Guild Wars 2

It’s a good idea… but I think that Anet thinks mass rallies due to one death are ‘cool’

I think it’s a good idea, but honestly it’s a non-issue in PvP. Even if it only rallied one, whichever team controlled downed state when there were people on both teams down would win.

In WvW I’m sure it would be a good change.

Nah what’d be REALLY cool is if the person who gets the killing blow got a “Rally” buff and it allowed them to tag-instant rally a friendly member, so then people could clobber the rally-guy to prevent him from rallying his friend. Talk about fun/interesting playing THEN!

Oh and the “Rally buff” needs to have a really REALLY obvious animation/look

This is a bad idea, which gives a huge favor to defensive setups.
And as mentioned before, this is not an issue.
Also imagine the situation, when 2 guys are downed from one team and 1 from another. U proposed:
“- The priority for who is rallied could be decided as whoever has been in downed state longest is rallied first.
- Since the downed player no longer needs to damage the opponent to be rallied, there needs to be a range in order to be rallied(earshot)”
This will force 1st team to go to res 2nd downed guy and to save stomp one downed guy, which is quite complicated. Sometimes also happens, that 2 guys are downed at the same time.
Yet, in atm tPvP downed state phase is most fun thing left(if its not the only one fun thing left in tPvP), so please dont ruin it.

Justin ODell.9517:

I really like this idea! Just sent an email to the team about it.

: |

This change would actually make a much MUCH bigger difference in WvW than in tPvP. Not entirely sure what to think of it, but suffice to say it is very interesting.

Just limit the number of rallies per player to one per defeat.
Nobody likes to see the same person rally five times, it’s just frustrating. Once chance should be enough, if he continues to play badly he should be punished.
It would also improve the quality of life for spectators.

Edit:
I know this does not adress the problem you raise, but as someone else just mentioned it’s a bit more complicated to fix. I do agree however, that five people rallying on the same person does not make any sense.

Just entirely remove rally on opponent’s death in sPvP, or restore some health (percentage of missing hp to avoid instant rallies) to a downed ally when an opponent is killed.

Angriff.1935:

I’ve felt for a long time that team fights in sPvP have been far too volatile. Things happen too quickly and momentum shifts are extremely common.

I think that one of the biggest culprits in this has always been the rally mechanic. More specifically that who ever has damaged an opponent that is finished, is rallied. This causes team fights that might be evenly matched suddenly swing in favor of one team because one of the teams happened to finish someone first.

My proposal is this:

1 finished enemy = 1 friendly rally

- The priority for who is rallied could be decided as whoever has been in downed state longest is rallied first.

- Since the downed player no longer needs to damage the opponent to be rallied, there needs to be a range in order to be rallied(earshot)

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This will make team fights much less volatile, but will leave small fights (1v1, 2v2) relatively unchanged. It also makes team fights a little less confusing, because opposing players will no longer rally seemingly out of nowhere because someone across the map was finished.

The way it works right now its as if you knock half the enemy team out but they catch one of your balls, they just got their whole team back. Which would be a really stupid game of dodgeball.

I never realized how broken this mechanic was until now…wow.

Justin ODell.9517:

Hey, what can I say? I’m not a designer. ;P

Sorry — I don’t have a problem with your authority in the matter, I actually really appreciate your concern! Thank you!

Only something tells me this isn’t exactly a new idea, and I’d be surprised if the devs missed that.

Justin ODell.9517:

I really like this idea! Just sent an email to the team about it.

If u want the game better remove downstate its stupid and frustrating kill someone twice or more times who is already dead and remove all ress abilities atleast in pvp

what will happen if 2 guys are down by the same skill (AOE?)? Who will rally first?

Richy Lao.8346:

what will happen if 2 guys are down by the same skill (AOE?)? Who will rally first?

Whoever most deserves/earns it.

The actual system of rally is awful in WvW. A lots of change could be welcome… the best change would be to suppress the down state. But as this is never gonna happen, a one finish=one rally, combined with the need to the rallied to be close to the finish would definitely be a good start.
Oh and btw please, please, please, no more “rally because I killed a mob” in wvw. It is really irrelevant. I’m talking about moas, wolves, etc…

This must definitely happen. There is allrdy too much randomness in this game. Especially balanced teamfights are heavily based on luck!

Bad idea for ele thief mesmer, kind of nerf against them. And don’t forget, that rally unique game mechanic. All classes have trait which increase damage while downed, for the reason, to get rally.

Malik.6781:

Bad idea for ele thief mesmer, kind of nerf against them. And don’t forget, that rally unique game mechanic. All classes have trait which increase damage while downed, for the reason, to get rally.

Downstate mechanics are also a big issue. Especially vapor form. It allows a perfect rezz, while other downstate mechanics doesn’t allow it. Traits that affect ds-mechanics are never used in PvP anyways, as they are terrible and the goal of PvP is not to fight in DS but alife.

As A-Net wants to go E-Sports (what an absurd idea if you look at the ressources they put into PvP) they need to reduce random/passive factors such as DS to a minimum anyway.

• Reduce the range that a person can rally off someone. So you can’t rally half way the across the map.

• Put a hit timer. So you need to at least hit the person once every 20s to receive a rally.

This would make warrior banner and other team revive abilities worth a lot more.

!http://www.indianfunpic.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Give-That-man-a-Medal.jpg!

(Seems like image previews are disabled…)

The power of rally and downed state in general should be reduced. This suggestion seems allright.

The Downed State should just be removed from PvP, along with Rally. They are both bad concepts for PvP.

In PvP people should just die and the Rez Time should be adjusted to what it is now for a Downed player.

Anything other than this is a bad ideia, sorry.

@up
Downed state is here to counter one-shot burst builds, and does its job quite well. You can spec yourself in managing it to help teammates, or stomp enemies – maybe even both. Having a dedicated “stomper” or a “medic” in your team gives you huge advantage.

I’ve come to like downed state, it adds depth to what very little we have.

I do think it requires some fine tuning though.

I would do very questionable things to make this happen in WvW.

I want to point out that it is currently limited to five. Makes no difference to tpvp but it does to wvw.

no no no, your all wrong. Players should be able to rally off of pets, minions, turrents, clones, and adds in general…. JK. I thnk the rally buff for a kill is an interesting concept though, perhaps with a 10 or 15 sec use window.

Jae.9682:

I want to point out that it is currently limited to five. Makes no difference to tpvp but it does to wvw.

If it is intended like this it is not wai.
It’s not unusual for us to witness one of us being finished and making 8-10 opponents rally.

The reason I suggested this in sPvP only is because it would be a much simpler fix and wouldn’t cause too many problems due to there only being two(opposing) teams.

In WvW you have multiple alliances so rally priority gets kinda squirly. It would be really annoying to kill someone in WvW and stomp them only to find out some idiot who ran in and got downed first got rallied instead of one of your allies. So maybe just add a range to rallying in WvW.

In PvE it’s not a huge problem.

As for the rally buff idea. It sounds interesting, but I think it adds a minor amount of complication to something that I don’t think should be complicated.

Just thinking about Hotjoin I can see all the frustration people would encounter because their teammates wont rally each other.

I think this is a good proposition for PvP only. However I always thought that the downed state in itself was too annoying. I feel it’s a little bit unfair when, for example, Elementalists just have an ability to move around when Thiefs or Mesmers can go invisible. Or how Guardians can insta-AoE knockback everyone and Necroes have to cast a 1-2 sec fear (which 50% of the time is resisted or doesn’t land before finish-off). Engineers don’t have anything really fancy either. Just seems that it’s all not so well balanced.

To be honest I really like the idea of the downed state, but I think there should only be two abilities (1 – throw rock or whatever and 2 – heal while calling for help). But heh maybe just my opinion.

Range limiting the rally mechanic would be good, but I would be opposed to the 1:1 kill:rally change.

The combat system of this game already makes it very difficult to win out numbered fights (i.e. a 3v4 on a mid node). One of the things that makes it slightly more manageable to pull off a win in those scenarios is the multi-rally.

Getting a rally from all the way across the map, however is total crapola and has nothing to do with skilled play. That should go.

Dagins.5163:

@up
Downed state is here to counter one-shot burst builds, and does its job quite well. You can spec yourself in managing it to help teammates, or stomp enemies – maybe even both. Having a dedicated “stomper” or a “medic” in your team gives you huge advantage.

Downed state isnt doing anything here, its just an annoyance players have to deal with to enjoy sPvP. I guess you would have to play without the Downed State to realize that.

I gave the solution in my previous post and if ANet insists on the concept then its the games loss and something i will have to continue dealing with.

Allie Murdock.8152:

This is definitely an interesting idea. I’m not 100% convinced it’d be good for all maps, but maybe it hints at a new game mode?

I want to add that ideas like this are what we’re looking for. Things that might sound crazy to some, or are outside of the box, are the ones that tend to spark ideas on our end. Of course, we definitely appreciate all kinds of feedback, but it’s great to see new suggestions like this.

Thanks for sharing!

This idea doesn’t sound crazy at all. Would be an interesting dynamic to try for sure.

It would mean revising the downed state abilities of some classes in wvw altleast

I can see a ranger,necro and elementalist melting away in the future, if not promote one profession to be the designated rallybot even more..

Cq. reroll warrior for downed ability.

what’s the purpose of a ranger’s elite skill if this was implented, might as well delete that skill altogether. we put effort to rush to our team to rez them with our elite spirit.

implementing this will be a huge nerf for rangers.

Uh, from what I understand here utility/elite resses are untouched (still rally up to 5 people). If anything this is a buff to those utilities and elites because they are now more necessary.

The crazy Idea I had was to make it so only STOMPS give a rally. So DPSing someone out only gets rid of them and does not grant a rally at all.

This would make stomping much more important and would add more gravity to the decisions of stomping vs DPSing. It might also reduce AoE spam on downed opponents(as you might want to rally a team mate)

This would even out the temperament of group fights even further by rewarding smart and coordinated play and discouraging spam.

Draygo.9473:

Uh, from what I understand here utility/elite resses are untouched (still rally up to 5 people). If anything this is a buff to those utilities and elites because they are now more necessary.

i got you. i’m sorry i just got confused a bit.

yeah! this is a great idea. if ill be able to resurrect 3 players from my team i get to kill the same # of downed players from the other team too. this is fantastic.

IMPLEMENT THIS!

I really don’t like the concept of this idea. It detracts from teamwork and would discourage players from trying to survive as long as possible (ie ‘if I go down before my teammate, I get to rally and he dies’).

small suggestion: the person who was downed last will rally first. adds some small amount of counterplay for attacking team if they can take out a high-priority target, then “cover” that rally with another kill. it is also slightly easier to understand this way I think, since the spectator focus naturally shifts to the newer downed player. i suggested something similar before but it was a bit more complicated.

Wait, I just caught on. So…. Players go in, people die, and have to be rallied to continue playing. Nice, pvp dodge ball.

Oh god please yes!

This was suggested countless times prior….no idea why this time it was recognized.

Maybe because the post was shorter than…say this one: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Reasonable-changes-to-downed-state/first#post2864247

Anyway, anything that limits the impact of downed-state is a welcome change in my book.

Dee Jay.2460:

Anyway, anything that limits the impact of downed-state is a welcome change in my book.

Naw, man. Downed state is probably the most impactful, creative, team oriented element of design in this game. It is FAR from perfect, but is absolutely necessary in a game the features one-shot kills (or very nearly one-shot) and stun locks that can 100-0 you.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Dee Jay.2460:

Anyway, anything that limits the impact of downed-state is a welcome change in my book.

Naw, man. Downed state is probably the most impactful, creative, team oriented element of design in this game. It is FAR from perfect, but is absolutely necessary in a game the features one-shot kills (or very nearly one-shot) and stun locks that can 100-0 you.

I disagree, the interesting part of combat is over as soon as one person is downed. Then it’s just the same old dance over and over again (depending on which class). Stomping every Thief is the same, stomping every Mesmer is the same and so it is with every other class as well.

And additionally, downed-state is a huge snowballing mechanic.

You’re fighting 2v1? Here, have a mechanic that makes it virtually impossible for you to fail.

Your zerg is larger than the enemy’s? Here, have an additional crutch by being able to revive even faster and easier than your enemy.

Downed-state is terrible in every PvP situation.

Dee Jay.2460:

Oh god please yes!

This was suggested countless times prior….no idea why this time it was recognized.

Maybe because the post was shorter than…say this one: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Reasonable-changes-to-downed-state/first#post2864247

Anyway, anything that limits the impact of downed-state is a welcome change in my book.

Ooh ooh I know!!!!

Because it had the word ‘reasonable’ in the thread title!

Hilarious that I made basically the same post!

I’ve been a proponent of slowing combat down and making it more about support and coordination for a long time. I’m not sure why I waited till now to post this