Guild Wars 2

There’s no denying that there’s less players in PvP but the fallacy here is that most believe Matchmaking is worse because of it. Now, here’s the ever-so contradicting answer. You’re right. The fallacy is that Matchmaking was Always the culprit. It was a fire cracker turned hand grenade. I will explain by first breaking down what Matchmaking is, bit by bit.

Matchmaking is the system that hands picked players in the GW2 queue pool based on their mmr rating. In the heart of what governs a player’s mmr is the Glicko algorithm. Then you have sub-systems that govers that algorithm based on the type of “quality” Matchmaking has deemed the match to be.

For example, if a player has waited 5 minutes for a game, then Matchmaking will give him higher priority, sort of speak, and give him a near-fair game. You gain or lose mmr based on how high, or low, that quality of match is.

So the next question is, "Why is the quality of matches lower than the previous seasons, if Matchmaking is technically the same? It has to be because of the lower population.

Well… it’s actually because of Matchmaking

• Matchmaking is a broad spectrum of algorithms like the ones I briefly listed above but it gets a lot more complicated. There are other sub-algorithms that “checks” its own algorithm, to limit the number of errors in-said algorithm. The PvP community knows about these algorithms, actually. It’s “duo teams”, “League Division Categories”, even the “Placement Matches”. It’s all part of the system to better the quality of Matchmaking.

It’s missing two big factors though,

• Class Specific Builds
• Class Specific MMR

The lack of Class Specific Builds means that Matchmaking does not include the 81 possible trait combinations a single class can have. Each and every one of these build combinations (not including weapons, sigil & amulet combos) will have their own in-game performance. So changing a build on one professsion is basically an entirely new class on that same profession, according to Matchmaking.

Now.. lets turn our heads to the ever-so-easy-to-blame, PvP Population.

We all know Matchmaking tries to find the fastest, highest quality, of a match for a single player. Matchmaking looks into our player pool for a quality match, but the player pool has lessened. So it has a broader spectrum to search, but we all know these ‘broader spectrum’ are really made up of Divisions Tiers. Player’s in these Divisions are in there based on their performance.

So, how is Matchmaking going to go out of its way, 2 or three Division Tiers over, to choose a single player, that Matchmaking initially picked based on Player mmr, but said player can swap to another class entirely,who may or may not be his main profession to begin with, in that profession’s 1 out of the 81 (or more) build combinations, going to suddenly make a “Good Quality” match?

Riddle me that.

The ideals in this thread are considered Collaborative Development and belongs entirely to ArenaNet, and those affiliated.

Class specific builds would turn this game into something I absolutely don’t want to play. I signed up for Guild Wars 2, not a video game like OW.

At least I think ANET realizes they are not going to be successful trying to compete in that market against well established games with a better system of fixed builds.

Class specific MMR would be lovely. The trouble is they’d have to lock classes, pre-match. The community has shown that they simply don’t have confidence that ANET would handle such a system successfully.

The first requirement for fixing things would be to build trust in the community that match quality is going to be good. That would take a major effort on ANET’s part and I don’t see it happening any time soon.

Ithilwen.1529:

Class specific builds would turn this game into something I absolutely don’t want to play. I signed up for Guild Wars 2, not a video game like OW.

Disagree 100%. Overwatch is considered a “successful game” with a Twitch daily viewership between 20,000 to 25,000. That said, it’s not a Genre to compete against Overwatch. Regardless, I read up on it’s Matchmaking and I want GW2 to be on that level of algorithms.

You could’ve just said “I want profession based MMR” and it would’ve been the same pile of nonsense.

PvP is in a death spiral because:

• HoT elite specs are way too powerful and too forgiving. They took decision making, i.e. skill, out of the game. It’s just not fun to play when everyone has a ton of auto-defenses which allow them to attack continually with no consequence.
• Solo/Duo queue was one of the worst decisions ANet made. It chased away players who like to play with friends and stabbed healthy team-based gameplay in the heart.

Saiyan.1704:

Ithilwen.1529:

Class specific builds would turn this game into something I absolutely don’t want to play. I signed up for Guild Wars 2, not a video game like OW.

Disagree 100%. Overwatch is considered a “successful game” with a Twitch daily viewership between 20,000 to 25,000. That said, it’s not a Genre to compete against Overwatch. Regardless, I read up on it’s Matchmaking and I want GW2 to be on that level of algorithms.

Its a sad godkitten day when we start calling a game successful because there are a certain number of people who aren’t even PLAYING it but rather watching someone else play it on a kitten website.

Saiyan.1704:

Regardless, I read up on [Overwatch]’s Matchmaking and I want GW2 to be on that level of algorithms.

You realize the overall algorithm is nearly identical.

Exedore.6320:

Saiyan.1704:

Regardless, I read up on [Overwatch]’s Matchmaking and I want GW2 to be on that level of algorithms.

You realize the overall algorithm is nearly identical.

It absolutely is not.

I’m not going to explain as to why because I just need to point out to the #1 (some what major) flaw Class Specific Builds.

The above is one of the major flaws of what Matchmaking does not calculate… Overwatch’s MMR is better because of how less their error corrections needs to be.

Population is an issue.

I’ve waited 10 minutes in a queue on a seemingly busy Saturday day, only for my full solo team of gold ~1500 players face against a duo que of Top 20 players with other plats.

There is clearly a problem here.

Dariya.9380:

Population is an issue.

I’ve waited 10 minutes in a queue on a seemingly busy Saturday day, only for my full solo team of gold ~1500 players face against a duo que of Top 20 players with other plats.

There is clearly a problem here.

You didn’t read my post then.

I’ve stated why players complain on population, when these complaints should instead be directed to Matchmaking’s (lack-there-of) algorithms. My explanation is in the original post above..

Saiyan.1704:

Dariya.9380:

Population is an issue.

I’ve waited 10 minutes in a queue on a seemingly busy Saturday day, only for my full solo team of gold ~1500 players face against a duo que of Top 20 players with other plats.

There is clearly a problem here.

You didn’t read my post then.

I’ve stated why players complain on population, when these complaints should instead be directed to Matchmaking’s (lack-there-of) algorithms. My explanation is in the original post above..

Yes I understand it’s cause and effect. And I do agree.

Saiyan.1704:

Exedore.6320:

You realize the overall algorithm is nearly identical.

It absolutely is not.

I’m not going to explain as to why because I just need to point out to the #1 (some what major) flaw Class Specific Builds.

So which do you want? More factors or less?

ANet at one point set the “profession uniqueness” factor to zero. But it seems many people here want it jacked up really high.

Lets just cut it,

GW2 PvP has not been fun since HOT came out. No one really likes playing it, we all like the mechanics of GW2.

Match making doesnt work because no one is playing. Of those not considered no one there rankings are 1200-1800 and guess what those 20 or so players are queing up at same time are screwed.

The PvP population is down because HOT isnt fun. Pro’s wont play because no ESL, Semi Pro to slightly above average wont play because there is no reason and its bothersome.

For instance if a player knows they are a top 200-250 player and in the past season they just missed the top 250 with a 1750 or so they know they can make a few small adjustments to get into the top 200. If they are playing this season, they will make it into the top 150. They know this isnt true. No one wants a medal they truly dont deserve. All the players into the 1800 to 1600 range fall here.

The average players who play well at times, understand the game at times, are the norm to rage. Or they are here for fun and once again HOT is not fun for PvP. This is the vast majority of the game. PvE players, the majority of WvW main players who are also on the dying side of this game since HOT. They are in the 1550 or below range either asking why i have to carry a player dying instantly. With another player wondering why the is being blown up in 5 secs.

Rewards suck, que times sucks, no team play sucks, class diversity sucks, the actual game play of PvP sucks since HOT released.

There is no algorithm for fixing a game that isnt fun to play for veterans and new players in the current GW2 state.

To be somewhat accurate, MMR requires a big enough sample size. This also applies to class/build specific MMR. If someone picks up a class only occasionally (which doesn’t neccessarily mean he is bad at playing it), the class MMR might be less accurate than his account MMR. And if someone plays multiple classes on a regular basis, his performance on those different classes will be reflected by his account MMR. Class/build performance is also not only dependent on the class itself and the ability of the player to play it, but also heavily on team compositions. Being able to pick the right class/build for a match is part of a player’s skill imo and shouldn’t be discouraged.
And locking classes/builds without balancing class/build distribution among the teams can lead to even more unbalanced matches, even if they would be more balanced MMR wise. Banning class stacking would reduce the amount of aviable players even more and the smaller the player pool to choose from, the worse matchmaking will become, no matter how good the algorithm is on paper.

Looking at weekend’s matchmaking.. It’s even worse while in other good games weekends are the most played times.

After 1 match today I decided never again to play Ranked PvP in the weekends (aslong it remains like this) and I think that’s the snowball everyone sane is getting caught by in this game.

Matchmaking is horrible aslong the pool is low.

I think Devs are paying too much time on expac 2 than the game the players are playing right now.

Overwatch matchmaking is incredibly well done. It takes pretty much everything into account. It would be even simpler in GW2 but I feel they lost so much of the player base that limiting class stacking will double queue time. They should still do it however, as it would bring players back.

Also they have a public testing realm with constant balance tweaks. Anet could certainly learn a thing or 2 from other games.

For example with WvW they need to look at like ESO’s modular campaign and guesting system.

Yes it’s the matchmakers fault, nevermore that there’s only 2 legend/ESL players in the entire player pool vs if we are lucky some very good mechanically skilled WvW players. Defo the matchmaker not the fact that every single on of those Legend/ESL players competition has left due to poor balance, poor communication of pro league opportunities or a stagnant game mode.

In other news it’s the builders fault for building houses out of wood which is why the tornado decimated the house even though we almost never get tornadoes.

Xillllix.3485:

Also they have a public testing realm with constant balance tweaks. Anet could certainly learn a thing or 2 from other games.

Jeff says otherwise:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/5yj2zk/ama_request_jeff_kaplan/dew569w/

Population is definitely an issue. But it is not the ONLY issue, however it remains the biggest one. Why even try queuing, if there is not enough players from within your rang to play with/against? You need people who play your gamemode first before you can modify the game mode to suit them.

You guys voted against class specific mmr and locking in the poll and I belive you were one of the no’s falselights. So this is what we get. I would be for class locking class specific mmr AND longer queue if it made for better matches. This system right now unless you one of the top 5%10% of twitch players you have no chance because you have to carry like half of the games to get above about 1600 MMR solo because of the matchmaking. Half of my losses I win like 80% of my fights and thats not good enough I have to win 100% and the occassional 2v1 and 3v2 to carry because I get teammates that are like your kittened little brother cant do anything on there own. I have to be there to wipe there hinies or they get wtfpwnd in seconds.

Even if you fixed match making with class based MMR, unless you balance around the “81 or more possible builds” (which is laughable by meta standards) with a stream lined experience of HARD counter play within the match that didn’t involve switching your class (with a system that is very clunky btw) to something that requires a whole different set of timings and muscle memory; very few people will want to play your game and the population will remain low. Unless you give them enough of an incentive… Like virtually free ascended to use in PvE… lol.

OW is well designed because the controls are virtually the same, switching (which we have removed) is seamless, and proper counter comps can dictate matches.

Every Moba lets you counter build your enemy team during the match.

GW2: You get a bit of time to counter the enemy comp, then hope when your thief switches to druid, he has some idea how to play it because regardless of how easy druid is, hes going to be objectively worse than the other DH hes trying to counter who mains it. (which might be a decent argument for including class based mmr)
Also BTW, not everyone wants to practice every class, and that being a barrier to entry is another deterring factor.

Ithilwen.1529:

Class specific builds would turn this game into something I absolutely don’t want to play. I signed up for Guild Wars 2, not a video game like OW.

The meta has already dictated this to some degree, and I wouldn’t want it to follow the same formula as OW for this game either, but it should balance around the meta builds or at least the play-styles with the idea of not being able to switch in mind, while offering an truly even chance to both teams.

Currently this game does not have that, and that drives people away, and I doubt just “profession based MMR” would solve it. I admit it might make matches more fun, but you’ll still see long queue times.

kdaddy.5431:

Lets just cut it,

GW2 PvP has not been fun since HOT came out. No one really likes playing it, we all like the mechanics of GW2.

Match making doesnt work because no one is playing. Of those not considered no one there rankings are 1200-1800 and guess what those 20 or so players are queing up at same time are screwed.

The PvP population is down because HOT isnt fun. Pro’s wont play because no ESL, Semi Pro to slightly above average wont play because there is no reason and its bothersome.

For instance if a player knows they are a top 200-250 player and in the past season they just missed the top 250 with a 1750 or so they know they can make a few small adjustments to get into the top 200. If they are playing this season, they will make it into the top 150. They know this isnt true. No one wants a medal they truly dont deserve. All the players into the 1800 to 1600 range fall here.

The average players who play well at times, understand the game at times, are the norm to rage. Or they are here for fun and once again HOT is not fun for PvP. This is the vast majority of the game. PvE players, the majority of WvW main players who are also on the dying side of this game since HOT. They are in the 1550 or below range either asking why i have to carry a player dying instantly. With another player wondering why the is being blown up in 5 secs.

Rewards suck, que times sucks, no team play sucks, class diversity sucks, the actual game play of PvP sucks since HOT released.

There is no algorithm for fixing a game that isnt fun to play for veterans and new players in the current GW2 state.

Nothing more to add. Everything has been said. We kinda have the same vision on the french forum.

I don’t get the point if this. you ask a question, answer it, then not really provide a solution that would not work for obvious reasons.

The class balance is the issue.
The skills design is the issue.
The game mode is the issue.
The game is not fair is the issue.
The powercreep is the issue.
Your Game Is Not Fun Is the kittenING ISSUE.

That why Population is not a issue. Population is a result.

steelheart.7386:

You guys voted against class specific mmr and locking in the poll and I belive you were one of the no’s falselights. So this is what we get.

I was 100% on board with the Yes vote.

I think Saiyan’s idea has legs. At the moment low to mid skill level players have NFI what their role in the match is. If we had say 4 set builds per class based around ‘assault, support, defense, roam’ then people can coordinate much better at the beginning of the game. Have nice icons above their heads so you can see what your team is generally doing. Allow these ‘set builds’ to make minor tweaks.

Dota 2 has a much higher skill ceiling, yet even low level players can have a general idea of what to do in a game, not to over-extend, etc, because the UI is good and there is a general idea of ‘classes’. Once players get better they break out of the preconceived class rules at their own pace.

If you compared low skill level players from other competitive games to gw2’s, you’d think the gw2 players are brainless.

Fixing the MMR is, in my opinion, treating the symptomns without treating the problem.
Of course the MMR isn’t the best MMR ever, but the fixing it won’t bring players back cause the problem is that HoT killed the fun.

I mean, look at what came with it. Some classes just have almost perma stability, or an amount of block / evade / invulnerability of the chart.

When you got stun locked and can do absolutly nothing against it, there is no fun. Thanks HoT for that. Some defense / CC skills need to get down. 30 sec CD for a gap closer + 3 sec stun? Way too powerfull. 3 sec block x2 on the same skill that pop an illusion? Way too powerfull. Stab on dodge : guess what?

Remove Elite specializations

Power creep is the death of many games. I have seen it multiple times. It´s a short sighted selling point. HoT power creep, combined with very slow balacing and no further elite (on the same level) also brought down viable builds to a minimum and thus reduced diversity to an unfun level.
Basically if you want to keep a game long term exiting, you have to add options(diversity) without power creep.

Maybe they are trying to bring us back to GW1. Haha. God i miss this game.

I feel like changing a base trait line to “elite” status would solve the issue because then you would have to pick b/w HoT or Core elite spec.

Like make Defense for warrior elite. Now zerkers can’t regen health like mad. It changes the choices you make and makes HoT specs more of a trade off than a bonus.

Saiyan.1704:

It’s missing two big factors though,

• Class Specific Builds
• Class Specific MMR

Though I know what algorithms are, I don’t really understand them, so I have to ask to be 100% sure: Wouldn’t it be super hard to create an algorithm with so many variables, e.g. traits, lines of each class and then make it to work with all other algorithms/ sub-algorithms with an outcome of minimal to none errors?

Yes.

Longer answer:

Anything like this is difficult even with just 9 options. You have to track performance on each class and then hope there are enough data points for all the players that the mmr is accurate. The total of games needed makes it hard to get accurate ratings in a shorter time period with fewer games played.

“Build” takes into account a lot of choices: amulets, traits, utilities, weapons, runes, and sigils. The more you include the more games are required under each to accurately rate you. Swapping a single point may be an improvement on an existing build or a completely different role (dps, sustain, etc). The game has no way of knowing which you intended so it has to redo your rank for your new build.

You could be allowed to mark your builds by role and have that factor into a class/build system without excessive complexity. That said, it relies on players to be good judges of what their build is meant to do. And, it ends up still requiring a lot of games on specific builds to accurately reflect your skill with it.

The match-making is always a hit or miss.

To help versus those issues, the rating system should be dynamic and individual. It should compare the odds you have to win and lose and give rating accordly.

Yesterday, I was with 1 decent thief and 3 no name versus 5 top 25. At least the lost at 350 should had give me some rating, I did manage to carry 200pts on that 350.

It’s why the system is stupid right now, we are not reward for our feat. Going 2v5 because of matchmaking and losing it 350+ should be rewarded like it was in season 1.

Adjust the rating dynamically and your MM issues would be less painful.

Matchmaking isn’t great, but that isn’t the real problem…the problem has always…ALWAYS been about balance.

class stacking is a symptom of crappy balance…such as skills that scale in effectiveness the more of that skill is on the team (cough shield of courage cough).

And like someone said earlier in the thread, the power creep essentially neutered all sense of diversity in matches…i see the same builds all the time, they’ve become too predictable and have remained so overpowered that even though people can predict each other’s moves, they will continue to use the same build because it’s just that powerful.

Gretzel.6790:

Its a sad godkitten day when we start calling a game successful because there are a certain number of people who aren’t even PLAYING it but rather watching someone else play it on a kitten website.

football is populare because a lot of people watch it instead of playing it.
Don’t be angry.

Ambrea.1852:

Maybe they are trying to bring us back to GW1. Haha. God i miss this game.

Since GW2 has been released I’ve never seen a dev post the 3 letters GvG on the forum. GW1 is a classic, like Quake 3 or Unreal Tournament. They can try to remake these great game but they always end up failing because they add on too many gimmicky features before focusing on the core gameplay.

Exedore.6320:

Jeff says otherwise:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/5yj2zk/ama_request_jeff_kaplan/dew569w/

Well at least it prevents completely kittening up classes like with the elementalist.

Kokoro.8437:

right now it IS a gamble, mostly because the game is dead.

dead game means no population -> trash matchmaking.

I assume Matchmaking still attempts to make fair mmr averages teams. So how is it then that certain games are lopsided?

If there’s such a deviation of Plat/Silver/Bronze on one team, shouldn’t the Win/Lose point ratio not be so great? In other words, why in the heck should I be “tested” against players who are not even in my same division, yet lose -21 points (I only gain 9) when there’s only 1 other player in my division on the opposite team? That’s just not fair at all…

I’ve been saying this since late 2014 when they were issuing test seasons… Matchmaking needs to be a smarter system.

Exedore.6320:

…and stabbed healthy team-based gameplay in the heart.

There was no healthy based team play, ranked play for teams was a joke where most of the time they either did not face other teams or when they did they got some team that was so far off their level it was not worth playing, the only useful option for most of this game for teams was scrims.

What mattered to teams (most) were the various weekly tournaments, but guess what they all died off before Anet even introduced solo/duo.

saerni.2584:

I feel like changing a base trait line to “elite” status would solve the issue because then you would have to pick b/w HoT or Core elite spec.

Like make Defense for warrior elite. Now zerkers can’t regen health like mad. It changes the choices you make and makes HoT specs more of a trade off than a bonus.

Been saying something along this line for quite some time. Honestly though i’d convert the old class lines, discipline, illusions, virtues, soulreaping, tools, arcana, trickery, beastmastery and invocation.
In addition, i’d put adrenal health, the problematic trait in defense, into disciplin and interchange it with something else.

There, done, core warriors can become tanky, berserkers are the damage line.

Saiyan.1704:

Exedore.6320:

Saiyan.1704:

Regardless, I read up on [Overwatch]’s Matchmaking and I want GW2 to be on that level of algorithms.

You realize the overall algorithm is nearly identical.

It absolutely is not.

I’m not going to explain as to why because I just need to point out to the #1 (some what major) flaw Class Specific Builds.

The above is one of the major flaws of what Matchmaking does not calculate… Overwatch’s MMR is better because of how less their error corrections needs to be.

OW uses group size and your MMR to determine who you’re matched up against. They don’t use anything else related to your characters to determine your MMR.

It’s also pretty silly to compare a static hero system with a dynamic profession system from two different games.

The boat has long sailed for gw2 pvp to include a class limit in pvp which would’ve solved quite a bit of problems. But them changing the matchmaking rules every season and the dramatic loss of players has them in a corner where their matchmaking seems broken. The only change they need to make is to equalize matchups from grouped players. 2-2-1 vs. 1-1-1-1-1 to 2-1-1-1 vs. 2-1-1-1.

Honestly, though, I’d rather just have automated tournaments at this point.

Ambrea.1852:

Maybe they are trying to bring us back to GW1. Haha. God i miss this game.

I’ve been playing GW1 PvE in preparation for PvP. That game is what? A decade old? Yet, it still has a scene in PvE and PvP. That’s pretty kittening good.

I think the devs should take a close look at what was done right. Perhaps allow us core multiclassing?

In GW1 there are literally dozens of builds for each class and at least 2 or 3 that are optimal for any given game mode.

Some nights, there ( subjectively ) are more players visible in GW1 than GW2.

zinkz.7045:

Exedore.6320:

…and stabbed healthy team-based gameplay in the heart.

There was no healthy based team play, ranked play for teams was a joke where most of the time they either did not face other teams or when they did they got some team that was so far off their level it was not worth playing, the only useful option for most of this game for teams was scrims.

What mattered to teams (most) were the various weekly tournaments, but guess what they all died off before Anet even introduced solo/duo.

Well Zinkz, you didn’t played before October 2015 it seems.

Ithilwen.1529:

Ambrea.1852:

Maybe they are trying to bring us back to GW1. Haha. God i miss this game.

I’ve been playing GW1 PvE in preparation for PvP. That game is what? A decade old? Yet, it still has a scene in PvE and PvP. That’s pretty kittening good.

I think the devs should take a close look at what was done right. Perhaps allow us core multiclassing?

In GW1 there are literally dozens of builds for each class and at least 2 or 3 that are optimal for any given game mode.

Some nights, there ( subjectively ) are more players visible in GW1 than GW2.

lol… core multiclasing will be good for build diversity but will be bad too bad for class balance and mostly imposible in this game without a trait redesign and redistribution to make more like GW1 class basic mechanics all in one trait line(not ellegible for multiclass)

Jourdelune.7456:

The match-making is always a hit or miss.

To help versus those issues, the rating system should be dynamic and individual. It should compare the odds you have to win and lose and give rating accordly.

Yesterday, I was with 1 decent thief and 3 no name versus 5 top 25. At least the lost at 350 should had give me some rating, I did manage to carry 200pts on that 350.

It’s why the system is stupid right now, we are not reward for our feat. Going 2v5 because of matchmaking and losing it 350+ should be rewarded like it was in season 1.

Adjust the rating dynamically and your MM issues would be less painful.

Agree. Often it feels the game punishes you for other players skill or behaviour. Even if this goes in both directions it creates a salty environment. Your personal participation should count much more than just the team end result when it comes to calculate mmr.

If nobody played, would it be a issue?

/thread

It’s better than it used to be, but an algorithm with no pool of players to choose from is close to worthless.

They ran off players by ignoring PvP and doing balance updates once in a blue moon. Even obvious things get put off until the “next balance update”.

The other problem is that they believe people want to play a game that makes them win 50% of the time. Should good players win only 50% of the time? Should bad players win 50% of the time? I could see the logic if it led to close games, but it really doesn’t. All it takes is one bad player on your team or one group of mismatched professions for the MMR algorithm to be useless and the game a wipeout.

The long term solution is to…

a) balance the professions such that certain ones aren’t liabilities if stacked.
b) frequently update/balance the game to address anything missed in a)
c) take more profession specific feedback on the forums.

C) is often overlooked, but it’s really the most important. People want the game to succeed, but their #1 priority is their character. Most people play just one or two regularly, so the secret to getting popularity up is to talk to players about what they really care about. All these polls and general posts about sigils are nice, but it’s missing the forest through the trees.

Jourdelune.7456:

The match-making is always a hit or miss.

To help versus those issues, the rating system should be dynamic and individual. It should compare the odds you have to win and lose and give rating accordly.

Yesterday, I was with 1 decent thief and 3 no name versus 5 top 25. At least the lost at 350 should had give me some rating, I did manage to carry 200pts on that 350.

It’s why the system is stupid right now, we are not reward for our feat. Going 2v5 because of matchmaking and losing it 350+ should be rewarded like it was in season 1.

Adjust the rating dynamically and your MM issues would be less painful.

System in S1 was a great idea, having “hidden” point objectives for the team awarding doing the better you cant againts the odds, but they implemented with mixed q and players learn how xploit it putting low ranked alts in their teams faking the system, geting more points than truly deserved for an easy win.
S1 system could work in a truly solo q environement. players dont have any capability to fake the system, alts of top players would be rocketed to top in few games for their own but not carrying main acounts of friends, and MM issues will not be so painfull as said

Trigr.6481:

If nobody played, would it be a issue?

/thread

That’s why it is a big issue. Because we are getting to the point. The point where nobody plays it anymore. Only reason I am even here on these forums trying to help out. In very minor ways is because I have multiple monitors and can monitor forums, Netflix, and watch my 5 to 10 minute queues in Smite or ESO or whatever.

[img]http://i.imgur.com/zrh7K60.jpg[/img]

Or else I’d completely giving up on yall/GW2 long time ago.

If you assume people play whatever class on whatever build gives them the best chance to win, this whole argument falls apart. Not that many of your matches are being ruined by people playing classes they aren’t experienced with. Getting rid of dailies, and the unique profession requirements for the legendary back piece would do a better job of solving this problem than your suggestions.

The larger the player pool, the better matchmaking will be. This is common sense. You can test this by queueing at different times. Everyone knows matchmaking is better during peak hours.

Having specific builds have specific mmr is very exploitable, nuts, and would destroy queue times. Amulet and profession….I could get on board with this, but it’s not going to solve your matchmaking crisis, and it’d still be exploitable. A power warrior or necro could switch between zerker(paladins for necro), marauder, and destroyer and bend their mmr whichever way they wanted it to go.

crunchyraisin.6054:

If you assume people play whatever class on whatever build gives them the best chance to win, this whole argument falls apart. Not that many of your matches are being ruined by people playing classes they aren’t experienced with. Getting rid of dailies, and the unique profession requirements for the legendary back piece would do a better job of solving this problem than your suggestions.

This is just a couple of several more items that needs addressing. By all means, list which ever you think has higher priority. The bottom line is that matchmaking needs to be smarter.

crunchyraisin.6054:

The larger the player pool, the better matchmaking will be. This is common sense. You can test this by queueing at different times. Everyone knows matchmaking is better during peak hours.

Not something i’m disagreeing with. My OP is a bit more detailed when pointing out what the “issues” are.

crunchyraisin.6054:

Having specific builds have specific mmr is very exploitable, nuts, and would destroy queue times. Amulet and profession….I could get on board with this, but it’s not going to solve your matchmaking crisis, and it’d still be exploitable. A power warrior or necro could switch between zerker(paladins for necro), marauder, and destroyer and bend their mmr whichever way they wanted it to go.

You’re absolutely right but there’s a smart way to do things. This concept idea would be easier if we had profession based mmr. So lets just assume Class MMR Matchmaking was a thing.

You queue with a class running Amulet/Rune with X/X/X treeline. Queue pops and MM picks you based on class and build. The moment queue pops, you cannot alter your build in any way. Game starts without the ability to alter anything build related.

I think that removes any exploitation but correct me if i’m wrong here.