How is ele ever going to beat reaper?
Even if you are a higher skilled ele, necro can beat you due to sheer sponge HP.
And before this patch, even if you were a higher skilled necro, any diamond skin ele could beat you with his eyes closed. Why is it only not ok now?
And why is he running zerker?
Best thing is, i didnt respond to that guy because he obviously doesnt understand what balance means, like so many other ppl. They only know spite.
“My class was underpowered last season, now yours can be underpowered because you already had your dominant meta”
Thats not promoting skill, thats promoting RNG imbalanced classes read the thread if you want to know what i think about it. Since this has been discussed over 3 times already.
Second on what you actually asked me. Why zerker? Because elementalist doesnt do any damage without zerker. Even marauder was extremely bad because its a sustain rune, in a time where scepter just doesnt do any damage.
As a scepter elementalist you are forced to play zerker to even be able to play this game on a fair level, yes its 20 times harder then other classes because you have almost no sustain or health, you dont have armor. and you fully relly on your dodges/kiting and timely blinds to stall. But atleast you can kill people before they kill you.
Its extremely high level if you know howto play it and i do.
Yet the problem still exists that as any elementalist that focusses on damage, even if its focus is hybrid support. You will not beat necros because you do not have enough traitlines/health and condi clears to simply clear the chills wich literally instant gg’s any scepter build.
You are forced into a few traitlines that can synergise with eachother to remove condis with. Do you know how little access elementalist even has to condi clear? And guess what, theyr all locked up in different trees. With the lowest HP ingame. With a single condi that hardcounters.
Chill needs to get reduced in effectiveness, its too potent. If it can hardcounter a class it shouldve been clear from the day chill go implemented in its current form, that it was too strong if you can shut down an entire class with it.
Ive stated it when reapers where revealed before HoT and everything following up to that point. That necros will be imbalanced in the ele vs necro matchup.
No I just thought it was funny that you only make the post when it’s your class. Where were your cries of outrage when DS wasn’t terrible and necros had no chance vs ele?
ah yes, we all want this thread to descend into petty spiteful messages because of the 180 turn in food chain aye Browrain. Please give something constructive.
Atm DS is simply garbage. You must get hit to remove 1 condi, with 1s CD, and 75% hp threshold. Too gimmicky for an inefficient result. Might as well slap a 3s resistance on 10s ICD when 3 conditions are applied. But that’d rely too much on passive traits as usual. I think a better solution is to increase the efficiency or heavily reduce the CD of active condi removal skills rather than traits so no one can really complains about “passive plays”. For example reduce cleansing fire CD to 25s, cleansing wave remove 3 condis, or give warhorn to include condi removal as well.
Ele has a terrible design because it’s garbage at base but basically carried by celestial amulet and boon stacking to cover up for those terrible base stats and miserable innate defenses and long cd burst.
They knocked out celestial amulet and reintroduced larcenous strike thief in the form of necro. Guess what total hardcounter.
I mean how can you play a berzerker class with 10k base hp and cloth armor when thieves, revenants, and mesmers exist.
It’s virtually impossible to go toe to toe as a zerker dagger ele against a thief or rev, their burst is easier to land, more frequent, and they got better mobility and innate defenses.
Look at fire grab, it’s basically a backstab that’s harder to land with an obvious telegraph and wonky range, and a whopping 45 sec cd I mean what the hell is a 45 sec cd for Fire Grab it’s absolutely idiotic.
Then look at the arcane skills, they basically are 15-30 sec cd for a skill that hits less hard than a thief/warrior/revenant autoattack crit.
And then you have mist form/arcane shield/armor of earth on 60+ sec cd’s. No way you can run a zerker ele successfully with such a long cd on burst and such a long cd on defenses.
(edited by Zenith.7301)
Even if you are a higher skilled ele, necro can beat you due to sheer sponge HP.
And before this patch, even if you were a higher skilled necro, any diamond skin ele could beat you with his eyes closed. Why is it only not ok now?
And why is he running zerker?
Best thing is, i didnt respond to that guy because he obviously doesnt understand what balance means, like so many other ppl. They only know spite.
“My class was underpowered last season, now yours can be underpowered because you already had your dominant meta”
Thats not promoting skill, thats promoting RNG imbalanced classes read the thread if you want to know what i think about it. Since this has been discussed over 3 times already.
Second on what you actually asked me. Why zerker? Because elementalist doesnt do any damage without zerker. Even marauder was extremely bad because its a sustain rune, in a time where scepter just doesnt do any damage.
As a scepter elementalist you are forced to play zerker to even be able to play this game on a fair level, yes its 20 times harder then other classes because you have almost no sustain or health, you dont have armor. and you fully relly on your dodges/kiting and timely blinds to stall. But atleast you can kill people before they kill you.
Its extremely high level if you know howto play it and i do.
Yet the problem still exists that as any elementalist that focusses on damage, even if its focus is hybrid support. You will not beat necros because you do not have enough traitlines/health and condi clears to simply clear the chills wich literally instant gg’s any scepter build.
You are forced into a few traitlines that can synergise with eachother to remove condis with. Do you know how little access elementalist even has to condi clear? And guess what, theyr all locked up in different trees. With the lowest HP ingame. With a single condi that hardcounters.
Chill needs to get reduced in effectiveness, its too potent. If it can hardcounter a class it shouldve been clear from the day chill go implemented in its current form, that it was too strong if you can shut down an entire class with it.
Ive stated it when reapers where revealed before HoT and everything following up to that point. That necros will be imbalanced in the ele vs necro matchup.
No I just thought it was funny that you only make the post when it’s your class. Where were your cries of outrage when DS wasn’t terrible and necros had no chance vs ele?
Well i wasnt playing the game last season at all when i found out bunker was meta… so i wasnt really there. Also i wouldnt know regardless since i dont play necro. But at the very least every comment ivve heard ingame about DS i replied with a ‘yes its a too strong for what it does and too weak for what it doesnt’ sad part is, DS wasnt that strong on zerker or marauder because life regen was allot lower and you have allot less basehealth an autoattack was enough that way.
In the end celestial/bunker amu’s caused DS to be OP and required it to be nerfed. Rightfully so.
But tbh if you played necro during that time and you vocally expressed yourself on the forums, you did cause a rightfull nerf. So you cant say it wasnt fixed.
ah yes, we all want this thread to descend into petty spiteful messages because of the 180 turn in food chain aye Browrain. Please give something constructive.
Atm DS is simply garbage. You must get hit to remove 1 condi, with 1s CD, and 75% hp threshold. Too gimmicky for an inefficient result. Might as well slap a 3s resistance on 10s ICD when 3 conditions are applied. But that’d rely too much on passive traits as usual. I think a better solution is to increase the efficiency or heavily reduce the CD of active condi removal skills rather than traits so no one can really complains about “passive plays”. For example reduce cleansing fire CD to 25s, cleansing wave remove 3 condis, or give warhorn to include condi removal as well.
I’m just searching for people’s “How is necro ever going to beat ele” threads as well. Can’t seem to find any. Of course eles are in a bad spot right now, but it looks bad when you all show up in the forums when it’s your class getting gutted. And fun fact, half my games from Diamond-Legendary were on ele.
It use to be that only mesmers or thieves could successfully run zerker, and better or for worse we seem to be returning to that meta. You need absolute escape options with that level of risk.
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ah yes, we all want this thread to descend into petty spiteful messages because of the 180 turn in food chain aye Browrain. Please give something constructive.
Atm DS is simply garbage. You must get hit to remove 1 condi, with 1s CD, and 75% hp threshold. Too gimmicky for an inefficient result. Might as well slap a 3s resistance on 10s ICD when 3 conditions are applied. But that’d rely too much on passive traits as usual. I think a better solution is to increase the efficiency or heavily reduce the CD of active condi removal skills rather than traits so no one can really complains about “passive plays”. For example reduce cleansing fire CD to 25s, cleansing wave remove 3 condis, or give warhorn to include condi removal as well.
I’m just searching for people’s “How is necro ever going to beat ele” threads as well. Can’t seem to find any. Of course eles are in a bad spot right now, but it looks bad when you all show up in the forums when it’s your class getting gutted. And fun fact, half my games from Diamond-Legendary were on ele.
So wait, you seriously expect elementalists to make a thread about necro? Have you even read the posts in this thread from necros like yourself? theres about 4/5 people here who are literally asking that ele should stay bad and imbalanced.
Srsly.
Also, Gj you abused an overpowered build at the time to get legendary. Gz bro!
It use to be that only mesmers or thieves could successfully run zerker, and better or for worse we seem to be returning to that meta. You need absolute escape options with that level of risk.
Well any games i play with no necros involved go super smooth, sure its high skillcap, but in general i know howto play my class well enough to be able to 1v1 pretty much everything, except chills. With zerker.
I currently really feel im getting set back by necros a tremendous amount in terms of MMR. And there is literally no road to improve upon due to this.
Because ive searched all my traits in my current setup, and literally nothing of the traits im using has any condi clear. Generally speaking its not that big of a problem due to focus 4 vs most condis. But necros have so much sustain and therefor access to chill, that i cant break through (as my OP said) due to shroud.The HP sponge is too big and kiting is impossible due to chill.
I can beat any other class in my current MMR pool most with relative ease due to them not knocking the sheer value of when to use dodge.
Yeah the hypocrisy in your posts is just too much for me. Good luck on your quest to beat a necro.
So what you’re saying is…nerf Necro because anything that survives your burst will kill you in return? Welcome to glass cannon ele.
Because ive searched all my traits in my current setup, and literally nothing of the traits im using has any condi clear.
So you’re running beserker with no condi clear, and you’re surprised that you have trouble with a condi class?
Also necros have terrible sustain, they do however have a huge health pool (when they have LF anyways) which gives them very good burst survivability, which is why your zerk build isn’t bursting them.
Basically you’re running the absolute worst build for fighting necros.
Sanity is for the weak minded.
YouTube
YouTube
(edited by Crinn.7864)
Just ignore this noob. Complaining all around map chat about necros, but he doesnt run any condi cleanse. Lol. Thats about the same as going outside right now without any clothes on, and complaining that you’re getting cold.
Chill always has been one of the main problems for Ele’s. Finally we got rid of that boring diamond skin, deal with it. Just don’t expect to defeat a necro without condi cleanses.
I don’t know why this thread is still going on. Erazor had 30 games this first season and he didn’t play about 4-5 months before that. I have no idea how can he make any basis for his arguments.
Yeah the hypocrisy in your posts is just too much for me. Good luck on your quest to beat a necro.
Hypocricy? I dont really know where i was being a hypocrit for not backing up imbalanced from other classes.
So what you’re saying is…nerf Necro because anything that survives your burst will kill you in return? Welcome to glass cannon ele.
Im saying nerf necro because its impossible to kite around them, once you get in combat as a glass vs necro you cant escape due to chills making it inherently a hardcounter to glass cannons. Im not a 1 trick pony glass cannon ele. I use sustain to either stay out of range and kiting with blinds to stop there attacks. Nothing of that type of skill is possible versus necros.
Because ive searched all my traits in my current setup, and literally nothing of the traits im using has any condi clear.
So you’re running beserker with no condi clear, and you’re surprised that you have trouble with a condi class?
Also necros have terrible sustain, they do however have a huge health pool (when they have LF anyways) which gives them very good burst survivability, which is why your zerk build isn’t bursting them.
Basically you’re running the absolute worst build for fighting necros.
Its the only way how you can even play damage as an ele, The other amulets just dont give that oompf to scepter because scepter DPS is extremely lackluster.
Just ignore this noob. Complaining all around map chat about necros, but he doesnt run any condi cleanse. Lol. Thats about the same as going outside right now without any clothes on, and complaining that you’re getting cold.
Chill always has been one of the main problems for Ele’s. Finally we got rid of that boring diamond skin, deal with it. Just don’t expect to defeat a necro without condi cleanses.
Oh right im a noob. Go youtube necro spamwich, ive posted here in this thread allready. You tell me thats not terrible gamedesign.
Also tell me why do i do just fine against other condi classes due to the ability to kite, (you know super speed? dodgerolls?) Just because other people who play condi have an advantage does not in any way mean i cannot beat them. Its just necro. If it was all sorts and forms of condi, then your point wouldve made sense. But its not.
I don’t know why this thread is still going on. Erazor had 30 games this first season and he didn’t play about 4-5 months before that. I have no idea how can he make any basis for his arguments.
You dont know? Do you even realise why i had 30 games the first season to start with? Because when the bunker meta settled i literally did not want to play anymore.
Right now ive played about 40/50 games in a week, dont give me that ‘hes a casual cuz he doesnt play the game 24/7’ kitten. I play this game when its fun. I’m not gonna force myself to play a game that i dont think is fun. I do not think bunker meta was fun. So i dont play.
Current meta is fine for me, except necro’s. Hence this thread. And hence why ive been playing allot more (except during necro dailies for obvious reasons)
I already stated that any game without a necro is just fine. So how can it be me?
So you’re running beserker with no condi clear, and you’re surprised that you have trouble with a condi class?
Also necros have terrible sustain, they do however have a huge health pool (when they have LF anyways) which gives them very good burst survivability, which is why your zerk build isn’t bursting them.
Basically you’re running the absolute worst build for fighting necros.
Its the only way how you can even play damage as an ele, The other amulets just dont give that oompf to scepter because scepter DPS is extremely lackluster.
You made a risk/reward choice. The reward is the damage, the risk is that you’re absurdly vulnerable to condi classes and classes with good burst defense.
My personal class and build performs poorly against thieves and some scrapper and warrior builds. That was a risk/reward choice that I made.
Sanity is for the weak minded.
YouTube
YouTube
So you’re running beserker with no condi clear, and you’re surprised that you have trouble with a condi class?
Also necros have terrible sustain, they do however have a huge health pool (when they have LF anyways) which gives them very good burst survivability, which is why your zerk build isn’t bursting them.
Basically you’re running the absolute worst build for fighting necros.
Its the only way how you can even play damage as an ele, The other amulets just dont give that oompf to scepter because scepter DPS is extremely lackluster.
You made a risk/reward choice. The reward is the damage, the risk is that you’re absurdly vulnerable to condi classes and classes with good burst defense.
My personal class and build performs poorly against thieves and some scrapper and warrior builds. That was a risk/reward choice that I made.
I am very well aware of this. And if there was counterplay i would seize it with both hands. Versus any class theres counterplay even with condi, Except necro.
I wanted to show you guys some gameplay footage of me playing, judge for yourself how bad am i at this game;
The counterplay to necro still is range. If you can maintain distance you can dps them down. Using fresh air and super speed is one of the easiest ways for ele to do this.
“Kentigem”-chief. Born cycle of Dusk. Wyld Hunt:
Learn as much mending and medical info as possible so that it can be added to the Dream.
Become the first Chief of Mending and guide the newly awaken as well as those who want to learn.
Learn as much mending and medical info as possible so that it can be added to the Dream.
Become the first Chief of Mending and guide the newly awaken as well as those who want to learn.
You made a risk/reward choice. The reward is the damage, the risk is that you’re absurdly vulnerable to condi classes and classes with good burst defense.
My personal class and build performs poorly against thieves and some scrapper and warrior builds. That was a risk/reward choice that I made.
I am very well aware of this. And if there was counterplay i would seize it with both hands. Versus any class theres counterplay even with condi, Except necro.
I wanted to show you guys some gameplay footage of me playing, judge for yourself how bad am i at this game;
…..a 500 to 150 match, against projectile heavy classes. That’s a terrible example to be judging any ele’s skill by.
Besides you miss the point, necros have counterplay, however your build lacks all of the tools necessary to execute on the counterplay
Sanity is for the weak minded.
YouTube
YouTube
Just give ele reasonable starting health and toughness it is an easy fix. A long term fix would involve evening out cool downs and completely reworking elites. Balance doesn’t need to be nuke or .1% change.
#1 of all #1 players as ranked by a fair and unbiased committee
So wait, you played 30 games this season. Am I correct in assuming you were either Emerald or Sapphire then?
I am more conerned about beating revenants than reapers on my ele
Even if you are a higher skilled ele, necro can beat you due to sheer sponge HP.
And before this patch, even if you were a higher skilled necro, any diamond skin ele could beat you with his eyes closed. Why is it only not ok now?
And why is he running zerker?
Best thing is, i didnt respond to that guy because he obviously doesnt understand what balance means, like so many other ppl. They only know spite.
“My class was underpowered last season, now yours can be underpowered because you already had your dominant meta”
Thats not promoting skill, thats promoting RNG imbalanced classes read the thread if you want to know what i think about it. Since this has been discussed over 3 times already.
Second on what you actually asked me. Why zerker? Because elementalist doesnt do any damage without zerker. Even marauder was extremely bad because its a sustain rune, in a time where scepter just doesnt do any damage.
As a scepter elementalist you are forced to play zerker to even be able to play this game on a fair level, yes its 20 times harder then other classes because you have almost no sustain or health, you dont have armor. and you fully relly on your dodges/kiting and timely blinds to stall. But atleast you can kill people before they kill you.
Its extremely high level if you know howto play it and i do.
Yet the problem still exists that as any elementalist that focusses on damage, even if its focus is hybrid support. You will not beat necros because you do not have enough traitlines/health and condi clears to simply clear the chills wich literally instant gg’s any scepter build.
You are forced into a few traitlines that can synergise with eachother to remove condis with. Do you know how little access elementalist even has to condi clear? And guess what, theyr all locked up in different trees. With the lowest HP ingame. With a single condi that hardcounters.
Chill needs to get reduced in effectiveness, its too potent. If it can hardcounter a class it shouldve been clear from the day chill go implemented in its current form, that it was too strong if you can shut down an entire class with it.
Ive stated it when reapers where revealed before HoT and everything following up to that point. That necros will be imbalanced in the ele vs necro matchup.
No I just thought it was funny that you only make the post when it’s your class. Where were your cries of outrage when DS wasn’t terrible and necros had no chance vs ele?
Funny, I already mentioned in this topic.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Does-Diamond-skin-need-a-nerf/5902374
Only bad Necro’s has no chance to kill Ele’s with old DS, as Nosc provide over and over in his stream, 0 power amulets, go to repear shroud, auto-attack for 10 might stack, gone the DS……
But no, it is easier to come here any cry then accepting you are a bad player.
Nosoc also couldn’t break it against eles at his skill level, but whether or not the arguably best Necro in the game can beat it or not is irrelevant to the fact it was horridly designed and needed to change anyway.
I don’t feel the change that was made was a great change, but it is a much healthier mechanic now. Note “healthy” and " good/weak" have nothing to do with each other.
The counterplay to necro still is range. If you can maintain distance you can dps them down. Using fresh air and super speed is one of the easiest ways for ele to do this.
Im getting kinda tired awnsering this question over and over again.
Chill and slows stop that, as about half of this thread is trying to explain. The only way to get reliable condi clear is to trait for it and sadly the only condi clear we have are all on defensive traitlines. Wich means in the end if people think is fine, will be the death of any sort of consistant creative builds for elementalist. And tbh i dont want to be paper when my enemy is scissors.
Sadly the only way to make scepter work in its current underrepresented state is going full ham on yolo offensive skills. Kiting and constant air swapping makes sure your doing sustain damage, so you can reliable sit inrange and spike. But this also means you are literally forced out of any sort of stab/condi removal/healing/health/prot uptime etc.
My current build works because i can spec into 3 traitlines that are all pretty offensive traited. But they have 0 possibilities for me to clear condi. In my opinion ANY form of DPS with ele is nullified by this alone. You are forced to take at the very least earth or water to get some condi clears going.
The counterplay to necro still is range. If you can maintain distance you can dps them down. Using fresh air and super speed is one of the easiest ways for ele to do this.
Im getting kinda tired awnsering this question over and over again.
Chill and slows stop that, as about half of this thread is trying to explain. The only way to get reliable condi clear is to trait for it and sadly the only condi clear we have are all on defensive traitlines. Wich means in the end if people think is fine, will be the death of any sort of consistant creative builds for elementalist. And tbh i dont want to be paper when my enemy is scissors.Sadly the only way to make scepter work in its current underrepresented state is going full ham on yolo offensive skills. Kiting and constant air swapping makes sure your doing sustain damage, so you can reliable sit inrange and spike. But this also means you are literally forced out of any sort of stab/condi removal/healing/health/prot uptime etc.
My current build works because i can spec into 3 traitlines that are all pretty offensive traited. But they have 0 possibilities for me to clear condi. In my opinion ANY form of DPS with ele is nullified by this alone. You are forced to take at the very least earth or water to get some condi clears going.
Like … really .. it’s better if you leave other people make the arguments against the reapers
Even if you are a higher skilled ele, necro can beat you due to sheer sponge HP.
And before this patch, even if you were a higher skilled necro, any diamond skin ele could beat you with his eyes closed. Why is it only not ok now?
And why is he running zerker?
Best thing is, i didnt respond to that guy because he obviously doesnt understand what balance means, like so many other ppl. They only know spite.
“My class was underpowered last season, now yours can be underpowered because you already had your dominant meta”
Thats not promoting skill, thats promoting RNG imbalanced classes read the thread if you want to know what i think about it. Since this has been discussed over 3 times already.
Second on what you actually asked me. Why zerker? Because elementalist doesnt do any damage without zerker. Even marauder was extremely bad because its a sustain rune, in a time where scepter just doesnt do any damage.
As a scepter elementalist you are forced to play zerker to even be able to play this game on a fair level, yes its 20 times harder then other classes because you have almost no sustain or health, you dont have armor. and you fully relly on your dodges/kiting and timely blinds to stall. But atleast you can kill people before they kill you.
Its extremely high level if you know howto play it and i do.
Yet the problem still exists that as any elementalist that focusses on damage, even if its focus is hybrid support. You will not beat necros because you do not have enough traitlines/health and condi clears to simply clear the chills wich literally instant gg’s any scepter build.
You are forced into a few traitlines that can synergise with eachother to remove condis with. Do you know how little access elementalist even has to condi clear? And guess what, theyr all locked up in different trees. With the lowest HP ingame. With a single condi that hardcounters.
Chill needs to get reduced in effectiveness, its too potent. If it can hardcounter a class it shouldve been clear from the day chill go implemented in its current form, that it was too strong if you can shut down an entire class with it.
Ive stated it when reapers where revealed before HoT and everything following up to that point. That necros will be imbalanced in the ele vs necro matchup.
No I just thought it was funny that you only make the post when it’s your class. Where were your cries of outrage when DS wasn’t terrible and necros had no chance vs ele?
Funny, I already mentioned in this topic.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Does-Diamond-skin-need-a-nerf/5902374
Only bad Necro’s has no chance to kill Ele’s with old DS, as Nosc provide over and over in his stream, 0 power amulets, go to repear shroud, auto-attack for 10 might stack, gone the DS……
But no, it is easier to come here any cry then accepting you are a bad player.
Can you tell me how much time it’s going to take to build enough LS to stay in shroud for 10 secs just auto-attacking, let’s ignore that the ele can attacks you or heal?
I mean how can you play a berzerker class with 10k base hp and cloth armor when thieves, revenants, and mesmers exist.
I don’t understand how this issue still hasn’t been addressed.
I like how people in the thread are now just accepting the fact the game is imbalanced and think that rerolling meta will ever fix anything.
Im sorry to burst your bubble but if they dont atleast attempt to fix the game now, they will never do it.
And with that in mind, if they trully want this game to die out, this is the way to do it.
I like to see how people that claims that this IS an ele’s problem, not a reaper’s problem are constatly ignored in the thread. I will be one more of them:
The current state of elementalits is a inherent issue of the class. Eles need better skill timing to deal with conditions.
This thread claims to be a balance discussion, but it is not. The only hope is to nerf reapers because of people, not the actual situation.
PS to fellow necros: Don’t be fooled! The nerf is comming because of toxic people that populate this forum.
Are we talking about this level of skill?
[Necro/Reaper Gameplay Walkthrough]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0JWZ8t08TYKk I want to say that ele can learn how to deal with current crap BUT…if you’re telling me that it takes any kind of skill to press one button every 5-6s and apply 5-6 condi on a target…I don’t know what to say, I must be having a nightmare
We want talk about diamond skin, condi clear, ele, engi, warrior, svanir, Disneyland…whatever! But pls have some self-respect and stop saying that playing a condi build in GW2 requires any resemblance of brain activity
Beautiful art, maps, lore…yes ok we can all agree that GW2 is the best BUT..balance, general gameplay, these are not the GW1 devs and they have absolutely 0 clue about what they’re doing, so enjoy your game..and your illusion of skill
Implying GW1 wwas balanced? LOL
That game mightve had more stale metas than GW2, lets be honest and nopt nostalgic here
This thread…
How is Guard ever going to beat Druid?
How is Thief ever going to beat Guard?
How is War ever going to be meta? (sry couldn’t help it)
Sometimes we just have to acknowledge the rock paper scissors aspect of GW2 and know that the game isn’t balanced for 1v1 :/
aka FalseLights
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
Even if you are a higher skilled ele, necro can beat you due to sheer sponge HP.
And before this patch, even if you were a higher skilled necro, any diamond skin ele could beat you with his eyes closed. Why is it only not ok now?
And why is he running zerker?
Best thing is, i didnt respond to that guy because he obviously doesnt understand what balance means, like so many other ppl. They only know spite.
“My class was underpowered last season, now yours can be underpowered because you already had your dominant meta”
Thats not promoting skill, thats promoting RNG imbalanced classes read the thread if you want to know what i think about it. Since this has been discussed over 3 times already.
Second on what you actually asked me. Why zerker? Because elementalist doesnt do any damage without zerker. Even marauder was extremely bad because its a sustain rune, in a time where scepter just doesnt do any damage.
As a scepter elementalist you are forced to play zerker to even be able to play this game on a fair level, yes its 20 times harder then other classes because you have almost no sustain or health, you dont have armor. and you fully relly on your dodges/kiting and timely blinds to stall. But atleast you can kill people before they kill you.
Its extremely high level if you know howto play it and i do.
Yet the problem still exists that as any elementalist that focusses on damage, even if its focus is hybrid support. You will not beat necros because you do not have enough traitlines/health and condi clears to simply clear the chills wich literally instant gg’s any scepter build.
You are forced into a few traitlines that can synergise with eachother to remove condis with. Do you know how little access elementalist even has to condi clear? And guess what, theyr all locked up in different trees. With the lowest HP ingame. With a single condi that hardcounters.
Chill needs to get reduced in effectiveness, its too potent. If it can hardcounter a class it shouldve been clear from the day chill go implemented in its current form, that it was too strong if you can shut down an entire class with it.
Ive stated it when reapers where revealed before HoT and everything following up to that point. That necros will be imbalanced in the ele vs necro matchup.
No I just thought it was funny that you only make the post when it’s your class. Where were your cries of outrage when DS wasn’t terrible and necros had no chance vs ele?
Only bad Necro’s has no chance to kill Ele’s with old DS, as Nosc provide over and over in his stream, 0 power amulets, go to repear shroud, auto-attack for 10 might stack, gone the DS……
Actually, if you watch Nos’ stream, you’d know he was beating bad eles. He’s stated many times that he was never able to beat Wakkey (an equally skilled player) on his ele. Nice try though.
Even if you are a higher skilled ele, necro can beat you due to sheer sponge HP.
And before this patch, even if you were a higher skilled necro, any diamond skin ele could beat you with his eyes closed. Why is it only not ok now?
And why is he running zerker?
Best thing is, i didnt respond to that guy because he obviously doesnt understand what balance means, like so many other ppl. They only know spite.
“My class was underpowered last season, now yours can be underpowered because you already had your dominant meta”
Thats not promoting skill, thats promoting RNG imbalanced classes read the thread if you want to know what i think about it. Since this has been discussed over 3 times already.
Second on what you actually asked me. Why zerker? Because elementalist doesnt do any damage without zerker. Even marauder was extremely bad because its a sustain rune, in a time where scepter just doesnt do any damage.
As a scepter elementalist you are forced to play zerker to even be able to play this game on a fair level, yes its 20 times harder then other classes because you have almost no sustain or health, you dont have armor. and you fully relly on your dodges/kiting and timely blinds to stall. But atleast you can kill people before they kill you.
Its extremely high level if you know howto play it and i do.
Yet the problem still exists that as any elementalist that focusses on damage, even if its focus is hybrid support. You will not beat necros because you do not have enough traitlines/health and condi clears to simply clear the chills wich literally instant gg’s any scepter build.
You are forced into a few traitlines that can synergise with eachother to remove condis with. Do you know how little access elementalist even has to condi clear? And guess what, theyr all locked up in different trees. With the lowest HP ingame. With a single condi that hardcounters.
Chill needs to get reduced in effectiveness, its too potent. If it can hardcounter a class it shouldve been clear from the day chill go implemented in its current form, that it was too strong if you can shut down an entire class with it.
Ive stated it when reapers where revealed before HoT and everything following up to that point. That necros will be imbalanced in the ele vs necro matchup.
No I just thought it was funny that you only make the post when it’s your class. Where were your cries of outrage when DS wasn’t terrible and necros had no chance vs ele?
Only bad Necro’s has no chance to kill Ele’s with old DS, as Nosc provide over and over in his stream, 0 power amulets, go to repear shroud, auto-attack for 10 might stack, gone the DS……
Actually, if you watch Nos’ stream, you’d know he was beating bad eles. He’s stated many times that he was never able to beat Wakkey (an equally skilled player) on his ele. Nice try though.
It’s true if the ele was decent, he wouldn’t die to a necro. It was basically impossible to break DS if the ele knew what he was doing. Sure you could beat really bad eles, but that’s about it. There was a lot of people flaming necros for not being able to break DS when it really wasn’t up to them. Even though the hp you had to go through wasn’t really high (around 1.8K), ele had so much heal and cleanse that even if you did break it, they would just go to full hp. In the long run you would just die because the ele would outsustain you.
Anyone who says the necro is bad if he couldn’t break DS never faced any ele with a brain.
Im getting kinda tired awnsering this question over and over again.
Chill and slows stop that, as about half of this thread is trying to explain. The only way to get reliable condi clear is to trait for it and sadly the only condi clear we have are all on defensive traitlines.
My current build works because i can spec into 3 traitlines that are all pretty offensive traited. But they have 0 possibilities for me to clear condi. In my opinion ANY form of DPS with ele is nullified by this alone. You are forced to take at the very least earth or water to get some condi clears going.
The problem here is you’re assuming you should be able to get away with taking 0 defensives and still be able out sustain people.
Elementalists have the capabilities to handle reapers. You have the ability to kite, and reaper’s ability to apply chill at range is lackluster, and could easily be handled by taking any number of cleanse options a ele has available.
You simply choose not to.
To turn your argument around, your argument is equivalent to me running a power necro build with no chill or boon corrupts and complaining that eles are OP.
Sanity is for the weak minded.
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Im getting kinda tired awnsering this question over and over again.
Chill and slows stop that, as about half of this thread is trying to explain. The only way to get reliable condi clear is to trait for it and sadly the only condi clear we have are all on defensive traitlines.
My current build works because i can spec into 3 traitlines that are all pretty offensive traited. But they have 0 possibilities for me to clear condi. In my opinion ANY form of DPS with ele is nullified by this alone. You are forced to take at the very least earth or water to get some condi clears going.The problem here is you’re assuming you should be able to get away with taking 0 defensives and still be able out sustain people.
Elementalists have the capabilities to handle reapers. You have the ability to kite, and reaper’s ability to apply chill at range is lackluster, and could easily be handled by taking any number of cleanse options a ele has available.
You simply choose not to.
To turn your argument around, your argument is equivalent to me running a power necro build with no chill or boon corrupts and complaining that eles are OP.
Out of curiosity, how do you think an ele is going to kite a reaper and to what end?
BUT…if you’re telling me that it takes any kind of skill to press one button every 5-6s and apply 5-6 condi on a target…I don’t know what to say, I must be having a nightmare
There are exactly 2 necro abilities capable of putting 5-6 condis on a target.
Signet of Spite and Plague Signet. Sig of Spite has a 48 second cooldown with traits, and Plague Signet has a 24 second cd and only works if you’re dumb enough to condibomb a Psig necro.
You should try to be more truthful when posting..I know it’s hard to admit how broken condi mechanic is because you rely on it to accomplish anything at all in PvP but….there must be a limit to the lies
Instant activation…from 1200 range and ofc…you have to be dumb to be hit by this as you can dodge 100 times during a fight and the 2m CD on the skill surely helps a lot
-_-
Just signet of spite and Plague signet to apply 5-6 condis in an instant? Are you bloody kidding me?
Chill does too much freaking dmg and the upkeep is stupidly high , saying otherwise is delusional
(edited by Supreme.3164)
BUT…if you’re telling me that it takes any kind of skill to press one button every 5-6s and apply 5-6 condi on a target…I don’t know what to say, I must be having a nightmare
There are exactly 2 necro abilities capable of putting 5-6 condis on a target.
Signet of Spite and Plague Signet. Sig of Spite has a 48 second cooldown with traits, and Plague Signet has a 24 second cd and only works if you’re dumb enough to condibomb a Psig necro.You should try to be more truthful when posting..I know it’s hard to admit how broken condi mechanic is because you rely on it to accomplish anything at all in PvP but….there must be a limit to the lies
Instant activation…from 1200 range and ofc…you have to be dumb to be hit by this as you can dodge 100 times during a fight and the 2m CD on the skill surely helps a lot
-_-Just signet of spite and Plague signet to apply 5-6 condis in an instant? Are you bloody kidding me?
Chill does too much freaking dmg and the upkeep is stupidly high , saying otherwise is delusional
Doesn’t snap to target option also remove the need to target the AoE?
Fear the might of SHATTERSTONE.
I’m intrigued at how necro went from merely countering popular ele specs if specifically built to outright dominating them.
Necro’s turn in the spotlight. at least you can kite them.
Resident Disgruntled, Coffee-drinking Charr.
Zarin Mistcloak(THF) Valkyrie Mistblade(WAR) Kossori Mistwalker(REV) Durendal Mistward(GRD)
I used to think (build op, pls nerf) like you, but then I took a nerf to the knee.
Zarin Mistcloak(THF) Valkyrie Mistblade(WAR) Kossori Mistwalker(REV) Durendal Mistward(GRD)
I used to think (build op, pls nerf) like you, but then I took a nerf to the knee.
Just wanted to comment, as someone who plays a necro main (condi, power, hybrid builds) and has gone up against tons of eles post patch from bunker to glass cannons, I can tell you that their bunkering is still pretty top notch. I got all the way up to diamond myself playing ranked solo, and am a decent player. I really feel it depends on the build you are playing vs the ele’s skill. They can hold a point solo still for some time no problem.
I also think some people are only looking at 1v1 situations, and depending on the necro build, it either is or isn’t made for that. And even in 1v1 situations the ele can still hold it’s own. I really don’t feel OP at all most times. And try rushing mid on any map and being the first one there. Getting burned down before you can even build enough to jump to Shroud etc.
And side note, a thief can still get a quick stealth, cc, down goes the necro lol. If you weren’t paying attention or have time to position etc.
If people stopped taking 1v1s into account, then they would never have complained about the old DS…
(Not saying that the old DS wasn’t a terribly designed trait. The new version sucks just as much)
Fear the might of SHATTERSTONE.
Only way a condition reaper can lose is when it starts to goof around trying different skills than number 1.
Alerie Despins
I’m intrigued at how necro went from merely countering popular ele specs if specifically built to outright dominating them.
Necro’s turn in the spotlight. at least you can kite them.
I wish I could kite against a 1200 range weapons and chill on me.
Alerie Despins
BUT…if you’re telling me that it takes any kind of skill to press one button every 5-6s and apply 5-6 condi on a target…I don’t know what to say, I must be having a nightmare
There are exactly 2 necro abilities capable of putting 5-6 condis on a target.
Signet of Spite and Plague Signet. Sig of Spite has a 48 second cooldown with traits, and Plague Signet has a 24 second cd and only works if you’re dumb enough to condibomb a Psig necro.You should try to be more truthful when posting..I know it’s hard to admit how broken condi mechanic is because you rely on it to accomplish anything at all in PvP but….there must be a limit to the lies
Instant activation…from 1200 range and ofc…you have to be dumb to be hit by this as you can dodge 100 times during a fight and the 2m CD on the skill surely helps a lot
-_-Just signet of spite and Plague signet to apply 5-6 condis in an instant? Are you bloody kidding me?
Chill does too much freaking dmg and the upkeep is stupidly high , saying otherwise is delusional
Running Spite and Curses plus Sigil of Torment, having already popped Blood is Power with, my guess, Aristocracy runes (that Might lasted a while) in a Viper amulet.
It was also a single hit that procced every single on-crit effect that could be mustered into the build, since it got Barbed Precision, Weakening Shroud, and the Sigil of Torment. Combined with my assumption on Vipers amulet, that is a 4.95% chance of happening. If it was a Wanderer’s amulet, it’s an 8.91% chance of happening. And this is only if every ICD lined up just right.
TLDR: Such a hit doesn’t happen enough to worry about in PvP as a balancing factor.
EDIT: Something just isn’t lining up. There was also a Sigil of ice proc in there (making that particular hit only a 2.673% chance of happening on Wanderer’s Amulet), but there is 3 Vulnerability that I can’t place. It was too high health for Death’s Embrace (plus only 1 hit). Only thing I can think of is Chilling Nova proccing, but the target wasn’t chilled before he got hit, which is a requirement for that trait to work.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Maybe learn and accept the hardcounters of this game and how to not be out rotated, and stop complaining? Or should we all agree that 1 spec shouldnt be able to beat every other / stall for ages?
Team Deathmatch for PvP – Raise the AoE cap for WvW – More unique events for PvE
BUT…if you’re telling me that it takes any kind of skill to press one button every 5-6s and apply 5-6 condi on a target…I don’t know what to say, I must be having a nightmare
There are exactly 2 necro abilities capable of putting 5-6 condis on a target.
Signet of Spite and Plague Signet. Sig of Spite has a 48 second cooldown with traits, and Plague Signet has a 24 second cd and only works if you’re dumb enough to condibomb a Psig necro.You should try to be more truthful when posting..I know it’s hard to admit how broken condi mechanic is because you rely on it to accomplish anything at all in PvP but….there must be a limit to the lies
Instant activation…from 1200 range and ofc…you have to be dumb to be hit by this as you can dodge 100 times during a fight and the 2m CD on the skill surely helps a lot
-_-
You’re original post that I was quoting said:
to press one button every 5-6s and apply 5-6 condi on a target
If you actually watched the video that you linked you would notice that 2 buttons where used, not 1. Of those two abilities, one of them has a 30 second CD (or 20 second if you’re using the glass cannon build linked in that vid)
And if you went farther and looked up said abilities you would realize that the build being used in that video was a total glass cannon build
Moreover some of those condis where from RNG on-crit sigils. Interestingly enough not one of the common meta necro builds use those on-crit sigils and traits because the meta necro builds don’t run precision, Or Curses for that matter.
Oh and that necro in that vid ending up losing 4,850 of his own health from the self conditioning incurred from using the corruption ability.
Also see this:
Running Spite and Curses plus Sigil of Torment, having already popped Blood is Power with, my guess, Aristocracy runes (that Might lasted a while) in a Viper amulet.
It was also a single hit that procced every single on-crit effect that could be mustered into the build, since it got Barbed Precision, Weakening Shroud, and the Sigil of Torment. Combined with my assumption on Vipers amulet, that is a 4.95% chance of happening. If it was a Wanderer’s amulet, it’s an 8.91% chance of happening. And this is only if every ICD lined up just right.
TLDR: Such a hit doesn’t happen enough to worry about in PvP as a balancing factor.
EDIT: Something just isn’t lining up. There was also a Sigil of ice proc in there (making that particular hit only a 2.673% chance of happening on Wanderer’s Amulet), but there is 3 Vulnerability that I can’t place. It was too high health for Death’s Embrace (plus only 1 hit). Only thing I can think of is Chilling Nova proccing, but the target wasn’t chilled before he got hit, which is a requirement for that trait to work.
Sanity is for the weak minded.
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YouTube
(edited by Crinn.7864)
Doesn’t snap to target option also remove the need to target the AoE?
Nobody in their right mind uses snap targeting since it centers the AoE on the target. Using manual targeting often allows you to hit more people by centering the AoE between two players that would otherwise be to far apart to cleave.
Sanity is for the weak minded.
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The counterplay to necro still is range. If you can maintain distance you can dps them down. Using fresh air and super speed is one of the easiest ways for ele to do this.
Im getting kinda tired awnsering this question over and over again.
Chill and slows stop that, as about half of this thread is trying to explain. The only way to get reliable condi clear is to trait for it and sadly the only condi clear we have are all on defensive traitlines. Wich means in the end if people think is fine, will be the death of any sort of consistant creative builds for elementalist. And tbh i dont want to be paper when my enemy is scissors.Sadly the only way to make scepter work in its current underrepresented state is going full ham on yolo offensive skills. Kiting and constant air swapping makes sure your doing sustain damage, so you can reliable sit inrange and spike. But this also means you are literally forced out of any sort of stab/condi removal/healing/health/prot uptime etc.
My current build works because i can spec into 3 traitlines that are all pretty offensive traited. But they have 0 possibilities for me to clear condi. In my opinion ANY form of DPS with ele is nullified by this alone. You are forced to take at the very least earth or water to get some condi clears going.
As I said, if you used the super speed on air attunement you would be unaffected by that part of chill. Then you about 9 seconds of superspeed before you run into the first attunement cooldown. If you clear the chill from staff they have very limited options to hit you, everything else for them is at 600 range or less, or heavily telegraphed like their scepter.
“Kentigem”-chief. Born cycle of Dusk. Wyld Hunt:
Learn as much mending and medical info as possible so that it can be added to the Dream.
Become the first Chief of Mending and guide the newly awaken as well as those who want to learn.
Learn as much mending and medical info as possible so that it can be added to the Dream.
Become the first Chief of Mending and guide the newly awaken as well as those who want to learn.
You are supposed to bend over and take it. He picked Reaper, so he is more skilled than you. Git gud.
BUT…if you’re telling me that it takes any kind of skill to press one button every 5-6s and apply 5-6 condi on a target…I don’t know what to say, I must be having a nightmare
There are exactly 2 necro abilities capable of putting 5-6 condis on a target.
Signet of Spite and Plague Signet. Sig of Spite has a 48 second cooldown with traits, and Plague Signet has a 24 second cd and only works if you’re dumb enough to condibomb a Psig necro.You should try to be more truthful when posting..I know it’s hard to admit how broken condi mechanic is because you rely on it to accomplish anything at all in PvP but….there must be a limit to the lies
Instant activation…from 1200 range and ofc…you have to be dumb to be hit by this as you can dodge 100 times during a fight and the 2m CD on the skill surely helps a lot
-_-Just signet of spite and Plague signet to apply 5-6 condis in an instant? Are you bloody kidding me?
Chill does too much freaking dmg and the upkeep is stupidly high , saying otherwise is delusional
Running Spite and Curses plus Sigil of Torment, having already popped Blood is Power with, my guess, Aristocracy runes (that Might lasted a while) in a Viper amulet.
It was also a single hit that procced every single on-crit effect that could be mustered into the build, since it got Barbed Precision, Weakening Shroud, and the Sigil of Torment. Combined with my assumption on Vipers amulet, that is a 4.95% chance of happening. If it was a Wanderer’s amulet, it’s an 8.91% chance of happening. And this is only if every ICD lined up just right.
TLDR: Such a hit doesn’t happen enough to worry about in PvP as a balancing factor.
EDIT: Something just isn’t lining up. There was also a Sigil of ice proc in there (making that particular hit only a 2.673% chance of happening on Wanderer’s Amulet), but there is 3 Vulnerability that I can’t place. It was too high health for Death’s Embrace (plus only 1 hit). Only thing I can think of is Chilling Nova proccing, but the target wasn’t chilled before he got hit, which is a requirement for that trait to work.
That was a chilling nova proc, which then critted which procced the torment sigil and procced chilling victory as well. How this occurred can be a coding issue. If sigil of ice is applied by the game first and then the “test” for chilling nova is done then you can proc it even when your target.
EverythingOP
Right now I don’t even care about ele beating reapers…we just need a hardcounter for reapers like an unwinnable 1vs1…right now there is nothing
Right now I don’t even care about ele beating reapers…we just need a hardcounter for reapers like an unwinnable 1vs1…right now there is nothing
Lol no. This game doesn’t need hard counters to anything. A favourable class yes, hard counter – hell no.
Right now I don’t even care about ele beating reapers…we just need a hardcounter for reapers like an unwinnable 1vs1…right now there is nothing
I suppose thiefs don’t exist.
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