No bad word about condi’s unlimited stacking,but this…this hurts you,just lol.
In a pvp environment, it’s very rare to even hit the 25 bleed stack cap, so I don’t see the change affecting pvp that much, maybe burning and poison stacking intensity with poison fields from thief shortbow and engi grenades.
I can easily stack 25 bleeds on condi warr,i dont even wanna see what 3 – 4 people are able to do when they all run condi spec,and they will..all run condi spec when this patch hits.
And the Shoutbow Warrior shrugs it all off together.
Or Revenant sends it all back. That will be fun to see.
No bad word about condi’s unlimited stacking,but this…this hurts you,just lol.
In a pvp environment, it’s very rare to even hit the 25 bleed stack cap, so I don’t see the change affecting pvp that much, maybe burning and poison stacking intensity with poison fields from thief shortbow and engi grenades.
I can easily stack 25 bleeds on condi warr,i dont even wanna see what 3 – 4 people are able to do when they all run condi spec,and they will..all run condi spec when this patch hits.
And the Shoutbow Warrior shrugs it all off together.
Or Revenant sends it all back. That will be fun to see.
Even now this is possible, Generosity Sigils, Arcane Thievery
No bad word about condi’s unlimited stacking,but this…this hurts you,just lol.
In a pvp environment, it’s very rare to even hit the 25 bleed stack cap, so I don’t see the change affecting pvp that much, maybe burning and poison stacking intensity with poison fields from thief shortbow and engi grenades.
I can easily stack 25 bleeds on condi warr,i dont even wanna see what 3 – 4 people are able to do when they all run condi spec,and they will..all run condi spec when this patch hits.
And the Shoutbow Warrior shrugs it all off together.
Or Revenant sends it all back. That will be fun to see.
Even now this is possible, Generosity Sigils, Arcane Thievery
Fiat will get you from point A to point B, but it’s no BMW.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Pain_Absorption
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Embrace_the_Darkness
This isn’t referring to the other bajillion power creep updates incoming.
Chill and cripple will no longer affect movement speed skills? What is the point of these conditions, then? NO ONE in the entire game is ever going to kill a greatsword/hammer warrior ever again. There are other problems as well.
This is a really stupid change.
i kill gs hammer wars all day without chill and cripple….just saying..
No bad word about condi’s unlimited stacking,but this…this hurts you,just lol.
In a pvp environment, it’s very rare to even hit the 25 bleed stack cap, so I don’t see the change affecting pvp that much, maybe burning and poison stacking intensity with poison fields from thief shortbow and engi grenades.
I can easily stack 25 bleeds on condi warr,i dont even wanna see what 3 – 4 people are able to do when they all run condi spec,and they will..all run condi spec when this patch hits.
And the Shoutbow Warrior shrugs it all off together.
And ? Your point is let’s all run shoutbow or.. ?
No bad word about condi’s unlimited stacking,but this…this hurts you,just lol.
In a pvp environment, it’s very rare to even hit the 25 bleed stack cap, so I don’t see the change affecting pvp that much, maybe burning and poison stacking intensity with poison fields from thief shortbow and engi grenades.
I can easily stack 25 bleeds on condi warr,i dont even wanna see what 3 – 4 people are able to do when they all run condi spec,and they will..all run condi spec when this patch hits.
And the Shoutbow Warrior shrugs it all off together.
And ? Your point is let’s all run shoutbow or.. ?
My point is that condi cleanse is so prevelant that the cap being raised in PvP will have next to zero actual impact.
Sorry got delayed in giving a response back a bit ago-
If my thoughts are right about this, Slow might be an even bigger danger to leaps than Chill or Cripple ever were since movement skills are now forced to move the same distance rather than a reduced one.
That’s still pretty big IF. Maybe they’ll be immune to slow as well.
And if not, it still remains to be seen how many classes will actually be able to apply it.
I extremely doubt it, purely based on how Slow works. All animations like Savage Leap or RTL take time to finish going their distance, Quickness will speed up the animation and distance achieved (hence you go the same distance faster).
Slow is the opposite, where you will still be going the full distance but at half speed. That means that the overall rate of which the leaper is moving with a slow is cut in half, so that means in the instance of say a Warrior’s Rush which moves 1200 units over its 2 second channel, will be going 1200 units in 3 seconds (Slow applies 50% animation increase).
You do have a good point, we don’t know who else will have Slow other than Chronomancers, but at least from one angle, WvW, and even so far as SPvP, I would be surprised to NOT see them being used to ensure enemies do not make a break for it.
I was wondering whether slow would affect movement skills. If so, then it’s likely Anet’s “let’s make a new condition that has enormous overlap with current conditions” forced them into this in order to make the new condition more unique (and to push people to get HoT).
Looks like really bad/lazy development to me
Yes and no. Thinking back to the original design of boons and conditions it likely seemed a bit imbalanced to have things like Quickness exist but not Slow. What I see from the changes going forward is an ‘ease to balance’. For instance, we already have traits that increase ranges on certain abilities or weapon skills or the like. With swiftness being a sort of ‘broken’ way to disengage or engage with a long distance using leaps, adding a trait that would boost a leap range would upset everything.
Now that swiftness, cripple and chill no longer affect Movement skills, not only can leap skills perhaps see a new trait come out to help, but since the numbers will always be stagnant, balancing becomes so much more impressive.
AKA, when this launches, if things like Warrior Rush show to be going just a bit too far, they can tweak the range and the channel time to be less and boom, instant balance. It could be considered lazy, but it can also be considered practical from a balance standpoint.
Another thing I forgot to mention was Taunt, which will be another condition to be coming out of the woodwork. The same arguments apply to taunt like they did slow, we don’t know how prevalent or how many professions have it, but if it is out there, it can ruin a disengage outright. We will have to see..
No bad word about condi’s unlimited stacking,but this…this hurts you,just lol.
In a pvp environment, it’s very rare to even hit the 25 bleed stack cap, so I don’t see the change affecting pvp that much, maybe burning and poison stacking intensity with poison fields from thief shortbow and engi grenades.
I can easily stack 25 bleeds on condi warr,i dont even wanna see what 3 – 4 people are able to do when they all run condi spec,and they will..all run condi spec when this patch hits.
And the Shoutbow Warrior shrugs it all off together.
And ? Your point is let’s all run shoutbow or.. ?
My point is that condi cleanse is so prevelant that the cap being raised in PvP will have next to zero actual impact.
The significant change here isn’t the cap being raised, its the stacking change. Now that burning/poison stack intensity you’re going to quickly find that cleanse is not longer nearly as powerful as it used to be. You can cleanse all you want but when that condi ele is throwing out nothing but 1 and 3 second burns, he isn’t going to care a bit.
Another thing I forgot to mention was Taunt, which will be another condition to be coming out of the woodwork. The same arguments apply to taunt like they did slow, we don’t know how prevalent or how many professions have it, but if it is out there, it can ruin a disengage outright. We will have to see..
Taunt is not a condition. Seriously, why do people keep saying this? It’s a control effect like Stun or Daze. Condition duration will have zero effect on it and Runes of the Trooper cannot help you out of it.
As for its frequency, we do know it will only show up on Revenant, Ranger (with 1 trait), and possibly some of the unrevealed elite specializations (Warrior comes to mind as a likely one).
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Another thing I forgot to mention was Taunt, which will be another condition to be coming out of the woodwork. The same arguments apply to taunt like they did slow, we don’t know how prevalent or how many professions have it, but if it is out there, it can ruin a disengage outright. We will have to see..
Taunt is not a condition. Seriously, why do people keep saying this? It’s a control effect like Stun or Daze. Condition duration will have zero effect on it and Runes of the Trooper cannot help you out of it.
Is it like stun or daze, or is it like fear? Fear is a condition but also a control effect. Since taunt is essentially the same thing it would be weird for it to be just a control effect and not double as a condition as well like fear does.
Another thing I forgot to mention was Taunt, which will be another condition to be coming out of the woodwork. The same arguments apply to taunt like they did slow, we don’t know how prevalent or how many professions have it, but if it is out there, it can ruin a disengage outright. We will have to see..
Taunt is not a condition. Seriously, why do people keep saying this? It’s a control effect like Stun or Daze. Condition duration will have zero effect on it and Runes of the Trooper cannot help you out of it.
Is it like stun or daze, or is it like fear? Fear is a condition but also a control effect. Since taunt is essentially the same thing it would be weird for it to be just a control effect and not double as a condition as well like fear does.
Considering the number of times ANet has specified that it is not a condition, I’d be inclined to believe it is not a condition.
Want more evidence? Taunt doesn’t have an icon in tooltips.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Another thing I forgot to mention was Taunt, which will be another condition to be coming out of the woodwork. The same arguments apply to taunt like they did slow, we don’t know how prevalent or how many professions have it, but if it is out there, it can ruin a disengage outright. We will have to see..
Taunt is not a condition. Seriously, why do people keep saying this? It’s a control effect like Stun or Daze. Condition duration will have zero effect on it and Runes of the Trooper cannot help you out of it.
Whoops!
Yep, just checked the wiki, I made a large error and I apologize.
I still believe Taunt will have an effect though, in fact if it runs in the same vein as Stuns and Dazes, with Stability as it is now it could be more impactful as I were under the impression Resistance would resist it but it will NOT.
Another thing I forgot to mention was Taunt, which will be another condition to be coming out of the woodwork. The same arguments apply to taunt like they did slow, we don’t know how prevalent or how many professions have it, but if it is out there, it can ruin a disengage outright. We will have to see..
Taunt is not a condition. Seriously, why do people keep saying this? It’s a control effect like Stun or Daze. Condition duration will have zero effect on it and Runes of the Trooper cannot help you out of it.
Whoops!
Yep, just checked the wiki, I made a large error and I apologize.
I still believe Taunt will have an effect though, in fact if it runs in the same vein as Stuns and Dazes, with Stability as it is now it could be more impactful as I were under the impression Resistance would resist it but it will NOT.
That’s an interesting point – how will Taunt interact with stability stacks. Will it take off one stack, like any other CC (that’s what I’m expecting to see), or rather remain for the full duration and remove 1 stack every tick.
As for the Taunt accesibility – remember there was no info on weapon skills / utility changes for base classes so far. We might see it added here and there when they show what skills were modified on Monday.
/Sigh
Anet’s kittenty and misguided “balance” strikes again. If they are changing existing perfectly functioning conditions to accommodate a new condi, all i can say to the devs who came up with this is way to show your lack of creativity, it’s not like you get paid to be innovative and not cut corners coz you lack forsight or anything.
This is an action based hybrid combat gaming system where movement and positioning are key and how certain skills and conditions interact with them to increase the depth of play. But Anet have decided to yet again NPE chill/cripple interactions with leap skills. SMH.
And everyone saying that they are changing chill and cripple to accomodate for slow, how is this even acceptable to anyone? I would rather slow get axed than they fundamentally change the existing functionality of these conditions for the worse. These conditions did not see a buff, they are not out of control and there are multiple ways to counter or deal with them, why change them at all?
It’s as though the devs don’t even play their own game. Always talking about they want players making meaningful decisions and having counter play for eSports, then they pull some weak kitten brainless kitten like this. The more is revealed about this expansion, the less i want to even play it. Yes, the condi changes is general are good, but the devs act like they just came up with the idea for this change now, yet we have been complaining about it for over 3 years since kittening beta!
Meh, whatever, i am done trying to make this game better when the devs see things supremely differently to me and they make changes to decisions they have ONLY when those decisions spawn a media crisis or player outcry.
/Sigh
(edited by Odeezee.7362)
Oddly enough, quickness shortens most leap/dash distances, so you often want to use your leap/dash skills without having quickness applied. This is because the animation occurs faster, and the leap/dash animation expires faster.
I don’t know if after the change this won’t be a factor, but it got me to thinking…
Since slow will lengthen the animation, maybe it will also lengthen the distance of the leap/dash? If you’re leaping/dashing for a longer period of time, it might send you further, just like how quickness can send you a shorter distance because the animation occurs for a shorter period of time.
And everyone saying that they are changing chill and cripple to accomodate for slow, how is this even acceptable to anyone? I would rather slow get axed than they fundamentally change the existing functionality of these conditions for the worse. These conditions did not see a buff, they are not out of control and there are multiple ways to counter or deal with them, why change them at all?
Never said it was acceptable. I said it is likely the real reason for the change and ANet is passing off the side effect of normalizing Quickness and Slow as a feature.
Doesn’t make it acceptable. In my mind, it’s less so.
Honestly, I don’t think they’re ignorant to the problems or just stupid. I think they see pvp as a really, really low maintenance way to increase the average minutes played by people. They see minutes as money through gem purchases or whatever. So the more fixing they have to do, the less easy money pvp is pulling in- in their eyes. They’re looking for cheap fixes that don’t take much from what I’m assuming. Taunts to pets might look like they’re trying to spice things up, but I really think that’s how they’re “fixing” all the pet issues and wouldn’t be surprised to see this on other classes pets. Personally, I don’t think a game can go esports if all you do is fling some dollars at elite tournaments when there’s some of these underlying issues. Does anyone else agree with this or what do you all think?
Honestly, I don’t think they’re ignorant to the problems or just stupid. I think they see pvp as a really, really low maintenance way to increase the average minutes played by people. They see minutes as money through gem purchases or whatever. So the more fixing they have to do, the less easy money pvp is pulling in- in their eyes. They’re looking for cheap fixes that don’t take much from what I’m assuming. Taunts to pets might look like they’re trying to spice things up, but I really think that’s how they’re “fixing” all the pet issues and wouldn’t be surprised to see this on other classes pets. Personally, I don’t think a game can go esports if all you do is fling some dollars at elite tournaments when there’s some of these underlying issues. Does anyone else agree with this or what do you all think?
What’s cheap for one company may not be so cheap to another.
Esports is possible through proper management and company inplementations. The expansion is going to bring a lot of player base through media and the likes. It’s no longer whether or not we’ll get a lot of people. It’s whether or not the new, old, and current player base will like pvp to the point the pvp population not just self sustains itself (goal 1), but grows in popularity (goal 2).
(edited by Saiyan.1704)
No bad word about condi’s unlimited stacking,but this…this hurts you,just lol.
In a pvp environment, it’s very rare to even hit the 25 bleed stack cap, so I don’t see the change affecting pvp that much, maybe burning and poison stacking intensity with poison fields from thief shortbow and engi grenades.
I can easily stack 25 bleeds on condi warr,i dont even wanna see what 3 – 4 people are able to do when they all run condi spec,and they will..all run condi spec when this patch hits.
And the Shoutbow Warrior shrugs it all off together.
And ? Your point is let’s all run shoutbow or.. ?
Realistically the increase will not affect PvP at all. Trust me.
This change s literally for PvE as the developers were having a hard time making maps around this concept.
ya…
Just wanted to call out that the devs noted the main reason for the removal of swiftness affecting movement skills was things like rocket boots breaking out of maps…
But engis are getting a trait that makes rocket boots go further now? This doesn’t add up…
Dev’s love engies, eles, Warriors, and guardians. in contrast they hate Necros. Rangers are loved but still not top tier.
Dev’s love engies, eles, Warriors, and guardians. in contrast they hate Necros. Rangers are loved but still not top tier.
Engi is definitely #1 on love list. But warrior? He got nerfed.
Dev’s love engies, eles, Warriors, and guardians. in contrast they hate Necros. Rangers are loved but still not top tier.
Engi is definitely #1 on love list. But warrior? He got nerfed.
Wasn’t just a ‘slap on the wrist’ either, we straight up got kidney-punched.
Whatever was left of Rifle is gone now (Mobile Strikes shared) and from what the wording on our Burst skills suggest, both share the same cooldown (meaning no back to back bursts)!
Someone throw in the white towel! TKO! TKO!!
I really hope they rethink this change. Swiftness enhancing movement skills is also a fun part of the game.
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