Guild Wars 2

Zoutsha.1093:

Mrbig.8019:

Zoutsha.1093:

The problem with that bo5 thing is that there are big differences between the maps. I dont know if u realized but with our comp there was no way to win on foefire. In bo5 TP had to win 1x niflhel or khylo and it was over. Before our second match on niflhel i told my team that we need to win this although it was 2:1 for CC cause i knew we gonna loose foefire again. We didnt complain cause after winnig good teams with 2 nec on foefire we felt confident to win TP aswell (big mistake) and after lossing our first match on foefire it was too late to say “öhhhhm guys we dont want to play bo5 anymore”. Thats why super and posi are complaning. No one tried to turn the final into TP favor but unfortunately for us it happend.

it doesn’t change the fact you had another chance to win back in nifhel, when TP lost very often.

You were 2-1, in nifhel ( again, that silly map when TP loses so much and you win so much) you had a chance to go 3-1 and close the match.

Yet you lost, that was your fault.

You agreed playing Bo5 by pressing ready and playing it, chances were fair for both teams ( at least regarding Bo5 scenario), the only “unfair” thing was CC had to play for 5 hours while TP was fresh and clean.

THIS is the real matter and the one you should complain about, because it’s simply not fair.

Altough, tbh, it also happens it soccer tournaments like Fifa World Cup, when the first ones playing semi-finals have 1 more day to rest than the the second ones.

Ofc this tournament had no need for this to happen, they could have easily put your semi-finals tomorrow, and there would not be any problem.

I can feel ya.

Great match anyway, CC is a great team, don’t be such kittens.

dude im not complaining. I would say niflhel is 60%:40% for CC, Foefire is 90% for TP khylo is 50%:50% so bo3 is actually not bad for CC. Best of 5 turns everything cause we couldnt win foefire and TP had a chance to win Niflhel or Khylo. Our second match on Niflhel was very good we won the first teamfight and had 2 points and then TP killed our thief offpoint and Teldo won a 2v1 on far. 2 mistakes and we lost the game. You cant compare that to foefire we couldve stayed in our base cause there was no chance. Im sure we wouldve lost a best of 9 vs NN aswell cause their advantage on foefire is bigger than CCs on niflhel.
TP deserved to win they played amazing im not question that at all.

I just can’t get it.

Bo5 doesn’t change anything, since you have 2 equal scenarios

Bo3

Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins
Khylo -> fair

Solution

In a Bo3 scenario, you need to win nifhel, since you know you’re going to lose on foefire.

Everything will be settled on Khylo ( which is a fair map)

Bo5

Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins
Khylo -> fair
Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins

Solution

In this scenario, everything is AGAIN settled on Khylo.
According to statistics ( those ones you said), you’ll lose in Foefire in any case, so the best is to win both Nifhel ( something you should, since you have a slight advantage).

If you win Khylo, and win both Nifhel ( the map where you are favoured), TP has not even a chance to go back to Foefire, and you “ON PAPER” win easily.

Again, eveything is settled on Khylo.

If anything, winning on Khylo should have given you an advantage.

There’s absolutely nothing different in a Bo3 when compared to a Bo5, the only issue , as i said before, is that you could have been tired due to 5 hours of playing, compared to TP whose were fresh and clean ( and you can say you weren’t, but OF COURSE you were).

Nothing else ( not that it doesn’t matter, it’s a very HUGE issue, but absolutely not the issue you’re referring about).

Mrbig.8019:

Zoutsha.1093:

Mrbig.8019:

Zoutsha.1093:

The problem with that bo5 thing is that there are big differences between the maps. I dont know if u realized but with our comp there was no way to win on foefire. In bo5 TP had to win 1x niflhel or khylo and it was over. Before our second match on niflhel i told my team that we need to win this although it was 2:1 for CC cause i knew we gonna loose foefire again. We didnt complain cause after winnig good teams with 2 nec on foefire we felt confident to win TP aswell (big mistake) and after lossing our first match on foefire it was too late to say “öhhhhm guys we dont want to play bo5 anymore”. Thats why super and posi are complaning. No one tried to turn the final into TP favor but unfortunately for us it happend.

it doesn’t change the fact you had another chance to win back in nifhel, when TP lost very often.

You were 2-1, in nifhel ( again, that silly map when TP loses so much and you win so much) you had a chance to go 3-1 and close the match.

Yet you lost, that was your fault.

You agreed playing Bo5 by pressing ready and playing it, chances were fair for both teams ( at least regarding Bo5 scenario), the only “unfair” thing was CC had to play for 5 hours while TP was fresh and clean.

THIS is the real matter and the one you should complain about, because it’s simply not fair.

Altough, tbh, it also happens it soccer tournaments like Fifa World Cup, when the first ones playing semi-finals have 1 more day to rest than the the second ones.

Ofc this tournament had no need for this to happen, they could have easily put your semi-finals tomorrow, and there would not be any problem.

I can feel ya.

Great match anyway, CC is a great team, don’t be such kittens.

dude im not complaining. I would say niflhel is 60%:40% for CC, Foefire is 90% for TP khylo is 50%:50% so bo3 is actually not bad for CC. Best of 5 turns everything cause we couldnt win foefire and TP had a chance to win Niflhel or Khylo. Our second match on Niflhel was very good we won the first teamfight and had 2 points and then TP killed our thief offpoint and Teldo won a 2v1 on far. 2 mistakes and we lost the game. You cant compare that to foefire we couldve stayed in our base cause there was no chance. Im sure we wouldve lost a best of 9 vs NN aswell cause their advantage on foefire is bigger than CCs on niflhel.
TP deserved to win they played amazing im not question that at all.

I just can’t get it.

Bo5 doesn’t change anything, since you have 2 equal scenarios

Bo3

Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins
Khylo -> fair

Solution

In a Bo3 scenario, you need to win nifhel, since you know you’re going to lose on foefire.

Everything will be settled on Khylo ( which is a fair map)

Bo5

Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins
Khylo -> fair
Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins

Solution

In this scenario, everything is AGAIN settled on Khylo.
According to statistics ( those ones you said), you’ll lose in Foefire in any case, so the best is to win both Nifhel ( something you should, since you have a slight advantage).

If you win Khylo, and win both Nifhel ( the map where you are favoured), TP has not even a chance to go back to Foefire, and you “ON PAPER” win easily.

Again, eveything is settled on Khylo.

If anything, winning on Khylo should have given you an advantage.

There’s absolutely nothing different in a Bo3 when compared to a Bo5, the only issue , as i said before, is that you were EXTREMELY TIRED due to 5 hours of playing, compared to TP whose were fresh and clean.

Nothing else ( not that it doesn’t matter, it’s a very HUGE issue, but absolutely not the issue you’re referring about).

We lost on niflhel although we played good thats the difference. Niflhel is not a free win for us like foefire is for TP and since everyone is doing mistakes from time to time its was just a matter of time for TP to win niflhel and the whole final.

Yep its all together but it is how it is u cant change things

You could have just had ended this with your last post but dragging it out to this point is kind of extra… You’re basically implying things by saying that TP already bags a free win from a map. Those percentages of yours hold little to no value seeing as how they’re opinions and most likely incorrect if I were to bring up your past wins against TP and etc. However, good on you for actually displaying sportsmanlike qualities. BO5 isn’t a huge difference from a BO3 as shown in Mrbig’s post. CC and TP are both amazing teams with records to show it. Those were good matches and everyone should be looking to improve instead of taking up matters that have already passed. I say GG and onwards to the next tournament.

Zoutsha.1093:

Mrbig.8019:

Zoutsha.1093:

Mrbig.8019:

Zoutsha.1093:

The problem with that bo5 thing is that there are big differences between the maps. I dont know if u realized but with our comp there was no way to win on foefire. In bo5 TP had to win 1x niflhel or khylo and it was over. Before our second match on niflhel i told my team that we need to win this although it was 2:1 for CC cause i knew we gonna loose foefire again. We didnt complain cause after winnig good teams with 2 nec on foefire we felt confident to win TP aswell (big mistake) and after lossing our first match on foefire it was too late to say “öhhhhm guys we dont want to play bo5 anymore”. Thats why super and posi are complaning. No one tried to turn the final into TP favor but unfortunately for us it happend.

it doesn’t change the fact you had another chance to win back in nifhel, when TP lost very often.

You were 2-1, in nifhel ( again, that silly map when TP loses so much and you win so much) you had a chance to go 3-1 and close the match.

Yet you lost, that was your fault.

You agreed playing Bo5 by pressing ready and playing it, chances were fair for both teams ( at least regarding Bo5 scenario), the only “unfair” thing was CC had to play for 5 hours while TP was fresh and clean.

THIS is the real matter and the one you should complain about, because it’s simply not fair.

Altough, tbh, it also happens it soccer tournaments like Fifa World Cup, when the first ones playing semi-finals have 1 more day to rest than the the second ones.

Ofc this tournament had no need for this to happen, they could have easily put your semi-finals tomorrow, and there would not be any problem.

I can feel ya.

Great match anyway, CC is a great team, don’t be such kittens.

dude im not complaining. I would say niflhel is 60%:40% for CC, Foefire is 90% for TP khylo is 50%:50% so bo3 is actually not bad for CC. Best of 5 turns everything cause we couldnt win foefire and TP had a chance to win Niflhel or Khylo. Our second match on Niflhel was very good we won the first teamfight and had 2 points and then TP killed our thief offpoint and Teldo won a 2v1 on far. 2 mistakes and we lost the game. You cant compare that to foefire we couldve stayed in our base cause there was no chance. Im sure we wouldve lost a best of 9 vs NN aswell cause their advantage on foefire is bigger than CCs on niflhel.
TP deserved to win they played amazing im not question that at all.

I just can’t get it.

Bo5 doesn’t change anything, since you have 2 equal scenarios

Bo3

Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins
Khylo -> fair

Solution

In a Bo3 scenario, you need to win nifhel, since you know you’re going to lose on foefire.

Everything will be settled on Khylo ( which is a fair map)

Bo5

Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins
Khylo -> fair
Nifhel -> CC advantage ( slightly)
Foefire -> TP wins

Solution

In this scenario, everything is AGAIN settled on Khylo.
According to statistics ( those ones you said), you’ll lose in Foefire in any case, so the best is to win both Nifhel ( something you should, since you have a slight advantage).

If you win Khylo, and win both Nifhel ( the map where you are favoured), TP has not even a chance to go back to Foefire, and you “ON PAPER” win easily.

Again, eveything is settled on Khylo.

If anything, winning on Khylo should have given you an advantage.

There’s absolutely nothing different in a Bo3 when compared to a Bo5, the only issue , as i said before, is that you were EXTREMELY TIRED due to 5 hours of playing, compared to TP whose were fresh and clean.

Nothing else ( not that it doesn’t matter, it’s a very HUGE issue, but absolutely not the issue you’re referring about).

We lost on niflhel although we played good thats the difference. Niflhel is not a free win for us like foefire is for TP and since everyone is doing mistakes from time to time its was just a matter of time for TP to win niflhel and the whole final.

You said it, everyone can do mistakes.

Imo, one of those reasons why you did mistakes in the second nifhel is because you were tired ( you can deny it, but it’s a fact).

This is baffling in my opinion, no one should face a fresh team after a session of 5 hours, it’s like if in a fighting demonstration your opponent comes after a quick workout while you’ve been under a training session of 3 hours ( it happened to me in real life, i can feel ya ) and you got demolished because you were so tired you were not even able to rise a leg for a mid-kick.

That’s how i see it.

Again, if you played correctly in nifhel and won khylo ( as you did) you could easily win TP: the odds were in your favour.

I have got a couple of questions

a.WHY would they fit in the semi-finals the same day of the qualified matches?
b.WHY was it thought that having an X Team well and rested vs an X team without rest?

And Xeph,

“Regardless if Arenanet wanted us there or not”

Arenanet Officially wanted TP to win. In fact it wants TP to win Pax. Do you understand the damage it does for the game to have the company that created it to want one team to win it? You know why it damages the game?

Side effects,

a. Rumors – The game is balanced the way TP sees balance.
b.Conspiracies – TP started the first day so it could have a day worth of rest.
c.Mistrust – There is no reason to compete with TP because Arenanet will always favor them.

TP proceeded to the finals because they earned it.

However how things were handled raised legit questions which unfortunately find ground because of this disgusting favorism of Arenanet.

And Xeph, it is relevant whether Arenanet favored you or not (which we all know the answer). To think that it is irrelevant or that it is “OK” is such a foul statement. I can’t even believe that you find irrelevant of the fact that the company of this game wants your team to win its own tournament.

If something like this happened in other competitive games, people would have been fired.

You should never mix business with pleasure.

PS: This is NOT good for the game.

prozon.3561:

Xeph.4513:

prozon.3561:

Xeph.4513:

prozon.3has 561:

Its no secret that anet want tp on the pax, so relax guys. Takse a look at the past tp was a long time dominating the competetive sczene. The most popluar team outside and also most constantly one. In my opinion its fair send them the Tickets. But i never will get confirm with their abuse play. But this happens to you cc guys also. Hard prefered of anets brainless patching.

Yes because we didn’t win those matches with our own effort, its disgusting the attitude some people bring; regardless if Arenanet wanted us there or not, we had to get there with our own efforts as a team, which we did accomplish, you may spread rumours as you like our accomplishments speak for themselves.

They do. Sure. Just confirmed the best team won. It has norhing to do with rumours, just a analyze of the past month. Casual players never be able to get sth even some ontop one wont get it. I wont put tp on a bad shot, only thing is i cant say ur winning by playing the best there are other reassons pushing your success also

Please inform my daft mind regarding what phantom force is pushing us to win.
I am entranced to find out what conspiracy theory that your going to come up with.

Rly? Serious? You are playing op kitten by months… what was tp before anet decided to make the engi the most broken class in the game? What was tp before anet decided to make the ranger the unbeatable 1v1 monster? Ye right one of many other good teams but not this one man show since april. You seriously think you guys are winning all by best playing? Cmon…..

Ehh, I created the unbeatable 1v1 monster Ranger Spec

It was possible since the beginning of the game to run this type of spec in SPvP as the amulet existed, It wasn’t possible in WvW as the armor wasn’t added later on.

But Anet didn’t “add” anything…

They’ve only made that spec weaker over time.

dawhl.4670:

You could have just had ended this with your last post but dragging it out to this point is kind of extra… You’re basically implying things by saying that TP already bags a free win from a map. Those percentages of yours hold little to no value seeing as how they’re opinions and most likely incorrect if I were to bring up your past wins against TP and etc. However, good on you for actually displaying sportsmanlike qualities. BO5 isn’t a huge difference from a BO3 as shown in Mrbig’s post. CC and TP are both amazing teams with records to show it. Those were good matches and everyone should be looking to improve instead of taking up matters that have already passed. I say GG and onwards to the next tournament.

i couldve ended but since everyone keeps telling that bo5 isnt a big difference i have to answer cause its not true. We had close matches on Niflhel and Khylo but TP stomped us on Foefire cause they could outcomp us. bo3 means we had to win 2 close matches while TP had to win 1 close match. bo5 means we had to win 3 close matches while TP still just had to win 1 close match thats the difference but somehow no one seems to understand.

Xsorus.2507:

prozon.3561:

Xeph.4513:

prozon.3561:

Xeph.4513:

prozon.3has 561:

Its no secret that anet want tp on the pax, so relax guys. Takse a look at the past tp was a long time dominating the competetive sczene. The most popluar team outside and also most constantly one. In my opinion its fair send them the Tickets. But i never will get confirm with their abuse play. But this happens to you cc guys also. Hard prefered of anets brainless patching.

Yes because we didn’t win those matches with our own effort, its disgusting the attitude some people bring; regardless if Arenanet wanted us there or not, we had to get there with our own efforts as a team, which we did accomplish, you may spread rumours as you like our accomplishments speak for themselves.

They do. Sure. Just confirmed the best team won. It has norhing to do with rumours, just a analyze of the past month. Casual players never be able to get sth even some ontop one wont get it. I wont put tp on a bad shot, only thing is i cant say ur winning by playing the best there are other reassons pushing your success also

Please inform my daft mind regarding what phantom force is pushing us to win.
I am entranced to find out what conspiracy theory that your going to come up with.

Rly? Serious? You are playing op kitten by months… what was tp before anet decided to make the engi the most broken class in the game? What was tp before anet decided to make the ranger the unbeatable 1v1 monster? Ye right one of many other good teams but not this one man show since april. You seriously think you guys are winning all by best playing? Cmon…..

Ehh, I created the unbeatable 1v1 monster Ranger Spec

It was possible since the beginning of the game to run this type of spec in SPvP as the amulet existed, It wasn’t possible in WvW as the armor wasn’t added later on.

But Anet didn’t “add” anything…

They’ve only made that spec weaker over time.

Infact spirit ranger was RIDICOLOUS in beta, when GS also had very strong damage and ranger had easy acces to quickness ( lol at 1 quickness GS spam killing whole teams LOLOLOL).

They just re-made some traits, any theorycrafter would came up with such build.

Mrbig.8019:

Xsorus.2507:

prozon.3561:

Xeph.4513:

prozon.3561:

Xeph.4513:

prozon.3has 561:

Its no secret that anet want tp on the pax, so relax guys. Takse a look at the past tp was a long time dominating the competetive sczene. The most popluar team outside and also most constantly one. In my opinion its fair send them the Tickets. But i never will get confirm with their abuse play. But this happens to you cc guys also. Hard prefered of anets brainless patching.

Yes because we didn’t win those matches with our own effort, its disgusting the attitude some people bring; regardless if Arenanet wanted us there or not, we had to get there with our own efforts as a team, which we did accomplish, you may spread rumours as you like our accomplishments speak for themselves.

They do. Sure. Just confirmed the best team won. It has norhing to do with rumours, just a analyze of the past month. Casual players never be able to get sth even some ontop one wont get it. I wont put tp on a bad shot, only thing is i cant say ur winning by playing the best there are other reassons pushing your success also

Please inform my daft mind regarding what phantom force is pushing us to win.
I am entranced to find out what conspiracy theory that your going to come up with.

Rly? Serious? You are playing op kitten by months… what was tp before anet decided to make the engi the most broken class in the game? What was tp before anet decided to make the ranger the unbeatable 1v1 monster? Ye right one of many other good teams but not this one man show since april. You seriously think you guys are winning all by best playing? Cmon…..

Ehh, I created the unbeatable 1v1 monster Ranger Spec

It was possible since the beginning of the game to run this type of spec in SPvP as the amulet existed, It wasn’t possible in WvW as the armor wasn’t added later on.

But Anet didn’t “add” anything…

They’ve only made that spec weaker over time.

Infact spirit ranger was RIDICOLOUS in beta, when GS also had very strong damage and ranger had easy acces to quickness ( lol at 1 quickness GS spam killing whole teams LOLOLOL).

They just re-made some traits, any theorycrafter would came up with such build.

Rofl, i’m sorry, He’s talking about spirit ranger? I thought when he said unbeatable he was referring to something like BM Bunker

Spirit Ranger isn’t unbeatable, and they’ve not done squat for them in comparison to how they were in beta.

Well…this thread is just sad. I’m even more happy TP won after seeing this level of sportsmanship. Sore losers are never fun to cheer for.

Kudos to the members of CC in this thread who seem to actually HAVE sportsmanship though. Good show, the whole matchup was extremely fun to watch and had me on the edge of my seat. This is exactly the kind of thing GW2 needs to make it in esports.

As an aside…lol at the tin foil hat brigade. I love how two members (Xeph and Phanta) having to switch classes a little over 1 week before the tournament is somehow indicative of Anet favoring TP and balancing according to their desires. Lmao…

The broken English makes this drama even better.

TP did actually very well. They even rerolled phanta on nec and xeph on thief and were competitive enough. I’d like to see CC winning outside of the new necro-meta, before coming on the forums and rage after loosing due to suprise-bo5. That’s not professional nor good sportsmanship.
It’s sad to see good players making themselves look bad with such posts.

Asura toon abusers accusing TP of underhanded tactics LOL

TP’s performance has been one of the most consistent on the game. They’ve been helpful for the community. They participate positively on the forums.

People have a reason to be biased in their favor. They actually make this game and the community better compared to the behavior some people make.

And the xenophobia behind the smear campaign on Xeph’s eligibility is just deplorable.

I don’t agree with their balance perspectives all the time, especially Phantaram, but they are amazing community members and players nevertheless.

i didnt noticed that yesterday ,but this is true :
why bo5 after playing few hours by CC ?that is so unfair for them …….
i hope that it will not break CC but make them even better team :
“things that dont kill u ,make u stronger”(i dont know how to translate it properly but should be understood)

beside all of drama ,really good games both teams yesterday ,with games like this u make things that esport needs ,and what makes spvp comunity larger and better

If it was best of three cc would have won.
But it was not best of three. As everyone pointed out, you were all told it was being changed to 5v5 before the game started. By walking out onto that field and hitting ready you agreed to the rules. Only with hindsight did you decide against it.

Don’t get me wrong I was excited to see the underdog win, but this discussion is a non issue imo.

Ixl Super Ixl.7258:

But it was not in the rules, and I am asking for the upcoming tournaments to be more fair, having a team play only 1 match and the other team play for 8h straight is just not fair. I am sure you will at least agree with that.

Yeah it isn’t fair that you guys had to play 8 hours while TP was fresh but that’s how tournaments go, sometimes you get a good draw and sometimes you don’t.

I’ve competed in sports tournaments where the matches are extremely physically gruelling and I’ve had to compete in 3 matches back to back with one minute rest in between while my opponents were resting the entire bracket.

That’s the way it goes, both teams fought extremely well regardless.

Xeph.4513:

Ixl Super Ixl.7258:

lol xeph, we are not whining or anything we are just telling the truth. If we were to whine we would have already complained about an ARAB- UAE- “Xeph” participating in a EU tournament. Don’t even get me started…

Go ahead, complain that I am allowed to participate in the tournament; all the info regarding why I am allowed to be in the tournament has already been announced on the forums; but if you feel like that would be a better option go for it, this topic has already been discussed on the forums, and it was also mentioned that anyone in a similar situation is allowed to participate.

Seems the ‘might be allowed to participate’ part was pretty much a ‘will be allowed to participate’ thing after all, eh? hint hint wink wink nudge nudge

At OP, more than the fact the rule was changed in the last moment, I’d ask WHY exactly was the change made, and especially why so late in (though I suppose the chances of a sincere and truthful answer stand fairly low). Moreover, as some posters already mentioned, you really had no say in the whole affair. However, such changes do drop the TO’s credibility and professionality at a historic low.

You are lucky it wasn’t change to BO7! ;-O

Poor orginisation is always poor in all stuff.

After pax gw2pvp = dead.

btw. none knew that 80% of balance changes since release are made by TPs? It’s well known fact. Some improvments were included when Powerr entered tester team ;-).

TRoopEr.5364:

You are lucky it wasn’t change to BO7! ;-O

Poor orginisation is always poor in all stuff.

After pax gw2pvp = dead.

btw. none knew that 80% of balance changes since release are made by TPs? It’s well known fact. Some improvments were included when Powerr entered tester team ;-).

[citation needed]

No wonder Dhuumfire was hotfixed that fast then!

Honestly what was said in map chat doesn’t matter. It’s the official rules that do. I didn’t see the finals, but if CC won the first two out of three games, and I were ArenaNet, I’d send CC to PAX, not TP.

Rules are rules and you don’t make them up as you go.

Interesting about the previous matches CC had to play on the day being mentioned here a few times. In twitch chat most discussion was that CC would have an advantage playing after a winning streak, whereas TP would be starting cold. No idea if either theory holds water.

Anyway gg to both. It was a good show to watch.

i liked TP untill they started whining about meta on forum ,ofcourse they started whining after they lost like 10 games with CC …..
i dont know why they change rules in the middle of tourney but that is weird….
the best sport attitude for TP would be play this final again ,and it should go from them ,to prove that they are really better than CC ,but things like these are not posiible probably XD

REALLY kittenful way to miss out. Being told you’re playing BO5 seconds before the round, being up after the 3 games the rules said you were going to play, and then dropping the 2 secret bonus games. No surprise after playing for several hours already either.

Everyone in this thread would be screaming and whining their kittening heads off if it happened to them.

tichorum.2415:

Honestly what was said in map chat doesn’t matter. It’s the official rules that do. I didn’t see the finals, but if CC won the first two out of three games, and I were ArenaNet, I’d send CC to PAX, not TP.

Rules are rules and you don’t make them up as you go.

The rules clearly state that the tournament organizer has the final say on all rulings. Meaning that nothing is going to get changed. I don’t think anything needs to be changed. It was definitely a mistep on Mist Leagues part, but CC had plenty of time to complain about this before the match started. If the situation was reversed CC obviously wouldn’t say a thing. They waited to see if the bo5 was to their advantage, and when it wasn’t, they complained.

@CC: You did a really great job at the tournament! The last matches were really close and exciting to watch. It has been a long time since someone was able to beat TP (let’s remember TCG or NN)

Frostedblaze.9017:

tichorum.2415:

Honestly what was said in map chat doesn’t matter. It’s the official rules that do. I didn’t see the finals, but if CC won the first two out of three games, and I were ArenaNet, I’d send CC to PAX, not TP.

Rules are rules and you don’t make them up as you go.

The rules clearly state that the tournament organizer has the final say on all rulings. Meaning that nothing is going to get changed. I don’t think anything needs to be changed. It was definitely a mistep on Mist Leagues part, but CC had plenty of time to complain about this before the match started. If the situation was reversed CC obviously wouldn’t say a thing. They waited to see if the bo5 was to their advantage, and when it wasn’t, they complained.

Rulings are for ambiguous rules. If the TO change a perfectly clear rule mid-tournament it it destroys all confidence in the TO and makes it impossible for any event they hold to be taken seriously.

Now, I don’t particularly care which team won. I just care that the TO was horribly unprofessional and that it affected the outcome of the tournament. In any competitive tournament the rules are absolute. You do not ever change them mid-tournament if you want to be taken seriously. If the final being longer was making it that much more interesting they should have put it in the rules before the tournament.

So much for sportsmanship.

If you don’t agree with something that gets changed right before finals start, you speak up front. If you got disqualified for that, you can complain all day long and everyone would agree with you.
Coming on the forum to complain after a loss, is just being sore losers, and if that’s how CC (well, just 2 of the team actually) is, than it’s better that they didn’t make it to PAX.

One should always be humble in victory and gracious in defeat.

Congrats for both teams, games were really nice!

Congrats on the 5k viewers on twitch (5k on gw2).

And lastly, congrats to the TO. Just want to say, please, don’t change rules mid tournament. TO has to adress teams play okay with the rules, not change them. We will never know what could have happen, and now it’s to late, but next time just respect the own rules you made.

Cheers all.

We can blame CC because they did not refused to play Bo5 after they proposed that, but nobody can deny that changing the match from Bo3 to Bo5 at the last moment was a really bad move.
What those poor guys of CC had to do? Refuse to play and make TP win by forfeit?

I don’t know of course everything about the competitive scene and what’s behind it, but what I’ve gathered in the last few days are the following info:

1. Xeph is not an european resident. His attendance to the tournament was not sure because he did not fit the tournament’s rules but, at the end of the day, Xeph was admitted to play the tournament. Nothing strange if they wanted to allow a top EU player to join the tournament, but if they negated the access to the tournament at some other very good players, as far as I’ve read…

2. Phantaram opened a topic in the sPvP forum informing the developers about the meta and the high damage of Necromancer, in which he admitted he didn’t played that much and he doesn’t have that much experience with. Phantaram is a well known elementalist player and, as far as I know, he doesn’t like that much to go deep into the Water Magic traitline, which may suggests some sort of bias about his opinion.
His feedback was called “unbiased and constructive”, ignoring all the feedback about the Necromancer changes who has been proposed in the Necromancer forum in the past weeks, and an hotfix came few days after the feedback was submitted.
Again, nothing strange if they take into consideration the opinion of a top player, but what makes me wonder is the time the hotfix came out and the fact that it is, in fact, another TP member listened by the developers. What is even stranger is that KarlaGrey opened a topic some times ago (before the hotfix) saying that ANet had a similiar behavior with the [rawr] guild. That topic was dismissed by the ANet saying it spreaded false informations and then it was deleted. At first, I thought that probably ANet was right, but now… I’m not sure anymore.

3. Then we have the Bo5 situation. I’ve watched the tournament and I knew that the match should have been Bo3 but, after 3 match has been played, Grouch stated it will be a Bo5. It completely surpried me and, in fact, I’ve checked the tournament rules just in case I’ve misreaded something but, oddly, rules said everywhere that the final match is Bo3.
Now, changing the rules on the fly right before the match is not-so professional, but what surprises me is that CC won the Bo3 and, again, such an extraordinary action as been taken again in favour of TP.

Now I do now question that TP is a great team formed of great players and they have won because of their efforts, but all of these coincidence can’t be ignored.
If there is nothing behind all of this, then I don’t know what to think.

@Sorrow the topic phantaram about necro has nothing to do with him wanting to lower the competition of other teams using one or gain ANY personal benefit from it ..as you probably know he already had made the switch to necro himself and sticked to that throughout the tournament even after the (minimal) nerf to him by hotfixing dhuumfire.
If he feels his ele is not as viable anymore and that some classes are way too strong he has every right to say so..But dont think that any of the top teams especially in the future would have any (non solvable) problem changing comp and followqing the meta in a matter of weeks of adapting…
People think that tp is affcting balance changes..and yet 2 members were forced to drop their favourite classes after getting beaten up repeatedly by teams that followed the meta earlier..If it was for tp mesm and dps ele would still perform good enough but they dont, i think !

prozon.3561:

Rly? Serious? You are playing op kitten by months… what was tp before anet decided to make the engi the most broken class in the game? What was tp before anet decided to make the ranger the unbeatable 1v1 monster? Ye right one of many other good teams but not this one man show since april. You seriously think you guys are winning all by best playing? Cmon…..

Can I have an autograph?

common sense that anet balance team is small and weak.

They need help. But they take help of players that are interested not in healthy balance but in invest all resource in winning. No matter how.

Team Rawradigm ;d

Avead.5760:

Sorrow the topic phantaram about necro has nothing to do with him wanting to lower the competition of other teams using one or gain ANY personal benefit from it ..as you probably know he already had made the switch to necro himself and sticked to that throughout the tournament even after the (minimal) nerf to him by hotfixing dhuumfire.
If he feels his ele is not as viable anymore and that some classes are way too strong he has every right to say so..But dont think that any of the top teams especially in the future would have any (non solvable) problem changing comp and followqing the meta in a matter of weeks of adapting…
People think that tp is affcting balance changes..and yet 2 members were forced to drop their favourite classes after getting beaten up repeatedly by teams that followed the meta earlier..If it was for tp mesm and dps ele would still perform good enough but they dont

It isn’t as simple as you are depicting it.
TP has a specific build composition which is composed of 5 people. You can’t know how that those change has not affected the tournament, you can’t say it did not went in favour to TP at all, as you can’t say that the fact that they changed Dhuumfire only and leafing spirit rangers and engineers untouched did not favoured TP. But anyway it wasn’t my point.

My point is that the topic opened by Phantaram suddently got dev’s attention and in a really short time window got a fix according to what Phantaram said, completely ignoring all the constructive feedback that has been posted in the Necromancer forum and event the sPvP forum itself.
That’s the point.

wtf sorrow
1. it is not important where xeph comes from – he play in an european team
there are reasons why arenanet said only from some countrys and not all – cause not all allow tournaments like this – it has nothing to do when he is arab european american or chinese or whatver

2.
phantarm opened a thread – yes
he did write nothing, he asked for opinions and people gave – it was constructive postings and comunication from arenanet with players and it was fine so a change in favour for all could be made
maby check forum there is big athread from xeph too about the meta we have and how bad it is – complain bout too?

3. again wtf
i watched stream too and he said atleast 30 min before the match started it would be bo5 and they even made a extra 15 min break for the teams – and again when the teams dont say tehy have a problem with this and agree with pressing the button " i am ready" than everything is fine and complaining now about is just WHINING

jsut stop this bull….. here . people are not stupid and see whats groing on the jealousy from people like this sorrow guy or mustafa from ulgyteam is insane and dont make you guys looking any better.

and @op from this tread here you dont make your team looking any better with this – atleast people will remember CC as bad losers.

have a nice day

sorrow.2364:

3. Then we have the Bo5 situation. I’ve watched the tournament and I knew that the match should have been Bo3 but, after 3 match has been played, Grouch stated it will be a Bo5. It completely surpried me and, in fact, I’ve checked the tournament rules just in case I’ve misreaded something but, oddly, rules said everywhere that the final match is Bo3.
Now, changing the rules on the fly right before the match is not-so professional, but what surprises me is that CC won the Bo3 and, again, such an extraordinary action as been taken again in favour of TP.

Now I do now question that TP is a great team formed of great players and they have won because of their efforts, but all of these coincidence can’t be ignored.
If there is nothing behind all of this, then I don’t know what to think.

I knew it was going to be BO5 way before the matches started, you might want to pay more attention to chat/what they say during/before matches

Well, TP has put a lot of effort in this game themselves to popularize it. It’s no secret they have good connection between A-Net devs. I call this Vitamine B, same story in business-world. You get something that an unknown person wouldn’t get . . . I doubt a member of TP would got banned by saying same things, helseth did. You don’t disqualify your best marketing product, you just don’t do that.
However, overall they’re a fair team of good players, no arrogance and such behaviours. I think these aspects many top-teams have lack of.

Romek.4201:

wtf sorrow
1. it is not important where xeph comes from – he play in an european team
there are reasons why arenanet said only from some countrys and not all – cause not all allow tournaments like this – it has nothing to do when he is arab european american or chinese or whatver

2.
phantarm opened a thread – yes
he did write nothing, he asked for opinions and people gave – it was constructive postings and comunication from arenanet with players was fine so a change in fvour for all could be made
maby check forum there is big athread from xeph too about the meta we have and how bad it is – complain bout too?

3. again wtf
i watched stream too and he said atleast 30 min before the match started it would be bo5 and they even made a extra 15 min break for the teams – and again when the teams dont say tehy have a problem with this and agree with pressing the button " i am ready" than everything is fine and complaining now about is just WHINING

jsut stop this bull….. here . people are not stupid and see whats groing on the jealousy from people like this sorrow guy or mustafa from ulgyteam is insane and dont make you guys looking any better.

and @op from this tread here you dont make your team looking any better with this – atleast people will remember CC as bad losers.

have a nice day

Man, chill out.
There is no reason to get that angry, did I offended you or something?

1. It is important when Xeph comes from when the tournament rules explicitly says that only people resident in EU are allowed to partecipate.

2. The fact that there is a thread by Xeph too proves nothing. You did not get my point.

3. You missed my point again. It doesn’t matter when they said that the match would have been Bo5, I could have not paid enought attention. The point is that they changed the match on the fly, which is an extraordinary decisions who favoured (casually or causally, doesn’t matter) TP. That decision put CC in a bad situations because they played for 5 hours straight, while TP were fresh and rested. As I said, they could have refused to play and let TP win by forfeit, but they didn’t because of their reasons I can understand. Fact stays that changing the rules on the fly which favoured TP again, probably not intentionally, is another coincidence to add to the list.

Romek.4201:

3. again wtf
i watched stream too and he said atleast 30 min before the match started it would be bo5 and they even made a extra 15 min break for the teams – and again when the teams dont say tehy have a problem with this and agree with pressing the button " i am ready" than everything is fine and complaining now about is just WHINING

The point that you are missing is that it’s never ok for the TO to change the rules mid-tournament in a competitive setting. Doesn’t matter how much more interesting it would make the matches. The rules were clear, all matches were BO3. No exceptions. If the final was supposed to be longer that should have been in the rules from the start. Any TO that wants to be taken seriously would never change the rules mid-tournament. Ever.

Romek.4201:

1. it is not important where xeph comes from – he play in an european team
there are reasons why arenanet said only from some countrys and not all – cause not all allow tournaments like this – it has nothing to do when he is arab european american or chinese or whatver

what? many players played for eu teams outside the countries that are allowed. But none of them got treated as Xeph. You call it legal? I say no.

sorrow.2364:

Romek.4201:

wtf sorrow
1. it is not important where xeph comes from – he play in an european team
there are reasons why arenanet said only from some countrys and not all – cause not all allow tournaments like this – it has nothing to do when he is arab european american or chinese or whatver

2.
phantarm opened a thread – yes
he did write nothing, he asked for opinions and people gave – it was constructive postings and comunication from arenanet with players was fine so a change in fvour for all could be made
maby check forum there is big athread from xeph too about the meta we have and how bad it is – complain bout too?

3. again wtf
i watched stream too and he said atleast 30 min before the match started it would be bo5 and they even made a extra 15 min break for the teams – and again when the teams dont say tehy have a problem with this and agree with pressing the button " i am ready" than everything is fine and complaining now about is just WHINING

jsut stop this bull….. here . people are not stupid and see whats groing on the jealousy from people like this sorrow guy or mustafa from ulgyteam is insane and dont make you guys looking any better.

and @op from this tread here you dont make your team looking any better with this – atleast people will remember CC as bad losers.

have a nice day

Man, chill out.
There is no reason to get that angry, did I offended you or something?

1. It is important when Xeph comes from when the tournament rules explicitly says that only people resident in EU are allowed to partecipate.

2. The fact that there is a thread by Xeph too proves nothing. You did not get my point.

3. You missed my point again. It doesn’t matter when they said that the match whould have been Bo5, I could have not paid enought attention. The point is that they changed the match on the fly, which is an extraordinary decitions who favoured (casually or causally) TP.

1. Exactly this is the point. his “resident” is not EU. I can go during holidays to spain. I am spain now? No, Xeph still is arabian-resident, even when change location for some weeks.

2. Romek missed the point

3. Even when they told it in chat. It’s unproffessional and bad organized. Organisators should never change rules during a tournament. The most basic failure you can do.

people stop hating, TP won fair and square. All that talking about TP changing the meta to their favour is nonsense because they had to change 2 classes last week to keep up with the current meta. Xeph from mesmer to thief, no offense but his thief play is not the best around and his team is not used to get refuged so they were breaking stealth more often than it should happen and phantaram on necro from burst/survival to sustain/runforurlife role.

Good luck on the pax all i have to say, well deserved.

and trooper i dont think ur tournament was more organized than this one so stop bashing out

ps: FUNNY SPIRIT RES
http://oi39.tinypic.com/2i8cgwi.jpg

TRoopEr.5364:

common sense that anet balance team is small and weak.

They need help. But they take help of players that are interested not in healthy balance but in invest all resource in winning. No matter how.

Team Rawradigm ;d

As far as I know you’re the guy who advocates playing builds and professions that give you the biggest advantage, so shouldn’t you complimenting them for adapting to the meta rather than bashing them?

I assume and hope you have a bone to pick with one or several of their team members for whatever reason, because it would be even worse if jealousy was the reason for your hypocrisy.

TRoopEr.5364:

Romek.4201:

1. it is not important where xeph comes from – he play in an european team
there are reasons why arenanet said only from some countrys and not all – cause not all allow tournaments like this – it has nothing to do when he is arab european american or chinese or whatver

what? many players played for eu teams outside the countries that are allowed. But none of them got treated as Xeph. You call it legal? I say no.

Didn’t Xeph bypass it by being a student in NA and having to pay flight himself or something like that? I swear i read it somewhere

jim.5380:

and trooper i dont think ur tournament was more organized than this one so stop bashing out

i am single random russian guy.

They are ANET. So you know if my little shop in side of the street is messy – is nothing. But when a Samsung shop is mess – it is disaster.

sorrow.2364:

they played for 5 hours straight

Oh please, like they never played 5 hours straight… And they had plenty of time to rest between the matches.
They played final just after semi-final, so what? When they organize Starcraft 2 tournaments they do it this way, and matches are longer.

jealous – nothing to say more

Vuh.1328:

Didn’t Xeph bypass it by being a student in NA and having to pay flight himself or something like that? I swear i read it somewhere

I’ve read that too, Xeph said it in the topic opened to discuss this fact.
The point still remains, even if he’s a student in NA, he hasn’t the NA citizenship as far I know. Rules has been bended to let him join the tournament, while other players were not allowed.

ExaFlare.1390:

Oh please, like they never played 5 hours straight… And they had plenty of time to rest between the matches.
They played final just after semi-final, so what? When they organize Starcraft 2 tournaments they do it this way, and matches are longer.

They are human being. Human being are subject to tiredness, regardless how good they are and it is a crucial factor for the outcome of a competitive match. It lowers the concentration, the ability to take decisions and reflexes.

Fact is that TP were well rested and fresh and did not played 4 match before the finals.

viivi.2394:

TRoopEr.5364:

common sense that anet balance team is small and weak.

They need help. But they take help of players that are interested not in healthy balance but in invest all resource in winning. No matter how.

Team Rawradigm ;d

As far as I know you’re the guy who advocates playing builds and professions that give you the biggest advantage, so shouldn’t you complimenting them for adapting to the meta rather than bashing them?

I assume and hope you have a bone to pick with one or several of their team members for whatever reason, because it would be even worse if jealousy was the reason for your hypocrisy.

I like people adapting current meta. But not addapting the meta for themself.
They have no necro player – they try to nerf necro. Thats the problem. They still take necro because he is good combo with spirit ranger and stuff,but less experienced as other necros who can use it in full power.

And i have no bone on any gw2 player, i have a biiiiiiiig bone on ANET for disgrasing a big part of community out of tournament for the reason of not willing orginising it and throwing it to mistleague to get a good benefit from advertisment and not interested in community and game itself. money is a power.