Guild Wars 2

Mhur.2904:

Malakree.5912:

I love the downed state, it’s the big thing that seperates the bad players from the good players.

Yeah it’s the big thing that gives an advantage to bad player over good ones.

Indeed. It’s what benefits bad players the most.

Not having downed state wouldn’t be bad but I’d rather have a separate Arena for that. In-fact I’d rather have another Arena where you don’t have to catch objectives and all you do is kill people mainly because its frustrating to play with people who don’t play sPvP for the objectives and capturing points.

downstate just means more fun when he gets back up and I beat his face back down again for more points. Unless of course your build is burn 2 60’s cd’s to burst someone. Silly silly.

Maybe when we’ll have private servers admins could remove it from options .
Like hardcore and normal servers on FPS games.
The problem still remains in tPvP anyway .

I feel like if it had a similar affect to freeze but made you regain your health and replaced your skills with more useful abilities to the ones we have in the current downed state, it’d flow better in combat. You’d never fall down. It’d just look like you had broken the enemy’s composure and they were now stumbling around, trying to regain it. The whole mechanic of lying on the ground chucking rocks is just silly.

An example, albeit a weird one, might be wrestling video games. It can be hard to win over someone in those games because they can fight through pain, shrug it off and come back stronger than ever. It should function sort of like that. Just with less spandex.

I enjoy the downed state but they need to normalize the the downed abilities, at least for pvp. It’s fairly obvious that some classes have superior downed abilities than others. Why do some get an aoe interrupt while others get a single target or none at all? If every class had a single target interrupt and attack and heal I believe there would be significantly less complaining.

Alot of the beginners(Player A) to Guild Wars 2 PvP are thinking of PvP as a deathmatch which it is not. It is a team based game in PvP and PvE. Player A jumps into hot join gets tunnel vision on one target. Player A ignores their surroundings and simply goes for that target through red circles, cc and when Player A finally manages to deplete his/her targets health, with little to no health of their own remaining. They are at the edge of their seat for the “Haha Player A has slain xxx” moment, they realize that the opponent has another bar of health and while they realize this boom!!! in comes a rock hits them in the face and they are in the downed state as well. Player A panics. Quickly!!! Quickly press 1, 11, 111111. Along comes a random teammate of his opponents and heals opponent right infront of them. Opponent gets up and gets the last laugh. Player A proceeds to play Team Matches as death match with similar results. Traumatized from his experience as a new born Sylvari waking up from a nightmare, Player A creates a thread "Get Rid of “Downed” State.

Advice: Play as a team. Good teams don’t need many kills to win matches. Concentrate on controlling points(Defending, reviving, hitting and running if too many). Make sure to look at conditions(red) that are on you and boons(yellow) on your opponents, for example confusion or retaliation(why are you hitting yourself)Get to at least rank 10 before deciding how bad downed state is. Form groups at rank 10 and participate in tournaments.

People need to be willing to help you from a downed state which may not happen in random teams which I can understand may give some people a hardtime. I think down state becomes more of an advantage though as your skill increases.

I really like down state because it adds another phase to the combat.
Some of the most intense tourney battles I’ve had have been around down state.

The only thing that I feel needs to be fixed is the some balance issues between classes. Some can survive a lot longer solo vs others.

Thief is arguably the strongest in down state since they have two interrupts and neither is affected by stability, blind or block.

Elementalist on the other hand is laughably weak when you get them downed unless you just leave them like that for 10 seconds there is nothing they can do to stop a stomp.

IF you want the downed state removed, the solution is easy, play a different game….this makes GW2 combat unique and it is an important part of pvp as well as pve.

/signed!

I hate downed in PvP. In PvE its great but in PvP it just really kills the flow of the game.

aleiro.8521:

IF you want the downed state removed, the solution is easy, play a different game….this makes GW2 combat unique and it is an important part of pvp as well as pve.

It makes it unique for thieves and mesmers.

For most others, you buy yourself 1-2 seconds before being finished off.

The ele may as well just die.

Hey guys here’s a few public service announcements:

When you’re downing a mesmer and they disappear, their clone will appear, and then a second later somewhere else they will appear. There will be a giant red down arrow over their heads. That’s them.

Thieves do not get two interrupts. In fact they don’t even get 1. When you go to finish them and they disappear, just hit escape to cancel your finisher (save time), walk over and finish them.

It does not take forever to finish these 2 classes. It’s actually pretty straight forward. If you are unable to finish someone because they have support from their team you have 2 options: 1) cry in forums; 2) deal with it. Also there is another tactic you might try which is to continue to damage them with ranged if you have it. Or not. Whatever.

Here are some downed state tactics: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Downed-State-Tutorial

I think the downed status in pvp is pretty fun actually and reviving someone in the heat of battle can deff give u the edge in battle. like sometimes ill use frenzy (makes me do everything twice as fast) just to revive downed players cause that one person can make the difference. the only thing i dont like about the downed status is the fact that pressing F is obviously the fastest way to finish them off when they are downed. give them slightly less hp when downed so when 3 people are hitting them F isnt the faster option of KB. Thats my opinion if u dont like it, well sorry.

milo.6942:

Who ever made a rule that you have to rely completely on your team to get back up? (spolier: no one) If a downed enemy can win a fight against you then gg man, I don’t know if you want to be telling the whole world about that.

Rangers do it all the time?

Many classes can take someone down if they end up with 1000-2000 health after the fight, and heal on CD.

I win double downed fights all the time on my necro simply because my 1 heals me as I use it.

People who are downed shouldn’t contribute to team-fights at all, is the point I’m trying to make. Please try to add to the discussion instead of uselessly trolling.

Ahlen.7591:

People who are downed shouldn’t contribute to team-fights at all, is the point I’m trying to make. Please try to add to the discussion instead of uselessly trolling.

I’m not trolling. Why do you think you can just decide what downed people should or should not do?

Ahlen.7591:

People who are downed shouldn’t contribute to team-fights at all, is the point I’m trying to make. Please try to add to the discussion instead of uselessly trolling.

That isn’t taking it far enough. Why not ask for people at 50% health to be removed from a fight as well? If they are that far down in health they have obviously lost, so just send them to spawn. Or ban their account. They need to be punished for coming close to losing, because allowing them to keep playing before the game actually defines them as being defeated takes no skill.

VincentCross.6954:

/signed!

I hate downed in PvP. In PvE its great but in PvP it just really kills the flow of the game.

^

downed state is hilariously bad in every game it’s implemented in and some of these arguments for it are just ridiculous or just blatant platitudes at best.

-Seperates the bad players from the good? are you serious? a platitude at best, and wrong besides; if anything it shrinks the gap.

-Makes gw2 gameplay unique. This is another atrocious argument for it. First of all if gw2 pvp actually relied on this mechanic to have “unique gameplay” then that would represent a major problem itself. gw2 gameplay should be unique because the spells and mechanics themselves are good, original and well thought out. and the downed mechanic is not at all original or unique, and in every game it’s in the players with brains hate it.

these are just 2 of the terrible arguments i have seen on this page, and there’s almost no doubt that there are no good arguments on the other pages either. Every player i’ve played with or against that wasnt terrible or dumb in some obvious way wishes arenanet would remove it.

Imbs what reasonable arguments have you got against downed state

milo.6942:

Imbs what reasonable arguments have you got against downed state

makes gameplay less interesting (esp with the 3 second self-stun thing slowing everything down when u do it) and too forgiving. You shouldn’t have to die >1 times to actually die. Ressing another player is overpowered whilst they are downed, if you just use one of your immunities (as a mesmer for example) whilst you do it it becomes absurd.

Often you will die because you make a mistake or a series of mistakes and getting a second chance so cost-free is counter-productive to good gameplay.

It makes pug groups far worse, 2(or more)v1ing players is often just impossible if they spam rez vs certain classes.

As i touched on a bit earlier it also makes certain classes better than others. Those with peels (for the f button finisher for example) become stronger because their rezzing is better. Those classes with higher passive defense (heavy armor wearers like guardian for example) also gain artificial strength from being able to tank better whilst finishing/ressing. I play mesmer and our immunities give us the opportunity to ress ppl like most classes cannot. Not to mention actual downed abilities for some classes – you can stomp some straight away, whilst others are a pain to land finishers on (like mesmer, thief) creating more unnecessary balance factors.

It makes the game worse in basically every way. The only even close to legit argument that i can think of for it is that it adds peeling to the game, but peeling is already in the game to a great extent and good teams will do it whilst their players are both downed and up, making this argument weak at best.

As i said in another one of these threads,I’m not really against the downed state,what i reallyyyyyyyy dislike is that i have to perform the rain dance after i down my opponent which makes absolutely no sense.

MAKE THE DOWNED PERSON RECIEVE DOUBLE/TRIPLE DAMAGE.

I’m curious to see what classes the people who think downed is fine play, I’d bet a lot of money it isn’t an ele. I think it’s a stupid idea to begin with, but at the very least if ANet won’t take it out, at least make it remotely balanced. Mesmers can get a clone to confuse you (not hard to counter to be honest but still an interrupt) and then do a good amount of dmg with their 3. Thieves can teleport away and then if you don’t start finishing them immediately they can stealth away. Warriors get their interrupt and then get their vengeance, which I’m ok with, until you find the warriors that spec to rally from vengeance. Meanwhile eles can immobilize, real helpful, and if they’re lucky or against someone taking a long time they can mist away, then just die since you can just follow them. The imbalance between downed skills is ridiculous, and it gets even worse when you notice that the classes with the most OP downed abilities are the most OP classes to begin with.

Either remove it from sPvP completely (or at least hot join) or balance it. Each class gets basic damage and bandage, no gimmicks, no escapes. Oh, and to whoever says “well you don’t need to finish them, you can just kill them through it” great idea until you try doing that outside of a burst class. On a toughness, kiting based engineer it takes me forever to try that. And if its on a thief, that just gives him time to get his escapes back off cooldown and run further and further away from any objective.

Imbs.7943:

makes gameplay less interesting (esp with the 3 second self-stun thing slowing everything down when u do it)

I think this makes combat more interesting. Do I risk my positioning to finish him? Can my team keep that warrior off me while I do this? Is it worth using my stealth to finish him? (yes) Could I just damage him occasionally to keep him downed and out of the fight while my team presses in with our advantage? Of course, I doubt you are sincerely thinking of these scenarios and taking them to heart, but as long as we are stating opinions the least I can do is give some specific situations I’ve encountered where the downed state has made my gameplay more interesting.

Imbs.7943:

and too forgiving. You shouldn’t have to die >1 times to actually die. Ressing another player is overpowered whilst they are downed, if you just use one of your immunities (as a mesmer for example) whilst you do it it becomes absurd.

Did you know you could use those immunities to perform finishers as well?

Imbs.7943:

Often you will die because you make a mistake or a series of mistakes and getting a second chance so cost-free is counter-productive to good gameplay.

If you are alone and you make a mistake and you die, downed state won’t help you. If you are with your team and you make a mistake and die, your team now has to try and res you, which can hardly be considered “cost-free” in the middle of combat. Not sure where you are getting your ideas from.

Imbs.7943:

It makes pug groups far worse, 2(or more)v1ing players is often just impossible if they spam rez vs certain classes.

If they can “spam res” and you’ve got nothing to interrupt them, what does that tell you? Also this is one of the silliest arguments against downed state I keep hearing. “I can’t win 2v1! pls nerf downed state” You can’t just burst down 1 player, run circles till you’re recharged and kill the other guy. What kind of skill is that.

Imbs.7943:

I play mesmer and our immunities give us the opportunity to ress ppl like most classes cannot. Not to mention actual downed abilities for some classes – you can stomp some straight away, whilst others are a pain to land finishers on (like mesmer, thief) creating more unnecessary balance factors.

You talk in forums like you are experienced spvp player, but the more I read the less I am convinced. ALL classes have utility skills help to give an edge to ressing, and stomping. Mesmers do not have a monopoly on this. Also as I wrote in my downed state tutorial (which you should take a look at…) mesmers are just as easy to stomp as other classes. Using immunities for stomps and resses is par for the course in tpvp.

Nerf Thiefs and Mesmers downed state.
SOLVED.

Keep the Downed state. It makes tournaments deliciously fun.

Yes remove it, it’s like Final Stand in Call of duty series, it’s annoying and frustrating that you kill someone then you have to worry about finishing and suddenly you’re surrounded by 100 enemies.

I already am sorry that I bought the game not knowing that downed state is actually that big factor in PvP. It sucks and I will never learn to deal with it because it’skitten

End of story.

Inb4. Teamplay everyone is zerging around with their team and ressing everybody they see for points.

It’s fine in pve but it’s akitten mechanic in PvP together with some really overpowered skills that thieves and mesmers have.

If they removed all the escapes/delays while downed it would be a lot more balanced IMO, at least for PVP. Some professions just get too many outs, and then more outs while downed to delay even longer just gets a tad too silly.

My Problem is, that certain down state skills are more overpowered than the others….

and Certain classes are good as dead moment they go down, while others are their to survive and way to powerful that destroys the balance….

I say remove it, or make it so that each class has similar DOWNSTATE, or Customizable to your own liking. Cause certain ones like the Warrior one… that makes you get up and smash the enemy’s face and lets u live.

Also i would like sucide button in downstate…. sometimes it annoying to wait…. for the enemy to finish you off… or they just leave u their to bleed out, while they cap ur waypoint.

I agree, downed state is beyondkitten in pvp. Some classes in downed state are insanely op’d and basically requires killing one person twice. It ruins the fun of pvp and just rewards massive zergs. Either it needs to be completely removed or it has to be severely toned down imo. It shouldn’t take twice as long to kill someone in downed state as it does when they are actually up and alive.

Come on … Downed fights are so much fun really im loving it.

Battle can turn side when people dont finish opponents, the battle is not over if ur team play smart

And when both you and your opponent finish the fight downed its hilarious as to who will kill other one first and get free rez hehehe

I agree from testing/playing different classes … everyone is not on par when downed

Guild Wars 2. The only game where you win a 1v1 duel by a sliver only to end up dying because the opponent gets a free res. Rally has to go.

/signed

You mean you downed ur ennemy, thought u had won but then you lost ur “downed duel” and lost the fight, so that means u were downed too so u didnt win anythng to begin with.
OR
You downed an ennemy but failed to “finish him” then he got rezed by teammate or by killing someone while downed.

In both case, L2P

I made a thread on the Guru forums months before the game went into beta about Downed State and the negative effects it could have on PvP. Back then, not many people seemed to mind and so I thought: well, maybe it’s just me and it will be fine.

After playing in sPvP for some time now, I find myself ignoring downed opponents as often as I can and if downed myself, I will press my magical “2” button as a Mesmer to disappear once to annoy people and then go brain AFK. Downing someone after a close fight and then being downed myself by his rocks results in 1 minute of mutual rock throwing. Or even worse: his buddies show up and kill me while I’m trying to execute and he pops back to life instantly, making me feel like I wasted my time.
Another problem is, that players with a ranged damage build have to get into melee range to execute, which takes more time and costs more life than for melee builds.
Overall, it’s not fun and I never feel like I can do anything meaningful while downed and rooted to the ground, neither do I want to, because I just died and that’s OK.

As stated several times before by others, Downed State is great in PvE, but in PvP it takes away from the satisfaction of bringing someone to 0 life, aka killing him or her, plus it actually limits tactical options as much as it brings with it new ones. For example, I had an intense 1v2 fight just today where I used everything I learned until now, and it would have been the first 1v2 I won since the game came out… if it wasn’t for Downed State.

My hopes are for the Downed State to be removed from sPvP at the least, because I think that this would make for a much cleaner gaming experience and make winning fights where your side is outnumbered not as impossible.

Raging Bull.5048:

Mhur.2904:

Malakree.5912:

I love the downed state, it’s the big thing that seperates the bad players from the good players.

Yeah it’s the big thing that gives an advantage to bad player over good ones.

Indeed. It’s what benefits bad players the most.

absolutely. all those awful bad pvp’ers who rally and kill you back when you can’t kill them because they’re too good to die. man. their lack of skills are abysmal.

CeCaKonVeu.5734:

Come on … Downed fights are so much fun really im loving it.

Battle can turn side when people dont finish opponents, the battle is not over if ur team play smart

And when both you and your opponent finish the fight downed its hilarious as to who will kill other one first and get free rez hehehe

i love it, too. and i don’t think it’s as painful as these posters think. most times you’re going to die when you’re downed. especially if you have no back-up. it’s not often i get through to rally. but when i do, it’s awesome. it feels great. and when someone manages to stop me spiking them, sure i rage. but it just shows at that moment, they were the better player. they timed themselves better.

i find it highly amusing many people complaining about this, will be the same people who like to say “learn to play”. seems they’re not taking their own advice.

you’re not in wow anymore, so i don’t see why you want a “different” game to be the “same” as “every other pvp game i’ve ever played.”

it’s a new flavour. learn to enjoy it. it’s quite refreshing. like homemade lemonade.

the downed feature hinders the competitive aspect of this game.. arenanet claim they want to be an esport but now it is impossible to beat two newbies who just started in a 1v2 no matter how experienced you are… I say if you want to keep the downed state just have two skills throw rock or whatever and heal self dont have all that bullcrap thief and mesmer OP skills, not like they arent OP in an up state but thats a different issue.. I know this game is meant to be focused on teams defending and capping but surely if your trying to bunker mines while your teams capping keep and you get in a 2v1 situation there is no way you can win even if you are elite.. it just pretty much closes the gap of best and worst which is bad for any esport

Gah, this is starting to annoy me too. As a thief I like to quickly finish off my foe and get the hell out of there in PVP, sometimes when trying to ‘Finish’ my foe I either die or get someone clean my kill. Rather annoying.

The more I play the more I realize the downed state is just an excuse to have people drop so fast from either random one shots (pve) or just insane spike dmg (please remove haste).

That’s really the only problem I have with it. But it’s still a bittersweet mechanic.

Or just make the 4th button available.

Stupid Idea, the downed state is awesome and creates lots of teamplay opportunities.

I say this a lot but people just need to learn each prof downstate skills to understand how to finish them off quickly.

I agree. Knowing that you can easily get revived makes you more comfortable with dying and it’s punishment hardly severe as it should be.

Hey guys, it’s understandable you’d want not like the downed state if you’re trying to play gw2 deathmatch 1v1 mode, but gw2 is actually balanced around team tournament play. Play some tournaments, get into a nice guild, get organized in voip and you will quickly realize the downed state’s purpose and usefulness.

Apathy.6430:

aleiro.8521:

IF you want the downed state removed, the solution is easy, play a different game….this makes GW2 combat unique and it is an important part of pvp as well as pve.

It makes it unique for thieves and mesmers.

For most others, you buy yourself 1-2 seconds before being finished off.

The ele may as well just die.

Too true. Let’s just go through a few scenarios on a Ranger, m’kay? I get downed defending a point, I interrupt with my awesome AoE interrupt skill! Oh, it bought me a full second and a half. I’m still dead. What’s the point?

I have a close fight with the guy on the enemy treb, he gets me down first, but because of my awesome rock-throwing arm I manage to down him, too! Too bad he isn’t a Ranger because I’m just going to throw rocks while my pet revives me. Easy win despite him likely playing better pre-downed state. Punishes the guy who outplayed me, but because I have a stronger downed skill I win the fight over all. Stupid design.

Attacking trebuchet, I down the guy who then downs me throwing rocks! I use pet revive… Oh wait it’s bugged and decided not to work at all this time. I outplayed him pre-downed state, but he can still throw rocks and down me. This punished me for outplaying an evenly matched opponent in the best-case scenario, and still punishes me in the worst case.

Defending a point 2v1, I manage to down one! I focus on the other guy, but wait what’s this? The guy I downed is back up! I die. No matter how this turns out I’m being punished for playing better than my two opponents. If I manage to down one, I will either die while stomping, or die after he revives himself if I ignore him. If I manage to get both down, I’m probably going to die to rocks being thrown at me. If I get one downed, then go down, as soon as I am stomped the downed guy revives. Now I’ve given up points, and gained nothing.

Then let’s not forget stuff like downing a person, then sending the pet after them to prevent them from reviving, but very slowly killing them. This essentially is griefing, and keeps them out of the match for a long period. Stupid design as it practically promotes griefing. He’ll die either way, but keeping him downed for as long as possible is more favorable than finishing him.

Let’s look at Elementalist: Gets downed, he dies. Gets down, but is able to pop mist form before someone stomps! He runs away with an enemy hot on his heels, and dies. Pointless.

Downed state doesn’t exactly reward good playing, promotes griefing, and rewards poor play with imbalanced downed skills. Balance the skills, remove self-revive in sPvP/tPvP AT LEAST. Otherwise, just remove thekittenthing.

Whoever made this Thread. you got my vote!!! Remove it Asap.

/signed.

Either give everyone the same spells while downed, or just remove the freaking thing and give everyone a one time ressurection sigil like in guild wars 1 … This is just stupid, some ppl gets to teleport or stealth … or even AOE knockback ..

GW2 isn’t about 1v2’s…. its a team game… get over yourselves

that’s an excellent vid Xanidus

Well … since Beta I’d like to get rid of this godkittenDown State in sPvP/tPvP … it’s just frustrating me every single day

1. Downed state is like an annoying auto-bubble with annoying abilities.

2. Downed state doesn’t promote team play, it promotes Zerging which basicaly means never go up against group bigger than yours even if its only a difference of 1. If you want to avoid getting killed instantly then simply have some defensive utility skills that is what they are there for.

3. People keep talking about second chances but you have re-spawn and if you screwed up and got killed then death should be your penalty, The sPvP maps are very tiny and getting from one point to other is very quick.

4. Downed state slows down the game and reduces the difference between skilled players and weak players which is a very bad thing in an e-sport!

5. 95% of players that play hot join sPvP don’t care about capturing the points, their main concern is to kill others because they will get glory anyway and its most fun!

EDIT: dont’t compare sPvP to wow’s arenas, compare it to battlegrounds! Arenas are death matches!