Guild Wars 2

tl;dr necro nerfs, overall balance changes were the exact opposite I was hoping to see (along with many others I would think) and killed the only reason I was still playing this game. Probably done for the foreseeable future

I’m not a wvw player. I was primarily a pve player, but due to the state of pve (lack of any new content since HoT launch and lack of living world from 15 months), I went to my much more less played pvp. But with the new reward tracks and division system, I finally had the incentive I needed to play pvp. The ONLY reason I was playing the games since ~January at all was because of pvp, which is far more replayable than any pve content in the game.

Season 2 was a huge step forward in the right direction for overall quality of pvp and balance. Further improvements did need to happen, but the outlook of spvp was a good one. Some things were imbalanced, but not by much.

This patches balance were the complete opposite of the changes I wanted to see, and I’m pretty sure the opposite of what most people wanted to see. It’s very obvious the changes were intended for the wvw audience, and that’s great for that crowd, but it set pvp back to a worse state than season 1 imo. If in 6 months the game is in a worse state, thats a bad sign… I’d be ok if the changes were bad but low impact, but the changes were just devastating in pvp.

In my mind the two goals for a healthy pvp game is having build diversity and counterplay. Bunker meta is inherently anti-counterplay- its a just a ’I’ll heal everything and never die’ while not even trying to kill other people. That would be fine if there was a class that punished that kind of play, but no class is even close to being able to say that. Just look at all the hubbub of season 1 to see why this unhealthy. Now look at the changes- offense was nerfed across the board (necro/engi and rev less so), but the defense which is out of control right now gets untouched. Without hotfixes, its looking very possible s3 will be as bad if not worse than s1. In fact, if that band-aid fix of no class stacking didn’t exist, I’m 100% certain nobody would ever die outside of moas (which still may be the case for s3).

The best thing for pvp is to have as much class and build viability as possible. Season 2, only 6 classes were ‘meta’, but guardian was verry close to being competitive. They are the only class that can reliably fight mesmers and if some classes reflects got toned down they would have been fine imo. Instead they got nerfed, removing their hope of being viable. Thieves have been pushed forward a bit and we’ll see how that plays out. Warriors are better but I don’t think they are good enough yet to even take a necro’s place on a team which is saying something.

But necros have been gutted in pvp. Theres no build anymore that allows them to apply enough pressure while have any kind of survivabilty (which is already the lowest of any class). Engis pretty much WERE slick shoes, and while it definitely was OP and needed a nerf, all kill potential engis had was gutted along with it. With both of these classes being so much worse than the top 4 now, you really only have 4 viable classes (maybe a fifth with thief… but I doubt it.)

Pvp desperately needed defense to be nerfed, but eles (already top 4 class), was untouched, revs got a slap on the wrist, stability change is huge improvement to overall defense, search and rescue got nerfed but it wasn’t even necessary before as druids are so good with glyphs already. The biggest problem with engis was their defense, which are unchanged, and the thing I personally felt should have been nerfed for necros (if anything) was rise, because that alone is what makes them live while being supported with an ele.

1. class by a huge margin in solo q was condi mesmer-#1 duelist, #1 utility, and no real weaknesses substantial enough to matter gets BUFFED (not signifcantly but still, mind blown). Heck, if class stacking was still around you’d probably be seeing 5 condi mesmers in esl right about now.

The map changes to skyhammer/spirit watch are awesome, but does it matter when class balance is so bad that pvp itself is unplayable?

The 4/19 patch should be known as, reroll mesmer or gfto, and that’s what I’m doing. I love the game so this is such a bitter pill to swallow for me.

Another reaper crying because a little nerf chill ….

Sounds like that you was playing 2 of the most face roll class’s In the game and now have to actually play the game insead.

If you was a true necro player you would not sit there and give up on day 2 also making this thread. Adapt and change your build. Us thieves and warriors have been a laughing stock for months and probably still are yet we still try.

Necro is only considered faceroll in lower tiers. Necro have bad defenses so it will always be a class that can be contained. Necros only defence is literally how many times can i get punched in the face before i go down. Necros are only strong when paired with eles.

Ele support is beyond strong and allows alot of classses to survive. Now i appreciate the support it brings but it can be overwhelming at times. I still dont get why they are allowed clerics ammy ( the last bunker ammy in the game). Real faceroll comes from rev and mesmer.

I like the changes to war, brings them back ( i personaly hate when theif is strong as i think entire pvp is less fun) but basicly theif is put in a good position.

But yea, nurfing offence and not nurfing defences (mainly active defences like mes and rev have and not necros) is not the direction this game needs for pvp.

Also the “little chill nurf” was basilcy 33% less application and 40% of its original dmg (assuming u chill 2x). Chill is basicly 1/3 of what it used to be.

New stab changes baffle me. I would leave it and just turn rev staff 5 into a knockdown.

mesmer insipiration line makes them want for a heal or condi cure as they spam both naturally as they deal their dmg.

Revanant sword 2 is bonkers. It does more than guard bow 2 did but has shorter cd and less of an animation and remains the same.

guard needs some qol changes with their sustain option and virtues. DH f2 could be an evade and f3 could just not be interruptable or when it is interrupted just be a normal 5s interrupt instead of full cd. Also zeal and honor lines should be straightened out a bit on which is the symbols line o-0!

theif seems good and well see where tehse changes take it.
druid is fine. snr got hit hard but well see how much it matters.

Engi i am not knowledge enough to comment.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Sounds like that you was playing 2 of the most face roll class’s In the game and now have to actually play the game insead.

If you was a true necro player you would not sit there and give up on day 2 also making this thread. Adapt and change your build. Us thieves and warriors have been a laughing stock for months and probably still are yet we still try.

Rap Tiger.1257:

Another reaper crying because a little nerf chill ….

I like when people comment who haven’t read patch notes they are referencing, the post they are commenting on, or have ever actually played pvp above amber.

KreatE.7612:

tl;dr NECRO NERFS, overall balance changes were the EXACT OPPOSITE I was hoping to see (along with many others I would think) and killed the only reason I was still playing this game. Probably done for the foreseeable future

How anyone could think Necros would not get nerfed is beyond me.

Then again ANET didn’t nerf Mesmers so i guess anything is possible

Rap Tiger.1257:

Another reaper crying because a little nerf chill ….

Except it was a huge nerf.

Just another player ignorant of balance changes.

KreatE.7612:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Sounds like that you was playing 2 of the most face roll class’s In the game and now have to actually play the game insead.

If you was a true necro player you would not sit there and give up on day 2 also making this thread. Adapt and change your build. Us thieves and warriors have been a laughing stock for months and probably still are yet we still try.

Rap Tiger.1257:

Another reaper crying because a little nerf chill ….

I like when people comment who haven’t read patch notes they are referencing, the post they are commenting on, or have ever actually played pvp above amber.

I got to ruby s1! I am just kidding, I hardly play pvp now a days because standing on points with some form of bunker is not my sort of fun.

I wish that what OP said about PvP, replay value being much higher than any PvE content, was a factor to assign dev time. We could then see more emphasis on PvP dev time such as (split) class balance, (re)design, and new content/QoL, like the bare minimum quality of life of having a free for all area in the mists for everyone to fight each other while waiting in queue.

Otherwise, I like that this patch introduced more nerfs than buffs: it’s a first in probably 2 years! But it’s not enough, keep them coming, other things are in deep need of a nerf. But, please, rebalance some of the harshest ones, like the gutted Deathly Chill, after you already gutted Blighter’s Boon, leaving no fallback. I even saw some reaper going back to base necro (which is horrendous).

Just halving chill damage and reducing chill uptime would have been a good start. Also, the stability nerf (8/20 to 5/25) hurts like hell and is totally unwarranted: necro needs stability, and this one is limited to shroud as it stops pulsing outside of it. Isn’t that a big enough limitation ?

Anyway, I hope to see another patch quickly after the feedback of this week.

Ara.4569:

Just halving chill damage and reducing chill uptime would have been a good start.

Even though i dont play necro, this is what i would have expected. A reduction in chill damage done and duration. Swapping to bleeds was a big surprise.

Awww tearful reapers. This is priceless after all the annoyance you and your brethren gave me while i was climbing the god kitten ladder. I must say, after seeing you getting corrected, which shows how ultimately bad 99% of the reapers were i sleep better at night

I don’t understand why people think necros having chill uptime is some huge problem.

Every single kitten condi class in the game has 1-2 condi type that they put out in large amounts.

Condi Guard -burn
Condi Engi – burn with minor amounts of bleed and poison
Condi Beserker – burn with a side of bleed
Condi revenant – torment with a side of poison
Condi Mesmer – confusion with a side of torment
Condi theif – bleed and poison
Condi ele (this really should be a thing) – bleed and burn

Crinn.7864:

I don’t understand why people think necros having chill uptime is some huge problem.

Every single kitten condi class in the game has 1-2 condi type that they put out in large amounts.

Condi Guard -burn
Condi Engi – burn with minor amounts of bleed and poison
Condi Beserker – burn with a side of bleed
Condi revenant – torment with a side of poison
Condi Mesmer – confusion with a side of torment
Condi theif – bleed and poison
Condi ele (this really should be a thing) – bleed and burn

Except no one hardly played the builds below in S2

Condi Guard -burn (LOL Wut?)
Condi Engi – burn with minor amounts of bleed and poison (yeah handicap yourself by not playing power hammer, sure)
Condi Beserker – burn with a side of bleed (LOL warriors)
Condi revenant – torment with a side of poison (saw like 2 of them the whole season)

Where as there were 2 necros in every team (sometimes 4) in diamond and below tiers

A few things that don’t make sense to me…

• Deathly Chill nerf. Of course it needed to happen, but why completely overdo it? With it now causing bleeds instead of chill damage, the trait took a huge hit on damage and now is more easily cleansed since it will just stack with the rest of the bleeds.

• Slick Shoes, also needed a nerf, but again overdone. Would have been much simpler to have the slick shoes puddle consumed when it cc’d a player, that way the same puddle couldn’t chain cc a player. But now once you are hit by it you can completely ignore it, and this skill is nothing more than a tickle of you have stability. Also, this really hurt Engies in PvE for no reason.

• Gadget buffs, I feel like they weren’t even trying with this. It’s like they don’t even understand why gadgets obsolete in the Engineer’s kitten nal.