Guild Wars 2

Hold on ArenaNet, can we please address the issue of 4v5 matches first? All the finer stuff like class makeup and MMR/rank is really nothing compared to how much of a deciding factor disconnects/AFK players are. Surely ArenaNet’s own data reflects this?

Right now the most I can ask for is a proper 5v5 match. I’m fine with losing, because at least I know that both teams had 5 players who were playing the game!

Thank you.

I want to play with-in 5 minutes. Preferably less than that with in 3 would be optimal. If our team is looking for good matches, we already know what teams around our level and we can challenge them to a scrim in a private server.

Sometimes it sucks getting matched up against the same team for hours on end. I would like to have more variety in the match making system. We would just scrim if we wanted to do things the other way.

Edit: I’m assuming this was poll meant for team queue.

I’m guessing the “play style” would breakdown into something along the lines of (cumulative weapon range) + (stat distribution)? I can see why that might be desirable but given that players can change classes before the start of the match, it seems kind of pointless.

I think most everyone would be OK with waiting for a few extra minutes for a better match, but I think the biggest issue people have with it is the perceived lack of integrity in the match making. For instance, too often matches start as 4v5. Fixing that alone would be a huge step forward. There’s also the mismatched ranks; seeing a lvl1 or multiple <10’s on one team, or multiple 50-60’s on one team and <20’s on the other, calls the integrity of the matchup into question. When the integrity of the match up is suspect, that’s when people leave. All of these are conditions that lead to the match ending as a blow out, and that is what I believe most people are thinking of when they say they want a better queue system.

I dont understand why the person with the highest mmr isnt placed on blue while the second highest mmr is placed on red, third on blue, fourth on red ect. No matter the population that will always work and it seems the most fair imo.

Not only will the matches be closer and que times shorter but because teams will be balanced the newer guys will get to play with good players and against good players allowing them to learn properly. Now if you have a low mmr its more than likely you play with low mmr people and against high mmr people.

As long as is take for sure.

Because I find it unacceptable to win three seats in the morning, and if I lose, I lose like 30-40 places, there is a serious problem on the matchmaking, even if a lack of players.

So if you go with a view not to consider it, thank you to do something to counter this.

The Q is already pretty long … I wonder how much longer to get a decent match?

The long queue times are attributed to the low player population and I don’t think things like leaderboards, rewards, or balance can bring a lot of players back. Something new and exciting like other game modes (which I believe is the culprit to the low population) will draw in players both old and new. In any mmo, balance is always an issue, but people will play through the imbalances.

Fixing the 4v5 issues should be a top priority along with new game modes. A lot of players stop queuing or rage quit when they’re 95% guaranteed a loss. This is the most basic part of pvp infrastructure.

kirito.4138:

infantrydiv.1620:

kirito.4138:

infantrydiv.1620:

In addition, I think giving the option to 1 team to resign if they are more than 200 points behind is completely reasonable.

Been in many matches where the game difference was more than 200, and a comeback win was achieved.

Justin ODell.9517:

Better quality can mean what ever you want. E.g. only one or two warriors at most.

If you have an opinion on what a good match should look like, please share it.

Unfortunately, if you are behind by 200 points you will usually lose. A resign option could be implemented where a majority of 4 would have to accept the resign for it to go through.

I rather not encourage the community that mentality to throw in the towel prematurely. Soon it will be “oh, we wiped on our first initial team fight, guess its a loss”. Also rather not have people start voting mid match lowering the team morale.

That’s why I suggest only having a resign option if you are down by more than 200 points (and are going to be at a huge disadvantage for the rest of the match).

I think it is clear that more blowout matches which are aborted early = more time for people to requeue and play good matches, meaning shorter queue times and a better overall experience.

infantrydiv.1620:

kirito.4138:

infantrydiv.1620:

kirito.4138:

infantrydiv.1620:

In addition, I think giving the option to 1 team to resign if they are more than 200 points behind is completely reasonable.

Been in many matches where the game difference was more than 200, and a comeback win was achieved.

Justin ODell.9517:

Better quality can mean what ever you want. E.g. only one or two warriors at most.

If you have an opinion on what a good match should look like, please share it.

Unfortunately, if you are behind by 200 points you will usually lose. A resign option could be implemented where a majority of 4 would have to accept the resign for it to go through.

I rather not encourage the community that mentality to throw in the towel prematurely. Soon it will be “oh, we wiped on our first initial team fight, guess its a loss”. Also rather not have people start voting mid match lowering the team morale.

That’s why I suggest only having a resign option if you are down by more than 200 points (and are going to be at a huge disadvantage for the rest of the match).

I think it is clear that more blowout matches which are aborted early = more time for people to requeue and play good matches, meaning shorter queue times and a better overall experience.

I disagree. Fostering that kind of mentality will just make it less fun in the long run. Soon people will purposely do nothing, waiting to initiate a resign vote after they lose the first team fight and feel discouraged.

The dynamic and thrill of coming back from a deficit is very rewarding. Being down 200 is still winnable especially early in the game. I see it in soloq a fair number of times. Those were the more memorable matches. Ending it early wouldn’t change the quality if the matches. Just more of it.

I rather have it give a bonus reward if you win from a deficit of 200+ than allow premature resignation allowing people to further demoralize the team by starting a vote.

5+ min. But I think better matchmaking can’t solve the 4v5-problem alone, there must be further instruments against this.

I personally think the way Dota2 handles this issue is really good. It happens so often that someone doesn’t accept a match or doesn’t finish loading the map for whatever reason (it happens every now and then that I have to press this button myself, so I don’t blame anyone for doing so), and when I think that this would always result in a 4v5-match it would be absolutly horrible.

In my oppinion, queing in GW2 should/could work like that:

1) Press Queue-button.
2) Match is ready: Accept/Don’t accept (you can’t queue again for ~1min, but nothing else happens), ~15sec time to do that. If you don’t press any button in the given time, you can’t queue for ~2min.
3a) Someone didn’t accept: Everyone except the refusing player is queued again automatically (after being informed that a player wasn’t ready)
3b) Everyone accepted: The map is loaded instantly and everyone is in spectator mode (not able to chose a side), seeing the list of players with classes. Now it’s time for strategy and rerolling classes. A Ready-button is available. There should be info like ‘Loading map’, ‘Ready’, and ‘Rerolling class’. It would be incredible awesome if one could swap the character directly from this menu without returning to the character-screen and doing a detour over the mists (or any other map where the character currently is), but this is more a detail. The whole thing can take up to ~2min, if everyone pressed the ready-button, the match is started earlier. Make sure that nothing else except waiting and rerolling the class can be done in meantime so that noone has to wait the full 2min because of the one guy that wants to finish his hotjoin-round.

This whole thing would increase the time needed until a match is ready by about ~1-2min. But it would allow you to punish players for leaving or afk’ing even harder because they explicitly stated that they’re ready for the match about 2min before it started (and not about ~3-10min like it is the case now). It has also the nice sideeffect that situations where you have 3 bunkers because all of them showed up in the last few seconds aren’t possible anymore.

I don’t mind waiting 5-10 minutes for a balanced match. The main reason I don’t play soloq often is cause I am getting people who don’t know what to do. But please make it so that the timer is set- like 10 minutes. Cause staring at timer all the time to not miss it will be, again, something unbearable.

I’d rather wait for a balanced team in terms of rank and composition than face 3 Hambow Warriors and 2 Spirit Rangers.

Crappy match-ups make a frustrating game even worse.

It’s nice to see a dev finally taking opinions from the players instead of adding random stuff that doesn’t work. gj justin

Wannse see: Minus minions, pets, clones and perma stealth. It´s a pvp-game, not a an ai-game.

it should be no question – good matchmaking should be standart at lowest que times possible

i dont wanna wait to can play – simple
and i dont play when i have to fight rank 1-100 with a monkey team – simple

atm i farm champion titles and when i lose 4x in a row than this is 1 hour playtime when i have to wait 10-15 min before i can play per match i waste 2 hours for NOTHING

no – i dont wanna wait

edit: and overpopulatet classes/builds should be a question for balancing team and not for a filter to make everyone wait

i prefer waiting 30min than matched up with mismatch groups (based on rating, but im not sure whether someting like rating is existing)

Romek.4201:

it should be no question – good matchmaking should be standart at lowest que times possible

i dont wanna wait to can play – simple
and i dont play when i have to fight rank 1-100 with a monkey team – simple

atm i farm champion titles and when i lose 4x in a row than this is 1 hour playtime when i have to wait 10-15 min before i can play per match i waste 2 hours for NOTHING

no – i dont wanna wait

edit: and overpopulatet classes/builds should be a question for balancing team and not for a filter to make everyone wait

+1

i voted for 0-5 min as a personal rule of thumb i shouldn’t be able to fit a match in in the time im waiting in que id rather just play and then hope i get a better match next map.

obviously there are still issues with for example joining towards the end of a match where you cant actually impact play before it ends, perhaps consider implementing a lockout so players cant join if there is very little time left in regards to auto balancing, however that has implications in regard to things like boosters, if you pay for a glory booster and spend 30 min in que its not ideal,

ive had unbalanced matches where ive built up a solid lead and then been moved to the other team, and had to fight against my own effort to get a victory. while its fun, i wouldn’t say no to a title track or something to mark the added effort that takes.

Two comments:

1) What defines a good match is that both sides have a reasonable chance of winning

2) In terms of balancing team composition, I think the focus should be less on class and more on amulet choice i.e. no more than 2 of the same amulet type per team. Multiples of a class can be fine if they are unique builds, and amulet is probably one of the easiest to identify build defining choices.

First of all: “Fix the leaderboards”, thanks!

Everyone wants shorter queue times. That’s a given, but if you have to sacrifice quality matches then there’s no point in it. Like I (and many players) have said, the issue is the population. The more people that pvp, the shorter the queue times and there wouldn’t be a need to place a low MMR player into a match with high MMR players just to get a match started.

I voted 0-5 minutes. I’m willing to wait, but 5 minutes is already a pretty long time to wait. I’ve never played a game other than WoW where >5 minutes was normal.

yes, I play for good matches and I would prefer a good match where the fights win the game instead of the game coming down to who has the best map control

As long as it takes.

It feels like 5v5 hotjoin otherwise. So just hotjoin or WvW while you wait. Its no fun losing or even winning a Solo Q game that feels like a hotjoin.

Id like the better quality when picking a team to do like you said “2 warriors at most”. I wouldn’t mind if a solo team for some reason decided to have someone switch to a 3rd warrior. I just hate seeing 4 guardians on my team and it already being GG.

Dominus.2360:

5+ min. But I think better matchmaking can’t solve the 4v5-problem alone, there must be further instruments against this.

I personally think the way Dota2 handles this issue is really good. It happens so often that someone doesn’t accept a match or doesn’t finish loading the map for whatever reason (it happens every now and then that I have to press this button myself, so I don’t blame anyone for doing so), and when I think that this would always result in a 4v5-match it would be absolutly horrible.

In my oppinion, queing in GW2 should/could work like that:

1) Press Queue-button.
2) Match is ready: Accept/Don’t accept (you can’t queue again for ~1min, but nothing else happens), ~15sec time to do that. If you don’t press any button in the given time, you can’t queue for ~2min.
3a) Someone didn’t accept: Everyone except the refusing player is queued again automatically (after being informed that a player wasn’t ready)
3b) Everyone accepted: The map is loaded instantly and everyone is in spectator mode (not able to chose a side), seeing the list of players with classes. Now it’s time for strategy and rerolling classes. A Ready-button is available. There should be info like ‘Loading map’, ‘Ready’, and ‘Rerolling class’. It would be incredible awesome if one could swap the character directly from this menu without returning to the character-screen and doing a detour over the mists (or any other map where the character currently is), but this is more a detail. The whole thing can take up to ~2min, if everyone pressed the ready-button, the match is started earlier. Make sure that nothing else except waiting and rerolling the class can be done in meantime so that noone has to wait the full 2min because of the one guy that wants to finish his hotjoin-round.

This whole thing would increase the time needed until a match is ready by about ~1-2min. But it would allow you to punish players for leaving or afk’ing even harder because they explicitly stated that they’re ready for the match about 2min before it started (and not about ~3-10min like it is the case now). It has also the nice sideeffect that situations where you have 3 bunkers because all of them showed up in the last few seconds aren’t possible anymore.

Awesome ideas there especially the info status of other players like Loading Map, Ready, Offline, etc other than the current green check that’s available.

As long as it takes…. 10, 20, 30….

For solo queue It should be totally random…. Anet is always telling that rank doesn’t mean anything when we all know this is not true, if it doesn’t mean anything the matches should be totally random !!! You can have a great player on your team but also a super noob, it doesn’t matter because the opposing team is in the same situation… If I want to play organized as a team I can go to team queue, wich also should be random according to Anet… Otherwise it should be separated by rank tiers, 0-10, 10-20, 20-30, 30-40 etc… Other than that are just excuses… Make rank to be valid or make it random

hooma.9642:

Justin ODell.9517:

…grouping people by rank or play style, etc…
…..

how do u identify play style?

using metrics like what percentage of a player’s points come from capping vs from kills vs from each map’s special mechanic. the percentage of playtime spent within x distance of capture point, things like that.

it could allow them to avoid teams made of 5 bunkers, or teams where everyone just wants to gank and no one tries to cap.

Justin ODell.9517:

Hi guys, I thought I’d try this out as an unofficial poll.

http://strawpoll.me/659515

You could do a quick survey at the end of each match to gauge satisfaction on the matchup…

Might allow you to better estimate matchup quality vs wait time

Justin ODell.9517:

For more context, I’m interested in improving matches beyond just finding players near your MMR. This includes doing things like preferring a better spread of professions and builds, matching people with dishonor with other people with dishonor, grouping people by rank or play style, etc…

These things can sound like a good idea, but can also cause you to wait in the queue longer.

Please keep in mind that players can reroll to another profession/build to adapt to their team or the opponents team. Also keep in mind, that the fact that i enter the queue as elementalist, does not mean that i will play as an elementalist… Maybe i’m just farming orichalcum in orr while waiting (5-10 min) for the matchup!

No 2 thieves 1 ele 1 guardian 1 enigneer vs 3 mesmer 2 necro(free win for the team with mesmer and necro). I would wait longer to have it more balanced. 1 less thief on first team. And max 3 out of necro/mesmer – no more than 2 of the same class. Instead of 3 mesmer 2 necro then 1 mesmer 2 necro or 2 mesmer 1 necro max.

For solo queue, assuming the new matchmaking is working properly (haven’t been able to play yet to see), I don’t think much waiting is needed. Maximum of 5 minutes I’d say, after that just throw together whatever 10 players you can get and split them up as fairly as you can.

For team queue, I don’t mind a bit of a wait since I’d rather have a competitive match against another highly rated team rather than discourage a brand new or lower rated team by playing against them. I’d say a good 10 minute wait is fine before you start getting desperate with the matchmaking.

Oh, and class mix doesn’t matter, really. I’ve been on effective solo queue teams with 3 Guardians, 2 Necros, 4 Engineers, etc.

cymerdown.4103:

Oh, and class mix doesn’t matter, really. I’ve been on effective solo queue teams with 3 Guardians, 2 Necros, 4 Engineers, etc.

It does. But only for certain classes and combinations. How often did you win with 3 thieves against a 3 bunker warrior, 2 necro(or mixed with some guardians) team? Of course you can win with 3 guardians, 2 necros or 4 engineers. These are more of the stronger classes.

But you will have trouble if the enemy has more of these and you have more than 1 thief instead. Cause they are imo not that effective and they are “doing nothing” if there is so much bunker stuff that even can damage. High health necro + their fear. Or the bunker guardians and stuff.

There should be some team classes value calculated by classes. Classes you don’t want to have too many should be 1. Other classes 2. Classes where it is good to have 3 or more should have value 3. Then add this up. Give some special values into the calculation like only bunker guardian = weak(you still would need some damage) and let it balance with this. Or at least avoid more than 2 of each classes. Thieves/ ele maybe max 1.

This is imo the biggest problem atm. That other change they just made to matchmaking… I did not notice a big difference(maybe this was only important for the top 100 with those queu sychning and stuff at 70-85 percent I did not notice problems before and not much change now).

Unbalanced teams because of classes – this is a problem. Last 2 matches I played against 3 necro on enemy team and we lost. But I have to stay we were pretty strong. 2nd match it was close 450 vs. 500.. if they did not have 3 necros we probably would have won 500 vs. 350 or 400.

It’s worth waiting 5 minutes if rewards are also increased. Tournaments should really give more points since there is a lot of waiting you cannot avoid.

Also match should not start until everyone ready.

An easy ToDo-List:

1. Make a split between ranked/normal games. Ranked will have very precise matchmaking with possible longer waiting times, normal is just for fun. This also prevents the current solo queue from turning into a flame war as people want to move up in ranks.

2. Introduce new shortcuts that allow solo queue teams to communicate with each other, similar to LoL, stuff like “I´m on the way to this checkpoint” “Help (me) over there” etc

3. Make the solo-queue into a solo/duo- queue and change the normal queue into a premade-team only one, also introduce ranked and normal there.

4. Give us divisions and PvP seasons

5. GW2 PvP == eSport

6. Sucess

;)

Acaro.4067:

An easy ToDo-List:

1. Make a split between ranked/normal games. Ranked will have very precise matchmaking with possible longer waiting times, normal is just for fun. This also prevents the current solo queue from turning into a flame war as people want to move up in ranks.

2. Introduce new shortcuts that allow solo queue teams to communicate with each other, similar to LoL, stuff like “I´m on the way to this checkpoint” “Help (me) over there” etc

3. Make the solo-queue into a solo/duo- queue and change the normal queue into a premade-team only one, also introduce ranked and normal there.

4. Give us divisions and PvP seasons

5. GW2 PvP == eSport

6. Sucess

;)

What makes this easy to do?

Solo queue pops take forever right now. I wait 7-10 minutes for a match and then it’s with/against the same people over and over. No one seems to be playing.

I very much hope this will change with the announcement of the reward system overhaul next week. Waiting 10 mins for a 15 minute match is way too long for me.

I’d appreciate waiting for a better match, but I sure as hell don’t appreciate waiting for a better match only to get Skyhammer and Spirit Watch. They are god-awful maps, and since the sPvP team still wants to justify that there still is nothing wrong with those maps, they need some real soul-searching.