Guild Wars 2

I do not like to @devs in titles, but the burst damage output, by some individual builds, is way off the charts… I’m not sure if, or how much, y’all have fingers on the pulse with regard to this, but it requires some serious attention.

I have a thread in the works about balance for the game, and included will have a couple video highlights on this subject, but I wanted to briefly talk about this subject now…

Ok, so, we have some 1 skill hits that are 10k… 13k single skill hits… 16k multi-skill hits in seconds, from stealth… 17k single skill hits… … but now I’ve seen the largest opening multi-skill burst in the matter of 2 seconds… 2.

22,829k multi-skill opening burst. 2 seconds.

All of the above numbers, by any individual profession build, are not acceptable to let linger in competitive game modes.

Imagine if you will some random necro put out 22k worth of damage in 2 seconds… I highly doubt there would be silence on the subject.

Imagine if a ranger were to pop out of stealth and burst open with 22k worth of damage in 2 seconds… I can’t even imagine the forum meltdown lol

I am a casual player because I stopped caring about being a truly competitive player long ago, but this stuff is just awful. Whenever I personally encounter a mess like this I can laugh it off to a degree, but I truly feel bad for any new players trying to experience pvp modes in this game due to lack of profession and combat development.

10k+ 1 skill hits and multi-skill bursts in seconds have zero place in wvw or spvp period. And 22,829k multi-skill burst openers in 2 seconds is off the scale stupidity for any experience level of player to face.

I will provide a screen shot to this later, but this needs to be discussed, looked at and fixed.

Thanks.

Edit- It’s bad enough that players are forced to manage around the “less than stellar” condi and stealth play and counter play designs, but this 22,829k is beyond any sensible level of gameplay.

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

This is why their esports dream will never happen. They just don’t know how to balance their game. What honestly makes them think they are set for the big stage?

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

It isn’t just the big hits for me. It’s the fact that a single build can hit for 10-15K in a couple of seconds, and still have evades and/or invulnerability out the wazoo, high sustain, low CD’s on skills and mobility enough to get away with impunity. Maybe there aren’t enough opportunity costs in the build system.

if your complaint is a 20K condi burst from a full tank with max damage (ie dire/trailblazer), then yes I agree with you.

But I’m guessing we are talking power damage given the single hit stuff. Here’s the thing – in order to do that kind of insane damages, all classes with one super OP exception (warrior with defense tree, adrenal health and healing signet) have to go full glass cannon. When facing similar builds its either kill or be killed quick and they often make themselves very voulnerable to condition damage by taking this route (except previously mentioned warrior), which is the very point of balance between the two types.

I honestly see little issues in small scale and when it comes to zerging a single ele can heal up that same damage in 2s while their far, far tougher buddies roflstomp the zerker.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Blah blah blah blah I like broken game

Cool story.

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

Are you saying Maul doesn’t have a huge telegraph? Because I’m pretty sure it’s the most telegraphed weapon skill in the game. The ranger literally has a huge bear appear over his head, the only way that could be more telegraphed is if they replaced the bear with a big neon sign saying “dodge now!”

And no, to achieve those numbers the thief isn’t appearing out of nowhere. They will be running d/d with signets which means they aren’t “stealth spam cancer”, they are full glass, blowing multiple cooldowns on 1 big burst. This means if you sneeze on them they will die, if they try and burst 1 of the multiple professions with a passive defense proc they will fail (and likely die).

The real “huge difference” is the ranger and thief burst require multiple traits and utility skills to pull off 1 big burst every 40 seconds or so, where as the rev and warrior’s attacks are basically spammable and don’t require a sacrifice.

Rambitshouse.8712:

This is why their esports dream will never happen. They just don’t know how to balance their game. What honestly makes them think they are set for the big stage?

If you just throw money at it…maybe it will happen!! (sarcasm)

You can just smell the thief complain topics before opening them.

Try playing said build.

Hello,

I can totally relate, and I agree it sometimes kill the fun. It’s also quite trendy, and I think it’s an explanation to things people also see and complain, i.e. : bunker builds, automatic skills (passive traits) that inflict condis or boons. And also zergs.

Maybe they could do a test for their balance system. Take any full zerk class with food and whatever could max damage output vs. a standing celestial ele. No skill or script ever should be able to take more than 66% HP. That’s an exemple of how things could be tweaked.

Also, in GW1, there used to be enchantements that prevented to lose more than 30% HP in a given amount of time. Such things should come back in GW2…

Wheres this sweet video i was promised?

Cygnus.6903:

You can just smell the thief complain topics before opening them.

Try playing said build.

Swagger never mentioned any specific profession or build. Why would you automatically assume a topic about balance problems is talking about thief? Weird.

If i was taking a guess id go with a DD, Herald or Zerker. He mentions 2 skill combo. Any of these rocking 20+ might stacks and specced as glass cannons are capable of hitting those numbers. Maybe a Maul, but i havnt seen a full glass Druid in forever.

It’s going to be something like.

a: Vault, Vault
b: Gunflame, Headbutt
c: Backstab, Heartseeker
d: Coalescence, Phase Smash

Our vault thief hits 11k vaults on bruiser targets, I think hes hit a 16k vault b4. Gunflames will hit squishies for 18k, ive been hit for a 14k backstab, could easily see an 8k heartseeker follow up to this. I’ve hit a 13k Coalescence and my Rev isnt even full glass. Thats what happens when you add traits like Cruel Repercussions into the game i guess.

Clownmug.8357:

Cygnus.6903:

You can just smell the thief complain topics before opening them.

Try playing said build.

Swagger never mentioned any specific profession or build. Why would you automatically assume a topic about balance problems is talking about thief? Weird.

You didn’t read through the entire topic, did you?

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

I play Rev in WvW it deals 15k easily when running Marauders gear with Cav trinkets with furious Sharpening Stone running Invo/Retribution/Herald. No stars align…

And you don’t know how Thieves achieve The 15k plus Hits here’s a hint no stealth spam, no Evade spam it is literally a Pure Berserker DA/CS/Tri Signet Dagger Dagger build, it uses all 4 signets to get 20 stacks of might, so using every single heal and utility which leaves nothing for if they fail or are spotted before they land the burst, since it’s not a one shot build and the only Stealth they get is CnD which means they don’t engage from stealth. It’s not an instant you’re dead they have to get close enought to CnD which means if a player cant react to two hits before the Backstab, it’s not the build that’s the issue, the thief would be seen from 1200+ range away.

Sorry every one of those classes is always visible to achieve their burst.

The game is unbalanced but there is a balance, you want to do huge numbers, you have to sacrifice survivability. Except for warrior because passives for days.

Dawdler.8521:

if your complaint is a 20K condi burst from a full tank with max damage (ie dire/trailblazer), then yes I agree with you.

As much conditions are strong in this game, I still need to see these “20k condi brusts” people talk so much about…

got hit by COR for 15k the other day, there should be a hard cap on max damage per skill.

Just a thought…

I don’t play a thief but this happened to me on my Ranger this morning. The thing is, he had to burn every CD to make this trick work and then, he’s got nothing left. So, he was able to down me but he didn’t notice the other Ranger coming behind him who simply just did a basic Pew-Pew to kill him.

It’s a great one-trick wonder of a build but other than ganking the random roamer, it doesn’t have much value.

Dawdler.8521:

if your complaint is a 20K condi burst from a full tank with max damage (ie dire/trailblazer), then yes I agree with you.

But I’m guessing we are talking power damage given the single hit stuff. Here’s the thing – in order to do that kind of insane damages, all classes with one super OP exception (warrior with defense tree, adrenal health and healing signet) have to go full glass cannon. When facing similar builds its either kill or be killed quick and they often make themselves very voulnerable to condition damage by taking this route (except previously mentioned warrior), which is the very point of balance between the two types.

The burst class in question (example Thief) doesn’t care if he has to spec full glass. If he can kill you in the opening burst he doesn’t need defense. He can just walk away because you are dead. And if he didn’t kill you he can disengage with ease and come back when his cooldowns are back.

Spartacus.3192:

Dawdler.8521:

if your complaint is a 20K condi burst from a full tank with max damage (ie dire/trailblazer), then yes I agree with you.

But I’m guessing we are talking power damage given the single hit stuff. Here’s the thing – in order to do that kind of insane damages, all classes with one super OP exception (warrior with defense tree, adrenal health and healing signet) have to go full glass cannon. When facing similar builds its either kill or be killed quick and they often make themselves very voulnerable to condition damage by taking this route (except previously mentioned warrior), which is the very point of balance between the two types.

The burst class in question (example Thief) doesn’t care if he has to spec full glass. If he can kill you in the opening burst he doesn’t need defense. He can just walk away because you are dead. And if he didn’t kill you he can disengage with ease and come back when his cooldowns are back.

Disengage with ease you say? Do elaborate. Also as stated multiple classes can deal more damage with little investment to acquire it with the click of one skill, Ranger being like Thief having to build everything around the one hit.

It was fine the first 2 years of the game, when only glass ele and thief could do that sort of stuff. When heavy classes started to hit for 17k (more if you add the aoe targets) on a 3 sec cooldown is when the balance team seriously failed at doing their job.

I’m still waiting to see the SS honestly

Still thinking that if they make stealth into less of a always on tool to more of a small window tool a lot of the problems with thf as a class would go away. If stealth only lasted for 3 sec you will know when a big hit is coming some time in thoughs 3 sec making it some what avoidable.
As things stand stealth is less of a small window tool but more on the lines of a perma effect like a class effect that not often removed and offers a host of other effects (healing, passive condi clear (better then active clear because ping / human reaction speeds)). When you add to it 0 cd effects to reapply it only a pool cost you can push all your effect into staying stealth where other classes cant put all there effect into dealing with that stealth (another problem in the game for thf is that being one of the only cost to use skill but 0 cd means they are able to push one tool where other classes have to be generalist all the time creating major moment to moment balancing problems). If say an ele could push all of there dmg tools and give up all there def moment to moment with 0cd but with a pool much like thf’s it would be the best class in the game in a hart beat the same could be said for any build and class as long as the other classes are locked into cd only.
That maybe the real balancing problem in GW2 with thf mostly the thf class with 0 cd dose not fit gw2 as a game. You could say other effect with “cost” death shored and celestial from to name a few are given so much power that they simply blow every thing else out of the water because they are pure cd effects. If GW2 is going to keep cost vs cd effects these need to be re-looked at for balancing badly.

Simply put thf can stealth to much and it get too much from stealth not because of stealth it self being op but because the game is balanced arone cd of skills not skills that cost from a pool.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

I play Rev in WvW it deals 15k easily when running Marauders gear with Cav trinkets with furious Sharpening Stone running Invo/Retribution/Herald. No stars align…

And you don’t know how Thieves achieve The 15k plus Hits here’s a hint no stealth spam, no Evade spam it is literally a Pure Berserker DA/CS/Tri Signet Dagger Dagger build, it uses all 4 signets to get 20 stacks of might, so using every single heal and utility which leaves nothing for if they fail or are spotted before they land the burst, since it’s not a one shot build and the only Stealth they get is CnD which means they don’t engage from stealth. It’s not an instant you’re dead they have to get close enought to CnD which means if a player cant react to two hits before the Backstab, it’s not the build that’s the issue, the thief would be seen from 1200+ range away.

Sorry every one of those classes is always visible to achieve their burst.

The game is unbalanced but there is a balance, you want to do huge numbers, you have to sacrifice survivability. Except for warrior because passives for days.

Yea you’re straight up lying about Rev damage in WvW.

I’m Zerk except 2 Cavalier trinks and Marauder weapons. 240% crit damage easily over 3100 power with full might. You don’t get 15k hits unless you hit Cruel Reprecussions with full stacks, full might, have every boon in the game on you (Elder’s Force) target less than 50% (Swift Termination on Devastation, which you don’t even take apparently…) and probably some vulnerability on target. Which is the stars aligning.

“Sacrifice survivability” uhhhh the signet build can just run d/p as the offhand set and stealth on approach/running away. Other full zerk glass cannon builds on other classes (except maybe mesmer) just lay down and die.

Thief mains lol

If you want to point at the problem it is the damage modifier calculation. Damage modifiers are multiplicative instead of additive. It is better to have more damage modifiers than increased power in the current system. Add in that some builds don’t need precision to crit or have strong built in mitigation and here we are.

Change the damage calc and suddenly those 10k hits will drop down to a more reasonable level. Course they will still get parked by condi in small scale but hey that isn’t the topic at hand.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

I play Rev in WvW it deals 15k easily when running Marauders gear with Cav trinkets with furious Sharpening Stone running Invo/Retribution/Herald. No stars align…

And you don’t know how Thieves achieve The 15k plus Hits here’s a hint no stealth spam, no Evade spam it is literally a Pure Berserker DA/CS/Tri Signet Dagger Dagger build, it uses all 4 signets to get 20 stacks of might, so using every single heal and utility which leaves nothing for if they fail or are spotted before they land the burst, since it’s not a one shot build and the only Stealth they get is CnD which means they don’t engage from stealth. It’s not an instant you’re dead they have to get close enought to CnD which means if a player cant react to two hits before the Backstab, it’s not the build that’s the issue, the thief would be seen from 1200+ range away.

Sorry every one of those classes is always visible to achieve their burst.

The game is unbalanced but there is a balance, you want to do huge numbers, you have to sacrifice survivability. Except for warrior because passives for days.

Yea you’re straight up lying about Rev damage in WvW.

I’m Zerk except 2 Cavalier trinks and Marauder weapons. 240% crit damage easily over 3100 power with full might. You don’t get 15k hits unless you hit Cruel Reprecussions with full stacks, full might, have every boon in the game on you (Elder’s Force) target less than 50% (Swift Termination on Devastation, which you don’t even take apparently…) and probably some vulnerability on target. Which is the stars aligning.

“Sacrifice survivability” uhhhh the signet build can just run d/p as the offhand set and stealth on approach/running away. Other full zerk glass cannon builds on other classes (except maybe mesmer) just lay down and die.

Thief mains lol

Hmm go look at the screenshot they are talking about 22k plus damage from multi skill hits guess what won’t achieve that with DP, since 7.6k of that damage was from guess what CnD guess what CnD is a skill from oh yeah that’s right Dagger Dagger not D/P. And that screenshot has zero context since it shows nothing of the players gear/build or class. Let’s play the no context game shall we? Look at this screenshot 21k CoR zero Context. There is also a screenshot of 18k Gun flame against a player with over 2600 Armor hmm. Two single hit attacks dealing way more damage than a single Backstab.

Oh I get 15k crits easily with CoR running this build I stated has higher damage out put without relying on any of those conditions besides having upkeep and Boons, you are wasting stats on Berserker gear with the Crit chance it’s not needed, with Invocation.
Cav beats berserker stats when you use Furious Sharpening Stones and Hardening Peristence. On average you will have 12 might Stacks, be under the effects of Fury and hit like a truck while not being glassy.

In Zergs I sometimes swap Devastation for Retribution and am at 25 might stacks and hit for 15k+ without swapping anything out gear wise.

Try to back up your claims it might help you.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

I play Rev in WvW it deals 15k easily when running Marauders gear with Cav trinkets with furious Sharpening Stone running Invo/Retribution/Herald. No stars align…

And you don’t know how Thieves achieve The 15k plus Hits here’s a hint no stealth spam, no Evade spam it is literally a Pure Berserker DA/CS/Tri Signet Dagger Dagger build, it uses all 4 signets to get 20 stacks of might, so using every single heal and utility which leaves nothing for if they fail or are spotted before they land the burst, since it’s not a one shot build and the only Stealth they get is CnD which means they don’t engage from stealth. It’s not an instant you’re dead they have to get close enought to CnD which means if a player cant react to two hits before the Backstab, it’s not the build that’s the issue, the thief would be seen from 1200+ range away.

Sorry every one of those classes is always visible to achieve their burst.

The game is unbalanced but there is a balance, you want to do huge numbers, you have to sacrifice survivability. Except for warrior because passives for days.

Yea you’re straight up lying about Rev damage in WvW.

I’m Zerk except 2 Cavalier trinks and Marauder weapons. 240% crit damage easily over 3100 power with full might. You don’t get 15k hits unless you hit Cruel Reprecussions with full stacks, full might, have every boon in the game on you (Elder’s Force) target less than 50% (Swift Termination on Devastation, which you don’t even take apparently…) and probably some vulnerability on target. Which is the stars aligning.

“Sacrifice survivability” uhhhh the signet build can just run d/p as the offhand set and stealth on approach/running away. Other full zerk glass cannon builds on other classes (except maybe mesmer) just lay down and die.

Thief mains lol

Blah

Wow you have been using the exact same picture for a while already and still kept getting debunked by other people.

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

I play Rev in WvW it deals 15k easily when running Marauders gear with Cav trinkets with furious Sharpening Stone running Invo/Retribution/Herald. No stars align…

And you don’t know how Thieves achieve The 15k plus Hits here’s a hint no stealth spam, no Evade spam it is literally a Pure Berserker DA/CS/Tri Signet Dagger Dagger build, it uses all 4 signets to get 20 stacks of might, so using every single heal and utility which leaves nothing for if they fail or are spotted before they land the burst, since it’s not a one shot build and the only Stealth they get is CnD which means they don’t engage from stealth. It’s not an instant you’re dead they have to get close enought to CnD which means if a player cant react to two hits before the Backstab, it’s not the build that’s the issue, the thief would be seen from 1200+ range away.

Sorry every one of those classes is always visible to achieve their burst.

The game is unbalanced but there is a balance, you want to do huge numbers, you have to sacrifice survivability. Except for warrior because passives for days.

Yea you’re straight up lying about Rev damage in WvW.

I’m Zerk except 2 Cavalier trinks and Marauder weapons. 240% crit damage easily over 3100 power with full might. You don’t get 15k hits unless you hit Cruel Reprecussions with full stacks, full might, have every boon in the game on you (Elder’s Force) target less than 50% (Swift Termination on Devastation, which you don’t even take apparently…) and probably some vulnerability on target. Which is the stars aligning.

“Sacrifice survivability” uhhhh the signet build can just run d/p as the offhand set and stealth on approach/running away. Other full zerk glass cannon builds on other classes (except maybe mesmer) just lay down and die.

Thief mains lol

Blah

Wow you have been using the exact same picture for a while already and still kept getting debunked by other people.

Go ahead and prove me wrong I am still waiting for a picture or video that shows more context as proves me wrong that CoR can’t hit hard. literally I said that picture I linked has zero context. Gg reading comprehension is hard.

Edit:
Oh look a Screenshot with a little more context, of Warrior Gun Flame for 18k

Cygnus.6903:

Clownmug.8357:

Cygnus.6903:

You can just smell the thief complain topics before opening them.

Try playing said build.

Swagger never mentioned any specific profession or build. Why would you automatically assume a topic about balance problems is talking about thief? Weird.

You didn’t read through the entire topic, did you?

Didn’t read your own post about predicting the contents of the topic before opening it, did you?

Devs have stated that balance is fine, it’s balanced around large scale, this thread should be deleted because we all know that everything Dev’s say is 100% accurate and there is no need to question them.

Spartacus.3192:

Dawdler.8521:

if your complaint is a 20K condi burst from a full tank with max damage (ie dire/trailblazer), then yes I agree with you.

But I’m guessing we are talking power damage given the single hit stuff. Here’s the thing – in order to do that kind of insane damages, all classes with one super OP exception (warrior with defense tree, adrenal health and healing signet) have to go full glass cannon. When facing similar builds its either kill or be killed quick and they often make themselves very voulnerable to condition damage by taking this route (except previously mentioned warrior), which is the very point of balance between the two types.

The burst class in question (example Thief) doesn’t care if he has to spec full glass. If he can kill you in the opening burst he doesn’t need defense. He can just walk away because you are dead. And if he didn’t kill you he can disengage with ease and come back when his cooldowns are back.

Look, I dont like thieves. In fact I loathe thieves. Most think they are so cool and awesome when they juggle knives and stealth like ninjas yet they are always the first to whine like little kittenes when they are killed. The ones running in 2-3 man gank squads are decidedly the worst and most cowardly of the bunch. I think stealth is a broken mechanic and they got way too much mobility.

That said a glass cannon thief is still a glass cannon. Maybe he doesnt “need” defense, true. Maybe a warrior just blocked his initial burst, turned around and killed the thief in one hit. Or maybe the engineer put a blowtorch to his face and laughs as he’s teleporting around like a hilarious headless chicken with 3k burns on him. Glass cannon thief is slippery as kitten but still wide open to good counterplay when it comes to smallscale and in largescale he drops like a rock when someone looks at him wrong.

Even if we where to look at balancing it, I dont think the damage is where you should look – rather toward the very low cooldown on DD block skill, dd/staff perma-evade, smoke field stacking, traps not doing damage and dire/trailblazers supertankcondi gear in general.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Yea you’re straight up lying about Rev damage in WvW.

I’m Zerk except 2 Cavalier trinks and Marauder weapons. 240% crit damage easily over 3100 power with full might. You don’t get 15k hits unless you hit Cruel Reprecussions with full stacks, full might, have every boon in the game on you (Elder’s Force) target less than 50% (Swift Termination on Devastation, which you don’t even take apparently…) and probably some vulnerability on target. Which is the stars aligning.

“Sacrifice survivability” uhhhh the signet build can just run d/p as the offhand set and stealth on approach/running away. Other full zerk glass cannon builds on other classes (except maybe mesmer) just lay down and die.

Thief mains lol

Hmm go look at the screenshot they are talking about 22k plus damage from multi skill hits guess what won’t achieve that with DP, since 7.6k of that damage was from guess what CnD guess what CnD is a skill from oh yeah that’s right Dagger Dagger not D/P. And that screenshot has zero context since it shows nothing of the players gear/build or class. Let’s play the no context game shall we? Look at this screenshot 21k CoR zero Context. There is also a screenshot of 18k Gun flame against a player with over 2600 Armor hmm. Two single hit attacks dealing way more damage than a single Backstab.

Oh I get 15k crits easily with CoR running this build I stated has higher damage out put without relying on any of those conditions besides having upkeep and Boons, you are wasting stats on Berserker gear with the Crit chance it’s not needed, with Invocation.
Cav beats berserker stats when you use Furious Sharpening Stones and Hardening Peristence. On average you will have 12 might Stacks, be under the effects of Fury and hit like a truck while not being glassy.

In Zergs I sometimes swap Devastation for Retribution and am at 25 might stacks and hit for 15k+ without swapping anything out gear wise.

Try to back up your claims it might help you.

D/P as second set, learn to read.

That build you gave me would feel like a pillow fight lol. Do you even see your power? 2193 baseline power and still less crit damage than me. Yet you expect me to believe you hit 15k lmfao. And Durability instead of something like Scholar. And no Cruel Reprecussions.

Talkin out dat kitten

BeepBoopBop.5403:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Yea you’re straight up lying about Rev damage in WvW.

I’m Zerk except 2 Cavalier trinks and Marauder weapons. 240% crit damage easily over 3100 power with full might. You don’t get 15k hits unless you hit Cruel Reprecussions with full stacks, full might, have every boon in the game on you (Elder’s Force) target less than 50% (Swift Termination on Devastation, which you don’t even take apparently…) and probably some vulnerability on target. Which is the stars aligning.

“Sacrifice survivability” uhhhh the signet build can just run d/p as the offhand set and stealth on approach/running away. Other full zerk glass cannon builds on other classes (except maybe mesmer) just lay down and die.

Thief mains lol

Hmm go look at the screenshot they are talking about 22k plus damage from multi skill hits guess what won’t achieve that with DP, since 7.6k of that damage was from guess what CnD guess what CnD is a skill from oh yeah that’s right Dagger Dagger not D/P. And that screenshot has zero context since it shows nothing of the players gear/build or class. Let’s play the no context game shall we? Look at this screenshot 21k CoR zero Context. There is also a screenshot of 18k Gun flame against a player with over 2600 Armor hmm. Two single hit attacks dealing way more damage than a single Backstab.

Oh I get 15k crits easily with CoR running this build I stated has higher damage out put without relying on any of those conditions besides having upkeep and Boons, you are wasting stats on Berserker gear with the Crit chance it’s not needed, with Invocation.
Cav beats berserker stats when you use Furious Sharpening Stones and Hardening Peristence. On average you will have 12 might Stacks, be under the effects of Fury and hit like a truck while not being glassy.

In Zergs I sometimes swap Devastation for Retribution and am at 25 might stacks and hit for 15k+ without swapping anything out gear wise.

Try to back up your claims it might help you.

D/P as second set, learn to read.

That build you gave me would feel like a pillow fight lol. Do you even see your power? 2193 baseline power and still less crit damage than me. Yet you expect me to believe you hit 15k lmfao. And Durability instead of something like Scholar. And no Cruel Reprecussions.

Talkin out dat kitten

And yeah I missed you say run D/P as the offset. But hey that makes Thief have less ability to kite and disengage in and chase people down in the first place which has been a few of the complaints in this thread. Since hey the Signet build doesn’t have access to any mobility once it engages, especially if it used Initiative to Stealth up onto some one to land the CnD burst which guess what requires even more setup and timing otherwise theThief will be revealed from the first hit and won’t get a Backstab off, but hey what do I know, It’s not like there was a post showing some people to be constantly corrected on mechanics by me or something like that.

Post your build go ahead you see the site. Because when in combat it has over 2700 power, over 60% Crit chance and over 249% Crit damage and guess what it can take a hit and still dish out huge damage with CoR. Wooo gotta love that. If I ran scholar runes oh it would be hitting even harder than the 10-15k CoRs I normally see but would lose on quiet a bit of survivability.

Nuzt.7894:

Devs have stated that balance is fine, it’s balanced around large scale, this thread should be deleted because we all know that everything Dev’s say is 100% accurate and there is no need to question them.

loooool what balance ? The whole gameplay in WvW is quite kittened up because of missing class balance .. they don´t even can handle pvp balancace.
It´s a developers fail not more not less.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

I play Rev in WvW it deals 15k easily when running Marauders gear with Cav trinkets with furious Sharpening Stone running Invo/Retribution/Herald. No stars align…

This is true. We tangled with a Rev last night that was durable to power and hit like a truck. Their build had a huge hole in condi removal so a quick respec made it easy to deal with but the first couple fights were a lot of Discord talk trying to figure out what hit us.

Swagger.1459:

I do not like to @devs in titles, but the burst damage output, by some individual builds, is way off the charts… I’m not sure if, or how much, y’all have fingers on the pulse with regard to this, but it requires some serious attention.

[sic]…[/sic]

22,829k multi-skill opening burst. 2 seconds.

All of the above numbers, by any individual profession build, are not acceptable to let linger in competitive game modes.

Imagine if you will some random necro put out 22k worth of damage in 2 seconds… I highly doubt there would be silence on the subject.

Signet thief is an abuse case build, its very gimmicky and unreliable. Its not really viable because you put all your eggs in one basket.

You can do the exact same thing with smoke scale for stealth and then use maul and signets on ranger. Maul you can get upwards of 38k on a single hit in wvw.

Pretty much every class save engie and necro has the tools to make one hit builds possible.

Do I support these kinds of builds? kinda.

They require very large sacrifices to the point where the build becomes binary. You either land the hit and score an instant kill or fold like cheap cardboard. All these builds are countered by a single dodge roll or block or invuln… then they have wait around 30 seconds to be able to do anything. If you can’t kill a full glass anything that just expelled its entire utility bar in 30 seconds your doing something wrong.

Frankly I’d rather have a dance with a one shot opponent than an undying(eg condi mesmer or frontline ele) opponent.

All that said, they need to reduce damage and defenses as a whole across the board so that combat can actually be tactical like it was before HoT.

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

With those values, every one plays decently since its is easy to kill targets, Gw2 is complete the oposite of Gw1 where u had several requirements to burst/gank/spike and several mechanics to understand.

In gw2 every one can do that with the “perfect” build for that class, by being mostly carried in who hit with more damage gimmicks, the game gets more easy for everyone since every one is effective and thinks they are good players (works like a placebo to atrack players).

Its a gimmicks wars wars game, not much skill is required since every will burst and get bursted, and every “looks like a decent” player.

Those are the ideals where gw2 was built on, a game for every one be “efective” good and bad players, and every one is rewarded.

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

If you can’t recognize that there’s a thief in the distance bee-lining it straight at you out of stealth (because D/D burst mandates the build will not have OOC stealth), and is likely burning two teleports straight at you, and then engages you, hits you for huge damage on CnD, and then 3/4 second later you fail to dodge, block, invuln, get a passive, CC, or really do virtually anything to negate the obvious incoming stealth attack… there’s no saving you. I could have engaged you harder and faster on a necromancer and you’d have still died because you lack basic situational awareness.

Not to mention in almost every case this build runs core thief instead of Daredevil (I.E. terrible), and to achieve this damage, the thief engages you with all utility skills and elites burned just to get that damage (I.E. he’s one/two-shotted if you immediately stunbreak/dodge after the CnD, which is easier to do than when against a warrior since its combo burst has shorter cast animations and does it in an AoE which a dodge will not strictly negate from the distance of the attack, unlike how backstab gets entirely negated and puts the thief’s AA chain on an ICD).

Even Gunflame signet of might Berserker has less-obvious tells with less-available counterplay. D/D signets is literally one of the worst builds in the game.

I think that a lot of the builds you’re talking about are considered “high risk, high reward” builds where people had to build full zerk to do that kind of damage which puts them at risk of dying much faster themselves.

There are other cases like warrior that can go full zerk and still have excellent sustain, or go dire/rabid and do the same kind of damage from their initial condi burst and have incredible sustain lol.

Ultimately, it has been made pretty clear that burning damage isn’t going to be changed any time soon since people have been complaining about it since they made it stacking. Things like gunflame, 100 blades, ranger longbow 2, and a few other skills have been complained about for a long time as well.

To be fair, I think OP should check their own build, because none of my characters take that kind of damage and some of them are set up to be a bit squishier. I’d be interested to know what class/build you’re running to be able to tell if this is user error on your part or not.

If you’re running around in WvW, one key thing I like to try to build my characters around is trying to have 18k+ HP, 3k+ armor, and if it is a power build, 2500~ power without stacks, 200%+ crit damage and 30%+ crit chance. This is very easy to accomplish with a mixture of marauder, zerk, and cavalier on pretty much any class.

XTR.9604:

I think that a lot of the builds you’re talking about are considered “high risk, high reward” builds where people had to build full zerk to do that kind of damage which puts them at risk of dying much faster themselves.

There are other cases like warrior that can go full zerk and still have excellent sustain, or go dire/rabid and do the same kind of damage from their initial condi burst and have incredible sustain lol.

Ultimately, it has been made pretty clear that burning damage isn’t going to be changed any time soon since people have been complaining about it since they made it stacking. Things like gunflame, 100 blades, ranger longbow 2, and a few other skills have been complained about for a long time as well.

To be fair, I think OP should check their own build, because none of my characters take that kind of damage and some of them are set up to be a bit squishier. I’d be interested to know what class/build you’re running to be able to tell if this is user error on your part or not.

If you’re running around in WvW, one key thing I like to try to build my characters around is trying to have 18k+ HP, 3k+ armor, and if it is a power build, 2500~ power without stacks, 200%+ crit damage and 30%+ crit chance. This is very easy to accomplish with a mixture of marauder, zerk, and cavalier on pretty much any class.

Unless playing a scrapper with bulwark gyro + prot or druid with bark skin + prot, every build in the game will take this kind of damage or more from signet burst.

The thing is, the build still sucks and most passives outright kill it; rev auto-taunt for example straight ends the thief before the CnD even lands since it procs on steal from SoH or BV on Mug, as this build runs no stunbreak or condition removal. The same as said for FoF DH getting free immunity to the backstab, CC mirror mesmer interrupting the CnD and backstab, static aura on ele interrupting the CnD and backstab, auto-shroud on DM necro free-soaking the damage, passive weakness on ranger negating 50%+ of the damage on top of bark skin + prot, passive DP on warrior, etc. The build is literally hard-countered in almost every way by passives alone lol, and since it lacks any utils and is playing D/D of all kits, it stands almost no chance when it comes to a fight.

Basically, it’s an assassination build, and only works when the target is unsuspecting/oblivious and on cooldowns… who knew.

You don’t just casually hit people with 15k CoR…

Average dmg for super glass CoR is ~10k.
Hits of 15-18k are with cruel repercussion trait AFTER an attack is negated.

I’m not saying it’s balanced or anything but let’s be accurate atleast. Alot of the times I’m getting big hammer dmg is simply because of upscaled and pver glass gear they probably use for loldungeons.

The more dmg a build does the more heavily – % dmg from protection, traits and even food cuts into it without even taking into consideration + toughness.

https://youtu.be/TOIaRDzeS9U

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQJASmnvN2gS6JvQRVlbosryPUYW5IKYs8ElFNFiNMnpNtFIANwegJshA-TlSBABkfEAGUTwCXQAAeQAmpE85DBAe6IoU9Ha2f4KlfBAQAu5Nzm3MbezcezbezbezzNv5Nv5NvZpACcCA-w

If I had to estimate crits without cruel repercussions, from glass opponents to toughness/above average %dmg reduction stacking:

Hammer bolts fall between 2-5.5k
CoR falls between 8-12k
Phase Smash 4-6k
Drop the hammer 4-5k

This is running pure glass cannon myself.

https://youtu.be/U3E4zb5j4uM

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

I mean that steal>CnD>backstab burst is a miserable thing to eat, but I find the dagger auto-attack numbers kind of funny. That Thief did over 15K damage in one dagger auto-attack chain. It’s funny what 15-20 stacks of might can do to one’s ability to…auto attack.

The signet build certainly feels a bit easier to pull off now that Daredevil exists. But all it takes is one auto-CC proc to force you to shortbow away.

Justine.6351:

You don’t just casually hit people with 15k CoR…

Average dmg for super glass CoR is ~10k.
Hits of 15-18k are with cruel repercussion trait AFTER an attack is negated.

I’m not saying it’s balanced or anything but let’s be accurate atleast. Alot of the times I’m getting big hammer dmg is simply because of upscaled and pver glass gear they probably use for loldungeons.

The more dmg a build does the more heavily – % dmg from protection, traits and even food cuts into it without even taking into consideration + toughness.

https://youtu.be/TOIaRDzeS9U

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQJASmnvN2gS6JvQRVlbosryPUYW5IKYs8ElFNFiNMnpNtFIANwegJshA-TlSBABkfEAGUTwCXQAAeQAmpE85DBAe6IoU9Ha2f4KlfBAQAu5Nzm3MbezcezbezbezzNv5Nv5NvZpACcCA-w

If I had to estimate crits without cruel repercussions, from glass opponents to toughness/above average %dmg reduction stacking:

Hammer bolts fall between 2-5.5k
CoR falls between 8-12k
Phase Smash 4-6k
Drop the hammer 4-5k

This is running pure glass cannon myself.

https://youtu.be/U3E4zb5j4uM

You are losing out on a lot of Damage running full Zerkers, let’s crunch some numbers do two sets for each set ok.

CoR full zerker using your build that you linked against let’s say Glass.

(908*2.25*3177)1.01*1.07*1.07*1.05*1.12*2.24=18829576.5/2118=9334.8

Now here is a variant swapping out the zerker trinkets for Cav and swapping food and utility. ~16k Hp, 3k+ Armor 67% Crit Chance 251% Crit damage and over 2900 Power.

(908*2.25*2981)1.01*1.07*1.07*1.1*1.12*2.51=19797530.3/2118=10172.03

These are just with 1 Vulnerability which can vary and be higher or lower due to the trait and 10 stacks of might which can be higher or lower and with full Bloodlust stacks. Now let’s factor in let’s say you factored to just this equation the prof based damage effects for the 50% and 20% you get 18309.7 from my build. And that is not showing full buffs/debuffs. All off of 1 Skill on a 4 second CD.

Now if you factor in say running with 25 stacks of might and more Vulnerability which is more realistic especially in small group (this can be easily achieved with just two Revs roaming together)it gets out of hand real quick. And not even having to be Glassy.

So how is it so bad that 1 class building for absolutely no survivability has to blow 5 CDs on one 12 sec CD and the rest between 20-30 sec CDs. That has to be in Melee Range to land the Hit, that can be completely negated by Passives before the Hit even lands and can do anything while having 11-12k hp and only 2118 armor and let’s not forget to achieve higher number than the one CoR that class has to use 3 attacks combined to achieve similar numbers.

So there are classes out there that can do that with 1 cd and there are classes that can do that with 5+ CDs on multiple hits.

#Funfacts

Edit:
Fixed typos and had to correct modifier on the Rune of Strength from 1.1 to 1.05

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

A perfect mesmer burst with full zerk, scholar can 100-0 any class without an auto invuln that’s in zerk. I’ve had mind wrack hit for 13k alone with 4.5k total from mirror blade and a 4k mind stab to finish.

Course if you make 1 mistake you are incredibly dead.

The Balance devs have gone to find some new skins for gems shop like all others do.

I’ve been checking out some comments in this thread and will have some replies soon, but I just wanted to make some players aware that the reason wvw and spvp have been such a mess since launch is because… (and I will paraphrase a developer here)… “balancing for all the game modes will add a lot of overhead to balance patches”…

So, all the funky and silly stuff we see happening in competitive games modes is not because that’s what the devs intended, it’s because the top is not giving the devs a green light to properly work on professions and combat for pvp modes…

Some of y’all might just keep defending away after reading this, but realize you are defending game designs that have been intentionally ignored and neglected.

Edit- and to be fair… only after 4 years have the devs started to make separate skill balances for spvp only, not wvw.

This was posted by Gaile 1 month ago… only 1 month ago. GW2 was released August 28th 2012 btw…

Gaile Gray.6029:

A message from the PvP Team:

Hey all,

We have a number of skill splits (and some global changes) that will be accompanying the launch of Season 5 next week. Read on to see what’s in store for December 13.

Over the past few releases the PvP team has been working closely with the Skills team to implement some PvP-only skill splits. Moving forward the PvP team will have more opportunity to make these skill splits as we see fit. It’s important to understand that skill splits should not change the core functionality of a skill. Players should be able to use a skill in PvE and have it do relatively the same thing in PvP, though it may be more or less effective depending on the game mode. This means that when we are looking to split out a skill, the changes are limited to the following areas:

• Recharge
• Damage multipliers
• Healing multipliers
• Number of conditions/boons applied
• Duration of conditions/boons applied
• Skill cost (energy and initiative)

A lot can be done with these knobs, but there still will be cases where we identify a problem skill or trait that we feel cannot be addressed without a functional change. In these cases, we are continuing to work closely with the Skills team to find a solution that makes the most sense as a global change.

Now on to the changes! Note that all changes listed are global changes except for those that are designated as “PvP only.”

Spvp only, but not a care about wvw…

Except for the fact that nothing about this build is OP?

Literally every other profession in the game except ele can deal near-identical damage in strictly less time with fewer disadvantages with much more consistency.

@Simon, typically speaking, signets is not a Daredevil build unless it’s playing some kind of combo-staff concept. It’s typically a core thief build since sacrificing DA and Trickery are very risky given the fact it relies heavily on weakness and PS from DA to prevent retaliation and loses damage from mug, or loses its reliability from ToTC and initiative for finishes when leaving Tr.

Clownmug.8357:

Cygnus.6903:

Clownmug.8357:

Cygnus.6903:

You can just smell the thief complain topics before opening them.

Try playing said build.

Swagger never mentioned any specific profession or build. Why would you automatically assume a topic about balance problems is talking about thief? Weird.

You didn’t read through the entire topic, did you?

Didn’t read your own post about predicting the contents of the topic before opening it, did you?

My predictions came true, so… what?