Guild Wars 2

applying 4-5 unique condis with almost every dodge roll and can do spikes with upwards of 8 unique condis being applied at time. It’s as if the thief has a permanent plaguelands at his location.

I would like to see lotus training be changed so that it no longer applies 3 unique condis baseline.

And before the “but condi thief isn’t even as good as d/p” starts, I will point out that condi thief is strong enough to be meta, it’s just overshadowed by d/p. But at least d/p has a skill requirement to it while condi thief is easier to learn than warrior is.

Lulz he Dodge only give at max 3 by itself and that’s if you are directly under it or run through the highly visible caltrops lulz #witchhuntisstrong.

Sly.9518:

Lulz he Dodge only give at max 4 by itself and that’s if you are directly under it or run through the highly visible caltrops lulz #witchhuntisstrong.

Exactly, my necros is even worst with condis yet, everyones kittening about thiefs

Lets see, I use scepter and dagger so that’s already bleed procs right there, then I give myself bleeding, poisoning, fumble etc, from the same skill that gives you the exact same conditions

Then I transfer said condition to you to stack them even higher (theyre already high before I do that most of the time)

Then of course as I’m spamming 1 each time it crits that’s more bleed stacks

Then I have it set to where chill adds even more bleed stacks

The entire time you fight me youre constantly dealing with back to back, bleeds, fumbles, weakness, poison, chill, torment, cripple

Condi necros can literally condi bomb you repeatedly till your dead and no one bats an eye

Teefs get a condi build that barely can be considered “condi bombing” and everyone loses their minds

GG community, gg

Condi thief has higher dps than condi necro. The only reason condi necro is considered good is because of the boon hate.

Also necromancers have no mobility and can’t attack you while evading.

Condi Thief Has low mobility compared to Meta D/P lulz #thewitchhuntisstrong.

Tell me more about the 5 unique conditions on Dodge alone.

What class are you playing? That is actually the first step to helping you
Also I am not seeing 5 condi’s on a dodge trait, can you link they trait that adds the extra condies on dodge?

Edit: Ok I think I see the issue, you’re standing in a 90radius caltrops drop from the dodge, that is only 4 conditions.
You could probably deal with this if you didn’t stand in the caltrops. . .

Solori.6025:

What class are you playing? That is actually the first step to helping you
Also I am not seeing 5 condi’s on a dodge trait, can you link they trait that adds the extra condies on dodge?

Edit: Ok I think I see the issue, you’re standing in a 90radius caltrops drop from the dodge, that is only 4 conditions.
You could probably deal with this if you didn’t stand in the caltrops. . .

Nah the Dodge alone only gives 3 if you notice caltrops only gives Bleed and Cripple, Impaling Lotus only Gives Bleeding, Cripple and Torment. So there are only 3 unique Condies on Dodge alone, what He stated in this thread and others is Dodge alone has 5 Unique Conditions.

It’s easy to see the problem.

Ehhh idk aplying alot of condis mean while these co dis dont reqlly burst you seems like a good balance.

You either go for less condis but much more ptency or more condis and play the w8ing game.

What i dont like is their playstyle and playing against them. Its just not fun.

I think people are too soon to jump to their LTP gun on OP. He’s wrong about only dodging give 5 condis, but he is referring to the following build, which probably has gained popularity lately.
https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Daredevil_-_S/D_Condition

As you see thief can start off with sword 2 then dodge, thus giving 4 unique condis even after immob wears off. The immob from sword 2 is more than enough to secure a caltrop proc. If sigil of fallibility proc that’s 5 unique condi as OP stated. Typical thief will wait for opponent to panic and cleanse before using more deadly steal (with confusion) but ofc if he decides to do it earlier it is possible to get more unique condi. 8 IS an exaggeration though.

As always, these thieves are susceptible to focus fire themselves and their effectiveness really depends on the opening strike. So personally I don’t find them OP or anything.

EDIT: actually forgot lotus poison also gives weakness, but it does have CD.

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

I think people are too soon to jump to their LTP gun on OP. He’s wrong about only dodging give 5 condis, but he is referring to the following build, which probably has gained popularity lately.
https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Daredevil_-_S/D_Condition

As you see thief can start off with sword 2 then dodge, thus giving 4 unique condis even after immob wears off. The immob from sword 2 is more than enough to secure a caltrop proc. If sigil of fallibility proc that’s 5 unique condi as OP stated. Typical thief will wait for opponent to panic and cleanse before using more deadly steal (with confusion) but ofc if he decides to do it earlier it is possible to get more unique condi. 8 IS an exaggeration though.

As always, these thieves are susceptible to focus fire themselves and their effectiveness really depends on the opening strike. So personally I don’t find them OP or anything.

EDIT: actually forgot lotus poison also gives weakness, but it does have CD.

Since I’m maining thief rn and condi thief to be exact ( I was using it before it became meta, I suck at d/p) and nothing you said is wrong

The second I realize that I’m being focused even the slightest I have two choices

1: I can stand my ground and try and hold up which is extremely difficult with this build
or
2: say kitten that kitten and dip

My builds different but, has a similar flow

Trying to stay and fight is going to get you squished cause you only have 3 dodges (its not even the dodges that’s producing the damage) once those three run out we either try and burn through initiative through evades or waste our heal for me endurance

If anything this is way more balanced than d/p because we have to actually sit there and try to micro manage every little thing we do

You can face roll d/p more and get away with it

Crinn.7864:

Condi thief has higher dps than condi necro. The only reason condi necro is considered good is because of the boon hate.

Also necromancers have no mobility and can’t attack you while evading.

I highly disagree, when I start off my rotation on my condi necros it not only gives you bleeding, but it also gives me might stacks, condi thieves don’t focus on might

So not only did just throw possibly 15-20 stacks of condis at you ( that numbers pretty low tbh, cause my bleed stacks can get atrocious) but theres also 10+ stacks of might effecting them boosting their damage even further

God forbid you decide to stand in my pl well like you did that caltrop and I’m in reaper spinning to win cause then youre going to get pulsed down since pl is gonna refresh the stacks on you and add to them

Then I’m in shroud using my 4, youre not only taking crit hits, I’m applying poison stacks to you as well as more bleed stacks due to a passive scepter trait and another in the reaper trait

Condi thief may be able to handle more classes by itself

But condi thief cannot out damage a condi necros

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

I think people are too soon to jump to their LTP gun on OP. He’s wrong about only dodging give 5 condis, but he is referring to the following build, which probably has gained popularity lately.
https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Daredevil_-_S/D_Condition

As you see thief can start off with sword 2 then dodge, thus giving 4 unique condis even after immob wears off. The immob from sword 2 is more than enough to secure a caltrop proc. If sigil of fallibility proc that’s 5 unique condi as OP stated. Typical thief will wait for opponent to panic and cleanse before using more deadly steal (with confusion) but ofc if he decides to do it earlier it is possible to get more unique condi. 8 IS an exaggeration though.

As always, these thieves are susceptible to focus fire themselves and their effectiveness really depends on the opening strike. So personally I don’t find them OP or anything.

EDIT: actually forgot lotus poison also gives weakness, but it does have CD.

Again the OP has stated in multiple threads now that Thief Dodge alone provides 5 Unique Condis, JS, #witchhuntisstrong

Crinn.7864:

What you don’t think applying 5 unique condis just by dodge rolling is balanced?

Crinn.7864:

applying 4-5 unique condis with almost every dodge roll and can do spikes with upwards of 8 unique condis being applied at time.

Well if you want to ignore the breakdown and smash on that point sure, doesn’t really help letting OP know what’s going on nor did it help him countering it though :P

I don’t know how anyone could defend condi thieves unless they themselves play it and just dont want to see it nerfed. It’s a broken build and OP is right.

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

Well if you want to ignore the breakdown and smash on that point sure, doesn’t really help letting OP know what’s going on nor did it help him countering it though :P

The OP knows what they are doing, I have played with them in platinum games, if you look at their post history the majority of it has one singular trend.

And once more your break down isn’t what isn’t an issue it just highlights my post and solidified it.

i think you have not enaugh condi cleaning , like meta … condi thief is new at meta, thats the problem…. and still viable, one nerf and its unplayable …. go on a 1v1 server and l2p to counter a s/d thief.

than you see the balance …. in gw2 you have counter builds, and condi thief counter your build… thats ^^…… and real to get a hardcounter.

Lord Velar.1509:

Sly.9518:

Lulz he Dodge only give at max 4 by itself and that’s if you are directly under it or run through the highly visible caltrops lulz #witchhuntisstrong.

Exactly, my necros is even worst with condis yet, everyones kittening about thiefs

Lets see, I use scepter and dagger so that’s already bleed procs right there, then I give myself bleeding, poisoning, fumble etc, from the same skill that gives you the exact same conditions

Then I transfer said condition to you to stack them even higher (theyre already high before I do that most of the time)

Then of course as I’m spamming 1 each time it crits that’s more bleed stacks

Then I have it set to where chill adds even more bleed stacks

The entire time you fight me youre constantly dealing with back to back, bleeds, fumbles, weakness, poison, chill, torment, cripple

Condi necros can literally condi bomb you repeatedly till your dead and no one bats an eye

Teefs get a condi build that barely can be considered “condi bombing” and everyone loses their minds

GG community, gg

Necro is fairly easy to kite and CC till dead though and if you don’t have shroud you’re killed a lot easier. Necro has 2 evades and maybe 2 stunbreaks, burn them and they die and ofc moa when they go DS means they die, alternatively you can kite the DS if it’s reaper or go ham if it’s normal shroud.

I do agree that necro spams out conditions like crazy but weakness is one of their primary forms of defence and they have quite a lot of ways to be dealt with, especially when not supported properly.

apharma.3741:

Lord Velar.1509:

Sly.9518:

Lulz he Dodge only give at max 4 by itself and that’s if you are directly under it or run through the highly visible caltrops lulz #witchhuntisstrong.

Exactly, my necros is even worst with condis yet, everyones kittening about thiefs

Lets see, I use scepter and dagger so that’s already bleed procs right there, then I give myself bleeding, poisoning, fumble etc, from the same skill that gives you the exact same conditions

Then I transfer said condition to you to stack them even higher (theyre already high before I do that most of the time)

Then of course as I’m spamming 1 each time it crits that’s more bleed stacks

Then I have it set to where chill adds even more bleed stacks

The entire time you fight me youre constantly dealing with back to back, bleeds, fumbles, weakness, poison, chill, torment, cripple

Condi necros can literally condi bomb you repeatedly till your dead and no one bats an eye

Teefs get a condi build that barely can be considered “condi bombing” and everyone loses their minds

GG community, gg

Necro is fairly easy to kite and CC till dead though and if you don’t have shroud you’re killed a lot easier. Necro has 2 evades and maybe 2 stunbreaks, burn them and they die and ofc moa when they go DS means they die, alternatively you can kite the DS if it’s reaper or go ham if it’s normal shroud.

I do agree that necro spams out conditions like crazy but weakness is one of their primary forms of defence and they have quite a lot of ways to be dealt with, especially when not supported properly.

That is true, but the same can be said for condi thieves.

In order for a condi thief build to seem “broken” a lot and I mean a lot of what thieves usually need to use to their advantage must be sacrificed, the blinds, the dazes, the interrupts, the loads of stealth, the mobility

All or at least the majority of all that must be given up

Condi thieves have a much harder time breaking away and disengaging fights, they lack stealth, stability is also little to none so dh guards are really kamikaze runs then, lastly they burn through way more initiative and endurance more so than other thieves so there is little to no room for error especially against classes like guardians, warriors, eles, and engis

one little mistake and that’s it, its back to the respawn screen they go

Since everyone wants to talk about Thieves

What about trap guardians or condi guardians, ive seen ridiculous burn numbers come from them

Or engis better yet, no one says kitten about how broken they are

Or better yet condi Mesmer, yeah, the most annoying class spreading condis left and right and downing you in an instant while laughing in your face cause you just wasted all your offensive and defensive cd’s as theyre finishing you isn’t a problem or anything

Ill never understand it

One profession does it, no one cares. Thief does it, now its an issue

foh

Lord Velar.1509:

Since everyone wants to talk about Thieves

What about trap guardians or condi guardians, ive seen ridiculous burn numbers come from them

Or engis better yet, no one says kitten about how broken they are

Or better yet condi Mesmer, yeah, the most annoying class spreading condis left and right and downing you in an instant while laughing in your face cause you just wasted all your offensive and defensive cd’s as theyre finishing you isn’t a problem or anything

Ill never understand it

One profession does it, no one cares. Thief does it, now its an issue

foh

Spvp has a lot of issues. Of course it’s not just condi thieves. But this thread is about condi thieves. There always other threads on all the other builds/classes you posted. But yeah, I agree with you. A lot of builds need to be toned down, but this is thread is about thieves. lets not derail it.

While i am not trying to defend condi thieves (i would rather stop playing this game all together than playing condi build), isn’t it what community (yes, you all) was asking for?

Since i started to play this game there was always this constant complains how thief instantly blows someone, always sits in stealth and always goes away, nerf nerf, yada yada. Anyone remember 2394872389478927 long threads with players begging to nerf PI, nerf backstab etc.? Well Anet did it for you.

Which resulted in thieves resorting to condis and dodge spam. Enjoy what you asked for?

Also, just fyi, condi thieves (yes there sd/sb ones) don’t have much going for survival. Think about them as about signet thieves – they miss their main burst, you can nuke them easily. Same goes for focus – it is extremely easy to kill them if your team actually throws something in general direction of the thief. Dodge their steal wombo combo, don’t blow condi cleanse right away – it shouldn’t be issue for most classes to kill them after that.

For once i am w8ing all the classes to have condition removals on dodges .
And later on the Rangers underpowered/less whined on the forums dodge/Protection , so we wont have 100% Berseker meta .

(p.s. isnt time that ranged(not Mace Enginners or 2-haned Greatsword Necros for example) character can can leap further with thier dodges , for some kiting capibilities ? i am not kidding about this one …
You can reduce my pistol/shield damage , or reduced even more the Flamethrower 3rd ……..ohhhh… ah kkk nvm …… wannabe replacement for the burn trait ….)

Hot Boy.7138:

I don’t know how anyone could defend condi thieves unless they themselves play it and just dont want to see it nerfed. It’s a broken build and OP is right.

I have enjoyed the trolling spree given by the Pulmonary Chocking build but i don’t have cryed when devs nerfed it. It was clearly OP.

In fact if before the build was about only spam interrupt and blind while spinning now it takes a little more skill to play it.

Lord Velar.1509:

Condi thieves have a much harder time breaking away and disengaging fights

My favourite disengage with S/D it’s Cloak and Dagger + Infiltrator’s Return and it’s not a bad combo. I can disengage when i want and making foes mad, if they waste their cleanse then it’s time to help ensuring the kill with steal combo, otherwise i have just helped my +1 and can run away.

It’s slower than D/P but i feel that I have to stick lesser to fight to give my mates the support they need, so i think it’s balanced.
Luckily the condi thieves i’ve facing on my necro are dumb and don’t los/stealth to prevent condi transfer. If I was ME condi thief vs ME anybuild necro i think that my thief could win 100% of the fights.

Sly.9518:

Again the OP has stated in multiple threads now that Thief Dodge alone provides 5 Unique Condis, JS, #witchhuntisstrong

Most thieves that I have encountered run vuln sigil which has a trivial enough ICD as to make almost every dodge apply 5 condis.

Also 8 condi is entirely within condi thief’s capabilities.
Here is what condi thief can apply:
Vuln
Bleeding
poison
torment
weakness
cripple
confusion
immob

Meh, for condi cover, I still prefer p/p engi w/ torment sigil…every DPS condi right there and multiple stacks of the ones that hurt the most

Crinn.7864:

Sly.9518:

Again the OP has stated in multiple threads now that Thief Dodge alone provides 5 Unique Condis, JS, #witchhuntisstrong

Most thieves that I have encountered run vuln sigil which has a trivial enough ICD as to make almost every dodge apply 5 condis.

Also 8 condi is entirely within condi thief’s capabilities.
Here is what condi thief can apply:
Vuln
Bleeding
poison
torment
weakness
cripple
confusion
immob

Again you said Dodge alone which means just Dodge your words not mine, and again Dodge by itself only applies 3 Condies so where is the Dodge magically getting those additional 2 by itself that you keep claiming?

Lulz, and I never called into question the 8 that was Nike.

This is what happens when you guys complained about supports being OP and now have nothing left but damage, damage, and more damage.
People cried and whined about clerics, soldier’s, hell even about ele, druid, and bunker mesmer cooldowns to help support these damage classes and cleanse you, but now that they are basically nerfed and are the #TeamGirlfriend class now, condis are now a problem?
Pfft.
What is it that this community even want anymore?

Lilyanna.9361:

This is what happens when you guys complained about supports being OP and now have nothing left but damage, damage, and more damage.
People cried and whined about clerics, soldier’s, hell even about ele, druid, and bunker mesmer cooldowns to help support these damage classes and cleanse you, but now that they are basically nerfed and are the #TeamGirlfriend class now, condis are now a problem?
Pfft.
What is it that this community even want anymore?

Free kills.

most of these complaint threads would be resolved if people multiclassed more

Lord Velar.1509:

You can face roll d/p more and get away with it

No s/d condi is absolutely the safest & most faceroll build to play on thief currently.

You said it yourself, “I suck at d/p”

But you succeed at s/d condi? Wonder why? Because its infinitely easier playing that than meta d/p (which is arguably the highest skill floor/ceiling class/build to play atm).

You can down ppl with just steal and dodge from 100-0 if they have no healing/clears. It’s instant, basically can’t be dodged, and you can do it by smashing your face on ur keyboard not looking at the screen. Kicker is if they don’t clear it you are going to do like 1/3rd of their life passively.

If you need to burst the burst is stupid damage that is easy as pie to do. 2, V, F1, V, 2 to gtfo of danger, and watch the poor soul burn to the ground.

Conclusion : bring back clonespammer to mesmer …

(when you see that today, every class has good or strong effects on dodge.)

#this is a message from a mesmer gameplay diversity activist.

Sly.9518:

Again you said Dodge alone which means just Dodge your words not mine, and again Dodge by itself only applies 3 Condies so where is the Dodge magically getting those additional 2 by itself that you keep claiming?

Lulz, and I never called into question the 8 that was Nike.

A thief running a realistic condi build will be applying 5 condis when they dodge due to the combination of lotus training, and procs.

Spectral Wall can be pretty good vs. these condi bads :P

Ever since Potato claimed this build to be OP and carrying him into 10th place, I’ve been seeing it show up in every other game. If you see anyone with more than a 50% win ratio making these claims, you can pretty much disregard them. The game is giving them favorable matches by default. I’m not saying hes not good, but as long as they are mechanically and logistically strong, and are also favored by matching mysteries, they could probably carry themselves with all sorts of strange setups.

The build itself is not very good. It’s more easily countered by other builds than the classical D/P because of how available cleanses are. It can also cause a lot of confusion among your team mates because it’s more practical to engage in 1v1s and group fights while your team is instead expecting your rotations, decaps, plusses, and stealth mobility mind games. If they don’t see that, there’s a greater chance they will get tilted and stoopid.

Hot Boy.7138:

Lord Velar.1509:

Since everyone wants to talk about Thieves

What about trap guardians or condi guardians, ive seen ridiculous burn numbers come from them

Or engis better yet, no one says kitten about how broken they are

Or better yet condi Mesmer, yeah, the most annoying class spreading condis left and right and downing you in an instant while laughing in your face cause you just wasted all your offensive and defensive cd’s as theyre finishing you isn’t a problem or anything

Ill never understand it

One profession does it, no one cares. Thief does it, now its an issue

foh

Spvp has a lot of issues. Of course it’s not just condi thieves. But this thread is about condi thieves. There always other threads on all the other builds/classes you posted. But yeah, I agree with you. A lot of builds need to be toned down, but this is thread is about thieves. lets not derail it.

that is true but look at how many posts are complaining about thieves then compare it to every other class

Every day without fail theres a post griping about a thief build, yet other more cancerous builds for other classes exist

I’d rather derail it cause its total bull and I’m tired of the biased which hunt

Every other class gets a condi build, almost no one bats an eye

Thief gets a condi build and everyone races to the forums to scream nerf

Just how tf is that fair?

viquing.8254:

Conclusion : bring back clonespammer to mesmer …

(when you see that today, every class has good or strong effects on dodge.)

#this is a message from a mesmer gameplay diversity activist.

Ive lost to more mesmers than I can count……mesmers don’t need a buff

If you lost to a condi thief as a Mesmer, that’s more of your fault than anything

Azukas.1426:

Lord Velar.1509:

You can face roll d/p more and get away with it

No s/d condi is absolutely the safest & most faceroll build to play on thief currently.

You said it yourself, “I suck at d/p”

But you succeed at s/d condi? Wonder why? Because its infinitely easier playing that than meta d/p (which is arguably the highest skill floor/ceiling class/build to play atm).

You can down ppl with just steal and dodge from 100-0 if they have no healing/clears. It’s instant, basically can’t be dodged, and you can do it by smashing your face on ur keyboard not looking at the screen. Kicker is if they don’t clear it you are going to do like 1/3rd of their life passively.

If you need to burst the burst is stupid damage that is easy as pie to do. 2, V, F1, V, 2 to gtfo of danger, and watch the poor soul burn to the ground.

Soooo it took 0 skill for me to decimate a bunker ele, a bunker rev, or a guardian solo?

Are you sure about that?

Yeah I sucked at d/p thief, that’s why I went condi. I also started using my condi thief build before everyone else picked up on it, its a build I’m good at and I can work with

I suck with condi necros, yet if no one keeps pressure up on me I can rip entire teams apart with my power necros

It’s not that its easy or face roll, its just a build I’m good at

No condi thief is going to take down a kitten bunker ele especially by themselves by face rolling s/d

That takes more know how than anything, especially when their build is made to counter condi………..

Lord Velar.1509:

Hot Boy.7138:

Lord Velar.1509:

Since everyone wants to talk about Thieves

What about trap guardians or condi guardians, ive seen ridiculous burn numbers come from them

Or engis better yet, no one says kitten about how broken they are

Or better yet condi Mesmer, yeah, the most annoying class spreading condis left and right and downing you in an instant while laughing in your face cause you just wasted all your offensive and defensive cd’s as theyre finishing you isn’t a problem or anything

Ill never understand it

One profession does it, no one cares. Thief does it, now its an issue

foh

Spvp has a lot of issues. Of course it’s not just condi thieves. But this thread is about condi thieves. There always other threads on all the other builds/classes you posted. But yeah, I agree with you. A lot of builds need to be toned down, but this is thread is about thieves. lets not derail it.

that is true but look at how many posts are complaining about thieves then compare it to every other class

Every day without fail theres a post griping about a thief build, yet other more cancerous builds for other classes exist

I’d rather derail it cause its total bull and I’m tired of the biased which hunt

Every other class gets a condi build, almost no one bats an eye

Thief gets a condi build and everyone races to the forums to scream nerf

Just how tf is that fair?

Thief is in a great spot when it’s a high skill class that shines when you truly master the class.

You gut skill requirements and allow low skill players to succeed at thief you start seeing the community react negatively.

In its current form Condi thief is too easy and forgiving on bad play.

Lilyanna.9361:

This is what happens when you guys complained about supports being OP and now have nothing left but damage, damage, and more damage.
People cried and whined about clerics, soldier’s, hell even about ele, druid, and bunker mesmer cooldowns to help support these damage classes and cleanse you, but now that they are basically nerfed and are the #TeamGirlfriend class now, condis are now a problem?
Pfft.
What is it that this community even want anymore?

Suports are OP, suport arent OP…
by this game design mechanics (aoes and blasts that afects equally suport and suported)heavy suport class become heavy unkillable god mode bunkers, having suport class are ok if they are not self suporting wile suports others and not suporting others while under heavy pressure on them and trhowing all on him to survive

Oooh how about we give ele a viable dps spec and everyone can support themselves or die trying!

Keadron.9570:

Oooh how about we give ele a viable dps spec and everyone can support themselves or die trying!

major problem of ele is not the dps specs are not viable, the problem is that healboot is so god mode than overshadows all other specs

Its incredible seeing all these people defend something ezmodecheeseplay as condi thief..“Look Mum i can press 2 buttons and win huhuhu”.Witchunt lfmao, people are just tired of baddies getting carried by broken condi builds.

You claim bad people are being carried and yet I never see these bad thieves actually winning.

I’ve fought good and bad condi thieves and it shows. I mean really shows.

By two button I assume you mean dodge and DB spam builds. Lol. Those builds need steal and at least precision signet to restore endurance and deal damage because their traits need to be damage focused rather than taking acro line. Suddenly two buttons becomes 4-6—because they need gap closing utilities and probably basi venom to improve their odds of landing a lot of their attacks. Not to mention channeled vigor for more dodges as their heal.

So, from experience fighting these builds, I’d say you have no idea what you are talking about. If they only use two buttons they will be laughably ineffective. If they use their skills poorly they will likewise be ineffective. If they are good they can be effective in certain circumstances. A good D/D thief is like a good staff thief in that regard.

And if you get wrecked by someone who only literally presses two buttons then you are objectively bad at this game. Period.

I once was in a match with two thieves, one was a D/P thief, the other I couldn’t really tell since they’d teleport to me (Either steal or IS I’m guessing) then I’d suddenly have 8 conditions on me and below 50% health in less than 2 seconds. In that time, I could heal/cleanse/give up but all wouldn’t have no effect since the thief would SS to me and interrupt my heal/lay more conditions/attack me down.

But thief isn’t OP, mesmer’s and their endless shatters and conditions are next to impossible for me to beat.

megilandil.7506:

Keadron.9570:

Oooh how about we give ele a viable dps spec and everyone can support themselves or die trying!

major problem of ele is not the dps specs are not viable, the problem is that healboot is so god mode than overshadows all other specs

You sort of have a point that auramancer would stay the go to ele build unless DPS ele was very op, but the DPS specs are genuinely horrible currently.

megilandil.7506:

Keadron.9570:

Oooh how about we give ele a viable dps spec and everyone can support themselves or die trying!

major problem of ele is not the dps specs are not viable, the problem is that healboot is so god mode than overshadows all other specs

You sort of have a point that auramancer would stay the go to ele build unless DPS ele was very op, but the DPS specs are genuinely horrible currently.

Lord Velar.1509:

apharma.3741

Necro is fairly easy to kite and CC till dead though and if you don’t have shroud you’re killed a lot easier. Necro has 2 evades and maybe 2 stunbreaks, burn them and they die and ofc moa when they go DS means they die, alternatively you can kite the DS if it’s reaper or go ham if it’s normal shroud.

I do agree that necro spams out conditions like crazy but weakness is one of their primary forms of defence and they have quite a lot of ways to be dealt with, especially when not supported properly.

That is true, but the same can be said for condi thieves.

In order for a condi thief build to seem “broken” a lot and I mean a lot of what thieves usually need to use to their advantage must be sacrificed, the blinds, the dazes, the interrupts, the loads of stealth, the mobility

All or at least the majority of all that must be given up

Condi thieves have a much harder time breaking away and disengaging fights, they lack stealth, stability is also little to none so dh guards are really kamikaze runs then, lastly they burn through way more initiative and endurance more so than other thieves so there is little to no room for error especially against classes like guardians, warriors, eles, and engis

one little mistake and that’s it, its back to the respawn screen they go

The difference is a condi thief has much more active defence than a necro which has a very clear and obvious weakness. With bandits defence trained to 12s cool down and the ability to regain dodges every 20/30s, decent to good condition cleanse and quite a few stun breaks it leaves many saying what is its weakness?

As I say a necro you know if it’s got low life force it’s a much easier kill, it’s easier to kite, easier to CC and lock down. There’s also the added bonus of most classes can simply leave and know the necro can’t really chase them too much.

I will elaborate on my original post, I don’t mind thieves having a viable condi spec, but my issue is with how easy damage application is for condi thief vs how difficult applying damage to a condi thief is.

Due to the natural stickiness of thieves combined with the insane number of cover condis available to condi thief, results in condi thief having both strong pressure that is extremely easy to apply, while the same time the enormous evade uptime that thief has makes applying damage to a condi thief extremely difficult.

Evade uptime mainly became a problem with HoT because of all the endurance regen. The same is true for staff power thief. The good ones have extremely high evade uptime.

Crinn.7864:

I will elaborate on my original post, I don’t mind thieves having a viable condi spec, but my issue is with how easy damage application is for condi thief vs how difficult applying damage to a condi thief is.

Due to the natural stickiness of thieves combined with the insane number of cover condis available to condi thief, results in condi thief having both strong pressure that is extremely easy to apply, while the same time the enormous evade uptime that thief has makes applying damage to a condi thief extremely difficult.

oh you need high skill for press skill 3 from p/p to make burst in range… lol sry..
its extemely difficult to press 1 skill and make 6k++++

counter the condi thief wiht cc and burst .. and done.