Guild Wars 2

Right now the warrior is nothing more than an extremely glass cannon one-button-wonder with virtually no survivability and very little viability in pvp. Something needs to change.

Here is what i have gathered from playing the warrior in pvp, and why it is not currently viable:

1. Terrible condition removal and healing; unless you want to constantly switch to your horn and blow all your shout cooldowns just to remove a condition that will most likely be immediately reapplied. But hey, that works for them, because if you are horn specced, chances are you have kitten for damage anyways, so you’ll still be useless. Your heals are all long cooldowns, and the only good heal is the one that gives you HP based on your adren level (around 9k), plus refills your adrenaline bar. The healing signet is by far the worst heal in the game, and isnt even for the briefest moment considered when making a build. This also ties in with your laughable mobility; no way to reset the fight except by blowing all your movement skills to try to run away.

2. No class diversity; you arent a warrior, you are a 100b. That is your class name. If you try to use something that doesnt in some way incorporate 100b, then you are a jelly brain, and you arent welcome in my or anyone else’s group, and you can gtfo.

3. Since you are a 100b, that means 2 of 3 traits are picked for you: Frenzy and bull charge. That leaves one choice, and boy, what to choose. Fear me is extremely situational, endure pain doesnt endure pain, banners? (huehuelol), signet? maybe (not really)… basically leaving just one that can be “useful” at any time: balanced stance.
- By useful i mean you can balanced stance to guarantee stomp someone (if they dont do the 10000 possible things to evade stomp), or revive someone (if you dont insta die to AOE), or to stop someone from knocking you over for 8 seconds (because it matters if your 100b warrior is currently knocked down, right?)… or finally to ensure that your 100b combo wont be disrupted by anyone (though it will most likely still miss due to random evades, bad collision, or blinding powder/ageis and every other thing that makes your chance of 100b’ing someone good around 1/10).

4. Broken/useless traits and utility. Traits that increase damage by paltry amounts (5%) based on random situational conditions are almost always a waste. Traits and skills that activate invulnerability are mostly useless and in the wrong trees. Invulnerability skills are useless; endure pain lasts for 3 seconds and doesnt give stability or block condition damage. If you even try to spec defensively, say good bye to at least 20% of your damage, just for the ability to… uhh… remove a few conditions, and hit balanced stance when you get to 50% life (because you’ll definetly only ever get to 50% from being CC’d), or endure pain at 25% life (which to a 100b is about 5k health) so you can still die to condition damage. The only viable trait lines are those that increase your precision, crit damage, and damage increase, because as a 100b, your only goal is damage.

5. Unviability of almost every weapon except the greatsword and possibly the warhammer.
Swords – useless due to low duration bleeds, and resultant inability to bleed stack effectively; useless burst.
Longbow – a complete joke of a weapon; low damage and slow auto attack, random skills that are extremely situational to the point of uselessness; useless burst.
Mace – another useless weapon; higher damage but slow; virtually useless compared to the warhammer; decent burst.
Horn – not even worth swapping from your greatsword.

6a. You are a one trick pony (and henceforth referred as such). The only viable damage comes from a glass cannon burst spec that absolutely always uses greatsword and 100b. No other weapons can register even a paltry fraction of 100b’s damage (except eviscerate).

6b. 100b, being the only pony trick the pony warrior has, is extremely predictable and extremely easy to dodge. This is somewhat due to the fact that bull’s charge has horrible collision problems and regularly misses outright, and the fact that… well, its virtually the only pony trick a pony warrior can do.

6c. Since 100b has such a long animation time, and since 100b freezes you in place, the only way to effectively land a 100b is to use frenzy coupled with bulls charge or another 2 second CC, making the pony only viable every 60 seconds. This isnt even mentioning that if by some miracle your 100b does hit, all they have to do is hit their stunbreaker and dodge, which means you’ll only hit them for around 5k at most (if they are good), and now the pony warrior wont be able to effectively do its pony trick for another 60 seconds.

There are many more reasons why the pony warrior is completely broken for pvp, but these are some of the ones i found most drastic. Some suggestions to make the pony into a real threat are:

1. Make weapons other than greatsword viable; bring up their skills to the usefulness of the greatsword, and rework the skills themselves; random conditions on your skills on an obviously non-condition oriented class is just a waste.
2. Possibly rework 100b, maybe lower the damage but make it mobile.
3. Rework some of the utilities, lower cooldowns (fear me).
4. Fix the swords, increase the bleed durations, rework the skills to make it easier to apply bleeds if possible. At least double the bleed duration on the burst.
5. Fix the collision issues that cause bulls charge to miss, and fix movement skills so you dont end up sword rushing into a wall for 3 seconds while you get pounded on.

Anyways, just some thoughts. I also propose that from now on, we only refer to warriors as either pony warriors, pony tricks, or simply pony’s, until Anet decides to make them an actual class, and not just a build.

Warrior are terrible in PvP because of this flawed perception. 100b warrior are poop at a highly competitive level. Thankfully Greatsword is not the only option. Once you get that idea out of your head you can start to Learn2Play warrior.

Until then save yourself the forum rant time and spend it trying new builds out.

XiL.4318:

Warrior are terrible in PvP because of this flawed perception. 100b warrior are poop at a highly competitive level. Thankfully Greatsword is not the only option. Once you get that idea out of your head you can start to Learn2Play warrior.

Until then save yourself the forum rant time and spend it trying new builds out.

Wrong. 100B is the ONLY viable build at the competitive level. I’d love it if I could use other builds, but they simply aren’t viable in the current metagame. This is what frustrates most warrior players.

Chi Malady.2015:

XiL.4318:

Warrior are terrible in PvP because of this flawed perception. 100b warrior are poop at a highly competitive level. Thankfully Greatsword is not the only option. Once you get that idea out of your head you can start to Learn2Play warrior.

Until then save yourself the forum rant time and spend it trying new builds out.

Wrong. 100B is the ONLY viable build at the competitive level. I’d love it if I could use other builds, but they simply aren’t viable in the current metagame. This is what frustrates most warrior players.

Whaaaa? XIL is right, try other builds. The PROBLEM is that most Warrior want dem big numbarz, instead of playing for their team.

A support warrior is awesome, so much so that my Warrior is now a Banner warrior. I support my team and win most of my matches when I am on him.

Seriously though OP, this is more of a L2P issue. You want to be Burst, but you don’t want to have to suffer what most burst suffers from. Survivability.

Archonis.7249:

Chi Malady.2015:

XiL.4318:

Warrior are terrible in PvP because of this flawed perception. 100b warrior are poop at a highly competitive level. Thankfully Greatsword is not the only option. Once you get that idea out of your head you can start to Learn2Play warrior.

Until then save yourself the forum rant time and spend it trying new builds out.

Wrong. 100B is the ONLY viable build at the competitive level. I’d love it if I could use other builds, but they simply aren’t viable in the current metagame. This is what frustrates most warrior players.

Whaaaa? XIL is right, try other builds. The PROBLEM is that most Warrior want dem big numbarz, instead of playing for their team.

A support warrior is awesome, so much so that my Warrior is now a Banner warrior. I support my team and win most of my matches when I am on him.

Seriously though OP, this is more of a L2P issue. You want to be Burst, but you don’t want to have to suffer what most burst suffers from. Survivability.

I’ve been theorycrafting since BWE1 so I’ve tried just about every build there is to try. I absolutely hate GS+Axe, but I’m forced to play it because all other builds are inferior. I wouldn’t be playing it if given the choice. Go have a look at what the “top teams” are running in tPvP. Barely any of them run a warrior (because the profession is nearly useless), and the ones that do bring one are always running a 100B spec.

It becomes shockingly apparent as soon as you set foot in a match that you aren’t contributing anything to your team if you aren’t running a 100B spec.

One reason for this problem is conquest being the only game mode. Conquest is designed around bunkers and bunker busters. Warriors are not good enough to be bunkers. That leaves the bunker buster role. Unfortunately, warrior condition damage is crap so that leaves us with burst damage. The ultimate burst weapon combo in the warrior’s arsenal is GS and axe. Even then, poor survivability and a complete lack of disengagement skills make the warrior a very easy target to stunlock/focus fire (thief is ultimately superior in the burst role). Other weapon sets might be allowed to shine in another game mode (like DM), but they are useless in conquest.

A LOT of discussion and 2000+ views in this thread about the same topic: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/We-want-the-Warrior-to-have-a-sturdy-body/first

If anyone has any more interesting suggestions and thoughts, that’s a good place to start. ^

Chi Malady.2015:

I’ve been theorycrafting…

This is your only problem. Theorycrafting is the most useless counter productive thing you can possibly do when trying to expand mastery.

Take it from someone who has been playing online games at a competitive level since 1997. Mastery comes with practice, not with forum arguments and quoting wiki. The best players in the world don’t sit on forums talking about what might work, and they don’t spend hours reading tooltips on wiki sites.

We spend our time playing the game and making it do things the developers never intended. Heed some helpful advice here and get off the forums for a month and spend all that time you would have spent reading and posting on actually playing the game and learning what works.

You will then start to notice your level of suck slowly diminish right up to the edge of getting good. You might even get good if you keep off the forums indefinitely and just play.

And before you smart off, I already got good. =P

edit: @zone, not the same topic, and forum advice all needs to come with a single grain of salt. Learning2Play requires time spent playing.

zone.1073:

A LOT of discussion and 2000+ views in this thread about the same topic: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/We-want-the-Warrior-to-have-a-sturdy-body/first

There have been a lot of threads asking for the warrior to be elevated to viable status, and with good reason.

XiL.4318:

Chi Malady.2015:

I’ve been theorycrafting…

This is your only problem. Theorycrafting is the most useless counter productive thing you can possibly do when trying to expand mastery.

Take it from someone who has been playing online games at a competitive level since 1997. Mastery comes with practice, not with forum arguments and quoting wiki. The best players in the world don’t sit on forums talking about what might work, and they don’t spend hours reading tooltips on wiki sites.

We spend our time playing the game and making it do things the developers never intended. Heed some helpful advice here and get off the forums for a month and spend all that time you would have spent reading and posting on actually playing the game and learning what works.

You will then start to notice your level of suck slowly diminish right up to the edge of getting good. You might even get good if you keep off the forums indefinitely and just play.

And before you smart off, I already got good. =P

Go find me one (recent) video of a top team running something other than a 100B spec. This is an RPG that revolves around builds and countering builds. I’ve got the gameplay mechanics mastered. Once you hit that plateau, the game becomes about theorycrafting.

Archonis.7249:

A support warrior is awesome, so much so that my Warrior is now a Banner warrior. I support my team and win most of my matches when I am on him.

Best trolling I’ve seen in awhile, thanks.

I certainly don’t agree with many of the OP’s suggestions, but he does have fair points. Reliable condition removal is a big issue, along with general bugginess of traits and skills. I can deal with limited weapon and build variety since any class typically has 1, rarely 2 viable setups, it’s still a fair point for any class to bring up though.

I’m still having a good time when people talk about being competitive outside of the burst/roam greatsword meta warriors have adopted though.

Chi Malady.2015:

I’ve got the gameplay mechanics mastered

It is hard to Learn2Play when you think you know everything. I could give you a build, show you my videos, and hold your hand while you attempt to copy what I can do, but none of that will help you Learn2Play.

You have to want to Learn or you never will. And as long as you are convinced you are right, you will never get good.

The first thing you learn about chasing the competitive Meta is, you can’t catch the dragon. All you can do is chase it. If you think you have it all figured out the meta just left you in the dust. Pro players are always looking for what they haven’t figured out yet. Always chasing the dragon.

Do you wanna get good, or theorycraft? You can’t do both.

there are a few builds that are quite good acually… its not cuz you dont see many warriors in the current meta that they are not viable… I can even see a warrior work instead of thief since thiefs die in 2 hits anyway. 1tip. dont take frenzy, take the sigil of rage on your gs and get a more usefull utility like fear or balanced stance. Also get runes of lyssa with reduced signet cd, does the trick for me.

TheMerc.4850:

Archonis.7249:

A support warrior is awesome, so much so that my Warrior is now a Banner warrior. I support my team and win most of my matches when I am on him.

Best trolling I’ve seen in awhile, thanks.

I certainly don’t agree with many of the OP’s suggestions, but he does have fair points. Reliable condition removal is a big issue, along with general bugginess of traits and skills. I can deal with limited weapon and build variety since any class typically has 1, rarely 2 viable setups, it’s still a fair point for any class to bring up though.

I’m still having a good time when people talk about being competitive outside of the burst/roam greatsword meta warriors have adopted though.

No trolling.

I am very successful with my Banner Warrior. I am built for support and that is what I do. I see so many 100b Warriors running into the thick of battles and then complain that the got melted. With that build, like the Thief BS burst build need to hang back and wait for an opportunity and get the hell out. They don’t most times, they stand in the sea of enemies and get consumed and then QQ on the forums about being UP and everyone else OP.

People will build their profession for a certain role, but play against it time and time again. They won’t learn or choose to not learn.

Sand Beagle.9867:

Longbow – a complete joke of a weapon; low damage and slow auto attack, random skills that are extremely situational to the point of uselessness; useless burst.

as a longbow warrior i consistently get 200-300 points in Spvp, the burst has a huge area, hits everything repeatedly, applies burning and also acts as a fire field to throw more burns around.

but i do agree that GS is just a league ahead of everything else.

Liewec.2896:

Sand Beagle.9867:

Longbow – a complete joke of a weapon; low damage and slow auto attack, random skills that are extremely situational to the point of uselessness; useless burst.

as a longbow warrior i consistently get 200-300 points in Spvp, the burst has a huge area, hits everything repeatedly, applies burning and also acts as a fire field to throw more burns around.

but i do agree that GS is just a league ahead of everything else.

GS is for r1-10. If you are still using it beyond that you better be using it for fun cause it is not helping you suck less.

XiL.4318:

Liewec.2896:

Sand Beagle.9867:

Longbow – a complete joke of a weapon; low damage and slow auto attack, random skills that are extremely situational to the point of uselessness; useless burst.

as a longbow warrior i consistently get 200-300 points in Spvp, the burst has a huge area, hits everything repeatedly, applies burning and also acts as a fire field to throw more burns around.

but i do agree that GS is just a league ahead of everything else.

GS is for r1-10. If you are still using it beyond that you better be using it for fun cause it is not helping you suck less.

Like Qt-hman? whos probably nearly rank50, and has more Qps than any other warrior, and still runs gs. I guess he sucks?

Yup…another thread with people arguing about something when they haven’t specified

HOTJOIN

or

TOURNAMENT PvP

This is largely the reason for the grossly different views of things. Particularly on the viability of the Warrior in PvP.

So please say what you play when you’re gonna make a statement.

Because there’s a difference between Hotjoin – Free Tournaments – Paid Tournaments

I have successfully played a warrior in both Hotjoin and Free Tournaments and even Paids at times

It’s in Paids where you start to feel useless though and limited to builds because people actually know how to deal with you there. It’s not impossible to play warrior in Paids, you just need a really good team that can make up for you playing a warrior.

Angriff.1935:

Yup…another thread with people arguing about something when they haven’t specified

HOTJOIN

or

TOURNAMENT PvP

This is largely the reason for the grossly different views of things. Particularly on the viability of the Warrior in PvP.

So please say what you play when you’re gonna make a statement.

Because there’s a difference between Hotjoin – Free Tournaments – Paid Tournaments

I have successfully played a warrior in both Hotjoin and Free Tournaments and even Paids at times

It’s in Paids where you start to feel useless though and limited to builds because people actually know how to deal with you there. It’s not impossible to play warrior in Paids, you just need a really good team that can make up for you playing a warrior.

No, i meant what i said. PvP. Both sPvP and tPvP. The warrior excels at neither. You may have more luck in sPvP because the teams are composed of newer players, solo players, and have almost no coordination. In pvp, regardless of type a warrior is one of the least viable classes.

If there was something besides conquest, then yes that statement might be too vague. If there was TDM and CTF, i am betting the warrior would be more useful and a heck of a lot more fun to play, but 5 months in and nothing has changed, so i am not holding my breath for anything besides more conquest.

And like others have said, once you reach a certain point, all that is left is crafting builds (besides teamwork, strategy, tactics obv).

And again, like others have said, the only warrior build right now that is even remotely viable in PvP is the 100b build. Here is why:

No matter what you do or how you do it, another class and another build can do it better. You are not helping your team by playing a gimped class. The 100b build is the only warrior build currently that can be partly useful, due to its high burst damage potential.

Provemewrong

Warriors are extremely team-dependent. They must be constantly supported and babied by the rest of the team – essentially being carried – in order to function. No other class is as team-dependent as Warriors. Every other class functions efficiently on their own, so they can contribute much more to the team than Warriors.

Saeco.7196:

there are a few builds that are quite good acually… its not cuz you dont see many warriors in the current meta that they are not viable… I can even see a warrior work instead of thief since thiefs die in 2 hits anyway. 1tip. dont take frenzy, take the sigil of rage on your gs and get a more usefull utility like fear or balanced stance. Also get runes of lyssa with reduced signet cd, does the trick for me.

Here comes the Big Playasauruz. Watched this warrior work on Sauruz’s stream, and I used this sigil/rune setup on my power necro. It really works people!

Sand Beagle.9867:

No, i meant what i said. PvP. Both sPvP and tPvP. The warrior excels at neither. You may have more luck in sPvP because the teams are composed of newer players, solo players, and have almost no coordination. In pvp, regardless of type a warrior is one of the least viable classes.

If there was something besides conquest, then yes that statement might be too vague. If there was TDM and CTF, i am betting the warrior would be more useful and a heck of a lot more fun to play, but 5 months in and nothing has changed, so i am not holding my breath for anything besides more conquest.

And like others have said, once you reach a certain point, all that is left is crafting builds (besides teamwork, strategy, tactics obv).

And again, like others have said, the only warrior build right now that is even remotely viable in PvP is the 100b build. Here is why:

No matter what you do or how you do it, another class and another build can do it better. You are not helping your team by playing a gimped class. The 100b build is the only warrior build currently that can be partly useful, due to its high burst damage potential.

Provemewrong

Well I’ll just say that because of the lack of coordination and lower skill players, the warrior can be used to greater effect. That’s not the point of my post though.

I’m not really even saying you’re wrong. I was moreso gearing my post towards the people who think warriors are “master of arms” and hail them as the ultimate fighting machine.

I do want the warrior to be more viable for tPvP and I would like to see more build diversity for warriors.

Saeco.7196:

there are a few builds that are quite good acually… its not cuz you dont see many warriors in the current meta that they are not viable… I can even see a warrior work instead of thief since thiefs die in 2 hits anyway. 1tip. dont take frenzy, take the sigil of rage on your gs and get a more usefull utility like fear or balanced stance. Also get runes of lyssa with reduced signet cd, does the trick for me.

Thieves have much more survivability than warriors. A warrior has no way to disengage from a battle. Once you’re in, there is a very good chance you will die if not supported by your teammates. Thieves can just stealth/teleport out of harm’s way.

And Frenzy is a must with GS. There is no way to get off your entire 100B channel without it.

Archonis.7249:

TheMerc.4850:

Archonis.7249:

A support warrior is awesome, so much so that my Warrior is now a Banner warrior. I support my team and win most of my matches when I am on him.

Best trolling I’ve seen in awhile, thanks.

I certainly don’t agree with many of the OP’s suggestions, but he does have fair points. Reliable condition removal is a big issue, along with general bugginess of traits and skills. I can deal with limited weapon and build variety since any class typically has 1, rarely 2 viable setups, it’s still a fair point for any class to bring up though.

I’m still having a good time when people talk about being competitive outside of the burst/roam greatsword meta warriors have adopted though.

No trolling.

I am very successful with my Banner Warrior. I am built for support and that is what I do. I see so many 100b Warriors running into the thick of battles and then complain that the got melted. With that build, like the Thief BS burst build need to hang back and wait for an opportunity and get the hell out. They don’t most times, they stand in the sea of enemies and get consumed and then QQ on the forums about being UP and everyone else OP.

People will build their profession for a certain role, but play against it time and time again. They won’t learn or choose to not learn.

There is no way you are playing at a competitive level running a banner warrior. I can guarantee that.

XiL.4318:

Chi Malady.2015:

I’ve got the gameplay mechanics mastered

It is hard to Learn2Play when you think you know everything. I could give you a build, show you my videos, and hold your hand while you attempt to copy what I can do, but none of that will help you Learn2Play.

You have to want to Learn or you never will. And as long as you are convinced you are right, you will never get good.

The first thing you learn about chasing the competitive Meta is, you can’t catch the dragon. All you can do is chase it. If you think you have it all figured out the meta just left you in the dust. Pro players are always looking for what they haven’t figured out yet. Always chasing the dragon.

Do you wanna get good, or theorycraft? You can’t do both.

You can go ahead and use any build you want. 90% of my warrior playtime has been spent with weapons other than GS+Axe. That doesn’t make those playstyles any more viable. You can be stubborn and play the game your way, to the detriment of your team, or you can conform and play an actual competitive build. The latter isn’t always fun (it certainly isn’t with the warrior), but it’s the only way to contribute optimally in a team fight.

Chi Malady.2015:

And Frenzy is a must with GS. There is no way to get off your entire 100B channel without it.

Well… there are ways. : ) But yes, Warriors are very restricted in builds. Only 1 viable tournament build = broken class that needs to be improved.

@OP

I get your frustration, however I simply don’t buy the statement saying “there is no hope for Warriors” at its current state.

1.) Punishing dodge isn’t exactly impossible with Bulls Charge + Frenzy + HB. There are openings when the dodge or a dodge skill is near its end. Let alone many other ways to land HB (I.E Skull Crack, Flurry).
2.) Look at number 1, learn how to do this and it is a sure kill with HB if you know how to bait out stun breaks. You have yourself, and your team mates to do this. If you can’t capitalize on this as a Warrior then sorry, play an easier class.
3.) Great AoE DPS. With Hundred Blades and Combustive Shot as team damage into consideration, the moment you get downed by good Warrior comps, you will stay down. Unless you’re an Ele in which case is just a broken down state that needs to be fixed. Also the main reason why protecting a Warrior is worth is because any Warrior who knows how to make plays around AoE damage puts A LOT to the table whether be it down state or combat state.
4.) That being said, good Warriors only needs someone to cleanse SLOWS for him simply because most of Warrior survivability comes from mobility such as Whirlwind Attack and Rush, but that isn’t enough due to how the application of slows is ridiculously broken.

I know you’re going to say where are my credentials on my statements?

http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw159_zps1c9804d2.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw133_zpsd696597e.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw167_zpsb1173b53.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw140_zps771280a5.jpg

Try to reach those team scores as a Warrior against competent teams with your team not having any resurrection signet, portal, time warp, an ele, and someone who cleanses slows. I guarantee most of you who try to attempt this won’t even reach half of what me and my team has accomplished through a massive handicap. So if you honestly think I’m spouting BS, think again. I’m not a bad Warrior and I’m pretty confident that I definitely know what needs to be done fix my class without making it broken. More than anyone if I should say.

Warrior needs fixes, I agree. But it doesn’t have to be over-buffed to Ele’s and Mesmer’s level of sleeper where people deny that its broken. Warriors should be balanced to Rangers efficiency, that’s about it.

How I would fix the Warrior without making it broken:

1.) Mobile Strikes now breaks out of slows and immobilize.
2.) Rework the tactics minor traits to something more aggressive.
3.) Fix adrenaline scarcity by completely revamping the adrenaline system to something like the initiative system. This isn’t broken because everyone agrees that the burst skills are fine and isn’t game breaking.
4.) Get rid of useless traits and replace them with better ones. Thick Skin and Precise Strikes are primary examples.
5.) Delays on weapons such as Hammer has got to go.
6.) Heals cleanse slows regardless of having restorative strength or not.
7.) Healing Signet scales with Healing Stat.
8.) Building Momentum becomes baseline.
9.) Shield Stance grants stability for the Shield Stance duration. This is so you don’t have to pop Balanced Stance to defend yourself from block piercing disables.
10.) Leg specialist becomes baseline.

Warrior suddenly becomes fine whether you’re a casual or a competent player.

Schwahrheit.4203:

@OP

I get your frustration, however I simply don’t buy the statement saying “there is no hope for Warriors” at its current state.

1.) Punishing dodge isn’t exactly impossible with Bulls Charge + Frenzy + HB. There are openings when the dodge or a dodge skill is near its end. Let alone many other ways to land HB (I.E Skull Crack, Flurry).
2.) Look at number 1, learn how to do this and it is a sure kill with HB if you know how to bait out stun breaks. You have yourself, and your team mates to do this. If you can’t capitalize on this as a Warrior then sorry, play an easier class.
3.) Great AoE DPS. With Hundred Blades and Combustive Shot as team damage into consideration, the moment you get downed by good Warrior comps, you will stay down. Unless you’re an Ele in which case is just a broken down state that needs to be fixed. Also the main reason why protecting a Warrior is worth is because any Warrior who knows how to make plays around AoE damage puts A LOT to the table whether be it down state or combat state.
4.) That being said, good Warriors only needs someone to cleanse SLOWS for him simply because most of Warrior survivability comes from mobility such as Whirlwind Attack and Rush, but that isn’t enough due to how the application of slows is ridiculously broken.

I know you’re going to say where are my credentials on my statements?

http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw159_zps1c9804d2.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw133_zpsd696597e.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw167_zpsb1173b53.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw140_zps771280a5.jpg

Try to reach those team scores as a Warrior against competent teams with your team not having any resurrection signet, portal, time warp, an ele, and someone who cleanses slows. I guarantee most of you who try to attempt this won’t even reach half of what me and my team has accomplished through a massive handicap. So if you honestly think I’m spouting BS, think again. I’m not a bad Warrior and I’m pretty confident that I definitely know what needs to be done fix my class without making it broken. More than anyone if I should say.

Warrior needs fixes, I agree. But it doesn’t have to be over-buffed to Ele’s and Mesmer’s level of sleeper where people deny that its broken. Warriors should be balanced to Rangers efficiency, that’s about it.

But that still leaves 100B as the only viable spec for warriors. Being that the warrior is the “weapons master” with 19 possible weapon combinations, it’s a travesty that only one weapon set is viable at a competitive level. We should have at least 2-3.

Chi Malady.2015:

Schwahrheit.4203:

@OP

I get your frustration, however I simply don’t buy the statement saying “there is no hope for Warriors” at its current state.

1.) Punishing dodge isn’t exactly impossible with Bulls Charge + Frenzy + HB. There are openings when the dodge or a dodge skill is near its end. Let alone many other ways to land HB (I.E Skull Crack, Flurry).
2.) Look at number 1, learn how to do this and it is a sure kill with HB if you know how to bait out stun breaks. You have yourself, and your team mates to do this. If you can’t capitalize on this as a Warrior then sorry, play an easier class.
3.) Great AoE DPS. With Hundred Blades and Combustive Shot as team damage into consideration, the moment you get downed by good Warrior comps, you will stay down. Unless you’re an Ele in which case is just a broken down state that needs to be fixed. Also the main reason why protecting a Warrior is worth is because any Warrior who knows how to make plays around AoE damage puts A LOT to the table whether be it down state or combat state.
4.) That being said, good Warriors only needs someone to cleanse SLOWS for him simply because most of Warrior survivability comes from mobility such as Whirlwind Attack and Rush, but that isn’t enough due to how the application of slows is ridiculously broken.

I know you’re going to say where are my credentials on my statements?

http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw159_zps1c9804d2.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw133_zpsd696597e.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw167_zpsb1173b53.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw140_zps771280a5.jpg

Try to reach those team scores as a Warrior against competent teams with your team not having any resurrection signet, portal, time warp, an ele, and someone who cleanses slows. I guarantee most of you who try to attempt this won’t even reach half of what me and my team has accomplished through a massive handicap. So if you honestly think I’m spouting BS, think again. I’m not a bad Warrior and I’m pretty confident that I definitely know what needs to be done fix my class without making it broken. More than anyone if I should say.

Warrior needs fixes, I agree. But it doesn’t have to be over-buffed to Ele’s and Mesmer’s level of sleeper where people deny that its broken. Warriors should be balanced to Rangers efficiency, that’s about it.

But that still leaves 100B as the only viable spec for warriors. Being that the warrior is the “weapons master” with 19 possible weapon combinations, it’s a travesty that only one weapon set is viable at a competitive level. We should have at least 2-3.

Suggest that you read his follow up post.

There are other builds and a few tightening of some screws will bring those into a more balanced line.

Most people BELIEVE that there is only one viable tourney build, mainly because they are following what the trend setters are using. Those people discovering the meta are finding things that work for their composition, everyone else is just a carbon copy and thinks that is the only way to compete so only 100B is an option in most Warriors mentality. There are other builds that work well in a team, people aren’t testing. They just want to get in there and win and get their QPs for kittens sake, instead of finding what works and doesn’t like the theorycrafting pro’s that they emulate.

Would like to add that my team is the only team that uses two Long Bow + GS Warriors in NA competitively. Let alone the only team that doesn’t play Mesmer and Ele because those two characters are cheese and is way too forgiving. The point of me putting those pictures up is to show that Warriors are not exactly bad even in competitive play and over-buffing Warriors is the dumbest thing ANET could do right now.

Therefore I suggest only a few simple fixes that would make things a little more balanced. Don’t need to listen to players who lack any form of credibility and reasoning. You know who you are, let the big kids do the work and just sit back

Its like take notes from RIOT games or something. All I have to say to this matter.

Schwahrheit.4203:

Would like to add that my team is the only team that uses two Long Bow + GS Warriors in NA competitively. Let alone the only team that doesn’t play Mesmer and Ele because those two characters are cheese and is way too forgiving. The point of me putting those pictures up is to show that Warriors are not exactly bad even in competitive play and over-buffing Warriors is the dumbest thing ANET could do right now.

Therefore I suggest only a few simple fixes that would make things a little more balanced. Don’t need to listen to players who lack any form of credibility and reasoning. You know who you are, let the big kids do the work and just sit back

Its like take notes from RIOT games or something. All I have to say to this matter.

I have trouble seeing how any of the builds on your page are better than the metagame 100B spec. For example, your GS+LB build is extremely glassy for a class with so few escapes. Your other builds, although unique, don’t fill any particular need in conquest. There is a difference between being good and being optimal. The problem is that very few warrior builds are optimal in conquest.

I agree that only some minor tweaks are needed, but that still isn’t as easy of a job as you may think. Just look at the suggestions you made. I still believe that the simplest solution would be implementing different game modes.

The warrior needs to be able to do something better than the other classes because currently it’s subpar in nearly every role.

Since there are people here who say 100b isn’t the only viable build, can you give a good example (with a bit of detail) of other viable builds? I want to try my warrior for tpvp, but I hate the greatsword and would prefer not to use it. I love the hammer and I think something like hammer/dual axe or hammer/sword/shield with a balanced build would be my ideal in terms of fun, but is it actually viable, or should I just suck it up and run 100b?

Archonis.7249:

Chi Malady.2015:

Schwahrheit.4203:

@OP

I get your frustration, however I simply don’t buy the statement saying “there is no hope for Warriors” at its current state.

1.) Punishing dodge isn’t exactly impossible with Bulls Charge + Frenzy + HB. There are openings when the dodge or a dodge skill is near its end. Let alone many other ways to land HB (I.E Skull Crack, Flurry).
2.) Look at number 1, learn how to do this and it is a sure kill with HB if you know how to bait out stun breaks. You have yourself, and your team mates to do this. If you can’t capitalize on this as a Warrior then sorry, play an easier class.
3.) Great AoE DPS. With Hundred Blades and Combustive Shot as team damage into consideration, the moment you get downed by good Warrior comps, you will stay down. Unless you’re an Ele in which case is just a broken down state that needs to be fixed. Also the main reason why protecting a Warrior is worth is because any Warrior who knows how to make plays around AoE damage puts A LOT to the table whether be it down state or combat state.
4.) That being said, good Warriors only needs someone to cleanse SLOWS for him simply because most of Warrior survivability comes from mobility such as Whirlwind Attack and Rush, but that isn’t enough due to how the application of slows is ridiculously broken.

I know you’re going to say where are my credentials on my statements?

http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw159_zps1c9804d2.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw133_zpsd696597e.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw167_zpsb1173b53.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw140_zps771280a5.jpg

Try to reach those team scores as a Warrior against competent teams with your team not having any resurrection signet, portal, time warp, an ele, and someone who cleanses slows. I guarantee most of you who try to attempt this won’t even reach half of what me and my team has accomplished through a massive handicap. So if you honestly think I’m spouting BS, think again. I’m not a bad Warrior and I’m pretty confident that I definitely know what needs to be done fix my class without making it broken. More than anyone if I should say.

Warrior needs fixes, I agree. But it doesn’t have to be over-buffed to Ele’s and Mesmer’s level of sleeper where people deny that its broken. Warriors should be balanced to Rangers efficiency, that’s about it.

But that still leaves 100B as the only viable spec for warriors. Being that the warrior is the “weapons master” with 19 possible weapon combinations, it’s a travesty that only one weapon set is viable at a competitive level. We should have at least 2-3.

Suggest that you read his follow up post.

There are other builds and a few tightening of some screws will bring those into a more balanced line.

Most people BELIEVE that there is only one viable tourney build, mainly because they are following what the trend setters are using. Those people discovering the meta are finding things that work for their composition, everyone else is just a carbon copy and thinks that is the only way to compete so only 100B is an option in most Warriors mentality. There are other builds that work well in a team, people aren’t testing. They just want to get in there and win and get their QPs for kittens sake, instead of finding what works and doesn’t like the theorycrafting pro’s that they emulate.

It’s extremely difficult to find a counter to the metagame. As soon as you find one, it will become the new metagame. Until then, the current metagame is the most effective way to play this game.

This isnt a L2P issue, you can overcompensate as much as you want, and adapt as much as you want to a broken class, but that doesnt make the class any less broken. I know how to warrior, i spend most of my time creating and testing builds for warrior, and i have done a multitude of different and successful builds. This doesnt change the fact that most of those builds absolutely have to incorporate 100b as the main damage, or that to be viable i have to be glass cannon.

Again, the fact that there are multiple builds for a warrior doesnt change the inviability of those builds in high level pvp, or that 100b is the most useful build to date.

I am sick of running 100b but i have no other option if i want to be at least partially useful to my team.

this build makes it a little better

Titan build
http://www.gw2build.com/builds/simulator.php#1.2.4.11.19.0.28.22.8.0.29.36.47.33.50.8.8.6.80.85.0.92.94.0.0.0.0.121.127.0.138.0.0.20.20.0.20.10

edit:healing surge for more dmg

Fake forum meta is fake.

100b Warrior are useless in competitive PvP as is any other spike damage with zero team support and condition control.

No one posting to the contrary has done anything but smash charge frenzy 100b or some immobilize build variant. Not a single one of them. They all want the boom stick and they want to make it like Thief boom stick cause RAMBO WINS TOURNAMENTS RIGHT GUISE!?!?!?!?!

Learning2play is a choice you must make for yourself. Forcing yourself into the fake forum troll meta is only making bad players stay bad and good players look bad.

Chi Malady.2015:

Saeco.7196:

there are a few builds that are quite good acually… its not cuz you dont see many warriors in the current meta that they are not viable… I can even see a warrior work instead of thief since thiefs die in 2 hits anyway. 1tip. dont take frenzy, take the sigil of rage on your gs and get a more usefull utility like fear or balanced stance. Also get runes of lyssa with reduced signet cd, does the trick for me.

Thieves have much more survivability than warriors. A warrior has no way to disengage from a battle. Once you’re in, there is a very good chance you will die if not supported by your teammates. Thieves can just stealth/teleport out of harm’s way.

And Frenzy is a must with GS. There is no way to get off your entire 100B channel without it.

I disagree, the build that I am talking about has 12 sec of endure pain, 7 k more hp than thiefs and 400 more thoughness and dont forget your 3sec shieldblock. and If you rly have to disengage you have your sword 2, gs 3 and gs5 to escape. I also disagree on frenzy being a must, it will proc most of the time on your first burst anyway with sigil of rage + you dont take double dmg + you have frenzy from traits as well. And even if condi’s are a problem… since I have reduced signet cd I take signet of stamina wich removes ALL conditions + runes of lyssa on a 36 sec and 48sec cooldown. I think that you need a thief wih a warrior though, so when they focus one, the other one can pewpew. Something like Guard / thief/ warrior / ele / mesmer should work I think.

XiL.4318:

Warrior are terrible in PvP because of this flawed perception. 100b warrior are poop at a highly competitive level. Thankfully Greatsword is not the only option. Once you get that idea out of your head you can start to Learn2Play warrior.

Until then save yourself the forum rant time and spend it trying new builds out.

Thx!

There are like 3+ other Builds I know of that are completely viable in tPvP……

PowerBottom.5796:

XiL.4318:

Warrior are terrible in PvP because of this flawed perception. 100b warrior are poop at a highly competitive level. Thankfully Greatsword is not the only option. Once you get that idea out of your head you can start to Learn2Play warrior.

Until then save yourself the forum rant time and spend it trying new builds out.

Thx!

There are like 3+ other Builds I know of that are completely viable in tPvP……

Practice until you feel comfortable enough to make your own build that suits your goals. To be honest, these forums are basically a troll field. Half of what you get is pure trolling, the other half is inadvertent trolling based on using previous trolling as factual evidence to support some theorycrafted nonsense.

The only way to develop mastery is to play the game as often as possible. There just are no shortcuts to being able to pop stun breakers on reflex or time your fields with teamates to apply secondary effects that having meaningful impacts on a consistent basis. You just gotta grind through the mastery like any other MMO element. It is all about how motivated you are to grind yourself into the position you are looking to achieve.

Sand Beagle.9867:

5. Unviability of almost every weapon except the greatsword and possibly the warhammer.
Swords – useless due to low duration bleeds, and resultant inability to bleed stack effectively; useless burst.

This is NOT true. There must be something fundamentally wrong with your sword warrior build. My own (pretty much unique) warrior uses dual swords. I am ALONE able to reach the 25 bleed stack limit. Many hits cause dual bleed (one bleed from the attack itself + bleed from critical). And some bleeds last 20 seconds without any food buffs or using Krait armor etc. The problem is not the amount or duration of the bleeds, but the lack of direct damage. Conditions can be removed way too easily and there goes most of your damage in any condition based build. Off hand sword is currently very unpopular, maybe the most unpopular 2nd hand weapon choice for warrior. Offhand sword skills should have a slightly lower cooldown (maybe 15 and 12 s for skill #4 and #5). And sword skills in general should do a bit more direct damage, maybe at the same time reducing the amount of bleed damage to offset this change. After these minor chances we are fine.

I am not claiming dual swords is as good in pvp. It isn’t. Greatsword is currently overpowered compared to other warrior choices. To fix this:
1. Hundred blades should do less damage, maybe 30% damage nerf
2. Forceful Greatsword trait is the true reason to play greatsword as it stacks might with critical hits. This is too good to be true.

No other warrior weapon gives the mobility and might stacking as the greatsword.

I am not a warrior hater. In fact I have played warrior more than other professions. I think the burst damage of all professions should be toned down. Then we would see less bunkers and more variety in the meta.

Deniara

Deniara Devious.3948:

Sand Beagle.9867:

5. Unviability of almost every weapon except the greatsword and possibly the warhammer.
Swords – useless due to low duration bleeds, and resultant inability to bleed stack effectively; useless burst.

This is NOT true. There must be something fundamentally wrong with your sword warrior build. My own (pretty much unique) warrior uses dual swords. I am ALONE able to reach the 25 bleed stack limit. Many hits cause dual bleed (one bleed from the attack itself + bleed from critical). And some bleeds last 20 seconds without any food buffs or using Krait armor etc. The problem is not the amount or duration of the bleeds, but the lack of direct damage. Conditions can be removed way too easily and there goes most of your damage in any condition based build. Off hand sword is currently very unpopular, maybe the most unpopular 2nd hand weapon choice for warrior. Offhand sword skills should have a slightly lower cooldown (maybe 15 and 12 s for skill #4 and #5). And sword skills in general should do a bit more direct damage, maybe at the same time reducing the amount of bleed damage to offset this change. After these minor chances we are fine.

I am not claiming dual swords is as good in pvp. It isn’t. Greatsword is currently overpowered compared to other warrior choices. To fix this:
1. Hundred blades should do less damage, maybe 30% damage nerf
2. Forceful Greatsword trait is the true reason to play greatsword as it stacks might with critical hits. This is too good to be true.

No other warrior weapon gives the mobility and might stacking as the greatsword.

I am not a warrior hater. In fact I have played warrior more than other professions. I think the burst damage of all professions should be toned down. Then we would see less bunkers and more variety in the meta.

Deniara

Sword has leap just like heartseeker, works from ledges… better than great sword spin. Just sayin. Also Rifle is much better for bleeds, might stacks on crits won’t change your squishy kitten from points on the scorecard of the other team, into a viable synergistic part of your own team.

Schwahrheit.4203:

@OP

I get your frustration, however I simply don’t buy the statement saying “there is no hope for Warriors” at its current state.

1.) Punishing dodge isn’t exactly impossible with Bulls Charge + Frenzy + HB. There are openings when the dodge or a dodge skill is near its end. Let alone many other ways to land HB (I.E Skull Crack, Flurry).
2.) Look at number 1, learn how to do this and it is a sure kill with HB if you know how to bait out stun breaks. You have yourself, and your team mates to do this. If you can’t capitalize on this as a Warrior then sorry, play an easier class.
3.) Great AoE DPS. With Hundred Blades and Combustive Shot as team damage into consideration, the moment you get downed by good Warrior comps, you will stay down. Unless you’re an Ele in which case is just a broken down state that needs to be fixed. Also the main reason why protecting a Warrior is worth is because any Warrior who knows how to make plays around AoE damage puts A LOT to the table whether be it down state or combat state.
4.) That being said, good Warriors only needs someone to cleanse SLOWS for him simply because most of Warrior survivability comes from mobility such as Whirlwind Attack and Rush, but that isn’t enough due to how the application of slows is ridiculously broken.

I know you’re going to say where are my credentials on my statements?

http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw159_zps1c9804d2.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw133_zpsd696597e.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw167_zpsb1173b53.jpg
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg556/andymcdonald/gw140_zps771280a5.jpg

Try to reach those team scores as a Warrior against competent teams with your team not having any resurrection signet, portal, time warp, an ele, and someone who cleanses slows. I guarantee most of you who try to attempt this won’t even reach half of what me and my team has accomplished through a massive handicap. So if you honestly think I’m spouting BS, think again. I’m not a bad Warrior and I’m pretty confident that I definitely know what needs to be done fix my class without making it broken. More than anyone if I should say.

Warrior needs fixes, I agree. But it doesn’t have to be over-buffed to Ele’s and Mesmer’s level of sleeper where people deny that its broken. Warriors should be balanced to Rangers efficiency, that’s about it.

If I was in coach we would have won

Sand Beagle.9867:

Right now the warrior is nothing more than an extremely glass cannon one-button-wonder with virtually no survivability and very little viability in pvp. Something needs to change.

Here is what i have gathered from playing the warrior in pvp, and why it is not currently viable:

1. Terrible condition removal and healing; unless you want to constantly switch to your horn and blow all your shout cooldowns just to remove a condition that will most likely be immediately reapplied. But hey, that works for them, because if you are horn specced, chances are you have kitten for damage anyways, so you’ll still be useless. Your heals are all long cooldowns, and the only good heal is the one that gives you HP based on your adren level (around 9k), plus refills your adrenaline bar. The healing signet is by far the worst heal in the game, and isnt even for the briefest moment considered when making a build. This also ties in with your laughable mobility; no way to reset the fight except by blowing all your movement skills to try to run away.

2. No class diversity; you arent a warrior, you are a 100b. That is your class name. If you try to use something that doesnt in some way incorporate 100b, then you are a jelly brain, and you arent welcome in my or anyone else’s group, and you can gtfo.

3. Since you are a 100b, that means 2 of 3 traits are picked for you: Frenzy and bull charge. That leaves one choice, and boy, what to choose. Fear me is extremely situational, endure pain doesnt endure pain, banners? (huehuelol), signet? maybe (not really)… basically leaving just one that can be “useful” at any time: balanced stance.
- By useful i mean you can balanced stance to guarantee stomp someone (if they dont do the 10000 possible things to evade stomp), or revive someone (if you dont insta die to AOE), or to stop someone from knocking you over for 8 seconds (because it matters if your 100b warrior is currently knocked down, right?)… or finally to ensure that your 100b combo wont be disrupted by anyone (though it will most likely still miss due to random evades, bad collision, or blinding powder/ageis and every other thing that makes your chance of 100b’ing someone good around 1/10).

4. Broken/useless traits and utility. Traits that increase damage by paltry amounts (5%) based on random situational conditions are almost always a waste. Traits and skills that activate invulnerability are mostly useless and in the wrong trees. Invulnerability skills are useless; endure pain lasts for 3 seconds and doesnt give stability or block condition damage. If you even try to spec defensively, say good bye to at least 20% of your damage, just for the ability to… uhh… remove a few conditions, and hit balanced stance when you get to 50% life (because you’ll definetly only ever get to 50% from being CC’d), or endure pain at 25% life (which to a 100b is about 5k health) so you can still die to condition damage. The only viable trait lines are those that increase your precision, crit damage, and damage increase, because as a 100b, your only goal is damage.

5. Unviability of almost every weapon except the greatsword and possibly the warhammer.
Swords – useless due to low duration bleeds, and resultant inability to bleed stack effectively; useless burst.
Longbow – a complete joke of a weapon; low damage and slow auto attack, random skills that are extremely situational to the point of uselessness; useless burst.
Mace – another useless weapon; higher damage but slow; virtually useless compared to the warhammer; decent burst.
Horn – not even worth swapping from your greatsword.

Aww that’s cute, you’re saying warrior is broken.

Sincerely,

-Engineer

Heojaua.6048:

Aww that’s cute, you’re saying warrior is broken.

Sincerely,

-Engineer

We’re both broken.

When custom arenas come out we can have engi vs. warrior showdowns. The rest of the classes can go play in their tournaments, we don’t need them.

Do people in this thread only play hot join or something? There are quite a few top teams who run a warrior of some sort and a grenade or support engi. Pretty sure they’re not useless when played well. I’ve been see’n more and/or more of both classes (specifically engi) making splashes again.

Mabye you could name a few besides TP, where teldo plays engineer and Onibawan, where magz play warrior. They play it in their setup because they can handle the deficit of the class and sure are good-class players. Never the less they are the weakest classes in the game.

100b tends to be the most efficient build at avoiding the warriors innate weakness. Other, more balanced builds tend to fall behind as the longer a fight goes on the worse of a position a warrior is in. This is because the design of the warrior makes a number of compromises for their higher health pool which effect itself diminishes as the fight length increases. Most of their skills have a single functionality compared to other professions multifunctional skills which leads to issues with lower sustained active defense, condition removal and range limitations.

Really I feel the game should promote more of a balanced warrior build. Having the strongest build being glass cannon causes problems at lower skill brackets. A lot of the % multipliers should be shifted to more flat values as well as give warriors stronger trait and skill options that help alleviate some of the compromises they are currently making such that a warrior is actually able to sustain themselves in a fight and fill a role similar to the ele d/d build.

Try to use some FLIP skills and be amazed how many classes you can destroy as a warrior.

Lucifer.3748:

Do people in this thread only play hot join or something? There are quite a few top teams who run a warrior of some sort and a grenade or support engi. Pretty sure they’re not useless when played well. I’ve been see’n more and/or more of both classes (specifically engi) making splashes again.

I can say most players here are Spvp elitist more than Tpvp elitist. I know warriors have limited potential in pvp overall like a few other professions but they can be useful in pvp especially as stun control.