Guild Wars 2

I’m kinda sad but the decision is not in my hands. Just hope you leave perplexity in Pve or my mesmer would be without runes T_T

Guess I have to kill my opponents by myself and don’t let them kill themself – but that’s okay as long as you don’t nerf or whatever comes in your mind the interruption off mesmer.

this made so many necro sad

Wow, unbelieveable…

The power of qq on those forums…and the weakness of Anet, in constantly giving into it!

I have never seen the like in any game ever!

To get something deleted from the game before its even released, well I never…

I could understand removing them after a month if they were too strong but to not even give them a chance…wow.

Wonder what the qq’ers are going to get deleted from the game next?

Meglobob.8620:

Wonder what the qq’ers are going to get deleted from the game next?

Hopefully the next thing that could ruin the game.
The community didn’t want all condition classes to have better condi spread from a single rune set, and you didn’t either. You just don’t know it yet XD.

Phaeton.9582:

Meglobob.8620:

Wonder what the qq’ers are going to get deleted from the game next?

Hopefully the next thing that could ruin the game.
The community didn’t want all condition classes to have better condi spread from a single rune set, and you didn’t either. You just don’t know it yet XD.

According to a lot of people who write on those forums sPvP was ruined along time ago and GW2 is rubbish…as you can see they talk utter rubbish…

I was playing when Mesmers confusion got nerfed, perhaps a year ago now…I wondered why then, why the big fuss about confusion? Whenever I saw the confusion icon flashing up, just did condition removal. Confusion has never give me problems ever…

Of course I learned then the majority of players can’t recognise a confusion symbol on there UI and can’t stop spamming skills, even if its killing them…weird I know! Also, the majority of players are too lazy to switch off auto attack!

Meglobob.8620:

Wow, unbelieveable…

The power of qq on those forums…and the weakness of Anet, in constantly giving into it!

I have never seen the like in any game ever!

To get something deleted from the game before its even released, well I never…

I could understand removing them after a month if they were too strong but to not even give them a chance…wow.

Wonder what the qq’ers are going to get deleted from the game next?

Perplexity rewards bad players, even with these nerfs, everyone knows… do you ?

btw if they fixed the bug of the +confusion duration they will be better than before imo XD (in wvw)

Proud of you Anet. Well done

sminkiottone.6972:

Perplexity rewards bad players, even with these nerfs, everyone knows… do you ?

btw if they fixed the bug of the +confusion duration they will be better than before imo XD (in wvw)

I would not agree. I would say perplexity punishes poor players since it scales with the number of attack a player uses during its duration. It could actually be healthy by teaching players just trying out spvp about how important condi removal is. It requires more skill to use it effectively, such as using it to burst down opponents at opportune moments. If you do not have condi removal against a condi build you will lose the fight (minus burst damage before the condis can all be applied). It doesn’t matter if the condition is confusion or bleeding or whatever. The difference with confusion is that there is a second option to combat it without using condi removal with its own risks and rewards. Because of this confusion is the most interesting condition in the game. Since its 50% nerf confusion has unfortunately been relegated to a supplement condition for mesmers and engis. With perplexity it could have become a main condition on select builds and brought some of the most interesting counter play into the game, however the rage of the community has completely shut out one of the potentially most interesting changes to the stale condition meta of bleed /burning/poison stacking.

An idea for when perplexity might be re-examined for implementation, perhaps put an effect such as -X% duration for bleed/burn/whatever along with +confusion duration to reduce the effectiveness of just spamming every condition under the sun while allowing confusion to become a satisfying condition to use.

Im gonna assume that anet devs arent that ..lets say incompetent, and already planned to not include this runeset in pvp. This was all a scam to make pvp players think they have a say in what goes in and out ?!! Mission accompliced anyway :P

Meglobob.8620:

Phaeton.9582:

Meglobob.8620:

Wonder what the qq’ers are going to get deleted from the game next?

Hopefully the next thing that could ruin the game.
The community didn’t want all condition classes to have better condi spread from a single rune set, and you didn’t either. You just don’t know it yet XD.

According to a lot of people who write on those forums sPvP was ruined along time ago and GW2 is rubbish…as you can see they talk utter rubbish…

I was playing when Mesmers confusion got nerfed, perhaps a year ago now…I wondered why then, why the big fuss about confusion? Whenever I saw the confusion icon flashing up, just did condition removal. Confusion has never give me problems ever…

Of course I learned then the majority of players can’t recognise a confusion symbol on there UI and can’t stop spamming skills, even if its killing them…weird I know! Also, the majority of players are too lazy to switch off auto attack!

I’m sorry for talking rubbish Meglobob.8620, and thanks for clearing up my problem with confusion. Next time I’ll just try to recognise the symbol then do condition removal.

The rune set just reads like i m op and there is no way for you to touch me.
Great decision made by listening to the community!
I like this new route of development

Curunier.4628:

-snip-

I can see you PoV, but very few classes can clean that much condi spam on top of confusion, also condi damage in pvp is not that high like wvw.

I made some tests with these runes on my condi mesmer against almost every build in WvW (Os) and it’s too easy and forgiving imo, it makes a bad player look good, on engi is even worst XD… It’s one of the few rune sets you can really tell you enemy is using after few second of fight.

I’m all about introducing more builds on pvp, but anet must test it before doing anything, and I don’t think they tested it properly… Let us test it on wvw and then we can see if it’s in a good spot or still OP.

Btw I’m not a fun of the “lets implement this and see what happens, if it doesn’t work we remove it in 6 months” kind of things

@Meglobob

Maybe you were figting NPC in the heart of the mist?
Try some more high end pvp – I play a guardian mainly and can’t get enought cleanses to get rid of all the confusion all the time (let’s remember about other condis). If you play mesmer you cann’t get rid of it all easier that all other people who are seeing problem here because mesmers have poor condi removal if I’m correct; as long as confusion will prock on auto attack this will be one of the most hated and unfun conditions to play against.

What would you people think about this: what if confusion would prock only on all utility skills and weapon attacks with double damage but not prock on auto attack?

Well done Mr. Sharp, and anyone else who listened, this is a good decision.

I’m still afraid of what conditions may turn into myself though. 55% burn duration on a single rune set is really scary and in my opinion more of a buff compared to the power rune sets shown alongside Balthazar.

monochrome.9841:

What would you people think about this: what if confusion would prock only on all utility skills and weapon attacks with double damage but not prock on auto attack?

This would make it even more devastating to Eles, who (in the majority of builds) can’t rely on autoattacks for damage and need to be constantly casting 2-5 weapon skills and switching attunements to be effective.

So…looks like Anet have finally found out what makes sPvP players happy…deleting stuff from the game!

Underwater Combat – Deleted.
Capricorn Map – Deleted.
Glory – Deleted.
Crafting Materials – Deleted.
Glory Boosters – Deleted.
Ability to craft skins – Deleted.
Rewards other than rank points – Deleted.
Reward chests – Deleted.

And

A complete Rune set – Deleted before it even made it into the game…

Awesome, at this rate, not going to be much left…

^ And we’ll get nice stuff the 15th. Why keep a horrid system?

JonathanSharp.7094:

Based on your feedback, we’ve decided not to add Runes of Perplexity to PvP in the 4/15 Feature Pack. We’ll be monitoring the balance of runes closely, making more tweaks if necessary, and revisiting the possibility of adding Runes of Perplexity to PvP at a later point.

Of course I can’t fault you for making a good decision, but this rune really should have been more effectively dealt with months ago. I wonder, if WvW players had posted a similar thread, would the issue have gotten as much attention?

Anyway, the double proc of perplexity makes it unique among runes, and I imagine it will continue to even in its revised form (depending on what other rune sets will look like). You did well here – but your trickle-down approach to balance isn’t very inspiring.

Well, way to snuff out that faint hope of making PvP remotely interesting for me when the patch hits.

Confusion sucks balls in PvE, including these.. how do people put it around here.. “hilariously broken set of runes”..? Heavens forbid I might actually be able to make use of it in PvP on my mesmer. On one side I get told that a condition build sucks.. and on the other side the PvP crowd cries so ungodly hard about it that anet actually removes something even before it goes live.

Then again, nothing new I guess. It’s something of a tradition that mesmer get kicked to the balls because the generic PvP player cannot play around their skills. At least this time we’re not getting kitten slapped in our PvE skills to apeace the almighty PvP whine.

AkkiChan.7164:

Well, way to snuff out that faint hope of making PvP remotely interesting for me when the patch hits.

Confusion sucks balls in PvE, including these.. how do people put it around here.. “hilariously broken set of runes”..? Heavens forbid I might actually be able to make use of it in PvP on my mesmer. On one side I get told that a condition build sucks.. and on the other side the PvP crowd cries so ungodly hard about it that anet actually removes something even before it goes live.

Then again, nothing new I guess. It’s something of a tradition that mesmer get kicked to the balls because the generic PvP player cannot play around their skills. At least this time we’re not getting kitten slapped in our PvE skills to apeace the almighty PvP whine.

Mes was not the class that would have benefited from these runes the most… not by a decent margin.

If you don’t believe me, go try them out roaming on mes in WvW. Then try them out on an eng and then a necro (post patch when fear will count as an interrupt).

With how mes has a harder time dealing with conditions… my mes is quite happy that they weren’t added.

JonathanSharp.7094:

Hey guys.

I just wanted to give you guys a quick update. Based on your feedback, we’ve decided not to add Runes of Perplexity to PvP in the 4/15 Feature Pack. We’ll be monitoring the balance of runes closely, making more tweaks if necessary, and revisiting the possibility of adding Runes of Perplexity to PvP at a later point.

Thanks again for comporting yourselves in such a cooperative and constructive manner – you guys had some great points and counterpoints regarding this issue.

yes! the community have spoken ty anet for listening to majority of players.

oZii.2864:

Your first 2 points are pretty much the same thing. Perplexity comes down to one problem it is the best dps rune set for conditions if you have interrupts. It doesn’t take long for the community to figure out what is the best to run they need to blur the lines a little bit more.

Good points over all, but the difference in those two points is one deals with the meta and the other deals with the rune itself. I mean, I think you’re right when you say that powerful rune sets push the current meta a certain direction (there is a very strong correlation there), but I think it’s still worth it to discuss the two different facets in unique context as well!

Good stuff overall. Thanks for the post.

Ty devs for listening to the community and don’t put perplexity runes in spvp as tey are now. As you said you still think adding them in a different form in spvp so here is my version of what a good balanced perplexity rune should be:

(1) +28 Condition Damage
(2) 15% Confusion Duration
(3) +55 Condition Damage
(4) Increase damage by 5% against confused foes
(5) +100 Condition Damage
(6) +15% Confusion duration; increase the damage of your confusion by 10%

I would like to see it this way, so you can’t run this rune with any condition build, if you want to play a confusion rune, you should already have access to alot of confusion to make it worth. Also the 10% damage of confusion would be great without being completly broken and it’s in the same mind of other new traits on the ranger that increase damage on poison, or the increased damage of burning damage on guardian.

Do you guys think it could be good idea?

sminkiottone.6972:

I can see you PoV, but very few classes can clean that much condi spam on top of confusion, also condi damage in pvp is not that high like wvw.

I made some tests with these runes on my condi mesmer against almost every build in WvW (Os) and it’s too easy and forgiving imo, it makes a bad player look good, on engi is even worst XD… It’s one of the few rune sets you can really tell you enemy is using after few second of fight.

I’m all about introducing more builds on pvp, but anet must test it before doing anything, and I don’t think they tested it properly… Let us test it on wvw and then we can see if it’s in a good spot or still OP.

Lets remember that for condi builds their only source of damage is conditions. Not every build should be able to deal with an infinite amount of condis since that would be equivalent to taking no direct damage. It makes sense that once in a while confusion and other conditions will down you if you run out of available cleanses before you were able to kill them. And yeah I would agree that the live version is op in wvw, however the new version has a much higher ICD for both procs, as well as switching to from being on-hit to being-hit. Along with the new traits and the balance changes the meta will shift and we are in for a test-phase with or without the runes of perplexity.

Aberrant.6749:

With how mes has a harder time dealing with conditions… my mes is quite happy that they weren’t added.

Mesmers can deal with conditions extremely well if they spec’d for it. With the ability to lose conditions on heal as well as heal on mantra-cast with mantra of recovery and resolve condis will never stick to a mesmer. This isn’t even including null field or the potentially table turning arcane thievery. Again, all builds should not be able to deal with all conditions all the time. If that was the case condi builds would do no damage. A burst mesmer with no condi removal is equally as susceptible to a burst thief who can 2-shot you to a condi spec who must interrupt you as well as apply a ton of other conditions.

For mes to be reasonable at removing conditions they need to give up a lot… too much loss in other important areas to the point to where it’s not really worth it.

JonathanSharp.7094:

Hey guys.

I just wanted to give you guys a quick update. Based on your feedback, we’ve decided not to add Runes of Perplexity to PvP in the 4/15 Feature Pack. We’ll be monitoring the balance of runes closely, making more tweaks if necessary, and revisiting the possibility of adding Runes of Perplexity to PvP at a later point.

Thanks again for comporting yourselves in such a cooperative and constructive manner – you guys had some great points and counterpoints regarding this issue.

:up: i’m glad anet is listening to players.

Aberrant.6749:

For mes to be reasonable at removing conditions they need to give up a lot… too much loss in other important areas to the point to where it’s not really worth it.

Sure, having the ability to completely ignore conditions better cost a lot, or it would be completely imbalanced. However there are some interesting phantasm/tank builds that take both the 15%damage on phantasms as well as going fully into inspiration. The mesmer does less damage but is now able to take alot of damage through both lots of healing and condi removal. Its a trade-off. If you want to be bursty, or do lots of damage you should be able to take less.

Amazing news , I think it’s really good for all sPvP.

But bb necs btw :P

Curunier.4628:

Aberrant.6749:

For mes to be reasonable at removing conditions they need to give up a lot… too much loss in other important areas to the point to where it’s not really worth it.

Sure, having the ability to completely ignore conditions better cost a lot, or it would be completely imbalanced. However there are some interesting phantasm/tank builds that take both the 15%damage on phantasms as well as going fully into inspiration. The mesmer does less damage but is now able to take alot of damage through both lots of healing and condi removal. Its a trade-off. If you want to be bursty, or do lots of damage you should be able to take less.

He never said “to completely ignore conditions”.

He said “to be reasonable at removing conditions”.

Being reasonable at removing conditions isn’t unbalanced, if anything it would be more balanced if every class had reasonable condition removal.

Jelzouki.4128:

He never said “to completely ignore conditions”.

He said “to be reasonable at removing conditions”.

Being reasonable at removing conditions isn’t unbalanced, if anything it would be more balanced if every class had reasonable condition removal.

You are right, I was being a bit sensationalist because I was pretty annoyed that the devs removed the runes completely without first saying that complete removal was a possible outcome. But again the build I provided has extreme condition removal, and pretty much any condition build coming against that build would not stand a chance. For “ok” condition removal the mesmer still has many options without going so hard into inspiration, its just that many players prefer other utility such as stealth or higher damage output. It is similar with every class, for damage mitigation such as condi removal, you need to sacrifice something. For every class to be ok at condi removal without using traits or utilities would make condition builds much less viable.

Thank you for not putting them in!!! Made my day

Can we open a “Balthazar runes = OP” thread now?

JonathanSharp.7094:

Hey guys.

I just wanted to give you guys a quick update. Based on your feedback, we’ve decided not to add Runes of Perplexity to PvP in the 4/15 Feature Pack. We’ll be monitoring the balance of runes closely, making more tweaks if necessary, and revisiting the possibility of adding Runes of Perplexity to PvP at a later point.

Thanks again for comporting yourselves in such a cooperative and constructive manner – you guys had some great points and counterpoints regarding this issue.

Now do the same to WvW pls, ty <3

JonathanSharp.7094:

Hey guys.

I just wanted to give you guys a quick update. Based on your feedback, we’ve decided not to add Runes of Perplexity to PvP in the 4/15 Feature Pack. We’ll be monitoring the balance of runes closely, making more tweaks if necessary, and revisiting the possibility of adding Runes of Perplexity to PvP at a later point.

Thanks again for comporting yourselves in such a cooperative and constructive manner – you guys had some great points and counterpoints regarding this issue.

Thank you very much!

man, this kinda makes me mad… i had bought and deleted a perplexity set when it first came out, because i wanted it in my necro build, but didn’t realize fear didn’t interrupt, and it was bothersome having to rely on a warhorn as my only interrupt, aside from that one spectral pull. and after the first nerf to perplex, it basically gave me the incentive to admit it was a bad idea, so i went back to Undead runes. but i still kinda wanted to mess around with them, but without spending 50 gold to own the set. i was stoked for perplexity to be in spvp, but then these crying children woke up their daddy, so daddy decided to take my toy away from me!

perplexity isn’t even that great, i don’t see why people complain about them, my warrior and thief in wvw, whenever i encountered such a build and i realize it, most of the time i caught on fast and i would just run away because perplex engies builds couldn’t possibly chase a GS warrior or dagger thief if they decided to run away. maybe in spvp, perplex would become favorable to a certain degree in that kind of build involving interrupts and conditions, but i doubt it would become a meta as bad as Lyssa was.

like seriously, i hardly even fight anyone in spvp that even has or uses confusion, aside from a couple random mesmers i encounter once in a while, most engies i see don’t seem to be using bombs and toolkit, at least no in a hardcore condi build, though this is probably by chance, i admit.

i guess i will wrap this comment up since nothing i say really matters, i want to let you know that i am disappointed that i have to waste 50 gold to experiment with perplexity runes again, i am peeved beyond imagine, because i would have rather messed around with it as a 5 gold unlock in spvp, that would have been nice.

Utomneian.9013:

.

I’m sorry that ANet decided to screw you out of 50 whole gold instead of destroying an entire game mode.

you pvpers are so over dramatic, first of all, if you think the rune is still too powerful, then maybe it should be further nerfed to be in line with the other condition sets, and second of all, it wouldn’t destroy pvp, it’s not like a whole bunch of people would run the set, like maybe for the first couple days you would see a spike of mesmers, engies, and thieves using it, then they would get bored, which is exactly what i was planning to do, mess around with perplex and their vastly over-rated alleged “over-powered” stats, then i would go back to my normal setups. all of these kids act like perplexity was such a cancer, as if anyone even runs them anymore, you’re all like months behind, the runes aren’t that great, and aside from 1 dagger elementalist, i haven’t encountered a single thief, engie, or mesmer (as far as i can tell cuz mes already have confusion) that seemed to be running the set in wvw, so obviously the popularity and hype has died down, and besides, those people probably are rocking min-maxxed 2,000 condi damage, yeah, that would be very deadly, but run this set in pvp, you’re only like 1,250~ more or less, 1,600~ if you’re really hamming and got stack sigils, but it’s not like they are invincible, i’ve ran condi setups on my engie and mesmer all the time, and i get destroyed in like 3/4 games, and the people who are actually good with their characters probably don’t even care about perplexity, though granted, if they did, it would be a nightmare, so okay, like 1% or 2% of the spvp would be ridiculous with those runes.

as for Arenanet, let’s solve this problem once and for all, make the final nerf of all nerfs, i want to see this set in spvp someday, and if you have to cut it down even more, then whatever, here is how i would nerf it, though grudgingly, granted.

(1) 25 condition damage
(2) +5% confusion duration; 35 toughness
(3) 50 condition damage
(4) +10% confusion duration; 25% chance when struck to inflict 2 stacks of confusion for 6 seconds (30 second cooldown)
(5) 100 condition damage
(6) +15% confusion duration; 50% chance on interrupt, inflict 3 stacks of confusion for 6 seconds (20 second cooldown).

there, it broke my heart making the confusion so low, but i want to please the people who are devastated by this alleged “over-powered” set, so i took it down to what i think is more in line with other condition runes… i cried a little on the inside though, just a little :’(