Guild Wars 2

I have typed this on another topic but that thread is not active now so I wanted to open this topic and wanted to talk about it.

I am aware of there are many threads in forum that complaining about matchmaking. This is just +1 to that.

Experienced players are having really really bad lose streaks due to matchmaking failures. Full pve or clueless teammates. Makes us hate this leauge, seriously.

To be honest, my words can be a little rough from this point.

I am surely believe that Anet has just failed adjusting Matchmaking big time. In fact this failure might be one of the biggest game developer mistakes in game history. Yeah, I believe its that terrible. it’s made me think that it’s even worse than before.

I got a above avarage mmr. I play with my close friend, whose MMR is similiar. Before season 2, we were doing pretty good. We even hit legend division in season1. But now, my friend’s having 9-10 winning streaks while Im having 7-8 lose streaks. This can’t be real. He gets always decent teammates and his games are challenging. All my lost games were lost with big score gap such as 500-50 or 500-100. This is horrible, all the time I get full noobs as teammates. I had a guy in my team died to beast at the beginning of the game TWICE in a row. and next game I get a Full PvE team(yes they had a name) as my teammates while enemy team having decent players. How can I carry this?

This is a nightmare. This matchmaking oficially broken and makes VETERAN players like us to think quit this game. I have lost my joy to play at the moment. If I get a 1 decent team next 3 game I get total clueless players.

Obviously unfair. Like the guy I quoted said, some players are getting always good teammates while some are getting Clueless players. and this leads to suffering.

Im trying to understand how could guild wars 2 pvp developers designed such a unbalanced, unfair, poor matchmaking.

This is trashing the game. Serious actions needs to be taken immediatly. My suggestion is, season 2 should be paused and pvp designers need to work on this matchmaking on this period. Because there is no point, giving this to players.

Another long term suggestion is; Anet should give a shot to create 3v3 or 2v2 pvp modes in order to reduce the fail ratio which caused by this 5v5 matchmaking.
Yes I believe, problem is big.

PS: I have over 7k games. So no l2p talk

Read this also;

It’s not broken because it’s intended to work this way. The system finds your teammates based on your MMR, which is obviously either a) lower than you expected, or b) the exact average in which all new players start in. When searching for opponents, you can get anybody at all.

Say you had 1200 MMR (the average, where new players start). you queue up. you get 4 other 1200~ MMR players on your team (maybe some of them are new, some of them are average players.) Then on the opposing side, they are all 2100 MMR players. Obviously, you’d get 500-xx’d. Your MMR goes down, and it creates a cycle of players on losing streaks being matched with other players on losing streaks.

Personally, I’m on a 22 win streak. Broke into Sapphire with 0 losses. I have extraordinarily high MMR – back when the system was MMR based (pre-dec 16th), I peaked at 7th place and ended 18th. Last season, I went something like 60-20 in ranked. When I queue into games, everyone on my team is rocking primordial legend, or were at the very least diamond. I face bear ranks all the time.

In my eyes, there is almost no way this is a mistake. This is what Anet must’ve intended the system to do. No one can screw up that hard.

So, basically you are saying; Anet wants matches like good ones versus bad ones. And this goes and goes in cycles. low mmr’s always fight against high mmr’s.

It’s like capitalism then, Rich will be rich and poor will be poor forever. This is the system that is intended? and there is no mistake? This is what we deserve? Wow just wow.

I managed to hit legend in season 1, ruby games were hard but diamond went easier. And I never had this much of lose streaks before.

How can you design a system that puts players with 5k+ games with total pve players into same team. It expects me to carry them? No sir, they are heavy as hell. This is what happening right now in season 2.

Why would it be a screw up? It’s only fair that, if you are good, you are rewarded with a good team. And then, to advance, you face any team in your division. If you are better than average in your division, you will move on. If you are not, you will have to wait till your division gets worse (good players ascending) to be closer to the average.

In the past league, the mmr would reward good players with horrible teams to keep your win rate at 50%.

I had a streak where i won 8 pips after winning 4 matches, with two losses in between. My chance to win was so low that i didnt lose points for lost matches, and i won double everytime.

Now, i get matched with decent players against anyone. If they are better, they will win. If we are better, we will win, that’s only fair.

Blackdagger.9670:

So, basically you are saying; Anet wants matches like good ones versus bad ones. And this goes and goes in cycles. *low mmr’s always fight against high mmr’s. *

It’s like capitalism then, Rich will be rich and poor will be poor forever. This is the system that is intended? and there is no mistake? This is what we deserve? Wow just wow.

I managed to hit legend in season 1, ruby games were hard but diamond went easier. And I never had this much of lose streaks before.

How can you design a system that puts players with 5k+ games with total pve players into same team. It expects me to carry them? No sir, they are heavy as hell. This is what happening right now in season 2.

nah, once players with higher mmr move up divisions, low mmr players won’t face them anymore

Aenesthesia.1697:

Why would it be a screw up? It’s only fair that, if you are good, you are rewarded with a good team. And then, to advance, you face any team in your division. If you are better than average in your division, you will move on. If you are not, you will have to wait till your division gets worse (good players ascending) to be closer to the average.

In the past league, the mmr would reward good players with horrible teams to keep your win rate at 50%.

I had a streak where i won 8 pips after winning 4 matches, with two losses in between. My chance to win was so low that i didnt lose points for lost matches, and i won double everytime.

Now, i get matched with decent players against anyone. If they are better, they will win. If we are better, we will win, that’s only fair.

You say it like that the whole match is won on his ability alone. The problem is you can not win a match on your own no matter how good you are.

I played 70 matches, i found MMR’s defect. We always in the same bad classes combination when we lose. And then u will see the same bad ppl stay in ur team again.
I met the same person five times in a row. So somebodies continue lose & lose 10~30 matches, it’s truth. It’s crazy and Miracles.

Oh exactly, I even forgot to mention, If there is a clueless noob teammate in your team and he CLEARLY made your team lost for once, you get him in your team again for the next 2-3 games aswell.

nice right? It just saying: Suffer.

This is marketing strategy to kinda push good pvpers who got burned by the first random games with horrid pve players or trolls in ranked. The intention is that if you truely think you are good but have a kitten tier’ed mmr is that you buy.. that’s right “buy” another account to try to get a fairer shot. Meaning a few better players will have to shell out another $50 or so to get back competitive before all the good players have moved on. Of course this is just my opinion and if this just soo happens to be true, then the system is absolutely workings as intended. Some bad players gets the random nod and get to go on the fast path to success while other good players will have to pay for another account to try to get a fair rating and decent shot.

Either way it a good way for Anet to pull in more money from the pvp community. After saying all of this and trying to make sense of a declining situation. I only hope that what I’ve said here is far from the truth. Again this is my opinion to give people another ideal to think about.

Blackdagger did you take a break for a few weeks or a month right before the season started?

I did and like you I am a pvp vet and am getting matched with brand new players. I may not be legendary, but I am certainly above these team mates I see over and over.

My theory is they implemented the MMR decay. Take a break right before season starts, your rating is reset, and you get put in with the noob teams.

Obviously we’re never going to be able to bring our MMR back up facing any team with noobs as team mates as normally MMR is based off even matches… fail system…

Mightybird.6034:

Blackdagger did you take a break for a few weeks or a month right before the season started?

I did and like you I am a pvp vet and am getting matched with brand new players. I may not be legendary, but I am certainly above these team mates I see over and over.

My theory is they implemented the MMR decay. Take a break right before season starts, your rating is reset, and you get put in with the noob teams.

Obviously we’re never going to be able to bring our MMR back up facing any team with noobs as team mates as normally MMR is based off even matches… fail system…

no I did not take a break before season start. I was playing unranked on that offseason period and was winning many games, was playing with %70 win ratio there. Now I lose 6-7 in a row. Doesn’t make any sense.

Okay, noone answered on my thread so I’ll ask here. Is it still working that when you try to invite somebody, while already being in a spvp match, to a party there won’t be an option for that if they are already in one?
Because today I’ve ran into 3 different premades of 4 (1 the same premade 2 times in a row, with the same solo pug in their team. Inocent coincidence?). Each time I checked all of them were in a party, including 1 supposed PUG with them and they ran as a team.

Blackdagger.9670:

no I did not take a break before season start. I was playing unranked on that offseason period and was winning many games, was playing with %70 win ratio there. Now I lose 6-7 in a row. Doesn’t make any sense.

Strange. One more theory I just read. Brand new players were given average MMR coming into this season instead of starting at 0 (no idea if this is fact).

So if you happen to be average or a bit above average and happened to get paired with them in your first few games, well you’d just keep dropping and be more likely to get worse players.

I’m pretty stumped though, because I am at least average. I use meta builds, I pay attention to the minimap, I don’t do stupid stuff, I’ve PvP’d for 2 years, and have played all classes except warrior. So I should be winning at least 50-50. But like you go on 10-12 loss streaks. and am paired with brand new players that are fighting off point, don’t know what tranq buff is, go ham and die on beast, spam their abilities, etc.

Mightybird.6034:

Blackdagger.9670:

no I did not take a break before season start. I was playing unranked on that offseason period and was winning many games, was playing with %70 win ratio there. Now I lose 6-7 in a row. Doesn’t make any sense.

Strange. One more theory I just read. Brand new players were given average MMR coming into this season instead of starting at 0 (no idea if this is fact).

So if you happen to be average or a bit above average and happened to get paired with them in your first few games, well you’d just keep dropping and be more likely to get worse players.

I’m pretty stumped though, because I am at least average. I use meta builds, I pay attention to the minimap, I don’t do stupid stuff, I’ve PvP’d for 2 years, and have played all classes except warrior. So I should be winning at least 50-50. But like you go on 10-12 loss streaks. and am paired with brand new players that are fighting off point, don’t know what tranq buff is, go ham and die on beast, spam their abilities, etc.

The whole system is flawed. Unless you’re the very top player (lets say 5%), you’re gonna have blowout matches depending on luck. The pip range which is considered by matchmaking is big enough to create unwinnable/unlosable matches. Needless to say this will make MMR completely inaccurate. I honestly have no clue why there was no MMR reset.

Can’t do much more then absolutely agree. Matchmaking is utterly broken at this moment. I will put a two screens, which perfectly illustrate how broken the system is right now. Before anyone jumps and start point fingers at me, yelling how I should just shut up and learn to play instead… well dont waste your breath. I will spell it for you. I am not the best. Very far from it, but I consider myself a decent player. I know my class, I know my rotations and I now basics of pvp. Being playing with guild mates quite a lot on ts orginised teams. My ratio is not something incredible, but its not terribly low either. Its around 50/50, w: 55/ l: 50 roughly. I never EVER had so much lose streaks. NEVER! I am constantly queued with visibly new players and people who straight out have zero idea what they should do in pvp. Talking about condi reaper necro dying, while trying to kill beasts. Yes, that kind of players. Last game I got queued with two players who were either very new or were some trolls with free accounts. No idea! One of them was 400 AP. HOW THE HELL DO I GET queued with someone with 400 ap who autoattack the treb, while I fight 1 DH literally next to him?!

How the hell is this system a system WORKING as intended? Its a massive pile of kitten, thats what it is! Anet, fix your messed up kitten. A lot of players are disgusted by the start of this new season. FIX UP your mess! Until this point I have been nothing but supportive for you since I got the game almost 1 year ago, but this is simply redicilous.

Here is some attachments showing my “amazing” experience so far in your “improved” league. I suppose this is what happens when they start caving in under all the freaking whining around this forums. The matchmaking wasnt that bad last season. Things needed fixing was the pip exploiting and the terrible bunker meta. But no, they just had to “improve” what was not broken, and emerge with this kitten in the end. Well, good freaking job.

For everyone who still will come and say – “Whoa dude learn to play..”, and their usual pick up lines. One question for you. How is it that I started getting all this terrible lose streaks, since the season started?! During season 1 I good enough moved from Amber through Ruby. Struggled a bit a long the way of course, BUT nothing like what I am experiencing right now. I got stuck for a while in ruby and then made to 3rd tier Diamon by the end of the season. So.. I guess my skills, which AGAIN I want to outline are not that of some pro, but decent enough, apparently in some unknown mystical way vanished entirely so now I am winning only 1 out of my 7-8 games. I certainly dont see myself as someone who should be getting queued with people who double or triple cap points or players who gets killed by beasts on Forest map, even thought they are running the strongest necro build.

The fact that players with high win ratio are getting queued with other strong players and are on high win streaks, does not make this horrible, broken system WORKING. Its just means that you are lucky enough, because of your MMR and performance during the last season and the few good games you got on the start of the season. That’s all. Well enjoy it while it last. I know I will push through this kitten to finish ember division and get my backpack. Then I am done with this pathetic excuse of a league, until Anet pick up their kitten together and fix their broken system.

Very top players should have matches depending on luck too if they played solo. They can be any pro they will lose all games too like an avarage player if you group them up with 3-4 other players that are bad. but they play in group with other high skill player and thats why they have better win rate than a good only solo player and they are out of the hell divisions with group q-ing. Solo players suffer, most matches are very one sided and not fun. Its always one team have players that all know teamplay and focus target. The other one is not focusing, let teammates just die, doesn’t even try to help. everyone attack other players while the other team kill everyone 3-4-5vs1.

You get a noob in your team? He wants to try beast at beginning of the game and die to it? No problem, you will get him again into your team next 2-3 games aswell!

Definetly fair, really balanced, epic matchmaking.

Blackdagger.9670:

It’s like capitalism then, Rich will be rich and poor will be poor forever. This is the system that is intended? and there is no mistake? This is what we deserve? Wow just wow.

This is exactly how it is. People who are now winning will always support this system. As soon as they start experiencing what kind of royal kitten of a system this is, they will complain.

The problem is nothing now. Wait for 1 or 2 weeks and then you will see what sort of craptastic system it becomes. You will always be matched against and with the same set of people again and again. I saw that in Diamond last season. I am seeing it in emerald now.

Last season, you could carry 1 or 2 ppl if you had a good setup w/ 3 people in the team because it was bunker meta. If you played an ele or a mes, you could carry people thru. At higher levels past t2 ruby that became harder to do. Now, with this 30 second meta, it’s impossible to carry anyone at any level. So, it’s roll or get rolled.

I completely stopped playing more than 3 games per night. Yesterday, I was paired with a bot in 3 games. It was quite shameful to be honest. After that I gave up. I am happy that I did. It was absolutely ruining my days. I was getting killed by players against whom I did not stand a chance. I was killing players who did not even know how to move.

I think, at a minimum, if ANET wants GW2 to truly become hardcore competitive game, which it is not, they need to segregate solo and team queue before next league season and make an entry barrier to league – rank 80, at least 10 wins in each conquest map.

I simply don’t know what the kitten this season is. People are telling other people not to play now to play later, which is stupid because if it’s bad now, in one week lower divisions will be unplayable if these players keep playing or become a queue time nightmare because of attrition. Bunch of loudmouths and poor devs are ruining the game for many of us.

Rolisteel.1375:

Very top players should have matches depending on luck too if they played solo.

Not a single top tiered player plays solo. They don’t have to. They live this stuff. My 2nd match in this season was SoloQ against Wakkey’s duo. It went downhill since then.

velmeister.4187:

Blackdagger.9670:

It’s like capitalism then, Rich will be rich and poor will be poor forever. This is the system that is intended? and there is no mistake? This is what we deserve? Wow just wow.

This is exactly how it is. People who are now winning will always support this system. As soon as they start experiencing what kind of royal kitten of a system this is, they will complain.

The problem is nothing now. Wait for 1 or 2 weeks and then you will see what sort of craptastic system it becomes. You will always be matched against and with the same set of people again and again. I saw that in Diamond last season. I am seeing it in emerald now.

Last season, you could carry 1 or 2 ppl if you had a good setup w/ 3 people in the team because it was bunker meta. If you played an ele or a mes, you could carry people thru. At higher levels past t2 ruby that became harder to do. Now, with this 30 second meta, it’s impossible to carry anyone at any level. So, it’s roll or get rolled.

I completely stopped playing more than 3 games per night. Yesterday, I was paired with a bot in 3 games. It was quite shameful to be honest. After that I gave up. I am happy that I did. It was absolutely ruining my days. I was getting killed by players against whom I did not stand a chance. I was killing players who did not even know how to move.

I think, at a minimum, if ANET wants GW2 to truly become hardcore competitive game, which it is not, they need to segregate solo and team queue before next league season and make an entry barrier to league – rank 80, at least 10 wins in each conquest map.

I simply don’t know what the kitten this season is. People are telling other people not to play now to play later, which is stupid because if it’s bad now, in one week lower divisions will be unplayable if these players keep playing or become a queue time nightmare because of attrition. Bunch of loudmouths and poor devs are ruining the game for many of us.

Rolisteel.1375:

Very top players should have matches depending on luck too if they played solo.

Not a single top tiered player plays solo. They don’t have to. They live this stuff. My 2nd match in this season was SoloQ against Wakkey’s duo. It went downhill since then.

EXACTLY. Even the ESL pros team up. They have to. Hell they have the ESL to compete in. Not even esl guys can carry a group of beginners.

Loudmouths is right. And I BET they have the devs ear, I know it.

They don’t have to but still its not fair against solo players. It ruins solo players experience. They also want to be at top with “solo play” ( i want too ) How can you tell who is the top 10 or top 20 solo players when most people at top got it with premade party farming soloer teams and some pve premades. Probably there are some unknown names that are just as good as the top tier players if not better. I like to know that things who is the top 10-20 solo necro,reve,ele,engi maybe after that its easier to make new good pvp teams as you know the players that got there alone.

Btw today i got grouped with 1 Amber in my team, Im in Sapphire. How is that possible?

Yes, the matchmaking is truly atrocious. It will drive all the mediocre and casual players away from ranked pvp after they experienced their first long loss streak and figure out that it is no longer worth their time.
But some PvP elitists will not notice this. Guess they want an even smaller pvp population lol. My queue times already went from instant to 3min since season start, so I guess many gave up already.

Rolisteel.1375:

They don’t have to but still its not fair against solo players. It ruins solo players experience. They also want to be at top with “solo play” ( i want too ) How can you tell who is the top 10 or top 20 solo players when most people at top got it with premade party farming soloer teams and some pve premades. Probably there are some unknown names that are just as good as the top tier players if not better. I like to know that things who is the top 10-20 solo necro,reve,ele,engi maybe after that its easier to make new good pvp teams as you know the players that got there alone.

Btw today i got grouped with 1 Amber in my team, Im in Sapphire. How is that possible?

This, couldn’t agree … wanted to solo my way to legendary but couldn’t even get out of AMBER!!! had to duo my way through Amber. Just sad.

Malediktus.9250:

Yes, the matchmaking is truly atrocious. It will drive all the mediocre and casual players away from ranked pvp after they experienced their first long loss streak and figure out that it is no longer worth their time.
But some PvP elitists will not notice this. Guess they want an even smaller pvp population lol. My queue times already went from instant to 3min since season start, so I guess many gave up already.

This as well, there is no way a pro pver is going to stick in rank after a 15-20 or 72 loss streak

I did it solo to Sapphire tier2. Can’t get to t3 atm. Most of the time grouped with players don’t know teamplay, focus, how to survive better to not die in 2sec even with tanky classes. Matchmaking put me most of the time in group with people that are not teamplayers against peoples that are teamplayers. So something is wrong. But rarely i get a team of teamplayers. Today i only had 1 match that was fun because both teams were really good teamplayers and the game actually was very exciting with that good teamplay from both sides. After that game a bad losing streak started that just didn’t stop.

The system is completely totally broken.

If it worked then there would be more matches that ended with score that was reasonably close. If the system worked properly then you could expect to see a lot of 500/450 or at least 500/350, but the majority of the matches end up being 500/150 or less.

Malediktus.9250:

Yes, the matchmaking is truly atrocious. It will drive all the mediocre and casual players away from ranked pvp after they experienced their first long loss streak and figure out that it is no longer worth their time.
But some PvP elitists will not notice this. Guess they want an even smaller pvp population lol. My queue times already went from instant to 3min since season start, so I guess many gave up already.

hahaha I notice the queue times are longer as well! You happy now elitists?

My last 3 games:

17 rezzes
14 rezzes
8 rezzes

I seem to make up my whole team MMR some games, or at least it feels like it.

One of those games, a thief managed to down 2 allies, so I rez and go to run away, they downed again, so I rez and ran off because another ally (4 on point vs thief) came along and those 3 got wiped to a single thief and abused me about not helping more on point… Playing a Druid, my pet killed that said thief… MY PET KILLED THE THIEF THAT 3 PEOPLE COULDN’T EVEN KILL.

Malediktus.9250:

Y It will drive all the mediocre and casual players away from ranked pvp after they experienced their first long loss streak and figure out that it is no longer worth their time.
.

Losing like this is not worth anyone’s time.

My wife: “Honey, what are you doing?”
Me: “Honey, finishing up my obligatory 3 matches loss for daily meta progress.”
My wife: “Uh. Ok honey.”

I have a good wife.

In all honesty, if I launched a release like this at my work, I’d have to clean up my desk the very next day. My client complains about 5 minutes downtime/per week because it breaks the SLA and my manager compels me to do RCA to come up with every imaginable reason why I could not avert a customer sat kitten up. I wish I had a job at ANET.

I think some people still don’t know how the matchmaking system works right now. So I’ll explain it again for the 100th time.

Quoted from their season 2 post:
“we’ll still use your MMR to place you on teams with similarly skilled players (from your division point range) to help ensure that you’re not forced to play with individuals that are of a much higher or lower skill than you.”

Notice it never says it will consider the MMR of all 10 matched players, instead it just considers your own team.

The way the system currently works is it only considers MMR on your own team and not the full 10 players. So let’s say there’s 10 people queuing within an acceptable division range, 5 players are around 800 MMR and the other 5 are around 1000 MMR. Due to the fact that the system only considers making a team of 5 of similar MMR players at a time, the 5 800 MMR players will be put on one team and the 5 1000 MMR players will be on the other team. So what you get is high skilled players on 1 team and less skilled players on the other. Of course the result is the 800 MMR team getting stomped.

It’s really a really weird and flawed system if it the matchmaking process never considers the MMR of your opponents. Also in theory, this system will balance itself out over time as eventually the low MMR players will be the only ones in that pip/division search range so you will get even matches. The real question is….How long will that take? Not to mention the time it takes for the thing to balance out will result in really garbage quality games that no one enjoys. Is enduring this time period of garbage quality games worth it? In my opinion, no…… Just give us season 1 style with improved smurfing and anti-stack measures.

2 months seasons are definitely not long enough to balance the system. If it takes 2 weeks thats already 25% of the season wasted.

The entire game is a waste. For the next 2 months expect to see nothing but necro’s, guards, revs, and engi’s. Anything else is told to commit suicide in rl.

Malediktus.9250:

2 months seasons are definitely not long enough to balance the system. If it takes 2 weeks thats already 25% of the season wasted.

This is actually what my doubt is. I really doubt if 2 months is actually enough time to sort everyone out.

In my eyes, there is almost no way this is a mistake. This is what Anet must’ve intended the system to do. No one can screw up that hard.

ANet is a solid object lesson in “never say never” They can do anything if they put their mind to it, and clearly they were working around the clock on this one.

Ohoni.6057:

In my eyes, there is almost no way this is a mistake. This is what Anet must’ve intended the system to do. No one can screw up that hard.

ANet is a solid object lesson in “never say never” They can do anything if they put their mind to it, and clearly they were working around the clock on this one.

Thanks this made me chuckle.

Is it normal to lose every single match since the season started? If it is where’s the fun in that, at least last season you got some wins in this is horrible starting to really hate this game

This is pretty much how every match goes these days

Hello. I just want to give you people the opinion of someone who stopped playing at the end of season 1 and started playing again yesterday, at night. I’m a solo player, and I’ve played 16 ranked games so far and won all of them easily (only 1 of them was challenging). New matchmaking allow good/excellent players to rank up very fast, even tho it is a bit boring. I mean, I don’t get any challenging ennemies, but at least I have good hopes that after 20 or 30 more wins I’ll get to interesting games.
To all of those who complain about “lose streaks” : It may (may is the key word here) be a l2p issue, don’t you think ? since the golden season of the golden bunker meta is gone, the old bunker players have to learn the game…
Only my opinion, tho. And yes, climbing is very easy compared to last season. Matchmaking is fair, if i’m emerald i play with/against emeralds, so I carry and win. Repeat the process until you get where you belong.

Oh, one good thing : the amount of salt amoung players appeared to have decreased significantly. I often have some cool talks with the guys i stomped during the whole game (the 2 players trying to get me out of their close node but kept dying…). Notice the thief in chat (attachments), it’s really a good feeling compared to last season

(btw i don’t know how to prove that i’m not a liar, i can’t see more than 10 matches in history, 16/0 atm, stop being salty about anet & enjoy the game ? peace)

EDIT : I played last season casually, only got to rubis, so the “you’re getting carried by your precedent mmr” argument doesn’t work here (i’ve seen this kind of bullkitten in other sections.. salt needs to go)

xZyemto.3928:

Hello. I just want to give you people the opinion of someone who stopped playing at the end of season 1 and started playing again yesterday, at night. I’m a solo player, and I’ve played 16 ranked games so far and won all of them easily (only 1 of them was challenging). New matchmaking allow good/excellent players to rank up very fast, even tho it is a bit boring. I mean, I don’t get any challenging ennemies, but at least I have good hopes that after 20 or 30 more wins I’ll get to interesting games.
To all of those who complain about “lose streaks” : It may (may is the key word here) be a l2p issue, don’t you think ? since the golden season of the golden bunker meta is gone, the old bunker players have to learn the game…
Only my opinion, tho. And yes, climbing is very easy compared to last season. Matchmaking is fair, if i’m emerald i play with/against emeralds, so I carry and win. Repeat the process until you get where you belong.

Oh, one good thing : the amount of salt amoung players appeared to have decreased significantly. I often have some cool talks with the guys i stomped during the whole game (the 2 players trying to get me out of their close node but kept dying…). Notice the thief in chat (attachments), it’s really a good feeling compared to last season

(btw i don’t know how to prove that i’m not a liar, i can’t see more than 10 matches in history, 16/0 atm, stop being salty about anet & enjoy the game ? peace)

Read my post earlier. Sometimes people that get stomped, it isn’t their fault as the game puts them in an almost guaranteed lose game. If you read what I posted earlier, no way in hell is the matchmaking fair right now. You can’t call a team of 5 low skilled players vs. 5 high skilled players a fair fight.

xZyemto.3928:

…

Finally, a post that’s completely accurate.

I’m a solo player, and I’ve played 16 ranked games so far and won all of them easily (only 1 of them was challenging). New matchmaking allow good/excellent players to rank up very fast, even tho it is a bit boring.

How would you know that? Do you assume that you are one of these “good/excellent” players, and that’s why you’re rising? Could it not be that you are no more “good/excellent” than the players who are struggling, you just happen to end up on “good/excellent” teams, and since you win those matches, you get placed on even more “good/excellent” team, and so on, giving you a glide path to Legendary?

To all of those who complain about “lose streaks” : It may (may is the key word here) be a l2p issue, don’t you think ?

Nope. It’s a team sport. If you end up on a team that is bad, you will lose, no amount of personal skill will make much difference. You might be able to lose 150/500 rather than 50/500, but you’ll lose nonetheless because the better team opposing you will hold 1.5 points the entire match while you can at best keep one alive, on average. You could argue that the entire team you’re assigned should “learn to play,” but no individual member is responsible for that if he already “knows how to play.”

Only my opinion, tho. And yes, climbing is very easy compared to last season.

For you, since you are on their “by system” path to the top, but not for those that aren’t on that track, through no fault of their own. It’s even more hilarious when people in your position seem to think that they’ve “earned” it by actually being more skillful than those less fortunate. It’s like trustfund babies all over again.

@Ohoni
You shouldn’t generalise that much dude. I don’t know you, you don’t know me, you don’t know how i play. Don’t make easy assumptions. This happens too much in this forum, really :/
And if you want to blame the “system”, do it correctly. Bring statitics, numbers, some elements of proof. Your response is made of personnal opinion and no facts, it’s worth nothing, unfortunately.

And, hum… if the system was trully broken, even recognized excellent players would have lose streaks and wouldn’t climb the ladder ? Is it the case ?
Btw, i just got to sapphire o/ (20/0)

Ohoni.6057:

How would you know that? Do you assume that you are one of these “good/excellent” players, and that’s why you’re rising? Could it not be that you are no more “good/excellent” than the players who are struggling, you just happen to end up on “good/excellent” teams, and since you win those matches, you get placed on even more “good/excellent” team, and so on, giving you a glide path to Legendary?

Winning one or two in a row is randomly getting on a team with good/excellent players. Winning 15 in a row means your team is obviously consistently far better than the other team. The only constant in all 15 games is you, so obviously you are a good player.

Ohoni.6057:

Nope. It’s a team sport. If you end up on a team that is bad, you will lose, no amount of personal skill will make much difference. You might be able to lose 150/500 rather than 50/500, but you’ll lose nonetheless because the better team opposing you will hold 1.5 points the entire match while you can at best keep one alive, on average. You could argue that the entire team you’re assigned should “learn to play,” but no individual member is responsible for that if he already “knows how to play.”

Losing 2 or 3 games is randomly getting a bad team. Losing 15 games means your team is consistently much worse than the other team. The only constant in those 15 games is you, so clearly you are bad. We’ve had this conversation before though, and you’ve denied the obvious logic of it so I doubt this will get anywhere.

Suffice to say, blaming your record on anyone but yourself is nothing but self-delusion that will result in you never getting better. Own up to your bad play and figure out how to fix it, don’t go complaining on the forums about how the matchmaking system is making you lose. Trying to claim that people who are winning are being carried by the system is just ridiculous and immature. People that win consistently are clearly better than those who don’t, that’s simply how it works. Deal with it.

Winning one or two in a row is randomly getting on a team with good/excellent players. Winning 15 in a row means your team is obviously consistently far better than the other team. The only constant in all 15 games is you, so obviously you are a good player.

Losing 2 or 3 games is randomly getting a bad team. Losing 15 games means your team is consistently much worse than the other team. The only constant in those 15 games is you, so clearly you are bad. We’ve had this conversation before though, and you’ve denied the obvious logic of it so I doubt this will get anywhere.

Suffice to say, blaming your record on anyone but yourself is nothing but self-delusion that will result in you never getting better. Own up to your bad play and figure out how to fix it, don’t go complaining on the forums about how the matchmaking system is making you lose. Trying to claim that people who are winning are being carried by the system is just ridiculous and immature. People that win consistently are clearly better than those who don’t, that’s simply how it works. Deal with it.

^
This. This is pure logic, there is absolutely nothing to argue against. Ty sir. You said in words what I couldn’t formulate.

@Ohoni
You shouldn’t generalise that much dude. I don’t know you, you don’t know me, you don’t know how i play. Don’t make easy assumptions.

And yet you are the one making easy assumptions that "new matchmaking allow good/excellent players to rank up very fast, " and To all of those who complain about “lose streaks” : It may (may is the key word here) be a l2p issue, don’t you think ?"

And, hum… if the system was trully broken, even recognized excellent players would have lose streaks and wouldn’t climb the ladder ? Is it the case ?

The basis of the system seems a bit wonky. People that ended last season (regardless of skill) in the upper tiers seem to be advancing much easier than those who ended last season in the lower tiers, and often that has more to do with time spent grinding the system than with individual skill. I just know that in my experience I’ve been placed in a lot of matches where victory was hopeless, no matter how well I personally do, and plenty of others have been reporting the same, so something is clearly up.

Winning one or two in a row is randomly getting on a team with good/excellent players. Winning 15 in a row means your team is obviously consistently far better than the other team. The only constant in all 15 games is you, so obviously you are a good player.

No, that’s nonsense. That actually proves the opposite point you seem to believe it does. If a really great player is truly randomly placed each match, then from time to time he’d find himself on a hopeless team, and lose the match even if he personally killed twice as many players as anyone on the opposing team and held points or whatever the maximum total contribution a single character could make. In a fair distribution, even the very best players out there would lose a match from time to time in solo queue.

What seems to be happening instead is that certain players keep getting matched with other good players. And since they win that match, the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” And then he wins that match, and the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” and repeat until he gets into the top tiers, whether or not that player was significantly responsible for his team’s outcome in each match (and therefore better than average himself).

Meanwhile, say an equally good player is matched early on with lower skill players, and his team cannot win that first match. The system says “this guys not so good, let’s group him with losers next time.” and so he loses the next match. And so the system goes “this guys not so good, let’s group him with losers next time,” but even so, they manage to do ok, win that match, so the system goes “he’s better than I thought, but still pretty bad, let’s group him with slightly better losers next time,” and it’s still lopsided, he loses again, and we’re back where we started.

The system rewards success WITH success, and failure with more failure, so there’s a steamroll effect that causes the system to distort very far away from “to each according to his skill.”

If you win or lose 15 games, the only constant is not you, you can only be accountable for 20% or less of your team’s total performance. The constant is the matchmaking system in place.

Suffice to say, blaming your record on anyone but yourself is nothing but self-delusion that will result in you never getting better. Own up to your bad play and figure out how to fix it, don’t go complaining on the forums about how the matchmaking system is making you lose.

So how do I play badly? You apparently know for a fact that I do, so surely you can tell me exactly what I’m doing wrong, when I can solo-hold a point the entire game against 2-3 enemies, but the rest of my team can’t manage to capture or hold a single other location. What am I doing wrong to make them not be better players?

Trying to claim that people who are winning are being carried by the system is just ridiculous and immature. People that win consistently are clearly better than those who don’t, that’s simply how it works. Deal with it.

The only think more ridiculous and immature would be to claim otherwise.

Ohoni.6057:

No, that’s nonsense. That actually proves the opposite point you seem to believe it does. If a really great player is truly randomly placed each match, then from time to time he’d find himself on a hopeless team, and lose the match even if he personally killed twice as many players as anyone on the opposing team and held points or whatever the maximum total contribution a single character could make. In a fair distribution, even the very best players out there would lose a match from time to time in solo queue.

What seems to be happening instead is that certain players keep getting matched with other good players. And since they win that match, the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” And then he wins that match, and the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” and repeat until he gets into the top tiers, whether or not that player was significantly responsible for his team’s outcome in each match (and therefore better than average himself).

Your entire argument boils down to ‘The system is randomly picking some people and making them win’. This is the very quintessence of absurdity.

Fay.2357:

Ohoni.6057:

No, that’s nonsense. That actually proves the opposite point you seem to believe it does. If a really great player is truly randomly placed each match, then from time to time he’d find himself on a hopeless team, and lose the match even if he personally killed twice as many players as anyone on the opposing team and held points or whatever the maximum total contribution a single character could make. In a fair distribution, even the very best players out there would lose a match from time to time in solo queue.

What seems to be happening instead is that certain players keep getting matched with other good players. And since they win that match, the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” And then he wins that match, and the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” and repeat until he gets into the top tiers, whether or not that player was significantly responsible for his team’s outcome in each match (and therefore better than average himself).

Your entire argument boils down to ‘The system is randomly picking some people and making them win’. This is the very quintessence of absurdity.

It’s true though, that’s the sad part.

Zenral.3958:

Fay.2357:

Ohoni.6057:

No, that’s nonsense. That actually proves the opposite point you seem to believe it does. If a really great player is truly randomly placed each match, then from time to time he’d find himself on a hopeless team, and lose the match even if he personally killed twice as many players as anyone on the opposing team and held points or whatever the maximum total contribution a single character could make. In a fair distribution, even the very best players out there would lose a match from time to time in solo queue.

What seems to be happening instead is that certain players keep getting matched with other good players. And since they win that match, the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” And then he wins that match, and the system says “hey, this guy is good, let’s match him with more good players!” and repeat until he gets into the top tiers, whether or not that player was significantly responsible for his team’s outcome in each match (and therefore better than average himself).

Your entire argument boils down to ‘The system is randomly picking some people and making them win’. This is the very quintessence of absurdity.

It’s true though, that’s the sad part.

[citation needed]

Your entire argument boils down to ‘The system is randomly picking some people and making them win’. This is the very quintessence of absurdity.

Not entirely randomly, but certainly based on factors that are outside a player’s direct control. The evidence currently points to your tier placing last season seems to get you on better teams this season, so if you placed in diamond then you’re more likely to get placed on winning teams, while if you placed in emerald then you’re more likely to end up on bad teams. And you might argue “well, people in diamond are clearly better players so they deserve it,” but keep in mind that a lot of tier-grinding had to do with time spent and exploits used. A player that played a dozen matches a day, and exploited the MMRs to get favorable s1 match-ups, would end up in a much higher s1 tier than and equally skilled player who only played a few matches a day, some of the time, and didn’t abuse those tactics.

Regardless of how the match-ups are determined, there seems to be fairly clear evidence that some players are repeatedly being placed on “strong” teams, and others repeatedly placed on “weak” teams, or at the very least alternating wildly between the two extremes. “Git gud” just doesn’t account for that.

Let’s say you can accurately rank each player on a scale of 1-10, a 10 being a pro-class player. He might be very good, but if you put a “10” player on a team with a bunch of 2-3s, and they have to face a team of 6-7s, then even though the one player is significantly better than anyone on the opposing team, his team is still likely to lose, because that one player can’t turn the tides like that. Conversely, if a 2 ends up on a team of 7-8’s, while they are matched against a team of 3-4s, then even though that player is worse than anyone on the opposing team, his team is likely to win anyway because the rest of that team could carry one bad player.

Now I’m not saying that most of the complainers are 10s, maybe not even 7s, but I believe that they are better than the average on their team, and that the opposing teams have a much higher average, enough that it is holding them back more than their own skill would merit, and likewise a lot of players that brag of infinite win streaks are hitting way above their own weight class due to the system working in their favor. They might deserve to win more than they lose, but very very few players actually deserve to have win streaks of 5+. If they are achieving them, then something must be unfair about the match-ups they’re facing, and if that’s true, then the opposite must be as well.

Blackdagger.9670:

It’s like capitalism then, Rich will be rich and poor will be poor forever. This is the system that is intended? and there is no mistake? This is what we deserve?

By how JS manages the game economy and Anet as a whole, I’d say your assumption sounds about right.

What I’m finding very odd is that I’m stuck in a tier. I get 1 pip away and lose the whole tier. I get 1 pip away and lose the whole tier. I get 1 pip away and lose the whole tier. It’s just keeps cycling like this all day long.

DeWolfe.2174:

What I’m finding very odd is that I’m stuck in a tier. I get 1 pip away and lose the whole tier. I get 1 pip away and lose the whole tier. I get 1 pip away and lose the whole tier. It’s just keeps cycling like this all day long.

Sounds like roughly a 50% winrate, which would be expected if you’ve arrived at a tier reflecting your average skill level.