Guild Wars 2

Holy Anet the Rangers actually got something nice. Better sound the alarm.
Can’t have that.

mmmm bring a necro?

Ragnarox.9601:

So 100% quickness uptime and awesome dmg is not OP right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDRfYhQZ-dA

cmon, be realistic!

Couple things about that video. First, that build would get stomped by any decent opponent. Second, Boon Corruption is a thing. Third, Boon Stripping is a thing. Fourth, Boon Stealing is a thing. Fifth, any opponent that tosses conditions its way will destroy it.

Mcrocha.3891:

In exhcange for two condi removal every 20 seconds you can have 6-7s quickness just by swapping pets right before WHaO is cast. You can have 12-13s quickness by popping WHaO shortly after QZ is cast(say you just got bursted and need to stunbreak/heal). That’s totalling ~20s [..]

- Where the 20 sec Cd comes from ? ZS is on a 15 sec CD.
- 6 or 7 ?
- 12 or 13 ?
- 7 + 7 = 13 ?
- 20 sec ?

Mcrocha.3891:

No, again lets say you NEED to heal so you cast WHaO, a 1s cast, 3/4 of the way through the cast, you swap pets=8s Quickness. You’re not casting heal immediately after swapping pets, you are using heal normally when you need to, but also deciding to swap pets then in order to get 8s Quickness. This is broken in itself because this could potentially have 50% uptime.

Now you don’t have to heal every time after you use QZ, but if you do and then decide to combo it with pet swap as discussed above then you will get 20s Quickness. Essentially you will have almost 50% uptime on Quickness for the cd of QZ. If you do not decide to pop heal, then your Quickness uptime is still ridiculous because of the 6s you get from QZ.

You mixed differents CD (traited an untraited) and differents based duration with and without Lingering Magic.

Jeez dude, it’s not that hard to be accurate.

Mcrocha.3891:

The reason why it is op is because it takes zero investment.

- You absolutly need 3 traits lines WS, NM and BM (that is not the meta like you said), 4 Traits, WEAO and QZ to achieve this. It’s far from zero investment for an hard rotation in a real fight and that is mostly, like others said, very dangerous. On the top of that you need to be a good ranger who can keep his pets alive.

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

T raw.4658:

There is no defending this amount of quickness.

Stop. Its broken.

I applaud effort but the devs who allowed this to go through need to be fired.

Care to elaborate on that or is this just another, ”I don’t know what killed me and I am too lazy to try to figure it out and see if I can counter it, so I’m just going to qq for nerfs” posts?

The reason why it is op is because it takes zero investment. Take the meta power survival build for instance which could now take zephyrs speed over beastly warden after it was nerfed. So the only “sacrifice” you have to make in your build is taking WHaO over TU. In exhcange for two condi removal every 20 seconds you can have 6-7s quickness just by swapping pets right before WHaO is cast. You can have 12-13s quickness by popping WHaO shortly after QZ is cast(say you just got bursted and need to stunbreak/heal). That’s totalling ~20s of quickness on a Marauder build just bc the Ranger was playing normally. Plus that’s only considering the boons you apply and not the other ones that would be on your pet from allies or traits etc.

That’s not good for balance and just adds to power creep, in the future people can say “oh look at Ranger they can have 20s quickness why can’t we have xxx.”

No investment… You just said they have to
-drop a condi removal
-drop their taunt (which up until yesterday was the providing the most qq about rangers)
-blow a stun break and condi removal
-blow a heal
-swap pets on cooldown rather than properly managing them and saving the swap for when they are in danger

Not to mention this is in PvP where everyone is running as much boonstripping as possible to deal with guardian’s and ele’s (who have easily been stacking boons without putting themselves in so much danger since forever).

How exactly is that OP again?

There is only 1 thing you have to invest in, which I said in my post was WHaO:
-I said that it is an exchange of only 2 condi cleanse every 20 seconds. In exchange for the potential of 20s quickness, pretty fair trade.
-It is questionable to slot taunt now when it is no longer broken and can be blocked/evaded. Zephyrs Speed offers more utility both with WHaO and general might stacking as well as for something like ressing or stomping.
-you misunderstand the gameplay, you don’t “blow” your skills, you use them normally as you would in any situation previously except now you can just have the potential for 20s quickness.
-you don’t swap the pets on cooldown, you swap them once again when you need to do so

And if you are playing normally you aren’t immediately healing after every pet swap and every time you use QZ, which means your point is moot.

No, again lets say you NEED to heal so you cast WHaO, a 1s cast, 3/4 of the way through the cast, you swap pets=8s Quickness. You’re not casting heal immediately after swapping pets, you are using heal normally when you need to, but also deciding to swap pets then in order to get 8s Quickness. This is broken in itself because this could potentially have 50% uptime.

Now you don’t have to heal every time after you use QZ, but if you do and then decide to combo it with pet swap as discussed above then you will get 20s Quickness. Essentially you will have almost 50% uptime on Quickness for the cd of QZ. If you do not decide to pop heal, then your Quickness uptime is still ridiculous because of the 6s you get from QZ.

So now you are back to arguing that you will occasionally blow cooldowns when you don’t need to in order to get the benefit of the skill…. That’s part of what makes it balanced….

I mean I don’t see where I argued to blow cds. What about swapping pets right before you heal is blowing a cd? What about healing after using a stunbreak/condi clear, IF you need to heal, is blowing a cd? If you take those as “blowing” cds then ok fine I’m not going to argue with that point anymore.

borya.2964:

Mcrocha.3891:

In exhcange for two condi removal every 20 seconds you can have 6-7s quickness just by swapping pets right before WHaO is cast. You can have 12-13s quickness by popping WHaO shortly after QZ is cast(say you just got bursted and need to stunbreak/heal). That’s totalling ~20s [..]

- Where the 20 sec Cd comes from ? ZS is on a 15 sec CD.
- 6 or 7 ?
- 12 or 13 ?
- 7 + 7 = 13 ?
- 20 sec ?

Mcrocha.3891:

No, again lets say you NEED to heal so you cast WHaO, a 1s cast, 3/4 of the way through the cast, you swap pets=8s Quickness. You’re not casting heal immediately after swapping pets, you are using heal normally when you need to, but also deciding to swap pets then in order to get 8s Quickness. This is broken in itself because this could potentially have 50% uptime.

Now you don’t have to heal every time after you use QZ, but if you do and then decide to combo it with pet swap as discussed above then you will get 20s Quickness. Essentially you will have almost 50% uptime on Quickness for the cd of QZ. If you do not decide to pop heal, then your Quickness uptime is still ridiculous because of the 6s you get from QZ.

You mixed differents CD (traited an untraited) and differents based duration with and without Lingering Magic.

Jeez dude, it’s not that hard to be accurate.

Mcrocha.3891:

The reason why it is op is because it takes zero investment.

- You absolutly need 3 traits lines WS, NM and BM (that is not the meta like you said), 4 Traits, WEAO and QZ to achieve this. It’s far from zero investment for an hard rotation in a real fight and that is mostly, like others said, very dangerous. On the top of that you need to be a good ranger who can keep his pets alive.

20s cooldown is the cooldown of Troll Unguent.
Base QZ would give you 12s (6×2) and then Zephyrs Speed would give you 6s (3×2), this is only taking the BM line. That’s 18s with 1 trait line. You can take any other two trait lines that you want and get 18s.

I’m pretty sure the “perma” quickness is not intended and they’ll fix it soon.

Mcrocha.3891:

20s cooldown is the cooldown of Troll Unguent.
Base QZ would give you 12s (6×2) and then Zephyrs Speed would give you 6s (3×2), this is only taking the BM line. That’s 18s with 1 trait line. You can take any other two trait lines that you want and get 18s.

Troll Unguent, you mean WEAO ?

You need WK in WS to reduce the survival’s CD and FB in NM to share the boons with your pet. 3 lines.

Take a break buddy.

every time Ranger gets something that makes the,:

1. excel over other classes in some specific way
2. gives them a niche that other classes don’t have
3. buffs them up in order to push them towards meta standards
4. Makes people change their approach to fighting them

people cry OP, over and over again. This happens every time ranger sees a significant buff like this one. Why?

Cuz people have grown complacent with not having to deal with Rangers.

enjoy it QQs rangers………….we mesmers are finally out for now until chrono ofc then mesmer whine starts again

Godmoney.2048:

Mesmer kneecapped? Huh? What? I don’t even? Seriously? You can’t be serious? Huh?

The PU trait was grossly overbuffed in the specialty patch.

And many players have been using various other builds successfully, like Illusions or Inspiration instead PU….

thief here, ty for making pistols good again….2 years later.. <3

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

T raw.4658:

There is no defending this amount of quickness.

Stop. Its broken.

I applaud effort but the devs who allowed this to go through need to be fired.

Care to elaborate on that or is this just another, ”I don’t know what killed me and I am too lazy to try to figure it out and see if I can counter it, so I’m just going to qq for nerfs” posts?

The reason why it is op is because it takes zero investment. Take the meta power survival build for instance which could now take zephyrs speed over beastly warden after it was nerfed. So the only “sacrifice” you have to make in your build is taking WHaO over TU. In exhcange for two condi removal every 20 seconds you can have 6-7s quickness just by swapping pets right before WHaO is cast. You can have 12-13s quickness by popping WHaO shortly after QZ is cast(say you just got bursted and need to stunbreak/heal). That’s totalling ~20s of quickness on a Marauder build just bc the Ranger was playing normally. Plus that’s only considering the boons you apply and not the other ones that would be on your pet from allies or traits etc.

That’s not good for balance and just adds to power creep, in the future people can say “oh look at Ranger they can have 20s quickness why can’t we have xxx.”

No investment… You just said they have to
-drop a condi removal
-drop their taunt (which up until yesterday was the providing the most qq about rangers)
-blow a stun break and condi removal
-blow a heal
-swap pets on cooldown rather than properly managing them and saving the swap for when they are in danger

Not to mention this is in PvP where everyone is running as much boonstripping as possible to deal with guardian’s and ele’s (who have easily been stacking boons without putting themselves in so much danger since forever).

How exactly is that OP again?

There is only 1 thing you have to invest in, which I said in my post was WHaO:
-I said that it is an exchange of only 2 condi cleanse every 20 seconds. In exchange for the potential of 20s quickness, pretty fair trade.
-It is questionable to slot taunt now when it is no longer broken and can be blocked/evaded. Zephyrs Speed offers more utility both with WHaO and general might stacking as well as for something like ressing or stomping.
-you misunderstand the gameplay, you don’t “blow” your skills, you use them normally as you would in any situation previously except now you can just have the potential for 20s quickness.
-you don’t swap the pets on cooldown, you swap them once again when you need to do so

And if you are playing normally you aren’t immediately healing after every pet swap and every time you use QZ, which means your point is moot.

No, again lets say you NEED to heal so you cast WHaO, a 1s cast, 3/4 of the way through the cast, you swap pets=8s Quickness. You’re not casting heal immediately after swapping pets, you are using heal normally when you need to, but also deciding to swap pets then in order to get 8s Quickness. This is broken in itself because this could potentially have 50% uptime.

Now you don’t have to heal every time after you use QZ, but if you do and then decide to combo it with pet swap as discussed above then you will get 20s Quickness. Essentially you will have almost 50% uptime on Quickness for the cd of QZ. If you do not decide to pop heal, then your Quickness uptime is still ridiculous because of the 6s you get from QZ.

So now you are back to arguing that you will occasionally blow cooldowns when you don’t need to in order to get the benefit of the skill…. That’s part of what makes it balanced….

I mean I don’t see where I argued to blow cds. What about swapping pets right before you heal is blowing a cd? What about healing after using a stunbreak/condi clear, IF you need to heal, is blowing a cd? If you take those as “blowing” cds then ok fine I’m not going to argue with that point anymore.

If they’re swapping pet on cooldown, you probably aren’t actually being hit by the pet most of the time (unless you have no idea how to kite, in which case learn that before making any posts regarding PvP balance). If it’s really a problem, burst their bird right when it comes out, and it will destroy their build entirely. Or stack conditions on them; they have no cleanse and chill will disrupt their build extremely harshly. This ranger build does similar damage to d/d cele ele, but (unlike cele) has no sustain and no condition cleanse. Like a mesmer, it seems overwhelming to someone who doesn’t know what they’re doing…but it isn’t actually overpowered.

No need to worry.
Roy confirmed Nerf:
https://twitter.com/roycronacher/status/649267788121411585

awesome, cant wait til they make it useless…

ronpierce.2760:

No need to worry.
Roy confirmed Nerf:
https://twitter.com/roycronacher/status/649267788121411585

…And this is why ranger is never meta. A powerful ranger build with no cleanse? Nerf immediately. A powerful elementalist build with the best cleanse and sustain in the game? Meh, leave it be for a few months.

ronpierce.2760:

No need to worry.
Roy confirmed Nerf:
https://twitter.com/roycronacher/status/649267788121411585

it was great tho, feeling op for a bit.

but d/d can have all the boons they want and still tanking 2 people, this logic.

LOL…. new record in nerf intentions, on noes cant have rangers be relevant.
I agree that it clearly isnt working as intended but this has to be a new record in fix intent when others have had similar advantages for long periods of time (cough current meta cough)

Yeah, it was fun. Hopefully they don’t over-do it so I can still use it with my Druid build. The boon build that popped up was almost exactly what I had in mind for Druid, minus the Natures magic which would have been less boon-crazy, but w better well rounded build.

Sucks because I’m pretty sure the biggest part of what made this build broke. Was the Natures Magic in terms of boon stacking.

Will probably just end up settling for survival Druid instead.

I can still get randomly 1-hitted by stealthed mesmers on my thief so dunno about them getting nerfed. And no it’s not an l2p issue since you can’t always see the pink bouncing blade flying across the area

Huttunen.8309:

I can still get randomly 1-hitted by stealthed mesmers on my thief so dunno about them getting nerfed. And no it’s not an l2p issue since you can’t always see the pink bouncing blade flying across the area

sorry to say that but it is…………..L2P issue.

On knee jerk reactions you remember nerfing mesmers torment after 10 hours from patch hitting live servers right? So this nerf wont be a new record sadly.

Well, it was nice being barely relevant with boons for about a day or so. Considering the build could be countered easily and caused self implosion with boon corruption.

borya.2964:

Mcrocha.3891:

20s cooldown is the cooldown of Troll Unguent.
Base QZ would give you 12s (6×2) and then Zephyrs Speed would give you 6s (3×2), this is only taking the BM line. That’s 18s with 1 trait line. You can take any other two trait lines that you want and get 18s.

Troll Unguent, you mean WEAO ?

You need WK in WS to reduce the survival’s CD and FB in NM to share the boons with your pet. 3 lines.

Take a break buddy.

How about you read the argument from the beginning buddy. The point was that if you are running the meta survival build, you would have TU instead of WHaO. TU with WK is 20s cd buddy. Therefore, taking WHaO instead of TU gives up 2 condi clear every 20s buddy.

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

T raw.4658:

There is no defending this amount of quickness.

Stop. Its broken.

I applaud effort but the devs who allowed this to go through need to be fired.

Care to elaborate on that or is this just another, ”I don’t know what killed me and I am too lazy to try to figure it out and see if I can counter it, so I’m just going to qq for nerfs” posts?

The reason why it is op is because it takes zero investment. Take the meta power survival build for instance which could now take zephyrs speed over beastly warden after it was nerfed. So the only “sacrifice” you have to make in your build is taking WHaO over TU. In exhcange for two condi removal every 20 seconds you can have 6-7s quickness just by swapping pets right before WHaO is cast. You can have 12-13s quickness by popping WHaO shortly after QZ is cast(say you just got bursted and need to stunbreak/heal). That’s totalling ~20s of quickness on a Marauder build just bc the Ranger was playing normally. Plus that’s only considering the boons you apply and not the other ones that would be on your pet from allies or traits etc.

That’s not good for balance and just adds to power creep, in the future people can say “oh look at Ranger they can have 20s quickness why can’t we have xxx.”

No investment… You just said they have to
-drop a condi removal
-drop their taunt (which up until yesterday was the providing the most qq about rangers)
-blow a stun break and condi removal
-blow a heal
-swap pets on cooldown rather than properly managing them and saving the swap for when they are in danger

Not to mention this is in PvP where everyone is running as much boonstripping as possible to deal with guardian’s and ele’s (who have easily been stacking boons without putting themselves in so much danger since forever).

How exactly is that OP again?

There is only 1 thing you have to invest in, which I said in my post was WHaO:
-I said that it is an exchange of only 2 condi cleanse every 20 seconds. In exchange for the potential of 20s quickness, pretty fair trade.
-It is questionable to slot taunt now when it is no longer broken and can be blocked/evaded. Zephyrs Speed offers more utility both with WHaO and general might stacking as well as for something like ressing or stomping.
-you misunderstand the gameplay, you don’t “blow” your skills, you use them normally as you would in any situation previously except now you can just have the potential for 20s quickness.
-you don’t swap the pets on cooldown, you swap them once again when you need to do so

And if you are playing normally you aren’t immediately healing after every pet swap and every time you use QZ, which means your point is moot.

No, again lets say you NEED to heal so you cast WHaO, a 1s cast, 3/4 of the way through the cast, you swap pets=8s Quickness. You’re not casting heal immediately after swapping pets, you are using heal normally when you need to, but also deciding to swap pets then in order to get 8s Quickness. This is broken in itself because this could potentially have 50% uptime.

Now you don’t have to heal every time after you use QZ, but if you do and then decide to combo it with pet swap as discussed above then you will get 20s Quickness. Essentially you will have almost 50% uptime on Quickness for the cd of QZ. If you do not decide to pop heal, then your Quickness uptime is still ridiculous because of the 6s you get from QZ.

So now you are back to arguing that you will occasionally blow cooldowns when you don’t need to in order to get the benefit of the skill…. That’s part of what makes it balanced….

I mean I don’t see where I argued to blow cds. What about swapping pets right before you heal is blowing a cd? What about healing after using a stunbreak/condi clear, IF you need to heal, is blowing a cd? If you take those as “blowing” cds then ok fine I’m not going to argue with that point anymore.

If they’re swapping pet on cooldown, you probably aren’t actually being hit by the pet most of the time (unless you have no idea how to kite, in which case learn that before making any posts regarding PvP balance). If it’s really a problem, burst their bird right when it comes out, and it will destroy their build entirely. Or stack conditions on them; they have no cleanse and chill will disrupt their build extremely harshly. This ranger build does similar damage to d/d cele ele, but (unlike cele) has no sustain and no condition cleanse. Like a mesmer, it seems overwhelming to someone who doesn’t know what they’re doing…but it isn’t actually overpowered.

By your logic, pets should never hit you if know how to kite, regardless of whether or not you swap pets. So I don’t see your point. Condi cleanse is a base problem with Ranger, stacking condis on Ranger is effective regardless.

ronpierce.2760:

No need to worry.
Roy confirmed Nerf:
https://twitter.com/roycronacher/status/649267788121411585

I don’t really mind that much, but really… This is nowhere near as strong as DD ele STILL is, yet they nerf this within days and left DD ele as it is for over a year. Talk about double standards…

no surprise to the nerf.
don’t even started to try to create builds around this heal.

that’s how to counterplay rangers.
just go to the forum and qq a bit.

Ragnar.3916:

no surprise to the nerf.
don’t even started to try to create builds around this heal.

that’s how to counterplay rangers.
just go to the forum and qq a bit.

Right? Now the dev’s can do another stream where they make kittenty bear bow jokes while leaving ranger as the bottom tier class for another 3 years.

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

Mcrocha.3891:

Puck.9612:

T raw.4658:

There is no defending this amount of quickness.

Stop. Its broken.

I applaud effort but the devs who allowed this to go through need to be fired.

Care to elaborate on that or is this just another, ”I don’t know what killed me and I am too lazy to try to figure it out and see if I can counter it, so I’m just going to qq for nerfs” posts?

The reason why it is op is because it takes zero investment. Take the meta power survival build for instance which could now take zephyrs speed over beastly warden after it was nerfed. So the only “sacrifice” you have to make in your build is taking WHaO over TU. In exhcange for two condi removal every 20 seconds you can have 6-7s quickness just by swapping pets right before WHaO is cast. You can have 12-13s quickness by popping WHaO shortly after QZ is cast(say you just got bursted and need to stunbreak/heal). That’s totalling ~20s of quickness on a Marauder build just bc the Ranger was playing normally. Plus that’s only considering the boons you apply and not the other ones that would be on your pet from allies or traits etc.

That’s not good for balance and just adds to power creep, in the future people can say “oh look at Ranger they can have 20s quickness why can’t we have xxx.”

No investment… You just said they have to
-drop a condi removal
-drop their taunt (which up until yesterday was the providing the most qq about rangers)
-blow a stun break and condi removal
-blow a heal
-swap pets on cooldown rather than properly managing them and saving the swap for when they are in danger

Not to mention this is in PvP where everyone is running as much boonstripping as possible to deal with guardian’s and ele’s (who have easily been stacking boons without putting themselves in so much danger since forever).

How exactly is that OP again?

There is only 1 thing you have to invest in, which I said in my post was WHaO:
-I said that it is an exchange of only 2 condi cleanse every 20 seconds. In exchange for the potential of 20s quickness, pretty fair trade.
-It is questionable to slot taunt now when it is no longer broken and can be blocked/evaded. Zephyrs Speed offers more utility both with WHaO and general might stacking as well as for something like ressing or stomping.
-you misunderstand the gameplay, you don’t “blow” your skills, you use them normally as you would in any situation previously except now you can just have the potential for 20s quickness.
-you don’t swap the pets on cooldown, you swap them once again when you need to do so

And if you are playing normally you aren’t immediately healing after every pet swap and every time you use QZ, which means your point is moot.

No, again lets say you NEED to heal so you cast WHaO, a 1s cast, 3/4 of the way through the cast, you swap pets=8s Quickness. You’re not casting heal immediately after swapping pets, you are using heal normally when you need to, but also deciding to swap pets then in order to get 8s Quickness. This is broken in itself because this could potentially have 50% uptime.

Now you don’t have to heal every time after you use QZ, but if you do and then decide to combo it with pet swap as discussed above then you will get 20s Quickness. Essentially you will have almost 50% uptime on Quickness for the cd of QZ. If you do not decide to pop heal, then your Quickness uptime is still ridiculous because of the 6s you get from QZ.

So now you are back to arguing that you will occasionally blow cooldowns when you don’t need to in order to get the benefit of the skill…. That’s part of what makes it balanced….

I mean I don’t see where I argued to blow cds. What about swapping pets right before you heal is blowing a cd? What about healing after using a stunbreak/condi clear, IF you need to heal, is blowing a cd? If you take those as “blowing” cds then ok fine I’m not going to argue with that point anymore.

If they’re swapping pet on cooldown, you probably aren’t actually being hit by the pet most of the time (unless you have no idea how to kite, in which case learn that before making any posts regarding PvP balance). If it’s really a problem, burst their bird right when it comes out, and it will destroy their build entirely. Or stack conditions on them; they have no cleanse and chill will disrupt their build extremely harshly. This ranger build does similar damage to d/d cele ele, but (unlike cele) has no sustain and no condition cleanse. Like a mesmer, it seems overwhelming to someone who doesn’t know what they’re doing…but it isn’t actually overpowered.

By your logic, pets should never hit you if know how to kite, regardless of whether or not you swap pets. So I don’t see your point. Condi cleanse is a base problem with Ranger, stacking condis on Ranger is effective regardless.

If you’re kiting, it can take a good 10 seconds for the pet to get to you. If they’re swapping pets on cooldown (which this build calls for), that’s at least half the time that you don’t take any damage from the pet, and they don’t have the infamous taunt, either. Also, having LR and TU (which are both given up for this build, as I recall) together gives up to 1 condition removed every five seconds, on average, and taking SotP (why did they change the name of that skill?) instead of entangle gives up a little bit more. This build gives up a lot of condition removal, on a profession which already has subpar cleanse in the first place. In order to deal slightly better damage than a d/d cele ele. Think about that.

Its not like i felt like a top tier class-build ( d/d cele ele ) and its not like i agree that it should stay that way for months ( d/d cele ele ) but it leaves me a bitter taste that i had no chance against a certain class-build ( d/d cele ele ) for so long and the moment i had a small chance into winning against it ( d/d cele ele ) the forums went crazy and the devs started to looking into it…

I main Ranger and i stopped playing this game for some time now cause i didnt want to play the most effective class-build ( d/d cele ele ) and i wanted to play my favourite ( Ranger )..

But it felt pointless. D/D cele ele could run, dmg me, condi me, outheal every dmg i put on them…
I know some time some players are better than me and they will win.
But that wasnt the case..

D/D cele ele is flawless. It simply has no counterplay

I don’t feel anything’s changed but Ranger’s design is so bad that they should still be UP because it’s not hard to play it. That’s if ANET wants to achieve actual balance which I don’t think they can because they can’t even rework pet mechanics and I don’t think their game engine can handle anything crazy.

Expect things to get worse though, even Warrior which was a very balanced class will be really broken once people understand how Last Stand and Shield buff made Axe + GS op and the only thing worth running.

You can’t trust ANET to get anything done.

BolshoiBooze.3406:

ronpierce.2760:

No need to worry.
Roy confirmed Nerf:
https://twitter.com/roycronacher/status/649267788121411585

I don’t really mind that much, but really… This is nowhere near as strong as DD ele STILL is, yet they nerf this within days and left DD ele as it is for over a year. Talk about double standards…

To Roy, ranger is the bottom class. If it exceeds the bottom class standard, they’d suddenly all jumped and then quickly nerf it back to bottom class.

Bunch of hypocrites.

Anyway, I think that build is below average and wouldn’t continue running that build anyway. Go on and nerf it. Make it a worthless 0 viability build then.

You all are actually defending this WOW. You do realize having that much quickness is game breaking right? This has nothing to do with keeping rangers bottom tier but goes along the lines of stopping super stomps/resses/etc.

Then imagine Druid with perma quickness. LOL

Hopefully the nerf is swift and kills this out right.

I see the mods go to work on the guy calling out the party responsible for this lol. I don’t condone that kinda stuff but I can understand the frustration with this balance team lately.

Azukas.1426:

You all are actually defending this WOW. You do realize having that much quickness is game breaking right? This has nothing to do with keeping rangers bottom tier but goes along the lines of stopping super stomps/resses/etc.

Then imagine Druid with perma quickness. LOL

Hopefully the nerf is swift and kills this out right.

I see the mods go to work on the guy calling out the party responsible for this lol. I don’t condone that kinda stuff but I can understand the frustration with this balance team lately.

Because the quickness uptime really didn’t require any sacrifice in survivability and/or utility, right? What bothers me most is how this is getting gutted ASAP, but PU and d/d ele was allowed to go on for a long while. I love the unconditional hate from the community towards rangers and every little buff they recieve. The longbow buffs got QQ from minute one too, with everyone crying how OP it was. People just seem to keep the class in the gutter.

How is it more gamebreaking than having 10-25 might stacks, perma invis, excessive dodge, or other such issues?
If this one is so bad, how are others so ok?

Look i agree its overkill and obviously not working as intended, but the uproar was funny in the face of other things that are accepted as fine. If this needs a nerf then don’t those too?

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

Do note Quickness on swap only works in combat.

Have fun stacking quickness when you fight any decent players who’s trying hard to kill you. You’d be wasting your pet potential, wasting QZ just to try to keep the quickness longer, and try to kill your foe with pitiful axe auto lol…

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

The build has no condition cleanse, no offensive traits, uses pet swap on cooldown (hint: kill their pet just once and the build becomes completely useless at everything)…and still doesn’t do that much damage compared to meta builds like d/d cele ele. But hey, it’s a ranger doing that damage, and that isn’t allowed. Meanwhile, pet pathing is worthless and f2 still doesn’t work at all.

Edit: by the way, the ranger’s healing skill is on cooldown for the first 16-20 seconds of the fight; more than enough time to burst them down.

As a Ranger and a Mesmer, I’m going to call out OP.

I agree on the point that We Heal As One is op atm, I am easily able to self sustain 25 stacks of might with RaO.. sorry, WE HUNT AS A PACK.. it has to be in caps because I am shouting and using Kaio Ken. Apologies. I believe Ranger has a natural advantage over the Mes. They outrange them, RF tracks stealth, and once on the real Mes the pet sticks to them. (and to be fair the pet could probobly smell them in a RL situatuon so the counter makes sense to me)

On the otherhand. PU is trash and deserved the nerf, when I initially saw the 100% (read, x2) stealth increase I said that’s insane.. and it was. Mesmers have great things coming with Chronomancer and we should wait to see what it brings before another balance change. We have less then a month until HoT and Mesmer should be buffed or nerfed accordingly to how it performs in the HoT meta.

If you want to beat a Ranger as a Mesmer you need to get up close or blink shatter. If they don’t suspect it they wont pop SoS, force a weapon swap by being close to the LB then kite the GS but be wary of the truly crafty Rangers who use Sword/X. They are far more dangerous and have three evade skills, avoid bursting them or wasting CDs until they swap back to LB. Lastly, keep an eye on the pet at all times and learn the tells for their CC.

Better yet, play a Ranger and use them first hand to get a good feel for the AI to better counter them. Don’t go in with the mindset “this is ez”. That will be your downfall. You need to go in with the mindset that “I am learning how this class works”. And I will tell you now much of it is pet management.

I suppose these words are wasted but I feel inclined to try none the less.. if anyone is actually reading this and learned anything, thank you for existing. My life isn’t a complete waste now!

Unholy Pillager.3791:

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

The build has no condition cleanse, no offensive traits, uses pet swap on cooldown (hint: kill their pet just once and the build becomes completely useless at everything)…and still doesn’t do that much damage compared to meta builds like d/d cele ele. But hey, it’s a ranger doing that damage, and that isn’t allowed. Meanwhile, pet pathing is worthless and f2 still doesn’t work at all.

Again stop thinking about the celestial build that has been posted around. Think about other builds such as survival that don’t really have to give up much to get this quickness stuff. Furthermore, think about how quickness could be too good on something like Druid who could put out an area 5-6k heal faster with Tidal Surge and quickness.

Amityel.5324:

Huttunen.8309:

I can still get randomly 1-hitted by stealthed mesmers on my thief so dunno about them getting nerfed. And no it’s not an l2p issue since you can’t always see the pink bouncing blade flying across the area

sorry to say that but it is…………..L2P issue.

On knee jerk reactions you remember nerfing mesmers torment after 10 hours from patch hitting live servers right? So this nerf wont be a new record sadly.

Not in all situations, do you even play this game? There can be some surprising situations in this game mode, and when it comes to random surprising 1-hits well played mesmer is only class which can pull it off in a second

Silly place anyway to have convo about this, I’ll drop it here

It took them over a kittening year to do a D/D Ele nerf and they barely put a dent in it. Rangers get a build with much less sustain and damage and its gets nerfed after a few days?
No, Anet doesn’t play favourites with classes at all…

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

The build has no condition cleanse, no offensive traits, uses pet swap on cooldown (hint: kill their pet just once and the build becomes completely useless at everything)…and still doesn’t do that much damage compared to meta builds like d/d cele ele. But hey, it’s a ranger doing that damage, and that isn’t allowed. Meanwhile, pet pathing is worthless and f2 still doesn’t work at all.

Again stop thinking about the celestial build that has been posted around. Think about other builds such as survival that don’t really have to give up much to get this quickness stuff. Furthermore, think about how quickness could be too good on something like Druid who could put out an area 5-6k heal faster with Tidal Surge and quickness.

No matter what, the ranger is still giving up their heal for the first 16-20 seconds of a fight if they open with quickness. Without this buff, rangers aren’t even competitive at all in high level PvP. Maybe the quickness could be toned down a bit…but every other aspect of that skill is still fine, and pets are still bugged as hell. Also, why should I stop comparing to cele ele? They let those stay out of control for months, yet want to gut rangers within a day of making them potentially competitive. People are complaining about long duration fury and protection, as if elementalists and revenants can’t already do that. I guess it’s only a problem if a bottom tier profession does it, because you feel entitled to an automatic win every time you face a ranger.

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

The build has no condition cleanse, no offensive traits, uses pet swap on cooldown (hint: kill their pet just once and the build becomes completely useless at everything)…and still doesn’t do that much damage compared to meta builds like d/d cele ele. But hey, it’s a ranger doing that damage, and that isn’t allowed. Meanwhile, pet pathing is worthless and f2 still doesn’t work at all.

Again stop thinking about the celestial build that has been posted around. Think about other builds such as survival that don’t really have to give up much to get this quickness stuff. Furthermore, think about how quickness could be too good on something like Druid who could put out an area 5-6k heal faster with Tidal Surge and quickness.

No matter what, the ranger is still giving up their heal for the first 16-20 seconds of a fight if they open with quickness. Without this buff, rangers aren’t even competitive at all in high level PvP. Maybe the quickness could be toned down a bit…but every other aspect of that skill is still fine, and pets are still bugged as hell. Also, why should I stop comparing to cele ele? They let those stay out of control for months, yet want to gut rangers within a day of making them potentially competitive. People are complaining about long duration fury and protection, as if elementalists and revenants can’t already do that. I guess it’s only a problem if a bottom tier profession does it, because you feel entitled to an automatic win every time you face a ranger.

It’s not the perma regen or swiftness or fury, we could already do that. It’s having 100% uptime on certain boons that is not intended(stated by devs), and the fact that you can stack quickness out the wazoo. And again stop thinking you have to use your heal before fights start, you can play normally just as you did before the patch, use heal midfight, and wow stack quickness, so much strat.

When you want to make an argument as to why something shouldn’t be taken down a notch, you don’t want to compare it to D/D ele that is agreed to be too strong by the whole community.

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

The build has no condition cleanse, no offensive traits, uses pet swap on cooldown (hint: kill their pet just once and the build becomes completely useless at everything)…and still doesn’t do that much damage compared to meta builds like d/d cele ele. But hey, it’s a ranger doing that damage, and that isn’t allowed. Meanwhile, pet pathing is worthless and f2 still doesn’t work at all.

Again stop thinking about the celestial build that has been posted around. Think about other builds such as survival that don’t really have to give up much to get this quickness stuff. Furthermore, think about how quickness could be too good on something like Druid who could put out an area 5-6k heal faster with Tidal Surge and quickness.

No matter what, the ranger is still giving up their heal for the first 16-20 seconds of a fight if they open with quickness. Without this buff, rangers aren’t even competitive at all in high level PvP. Maybe the quickness could be toned down a bit…but every other aspect of that skill is still fine, and pets are still bugged as hell. Also, why should I stop comparing to cele ele? They let those stay out of control for months, yet want to gut rangers within a day of making them potentially competitive. People are complaining about long duration fury and protection, as if elementalists and revenants can’t already do that. I guess it’s only a problem if a bottom tier profession does it, because you feel entitled to an automatic win every time you face a ranger.

It’s not the perma regen or swiftness or fury, we could already do that. It’s having 100% uptime on certain boons that is not intended(stated by devs), and the fact that you can stack quickness out the wazoo. And again stop thinking you have to use your heal before fights start, you can play normally just as you did before the patch, use heal midfight, and wow stack quickness, so much strat.

When you want to make an argument as to why something shouldn’t be taken down a notch, you don’t want to compare it to D/D ele that is agreed to be too strong by the whole community.

What boons besides quickness are problematic? And as for cele ele, they left that out of control for months. This build, which is less effective than that, is going to be gutted within a week. They have a serious double standard going.

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

The build has no condition cleanse, no offensive traits, uses pet swap on cooldown (hint: kill their pet just once and the build becomes completely useless at everything)…and still doesn’t do that much damage compared to meta builds like d/d cele ele. But hey, it’s a ranger doing that damage, and that isn’t allowed. Meanwhile, pet pathing is worthless and f2 still doesn’t work at all.

Again stop thinking about the celestial build that has been posted around. Think about other builds such as survival that don’t really have to give up much to get this quickness stuff. Furthermore, think about how quickness could be too good on something like Druid who could put out an area 5-6k heal faster with Tidal Surge and quickness.

No matter what, the ranger is still giving up their heal for the first 16-20 seconds of a fight if they open with quickness. Without this buff, rangers aren’t even competitive at all in high level PvP. Maybe the quickness could be toned down a bit…but every other aspect of that skill is still fine, and pets are still bugged as hell. Also, why should I stop comparing to cele ele? They let those stay out of control for months, yet want to gut rangers within a day of making them potentially competitive. People are complaining about long duration fury and protection, as if elementalists and revenants can’t already do that. I guess it’s only a problem if a bottom tier profession does it, because you feel entitled to an automatic win every time you face a ranger.

It’s not the perma regen or swiftness or fury, we could already do that. It’s having 100% uptime on certain boons that is not intended(stated by devs), and the fact that you can stack quickness out the wazoo. And again stop thinking you have to use your heal before fights start, you can play normally just as you did before the patch, use heal midfight, and wow stack quickness, so much strat.

When you want to make an argument as to why something shouldn’t be taken down a notch, you don’t want to compare it to D/D ele that is agreed to be too strong by the whole community.

What boons besides quickness are problematic? And as for cele ele, they left that out of control for months. This build, which is less effective than that, is going to be gutted within a week. They have a serious double standard going.

Quickness by itself is enough, but I’m gonna go out on a limb here and say prot.

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mcrocha.3891:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

CobOfCorn.6352:

“The other OP builds were allowed for longer” lmao rangers that’s not a great argument against a minute and a half of quickness and fury.

The build has no condition cleanse, no offensive traits, uses pet swap on cooldown (hint: kill their pet just once and the build becomes completely useless at everything)…and still doesn’t do that much damage compared to meta builds like d/d cele ele. But hey, it’s a ranger doing that damage, and that isn’t allowed. Meanwhile, pet pathing is worthless and f2 still doesn’t work at all.

Again stop thinking about the celestial build that has been posted around. Think about other builds such as survival that don’t really have to give up much to get this quickness stuff. Furthermore, think about how quickness could be too good on something like Druid who could put out an area 5-6k heal faster with Tidal Surge and quickness.

No matter what, the ranger is still giving up their heal for the first 16-20 seconds of a fight if they open with quickness. Without this buff, rangers aren’t even competitive at all in high level PvP. Maybe the quickness could be toned down a bit…but every other aspect of that skill is still fine, and pets are still bugged as hell. Also, why should I stop comparing to cele ele? They let those stay out of control for months, yet want to gut rangers within a day of making them potentially competitive. People are complaining about long duration fury and protection, as if elementalists and revenants can’t already do that. I guess it’s only a problem if a bottom tier profession does it, because you feel entitled to an automatic win every time you face a ranger.

It’s not the perma regen or swiftness or fury, we could already do that. It’s having 100% uptime on certain boons that is not intended(stated by devs), and the fact that you can stack quickness out the wazoo. And again stop thinking you have to use your heal before fights start, you can play normally just as you did before the patch, use heal midfight, and wow stack quickness, so much strat.

When you want to make an argument as to why something shouldn’t be taken down a notch, you don’t want to compare it to D/D ele that is agreed to be too strong by the whole community.

What boons besides quickness are problematic? And as for cele ele, they left that out of control for months. This build, which is less effective than that, is going to be gutted within a week. They have a serious double standard going.

Quickness by itself is enough, but I’m gonna go out on a limb here and say prot.

Elementalist can spam prot, and they have better cleanse as well…I’m not seeing the problem there. It isn’t like ranger is being abused in tournaments. In fact, it’s not like ranger is even being used in tournaments. The first time that ranger might become tournament viable and ANet wants a nerf within 24 hours? From where I sit, they appear to be playing favorites…or least favorites, as it were.

Mcrocha.3891:

I mean I don’t see where I argued to blow cds. What about swapping pets right before you heal is blowing a cd? What about healing after using a stunbreak/condi clear, IF you need to heal, is blowing a cd? If you take those as “blowing” cds then ok fine I’m not going to argue with that point anymore.

Puck is right here. You have to actively use other skills other than WHaO to solely gain the quickness your taking about. Your not using these skills for the situational advantage, your blowing them in conjunction off cool down to stack them onto your self. Using skills in such a way has never been part of any rangers rotation until now. To say this is normal game play is wrong.

Now normally I would agree with you that quickness stacking is overpowered. The thing is ranger really has low damage. We have high single hit modifiers but that is it. Attacking twice as long with quickness means nothing when you don’t do any damage.

You don’t have any damage traits aside from two handed training and bountiful hunter when doing the permanent stack build using NM WS and BM. Meaning even the fact that we can keep up permanent quickness, protection, swiftness and regen is irrelevant because every single class/build( aside from things like condition sword/dagger thief) will out dps you.

PVP has become an absolute joke in GW2 with lackluster PVE i dont understand what Anet is doing! i want to buy the Expack but BTW i feel like im playing a blizzard game again.. just cycling 1 class as op and everyone else can just suffer. I just dont get it.

BRING BACK GW1 style PVP and class balance! Subclasses ftw!

i for one feel that boons should be equal opportunity, and they should implement more builds across classes that emphasize boon removal. That would make a nice meta/anti-meta environment about counterplay/risk-reward.

So what ranger can get boons now on a niche build? Chill, boon copy/removal, and pure condi builds destroy this build cuz it has nothing outside of this one niche.

only thing that should be touched with this “looking at” should be the quickness

lol at Roy too. Sorry Ranger was at risk for making your precious Herald look sub-par in comparison.