Guild Wars 2

fixing page 2 glitch

Face it, they didn’t try to balance turrets, they just took them out of the pvp game.

Xillllix.3485:

Face it, they didn’t try to balance turrets, they just took them out of the pvp game.

Not just the PvP game. They removed any possibility of Turrets ever being viable utility choices in any game mode.

Again, it reflects bad on Anet that the majority of players agreeing with these changes have nothing to contribute to this thread in support of the nerfs other than misinformed, biased, and often rude posts.

Post all the childish comments you want, but it’s plain to see that the nerfs to turrets was the wrong way to handle this.

All those majestic turret engie tears… Delicious…

Evidently, people defending turrets are turret engie mains..

StickerHappy.8052:

All those majestic turret engie tears… Delicious…

Evidently, people defending turrets are turret engie mains..

Sagat.3285:

Can they replace them with “skillful” utilities now? If it’s useless everywhere why is it there in the first place?

Manuhell.2759:

Saying they should “play smart” to overcome the nerf is simply idiotic, if not downright trolling….

And how many times in those “nerf turret engy” posts have the zealous defenders of the turret build rambled off about “outplaying” “play smart” or “out rotate!”

There is no sympathy here.

Turk.5460:

Manuhell.2759:

Saying they should “play smart” to overcome the nerf is simply idiotic, if not downright trolling….

And how many times in those “nerf turret engy” posts have the zealous defenders of the turret build rambled off about “outplaying” “play smart” or “out rotate!”

There is no sympathy here.

The issue is turk that when the turret engies said that before it was actually good advice. Becuase they knew EXACTLY how to kill there own build. The community as a whole CHOSE not to listen. That was a decision they actively made. Hell even ArrDee of ALL PEOPLE says that this was the wrong way to go about it? Holy kittening kitten.

This is a perfect example of what happens when the community refuses to listen to common sense and detailed explanations. We made SEVERAL posts telling step by step how to kill a turret group while taking less than 10% of your health in damage.

You chose not to listen. And instead acted like villagers during the Salem Witch Trials. Listening to a few little girls tell you that turret engineers are the root of all evil.

From a thief perspective, supply drop as the “Ohh crap” button still does a number on me.

Now if I come up on the engi in team fight, then I Immediately switch to shortbow and watch them melt in a couple hits, though a tad hard to do when the engi is concentrated on you with a rifle in a 1v1.

I mean now, the stun, the turret shots, the immobs, and the engi combined are still problematic and I have to find a way out to fight that of which those turrets have a longer range than I do.

But in team fights, thief shortbow can make fairly quick work of that problem.

Gern.2978:

Step back and look at what you are all arguing for: Essentially you want turret engi’s to be an easy faceroll class. Made evident by statements like this:

cut

Those are all you had as your own personal abilities with turret builds before the nerf. Most of your damage and attacks came from turrets. A turrent engi would just sit amongst thier turrets and let them do most of the work.

No, i just said that it can’t be otherwise with the current design.
Thus the solution can’t be achieved by some balancing measure – they have to change the design. And that’s what they should have done to start with.
(for example, something like this post of mine, albeit a copypaste of an older suggestion i made: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/Why-do-people-play-turrets-Brainstorm/4990598)

Gern.2978:

Yes, I do. Very few points have more than 2 access points, and they all have places where you can place that thumper turret by an access point where it is out of LOS, but will still effect an enemy that is approaching. Like I said, you have to tactically place your turrets. And yes, good turret engineers were already doing this, and they wont feel the nerf nearly as badly. bad turret engineers however, could and did just place all their turrets on point, and were still almost as effective as the "good’ turret engineers. Those bad turret engineers are the ones who will feel this nerf the most.

Why should he even stay there at your “access point”? He’ll go for the point, no use spending time at that “access point” if there is no reason to, all the more if you even put a melee turret here (thus moving from there also solves his problem). Sure, you may stall for some seconds, but even with the couple CC you can provide, he’ll just pass over (especially if the other turrets haven’t been placed, thus no CC from them as well). You’ll have to pick it up, wait for the cooldown and reposition it. Not as bad as having it destroyed, but a bad strategy overall.

Gern.2978:

And that is why all of our weapons have some form of CC for survival while you wait for your turret to come off cooldown. Like I have said: you have to play smart, know all of your abilities and when to use them. If all your turrets are dead, you move off point, CC your enemy and use your terrain to get out of LOS, this is a tactic all non-turret engi’s are very aware of and experienced doing. Non-turret engi’s have never been a “fight on point” class. Now turret engi’s have to play similarly.

Yeah, just try stalling for 20s (and i’m being generous here, cause thumper and rocket have a 50s cooldown) with a single launch and a 2s immobilize every 10s. It will work so well, heh.
Having few skills also means that dodging them is all the more important, and their use is also more predictable.
Non-turret engi usually have kits. That means a lot more skills to work with (and guess won’t, they can’t even be destroyed).

Gern.2978:

They can be used as turrets, in the manner that I have just described: You place them around tactically, forcing your enemy to either run around killing your turrets while eating your damage, or eat the damage from your turrets while focusing on you. Yes, ranged is difficult to contend with as a turret engi, but it has always been difficult to deal with as a turret engi and frankly that’s fine. Every class/build should have another class/build that is it’s hard counter. Turret engi’s have always been very hard for melee builds to deal with, and fairly easy for ranged builds to deal with, and that dynamic hasn’t changed if you play your turret intelligently.

The “manner you have described” is to put a melee turret – that, i should remind, can’t move – in a spot where the opponent has no reason to stay. And since he can just pass over it to achieve his result – get to the point and not being hit by that turret anymore – he’ll just do that. He has no reason at all to bother with it.
There is nothing intelligent in such an action. You’ve just wasted a turret with a 50s cooldown (less if you pick it up, but still…). Why do you think thumper turrets have higher hp than other ones? They’re supposed to stay on the point you want them to protect…since they’re melee turrets (and since they’re there they’ll get mauled, and die if they aren’t sturdy enough). And that’s the same for any other close range turret.
I mean, that’s even in our profession page – they can take control of an area by placing turrets. You control an area where the opponent will have to be in, not one he’ll just pass over.

well its more fun to pvp since the patch.. even noticed a change on ppl humor.

Engie just killed the fun out of it.

Well, it might be an overkill but we are still better off w/o this spec than with it in terms of having fun.

Exciton that may be true for you. But for the people that didn’t play because it was strong but because it was fun to lay? Those guys are screwed completely.

Shaogin.2679:

and no amount of “skill” will will be required to defeat a Turret Engi.

A build which requires no skill to play it can be beaten with no skill. Sounds quite balanced for me.

StickerHappy.8052:

All those majestic turret engie tears… Delicious…

Evidently, people defending turrets are turret engie mains..

Static Discharge Zerk Engi actually.

Manuhell.2759:

Manuhell.2759:

Saying they should “play smart” to overcome the nerf is simply idiotic, if not downright trolling….

And how many times in those “nerf turret engy” posts have the zealous defenders of the turret build rambled off about “outplaying” “play smart” or “out rotate!”

There is no sympathy here.

Exciton.8942:

Well, it might be an overkill but we are still better off w/o this spec than with it in terms of having fun.

Shylock.4653:

Shaogin.2679:

and no amount of “skill” will will be required to defeat a Turret Engi.

A build which requires no skill to play it can be beaten with no skill. Sounds quite balanced for me.

Again, this just adds to my point I made earlier….

Again, it reflects bad on Anet that the majority of players agreeing with these changes have nothing to contribute to this thread in support of the nerfs other than misinformed, biased, and often rude posts.

Post all the childish comments you want, but it’s plain to see that the nerfs to turrets was the wrong way to handle this.

Shaogin.2679:

Not just the PvP game. They removed any possibility of Turrets ever being viable utility choices in any game mode.

Turret Engi were nearly exclusively used in PvP, because they were bad in every other game-mode. So there is no real collateral damage here. Instead of removing Turrets “completely” from the game anet should have taken a bigger approach and completely rework turrets to make them viable and skillful but not OP in all game-modes.

I went to PvP after this patch. The tears of the Turret Engi tasted ever so sweet

Shylock.4653:

Shaogin.2679:

Not just the PvP game. They removed any possibility of Turrets ever being viable utility choices in any game mode.

Turret Engi were nearly exclusively used in PvP, because they were bad in every other game-mode. So there is no real collateral damage here. Instead of removing Turrets “completely” from the game anet should have taken a bigger approach and completely rework turrets to make them viable and skillful but not OP in all game-modes.

If they changed the auto-attacks to act like an additional skill usage, this would make it a skillful build that acts no different from any other class’s skills except for where the attack is coming from. For example, The rifle turret would not auto-attack. Instead, a powerful rifle shot from it, with a CD of, say, 5 seconds, could be activated by pressing the utility skill button and it would fire at the current target that you have, and if nothing is targeted then it would fire off into the distance. It would act like an extension of your weapon, not like a pet. Almost all of the other turrets could accomplish this too. Even the healing turret could be an AoE ground targeted heal bomb instead of just spitting out regen every few seconds. I might try and make a post about this in the engineer forum to see if it can garner any support.

So turret engis definitely needed a nerf, but ANET did it the wrong way. As I’ve said before, they should have tied turret damage to the stats of the engi. The issue is that someone could spec to be extremely tanky and yet the turrets would still deal a lot of damage.

It should have been higher risk/reward. A tanky engi should have turrets that do virtually no damage. A zerker engi (which you never saw) should have turrets that hit hard.

turret engies are dead. one cast of my bonfire destroys all their turrets. gj anet. this is what happens when u listen to a bunch of vocal noobs.

I find it odd applying fear and torment on a turret.

mistsim.2748:

turret engies are dead. one cast of my bonfire destroys all their turrets. gj anet. this is what happens when u listen to a bunch of vocal noobs.

Does anyone remember those guys who fought me when I said they will be able to die from a single skill and a weapon swap? (Geo+bonfire/combustive etc) but how could I “know without it being live”? Wish we had more people playing this game and designing it with Insight and intuition… Design turrets to be more active and legit skills rather than just making more of your game obsolete… Sigh…

all I know is that whenever one of those “nerf turret engie” threads popped up, I always said something along the lines of “no theyre fine, l2p, kill their turrets, put condis on them”. i handled turret engies on my glassbow, I handled them on my condi bunker, I handled them on my medi guard. I have never played an engie.

problem is people don’t know how to time their dodges and do other skill-based maneuvers so they get on the forums and cry. anet listens, spec dead. like totally dead dead.

mistsim.2748:

turret engies are dead. one cast of my bonfire destroys all their turrets. gj anet. this is what happens when u listen to a bunch of vocal noobs.

Reminds me of how Beast-master ranger and spirit ranger got butchered and never returned to their former glory.
Thanks to the community, ranger once turned into an utter piece of trash for a very long time until they finally return some power back to ranger,

I tried a few games today. The turrets go down way too fast. I think it could be useful and balanced if they reduced the recharge on them. Maybe one of the traits could give a buff to rifles so the Engi does a bit more damage. Perhaps something that buffs rifles and rifle turret.

either reduce recharge or give them 50-100% more HP. it was totally unnecessary to completely destroy the spec. I hope they don’t leave this issue for the next two years.

also, this is what happens WHEN YOU DONT TEST THINGS PROPERLY ANET. builds get KILLED.

Turk.5460:

Manuhell.2759:

Saying they should “play smart” to overcome the nerf is simply idiotic, if not downright trolling….

And how many times in those “nerf turret engy” posts have the zealous defenders of the turret build rambled off about “outplaying” “play smart” or “out rotate!”

There is no sympathy here.

When your build is destroyed you’ll get none either.

mistsim.2748:

either reduce recharge or give them 50-100% more HP. it was totally unnecessary to completely destroy the spec. I hope they don’t leave this issue for the next two years.

also, this is what happens WHEN YOU DONT TEST THINGS PROPERLY ANET. builds get KILLED.

Wasn’t tested even for a second. Shambolic shamefully bad balancing.

I loved watching my teammate Warrior shred turrets in seconds. This patch is kind of funny, shows how submissive Anet can be. Why nerf when you can shred a build?

Aidenwolf.5964:

mistsim.2748:

either reduce recharge or give them 50-100% more HP. it was totally unnecessary to completely destroy the spec. I hope they don’t leave this issue for the next two years.

also, this is what happens WHEN YOU DONT TEST THINGS PROPERLY ANET. builds get KILLED.

Wasn’t tested even for a second. Shambolic shamefully bad balancing.

That’s because there isn’t a balance team at ANET. If you think this is bad, wait until specializations come out. Be very afraid.

Turret engi are terrible now but its prob the way it should be. That said I would still prob rather fight the pre nerf turret engi over a shoutbow war.

Turrets should be able to crit and be based on your crit chance and be able to take boons there now its fair

If turrets take damage like a glass cannon ele they need to do zerker ele damage. Even fully traited turrets last seconds against even a downed players attacks… Its pathetic and Anet have destroyed a build they put into the game.

Think turret engineers weren’t meant to exist? Look at the traits… Some of us loved this playstyle and it’s been obliterated on a whim. I don’t care if players dislike turrets I dislike shoutbow and medi hammer guardians which are both absolute cheese but they’re still around.

Fix turrets now. If they take damage they need regen.

Shadelang.3012:

The issue is turk that when the turret engies said that before it was actually good advice. Becuase they knew EXACTLY how to kill there own build. The community as a whole CHOSE not to listen. That was a decision they actively made.

And now after the nerf people are giving sound advice to engies, such as place turrets away from each other, don’t stand within cleave distance of your turret, etc.

Hell even ArrDee of ALL PEOPLE says that this was the wrong way to go about it? Holy kittening kitten.

Who? Unless whoever this is works for Anet, why should their opinion matter to anyone but themselves?

This is a perfect example of what happens when the community refuses to listen to common sense and detailed explanations. We made SEVERAL posts telling step by step how to kill a turret group while taking less than 10% of your health in damage.

Pretty deep in the denial, were you, pal? As a theif, without the engy even being there, turrets would take over two thirds of my health by the time I capped the point they were placed on. That’s not killing them, that’s actively evading their attacks to the best of my ability. Actually damaging them would mean sacrificing my dodges and evades….I don’t even know why I’m arguing this point, its over, you lost, adapt. L2P

Turk.5460:

Shadelang.3012:

The issue is turk that when the turret engies said that before it was actually good advice. Becuase they knew EXACTLY how to kill there own build. The community as a whole CHOSE not to listen. That was a decision they actively made.

And now after the nerf people are giving sound advice to engies, such as place turrets away from each other, don’t stand within cleave distance of your turret, etc.

Hell even ArrDee of ALL PEOPLE says that this was the wrong way to go about it? Holy kittening kitten.

Who? Unless whoever this is works for Anet, why should their opinion matter to anyone but themselves?

This is a perfect example of what happens when the community refuses to listen to common sense and detailed explanations. We made SEVERAL posts telling step by step how to kill a turret group while taking less than 10% of your health in damage.

Pretty deep in the denial, were you, pal? As a theif, without the engy even being there, turrets would take over two thirds of my health by the time I capped the point they were placed on. That’s not killing them, that’s actively evading their attacks to the best of my ability. Actually damaging them would mean sacrificing my dodges and evades….I don’t even know why I’m arguing this point, its over, you lost, adapt. L2P

Turrets only fire every 2 seconds… Learn to dodge

Now all they need to do is nerf stealth and Mesmers similarly and we’d have a game.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Turrets only fire every 20 seconds… Learn to dodge

Rifle turret – rate of fire 2s
Flame turret – rate of fire 3s
Net turret – rate of fire 10s
Rocket turret – rate of fire 4s
Thumper turret – rate of fire 3s

Your credibility – zero

;3

No one played on turret engis because they were good. They played on them because quite the opposite. They wanted free wins, whether or not they knew how to play well. Now that Turrets can be killed by things other than smart zerkers w/ ranged that actually was able to fight on a point against one, no one is using them.

People only use the next “easy” thing. In this pvp environment, the way turrets were, they were game-breaking. No other class that has AI-controlled summons did anything near what turret engis did. Mesmers have phantasms but no where near the survivability. Liches (Necros) have a thousand things following them around and it makes it inconvenient to target them sometimes but they are ultimately all useless.

Turrets on the other hand dealt heavy damage to light and medium, and CC’d any weight a ridiculous amount of times way too often. If you weren’t on zerker and used ranged weps to target most smartly-placed turrets, then you effectively were useless against a turret engi (a good one anyway but I found it hard to pair “good” with turret builds).

If you actually enjoyed playing on a turret engi, then go right ahead and keep using it. The only difference now is that you don’t have a ridiculous lifeline that allows you to stay alive against 3 people at a time while running around on a point. It’s only more sad to see how everyone completely ditched Turrets now that they have a vulnerability like all other classes — it shows the true colors of the people that used to play on them.

I haven’t fought one turret engi within the last 3 days of active pvping. Sad part is I’ve encountered double if not triple the amount of shoutbows — talk about moving to the next ridiculous build that 3/5 of teams on average are composed of. It’s quite sad.

Johje Holan.4607:

Now all they need to do is nerf stealth and Mesmers similarly and we’d have a game.

A good mesmer can kill you within 10 seconds; a better player can easily learn when to dodge and know when to disengage the mesmer and kill the phantasms first. An even better mesmer knows to place the clones in a place that will require the enemy to leave the point in order to kill them (assuming they don’t have ranged).

Mesmers don’t need a nerf. If you are talking about shatter builds then I find them no more of a problem than any other class. One dodge or stun break and their shatter is wasted, be weary of their clones — if they are close to you then the shatter will be instant, keep a distance and when you see them running to you just dodge towards them and crisis averted.

Ashern.5328:

Johje Holan.4607:

Now all they need to do is nerf stealth and Mesmers similarly and we’d have a game.

A good mesmer can kill you within 10 seconds; a better player can easily learn when to dodge and know when to disengage the mesmer and kill the phantasms first. An even better mesmer knows to place the clones in a place that will require the enemy to leave the point in order to kill them (assuming they don’t have ranged).

Mesmers don’t need a nerf. If you are talking about shatter builds then I find them no more of a problem than any other class. One dodge or stun break and their shatter is wasted, be weary of their clones — if they are close to you then the shatter will be instant, keep a distance and when you see them running to you just dodge towards them and crisis averted.

If only it were that simple.

Could really say the same about any spike build; fresh air ele for instance, if they are on high alert they are able to survive a while if their attunements are properly rotated and also deliver crazy spikes. Their tradeoff is getting squished when not prepared. Mesmers have it no easier and have less survivability. Classes that trait heavily into spike-related kills aren’t a problem because they are killed just as quick. In a 2 vs 1 a spike-build will always lose. 1 vs 1 however, that’s just an unfortunate match up and you should just avoid them.

Turret engis on the other hand were the complete opposite. They dealt spike-worthy damage if all their turrets were overcharged and also spammed CCs like crazy, not to mention gaining pretty much every boon from each turret. Half the time while you were trying to pick their turrets off (would be impossible for condi), you’d be getting dead or useless because while you spent all that time, the engi was still holding the point getting pips/per sec.

Turk.5460:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Turrets only fire every 20 seconds… Learn to dodge

Rifle turret – rate of fire 2s
Flame turret – rate of fire 3s
Net turret – rate of fire 10s
Rocket turret – rate of fire 4s
Thumper turret – rate of fire 3s

Your credibility – zero

;3

Meant 2s I fixed the error

As for street cred I’ve killed you in pvp

Aidenwolf.5964:

Turk.5460:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Turrets only fire every 20 seconds… Learn to dodge

Rifle turret – rate of fire 2s
Flame turret – rate of fire 3s
Net turret – rate of fire 10s
Rocket turret – rate of fire 4s
Thumper turret – rate of fire 3s

Your credibility – zero

;3

Meant 2s I fixed the error

As for street cred I’ve killed you in pvp

Shots fired! (Every 2 seconds)

Ashern.5328:

If you actually enjoyed playing on a turret engi, then go right ahead and keep using it. The only difference now is that you don’t have a ridiculous lifeline that allows you to stay alive against 3 people at a time while running around on a point. It’s only more sad to see how everyone completely ditched Turrets now that they have a vulnerability like all other classes — it shows the true colors of the people that used to play on them.

I haven’t fought one turret engi within the last 3 days of active pvping. Sad part is I’ve encountered double if not triple the amount of shoutbows — talk about moving to the next ridiculous build that 3/5 of teams on average are composed of. It’s quite sad.

The reason they stopped using turrets wasn’t because they are suddenly balanced with the other professions. it’s because they are now free kills to literally anyone. The turrets don’t have the survivability to last longer than a couple seconds against any kind of pressure, and placing the turrets in unique spots only saves them for a few more seconds so long as the opponent doesn’t have any kind of ranged damage.

So now they are a bunker build that is only effective on certain points on certain maps against opponents who have absolutely no range at all. In other words they are completely non-viable in any form of PVP. They also no longer have the boon production they relied on for survival and their heal skill can be immediately killed with auto attack cleave by accident, so they don’t even have innate sustain beyond their toughness and vitality stats.

The turrets are actually dying faster than necro minions. The big difference there is necro minions can actually move out of AoE. Turrets just die.

AI companions need an overhaul. It needs to go back to the drawing board and start from the scratch.

There is no way for an AI to be viable and not expect people to be angry that it is viable. The current AI system is just bad because it is either useless(spirit weapons) or OP(pre-nerfed turrets). There is no way to get the right balance.

runeblade.7514:

AI companions need an overhaul. It needs to go back to the drawing board and start from the scratch.

There is no way for an AI to be viable and not expect people to be angry that it is viable. The current AI system is just bad because it is either useless(spirit weapons) or OP(pre-nerfed turrets). There is no way to get the right balance.

As an MM lover, I agree. They need better control, less passive damage, better use AND survival from aoe (like turrets had, which wouldn’t be as much of a problem if they weren’t so kitten passive overall), and more pet-player interaction and required* synergy in order to be effective.

Problem is, it’s a far shot from where we are and I don’t think Anet has the resources they want to sink into it. Plus the AI stigma is already so bad because of the initial design of dos sticks…

Mm is still my favorite as it requires a pretty good amount of interaction and control to allow pets to be useful. Unfortunately pets are still bad because of their weakness to AOE and a bit too much passive damage making them strong against lesser skilled players and useless against good teams.

Ah well. I still play MM because I enjoy it’s unique play style and I understand it’s stengths and weaknesses. Haters can keep hating. :P

Ehecatl.9172:

Ashern.5328:

If you actually enjoyed playing on a turret engi, then go right ahead and keep using it. The only difference now is that you don’t have a ridiculous lifeline that allows you to stay alive against 3 people at a time while running around on a point. It’s only more sad to see how everyone completely ditched Turrets now that they have a vulnerability like all other classes — it shows the true colors of the people that used to play on them.

I haven’t fought one turret engi within the last 3 days of active pvping. Sad part is I’ve encountered double if not triple the amount of shoutbows — talk about moving to the next ridiculous build that 3/5 of teams on average are composed of. It’s quite sad.

The reason they stopped using turrets wasn’t because they are suddenly balanced with the other professions. it’s because they are now free kills to literally anyone. The turrets don’t have the survivability to last longer than a couple seconds against any kind of pressure, and placing the turrets in unique spots only saves them for a few more seconds so long as the opponent doesn’t have any kind of ranged damage.

So now they are a bunker build that is only effective on certain points on certain maps against opponents who have absolutely no range at all. In other words they are completely non-viable in any form of PVP. They also no longer have the boon production they relied on for survival and their heal skill can be immediately killed with auto attack cleave by accident, so they don’t even have innate sustain beyond their toughness and vitality stats.

The turrets are actually dying faster than necro minions. The big difference there is necro minions can actually move out of AoE. Turrets just die.

I don’t have any sympathy for turret engis because of this. Goes to show how their turrets were doing all the work against multiple enemies and still killing them. The moment everyone else has a chance to kill the turrets, they are useless. Which goes back to my previous statement: no one played on turret engis because they were good, they did it because they generally didn’t die and killed in the process.

Any build that is able to do what turret engis did were fine. The fact of the matter is that people began to abuse it going with 2, 3+ turret engis on one team and completely shattering the purpose of PvP in the first place — it became PvEvCC. Now as I stated, more and more people are going on shoutbows because it’s the next most ridiculous thing to jam pack into a team..

Ashern.5328:

Ehecatl.9172:

Ashern.5328:

If you actually enjoyed playing on a turret engi, then go right ahead and keep using it. The only difference now is that you don’t have a ridiculous lifeline that allows you to stay alive against 3 people at a time while running around on a point. It’s only more sad to see how everyone completely ditched Turrets now that they have a vulnerability like all other classes — it shows the true colors of the people that used to play on them.

I haven’t fought one turret engi within the last 3 days of active pvping. Sad part is I’ve encountered double if not triple the amount of shoutbows — talk about moving to the next ridiculous build that 3/5 of teams on average are composed of. It’s quite sad.

The reason they stopped using turrets wasn’t because they are suddenly balanced with the other professions. it’s because they are now free kills to literally anyone. The turrets don’t have the survivability to last longer than a couple seconds against any kind of pressure, and placing the turrets in unique spots only saves them for a few more seconds so long as the opponent doesn’t have any kind of ranged damage.

So now they are a bunker build that is only effective on certain points on certain maps against opponents who have absolutely no range at all. In other words they are completely non-viable in any form of PVP. They also no longer have the boon production they relied on for survival and their heal skill can be immediately killed with auto attack cleave by accident, so they don’t even have innate sustain beyond their toughness and vitality stats.

The turrets are actually dying faster than necro minions. The big difference there is necro minions can actually move out of AoE. Turrets just die.

I don’t have any sympathy for turret engis because of this. Goes to show how their turrets were doing all the work against multiple enemies and still killing them. The moment everyone else has a chance to kill the turrets, they are useless. Which goes back to my previous statement: no one played on turret engis because they were good, they did it because they generally didn’t die and killed in the process.

Any build that is able to do what turret engis did were fine. The fact of the matter is that people began to abuse it going with 2, 3+ turret engis on one team and completely shattering the purpose of PvP in the first place — it became PvEvCC. Now as I stated, more and more people are going on shoutbows because it’s the next most ridiculous thing to jam pack into a team..

The reason turret engineers die when you kill the turrets is because they’ve sacrificed every single utility to run turrets. No stealth, no escapes, nothing but the turrets.

Also you just described every defensive build, which is what turret engineers were.

Like someone mentioned, anet should take turrets out and replace them with some skills that people would consider to need actual “skill” to use. Call it “devices” or something. Make these truly OP. Problem solved.

Aidenwolf.5964:

The reason turret engineers die when you kill the turrets is because they’ve sacrificed every single utility to run turrets. No stealth, no escapes, nothing but the turrets.

Also you just described every defensive build, which is what turret engineers were.

Which is why I say again, turret engis were never good to begin with!! And they weren’t just defensive build, they were full on offense as well especially against any zerkers.