that simple team deathmatch 20v20 in a flat surface can be bland and is hardly a game mode, I think that this picture shows you the real interest in large scale PvP. Keep in mind, this is a completely and totally unofficial game-mode, with very little publicity or advertisement. The viewers on this are kitten near what ESL got, with all the publicity and whatnot you guys had on that. Imagine if you had hyped this.

I just ask that you folks at ArenaNet reconsider what your true focus is as far as what the PvP in this game entails. I love PvP, I’m rank 80, play it a lot. I loved large scale WvW fighting as well.

But the lack of a true player versus player mode with a larger scale basis that focuses on the true mechanics of the game’s combat system is a huge business blunder and something I definitely believe could benefit your company.

I think we all understand that WvW is a bit more casual of a game mode – there is no true rewards or incentives to play. This is totally fine, but ANET, you’re missing a massive business opportunity sitting right under your nose by overlooking the community of players that are interested in larger scale COMPETITIVE PvP. You’re never going to compete with League of Legends with Stronghold. But you’re overlooking an entire market because it seems to me, from the outside, that from a business standpoint you’re trying to get a slice of the MOBA pie when you could have a whole pie all to yourself.

Your game has an amazing combat system and an amazing capability to have very intense, teamwork-oriented fights at a larger scale. To be completely honest, I legitimately don’t think I’ve ever seen a game come close to the ability that you have currently to create a PvP mode to support a mid-scale (10-20 vs. 10-20) competitive PvP scene with the success I believe you would have.

I am not asking for GvG. I am asking for you to consider the possibility of having “raid size” COMPETITIVE player versus player, as I believe there is an entire untapped market out there that you would be able to benefit from without having to compete with games like SMITE, League, or DotA.

Just food for thought.

What you and the other gvgers seem to miss is the lessons your own scene teaches.

Why do you think your scene is dead? Why do you think smaller scale pvp is preferable from a business perspective?

If I were to look at the player based mode as a dev, I would think gvgs (or whatever you want to use as a codeword) as a waste of time to invest in.

If you are going to shoot down an idea, put some facts up please.

Fact: your gvg guilds quit the game regularly.

Fact: small scale pvp is more watchable than the visual clusterkitten gvg would be and already is.

Fact: 20 pvp teams could form from the same number of people it would take to make 5 20-man gvg guilds.

It’s a waste of resources for a scene that doesn’t even have guilds playing consistently.

They do not play consistently because there’s zero support. Many of them stated that they would come back permanently if it is supported.

Your fact about watchable? That’s an opinion not a fact. I do not find it pleasurable to watch 1v1 or 2v1 for a point. Not interesting to me. I love the teamwork it takes to do a Gvg battle and is much more interesting for me to watch.

I’m not sure what statement you were making wiTh your last fact.

Who cares what their reasoning is behind leaving? If I’m a developer, there’s no chance I’m designing a game mode for a wishy washy crowd.

GvG being unwatchable is not an opinion. It is a fact. There’s no camera that can cover the entire thing or single out intricate play. If you showed it to someone outside of the GW2 player base, they wouldn’t be able to distinguish much from it.

Why sink resources into a mode that you couldn’t promote on Twitch or where ever? It would be silly.

You gvg guys can scream for the mode you all want, but you need to take a healthy and honest look at why the chances of it happening is less than 2% in the next few years.

The fact is that the OP linked a screenshot to a gvg having 800+ viewers. What are you even saying?

Oh, Chem’s channel got 800 viewers once. So has a pve stream. Yawn.

SobeSoul.6910:

Who cares what their reasoning is behind leaving? If I’m a developer, there’s no chance I’m designing a game mode for a wishy washy crowd.

GvG being unwatchable is not an opinion. It is a fact. There’s no camera that can cover the entire thing or single out intricate play. If you showed it to someone outside of the GW2 player base, they wouldn’t be able to distinguish much from it.

Why sink resources into a mode that you couldn’t promote on Twitch or where ever? It would be silly.

You gvg guys can scream for the mode you all want, but you need to take a healthy and honest look at why the chances of it happening is less than 2% in the next few years.

In all honesty, conquest isn’t that pleasurable of a viewing experience either, especially since there are multiple skirmishes happening at the same time, it’s nearly impossible to capture every play unless it’s a teamfight going on at a point or something, and that’s pretty rare as people would rotate out to try to decap the obviously uncontested points. And then additionally, non GW2 players will probably have a hard time following normal PvP anyway. Hell I bet if you get a PvE main to spectate a PvP match they won’t understand either.

That not withstanding, with first person view, it’s now possible to get an overhead view in the Obsidian Sanctum of a GvG, similar to how camera works for traditional sports like hockey, football, soccer, basketball. You cover the entire play area and can see the movements of both guilds’ melee trains, backlines, and gank skirmishes.

I think a lot criticism stems from the misconception that something like this has to be easily spectated (not going to argue whether it is or not, just that people for some reason are under the assumption that it has to be) or that you need to have a matchmaking system. It’s not a mode that lends itself to being spectator friendly with a complex algorithm to matchmake and determine leaderboards (hell Anet’s still trying to figure out normal matchmaking and leaderboards for PvP), neither does it have to. It’s about being a worthwhile thing to have because people have fun doing it.

WvW is 100% impossible to spectate, because in addition to the points you brought up regarding 15v15/20v20, you still have capture points spread across 4 maps. Yet WvW exists.

And I think the reasoning behind leaving is important to consider. People want to play the game, but can’t because there’s no support for how they play. It’s a chicken and egg scenario.

I don’t think it’s as simple as saying guilds leave and that’s why Anet shouldn’t put in dev time. There’s a lot of things that go into the reason guilds leave that’s not just clearcut “because the game isn’t interesting”. The pool of guilds to fight right now is restricted to guilds not on your server, and guilds who are in your tier. Those severely limit possible opponents. EotM is currently a suboptimal battle ground as there are a ton of environmental hazards such as canons that can easily disrupt the middle of a fight.

SobeSoul.6910:

Oh, Chem’s channel got 800 viewers once. So has a pve stream. Yawn.

This has probably been the most dead the GvG scene has gotten, and it still hit 800 viewers, all the while when at the same time G4GW2 EU was running with 500 viewers.

Lest we forget Agg vs TA had 4.3k viewers when that happened last year.

If people knew that GvGs were going on more often, then yes they would probably watch.

Jinn.7948:

SobeSoul.6910:

Who cares what their reasoning is behind leaving? If I’m a developer, there’s no chance I’m designing a game mode for a wishy washy crowd.

GvG being unwatchable is not an opinion. It is a fact. There’s no camera that can cover the entire thing or single out intricate play. If you showed it to someone outside of the GW2 player base, they wouldn’t be able to distinguish much from it.

Why sink resources into a mode that you couldn’t promote on Twitch or where ever? It would be silly.

You gvg guys can scream for the mode you all want, but you need to take a healthy and honest look at why the chances of it happening is less than 2% in the next few years.

In all honesty, conquest isn’t that pleasurable of a viewing experience either, especially since there are multiple skirmishes happening at the same time, it’s nearly impossible to capture every play unless it’s a teamfight going on at a point or something, and that’s pretty rare as people would rotate out to try to decap the obviously uncontested points. And then additionally, non GW2 players will probably have a hard time following normal PvP anyway. Hell I bet if you get a PvE main to spectate a PvP match they won’t understand either.

That not withstanding, with first person view, it’s now possible to get an overhead view in the Obsidian Sanctum of a GvG, similar to how camera works for traditional sports like hockey, football, soccer, basketball. You cover the entire play area and can see the movements of both guilds’ melee trains, backlines, and gank skirmishes.

I think a lot criticism stems from the misconception that something like this has to be easily spectated (not going to argue whether it is or not, just that people for some reason are under the assumption that it has to be) or that you need to have a matchmaking system. It’s not a mode that lends itself to being spectator friendly with a complex algorithm to matchmake and determine leaderboards (hell Anet’s still trying to figure out normal matchmaking and leaderboards for PvP), neither does it have to. It’s about being a worthwhile thing to have because people have fun doing it.

WvW is 100% impossible to spectate, because in addition to the points you brought up regarding 15v15/20v20, you still have capture points spread across 4 maps. Yet WvW exists.

And I think the reasoning behind leaving is important to consider. People want to play the game, but can’t because there’s no support for how they play. It’s a chicken and egg scenario.

I don’t think it’s as simple as saying guilds leave and that’s why Anet shouldn’t put in dev time. There’s a lot of things that go into the reason guilds leave that’s not just clearcut “because the game isn’t interesting”. The pool of guilds to fight right now is restricted to guilds not on your server, and guilds who are in your tier. Those severely limit possible opponents. EotM is currently a suboptimal battle ground as there are a ton of environmental hazards such as canons that can easily disrupt the middle of a fight.

You say conquest isn’t viewer friendly always and try to explain how gvgs can be. lol. I agree with you that conquest isn’t always viewer friendly. When 8 people get together and team fight, you miss things because the laser light show. You add 30 more to it, and it just looks like a mess to people who don’t play the game or gvg.

I’m not against a gvg game mode. But it’s like none of you gvgers ever stop and look at it from the perspective of the game designers. I have heard some of the gvg activists whine about how Anet is so evil blah blah blah. I would almost guarantee none of them understand business, nor the business structure of Anet.

Jinn.7948:

SobeSoul.6910:

Oh, Chem’s channel got 800 viewers once. So has a pve stream. Yawn.

This has probably been the most dead the GvG scene has gotten, and it still hit 800 viewers, all the while when at the same time G4GW2 EU was running with 500 viewers.

Lest we forget Agg vs TA had 4.3k viewers when that happened last year.

If people knew that GvGs were going on more often, then yes they would probably watch.

Considering gvgs are broadcast a lot, usually see one a night of some sort while browsing GW2’s twitch directory, and get next to no viewers I don’t think this statement is accurate.

Sodapoppin got 15k viewers and he was a complete GW2 newbie.

I would also state that when you get 800 viewers on Twitch in GW2, you are on top of the list, so you are probably getting quite a few viewers who just watch GW2 in general, and not there for gvgs or spvp or pve in particular.

Gauging how popular gvg actually is among players would take guilds doing rolecalls of sorts and tallying numbers on a nightly basis to give Anet data.

-1, horrible way to spend resources. Developing a gamemode for what, 100 people per region? You can’t be serious. Besides the combat system was simply not designed for that.

adrielle.2109:

-waves from Tier 8-

[VOX]
[SN]
[HK]
[Jynx]
[Bard]
[Maki]
[VNG]
[DoD]
[Krew]
[SL]
[BAT]
[HT]
[ALS]
[MOA]
[Phnx]
[Noop]
[NK]
[SA]

Edit to remove crap – that’s 18 Guilds participating in a made-up unsupported GvG tournament in T6/7/8 only, requiring a minimum of 10v10, so that’s a minimum of 180 people right there.

There’s way more Guilds than that doing 15/20v every day in the other tiers, on both the EU and NA servers (and even the Chinese ones too). How many thousands of people do you think that is?

witcher.3197:

-1, horrible way to spend resources. Developing a gamemode for what, 100 people per region? You can’t be serious. Besides the combat system was simply not designed for that.

The scene isn’t as busy now, but at its height I’d peg it at a few thousand per region. That’s with an unofficial game mode.

If there were some mechanic to allow guilds to fight outside of their tier (that isn’t color-based like EotM), the competition would be better. I think it would also open it up to more casual guilds that don’t GvG but see it as another activity to do on a large scale, a la Guild Missions.

Frankly I think it comes down to a lot of people not being exposed to the playstyle. I get the impression that a lot of hardcore PvPers dislike wvw because their only experience with it is either roaming, or joining a zerg.

While roaming can be a satisfying experience, I’m sure zerging is sort of devoid of any real strategy or complexity. Nor does it have any real organization.

GvG/fighting imo is the bridge between PvP and WvW much like how WvW is supposed to be the bridge between PvE and PvP.

superseven.1058:

witcher.3197:

-1, horrible way to spend resources. Developing a gamemode for what, 100 people per region? You can’t be serious. Besides the combat system was simply not designed for that.

The scene isn’t as busy now, but at its height I’d peg it at a few thousand per region. That’s with an unofficial game mode.

If there were some mechanic to allow guilds to fight outside of their tier (that isn’t color-based like EotM), the competition would be better. I think it would also open it up to more casual guilds that don’t GvG but see it as another activity to do on a large scale, a la Guild Missions.

You need too many players for a team. Qs would be dead for 20-22 hours a day, with no matchmaking. Because of the size of the rosters, 99% of the gw2 community would never get to experience it. It’s a bad investment for Anet.

witcher.3197:

You need too many players for a team. Qs would be dead for 20-22 hours a day, with no matchmaking. Because of the size of the rosters, 99% of the gw2 community would never get to experience it. It’s a bad investment for Anet.

I believe “most of us” are not asking for Qs and matchmaking, but a (better) place to use for it.

Sizzle Hint.1820:

I agree OP, i think this should be made into a new sPvP game mode.

Picture something like 15vs15 or 20vs20 fighting over a single tower. One group on the defensive side one on the offensive. Ah one can dream i guess…

Considering it took them an eternity to come up with a single Stronghold map I wouldn’t expect anything revolutionary in terms of pvp content duting GW2 lifespan.

Look at all the people thinking that the GvG community is small when new GvG guilds are forming up constantly. There is a serious misunderstanding of what GvG is from people that never participated in one, both from a gameplay and community perspective.

A GvG hub would give this game new life. A single Stronghold map will get pvp players sticking around for 6 more months or so before they are bored again.

Jinn.7948:

Frankly I think it comes down to a lot of people not being exposed to the playstyle. I get the impression that a lot of hardcore PvPers dislike wvw because their only experience with it is either roaming, or joining a zerg.

While roaming can be a satisfying experience, I’m sure zerging is sort of devoid of any real strategy or complexity. Nor does it have any real organization.

GvG/fighting imo is the bridge between PvP and WvW much like how WvW is supposed to be the bridge between PvE and PvP.

I don’t think exposure is the issue. It’s not that PvPers dislike WvW, it’s because WvW offers no skillful game play on an individual level for numerous reasons.

I have watched enough gvgs to understand that a lot of the game play is really brainless in comparison to spvp. Waiting on some guy yelling in TS to tell you when to throw down wells or deliver hammer stuns isn’t something I consider an art form like knowing when to lay down a cc combo. Not to mention, gvg meta appears to be 100x less diverse than our already non-diverse spvp meta lol. I mean you guys don’t use one or two classes when all classes are playable. Something is wrong there.

Xillllix.3485:

Sizzle Hint.1820:

I agree OP, i think this should be made into a new sPvP game mode.

Picture something like 15vs15 or 20vs20 fighting over a single tower. One group on the defensive side one on the offensive. Ah one can dream i guess…

Considering it took them an eternity to come up with a single Stronghold map I wouldn’t expect anything revolutionary in terms of pvp content duting GW2 lifespan.

Look at all the people thinking that the GvG community is small when new GvG guilds are forming up constantly. There is a serious misunderstanding of what GvG is from people that never participated in one, both from a gameplay and community perspective.

A GvG hub would give this game new life. A single Stronghold map will get pvp players sticking around for 6 more months or so before they are bored again.

New gvg guilds form from players from dead gvg guilds. lol. It is doubtful any game mode is receiving a steady increase of new blood these days. Maybe new guilds form, but how many actual new players are joining in?

SobeSoul.6910:

Xillllix.3485:

Sizzle Hint.1820:

I agree OP, i think this should be made into a new sPvP game mode.

Picture something like 15vs15 or 20vs20 fighting over a single tower. One group on the defensive side one on the offensive. Ah one can dream i guess…

Considering it took them an eternity to come up with a single Stronghold map I wouldn’t expect anything revolutionary in terms of pvp content duting GW2 lifespan.

Look at all the people thinking that the GvG community is small when new GvG guilds are forming up constantly. There is a serious misunderstanding of what GvG is from people that never participated in one, both from a gameplay and community perspective.

A GvG hub would give this game new life. A single Stronghold map will get pvp players sticking around for 6 more months or so before they are bored again.

New gvg guilds form from players from dead gvg guilds. lol. It is doubtful any game mode is receiving a steady increase of new blood these days. Maybe new guilds form, but how many actual new players are joining in?

It really doesn’t matter hat you think about the GvG community size considering it doesn’t even have a proper map and isn’t a supported game mode. If it was in the game, with defined rules, ranking and a good 4-5 arenas, people would play it more than PvP.

Nothing would be better for GW2 than having short WvW-size type battles with a scoring system that isn’t as meaningless as the current PPT system.

+1 Has my support.

Logistically speaking, I think it is sort of unfair for us to ask for everything all at once. As many people have said, Arena Net would have to make sure that they can profit off something like this before they can fully support it.

I think a great way to get the ball rolling would be to add an NPC to the coming Guild Halls which provide guild leaders with the ability to challenge other guilds to a GvG. The size of the fight, ranging from 5v5’s to 20v20’s, could be selected while interacting with the NPC and the fight could take place in an instanced form of the OS (that way no new maps need to be developed). By being able to select the size of the fight, no guilds are excluded from the game mode. Upon accepting a guilds challenge to GvG, guild leaders could invite ‘x’ amount of players to a squad and enter the OS. If Arena Net wished to make money off this game mode, they could simply charge guilds a monthly gem fee to have the NPC present in their guild hall (sort of like how private arenas work now). As long as guilds have the ability to challenge other guilds regardless of their server/tier (and maybe one day their continent) I’m sure it would be a hit.

If the idea became more popular things like spectator mode, new maps and a leaderboard could be added later.

Just my 2 cents.

x FERGUSON.3046:

+1 Has my support.

Logistically speaking, I think it is sort of unfair for us to ask for everything all at once. As many people have said, Arena Net would have to make sure that they can profit off something like this before they can fully support it.

I think a great way to get the ball rolling would be to add an NPC to the coming Guild Halls which provide guild leaders with the ability to challenge other guilds to a GvG. The size of the fight, ranging from 5v5’s to 20v20’s, could be selected while interacting with the NPC and the fight could take place in an instanced form of the OS (that way no new maps need to be developed). By being able to select the size of the fight, no guilds are excluded from the game mode. Upon accepting a guilds challenge to GvG, guild leaders could invite ‘x’ amount of players to a squad and enter the OS. If Arena Net wished to make money off this game mode, they could simply charge guilds a monthly gem fee to have the NPC present in their guild hall (sort of like how private arenas work now). As long as guilds have the ability to challenge other guilds regardless of their server/tier (and maybe one day their continent) I’m sure it would be a hit.

If the idea became more popular things like spectator mode, new maps and a leaderboard could be added later.

Just my 2 cents.

u r still asking for too much. ur best bet to start w/ is to have a single arena for your 20v20s. at the very best, u can try to get them to make an arena out of obsidian sanctums dueling area, or where ever these fights take place. likely as a custom arena or something

got to think, whats the smallest amount of work devs could do for you to get the most out of it. from what i’m seeing, its something like this.

Xillllix.3485:

SobeSoul.6910:

Xillllix.3485:

Sizzle Hint.1820:

I agree OP, i think this should be made into a new sPvP game mode.

Picture something like 15vs15 or 20vs20 fighting over a single tower. One group on the defensive side one on the offensive. Ah one can dream i guess…

Considering it took them an eternity to come up with a single Stronghold map I wouldn’t expect anything revolutionary in terms of pvp content duting GW2 lifespan.

Look at all the people thinking that the GvG community is small when new GvG guilds are forming up constantly. There is a serious misunderstanding of what GvG is from people that never participated in one, both from a gameplay and community perspective.

A GvG hub would give this game new life. A single Stronghold map will get pvp players sticking around for 6 more months or so before they are bored again.

New gvg guilds form from players from dead gvg guilds. lol. It is doubtful any game mode is receiving a steady increase of new blood these days. Maybe new guilds form, but how many actual new players are joining in?

It really doesn’t matter hat you think about the GvG community size considering it doesn’t even have a proper map and isn’t a supported game mode. If it was in the game, with defined rules, ranking and a good 4-5 arenas, people would play it more than PvP.

Nothing would be better for GW2 than having short WvW-size type battles with a scoring system that isn’t as meaningless as the current PPT system.

Lol. The first part is absolutely wrong. The average player would rather spend 5 minutes in queue than fiddle around for however long it takes 20 player teams to organize fights and all the time you guys spend between rounds.

Second part is just your preference.

+1 for PvP in general

Gvgs would be great (even though I’ve moved on) but more regular pvp maps for the competitive rotation would be appreciated.

Right now your squandering a unique pvp experience that I believe has the potential to sit beside LoL and the other greats

witcher.3197:

superseven.1058:

witcher.3197:

-1, horrible way to spend resources. Developing a gamemode for what, 100 people per region? You can’t be serious. Besides the combat system was simply not designed for that.

The scene isn’t as busy now, but at its height I’d peg it at a few thousand per region. That’s with an unofficial game mode.

If there were some mechanic to allow guilds to fight outside of their tier (that isn’t color-based like EotM), the competition would be better. I think it would also open it up to more casual guilds that don’t GvG but see it as another activity to do on a large scale, a la Guild Missions.

You need too many players for a team. Qs would be dead for 20-22 hours a day, with no matchmaking. Because of the size of the rosters, 99% of the gw2 community would never get to experience it. It’s a bad investment for Anet.

I wouldn’t go with a Q mechanic. Something closer to LFG tool might make sense. I agree it will probably be empty outside of NA prime, though.

+1

by far my favorite part of the game

SobeSoul.6910:

Sodapoppin got 15k viewers and he was a complete GW2 newbie.

Sodapoppin got 15k viewers because he’s Sodapoppin not because he was playing Guildwars 2.

SobeSoul.6910:

I have watched enough gvgs to understand that a lot of the game play is really brainless in comparison to spvp. Waiting on some guy yelling in TS to tell you when to throw down wells or deliver hammer stuns isn’t something I consider an art form like knowing when to lay down a cc combo.

This is how pug blobs in WvW work, not how any of the best GvG guilds have worked. The driver is a beacon for the rough positioning of the group and a safe place to regroup. Melee are expected to stay fairly tight to tag but even individual melee take opportunities they see by reading the situation. It’s very rare for a driver to call skills, or well bombs, or anything specific like that.

Disappointed that this thread was moved to this forum. It’s already starting to turn into a mix of “YOUR GVGS NOT TRUEEEEE GVGGGG!!!!!!” and “That thing I’ve never tried and admit i don’t understand is bad”.

KcB.6890:

SobeSoul.6910:

Sodapoppin got 15k viewers and he was a complete GW2 newbie.

Sodapoppin got 15k viewers because he’s Sodapoppin not because he was playing Guildwars 2.

Disappointed that this thread was moved to this forum. It’s already starting to turn into a mix of “YOUR GVGS NOT TRUEEEEE GVGGGG!!!!!!” and “That thing I’ve never tried and admit i don’t understand is bad”.

You missed my point. People watch things on Twitch that are popular.

SobeSoul.6910:

Fact: your gvg guilds quit the game regularly.

Including OP’s guild, because there’s rampant elitism in the scene and they’re too good to muck about with the slightly-lower-skill guilds, which, you know, is always good for competition

Also, this thread getting moved to the PvP forum is just hysterical

KcB.6890:

SobeSoul.6910:

Sodapoppin got 15k viewers and he was a complete GW2 newbie.

Sodapoppin got 15k viewers because he’s Sodapoppin not because he was playing Guildwars 2.

SobeSoul.6910:

I have watched enough gvgs to understand that a lot of the game play is really brainless in comparison to spvp. Waiting on some guy yelling in TS to tell you when to throw down wells or deliver hammer stuns isn’t something I consider an art form like knowing when to lay down a cc combo.

This is how pug blobs in WvW work, not how any of the best GvG guilds have worked. The driver is a beacon for the rough positioning of the group and a safe place to regroup. Melee are expected to stay fairly tight to tag but even individual melee take opportunities they see by reading the situation. It’s very rare for a driver to call skills, or well bombs, or anything specific like that.

Disappointed that this thread was moved to this forum. It’s already starting to turn into a mix of “YOUR GVGS NOT TRUEEEEE GVGGGG!!!!!!” and “That thing I’ve never tried and admit i don’t understand is bad”.

to be fair, it was basically an echo chamber where it was before, where the same people/guilds were +1-ing each other. at least here you are getting some debate/conversation started. and with that u may be able to come up with reasonable solutions

Face.4216:

SobeSoul.6910:

Fact: your gvg guilds quit the game regularly.

Including OP’s guild, because there’s rampant elitism in the scene and they’re too good to muck about with the slightly-lower-skill guilds, which, you know, is always good for competition

Also, this thread getting moved to the PvP forum is just hysterical

well from what i’ve seen of this thread (basically this page and parts of the prev) i would think the best/reasonable solution is a very large arena for large guilds to 20v20 or 30v30.

which sounds like pvp arenas/battles/conquests/deathmatches. and so… here we are, pvp subforums