Guild Wars 2

So, NA Tournament of Legends: 3 of the top 4 teams are running double warrior.

Why is this? You take the easiest class in the game to play. You introduce strength runes. You slap on a Soldier’s amulet and run around all game with 20 stacks of might dealing 500 perma burn ticks and more damage than almost a GC.

Combustive shot is an embarrassment to this game; the antithesis of a skillshot. Reduce the radius, make it actually have to touch something to clear conditions.

Warriors are running around with 3000 toughness, effective 3800 power and 800 condition damage. They also have access to the most powerful CC in the game. This spec is absurd, and is obviously forcing other classes out of the team fighter role.

Yes its a viable build for wars but its not really over the top. Other classes can bring just as much to the table and strength runes are available to all classes.

vincecontix.1264:

Yes its a viable build for wars but its not really over the top. Other classes can bring just as much to the table and strength runes are available to all classes.

No, strength runes are not ‘available’ to other classes since they don’t have firefields and blast finishers on a 7 second cooldown.

It’s not OP, just very easy to play.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

It’s not OP, just very easy to play.

infantrydiv.1620:

vincecontix.1264:

Yes its a viable build for wars but its not really over the top. Other classes can bring just as much to the table and strength runes are available to all classes.

No, strength runes are not ‘available’ to other classes since they don’t have firefields and blast finishers on a 7 second cooldown.

Elementalists have waaaaay more than soldiers axe, which is a better build IMO.

Phaeton.9582:

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

It’s not OP, just very easy to play.

infantrydiv.1620:

vincecontix.1264:

Yes its a viable build for wars but its not really over the top. Other classes can bring just as much to the table and strength runes are available to all classes.

No, strength runes are not ‘available’ to other classes since they don’t have firefields and blast finishers on a 7 second cooldown.

Elementalists have waaaaay more than soldiers axe, which is a better build IMO.

Elementalists also have to rotate properly, and dont have complete immunity to damage periodically.

I think there are much stronger comps than double war at the moment. The meta is still adjusting so double war is a pretty ‘safe’ option but I believe we’re going to see composition changes after the tournament, at least among the top teams.

I think the point; to coin a phrase here in America is, “Just win, baby!”. It doesn’t matter what you run as long as you do that. Can’t criticize teams for bringing whatever they think is the best option to the team. If that’s two Hambows and getting a win out of it, then you picked right. If you want to criticize the build that ArenaNet provided, then do that. Don’t critique players for utilizing something that works. All’s fair in love and war.

Iason Evan.3806:

I think the point; to coin a phrase here in America is, “Just win, baby!”. It doesn’t matter what you run as long as you do that. Can’t criticize teams for bringing whatever they think is the best option to the team. If that’s two Hambows and getting a win out of it, then you picked right. If you want to criticize the build that ArenaNet provided, then do that. Don’t critique players for utilizing something that works. All’s fair in love and war.

You couldn’t have said it better

Rarnark.5623:

I think there are much stronger comps than double war at the moment. The meta is still adjusting so double war is a pretty ‘safe’ option but I believe we’re going to see composition changes after the tournament, at least among the top teams.

Man I want to see some of that old double D/D action again (Lel).

Two of them would be putting out 25 stacks AoE anyway; what would be the point of warriors might stacking!

Iason Evan.3806:

I think the point; to coin a phrase here in America is, “Just win, baby!”. .

I don’t think you could be more wrong tbh. NA are the kings of YOLO comps. That’s why EU did bunker meta so much better; they play to win through out rotations on whatever works best; not through outplaying people on ‘their’ builds.

I remember when war was “that red haired step child” and team from NA who were running him and still they beated every other team comp……its not about classes its about team tactics.

Phaeton.9582:

Iason Evan.3806:

I think the point; to coin a phrase here in America is, “Just win, baby!”. .

I don’t think you could be more wrong tbh. NA are the kings of YOLO comps. That’s why EU did bunker meta so much better; they play to win through out rotations on whatever works best; not through outplaying people on ‘their’ builds.

I’ve played on both servers (just EU on trial weekends) and this is probably the best comparison of EU and NA I’ve seen in a while.

This is my stupid opinion

At high levels of play you don’t see mechanical skill being the deciding factor in match-ups. Most high level players are hovering around the cap of max efficiency skill usage, and so the deciding factors become rotation and build synergy – forcing fights where you have the advantage more often than not.

Warrior plays into this very well because it is relatively easy to play compared to other classes, which allows the player to devote more of their mental concentration to awareness of the map, allies, and enemies. Sure, they could play a more mechanically intensive class and maybe gain a tiny bit more utility in combat, but that comes at the cost of a devoting a lot more of their concentration to the mechanical aspect of the fight, which means reduced awareness of the map and their allies’ situations.

As a bad example, the warrior could go another class and may get that enemy downed faster, but was focusing too much on his skill to do it and so it took him too long to realize his ally was getting stomped behind him and rallied the guy he just got down.

Obviously 5 warriors is not a good idea though because there is no synergy and too easily hard-counted.

So NA soloqueue > EU soloqueue and
NA Teamqueue < EU Teamqueue?

I think it is interesting to see the comps from UE vs the comps from NA. None of the top UE teams ran 2 warriors. A lot of them didn’t run Hambow either and from what I have seen so far, Eu has better PvP.

EU has more high level competitive teams. that means they also have more practice against high level competitive teams. that gives them the advantage. I think the NA teams have just as much potential but less experience fighting a wide variety of top teams.

Eu is bursty, NA is tanky

/thread

people don’t realize just how strong the double warrior is.
Don’t forget that APeX beat 55HP 2-1 in a scrimm (on NA servers), including a game on legacy that was 70-500.

Phaeton.9582:

Iason Evan.3806:

I think the point; to coin a phrase here in America is, “Just win, baby!”. .

I don’t think you could be more wrong tbh. NA are the kings of YOLO comps. That’s why EU did bunker meta so much better; they play to win through out rotations on whatever works best; not through outplaying people on ‘their’ builds.

NA ain’t playing EU though. If a double Hambow team wins the NA ToL then I was right. If they don’t then you are right. It comes down to using the comp you feel is best or are more comfortable with. Even the EU champions said that. Opinions yo.

a t s e.9614:

Eu is bursty, NA is tanky

/thread

Again, misinformation from a t s e.

EU started the double warrior comp with Cheese Mode (the top team in EU for a really long time, that would usually wreck 55 HP monks). EU players have usually stayed away from bursty varieties of thief like D/P. EU warriors also do not run berserker amulet, like Apex warriors do (at least last I saw). NA also plays Engineer which is riskier in team fights.

CC in this game is too strong. With sigil of Paralyzation, a double hambow can disable/immobilize a team almost constantly. If the other team run out of stability, it’s a death sentence.

infantrydiv.1620:

Elementalists also have to rotate properly, and dont have complete immunity to damage periodically.

What… are you talking about? Warriors have to do just as much rotation on a hambow build to get might stacks, and Elementalists get Mist Form and Obsidian Flesh which are truly complete immunity and not just immune from direct damage or conditions — not to mention Swirling Winds and Magnetic Wave, which reflect projectiles. Oh, and Fire Shield, which grants Might on hit.

Darek.1836:

people don’t realize just how strong the double warrior is.
Don’t forget that APeX beat 55HP 2-1 in a scrimm (on NA servers), including a game on legacy that was 70-500.

I’m aware, the differences between team power level on NA/EU aren’t as big as the Twitch EU fanboys would have you think.

Double warrior is going to be one of the best options until might stacking gets nerfed, because you can’t really beat:

-3800 power
-3000+ toughness
-800 condi damage
-AoE CC
-AoE burn
-Great condi clear
-Personal stability
-Endure Pain/Berserker’s stance

a t s e.9614:

infantrydiv.1620:

a t s e.9614:

Eu is bursty, NA is tanky

/thread

Again, misinformation from a t s e.

EU started the double warrior comp with Cheese Mode (the top team in EU for a really long time, that would usually wreck 55 HP monks). EU players have usually stayed away from bursty varieties of thief like D/P. EU warriors also do not run berserker amulet, like Apex warriors do (at least last I saw). NA also plays Engineer which is riskier in team fights.

Double warrior is still tanky no matter what amulet you have. If double warrior is not tanky to you then I don’t know to say.

Yeah, it really is tanky as hell no matter what. That’s why we have this topic.

ceol.9175:

infantrydiv.1620:

Elementalists also have to rotate properly, and dont have complete immunity to damage periodically.

What… are you talking about? Warriors have to do just as much rotation on a hambow build to get might stacks, and Elementalists get Mist Form and Obsidian Flesh which are truly complete immunity and not just immune from direct damage or conditions — not to mention Swirling Winds and Magnetic Wave, which reflect projectiles. Oh, and Fire Shield, which grants Might on hit.

No one is questioning that the base damage of an elementalist is greater than that of a warrior. It’s just that the warrior can put out almost as much damage on a far tankier spec, with 6,700 more health and literally 1,000 more armour!

As for Might generation, yes, hambow warriors have the edge there too, as they can keep up a permanent fire field (9" duration, 7.75" recharge), and have 2 blast finishers at 10" and 7.75" recharge, and as a bonus 2 out of those 3 skills moreover cleanse 2 condis eeach whenever they’re used! The standard cantrip d/d ele has 2 very short duration fire fields at 15" recharge each, with one being an awkward shake, 2 blast finishers at 15" and 45" recharge, plus dodging in Earth attunement if evasive arcana is traited, and all these skills are spread across THREE different attunements with 10" recharge each, whereas the warrior has a field and a finisher on the same weapon set and another finisher only a 5" recharge weapon swap away. So no, elementalists do not gain the same benefit from Strength runes even though they’re available to them just as they’re available to warrior: by not having as much access to blast finishers and fire fields they do not gain as much benefit from the +duration aspect of Strength runes, and due to their glassier nature they can’t gian as much from the #4 bonus (might when struck) either. So while Strength runes are available for everyone, they certainly don’t give the same bonus for everyone. With the amount of Might a warrior can stack their total damage output is higher than a d/d ele’s even though the ele’s base damage is higher, and, to add insult to injury, higher burning uptime than an elementalist, the quintessential burning applicator! Having these advantages while also having more armour, more health, and better healing, means that imho the hambow warrior is not merely easier to play, it is baseline better than any other build in the game, and it’s a huge imbalance that needs to be addressed.

Solstice.1097:

This is my stupid opinion

At high levels of play you don’t see mechanical skill being the deciding factor in match-ups. Most high level players are hovering around the cap of max efficiency skill usage, and so the deciding factors become rotation and build synergy – forcing fights where you have the advantage more often than not.

Warrior plays into this very well because it is relatively easy to play compared to other classes, which allows the player to devote more of their mental concentration to awareness of the map, allies, and enemies. Sure, they could play a more mechanically intensive class and maybe gain a tiny bit more utility in combat, but that comes at the cost of a devoting a lot more of their concentration to the mechanical aspect of the fight, which means reduced awareness of the map and their allies’ situations.

As a bad example, the warrior could go another class and may get that enemy downed faster, but was focusing too much on his skill to do it and so it took him too long to realize his ally was getting stomped behind him and rallied the guy he just got down.

Obviously 5 warriors is not a good idea though because there is no synergy and too easily hard-counted.

Ok. So, are you telling that hambow is an easy build that asks the lowest concentration from the player to be the highest effective possible? High “ranked” players should all play this way? Your justifications are invalid. If you aren’t able to pay attention to what’s happening around you, then you should first learn to pay attention to these things before playing in team (Team Arena). Since, the stomp and revive are really important in this game you cannot tell things like you are saying.
If it asks less concentration from the player, then it should be less effective.

ceol.9175:

infantrydiv.1620:

Elementalists also have to rotate properly, and dont have complete immunity to damage periodically.

What… are you talking about? Warriors have to do just as much rotation on a hambow build to get might stacks, and Elementalists get Mist Form and Obsidian Flesh which are truly complete immunity and not just immune from direct damage or conditions — not to mention Swirling Winds and Magnetic Wave, which reflect projectiles. Oh, and Fire Shield, which grants Might on hit.

I wasn’t even talking about focus elementalist, which probably takes even more skill than d/d.

Elementalist rotations are obviously more complex…if you can’t grasp the fact that they have 4 attunements on ~10 second cooldowns while warrior has two weapons with 5 second cooldowns and exceedingly simple skills…I don’t know what to say. And of course you are leaving out the fact that warrior healing is completely passive unlike eles which is tied to rotations. You are also leaving out the fact that warrior is naturally far more tanky than elementalist… so, what, again, is your point?

Warrior spams combustive shot completely covering the entire point and then uses Arcing Arrow and Earthshaker on the field the size of the moon… that’s some really complicated rotation right there, folks!

Everyone who is thinking warrior is not completly broken should be slapped in the face. There is currently just a minor outplay potential (due to range) against warriors.

If you get hit by burning field you take way too much damage for a field that covers more than a node, if you then get hit by longbow 3 you are almost dead. The pindown animation is still not reliable dodgeable and even it would be you currently have to dodge so much stuff (longbow f1, 3, 5 ; Eviscerate or Hammer stun; Torment stacks or Hammer stun chain) + every animation looks almost the same … there are not enough dodges in a capture node based game for that kitten (and we currently have a lot of vigor uptime).

I still vote for a 1/3 loss of adrenalin if they miss there f1 skillshots. This class is already so easy to learn that there is just a minor gap between noobs and professionals. In addition it shouldnt be that a class misses e.g. a 9k skillshot and 5 sec after that they get the next try.

So fix warrior by:
-Removing torment stacks from offhand or lower stacks/duration substantially
- Punish missing skillshot especially on hammer and axe
- Decrease radius of longbow f1 or decrease burning duration
- Improve pin-down animation especially on asuras
- Reduce berserker stance duration to 6 seconds or let blinds go through

Don’t get me wrong. Warriors may not be the best 1vs1 class (okay the axe/sword+longbow build is kittening strong) but espcially in teamfights they outsustain and in the sametime outdamage (especially due to shortbow) other classes so easily that they are a must in a teamcomp.

And dont forget the amazing bug that gives you free Passive Signet of Might for equipping Healing Signet and Deep Strike together. That’s free +180 Power for every Warrior out there.

ive been observing this now since the day of the balance patch when i revived my old d/d ele. the celestial build is in a very nice spot right now, if played skillfully you can win the majority of 1vs1 fights.

guess against which class i struggle the most? – hambow war

if i sacrifice my utility skills at the right time i can have almost perma vigour uptime. i also have good access to protection and 6 seconds of stability with armor of earth.

but here comes the problem. i cannot avoid all the crucial attacks a hambow can dish out. i can only dodge 2-3 out of 5 attacks: longbow 5, 3 hammer 4, 5, f1.

my stability is nice for most of the fights against non warriors but not against 9 sec cooldown earthshaker when my armor of earth has a cooldown of 75 seconds.

another problem is the difference in my health regeneration and the warrior´s:
if the warrior disables me my heal signet will not work, i will not get those 280 hitpoints per cast. if i disable the warrior his healing signet continues to tick for at least 350 hitpoints per second. and then of course there is the difference in armor – 2400 vs 3000 and more.

with the update to sigil of intelligence you can even run cavalier or valk and still crit for 4k while being very tanky.

something seems odd, doesnt it?

manveruppd.7601:

snip

If you stay in longbow the entire time, you’re gimping yourself in the fight, and that’s the only way you’re going to keep Combustive Shot up 100% of the time.

The fact that elementalist needs to be buffed doesn’t mean warrior needs to be nerfed.

And I’m not sure what you’re talking about with elementalists not getting the same benefit from strength runes. Rarely will a warrior or an ele be able to keep 25 stacks of might up by themselves in a fight, but they will be able to have some sort of might from their combos and weapon/attunement swapping.

infantrydiv.1620:

Elementalist rotations are obviously more complex…if you can’t grasp the fact that they have 4 attunements on ~10 second cooldowns while warrior has two weapons with 5 second cooldowns and exceedingly simple skills…I don’t know what to say. And of course you are leaving out the fact that warrior healing is completely passive unlike eles which is tied to rotations. You are also leaving out the fact that warrior is naturally far more tanky than elementalist… so, what, again, is your point?

Yeah, their rotations are more complex. They also offer a bit more utility. The basic hambow build doesn’t have any mobility and barely has any sort of conditions. It’s kitten-easy to dodge out of Combustive Shot and Arcing Arrow as well as half the kitten hammer skills. “B-B-But the capture point!!” Yeah? Every class has AoE skills to force people off-point.

Elementalists also has passive healing in the form of Signet of Healing, which combined with 6 in water gives a lot of condition removal and regen as well. They’re also going to be getting a lot more dodges than a hambow warrior with their almost-perma Vigor uptime.

infantrydiv.1620:

Warrior spams combustive shot completely covering the entire point and then uses Arcing Arrow and Earthshaker on the field the size of the moon… that’s some really complicated rotation right there, folks!

It’s the exact same complexity as D/D elementalist: Fire #3, Fire #4, switch to Earth, Earth #4, dodge. Judging by your signature, you’ve never actually played the class, so I can’t blame you for not knowing that. What I can blame you for is getting your butt handed to you by a hambow warrior and coming on the forums to complain and beg for nerfs instead of examining why you were having trouble.

Warrior doesn’t need a nerf. Elementalist needs a buff.

Hambow is only strong because the only game-type benefits a warriors earthshaker or burning firefields. There should be more game modes, warrior is fine where it is.

Cleansing Ire + Combustion Shot is what carries Hambows. They are one of the few builds that can actually hold up against constant condition pressure. Very few other builds have a similar level of condition removal available to them.

Hambow is only strong because no one is taking projectile reflection. Just saying.

ceol.9175:

manveruppd.7601:

snip

If you stay in longbow the entire time, you’re gimping yourself in the fight, and that’s the only way you’re going to keep Combustive Shot up 100% of the time.

The fact that elementalist needs to be buffed doesn’t mean warrior needs to be nerfed.

And I’m not sure what you’re talking about with elementalists not getting the same benefit from strength runes. Rarely will a warrior or an ele be able to keep 25 stacks of might up by themselves in a fight, but they will be able to have some sort of might from their combos and weapon/attunement swapping.

infantrydiv.1620:

Elementalist rotations are obviously more complex…if you can’t grasp the fact that they have 4 attunements on ~10 second cooldowns while warrior has two weapons with 5 second cooldowns and exceedingly simple skills…I don’t know what to say. And of course you are leaving out the fact that warrior healing is completely passive unlike eles which is tied to rotations. You are also leaving out the fact that warrior is naturally far more tanky than elementalist… so, what, again, is your point?

Yeah, their rotations are more complex. They also offer a bit more utility. The basic hambow build doesn’t have any mobility and barely has any sort of conditions. It’s kitten-easy to dodge out of Combustive Shot and Arcing Arrow as well as half the kitten hammer skills. “B-B-But the capture point!!” Yeah? Every class has AoE skills to force people off-point.

Elementalists also has passive healing in the form of Signet of Healing, which combined with 6 in water gives a lot of condition removal and regen as well. They’re also going to be getting a lot more dodges than a hambow warrior with their almost-perma Vigor uptime.

infantrydiv.1620:

Warrior spams combustive shot completely covering the entire point and then uses Arcing Arrow and Earthshaker on the field the size of the moon… that’s some really complicated rotation right there, folks!

It’s the exact same complexity as D/D elementalist: Fire #3, Fire #4, switch to Earth, Earth #4, dodge. Judging by your signature, you’ve never actually played the class, so I can’t blame you for not knowing that. What I can blame you for is getting your butt handed to you by a hambow warrior and coming on the forums to complain and beg for nerfs instead of examining why you were having trouble.

Warrior doesn’t need a nerf. Elementalist needs a buff.

How about water 3? You don’t know that’s a blast finisher? I guess you never played the class. Not to mention the fact that different attunements on Ele do much different things. Hambow = spam

Also, Elementalist sure as hell does not need a buff. I dunno where you got that idea from.

lawl yea all those hambow and there “strength runes”

QtHman.6502:

Iason Evan.3806:

I think the point; to coin a phrase here in America is, “Just win, baby!”. It doesn’t matter what you run as long as you do that. Can’t criticize teams for bringing whatever they think is the best option to the team. If that’s two Hambows and getting a win out of it, then you picked right. If you want to criticize the build that ArenaNet provided, then do that. Don’t critique players for utilizing something that works. All’s fair in love and war.

You couldn’t have said it better

By that logic cheating and using bugs also ok – ‘just win baby’

I think many of you are looking at this from the wrong angle. It’s not the Warrior, or any one class/spec, that that is to blame. What’s wrong with PvP is that we have tiny little capture points and the fact that one tanky player can totally deny the cap of 2 or more players.

This design means that AoE and tanky builds are going to be prevalent. Hambow wouldn’t be that great if the capture point wasn’t so small. The same goes for condi necros and engis. If the points were larger the builds would still be good, but avoidable without leaving the point. I’m also not a fan of one player being able to deny the cap of 2+. It should definitely slow the progress by a large amount but it being able to stall indefinitely is not a mechanic I’m a fan of.

The playerbase seems to be pretty satisfied with where Warrior is at now. Beating on Hammer or Bow any more would just make them worthless.

infantrydiv.1620:

How about water 3? You don’t know that’s a blast finisher? I guess you never played the class. Not to mention the fact that different attunements on Ele do much different things. Hambow = spam

Also, Elementalist sure as hell does not need a buff. I dunno where you got that idea from.

…what? We’re talking about might stacking. There isn’t a lot of time to fit Water #3 in, especially since the enemy will rarely give you the opportunity to get the base rotation off. You don’t want to switch into a whole separate attunement just for a single blast finisher. Save water attunement for when you need condition cleansing or to back off and give yourself some breathing room. And even then, that point would only help me! Since one more blast finisher means more might stacks, which your argument seems to be that elementalist lacks.

See, these are things you would know if you played the class. Do you see me on here speaking out of my kitten about necro or thief? No? Then don’t come in here spouting nonsense about classes you don’t play.

ceol.9175:

infantrydiv.1620:

How about water 3? You don’t know that’s a blast finisher? I guess you never played the class. Not to mention the fact that different attunements on Ele do much different things. Hambow = spam

Also, Elementalist sure as hell does not need a buff. I dunno where you got that idea from.

…what? We’re talking about might stacking. There isn’t a lot of time to fit Water #3 in, especially since the enemy will rarely give you the opportunity to get the base rotation off. You don’t want to switch into a whole separate attunement just for a single blast finisher. Save water attunement for when you need condition cleansing or to back off and give yourself some breathing room. And even then, that point would only help me! Since one more blast finisher means more might stacks, which your argument seems to be that elementalist lacks.

See, these are things you would know if you played the class. Do you see me on here speaking out of my kitten about necro or thief? No? Then don’t come in here spouting nonsense about classes you don’t play.

My argument has never been that elementalist was underpowered… holy kitten… the only thing i was saying is that currently, playing elementalist is at least more complicated than warrior, so it isn’t as bad.

infantrydiv.1620:

My argument has never been that elementalist was underpowered… holy kitten… the only thing i was saying is that currently, playing elementalist is at least more complicated than warrior, so it isn’t as bad.

Your argument was that elementalists don’t have the ability to do the things warriors do. They do. It just takes a little bit more coordination.

The problem with elementalist is its really high skill floor (meaning it’s too much work to get proficient) compared to warrior. Meanwhile, hambow warrior is much easier to get into, but its skill ceiling is low, so there isn’t a lot of room to grow. It’s kind of almost balanced out. A little bit. Maybe.

ceol.9175:

infantrydiv.1620:

My argument has never been that elementalist was underpowered… holy kitten… the only thing i was saying is that currently, playing elementalist is at least more complicated than warrior, so it isn’t as bad.

Your argument was that elementalists don’t have the ability to do the things warriors do. They do. It just takes a little bit more coordination.

The problem with elementalist is its really high skill floor (meaning it’s too much work to get proficient) compared to warrior. Meanwhile, hambow warrior is much easier to get into, but its skill ceiling is low, so there isn’t a lot of room to grow. It’s kind of almost balanced out. A little bit. Maybe.

Please stop putting words in my mouth. I never said that. D/D ele and Hambow are playing similar roles in the current meta, and what I said was that D/D ele is at least a bit more complicated to learn, so the fact that it is able to might stack while being tanky isn’t as bad as warrior which is literally faceroll

BurrTheKing.8571:

I think many of you are looking at this from the wrong angle. It’s not the Warrior, or any one class/spec, that that is to blame. What’s wrong with PvP is that we have tiny little capture points and the fact that one tanky player can totally deny the cap of 2 or more players.

This design means that AoE and tanky builds are going to be prevalent. Hambow wouldn’t be that great if the capture point wasn’t so small. The same goes for condi necros and engis. If the points were larger the builds would still be good, but avoidable without leaving the point. I’m also not a fan of one player being able to deny the cap of 2+. It should definitely slow the progress by a large amount but it being able to stall indefinitely is not a mechanic I’m a fan of.

The playerbase seems to be pretty satisfied with where Warrior is at now. Beating on Hammer or Bow any more would just make them worthless.

this ^

Ugh drunk times. A valid statement but I quoted myself in contradiction – doh!

Kagamiku.9731:

Hambow is only strong because the only game-type benefits a warriors earthshaker or burning firefields. There should be more game modes, warrior is fine where it is.

no

just look in wvw and all this wannabe GvG guilds – they all exploit hammer warrior to aoe stun targets and do imba dmg on stunned targets

i said it months ago – the only OP thing is the trait to do more dmg on stunend targets

a bunkerish build dont has to do dmg and should be nerfed to bunker guardian niveau

bye

edit: oh same for engineers too and necro – when go bunker you should not allowed to do dmg

Darek.1836:

people don’t realize just how strong the double warrior is.
Don’t forget that APeX beat 55HP 2-1 in a scrimm (on NA servers), including a game on legacy that was 70-500.

As you said, it was on NA. Not taking anything away from Apex’s performance ; we failed our opening on legacy and couldn’t come back after this. We said gg at 70-200 something and stopped playing at this point. You can ask them about that. On kyhlo, it was impossible to dodge treb because of latency. And as you pointed out, it was 2-1.
And to finish up, it was supposed to be PRIVATE practice scrims. If you made assumptions on who is better based on practice runs, in any game, you’re making a big mistake. You have no idea how the games went and what went wrong, so be a bro and use something else to make your point.

BurrTheKing.8571:

I think many of you are looking at this from the wrong angle. It’s not the Warrior, or any one class/spec, that that is to blame. What’s wrong with PvP is that we have tiny little capture points and the fact that one tanky player can totally deny the cap of 2 or more players.
This design means that AoE and tanky builds are going to be prevalent. Hambow wouldn’t be that great if the capture point wasn’t so small. The same goes for condi necros and engis. If the points were larger the builds would still be good, but avoidable without leaving the point. I’m also not a fan of one player being able to deny the cap of 2+. It should definitely slow the progress by a large amount but it being able to stall indefinitely is not a mechanic I’m a fan of.

The playerbase seems to be pretty satisfied with where Warrior is at now. Beating on Hammer or Bow any more would just make them worthless.

This exactly. We need larger node. By a lot. Mid point in legacy of the Foefire is decently big, I think every node should be at least as big as this one.

Lopez.7369:

That is completely inaccurate. The comp is even stronger in Legacy because it’s practically impossible to take a large point away from a full bunker team.

That’s only because of the mechanic which make one guy able to anticap a node against any number of ennemies.

no – bigger nodes make it only easier for bunkers and wannabe bunkers jsut running in circles forever

only thing to nerf bunkers would be to tick the cap for the team with more players on node
so when a bunker wanna bunker it forever just bring 2 ppl and decap

but dont know when this would be fun

To be frank, it is a reason why us in TCG does not run double hambow. 1, it is cheesy. But 2, it is not OP. It is surely counterable. I read a few comments here about “because that class or spec didnt reach finals obviously it needs buff or what not” or “look at final teams obviously WAR needs nerf”.

I bet they could have pracced with only 1 WAR also and probably hit the finals anyways.

People seem to be so harsh at judging a mere 10days since a huge patch that made a lot of impact on both gameplay such as theorycraft.

I can tell you already that I didnt see anybody using the most “OP” things yet on ToL NA. We The Civilized Gentlemen didnt find our complete perfected line-up with builds yet. We already noticed a lot of other things that we didnt even use in the EU ToL just a few days after.

I’m simply stating, stop being so drastic in judgement and basing all of your ideas off of this ToL in NA. Some talk about buffs and nerfs like thats the answer to your issues. Its fun how people just cant stand maybe not being as superior as you they think they are. Simply train with mates and become better instead of shoving the NERF-towel into the winners face.