Guild Wars 2

http://strawpoll.me/1609032

I’ll expand a bit and say that a lot of the matchmaking catastrophes we’ve all experienced in the last week wouldn’t have even happened if you guys didn’t give new players such high MMR.

I can’t tell you the amount of times we all (in high rating) saw complete noobs double capping, running in circles, or both. It is inexcusable.

Edit: Adding some points also mentioned in replies for clarity & more discussion material.
Defined wait-time lengths:
Short: < 1 minute
Moderate: 1-5 minutes
Long: 5-10 minutes
As long as I have to: 10+

Proposed improved queuing system:

• Unranked “Everything Goes” Queue This would be what the current Team Queue system is, only unranked.
• Ranked Solo/Duo Queue Yea, sometimes I like to solo, sometimes I like to queue up with a friend. Is that too much to ask for? kitten. This should only be open to people rank 20 AND higher. This is how you filter the news from the experienced. Seems simple right?
• Ranked Team Queue TEAMS ONLY. No roster of any less than 5 people should be allowed to queue up in here. Period. Get it through your head.

From all the soloq and teamq matches I have played after the patch only 2 were with nubs. A good indicator is actually a legendary skin – true beacon of pve grinder. All the other matches were usually the same quality as before the patch: usually a one-sided match with a couple 4×5 and about 30%-40% skyham.

As a new player I was a bit surprised when I was landing matches with people ranked 40-50 and even 80 (based on finishers I see them using). How dose their matching making work?

I know I’m new and therefore not great so I would rather be matched with other people who are new so I can have a chance and not be screwing over veterans. I know better than to double cap but I do run in circles/take the long sometimes because I don’t the maps that well. I’m still learning the tricks, still tying out different classes. I imagine it must be almost as frustrating to be on a team with a newb as it for me to die repeatedly to same person who can down me in 3 seconds.

I will just copy paste my answer from another Threat:

“Why not just introduce Unranked SoloQ and Ranked SoloQ?
The ranked ones are having an impact on your MMR – and I would suggest not letting players in below a certain amount of games in unranked
The unranked ones are free for everyone – they don’t have an impact at all. Here everybody can join and gain experience – and prepare for the Ranked ones.
I think also skilled players would jump into unranked matches from time to time to test new builds e.g.
I would do the same thing for TeamQ as well btw. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a ranked TeamQ where you jump in with your Team and play – and then when they go offline enjoy being paired with strangers with equal skill level to play for fun Unranked games.
I think this would actually already improve a lot. The tweaks to MMR will improve the system even more.”

The MMR Tweaks I’m referring to are planned – but that issue with new players and experience players can be adressed with the split in ranked and unranked the best possible way IMO

BR
Traq

Demented Sheep.1642:

As a new player I was a bit surprised when I was landing matches with people ranked 40-50 and even 80 (based on finishers I see them using). How dose their matching making work?

I know I’m new and therefore not great so I would rather be matched with other people who are new so I can have a chance and not be screwing over veterans. I know better than to double cap but I do run in circles/take the long sometimes because I don’t the maps that well. I’m still learning the tricks, still tying out different classes. I imagine it must be almost as frustrating to be on a team with a newb as it for me to die repeatedly to same person who can down me in 3 seconds.

Just like people mindlessly grinded for legendaries in PvE, there is people in SPvP who turned off their brains and grinded SPvP levels, without gitting gud and staying in the trench bracket, not all of them… but a good portion, especially anyone who did skyhammer cheesing.

Find a class and spec you are good at, read some SPvP guides and figure out what type of role you should be playing, and start playing your best every match and you will eventually get out of the bracket with all the terrible people. It’s easy to know when you are out because you will go 10 games in a row without people calling each other names constantly, or getting tells about how good/bad you are.

If you ever see anyone make a post on here using a screen shot as “evidence” and there is tons of bsing in team/map, and they are getting tells, its only evidence to how bad THEY are.

NA has had much worse matchmaking than EU all year now.

It’s almost like they use a different formula..

But the truth is competitive player numbers makes a huge difference to matchmaking quality..

Phaeton.9582:

NA has had much worse matchmaking than EU all year now.

It’s almost like they use a different formula..

But the truth is competitive player numbers makes a huge difference to matchmaking quality..

In terms of expanding the search outside the MMR range…sure.

This thread is for a big part about giving ppl a super high MMR /leaderboardstanding after 10-20 games played total tho. So you have ppl that have or had super high MMR while having no clue what theyre doing. And that happens everywhere.

Like this DPS guardian that was fighting a banner regen warrior on a fully capped point … untill he gave up after about 3 minutes of fighting.

http://www.gw2score.com/PvP/player/Jaco7256

Max rank 2 on the leaderboard after about 10-20 games played. Yet admits he is new and therefor has nfc what he is doing.

I think a loss starts you on a downward spiral for some reason. The amount of times I’ve gotten to sub 50 rank only to lose 10 straight afterwards is crazy. Good matches are far and few between. Then again, I don’t care nor am I surprised since it is solo queue. I haven’t had a desire to team queue in a year but perhaps I should start if I want good matches more often.

Shranks.3260:

I will just copy paste my answer from another Threat:

“Why not just introduce Unranked SoloQ and Ranked SoloQ?
The ranked ones are having an impact on your MMR – and I would suggest not letting players in below a certain amount of games in unranked
The unranked ones are free for everyone – they don’t have an impact at all. Here everybody can join and gain experience – and prepare for the Ranked ones.
I think also skilled players would jump into unranked matches from time to time to test new builds e.g.
I would do the same thing for TeamQ as well btw. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a ranked TeamQ where you jump in with your Team and play – and then when they go offline enjoy being paired with strangers with equal skill level to play for fun Unranked games.
I think this would actually already improve a lot. The tweaks to MMR will improve the system even more.”

The MMR Tweaks I’m referring to are planned – but that issue with new players and experience players can be adressed with the split in ranked and unranked the best possible way IMO

BR
Traq

I’ve been suggesting something similar to this for a little over a year now. My proposed system would be:

• Unranked “Everything Goes” Queue This would be what the current Team Queue system is, only unranked.
• Ranked Solo/Duo Queue Yea, sometimes I like to solo, sometimes I like to queue up with a friend. Is that too much to ask for? kitten. *This should only be open to people rank 20 AND higher. This is how you filter the news from the experienced. Seems simple right?
• Ranked Team Queue TEAMS ONLY. No roster of any less than 5 people should be allowed to queue up in here. Period. Get it through your head.

Right now, in NA especially, I find that more matches are decided by which team has a really inexperienced player than who plays the best in general.

I’ve been playing more solo queue matches on EU recently and it seems better there, although I’m not sure why that is in particular.

Also, I like your idea of the queue system.

Unranked queue should replace the ‘Play Now’ button. It should have better rewards than hotjoin and really encourage new players to learn the conquest mode as it was intended.

Ranked Solo queue should definitely have a rank limit. 20 is pretty low, I would probably put it at rank 25 or 30.

On a side note, it would be cool if guilds could earn influence and possibly even guild commendations by pvping together in ranked team queue. This would encourage the growth of more pvp guilds/communities.

infantrydiv.1620:

Ranked Solo queue should definitely have a rank limit. 20 is pretty low, I would probably put it at rank 25 or 30.

My original suggestion was rank 30, and I know someone like myself could get to rank 30 within a week, but many casual players take a couple weeks to even get rank 20 so 30 might be too high. 25 definitely sounds feasible.

Acandis.3250:

infantrydiv.1620:

Ranked Solo queue should definitely have a rank limit. 20 is pretty low, I would probably put it at rank 25 or 30.

My original suggestion was rank 30, and I know someone like myself could get to rank 30 within a week, but many casual players take a couple weeks to even get rank 20 so 30 might be too high. 25 definitely sounds feasible.

Yep, and to be honest I think many casual/newbies would actually rather unlock their achievements/titles by playing in an unranked queue. It would be a healthier starting environment. Better for new players, better for vets.

Be cool if they gave us bots. New pvp player must be able to beat a team of bots in a match. Every new PVE character is forced to do a start quest and kill some big monster, why not PVP too.

Remember that longer queues also translate to more people forgetting they queued up, i.e. 4v5s.

Ideally, there could be a required click confirmation from all ten players before the match is created, combined with a longer average search period for matchmaking. Of course, both of those combined could make queues incredibly long (for example, if your match failed the manual confirmation and you had to keep waiting for another player with a very similar MMR to yours).

I just wanted to do this poll. However I find that I can’t. What is considered a moderate or long Q time? 5 Minutes, 10, 30, 60? Not having any idea what we are talking about here, how do you answer that?

This is a bad poll; there is so much ambiguity.

I want to play right now or as quickly as possible, it’s already annoying that once a game becomes available you have to wait for the match to start, then wait again for the gates to open.

If currently it takes me longer than a minute to get a match I just click on hot join instead.

Shinzan.2908:

I want to play right now or as quickly as possible, it’s already annoying that once a game becomes available you have to wait for the match to start, then wait again for the gates to open.

If currently it takes me longer than a minute to get a match I just click on hot join instead.

Changes to matchmaking will be close to unnoticable for people like you who are in the percentages. There are a lot more lower rated than higher rated people so its a lot harder to start a proper match in the top 500.

Since the system prioritizes a short queuetime over a good matchup youll see “top 500 matchups” with 3-4 top 100-200 players and 1 or 2 percentage players. Enormous differences like this create a very toxic atmosphere.

I think most higher rated ppl would prefer to wait a bit longer for a good matchup. Instead of getting close to instant pop and getting matched with ppl who are as good as random hotjoin players.

Look at the ladder/MMR system in wow for example. Higher rated ppl have to wait untill a proper team is found by the system. Only after like 10 minutes the system starts matching you with ppl far from your own MMR. So if your queuetimes are that long you know there is no other team available at that moment at your MMR.

Lukin.4061:

From all the soloq and teamq matches I have played after the patch only 2 were with nubs. A good indicator is actually a legendary skin – true beacon of pve grinder. All the other matches were usually the same quality as before the patch: usually a one-sided match with a couple 4×5 and about 30%-40% skyham.

That’s actually a terrible indicator (legendary skin). I’ve played a decent amount of pvp (over 1000 tourney matches), (flit in and out of being ranked since I like to teach my guildes how to pvp and don’t mind losing to help them learn), have my Champ Phantom title and almost done with Champ Paragon, and I’ve played on teams with people who are ranked in the top 20 in the world (and they said I performed admirably). I also happen to have Twilight. I’m not sure how you have come to the conclusion that because I have a legendary skin I’m all of the sudden a PvE hero…. The only PvE I do is dungeon speed runs, and that is only because it is good gold and only takes a 2 hours for about 14g if you know what you are doing. Almost all of my playtime is spent in PvP or WvW.

So no, having a legendary skin does not mean you are a PvE grinder and know nothing about PvP.

Acandis.3250:

I’ve been suggesting something similar to this for a little over a year now. My proposed system would be:

• Unranked “Everything Goes” Queue This would be what the current Team Queue system is, only unranked.
• Ranked Solo/Duo Queue Yea, sometimes I like to solo, sometimes I like to queue up with a friend. Is that too much to ask for? kitten. *This should only be open to people rank 20 AND higher. This is how you filter the news from the experienced. Seems simple right?
• Ranked Team Queue TEAMS ONLY. No roster of any less than 5 people should be allowed to queue up in here. Period. Get it through your head.

Thissssssss +1 – Also 3 vs 3 -
That might probably make me come back to pvp a bit more actively. Straight after patch iv’e played 2 SoloQ and then i decided to stop for my ulcer to not get worse…
Moreover i used to TeamQ with a friend but most of the times it resulted to be a drama gettin smashed by full premades, so we decided to give up there.
Unranked Arenas would totally suits me.

I’m ranked 348 in solo queue and still regularly have low level players in my games.

AlbertoUlkesh.4517:

I just wanted to do this poll. However I find that I can’t. What is considered a moderate or long Q time? 5 Minutes, 10, 30, 60? Not having any idea what we are talking about here, how do you answer that?

Short: < 1 minute
Moderate: 1-5 minutes
Long: 5-10 minutes
As long as I have to: 10+

The as long as I have to doesn’t have to be extreme. For example, if there are no equally ranked players online then the algorithm should look for players of neighboring MMR to fill in the gap. If players of similar MMR are online but some are in game, the algorithm should wait for some of them to get out in order to match them those who are waiting in queue, instead of just looking for random people to fill in the gaps.

A poor MMR-pairing of players should never, ever, ever come to fruition and become an actual match that will take place in arena queues. Reserve that feature for a “Normal Queue” mode or something that is not intended to be competitive that is separate from custom arenas.

This is the master plan to fix matchmaking:

Phase 1: Separation of the experienced ones from newbies. For the protection of newbies, and for the saved frustration of the experienced players, there must be a filtering strain in place. The solution = Normal Mode queue. This is a matchmaking mode that is non-competitive (no ladder ranking system) but is separate from custom arenas. Make it a requirement for all players (even experienced ones) to initially clock in X amount of matches in Normal Mode before unlocking the option to queue for Solo or Team Arenas.

Phase 2: Strict “Confirm Or GTFO” system. Once a player gets a solo/team arena queue pop, they must confirm attendance before being placed into the match, and then once in the match, they must confirm a second time by pressing the “I Am Ready” button before the final countdown begins. If a player fails to comply with both ready checks, then the match disbands, and all players are put back into the queue (with the failed attendance player being punished with Dishonored debuff). Treat solo/team queue players with respect: If they are queuing competitively, they must understand the importance of attendance, and being strict to experienced players is crucial (and respectful, too). Treat experienced players like how ArenaNet employees in Bellevue, WA are treated. Would an ANet employee be able to get away with slacking performance and poor attendance in the work place?

Phase 3: Equal MMR or no match at all. If a group of players have too much MMR variance, then the match should not take place at all. This is a requirement to achieve a perfect foundation for a growing competitive pvp community. If players are looking for a quickie, they have Custom Arenas or Normal Mode queue options. Serious players require a serious matchmaking system.

Implementing all 3 phases will eliminate the vast majority of current matchmaking issues.

tl;dr ArenaNet, you have the beginning foundation for a great competitive PvP mode…just tighten things up. Pull up the loose ends. Work off the flabs to achieve a nice, cut competitive PvP system.

The scene from Knocked Up, where Allison’s boss cannot legally tell her to lose weight, sums up everything: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvP7cnmxlLM#t=1m

Moleless.1462:

I’m ranked 348 in solo queue and still regularly have low level players in my games.

But were all those low lvl players really bad? I am ranked 294 and got paired up with quite a few low lvl players but most seem to do alright in my matches(not all).

vincecontix.1264:

But were all those low lvl players really bad? I am ranked 294 and got paired up with quite a few low lvl players but most seem to do alright in my matches(not all).

I actually had a chat with one of the very few good new players ive met.

He was good mechanically but really bad with his rotations. The cool thing was that he was humble and nice.

The majority of new players are really bad tho. I cant think of a single guy (besides that guy) in the 0-20 pvprank range that is able to compete at top 100 level. Anet thinks differently about that judging by the guys ive met in some games.

Sigh matchmaking is complete crap.

All day I have been getting ( nwo that we cant see ranks) what I assume are below rank 10 pve’rs with legendaries. I literally spawn camped 2 players all round last match then the match after had 3 people on my team spend 4 minutes trying to kill treb. And I’ve been consistently top 25 solo q.

srsly?

vincecontix.1264:

Moleless.1462:

I’m ranked 348 in solo queue and still regularly have low level players in my games.

But were all those low lvl players really bad?

Most of them. Yes.

Its the weekend aswell which makes it worse even. Ppl deep in the percentages vs ppl in the top 20. Good job Anet!

Locuz.2651:

Phaeton.9582:

NA has had much worse matchmaking than EU all year now.

It’s almost like they use a different formula..

But the truth is competitive player numbers makes a huge difference to matchmaking quality..

In terms of expanding the search outside the MMR range…sure.

This thread is for a big part about giving ppl a super high MMR /leaderboardstanding after 10-20 games played total tho. So you have ppl that have or had super high MMR while having no clue what theyre doing. And that happens everywhere.

Like this DPS guardian that was fighting a banner regen warrior on a fully capped point … untill he gave up after about 3 minutes of fighting.

http://www.gw2score.com/PvP/player/Jaco7256

Max rank 2 on the leaderboard after about 10-20 games played. Yet admits he is new and therefor has nfc what he is doing.

People are less likely to be inflated when matchmaking is more consistent however.

Plus there’s nothing better than killing a banner warrior on deeps guard. Sounds like the guy was rocking it.

Unless the banner warrior is condi. But those don’t exist on EU.

Phaeton.9582:

Plus there’s nothing better than killing a banner warrior on deeps guard. Sounds like the guy was rocking it.

Unless the banner warrior is condi. But those don’t exist on EU.

Whats the point of trying to fight a bunker who is afking on a fully capped point? He was trying to kill that guy for 3 minutes at least…and at the end he walked away lol.

Locuz.2651:

Phaeton.9582:

Plus there’s nothing better than killing a banner warrior on deeps guard. Sounds like the guy was rocking it.

Unless the banner warrior is condi. But those don’t exist on EU.

Whats the point of trying to fight a bunker who is afking on a fully capped point? He was trying to kill that guy for 3 minutes at least…and at the end he walked away lol.

Lol. Better than an indestructible golem I’d say..

Acandis.3250:

snip
I’ve been suggesting something similar to this for a little over a year now. My proposed system would be:

• Unranked “Everything Goes” Queue This would be what the current Team Queue system is, only unranked.
• Ranked Solo/Duo Queue Yea, sometimes I like to solo, sometimes I like to queue up with a friend. Is that too much to ask for? kitten. *This should only be open to people rank 20 AND higher. This is how you filter the news from the experienced. Seems simple right?
• Ranked Team Queue TEAMS ONLY. No roster of any less than 5 people should be allowed to queue up in here. Period. Get it through your head.

+1
Would solve a lot of issues…

And another +1 for Duo Queue!!!

Matchmaking is such a mess.

I have had horrible games today including one where I had a much better team and I knew the other team had no chance so I went AFK at the start to see if my team could win 4v5 and they did – It’s just sad. I knew that they had no chance so that’s why I did this. I hate this, I want proper games and there is no where to go for that at the moment.

jefferson.8317:

I think a loss starts you on a downward spiral for some reason. The amount of times I’ve gotten to sub 50 rank only to lose 10 straight afterwards is crazy. Good matches are far and few between. Then again, I don’t care nor am I surprised since it is solo queue. I haven’t had a desire to team queue in a year but perhaps I should start if I want good matches more often.

I don’t know if it’s my rating (I’m not PvP pro) or I just don’t know how PvP works but I consistently lose matches solo queuing for TA because my team always has someone pushing far point and often they fail after mid gets wiped in a 4v3. Anyone we might kill at mid kills the far decapper on their way back to mid and then the guy on our team who went far complains that the players at mid failed to win a 3v4 all while our guy at home does his job and holds home against no-one.

Other times we will do one home four mid but after winning the mid fight two or three people run off to far like it’s a hot join, or the person on home runs off and lets the enemy decap it. So much decaping, the worst ones are fighting for mid, killing the enemy, seeing everyone else is staying for the cap while home gets hit by two or three so I leave mid to reinforce home then once it’s capped, everyone on mid leaves for far and the enemy decaps it. I’m also seeing a lot of people fighting off point, it’s worst on Temple of the Silent Storm, we will wipe the enemy at mid and then one or two people run off point to the drop down point from their spawn and they quickly get overwhelmed and die, leading to a 4v2 at mid, throwing away our good lead.

I understand pushing far if you can’t win mid, if your party composition is a bad one to hold mid or you are so far behind you need at least two points and a decap to win but so many teams seem to throw games away because they want to run circles around the map capping and can’t defend and hold when they have the advantage.

Am I misunderstanding the strategy people in sPvP are using? It seems to be there is rarely a reason to push three points when you have successfully taken two and can pay attention to home while holding mid.