Guild Wars 2

I was fighting the ultimate annoying combo today: CC engi with slick shoes, daze mesmer with so many skills bursts and clones it’s almost funny (specially when you are moa), and ranger pewpewing from 1500 range. Just makes you want to uninstall the game.

I don’t what happened with class balance, but things are just getting worse and worse. The stability changes made Slick Shoes completely broken, the longbow buff is unjustifiable…

I didn’t want to rant but seriously Anet, why allow Moa in PvP? how can you 1v1 someone that has a 12k + burst when you are stuck moa for 10 seconds? Like compare ele elites for example, they don’t even do anything helpful, but Mesmer has an elite that makes it impossible to fight for 10 seconds? lol we’re light years from eSport there.

Xillllix.3485:

I was fighting the ultimate annoying combo today: CC engi with slick shoes, daze mesmer with so many skills bursts and clones it’s almost funny (specially when you are moa), and ranger pewpewing from 1500 range. Just makes you want to uninstall the game.

I don’t what happened with class balance, but things are just getting worse and worse. The stability changes made Slick Shoes completely broken, the longbow buff is unjustifiable…

I didn’t want to rant but seriously Anet, why allow Moa in PvP? how can you 1v1 someone that has a 12k + burst when you are stuck moa for 10 seconds? Like compare ele elites for example, they don’t even do anything helpful, but Mesmer has an elite that makes it impossible to fight for 10 seconds? lol we’re light years from eSport there.

Instead of spamming your CC during your spam skill rotations, just wait until the highly animated, long cast timed Moa skill starts to channel and interrupt it.

If you’re ele follow through with a Tornado and spam 3 CC knockback into oblivion for maximum effect ;D

Edit: Oh, and don’t try to 1v3 then come to the forums to complain like it’s the Mesmer classes fault when you lose?

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xillllix.3485:

I was fighting the ultimate annoying combo today: CC engi with slick shoes, daze mesmer with so many skills bursts and clones it’s almost funny (specially when you are moa), and ranger pewpewing from 1500 range. Just makes you want to uninstall the game.

I don’t what happened with class balance, but things are just getting worse and worse. The stability changes made Slick Shoes completely broken, the longbow buff is unjustifiable…

I didn’t want to rant but seriously Anet, why allow Moa in PvP? how can you 1v1 someone that has a 12k + burst when you are stuck moa for 10 seconds? Like compare ele elites for example, they don’t even do anything helpful, but Mesmer has an elite that makes it impossible to fight for 10 seconds? lol we’re light years from eSport there.

Instead of spamming your CC during your spam skill rotations, just wait until the highly animated, long cast timed Moa skill starts to channel and interrupt it.

If you’re ele follow through with a Tornado and spam 3 CC knockback into oblivion for maximum effect ;D

Edit: Oh, and don’t try to 1v3 then come to the forums to complain like it’s the Mesmer classes fault when you lose?

Oh for god sake…mesmers use moa from freaking stealth, just let’s stop this “long animation” BS already, I have no complaints against mesmer…but Moa used from stealth is utterly broken, ridiculous design

Supreme.3164:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xillllix.3485:

I was fighting the ultimate annoying combo today: CC engi with slick shoes, daze mesmer with so many skills bursts and clones it’s almost funny (specially when you are moa), and ranger pewpewing from 1500 range. Just makes you want to uninstall the game.

I don’t what happened with class balance, but things are just getting worse and worse. The stability changes made Slick Shoes completely broken, the longbow buff is unjustifiable…

I didn’t want to rant but seriously Anet, why allow Moa in PvP? how can you 1v1 someone that has a 12k + burst when you are stuck moa for 10 seconds? Like compare ele elites for example, they don’t even do anything helpful, but Mesmer has an elite that makes it impossible to fight for 10 seconds? lol we’re light years from eSport there.

Instead of spamming your CC during your spam skill rotations, just wait until the highly animated, long cast timed Moa skill starts to channel and interrupt it.

If you’re ele follow through with a Tornado and spam 3 CC knockback into oblivion for maximum effect ;D

Edit: Oh, and don’t try to 1v3 then come to the forums to complain like it’s the Mesmer classes fault when you lose?

Oh for god sake…mesmers use moa from freaking stealth, just let’s stop this “long animation” BS already, I have no complaints against mesmer…but Moa used from stealth is utterly broken, ridiculous design

wait wait wait, I can do this too /clears throat/

“Oh for god sake… aegis, dodge roll, invuln, aoe knockback, LoS, AoE blinds, etc etc etc”, yeah that was fun.

The amount of Mesmer mains in this thread is staggeringly hilarious.

Another Lordrosicky’s daily troll thread <3.

I used to think you were serious and simply had no concept of balance.

Now I’m struggling to believe that you are not a really dedicated troll.

must not feed….. must resist….

mesmer do have strong sides but really that do have counterplay (just to name few: blinds, stealth, condis, CCs lol)

WhiteCrow.5310:

The amount of Mesmer mains in this thread is staggeringly hilarious.

i am thief main :P

Ross Biddle.2367:

vincecontix.1264:

Thief is the main thing that is keeping mesmer in check, if not for thief there would be far more mesmer complaints.

If you removed thieves from the game, comps would change, and something else would sit in play to counter Mesmer.

If it weren’t for theives mesmers would wreak Havoc. Portal plays would become more common and zergfests would be more common without the threat of the theif intercepting and decapping

NeXeD.3042:

Ross Biddle.2367:

vincecontix.1264:

Thief is the main thing that is keeping mesmer in check, if not for thief there would be far more mesmer complaints.

If you removed thieves from the game, comps would change, and something else would sit in play to counter Mesmer.

If it weren’t for theives mesmers would wreak Havoc. Portal plays would become more common and zergfests would be more common without the threat of the theif intercepting and decapping

not really… people would just play necros and nuke mesmers since those have close to no condi removal

and medi guards fair pretty well vs mes, not to mention any cele~

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xillllix.3485:

I was fighting the ultimate annoying combo today: CC engi with slick shoes, daze mesmer with so many skills bursts and clones it’s almost funny (specially when you are moa), and ranger pewpewing from 1500 range. Just makes you want to uninstall the game.

I don’t what happened with class balance, but things are just getting worse and worse. The stability changes made Slick Shoes completely broken, the longbow buff is unjustifiable…

I didn’t want to rant but seriously Anet, why allow Moa in PvP? how can you 1v1 someone that has a 12k + burst when you are stuck moa for 10 seconds? Like compare ele elites for example, they don’t even do anything helpful, but Mesmer has an elite that makes it impossible to fight for 10 seconds? lol we’re light years from eSport there.

Instead of spamming your CC during your spam skill rotations, just wait until the highly animated, long cast timed Moa skill starts to channel and interrupt it.

If you’re ele follow through with a Tornado and spam 3 CC knockback into oblivion for maximum effect ;D

Edit: Oh, and don’t try to 1v3 then come to the forums to complain like it’s the Mesmer classes fault when you lose?

Yes, use tornado which get only one stack of stab against a class that have loads of interruptsd and boon removal. Great idea.

Seriously? How often do you see a Mesmer do reliably well in tournaments, heck even in normal TPvP if the enemy team has a even semi-competent teef? As it currently stands you have to play perfectly in order to beat a teef 1v1 unless you’re one of the few Mesmers that are true masters at the class, in an actual game it’s even more chaotic and 1 Backstab that double crits Fire/Air means your death.

Is the utility and mobility good? Yes. Is the class good at 1v1s? Yes. That doesn’t make the class OP when several of the current meta builds flat out counter them. Focus the Mes and chances are you at the very least make them have to go purely on the defensive or they have to retreat. Atm Shatter is the only real viable build and the TPvP setup has generally no condi removal and is weak to focus fire.

Meanwhile, we have teef that is pushing Mes out of the meta and the cele builds that are generally not that weak to the Mesmer’s way of dealing damage. Man oh man, I can’t wait to master this class and have the update land and make people give me crap for my interrupt build.

Compared to teef, Mesmer looks flat out weak atm. Oh, and MediGuard is also very strong vs Shatter. I’ll admit I used to hate Mesmers as a Warrior main, but once you play one for yourself beating them becomes much easier. It’s all about knowing your enemy.

NeXeD.3042:

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

- mesmer stealth may be annoying but is actually necessary, they are glass after all
- define lock down? most of them are visible
- 10k spikes happen only on squishies and squishies have ways to do same thing to mesmers, really
- moa is really long CD and is interruptable, can be blinded, blocked etc……
- mes ports have relative long CD and oncea gain necessary for their viability; they have low HP, not that amazing heals and almost no condi removal
- mes portal is long CD and forces them to drop other survivality spells; how dare mes to have team support O_O
- air/fire sigils are not class mechanics….
- necros/eles do same thing?
- invul is annoying but once again what is the issue? it is not like class is bunkery by all means and they still eat condis while in it

P.S. i don’t even play mesmer….

Cynz.9437:

NeXeD.3042:

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

- mesmer stealth may be annoying but is actually necessary, they are glass after all
- define lock down? most of them are visible
- 10k spikes happen only on squishies and squishies have ways to do same thing to mesmers, really
- moa is really long CD and is interruptable…..
- mes ports have relative long CD and oncea gain necessary for their viability; they have low HP, not that amazing heals and almost no condi removal
- mes portal is long CD and forces them to drop other survivality spells; how dare mes to have team support O_O
- air/fire sigils are not class mechanics….
- necros/eles do same thing?
- invul is annoying but once again what is the issue? it is not like class is bunkery by all means and they still eat condis while in it

P.S. i don’t even play mesmer….

I would just like to point out some things. Mesmers are glassy, yes but compare their hp pool to eles/thieves. I’m not saying that they have more survability, just the fact their hp pool is a bit higher.

I think the issue with their burst from stealth is the fact they can apply 2 sec immob. You can see the clone going after you and dodge it, but I suppose it requires quite a fast reaction time.

The fact Moa is interruptable doesn’t change anything because you can cast it from stealth. I think that’s one of the most broken things about mesmers, it leaves you with literally no counterplay. However, this has only its full potential in coordinated teams and it can really turn a game around, but same goes for Lich, Rampage…

I would argue that mesmers have bad heal, in the regards of healing skill. It’s pretty good.

I don’t think mesmers are overpowered, however I think ANet is creating a major power creep with the suggested changes, which could bring many issues to the game if the traits will stay as we saw them. Also, I think that if thieves weren’t a thing, mesmers would be dominating the game. The class is not weak at all, it just has issues competing with thieves.

Cynz.9437:

NeXeD.3042:

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

- mesmer stealth may be annoying but is actually necessary, they are glass after all
- define lock down? most of them are visible
- 10k spikes happen only on squishies and squishies have ways to do same thing to mesmers, really
- moa is really long CD and is interruptable, can be blinded, blocked etc……
- mes ports have relative long CD and oncea gain necessary for their viability; they have low HP, not that amazing heals and almost no condi removal
- mes portal is long CD and forces them to drop other survivality spells; how dare mes to have team support O_O
- air/fire sigils are not class mechanics….
- necros/eles do same thing?
- invul is annoying but once again what is the issue? it is not like class is bunkery by all means and they still eat condis while in it

P.S. i don’t even play mesmer….

Ps I’m a necro. I can also play a mesmer. People have a much harder time locking me down on a mesmer than they do on against my necro. If it wasn’t for theives I wouldn’t play my necro. I would play my mesmer because then I would have ranged burst (necro is melee), vertical teleport (plz don’t even compare wurm with blink, retreat, and portal) ), true invuln (necro has nothing like that, it has a pseudo invuln with sa and ds still isn’t close to be as good as a mesmer) the only thing I ever have trouble agaisnt when I’m on my mesmer is theives. Everything else I can kite forever as long as I avoid their gap closer combos I’m golden.

I’m not saying mesmers are op in the current meta. I think that is mostly because it is so widely known that theives rek mesmers hard. So the players that would be extraordinary mesmers switch classes.

I wasn’t arguing they were op, my argument was they would be “wreak havoc” if it wasnt for theives.

and the thing that makes theives and mesmers somewhat ridiculous is stealth, so they gave some other classes some aoe and passive procs to death with all the stealth spikes… then you have some people complaining about stealth and some people about passives procs. Both are broken. But only mesmers and theives can truly combine the two to make a ridiculous pain train combo. Yeah I know engi has that one ridiculous combo from stealth but I don’t see too many people playing that engi zerker spec, someone got me with it the other day though literally killed me from 16k health.

glock.6590:

Lordsicky you made a QQ post about every class at this point about how it takes no skill and its overpowered. Is there something that takes skill and that isn’t overpowered to you? I’m just curious.

condition necro i think

Vapour.7348:

what counters mesmer – thieves and condi pressure

most thieves are bad and it’s not rare to see mesmers outsmart them.
thanks to ele and warrior cleansing, condi builds are played much less.

mesmers counter:

shout warriors – meta
dps guards – meta
power necros
power rangers
cele rifle engie – meta
turret engie
d/d ele – meta
fresh air ele
staff ele

mesmers arent the best at holding points and their mobility is crap. but the poor mobility is somewhat compensated by their portal.

I used to queue with a good thief and together we’d prevent anyone from reaching our points held by downing them in less than 5 sec.

If a mesmer “outsmarts” a thief the thief has to be soooo much worse, so this really is not a legit thing.

I don’t know if you are talking about 1v1 here but mesmer actually counters few of the classes you mention. Power ranger and guardian are actually really annoying vs mesmer. Tell me if i misunderstood your post, but if not, it is full of misconceptions. ^^

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Laraley.7695:

Cynz.9437:

NeXeD.3042:

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

- mesmer stealth may be annoying but is actually necessary, they are glass after all
- define lock down? most of them are visible
- 10k spikes happen only on squishies and squishies have ways to do same thing to mesmers, really
- moa is really long CD and is interruptable…..
- mes ports have relative long CD and oncea gain necessary for their viability; they have low HP, not that amazing heals and almost no condi removal
- mes portal is long CD and forces them to drop other survivality spells; how dare mes to have team support O_O
- air/fire sigils are not class mechanics….
- necros/eles do same thing?
- invul is annoying but once again what is the issue? it is not like class is bunkery by all means and they still eat condis while in it

P.S. i don’t even play mesmer….

I would just like to point out some things. Mesmers are glassy, yes but compare their hp pool to eles/thieves. I’m not saying that they have more survability, just the fact their hp pool is a bit higher.

I think the issue with their burst from stealth is the fact they can apply 2 sec immob. You can see the clone going after you and dodge it, but I suppose it requires quite a fast reaction time.

The fact Moa is interruptable doesn’t change anything because you can cast it from stealth. I think that’s one of the most broken things about mesmers, it leaves you with literally no counterplay. However, this has only its full potential in coordinated teams and it can really turn a game around, but same goes for Lich, Rampage…

I would argue that mesmers have bad heal, in the regards of healing skill. It’s pretty good.

I don’t think mesmers are overpowered, however I think ANet is creating a major power creep with the suggested changes, which could bring many issues to the game if the traits will stay as we saw them. Also, I think that if thieves weren’t a thing, mesmers would be dominating the game. The class is not weak at all, it just has issues competing with thieves.

- eles have heals, thieves have more steath and mobility than mes hence why low HP pool
- You can see the clone going after you and dodge it, but I suppose it requires quite a fast reaction time. <<< "yeah that is called l2p O_O
- moa can be blocked, blinded, LoSd etc.; i am pretty sure moa fails more than it actually lands and moa isn’t as nasty as crate for example as you still can dodge and use skill 5 to get away~
- it is not easiest heal to pull off effectively and can be easily interrupted….. not to mention CD on it
- i think talking about how builds will play out once specializations come out is too early, nothing is set and we didn’t even see all specs yet~
- yeah i am sure mesmers would replace thieves but then again if that happend we would see more necros probably because mes get nuked by condis like nobody else and more guards ofc

bottom line, as annyoing mesmers are, i think they are fine in overall picture…. we can’t just have everyone play celery/cele engi/shoutbow and delete every other build~

other zerkers may struggle a bit vs thieves/mes/dps guards but maybe those builds need buffs because frankly even if mes/guards/thieves didn’t exist those zerkers still wouldn’t fair well vs celestial cancer

NeXeD.3042:

Cynz.9437:

NeXeD.3042:

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

- mesmer stealth may be annoying but is actually necessary, they are glass after all
- define lock down? most of them are visible
- 10k spikes happen only on squishies and squishies have ways to do same thing to mesmers, really
- moa is really long CD and is interruptable, can be blinded, blocked etc……
- mes ports have relative long CD and oncea gain necessary for their viability; they have low HP, not that amazing heals and almost no condi removal
- mes portal is long CD and forces them to drop other survivality spells; how dare mes to have team support O_O
- air/fire sigils are not class mechanics….
- necros/eles do same thing?
- invul is annoying but once again what is the issue? it is not like class is bunkery by all means and they still eat condis while in it

P.S. i don’t even play mesmer….

Ps I’m a necro. I can also play a mesmer. People have a much harder time locking me down on a mesmer than they do on against my necro. If it wasn’t for theives I wouldn’t play my necro. I would play my mesmer because then I would have ranged burst (necro is melee), vertical teleport (plz don’t even compare wurm with blink, retreat, and portal) ), true invuln (necro has nothing like that, it has a pseudo invuln with sa and ds still isn’t close to be as good as a mesmer) the only thing I ever have trouble agaisnt when I’m on my mesmer is theives. Everything else I can kite forever as long as I avoid their gap closer combos I’m golden.

I’m not saying mesmers are op in the current meta. I think that is mostly because it is so widely known that theives rek mesmers hard. So the players that would be extraordinary mesmers switch classes.

I wasn’t arguing they were op, my argument was they would be “wreak havoc” if it wasnt for theives.

and the thing that makes theives and mesmers somewhat ridiculous is stealth, so they gave some other classes some aoe and passive procs to death with all the stealth spikes… then you have some people complaining about stealth and some people about passives procs. Both are broken. But only mesmers and theives can truly combine the two to make a ridiculous pain train combo. Yeah I know engi has that one ridiculous combo from stealth but I don’t see too many people playing that engi zerker spec, someone got me with it the other day though literally killed me from 16k health.

Very well said.

As I said, they buffed mesmer too much to cope with thieves. Yeh we all know thieves are broken and have been required in gw2 teams since release. On thief you can carry harder than any other class. Everyone knows how broken thieves are. And it isn’t just mesmers who struggle with them. Everyone does. Even shoutbows can get spiked and stuned to death by a thief easily.

So now every other class has to deal with mesmers being broken just because they have trouble with thieves? Talk about rampant power creep. Thief needs significant nerfs, and when it does then mesmer will need nerfs too. Hence the point of this thread.

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

Coulter.2315:

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

they are nerfing stolen spells tho by 50%… all of them :/

Lordrosicky.5813:

NeXeD.3042:

Cynz.9437:

NeXeD.3042:

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

- mesmer stealth may be annoying but is actually necessary, they are glass after all
- define lock down? most of them are visible
- 10k spikes happen only on squishies and squishies have ways to do same thing to mesmers, really
- moa is really long CD and is interruptable, can be blinded, blocked etc……
- mes ports have relative long CD and oncea gain necessary for their viability; they have low HP, not that amazing heals and almost no condi removal
- mes portal is long CD and forces them to drop other survivality spells; how dare mes to have team support O_O
- air/fire sigils are not class mechanics….
- necros/eles do same thing?
- invul is annoying but once again what is the issue? it is not like class is bunkery by all means and they still eat condis while in it

P.S. i don’t even play mesmer….

Ps I’m a necro. I can also play a mesmer. People have a much harder time locking me down on a mesmer than they do on against my necro. If it wasn’t for theives I wouldn’t play my necro. I would play my mesmer because then I would have ranged burst (necro is melee), vertical teleport (plz don’t even compare wurm with blink, retreat, and portal) ), true invuln (necro has nothing like that, it has a pseudo invuln with sa and ds still isn’t close to be as good as a mesmer) the only thing I ever have trouble agaisnt when I’m on my mesmer is theives. Everything else I can kite forever as long as I avoid their gap closer combos I’m golden.

I’m not saying mesmers are op in the current meta. I think that is mostly because it is so widely known that theives rek mesmers hard. So the players that would be extraordinary mesmers switch classes.

I wasn’t arguing they were op, my argument was they would be “wreak havoc” if it wasnt for theives.

and the thing that makes theives and mesmers somewhat ridiculous is stealth, so they gave some other classes some aoe and passive procs to death with all the stealth spikes… then you have some people complaining about stealth and some people about passives procs. Both are broken. But only mesmers and theives can truly combine the two to make a ridiculous pain train combo. Yeah I know engi has that one ridiculous combo from stealth but I don’t see too many people playing that engi zerker spec, someone got me with it the other day though literally killed me from 16k health.

Very well said.

As I said, they buffed mesmer too much to cope with thieves. Yeh we all know thieves are broken and have been required in gw2 teams since release. On thief you can carry harder than any other class. Everyone knows how broken thieves are. And it isn’t just mesmers who struggle with them. Everyone does. Even shoutbows can get spiked and stuned to death by a thief easily.

So now every other class has to deal with mesmers being broken just because they have trouble with thieves? Talk about rampant power creep. Thief needs significant nerfs, and when it does then mesmer will need nerfs too. Hence the point of this thread.

Mesmers have had Staff clone extra bounce (Staff isn’t used that much atm), extra Might on Shatter, increase in Torch 4 radius and Halting Strike as essentially the ONLY buffs to Shatter build SINCE LAUNCH. The Sword changes were so you didn’t have hills kitten us – you can count it a buff if you really want but that brings us up to 5 positive changes in almost 3 years – also we lost the ability to blink to our clone’s location if it died in the process.

I’m fine with you saying “I don’t like Mesmers” but don’t say “they buffed mesmer too much to cope with thieves.” cause that be lies. You know my feelings on Fire+Air, argue their removal rather than “Mesmer OP” if thats your real concern.

Cynz.9437:

Coulter.2315:

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

they are nerfing stolen spells tho by 50%… all of them :/

Whatever. Every patch all the thieves claim it is the end of thieves. The patch comes out and they are literally better than ever. Remember when thief was in every team and they randomly decided to buff their base initative regen. Thieves claimed that was a nerf. Hilarious. Problem for thieves is most of them are mechanically worse than their mmr. They are carried by their spec. Same for warriors too. So they will think nerfs are actually bad for them, when actually big nerfs are needed to make thieves play at the mmr they should play at.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Cynz.9437:

Coulter.2315:

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

they are nerfing stolen spells tho by 50%… all of them :/

Whatever. Every patch all the thieves claim it is the end of thieves. The patch comes out and they are literally better than ever. Remember when thief was in every team and they randomly decided to buff their base initative regen. Thieves claimed that was a nerf. Hilarious. Problem for thieves is most of them are mechanically worse than their mmr. They are carried by their spec. Same for warriors too. So they will think nerfs are actually bad for them, when actually big nerfs are needed to make thieves play at the mmr they should play at.

mmm must bite…. where do you see any thief right now saying that next patch gonna destroy them lol

Cynz.9437:

Coulter.2315:

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

they are nerfing stolen spells tho by 50%… all of them :/

Actually they are nerfing them by about 1/3 and giving access to a 2nd activation, some are even just being made more efficient (think the ranger one ticks faster so you get the same effect in shorter duration).

Coulter.2315:

Cynz.9437:

Coulter.2315:

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

they are nerfing stolen spells tho by 50%… all of them :/

Actually they are nerfing them by about 1/3 and giving access to a 2nd activation, some are even just being made more efficient (think the ranger one ticks faster so you get the same effect in shorter duration).

Which makes it much better imo

Quadox.7834:

Vapour.7348:

what counters mesmer – thieves and condi pressure

most thieves are bad and it’s not rare to see mesmers outsmart them.
thanks to ele and warrior cleansing, condi builds are played much less.

mesmers counter:

shout warriors – meta
dps guards – meta
power necros
power rangers
cele rifle engie – meta
turret engie
d/d ele – meta
fresh air ele
staff ele

mesmers arent the best at holding points and their mobility is crap. but the poor mobility is somewhat compensated by their portal.

I used to queue with a good thief and together we’d prevent anyone from reaching our points held by downing them in less than 5 sec.

If a mesmer “outsmarts” a thief the thief has to be soooo much worse, so this really is not a legit thing.

I don’t know if you are talking about 1v1 here but mesmer actually counters few of the classes you mention. Power ranger and guardian are actually really annoying vs mesmer. Tell me if i misunderstood your post, but if not, it is full of misconceptions. ^^

You are entitled to your opinion even if it’s wrong. Since you’ve mentioned 1v1, mesmers have always been apex predators in 1v1 and it hasn’t changed. Thieves are the only thorn on our side. Another counter is condi trap ranger but who plays that. If you lose to power rangers and dps guardians, I don’t know what to say.

I dont think you misunderstood my post, but perhaps you misunderstood your profession.

Vapour.7348:

Quadox.7834:

Vapour.7348:

what counters mesmer – thieves and condi pressure

most thieves are bad and it’s not rare to see mesmers outsmart them.
thanks to ele and warrior cleansing, condi builds are played much less.

mesmers counter:

shout warriors – meta
dps guards – meta
power necros
power rangers
cele rifle engie – meta
turret engie
d/d ele – meta
fresh air ele
staff ele

mesmers arent the best at holding points and their mobility is crap. but the poor mobility is somewhat compensated by their portal.

I used to queue with a good thief and together we’d prevent anyone from reaching our points held by downing them in less than 5 sec.

If a mesmer “outsmarts” a thief the thief has to be soooo much worse, so this really is not a legit thing.

I don’t know if you are talking about 1v1 here but mesmer actually counters few of the classes you mention. Power ranger and guardian are actually really annoying vs mesmer. Tell me if i misunderstood your post, but if not, it is full of misconceptions. ^^

You are entitled to your opinion even if it’s wrong. Since you’ve mentioned 1v1, mesmers have always been apex predators in 1v1 and it hasn’t changed. Thieves are the only thorn on our side. Another counter is condi trap ranger but who plays that. If you lose to power rangers and dps guardians, I don’t know what to say.

I dont think you misunderstood my post, but perhaps you misunderstood your profession.

You shouldn’t be attacking someone’s knowledge of the class if you think trap ranger is a counter – its probably the weakest ranger variant for us to fight (pssst clones set off traps).

Coulter.2315:

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

I main thief,SA didn’t get buffed they just turned it into medic, why I would be happy fighting other thieves is the buff to condition/cc application on almost every class especially stacking burning but of course as usual I worry of necro, most just put themselves in vulnerable scenarios.

Coulter.2315:

Vapour.7348:

Quadox.7834:

Vapour.7348:

what counters mesmer – thieves and condi pressure

most thieves are bad and it’s not rare to see mesmers outsmart them.
thanks to ele and warrior cleansing, condi builds are played much less.

mesmers counter:

shout warriors – meta
dps guards – meta
power necros
power rangers
cele rifle engie – meta
turret engie
d/d ele – meta
fresh air ele
staff ele

mesmers arent the best at holding points and their mobility is crap. but the poor mobility is somewhat compensated by their portal.

I used to queue with a good thief and together we’d prevent anyone from reaching our points held by downing them in less than 5 sec.

If a mesmer “outsmarts” a thief the thief has to be soooo much worse, so this really is not a legit thing.

I don’t know if you are talking about 1v1 here but mesmer actually counters few of the classes you mention. Power ranger and guardian are actually really annoying vs mesmer. Tell me if i misunderstood your post, but if not, it is full of misconceptions. ^^

You are entitled to your opinion even if it’s wrong. Since you’ve mentioned 1v1, mesmers have always been apex predators in 1v1 and it hasn’t changed. Thieves are the only thorn on our side. Another counter is condi trap ranger but who plays that. If you lose to power rangers and dps guardians, I don’t know what to say.

I dont think you misunderstood my post, but perhaps you misunderstood your profession.

You shouldn’t be attacking someone’s knowledge of the class if you think trap ranger is a counter – its probably the weakest ranger variant for us to fight (pssst clones set off traps).

Ugh, I cited condi trap due to its extreme rarity and I have melted mesmers with it but it’s a troll build more than anything else.

If you read his response, he was first to say that my post was full of misconceptions. His opinion needed correction because it was false and misleading. I play multi classes and dont recall ever having an issue against power rangers or dps guards when on my mesmer.

Coulter.2315:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Oh dear Henry xDudisx is agreeing with you – time to think about your life choices.

And Charles Kennedy died

i’ve been wanting to ask you this for a long long long time but…are you anne coulter? coz omigharrd i love your books and interviews and pic of you with a shotgun and crapp. can i have an autograph? also your botox administrator does an amazing job. you’re like 65 but look 35. omigharrd im so star struck.

I’m named for Mrs Coulter from His Dark Materials, books I liked growing up by Philip Pullman.

Oh ok. You’re still cool

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Oh dear Henry xDudisx is agreeing with you – time to think about your life choices.

And Charles Kennedy died

i’ve been wanting to ask you this for a long long long time but…are you anne coulter? coz omigharrd i love your books and interviews and pic of you with a shotgun and crapp. can i have an autograph? also your botox administrator does an amazing job. you’re like 65 but look 35. omigharrd im so star struck.

I’m named for Mrs Coulter from His Dark Materials, books I liked growing up by Philip Pullman.

Oh ok. You’re still cool

He picked the name Coulter as his second choice. His first choice was Salmond after his hero. :P

Lordrosicky.5813:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Oh dear Henry xDudisx is agreeing with you – time to think about your life choices.

And Charles Kennedy died

i’ve been wanting to ask you this for a long long long time but…are you anne coulter? coz omigharrd i love your books and interviews and pic of you with a shotgun and crapp. can i have an autograph? also your botox administrator does an amazing job. you’re like 65 but look 35. omigharrd im so star struck.

I’m named for Mrs Coulter from His Dark Materials, books I liked growing up by Philip Pullman.

Oh ok. You’re still cool

He picked the name Coulter as his second choice. His first choice was Salmond after his hero. :P

Henry I will tear your soul apart!!!!!!!!1111one

Ross Biddle.2367:

Supreme.3164:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xillllix.3485:

I was fighting the ultimate annoying combo today: CC engi with slick shoes, daze mesmer with so many skills bursts and clones it’s almost funny (specially when you are moa), and ranger pewpewing from 1500 range. Just makes you want to uninstall the game.

I don’t what happened with class balance, but things are just getting worse and worse. The stability changes made Slick Shoes completely broken, the longbow buff is unjustifiable…

I didn’t want to rant but seriously Anet, why allow Moa in PvP? how can you 1v1 someone that has a 12k + burst when you are stuck moa for 10 seconds? Like compare ele elites for example, they don’t even do anything helpful, but Mesmer has an elite that makes it impossible to fight for 10 seconds? lol we’re light years from eSport there.

Instead of spamming your CC during your spam skill rotations, just wait until the highly animated, long cast timed Moa skill starts to channel and interrupt it.

If you’re ele follow through with a Tornado and spam 3 CC knockback into oblivion for maximum effect ;D

Edit: Oh, and don’t try to 1v3 then come to the forums to complain like it’s the Mesmer classes fault when you lose?

Oh for god sake…mesmers use moa from freaking stealth, just let’s stop this “long animation” BS already, I have no complaints against mesmer…but Moa used from stealth is utterly broken, ridiculous design

wait wait wait, I can do this too /clears throat/

“Oh for god sake… aegis, dodge roll, invuln, aoe knockback, LoS, AoE blinds, etc etc etc”, yeah that was fun.

Unfortunately ross, I agree with supreme, Moa From stealth has no tells and no counterplay.

You just have to be really really lucky to have aegis or dodge luckily. You cannot LOS something you cant see, When a mesmer goes stealth, There is NO tells what he will be casting, It CAN be moa or it CAN be another skill .. so yeah..

Coulter.2315:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Oh dear Henry xDudisx is agreeing with you – time to think about your life choices.

And Charles Kennedy died

i’ve been wanting to ask you this for a long long long time but…are you anne coulter? coz omigharrd i love your books and interviews and pic of you with a shotgun and crapp. can i have an autograph? also your botox administrator does an amazing job. you’re like 65 but look 35. omigharrd im so star struck.

I’m named for Mrs Coulter from His Dark Materials, books I liked growing up by Philip Pullman.

Oh ok. You’re still cool

He picked the name Coulter as his second choice. His first choice was Salmond after his hero. :P

Henry I will tear your soul apart!!!!!!!!1111one

Sorry

Cynz.9437:

Laraley.7695:

Cynz.9437:

NeXeD.3042:

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

- mesmer stealth may be annoying but is actually necessary, they are glass after all
- define lock down? most of them are visible
- 10k spikes happen only on squishies and squishies have ways to do same thing to mesmers, really
- moa is really long CD and is interruptable…..
- mes ports have relative long CD and oncea gain necessary for their viability; they have low HP, not that amazing heals and almost no condi removal
- mes portal is long CD and forces them to drop other survivality spells; how dare mes to have team support O_O
- air/fire sigils are not class mechanics….
- necros/eles do same thing?
- invul is annoying but once again what is the issue? it is not like class is bunkery by all means and they still eat condis while in it

P.S. i don’t even play mesmer….

I would just like to point out some things. Mesmers are glassy, yes but compare their hp pool to eles/thieves. I’m not saying that they have more survability, just the fact their hp pool is a bit higher.

I think the issue with their burst from stealth is the fact they can apply 2 sec immob. You can see the clone going after you and dodge it, but I suppose it requires quite a fast reaction time.

The fact Moa is interruptable doesn’t change anything because you can cast it from stealth. I think that’s one of the most broken things about mesmers, it leaves you with literally no counterplay. However, this has only its full potential in coordinated teams and it can really turn a game around, but same goes for Lich, Rampage…

I would argue that mesmers have bad heal, in the regards of healing skill. It’s pretty good.

I don’t think mesmers are overpowered, however I think ANet is creating a major power creep with the suggested changes, which could bring many issues to the game if the traits will stay as we saw them. Also, I think that if thieves weren’t a thing, mesmers would be dominating the game. The class is not weak at all, it just has issues competing with thieves.

- eles have heals, thieves have more steath and mobility than mes hence why low HP pool
- You can see the clone going after you and dodge it, but I suppose it requires quite a fast reaction time. <<< "yeah that is called l2p O_O
- moa can be blocked, blinded, LoSd etc.; i am pretty sure moa fails more than it actually lands and moa isn’t as nasty as crate for example as you still can dodge and use skill 5 to get away~
- it is not easiest heal to pull off effectively and can be easily interrupted….. not to mention CD on it
- i think talking about how builds will play out once specializations come out is too early, nothing is set and we didn’t even see all specs yet~
- yeah i am sure mesmers would replace thieves but then again if that happend we would see more necros probably because mes get nuked by condis like nobody else and more guards ofc

bottom line, as annyoing mesmers are, i think they are fine in overall picture…. we can’t just have everyone play celery/cele engi/shoutbow and delete every other build~

other zerkers may struggle a bit vs thieves/mes/dps guards but maybe those builds need buffs because frankly even if mes/guards/thieves didn’t exist those zerkers still wouldn’t fair well vs celestial cancer

Zerker ele doesn’t really have that much healing, thief has stealth but what’s your point? Mesmers still have higher hp pool, don’t act like they don’t. Never once I said they shouldn’t .

I also never said that people don’t need to learn to deal with IP better, but I can understand why they get caught up. On the other hand there is a little counter to mesmer burst from stealth, too if you’re a squishy class.

Well, then that’s L2P issue for the mesmer if he cannot make sure his moa will land. It has long cast time, you can always stow it, immob before casting…

And I did say that they’re fine now, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the class was broken after the trait change.

What is this I don’t even…

:o

Ok, I really didn’t want to get involved in the stupidity of this thread, but I’m gonna bite.
Not a single person claiming Mesmers are OP have given anything actually factual about Mesmers. Seriously? Have any of you ever played one? The only legit point without hyperbole’s and straight up lies to be mentioned is that Mesmers Moa from stealth has little counterplay, (that’s if you fail to see the mesmer stealthing or your team doesn’t keep track of it’s opponants glassiest dps dealer).
As for all the GS complaints. Your complaining GS has insane damage. No kitten. GS is a 100% offensive weapon. Every skill on it is about dps with little utility and no defense. A shatter mesmer who just swapped to GS is literally the easiest focus target in the game.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Coulter.2315:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Furious.2867:

Coulter.2315:

Oh dear Henry xDudisx is agreeing with you – time to think about your life choices.

And Charles Kennedy died

i’ve been wanting to ask you this for a long long long time but…are you anne coulter? coz omigharrd i love your books and interviews and pic of you with a shotgun and crapp. can i have an autograph? also your botox administrator does an amazing job. you’re like 65 but look 35. omigharrd im so star struck.

I’m named for Mrs Coulter from His Dark Materials, books I liked growing up by Philip Pullman.

Oh ok. You’re still cool

He picked the name Coulter as his second choice. His first choice was Salmond after his hero. :P

Henry I will tear your soul apart!!!!!!!!1111one

Sorry

hawt +1 for attaching a pic of such a gorgeous young lady

Neptune.2570:

<snip>

As for all the GS complaints. Your complaining GS has insane damage. No kitten. GS is a 100% offensive weapon. Every skill on it is about dps with little utility and no defense. A shatter mesmer who just swapped to GS is literally the easiest focus target in the game.

So much this.

If a mesmer is in GS, beyond dodging F3, F4 and blink/decoy/portal, there is literally NO defence. Only iWave could be used defensively to buy some time, but otherwise once those very few cooldowns are burned it’s gg.

“mesmer has more hp than thief and ele”-
Thief has more armor and ele has heals and protection.

“mesmer is the apex predator of 1v1s”
Except mesmer loses vs thief, ranger (condi especially), dps guard, shoutwarrior (unless perfect plays from the mesmer) and more.

So much smh at this thred o.0

But i like discussions, so keep it up ^^

Quadox.7834:

“mesmer has more hp than thief and ele”-
Thief has more armor and ele has heals and protection.

“mesmer is the apex predator of 1v1s”
Except mesmer loses vs thief, ranger (condi especially), dps guard, shoutwarrior (unless perfect plays from the mesmer) and more.

So much smh at this thred o.0

But i like discussions, so keep it up ^^

People here seriously. I already said I was pointing out mesmer is not the squishiest thing in the game, jeez.

Neptune.2570:

Ok, I really didn’t want to get involved in the stupidity of this thread, but I’m gonna bite.
Not a single person claiming Mesmers are OP have given anything actually factual about Mesmers. Seriously? Have any of you ever played one? The only legit point without hyperbole’s and straight up lies to be mentioned is that Mesmers Moa from stealth has little counterplay, (that’s if you fail to see the mesmer stealthing or your team doesn’t keep track of it’s opponants glassiest dps dealer).
As for all the GS complaints. Your complaining GS has insane damage. No kitten. GS is a 100% offensive weapon. Every skill on it is about dps with little utility and no defense. A shatter mesmer who just swapped to GS is literally the easiest focus target in the game.

Your right, my bad mesmers are definitely just bad. They can’t lockdown from stealth and spike people for 10k. They can’t completely shutdown all transformations. They can’t teleport vertically, they can’t teleport there whole team to a point after they have stealthed to a point, they can’t proc air fire sigils from an insane range or use their gs as a range finder for enemies. They can’t go invincible every 10 seconds. my bad.

Where’s my hyperbole.

Except mesmer loses vs thief, ranger (condi especially), dps guard, shoutwarrior (unless perfect plays from the mesmer) and more.

If we’re really talking about 1v1 then DPS guard (if you know when they are going to use gap closers) burns down fast, and you have so many options when it comes to shattering the ranger (illusion IV is especially hepful).

shoutwarrior? XD

the only one I can agree with is condi ranger, the axe flies everywhere

the whole thread made my day

voteforwinners.9576:

Except mesmer loses vs thief, ranger (condi especially), dps guard, shoutwarrior (unless perfect plays from the mesmer) and more.

If we’re really talking about 1v1 then DPS guard (if you know when they are going to use gap closers) burns down fast, and you have so many options when it comes to shattering the ranger (illusion IV is especially hepful).

shoutwarrior? XD

the only one I can agree with is condi ranger, the axe flies everywhere

the whole thread made my day

He was right. There is no way a good mesmer should engage into any of those matchups 1v1. You are the one making others laugh.

Coulter.2315:

Cynz.9437:

Coulter.2315:

Sagat.3285:

So MotD mesmers are defenseless thief food too?? Not everyone runs meta you know and we have traits changes coming up too.

Thieves will be getting access to the Panic Strike build with all the defensive Shadow Art traits (condi cleanse, 50% reduction, hp tick), don’t get too excited about fighting Thieves after the update.

they are nerfing stolen spells tho by 50%… all of them :/

Actually they are nerfing them by about 1/3 and giving access to a 2nd activation, some are even just being made more efficient (think the ranger one ticks faster so you get the same effect in shorter duration).

depends on spell

nerf to duration on ranger stolen spell is actually bigger because you can get less blasts off → less healing

The mixture of frequent invuln and portal entre is the problem

Laraley.7695:

I don’t think mesmers are overpowered, however I think ANet is creating a major power creep with the suggested changes, which could bring many issues to the game if the traits will stay as we saw them. Also, I think that if thieves weren’t a thing, mesmers would be dominating the game. The class is not weak at all, it just has issues competing with thieves.

I think the important thing to realize is that the changes brought by improvements to the domination/dueling lines and the addition of chronomancy only necessarily raise the burst potential for the mesmer if the mesmer is competent enough to use them properly. Things like continuum shift will only be effective if you use them cleverly, if not, an enemy can destroy the rift and shut you down. Additionally, using alacrity as a mechanism for cooldown management rewards you for shattering more clones at once. When the expac hits it would feel like more of a waste to shatter only 2 or 3 clones instead of 4 (with IP baseline) because you need to shatter higher amounts of clones to maintain that alacrity (and quickness if traited).

So yes the mesmer will be stronger, but it won’t be an easier profession to play by a longshot. As far as thieves go I can see access to slow, and access to blind on shatter, and access to stun from confounding suggestions as ways to help with that matchup to an extent, but I don’t think it will solve the problem completely.

The other things that chronomancy is getting, such as shield and wells look to be purely for WvW/GvG viability. I don’t see the shield supplanting torch or staff in pvp and I don’t think the wells will get taken out of lack of room, but well of calamity and well of gravity could possibly work at the cost of giving up decoy and moa/mass invis, which will help mesmers in teamfights but make them weaker 1v1.