Guild Wars 2

On the other hand, you have to understand that they are sick of seeing PvE players that are dispatched everywhere due to the teribad MMR. No matter where you are on the leaderboards, you will get paired with and against PvE players : in that case, the team with the less PvE players will most often win.

So yes, I completely understand that they are sick of explaining how to play the game while playing it (which is quite a feat) every single game. ArenaNet should have thought and tried to fix the LB before making that PvE patch.

currently im rank 67 (pre 50) and right now im in a tpvp group with rank 20-40. sometimes its frustrating but if you explain them stuff (and carry them a bit too) it works better than you would expect. we managed to defeat some stronger enemy groups and it really surprised me^^

i think there is toxity because of all those crap meta builds you have to deal with day in and day out. yelling at low levels is maybe just a way to let off some steam. but what i dont like is when low level players dont listen and think they can do everything better on their own.

The very real problem is not in it’s community. It’s in the match-ups. Example: I was top 400 Solo Q for few weeks in a row pre-patch k. Patch came in, boom, getting teamed up with people who don’t know anything about Team Arena or Solo Q or it’s teamwork. Capping one freecap with 4. Staying there waiting.. Now my ranking is 9xx or lower.. Why do ranked ppl get matched with unranked r5 players anyway? There is a reason why Anet removed the ability to see other ppl ranks after the match. They knew ranked ppl were gonna rage because they’re losing their leaderboard ranking so Anet decided to hide the problem. Match ups should be based on tourni games won/lost ratio or something. I love new people in PvP, really. But I rly hate having beginners in my party when i’m competitive. It’s just the same the elitist PvE’rs wwant experienced +5k AP zerkers in their party to do Speedrun. They get what they want through LFG. Let the PvP’ers have fair match-ups then..

And I get that. The MMR matching isn’t great. I’ve ended up in some frustrating matches before with people that will all flock to home, and then all leave after it is capped. But we have to work with the system we have, and provide feedback to Anet. Not take it out on these players who really don’t know any better.

If we want that to change let’s look at the root cause of the issue : Matchmaking is flawed. We know that we get matches where the people are of vastly different skill levels. We get matches where one side is all condi pu mesmers. It’s frustrating no doubt. But we have to provide feedback and offer solutions that are well thought out and not anger based.

The problem is that there is no great way for a player to learn how to do PvP at this point before jumping into the high end matches. Hotjoin teaches them the mechanics of maps, but also reinforces bad habbits like zerging. Taking away the phoney point system I think would help to lighten the zerg teaching. We are constantly told this is a team format, so why do we have individual scores? You either win or lose. And the points are awarded for doing things that oftentimes don’t actually help your team.

Those are the types of things we need to do though if we want things to get better. Not hate on newer players.

The problem is that you depend so much on your team-mates to win, it gets frustrating, seeing people just going randomly killing people off point and zerging to w/e they feel like, trying to cap with you when there is no one around (no it doesn’t cap any faster), losing outnumbered fights when they have the number advantage etc..etc….

All this in solo Q, not even hotjoin

Conquest has many nuances, way to complex to explain before a game, let alone mid-game. There needs to be better guidance. And ofcourse, hotjoin learned some bad habits too.

+1 to you Eleshazar. I totally agree.

That’s so true. I’ve turn off the chat because of all this newcomer slapping. The game is amazing now. Those trolls don’t know anything about respect and helping out. Tutoring new comers is a great way to learn the game since you actually have understand and word it properly yourself.

We should start a PvP guild for enjoyable people :P

Akeif.7491:

That’s so true. I’ve turn off the chat because of all this newcomer slapping. The game is amazing now. Those trolls don’t know anything about respect and helping out. Tutoring new comers is a great way to learn the game since you actually have understand and word it properly yourself.

We should start a PvP guild for enjoyable people :P

Try looking at it from another point of view: Some of us try to actually explain to people why they’re doing something they should probably not be doing but in return all we get is a response that has absolutely no relevance to PvP whatsoever, not seldom has it included comparisons in the amount of purple items either player has equipped.

I’m happy we’ve got more people playing PvP, I’m not happy that quite a bunch of those newcomers consider their Twilight a confirmation of their knowledge of how conquest works.

You’re assuming way too much. Do you know how often I have tried to nicely explain things to new comers only for them to:

a) Not respond at all (most common)
b) Tell me to keep quiet

Just to make sure that they can see what I’m saying, I sometimes type with /s instead of /t. So when I’m capping close and another guys is standing on the point with me, I’ll say “/s go!” Only to have no response at all.

Then I’ll even PM them in case they still haven’t seen it. Still no response. I’m sick and tired of explaining things only to be greeted with radio silence. I’ll still keep trying though since there might be someone who will listen.

In short, your attempt to characterize most of us veteran players as evil and “toxic” and all the new comers as hapless well meaning innocents in PvP is biased and extremely flawed.

^ I have to agree that it’s not only coming from the pvp-side. I’ve seen pve-heroes assuming things, which are completely not true, but yet resorting to some next gen flaming.

The problem isn’t entirely the toxicity of some members, because this exists in every single competitive game scenario. The problem is new players are getting matched with veteran players on tournaments, thus causing this situation.

Is “toxic” the new wotm ?

Everyone uses it these last couple of days.

The problem isn’t entirely the toxicity of some members, because this exists in every single competitive game scenario.

I’ve seen this come up over and over again as some kind of justification. Just because this happens in other games, can’t we try to be better than them?

Well I’m only speaking from my own empirical evidence which is bound to be flawed. But I can say that in the past few days I’ve played over 100 tourney games and the results have been overwhelmingly not helpful. You have to treat each player differently. You can’t have a bad experience with one new player and assume they all are going to be like that.

The other thing that you can’t assume is that they are in fact new (sure if they are doubling up on a cap then you can be pretty sure). I’ve seen people criticize someone for going far when the team is losing a team fight on mid and a thief goes to decap. I’ve seen people criticize someone for defending home. So there are a lot of people offering “advice” that may not be the greatest advice to who they think are “new” people simply because they don’t play the same strategy as you.

I’m not trying to demonize all of sPvP veterans, and I see where people are getting frustrated, we all agree the matchmaking needs work, and they need a way to teach people sPvP without just throwing them in cold turkey. All I’m trying to do is get you to ask each and everyone of yourselves if you have treated someone poorly these last couple of days because of your frustration. I know that it happens to the best of us (I’ve definitely lost my cool with people in this game before when I was frustrated), I’m just asking everyone to keep in mind that these are people, and they are different people. Treat each interaction with respect first, and not based on your past experiences. It is after all a game, and getting stressed about it isn’t worth it. Sure these weeks will be tough at first, but be welcoming and work with people. Sure you will lose some games, but overall I’ve noticed that you can carry your team quite easily now since there are new players on both sides.

I’m just saying that if the toxicity continues through this transitioning time, we will be left with the same small population that we had pre patch.

bhagwad.4281:

You’re assuming way too much. Do you know how often I have tried to nicely explain things to new comers only for them to:

a) Not respond at all (most common)
b) Tell me to keep quiet

Just to make sure that they can see what I’m saying, I sometimes type with /s instead of /t. So when I’m capping close and another guys is standing on the point with me, I’ll say “/s go!” Only to have no response at all.

Then I’ll even PM them in case they still haven’t seen it. Still no response. I’m sick and tired of explaining things only to be greeted with radio silence. I’ll still keep trying though since there might be someone who will listen.

In short, your attempt to characterize most of us veteran players as evil and “toxic” and all the new comers as hapless well meaning innocents in PvP is biased and extremely flawed.

Just a quick comment on your post here. Saying “Go!” to someone who is new to PvP means nothing and can easily be seen as something meant in a mean way (even if it isn’t). If I was new I would think “Go where? Did I do something wrong already?”. Try “go cap mid pls” or “stay here and defend” and then you run to mid. sPvP can be very intimidating to a new player that hasn’t done it before and doesn’t know what they are supposed to be doing. The instinctual thing for them will be to follow other players. And when another player shouts something at them that they don’t understand their reaction to avoid confrontation will be to pretend like they didn’t hear you.

I’m not saying what you did was wrong, just trying to point out again that learning this game mode isn’t easy, and interpreting someone’s silence as a direct afront to you may not be the best option.

AlbertoUlkesh.4517:

The problem isn’t entirely the toxicity of some members, because this exists in every single competitive game scenario.

I’ve seen this come up over and over again as some kind of justification. Just because this happens in other games, can’t we try to be better than them?

I’m sorry, but this will never happen. There will always be the one who like to trashtalk, and they do it just because they find it fun. This game have a good overall community, but there will always be the toxic ones (even on PvE).
Just ignore them and your problem will be “solved”.

Solidor.4876:

AlbertoUlkesh.4517:

The problem isn’t entirely the toxicity of some members, because this exists in every single competitive game scenario.

I’ve seen this come up over and over again as some kind of justification. Just because this happens in other games, can’t we try to be better than them?

I’m sorry, but this will never happen. There will always be the one who like to trashtalk, and they do it just because they find it fun. This game have a good overall community, but there will always be the toxic ones (even on PvE).
Just ignore them and your problem will be “solved”.

Yes but if the majority are against it and stand up for people then you will notice it stops. It is much the same as people making racial slurs, or bigoted remarks. Random people standing up for others shuts those guys up pretty quickly. If you can improve the behavior of the majority, the others will fall into line because they don’t like the pressure they get back when they act out.

Look at it from the other side. Dealing with pve/wvw baddies is a new concept to many vets. If your game is on another level you wouldn’t want to work with someone who has no idea how to play. So this MMR system is terrible.

That being said people will get used to the influx of new players and will eventually accept them

Also not sure what fantasy you live in but just about every pvp game has this problem.

eleshazar.6902:

Well I’m only speaking from my own empirical evidence which is bound to be flawed.

I would in all honesty not call your anecdotal fallacy empirical evidence, you did not perform a test nor provide sufficient evidence to display that the community is like you claim it is.

eleshazar.6902:

But I can say that in the past few days I’ve played over 100 tourney games and the results have been overwhelmingly not helpful. You have to treat each player differently. You can’t have a bad experience with one new player and assume they all are going to be like that.

Which is just refering to your anecdotal fallacy to back it up, we all know there are rude players in PvP, it is however not a phenomena that is unique to the PvP community(Look at how people behave when someone wants to play something else than zerker in PvE for example).
However as a rebutle to your anecdotals: My own experience since the patch has been nothing short of dreadful and it has been agonizingly clear who is a new player and who isn’t. For the greater part of the soloqueues I’ve ran since the 15th I’ve been paired up with people who most likely never played PvP of any sort, anywher,e since the dawn of time. Among the ones I’ve played with the vast majority has been both fairly bad, but also severly uninterested in any kind of hints, tips, advice or suggestions whatsoever. The unwillingness to learn how even the most simple concepts in PvP function is just absurd but we can’t force them to listen and eventually it just gets far too tedious to attempt to help them.

eleshazar.6902:

The other thing that you can’t assume is that they are in fact new (sure if they are doubling up on a cap then you can be pretty sure). I’ve seen people criticize someone for going far when the team is losing a team fight on mid and a thief goes to decap. I’ve seen people criticize someone for defending home. So there are a lot of people offering “advice” that may not be the greatest advice to who they think are “new” people simply because they don’t play the same strategy as you.

But if they’re standing in 8 necromancer marks while being attacked by a thief and refusing to move, even tho they’re not immobilized or stunned you can be absolutely certain that they are fairly new, when this player then politely requests that you puppy off and burn in righteous fire merely because you attempted to help you kinda lose hope in the new ones.

eleshazar.6902:

I’m not trying to demonize all of sPvP veterans

Yet you refer to the entire sPvP community in your first post:
_This community really needs to shape up. _
_The reason that sPvP is so small of a population is because of the toxicity of its members. _

There are rotten eggs in all baskets, not just the spvp one. I’d like to think that they’re still a minority tho.

I’m sure we can arrange for new players to be eased into it tho.

AlbertoUlkesh.4517:

The problem isn’t entirely the toxicity of some members, because this exists in every single competitive game scenario.

I’ve seen this come up over and over again as some kind of justification. Just because this happens in other games, can’t we try to be better than them?

The actual core problem lies in the fact that people are anonymous online and therefor think they can act in any way they please towards eachother, doesn’t have anything at all to do with justification.

eleshazar.6902:

Yes but if the majority are against it and stand up for people then you will notice it stops. It is much the same as people making racial slurs, or bigoted remarks. Random people standing up for others shuts those guys up pretty quickly. If you can improve the behavior of the majority, the others will fall into line because they don’t like the pressure they get back when they act out.

The majority is against already. What would happen if the majority of the players were the trashtalkers? I can’t even think about how things would be bad. Just ignore, it’s the best thing to do, try to argue will just give them more opportunity to trashtalk you once again.

My biggest problem is the downing system in pvp. Why I have never got into pvp as I did in gw1. When you die you should die….you should not be able to warp around basically wasting more time to finish you off….it is like the only reason they added this silly system is so they could sell finishers.

They really need to fix matchmaking, this would solve everything. PvP people will always have complainers, but you can seperate them more.

Arena should be split between 1-9, 10-10, 20 – 29, etc. … Let the higher ranks choose to join lower rank matches, don’t automate it.

This was an inevitable thing. If you didn’t know, pretty much every game that involves pvp has a rather toxic community. I’ve never played a game that doesn’t. You will also never find a game (that has at least a few thousand players) that doesn’t have people like this. It’s a part of being on the internet. People on the internet typically aren’t nice. Thinking that they will be is naive. I wouldn’t even consider myself a nice person and it takes a lot for me to bad mouth my team. This isn’t really an issue at all, people need to grow a thicker skin if they’re going to step into pvping because most pvpers are some of the most trolly, rage-happy, toxic people on the internet.

The reason why PvP in this game and almost all games is toxic is because of the incentives. The teammates we get are randomly picked, we see them for 10-15 min. during this match then are likely to never see them again. The expectation is for them to do what is tactically correct, make optimal decisions, etc. We expect people to do what seems obvious and correct to us and that comes as natural. If they don’t there is nothing we can do about it except hope we don’t play with them again. Any advice we give in team chat isn’t going to be thorough enough to help the other person improve and even if it is the match is probably over by then. In a 10-15 min. anonymous instant gratification game type like this flaming other people has no downsides and helping them has no upsides.

This thread is unnecessary, OP should suggest a way to create meaningful relationships in PvP, or a way to improve communication with tactical commands that are easy for beginners to grasp. Both of these will make friendlier player interactions, “my son I am disappoint” threads like these won’t change people’s behavior.

Well if that is the way you want to operate that is well within your rights (assuming you don’t break the ToS in your flaming speech).

I’m simply pointing out that I should never see a thread from some sPvP person that “has been loyal to this dying format since launch” crying about how the game mode is dying. If you want to be toxic and claim it is inevitable, go for it. Your game mode will get no dev attention (because you guys can’t support the dev time with your sparse gem store purchases on your own), and it will die. You are drowning yourselves and asking for more rocks to help the sinking process. Hope your ability to attack random people on the internet was worth it.

I personally do not understand why the toxicity has been so bad as of late in the Spvp community, I must have blocked and reported at least 50+ players since patch for verbal abuse and harassment, it feels like almost every match I see someone just bashing and cussing out other players, not sure if they are veteran players or not but IMO doesn’t matter. If they are veterans/experienced players I don’t get why they waste their time in solo q and hot join, you have Team Q to be as competitive as you want with the players you want without the worry of newbie/less experienced players to hold you back.

As far as newer/less experienced players who are willing to learn they are kinda in a bad spot now, I see many asking for help or asking what they did wrong just to get raged and cuss’d at, I wish I was able to offer advice and tips to these players but I am not in a skilled enough position to feel comfortable doing so, theres many times a situation will occur where I find myself not knowing which way to respond, 90% of the time I would ask for advice just to get raged/cuss’d at lol.

Attitudes need to change or Spvp will find itself back where it was a week ago with no one playing.

eleshazar.6902:

Well if that is the way you want to operate that is well within your rights (assuming you don’t break the ToS in your flaming speech).

I’m simply pointing out that I should never see a thread from some sPvP person that “has been loyal to this dying format since launch” crying about how the game mode is dying. If you want to be toxic and claim it is inevitable, go for it. Your game mode will get no dev attention (because you guys can’t support the dev time with your sparse gem store purchases on your own), and it will die. You are drowning yourselves and asking for more rocks to help the sinking process. Hope your ability to attack random people on the internet was worth it.

You assume a bit too much there bud. I try to help people that want it, but the fact is that most people don’t. So do I get frustrated when my team is fighting over stillness for almost 5 mins while they have us 3 capped and I’ve told them repeatedly to try to fight on points? Yeah. It also might result in me venting that frustration at the end of the match. I’m only human, I can only take so much frustration at a time.

Also the population didn’t start off low. It dropped dramatically over the course of a few updates because Anet showed that they cared very little for what the community wanted/needed and the fact that it takes them much too long to fix broken things. It started off fine with loads of potential and declined rapidly, that’s why pvpers complain.

Also developers should care immensely about every feature their game has. Period. It doesn’t matter which part makes you the most money if you created the entire thing. It’s called having pride in your work. That’s not a shot at Anet btw, just a blanket statement.

Dont know where you ppl get all this toxicity, happened just once since patch to me and i played quite alot games since.

eleshazar.6902:

Every single match someone would make a comment about those kitten PvE players joining and ruining PvP. (And for reference I was in TeamQ, SoloQ and only a few times in hotjoin [like 3?])

“Those dumb noobs ran to beast first! GG "
“God you suck go back to PvE”
“All these matches are awful now that the PvErs came in.”
“WHAT ARE YOU DOING AT THE ORB?!”
“All they want are their rewards, they are awful”
“Why don’t you uninstall the game already?!”

aren’t they right? except for beast.
stop learning how to play in team arena or even solo q.
stop test your build
stop double stomp (unless it’s rly need)/double cap/fight outside points (except you can’t avoid this fight/tactic)

in other words stop being such noobs and …poof…toxic attitude disappear.

also MMR not works. or works wrong.
btw i dont like these new trend for “toxic”

I only read the part where you said the community is small because of the toxicity of it’s members. I can’t agree though.

Every other popular game I’ve ever played also has extreme toxicity. League of legends is the biggest game and solo queue is the worst I’ve seen except for HoN.

Hey guys. I just played PvE nonstop for the past few days and now I know why it will not succeed without some changes.

The reason that PvE is so small of a population compared to WoW is because of the toxicity of its members. It isn’t an Anet problem (although they have stuff they need to work on), it is a community problem.

Every single encounter someone would make a comment about those kitten new players joining and ruining PvE. (And for reference I was in Dungeons, World Events and only a few times in Champ Train Farm [like 3?])
“Those dumb noobs ran to Oak first! GG "
“WHAT ARE YOU DOING AT THE OAK?!”
“Why don’t you speak my language, commie?”
“Why is your armor not infused, noob?”
“Where is your legendary skin, nubcake?”
“CoF runs take 2 minutes longer now thanks to these scrubs.”
“Can you bring your warrior instead?”
“Lol, why have you not memorized every mob and boss tell in every dungeon path?”
“You can’t solo Jormag, you dork. He’s not Svanir.”

And trust me there were much worse comments that aren’t appropriate to post on the forums.

After hearing all this, I fear that I won’t be going back to PvE. It’s quite sad, really.

lol wat a joke , you know there’s an option to hide the chat right? If the word “noob” offends you then I don’t know what wat to say.

The real problem is poor match making , condi bunkers and skill less specs aka: spirit,hambow etc.

eleshazar.6902:

The reason that sPvP is so small of a population is because of the toxicity of its members. It isn’t an Anet problem (although they have stuff they need to work on), it is a community problem.

In my opinion in-game population in most of cases comes off as a bunch of whiny, self-entitled, elitist brats, and since I’m actively playing all 3 game modes I can honestly say that the attitude is the same across the entire game. Taking that into consideration and comparing popularity of PvE, WvW and PvP, I’d have to disagree with your analysis.
On top of that, other wildly successful competitive games (DotA, HALO, LoL, CS, CoD etc.) are all infamous for their toxic player base.
In conclusion I think that nastiness should be toned down, but is not the reason for low PvP population.

Real problem, passive gameplay:

stealth
AI: clones, minions (not ranger pet because they suck mostly)
healing signet
etc

This game was supposed to be active combat, why make passive builds strongest?

The OP is right, there is a level of trash talking that is VERY anti social and non-constructive. Tis the nature of the beast perhaps. I know I have come across players that were geared out but not very skilled, and I use emotes to talk junk, such as /laugh /ponder / cry. but when you start typing negative things to others to belittle or berate, its no longer trash talking.

I think its important to realize that a good portion of the people that play this game are young as in teens. So this sort of behavior is to be expected to exist. I think its like a bully perhaps.

Great thing anet made this game with a mute player choice.

Verbal abuse like that should be reported to arena net through the report function. Sure, “i do not like it when PvEheroes ruin my WvW”. But if they turn out to be a liability, ill rather just buy em some cheap PVT armor set, and hope they put it on a last a second longer then nag about it.

the OP seems sadly mistaken about the state of this game. The community was initially thriving and as positive as any pvp community can be, however after it became clear Anet had no intention of putting in the work required to make this game live up to its namesake (the original Guildwars) the community started to fall apart. The toxicity of the community is entirely on Anet’s shoulders for not delivering a proper PVP game as was promised.

I disagree. League of Legends is probably the most played game on earth right now and it has a incredibly “toxic” community. GW2’s PvP problems are specific to the content, not the rewards or the community.

Losing games is a natural part of any pvp; and even more when we get that huge wave of new players which I welcome with an open arm. Pvp finally feels alive…
but tonight, I finally decided to soloQ since april patch, and to my suprise, I kept reading:

“Go back in pve where you belong noob”
“Super noob, uninstall the game now, nasty noob”
“I’m going afk, none of you deserve to get carried”

The thing is that I feel those kinds of remarks mostly come from people who have absolutely no awareness that it might bring the players moral DOWN. How do you expect players to get better? It does more harm than good in your team.

I want to welcome people to play PvP, but currently I just can’t with the amount of frustration I get.

I tried, I tried interacting with my teammate at the start, during the match, with friendly attitude too. But most of the time there just were no respond from them at all, or likely they didn’t even have a clue of what I’m saying (for instance, telling them to rotate)

While not completely accurate, you can somewhat tell if the player is experienced in PvP by looking at their title, and the amount of people I see with non-PvP title just worries me, wondering how many of them really know anything about playing in solo/team queue.

I’m sure there are definitely PvP players with really bad attitude toward PvE players, but if you think about it, PvP players were always the minority group in GW2, I can only imagine there will be MORE PvE players with bad attitude or playing deaf when in a match.

I’m not kidding, I’m starting to hate PvE player even though I really shouldn’t, but I hate Anet even more. All this kitten happened because they put that stupid daily cap limit on Reward Track, which forces PvE players with no choice to play solo/team if they want to keep progressing.

I’m not saying PvE players shouldn’t play solo/team queue at all (after all, if you don’t play, how will you improve), but they should be separated into group that truly wish to improve their PvP skill, and group that simply wants the reward. And it’s the later PvE group that should be barred from solo/team, they should just earn their reward by playing in hotjoin (just as how back then PvP daily should be done in hotjoin, not solo/team queue).

But oh no, Anet decided to put the stupid daily cap limit on reward track in hotjoin, so the system screwed over us, and we end up in a situation it’s a lose/lose for everybody.

The OP nails one of the reasons why I’m probably never going back to sPVP: the frontiersman days are over.

When GW2 first came out, everyone was experimenting with builds, so pretty much anything was possible. Teams and strategies didn’t fully form, and so there was a lot of forgiveness and leeway in the game. At this point, I could have random, stupid, n00by fun, and there wasn’t a single person who hated this fact.

But now that everything is so solidified, sPVP sounds like a horrible game mode to play. You are stuck using specific meta builds and specific strategies against players who are 10 times better than you with 10 times better hardware and experience. These builds only work when other team members do their meta-based things, so experimentation is discriminated against. This means that, unless you happen to like a meta-build’s particular playstyle or role, then sPVP isn’t going to be fun to play.

To top it off, no one wants you to be there. The vets don’t want to put up with you, or teach you. Any sane person who walks someplace new and faces immediate hostility wouldn’t ever go there again. Despite how much QQing the sPVP community does about a lack of playerbase, this is at constant odds with their desire to only play with seasoned vets.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

The OP nails one of the reasons why I’m probably never going back to sPVP: the frontiersman days are over.

When GW2 first came out, everyone was experimenting with builds, so pretty much anything was possible. Teams and strategies didn’t fully form, and so there was a lot of forgiveness and leeway in the game. At this point, I could have random, stupid, n00by fun, and there wasn’t a single person who hated this fact.

But now that everything is so solidified, sPVP sounds like a horrible game mode to play. You are stuck using specific meta builds and specific strategies against players who are 10 times better than you with 10 times better hardware and experience. These builds only work when other team members do their meta-based things, so experimentation is discriminated against. This means that, unless you happen to like a meta-build’s particular playstyle or role, then sPVP isn’t going to be fun to play.

To top it off, no one wants you to be there. The vets don’t want to put up with you, or teach you. Any sane person who walks someplace new and faces immediate hostility wouldn’t ever go there again. Despite how much QQing the sPVP community does about a lack of playerbase, this is at constant odds with their desire to only play with seasoned vets.

The only complaint that Veteran PvPers have is that the game currently starts out new players with an extremely high MMR. If you look at the leaderboards currently you will see plenty of people with barely any games played yet high MMR.

MMR needs to start at 0-25% for new players and they need to work their way up to be able to play with the vets rather than starting out with them and either getting lucky, or getting crushed.

Starting new players at rock bottom would instantly solve most of the complaints.

Your post really does most pvpers a disservice, as I and many others definitely don’t mind helping or giving advice to new players.

There are 2 reasons for the toxic bahaviour.

One is the the Softcap for hotjoin rewards. All those PVe players are only joining the Arena because they dont get anymore rewards in hotjoins. I originally liked the idea but the way it turns out it has ruined the entire of SPVP.

Second is because of the matchmaking. They pair up pvp lvl’s randomly as far as i can tell. Obviously all the pvp lvl 60 players are gonna be kittened at the lvl 6 guy. And its not even his fault nor theirs. They loose the match and get annoyed he looses the match and get frustrated.

Now one of these things wouldnt result in such extreme toxic behaviour that we have now. Its just both of them together that provide the results we are seeing now. Not to mention it ruins all the fun of the arena

Toxic communities are in every PvP game. Half minded people blame others for losing matches. I’ve never seen negative attitude improving anyone elses play, but nobody cares because its faster to type “u suck, uninstall” than explain and guide.

On the other hand balance in the game doesn’t favor build diversity, you have 1 maybe 2 meta builds for each profession and if you don’t play them you are considered an anchor for your team.

Next thing is matchmaking which often pairs veterans with newcomers which frustrates both sides.

Yes, the onus is totally on the player for SPvP having a small playerbase, not on Arenanet (which totally didn’t make a subpar PvP experience).

For example, games with horrible communities such as LoL or Dota 2 have very small playerbases…oh, wait.

Solidor.4876:

The problem isn’t entirely the toxicity of some members, because this exists in every single competitive game scenario. The problem is new players are getting matched with veteran players on tournaments, thus causing this situation.

What you say is also true. And there’s also toxicity. There’s a few issues here :P

Blizt.3086:

I want to welcome people to play PvP, but currently I just can’t with the amount of frustration I get.

I tried, I tried interacting with my teammate at the start, during the match, with friendly attitude too. But most of the time there just were no respond from them at all, or likely they didn’t even have a clue of what I’m saying (for instance, telling them to rotate)

While not completely accurate, you can somewhat tell if the player is experienced in PvP by looking at their title, and the amount of people I see with non-PvP title just worries me, wondering how many of them really know anything about playing in solo/team queue.

I’m sure there are definitely PvP players with really bad attitude toward PvE players, but if you think about it, PvP players were always the minority group in GW2, I can only imagine there will be MORE PvE players with bad attitude or playing deaf when in a match.

I’m not kidding, I’m starting to hate PvE player even though I really shouldn’t, but I hate Anet even more. All this kitten happened because they put that stupid daily cap limit on Reward Track, which forces PvE players with no choice to play solo/team if they want to keep progressing.

I’m not saying PvE players shouldn’t play solo/team queue at all (after all, if you don’t play, how will you improve), but they should be separated into group that truly wish to improve their PvP skill, and group that simply wants the reward. And it’s the later PvE group that should be barred from solo/team, they should just earn their reward by playing in hotjoin (just as how back then PvP daily should be done in hotjoin, not solo/team queue).

But oh no, Anet decided to put the stupid daily cap limit on reward track in hotjoin, so the system screwed over us, and we end up in a situation it’s a lose/lose for everybody.

The cap is indeed one of the problems.

I haven’t actively played the game for more than a month now, but I can assure you the Toxic Atmosphere is NOT the Number 1 problem with Spvp. Of course it is a very important problem that affects the ways people enjoy the game, but its secondary to the relative poor perception of balance between the professions, and the overall stale game-play.

We as a community have to work together to show that toxicity is unacceptable. This is the best way to solve this problem at its core.

The professions do not have many unique, interesting, fun things to use, or roles to fill. There’s very few, if any skill shots present in the game that require some amount of thinking and skill to use. There’s generally only a few viable builds for each profession to use that mainly revolve around Damage. I consider most conditions to be a form of soft control on another person’s actions, but generally only immobilize and torment control another’s movements. The other primary combat roles of Control and Support are vastly inferior to the Damage role and do not have many viable or useful applications outside of very small and unique uses.

There is not much point to preventing or controlling another’s movements when killing them is more effective. There’s not many ways of directly manipulating enemy movements within the professions, nor is there a strategic situation where this would be the best strategy to use. Although there are a couple situations where this is necessary, like the Ice Elemental in the Dredge Fractal.

Same with support: There’s not many benefits to supporting allies both aggressively or passively. Its always better to kill your foes before they kill you because there’s not many tools available to do another strategy. Giving shields to allies and other boons/debuffs/ effects would help open the support role more provided there was a greater need for them.