Guild Wars 2

I’ve played enough PvP that’s being plagued by this what I see as unbalanced specialization and frankly its ruining the fun for me. Its Tough, It does a lot of damage, and its got the crowd control to make sure it can get it off. Fighting against them seems to be like fighting against a brick wall where no amount of effort will make a difference. The only Reapers I’ve seen be beaten often seem inexperienced and simply ‘bad’ at PvP and even then it usually takes 2 or more people just to down and finish them in a timely manner. In all honesty I think the Reaper is a bloody cool specialization but I don’t think it’s fair in PvP right now. So I’m asking: Will Reapers be getting a nerf? and How can we do it without ruining the fun of the class?

It’s possible, but nothing is for certain. The main thing with Reaper is that every aspect to it has clear counterplay options. Usually, this just means “kite” as there’s not a lot a Reaper can do to you outside 600 range.

I will say it’s bruiser specs are hellish to deal with, but that was kind of the focus of the specialization anyway. Slow, tough, and gods help you if they catch you. These specs actually do worse in 1v1’s than 1v2’s if you’re not properly coordinated, so if you’re having trouble bringing one down, try soloing it. It sounds counterproductive, but it really can work.

Also, the CC that Reaper brings has 1.25 second cast times. Watch for the animations and dodge/blind/block it. If you don’t, they can’t be stunbroken, so you really are in serious trouble.

It’s potent, but I find roots/cripple/chills on it or just swiftness (maybe even like Runes of Traveler or Speed) tend to do WONDERS. Then again, I play funny specs. They work, they just aren’t “top meta, must copy and play NOW, GIMME YOUR ESPECS” good for most. Read my signature if you don’t believe :^) Willing to help you fight a Reaper, just be warned I got good on Necro before it became a ~thing~ to play.

The only thing that really tickles me is the long-lasting chill that we have as reapers. A lot of times, attacks will try to run away from me while chilled, and end up downed a mile away from me because they couldn’t clear off the chill that was eating them away.

With how much conditions we can spam, a condi cleanse class can’t really do anything against us anymore. The only thing that stops me in my tracks is Resistance, and that’s only if my boon strip + CC chain doesn’t manage to kill the Revenant (yes, i said Revenant. He’s the only class with resistance that can beat a necro).

The frostfire build that is going around is ridiculously good, chill + 3 burns is a good amount of dps by itself (2-3k), not to mention the fact that you’ll have bleeds, poison, weakness…. and i’ll have like 10-25 stacks of might….

Reapers could probably deal a little less chill damage.

yeah, I main reaper and I think its a bit too much right now (then again, so are most of the elite specs). I think the chill trait should be changed back to what it was when the expansion first launched (half dmg when the enemy is above 50% health, normal when below 50%). Maybe even give Shroud 2 a longer CD. Hopefully they don’t go overboard with nerfs again like they did with dhuumfire, where they decided to nerf more then just one op trait or terrormancer where they messed up the curses line and made condi necro garbage for 3 months.

With that in mind, I think regular death shroud could use a buff since its worthless compared to reapers shroud in almost every type of build.

Quaman.9167:

yeah, I main reaper and I think its a bit too much right now (then again, so are most of the elite specs). I think the chill trait should be changed back to what it was when the expansion first launched (half dmg when the enemy is above 50% health, normal when below 50%). Maybe even give Shroud 2 a longer CD. Hopefully they don’t go overboard with nerfs again like they did with dhuumfire, where they decided to nerf more then just one op trait or terrormancer where they messed up the curses line and made condi necro garbage for 3 months.

With that in mind, I think regular death shroud could use a buff since its worthless compared to reapers shroud in almost every type of build.

Honestly, shroud 2 is okay. when you get chilled, its agonizing and often you’ll die waiting for the cooldown. I think the strongest things on Reaper are:

Chill damage- keep its current state, but reduce its damage dealt by a considerable amount. If you revert it back to previous state, it becomes almost worthless (25% nerf in one swoop, if not more).

CC chain – worse than Terrormancer when it was popular. Fear from staff, shroud stability so you cant knock me down, #5 to stun you, spin, #3 to fear you, leave shroud, use scepter to blind….

That, and the combined use of sigils to apply bleed and chill, chill applied by fear, poison, weakness….

A “good” reaper can pick a target and down him within seconds with the amount of crowd control we have available, in combination with the massive amounts of conditions we can apply in a very short frame of time.

Posts like these are ridiculous because as a Reaper I can say exactly the SAME thing about Diamond Skin Auromancer Tempest – It’s literally like hitting a wall. Nothing I could do to drop its HP below 90% when running the Reaper build you are complaining about.

I could say the same thing again with Daredevils.

And yet again with Mallyx/shiro heralds.

That’s 3 counters, to me that says the build is fine.

If you evade/kite the Necro while in Reaper Shroud, then really apply your pressure while the Necro is out of Shroud, you’ll find the advantage. Use cleanses when the Necro hits Shroud as well and just dodge the Executioner’s Scythe. Evade that, and the spin, and if you aren’t getting auto’d you’re taking basically no damage whatsoever.

No amount of additional chill will make it tick any harder than a single application, and if Chill wasn’t doing meaningful damage, Condi Reaper would probably be ejected from the meta again, unless team cleanse is truly lacking these days. Without it, you’re talking periods of burst Poison, and generally slow Bleed application. Maybe some Burning application from Shroud #1, but it seems people have learned that manning up against a Reaper Shrouded Necro isn’t always the best idea.

I really think the perception of how much damage Chill is doing is off from the reality. The only explanations I’ve tried to see about it doing too much damage have fallen incredibly short of convincing me it’s too much. It seems most people think they should survive forever against Condis, and Chill’s unique single-stack pressure means now they don’t.

I’m not really sure what the correct move is. I’d personally like to see a huge wipe of many of the runes/sigils I think exacerbate build issues, but I doubt that’s going to happen.

Reapers, even my cat can play them well.

I’m glad to hear your cat is a better pvper than you. I suggest that you take lessons from him

What is it that people think a Reaper should feasibly be able to do?

i hope not.

i’m enjoying my reaper at the moment.

plus, there are other elite specs that need nerfing.

Cogbyrn.7283:

What is it that people think a Reaper should feasibly be able to do?

This is true: my cat walked across the keyboard and it managed to kill two enemy players as reaper, it was totally hilarious.

Vapour.7348:

Posts like these are ridiculous because as a Reaper I can say exactly the SAME thing about Diamond Skin Auromancer Tempest – It’s literally like hitting a wall. Nothing I could do to drop its HP below 90% when running the Reaper build you are complaining about.

I could say the same thing again with Daredevils.

And yet again with Mallyx/shiro heralds.

That’s 3 counters, to me that says the build is fine.

Thieves in general have always been hard on necros, but I feel like it’s 50/50 when I’m fighting thieves now.

Auramancer/Diamond skin is literally impossible without help.

I can kill Mallyx if i land all my boon strips when I have a fair amount of conditions ready to kill him. And i mean, land EVERY boon strip. Corrupt Boon, Plague Signet, Locust…. then i have a fair chance at killing him. If I miss Corrupt boon, it’s not worth even attempting it.

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

IKR? Even if you don’t have HoT there are three powerful counters, namely 3vs1, 4vs1, and 5vs1. You guys just need to wake up and figure this simple stuff out.

Reaper is in a good spot and I think it’s neither too strong or too weak. I think old chill damage was better and had a more unique feel to it but other than that i think the power level of reaper is where all of the other classes should be. Maybe not quite as tanks by default(it IS still a necro after all) but generally be as fluid as a reaper feels.

And of course, reaper is “so easy” to play now, huh? Seems similar in difficulty as base necro was and I don’t recall anyone ever telling me I won because I was playing an easier class. Lol

Yasha.5963:

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

IKR? Even if you don’t have HoT there are three powerful counters, namely 3vs1, 4vs1, and 5vs1. You guys just need to wake up and figure this simple stuff out.

Base Necro actually does pretty decent against Reaper if you are patient. I would say that Ranger also does decently against Reaper (better than Druid from my experience).

I doubt it, still many teams haven’t used Reapers in last Pro League… we will see if they are more used tomorrow.

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

Using resistance spam or diamond skin has nothing to do with “learning how to counter”. It is just counterbuilding and limited to very few classes. If the only aviable counter is picking the right class and traits, otherwise you can’t do anything, it actually means, there is no real counterplay to condi reaper.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

Using resistance spam or diamond skin has nothing to do with “learning how to counter”. It is just counterbuilding and limited to very few classes. If the only aviable counter is picking the right class and traits, otherwise you can’t do anything, it actually means, there is no real counterplay to condi reaper.

There is counter*play*. Cleanse and kite when the Necro is in Reaper Shroud. Keep slows up and simply dodge away from the Shroud #2, or just make sure to dodge Shroud #5. When the Necro isn’t in Shroud, apply burst/damage/focus/etc. Dodge the LF generating abilities, if you feel inclined to keep the Necro out of Shroud, or dodge the highest damage/condi applying abilities if you want to mitigate the damage potential.

And counterbuilding is part of the game. You expect every class spec to be balanced against every class spec in 1v1? Is that what you think this game is about? If you don’t expect that, then it’s necessarily the case that certain builds will be better against certain other builds. That’s the way the cookie crumbles. If you do expect that, then I think you’ve been misinformed.

Yasha.5963:

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

IKR? Even if you don’t have HoT there are three powerful counters, namely 3vs1, 4vs1, and 5vs1. You guys just need to wake up and figure this simple stuff out.

All you’re doing, Yasha, is making the argument against Reaper look like it’s coming from a group of inflammatory people who aren’t trying to form a logical argument.

TimTWW.5867:

I’ve played enough PvP that’s being plagued by this what I see as unbalanced specialization and frankly its ruining the fun for me. Its Tough, It does a lot of damage, and its got the crowd control to make sure it can get it off. Fighting against them seems to be like fighting against a brick wall where no amount of effort will make a difference. The only Reapers I’ve seen be beaten often seem inexperienced and simply ‘bad’ at PvP and even then it usually takes 2 or more people just to down and finish them in a timely manner. In all honesty I think the Reaper is a bloody cool specialization but I don’t think it’s fair in PvP right now. So I’m asking: Will Reapers be getting a nerf? and How can we do it without ruining the fun of the class?

No offense but this is nothing but a fairytale with pretty words. Nothing u say describe any specific that makes a reaper op, for what i could gather is the almighty reaper that has +1200 amu in all stats with 5 specializations with reaper ES aka every other ES that is out there (as all classes part from berserker) are quite stronk.
Also, since we r being so vague here, just cuz 1 class build beats ur one main class doesnt make it OP.

I’m so Pro my Reaper build is 30/30/30/30/30!

Cogbyrn.7283:

There is counter*play*. Cleanse and kite when the Necro is in Reaper Shroud. Keep slows up and simply dodge away from the Shroud #2, or just make sure to dodge Shroud #5. When the Necro isn’t in Shroud, apply burst/damage/focus/etc. Dodge the LF generating abilities, if you feel inclined to keep the Necro out of Shroud, or dodge the highest damage/condi applying abilities if you want to mitigate the damage potential.

And counterbuilding is part of the game. You expect every class spec to be balanced against every class spec in 1v1? Is that what you think this game is about? If you don’t expect that, then it’s necessarily the case that certain builds will be better against certain other builds. That’s the way the cookie crumbles. If you do expect that, then I think you’ve been misinformed.

You are talking as if reapers can’t deal any dmg outside of shroud. Staff has 1200 range, scepter 900. Chill, poison, few bleeds, fear, torment, and even more chill … Everything can be applied without shroud. Doesn’t need high stacks, just some condis to cover the chill. If the take sigil of ice they can apply chill even with autoattacks.
Dodging the LF generating abilities? Such as staff auto and marks? Oh wait, marks generate LF even if you dodge them …
And pvp maps offer plenty obstacles to block ranged attacks so it is often not possible to attack from outside of 600 range …

How do you cleanse condition when you’re chilled back everytime you do that condi cleanse? You eventually run out of options.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Cogbyrn.7283:

There is counter*play*. Cleanse and kite when the Necro is in Reaper Shroud. Keep slows up and simply dodge away from the Shroud #2, or just make sure to dodge Shroud #5. When the Necro isn’t in Shroud, apply burst/damage/focus/etc. Dodge the LF generating abilities, if you feel inclined to keep the Necro out of Shroud, or dodge the highest damage/condi applying abilities if you want to mitigate the damage potential.

And counterbuilding is part of the game. You expect every class spec to be balanced against every class spec in 1v1? Is that what you think this game is about? If you don’t expect that, then it’s necessarily the case that certain builds will be better against certain other builds. That’s the way the cookie crumbles. If you do expect that, then I think you’ve been misinformed.

You are talking as if reapers can’t deal any dmg outside of shroud. Staff has 1200 range, scepter 900. Chill, poison, few bleeds, fear, torment, and even more chill … Everything can be applied without shroud. Doesn’t need high stacks, just some condis to cover the chill. If the take sigil of ice they can apply chill even with autoattacks.
Dodging the LF generating abilities? Such as staff auto and marks? Oh wait, marks generate LF even if you dodge them …
And pvp maps offer plenty obstacles to block ranged attacks so it is often not possible to attack from outside of 600 range …

If you can’t attack the Reaper from outside 600 range because of obstacles, he can’t attack you either.

If the Reaper is on Staff, they have okay life force generation (try strafing to dodge the auto, it works quite well), but low pressure. Reaper’s Mark is the important one to dodge and has a very unique animation. Conversely, if they’re on Scepter, they have high pressure, but low life force generation.

On either one, chill application is limited to just two skills outside of shroud (nobody runs Spectral Grasp) if you’re outside 600 range. Both skills are on staff and have decent cooldowns.

Even so, Chill in PvP caps out at ~800 DPS, which is hardly difficult to deal with. Heck, Burning did more than that before the condition changes.

Alekt.5803:

How do you cleanse condition when you’re chilled back everytime you do that condi cleanse? You eventually run out of options.

So stop trying to melee them while in the ice field?

Also, this comment kind of sets up exactly how Necromancers should be functioning. They were intended to be the attrition class since day 1, but to be “attrition” in this game, you eventually need to be able to cause your foes to run out of options. Fighting a Necro should basically have always put you on a timer; the longer you let the fight go on, the less likely you are to win.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Cogbyrn.7283:

There is counter*play*. Cleanse and kite when the Necro is in Reaper Shroud. Keep slows up and simply dodge away from the Shroud #2, or just make sure to dodge Shroud #5. When the Necro isn’t in Shroud, apply burst/damage/focus/etc. Dodge the LF generating abilities, if you feel inclined to keep the Necro out of Shroud, or dodge the highest damage/condi applying abilities if you want to mitigate the damage potential.

And counterbuilding is part of the game. You expect every class spec to be balanced against every class spec in 1v1? Is that what you think this game is about? If you don’t expect that, then it’s necessarily the case that certain builds will be better against certain other builds. That’s the way the cookie crumbles. If you do expect that, then I think you’ve been misinformed.

You are talking as if reapers can’t deal any dmg outside of shroud. Staff has 1200 range, scepter 900. Chill, poison, few bleeds, fear, torment, and even more chill … Everything can be applied without shroud. Doesn’t need high stacks, just some condis to cover the chill. If the take sigil of ice they can apply chill even with autoattacks.
Dodging the LF generating abilities? Such as staff auto and marks? Oh wait, marks generate LF even if you dodge them …
And pvp maps offer plenty obstacles to block ranged attacks so it is often not possible to attack from outside of 600 range …

When the Necro is outside of Shroud, you apply the pressure. Staff’s range is 1200, but its damage is actually not good at all. Go look it up.

What exactly are you doing while the Necro is spending several seconds applying chill, minor poison, some torment, and starting to stack bleeds? Nothing? You aren’t dodging the main condi applicators? You aren’t blocking/blinding? You aren’t applying any pressure whatsoever while the Necro is vulnerable outside of shroud?

Do you think a Condi Necro should not be able to do anything while outside of shroud? You shouldn’t feel like you are in danger at all to condis? Is that it?

Also, I’ve never heard obstacles used as a reason to label one individual class imbalanced. Here I’d thought I’d seen it all.

everything feels so bloated IMO so everything needs toning down/nerfing (in the CC department especially) execpt daredevil and berserker? Then again I’m a vanilla pleb, i shouldn’t be competing with the $50 boiz am i

The issue with Reapers is the issue with Chill.

Chill DESTROYS all bunker builds as players will be unable to sustain the damage thanks to the -66% recharge.

In a way, Reapers completely remove an entire playstyle from the game. Only Auramancers and Revenants can sustain themselves because of the immunity. In other words, if Diamond Skin and the Revenants Resistance gets nerfed, everyone will be using zerker specs.

MAN.9046:

everything feels so bloated IMO so everything needs toning down/nerfing (in the CC department especially) execpt daredevil and berserker? Then again I’m a vanilla pleb, i shouldn’t be competing with the $50 boiz am i

Quite a few core specs that compete quite well with elite specs, actually. There are actually a fair number of core builds that counter the elite specs, but these tend not to be run because in the prior meta, they were seen as “bad.”

For example, a shortbow Ranger will actually stomp all over any Reaper build. By outranging Shroud + shouts and being able to easily kite the Reaper, plus decent condi clear, it has the upper hand. However, you won’t find anyone running it because it wasn’t great in the prior meta. Also, the shortbow trait isn’t that great :/

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would probably actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would probably actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Are you clueless to the fact it can go through walls and has infinite range? to top it off take notice of how many conditions it applies.

Like most would agree just remove the through wall and stupid range factor and it wouldn’t be a problem.

Reapers are the Kassadin of Guild Wars 2. They are not exactly god tier broken but their mechanics hard counters so many builds.

PvP is a mess. Reapers are an unstoppable force, Auramancers are an unbreakable wall and what we get is a giant, chaotic clashing mess that people can barely tell what is going on.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Please, please! Check Pro League or Metabattle builds, Signet of Vampirism is the most used healing skill., e.g. in Pro League each Necro used SoV…

Sol.4310:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would probably actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Are you clueless to the fact it can go through walls and has infinite range? to top it off take notice of how many conditions it applies.

Like most would agree just remove the through wall and stupid range factor and it wouldn’t be a problem.

It applies…no conditions. Seriously, none. At all.

Also, it has 1200 range. The debuff stays on you if you leave that, sure, but it doesn’t get applied if you’re that far away.

@Morwrath: Metabattle is hardly representative of what “most” people run and lower MMR’s tend not to have the coordination to really use SoV. It’s used frequently, sure, but not even 50% of the time. As you go up in rating, it gets more common.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would probably actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Are you clueless to the fact it can go through walls and has infinite range? to top it off take notice of how many conditions it applies.

Like most would agree just remove the through wall and stupid range factor and it wouldn’t be a problem.

It applies…no conditions. Seriously, none. At all.

Also, it has 1200 range. The debuff stays on you if you leave that, sure, but it doesn’t get applied if you’re that far away.

It corrupts boons (= inflicts conditions) and corrupt boons works thru entire map…

Morwath.9817:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Please, please! Check Pro League or Metabattle builds, Signet of Vampirism is the most used healing skill., e.g. in Pro League each Necro used SoV…

So it’s like engi healing turret since forever.

On second thought, the majority of classes tend to only have 1 maybe 2 “good” healing skills.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would probably actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Are you clueless to the fact it can go through walls and has infinite range? to top it off take notice of how many conditions it applies.

Like most would agree just remove the through wall and stupid range factor and it wouldn’t be a problem.

It applies…no conditions. Seriously, none. At all.

Also, it has 1200 range. The debuff stays on you if you leave that, sure, but it doesn’t get applied if you’re that far away.

How do you not know how Signet of Vamp works? you sound rather clueless I advise you go test before you start ranting false facts.

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

I actually play the 2 counter builds to Reaper, Daredevil being the exception.

And there are counter plays to the Reaper outside playing counter builds. But with the “nerf” premise of this thread, it’s a waste of time explaining anything because they already have their opinions established and won’t consider advice.

Reapers are fine. There are builds far more superior than the Reaper in every way possible. But I’m not the kind of person who complains a lot because it’s often seen as a sign of weakness of the will

Sol.4310:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would probably actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Are you clueless to the fact it can go through walls and has infinite range? to top it off take notice of how many conditions it applies.

Like most would agree just remove the through wall and stupid range factor and it wouldn’t be a problem.

It applies…no conditions. Seriously, none. At all.

Also, it has 1200 range. The debuff stays on you if you leave that, sure, but it doesn’t get applied if you’re that far away.

How do you not know how Signet of Vamp works? you sound rather clueless I advise you go test before you start ranting false facts.

Probably because you are simply wrong. I’ve run SoV a lot. Heck, I was doing it before Signets of Suffering was even thought of.

Signet of Vampirism does not have unlimited range, nor does it cause any conditions whatsoever. The only signet that does cause conditions is Signet of Spite.

Now, can there be a bug with Signets of Suffering? That I can buy. There’s not a reason the range should work differently with SoV compared to Signet of Spite or Plague Signet. All three are single-target with the same range. The debuff on SoV functions properly in respect to range, so why Signets of Suffering doesn’t is beyond me.

Going through walls I think might have some coding issues due to the lack of checks (like dodging).

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Sol.4310:

Maybe Reaper wouldn’t be so bad if they bloody fixed Signet of Vamp, it’s a joke.

What about it needs to be fixed? The fact the active can’t be dodged? Keep in mind that it doesn’t do anything by itself and you can prevent the debuff from doing anything.

Making it so the active can be dodged would probably actually add too much counterplay to the skill. It already has a longer cooldown for a heal skill and a long cast time, plus doesn’t heal for much unless he can use most of the debuff stacks.

Plus, most Reapers are running Consume Conditions or Your Soul is Mine!

Are you clueless to the fact it can go through walls and has infinite range? to top it off take notice of how many conditions it applies.

Like most would agree just remove the through wall and stupid range factor and it wouldn’t be a problem.

It applies…no conditions. Seriously, none. At all.

Also, it has 1200 range. The debuff stays on you if you leave that, sure, but it doesn’t get applied if you’re that far away.

How do you not know how Signet of Vamp works? you sound rather clueless I advise you go test before you start ranting false facts.

Probably because you are simply wrong. I’ve run SoV a lot. Heck, I was doing it before Signets of Suffering was even thought of.

Signet of Vampirism does not have unlimited range, nor does it cause any conditions whatsoever. The only signet that does cause conditions is Signet of Spite.

Now, can there be a bug with Signets of Suffering? That I can buy. There’s not a reason the range should work differently with SoV compared to Signet of Spite or Plague Signet. All three are single-target with the same range. The debuff on SoV functions properly in respect to range, so why Signets of Suffering doesn’t is beyond me.

Going through walls I think might have some coding issues due to the lack of checks (like dodging).

You refuse to go and see for yourself, I don’t want to be forced to search my footage just to prove to you that you are clueless.

Pimsley.3681:

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

I actually play the 2 counter builds to Reaper, Daredevil being the exception.

And there are counter plays to the Reaper outside playing counter builds. But with the “nerf” premise of this thread, it’s a waste of time explaining anything because they already have their opinions established and won’t consider advice.

Reapers are fine. There are builds far more superior than the Reaper in every way possible. But I’m not the kind of person who complains a lot because it’s often seen as a sign of weakness of the will

Word

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

If you can’t attack the Reaper from outside 600 range because of obstacles, he can’t attack you either.

This wouldn’t be a problem, if pvp wasn’t all about capping kittening points.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

If the Reaper is on Staff, they have okay life force generation (try strafing to dodge the auto, it works quite well), but low pressure. Reaper’s Mark is the important one to dodge and has a very unique animation. Conversely, if they’re on Scepter, they have high pressure, but low life force generation.

Chillblains is as dangerous as Reaper’s Mark and it looks exactly the same as other marks. And the casting animation from staff 5 itself isn’t much different from other marks (I even tried necro/reaper myself to learn the animations, but couldn’t see much difference on staff animations).

And i wouldn’t call staff low pressure, chill alone forces you to cleanse.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

On either one, chill application is limited to just two skills outside of shroud (nobody runs Spectral Grasp) if you’re outside 600 range. Both skills are on staff and have decent cooldowns.

Don’t forget sigil of ice, traited signets, chill of death, …

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Even so, Chill in PvP caps out at ~800 DPS, which is hardly difficult to deal with. Heck, Burning did more than that before the condition changes.

Burning did about the same, not more. And unlike chill it has no additional effects aside dmg, yet burning was on of the strongest conditions even back then.

Cogbyrn.7283:

What exactly are you doing while the Necro is spending several seconds applying chill, minor poison, some torment, and starting to stack bleeds? Nothing? You aren’t dodging the main condi applicators? You aren’t blocking/blinding? You aren’t applying any pressure whatsoever while the Necro is vulnerable outside of shroud?

Dodging which main condi applicators? Marks which look all the same (well almost)? Unavoidable procs like chill of death or sigils? Blocking unblockable marks? Blinding from 1200 range? Pls tell me how to do all this, i really want to learn how to counter condi reaper.
But to answer your question, i’m cleasing and running away because currently this is the only way to stay away far enough to survive.

Cogbyrn.7283:

Also, I’ve never heard obstacles used as a reason to label one individual class imbalanced. Here I’d thought I’d seen it all.

I didn’t used obstacles as a reason to call reaper op.

Cogbyrn.7283:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

Using resistance spam or diamond skin has nothing to do with “learning how to counter”. It is just counterbuilding and limited to very few classes. If the only aviable counter is picking the right class and traits, otherwise you can’t do anything, it actually means, there is no real counterplay to condi reaper.

There is counter*play*. Cleanse and kite when the Necro is in Reaper Shroud. Keep slows up and simply dodge away from the Shroud #2, or just make sure to dodge Shroud #5. When the Necro isn’t in Shroud, apply burst/damage/focus/etc. Dodge the LF generating abilities, if you feel inclined to keep the Necro out of Shroud, or dodge the highest damage/condi applying abilities if you want to mitigate the damage potential.

And counterbuilding is part of the game. You expect every class spec to be balanced against every class spec in 1v1? Is that what you think this game is about? If you don’t expect that, then it’s necessarily the case that certain builds will be better against certain other builds. That’s the way the cookie crumbles. If you do expect that, then I think you’ve been misinformed.

Yasha.5963:

abc.5790:

Wake up people. Like Vapour said, Condi Reapers have 3 powerful counters. That in itself proves that the build is balanced.

Instead of learning how to counter, all I see are people throwing tantrums demanding to get builds nerfed.

It’s pretty disgusting to witness how lazy people are at attempting to figure things out on their own.

IKR? Even if you don’t have HoT there are three powerful counters, namely 3vs1, 4vs1, and 5vs1. You guys just need to wake up and figure this simple stuff out.

All you’re doing, Yasha, is making the argument against Reaper look like it’s coming from a group of inflammatory people who aren’t trying to form a logical argument.

+1

at mass combat you get seriously penalized for trying to bring them down
i like long duration battles but all classes should have that option to be tanky and effective

The thing about necro is that anet keeps making them easier and easier.

First was dumbfire then fear chains and now chill, everyone of them is kittening passive, they don’t have to do anything really, dumbfire is in AA fear from rune and boon convert chill from whatever kittening way you use…

I think is time for anet to stop making this class a joke and get serious Kappa.

either nerf chill damage or their propagation, having both is too strong imo.

When I told that you eventually run out of condition clears due to the chill, some assumed that it was a melee issue.

First of all, I am ranged. Reapers actually apply some considerable pressure from range too. As a marauder staff tempest, I am pretty sure I would lose the fight with simple auto-attacks against carrion.

I’m not saying they are broken, but the main reason eles run diamond skin are because of reapers. We simply do not have enough cleanses (gasp, but eles have one of the most cleanses in game!) to deal with perma chill.

If the chill werent so potent we would rather take stone heart any time.