Guild Wars 2

Is this really working as intended? The new trait gives warriors 98% reduce duration on immob/cripple/chill etc when they combine it with Lemongrass+Melandru Runes. This is a 10 POINT TRAIT yet it is over the top when fighting warrior with this setup.

Always thought of the warrior as the slow guy who deals tons of damage + reliably tanky. I guess that sorta fits the guardian more but just my thoughts.

I must say, as a Gaurdian, this is the first time I’ve felt considerably jealous of the warrior.

@Doom, warriors are actually surprisingly mobile, even before this patch.

Moleless.1462:

@Doom, warriors are actually surprisingly mobile, even before this patch.

Yeah, actually one of the most mobile classes I’ve seen. I just don’t think they should be that mobile. Just my opinion though :P

Doomdesire.9365:

Moleless.1462:

@Doom, warriors are actually surprisingly mobile, even before this patch.

Yeah, actually one of the most mobile classes I’ve seen. I just don’t think they should be that mobile. Just my opinion though :P

Well look at it this way. Most of their mobility comes from GS. The GS is a clsoe range melee weapon, so if they’re using GS for mobility, it’s mainly to run away. If a warrior is actually in combat and wants to be dealing heavy damage, they have to be in the thick of it. If they’re using GS skills as an escape, well that’s just potential damage they aren’t dealing.

Traits are fine, melandu runes + food is OP as kitten. Ideally you should be able to effectively counter it with +condition duration on your end but that doesn’t pan out well enough since the majority of conditions are only 1-5s.

Gain some lose some, the runes aren’t that good compared to others. You lose again with the food.

It can be done but comes at a price. I wont be running it because I don’t find it worth it. The trait is really nice thou and should stay the way it is.

I have to ask, why is this bugging you? Warriors are already ridiculously easy to kill in wvw, even with that setup on them. Give them just a little bit of tankiness before you crush them in battle.

RyuDragnier.9476:

I have to ask, why is this bugging you? Warriors are already ridiculously easy to kill in wvw, even with that setup on them. Give them just a little bit of tankiness before you crush them in battle.

Pretty true. I’d say warriors are atm the most killable class in WvW. No harm giving them a bit of extra escape

RyuDragnier.9476:

I have to ask, why is this bugging you? Warriors are already ridiculously easy to kill in wvw, even with that setup on them. Give them just a little bit of tankiness before you crush them in battle.

So much this. Warriors have no sustain.

This is quite hilarious. Warrior is super fun to play now. 3.8k armor, 3.1k attack, 70% crit chance, 26k HP, invulnerable to CC… gg. Warrior is God Mode now XD.

buki.3108:

This is quite hilarious. Warrior is super fun to play now. 3.8k armor, 3.1k attack, 70% crit chance, 26k HP, invulnerable to CC… gg. Warrior is God Mode now XD.

Then you realize you have no sustain and none of that matters. Do people still think armor and HP matter in this game? If it did Guardians and Eles wouldn’t be the top dogs.

RyuDragnier.9476:

I have to ask, why is this bugging you? Warriors are already ridiculously easy to kill in wvw, even with that setup on them. Give them just a little bit of tankiness before you crush them in battle.

This..

I absolutely just take a dump on pretty much every Warrior I come across 1v1 on my Thief/Ranger/Necro.

buki.3108:

This is quite hilarious. Warrior is super fun to play now. 3.8k armor, 3.1k attack, 70% crit chance, 26k HP, invulnerable to CC… gg. Warrior is God Mode now XD.

I hate to tell you this, but most classes will still just crap on you unless you somehow jump them while they’re not looking at 100b them to death (even then most will stun break and break their foot off in your kitten /p>

buki.3108:

This is quite hilarious. Warrior is super fun to play now. 3.8k armor, 3.1k attack, 70% crit chance, 26k HP, invulnerable to CC… gg. Warrior is God Mode now XD.

They were always like that -.-
And as a guardian i never could chase a warrior -.-

I’ve only played mes since release. Can someone define “sustain” for me as it’s being used with regards to warriors?

I don’t run this setup but I find it funny that people think warrior is the most killable class. I wont go too much into my build but I have mostly pvt gear and I run sword/shield & greatsword. I don’t die unless I decide I’m going to go down with the ship so to speak. Even then, I’m one of, if not the last man standing in a losing fight, not counting those who ran away of course :P The most killable class is the one with the worse person playing it.

Doomdesire.9365:

Moleless.1462:

@Doom, warriors are actually surprisingly mobile, even before this patch.

Yeah, actually one of the most mobile classes I’ve seen. I just don’t think they should be that mobile. Just my opinion though :P

A mostly melee damage dealing class should not have mobility ?Mkaaay

Ross Biddle.2367:

I’ve only played mes since release. Can someone define “sustain” for me as it’s being used with regards to warriors?

In regards to warriors, it usually is referring to warriors lack of sustained healing.

I’m sure there must be some good warrior builds/players out there it’s just there are lots of zerker glass warriors, that are easy to kill, makes the class look weak.

thievery.2701:

I don’t run this setup but I find it funny that people think warrior is the most killable class. I wont go too much into my build but I have mostly pvt gear and I run sword/shield & greatsword. I don’t die unless I decide I’m going to go down with the ship so to speak. Even then, I’m one of, if not the last man standing in a losing fight, not counting those who ran away of course :P The most killable class is the one with the worse person playing it.

I generally run bunker shout heals, but at the end of the day your just prolonging your death. Sure it’s nice to be the last one standing in a zerg, but then your alone and and most any class can 1v1 you.

“Sustain” is not an adjective, guys, you’re thinking of sustainability.

So stop saying that.

Chaosky.5276:

“Sustain” is not an adjective, guys, you’re thinking of sustainability.

So stop saying that.

Come on guy, we know that. Its shorthand basically. Stop trying to correct grammar as if that really matters to the discussion.

Ross Biddle.2367:

I’ve only played mes since release. Can someone define “sustain” for me as it’s being used with regards to warriors?

Sustain is the ability to stay in battle.
Warriors got:
-Evades(duh)
-Blocks(on certain weapon sets which limit offensive strength)
-Endure Pain
-Adrenal Healing
-Healing spells

now let’s match these up.
Evades: Standard, no need to say anything, every class got that.
Blocks can be ruled out, Endure pain is on a horrible cooldown

Leaves the regeneration, which is meh’ish and heals, which are horribly low and on rather long cooldowns. Warriors sit on a huge hp pool, but their natural healing is almost non existant in comparison, while their only way of taking some hits is on a 90 second cooldown.

If a warrior enters a battle, he will constantly lose more life than he can recover and take more hits than he can manage. He will simply bleed out due to being unable to keep his hitpoints above “0” for long.

Mastering the warrior in a duel situation takes more skill than other classes but it can be done. Warrior has a limited time frame he can work with due to the lack of sustained healing that some other classes have, but it can make up for it with an initial high armor/HP pool along with high damage and capacity for crowd control.

A cc warri at best can keep an enemy crowd controlled 100% of the time.

Warriors have some decent match-ups in duels. A properly played warrior shouldn’t lose to any thief other than a condi pistol (lack of reliable cond removal) or dagger/pistol thief (due to blind spam).

naphack.9346:

Systain is the ability to stay in battle.

That would be ‘survivability’.

I always thought ‘sustain’ referred to the ability to apply constant pressure to the opposition through damage.

as in, ‘sustain’ damage being the opposite of ‘burst’ damage

nah, survivability doesn’t necessary mean the ability to stay in battle, it’s the ability to “not die”.
The difference is, a survivable class doesn’t necessarily need to be able to stay in battle, it’s enough to be able to stay alive under pressure, whether it’s by escaping or fighting back.

I presume this is all tested and we’re not just assuming it works this way? You would expect percentage things to be multiplicative. Granted that is still an enormous reduction in effectiveness, but it’s still not 2%.

But yea, you’d think something like this would be capped at 33%. That way a class could use the trait instead of food to open up other options. Kind of like how movement skills are capped at 33% but classes like Ele’s still sometimes choose to run signet for 25% as opposed to buffing for 33%.

Atherakhia.4086:

I presume this is all tested and we’re not just assuming it works this way? You would expect percentage things to be multiplicative. Granted that is still an enormous reduction in effectiveness, but it’s still not 2%. FYI – Wiki states the condition reduction cap is 95%.

But yea, you’d think something like this would be capped at 33%. That way a class could use the trait instead of food to open up other options. Kind of like how movement skills are capped at 33% but classes like Ele’s still sometimes choose to run signet for 25% as opposed to buffing for 33%.

Tested it and the results indicate that the values are added. So, 33% Trait + 40% Food + 25% Melandru = 98% reduction. It was easy to test at 73% reduction and 65% reduction. With the 98% reduction, it was very hard to test this since you barely notice the 2%.

With that being said, this will make some traits, utilities, skill, etc 95% less effective against said warrior. I understand that there are counterbuilds but to render someone’s abilities complete useless 95% of the time is OP. There is something wrong with this and it needs to be addressed.

naphack.9346:

Ross Biddle.2367:

I’ve only played mes since release. Can someone define “sustain” for me as it’s being used with regards to warriors?

Sustain is the ability to stay in battle.
Warriors got:
-Evades(duh)
-Blocks(on certain weapon sets which limit offensive strength)
-Endure Pain
-Adrenal Healing
-Healing spells

now let’s match these up.
Evades: Standard, no need to say anything, every class got that.
Blocks can be ruled out, Endure pain is on a horrible cooldown

Leaves the regeneration, which is meh’ish and heals, which are horribly low and on rather long cooldowns. Warriors sit on a huge hp pool, but their natural healing is almost non existant in comparison, while their only way of taking some hits is on a 90 second cooldown.

If a warrior enters a battle, he will constantly lose more life than he can recover and take more hits than he can manage. He will simply bleed out due to being unable to keep his hitpoints above “0” for long.

I don’t play a warrior, I have never created one.
Stating this to show my ignorance, it sounds like what warriors could use is some kind of decent life leach attached to their ranged weapon attacks.

Get low on health, use that mobility to get a little distance and open up with rifle (or bow, do they use those?) which should have either a trait or a skill to leach life with their shots. Add a Sigil of Life or Sigil of Blood to their ranged weapon and it SEEMS like that would be of some help to their survivability.

OT: The trait only gives 33% reduction, which is fine for a 10pt trait. Runes are a huge part of a build so it’s normal it has a bigger impact. But the biggest reduction comes from the food, so if anything is too much, it’s the food :p

What is this non-sense about “sustain”? Warriors don’t need sustain, that’s what Guardians are for (protection and heals.) With 26k HP and a 9k heal there is no need for sustain. Anything you hit will die within 10 seconds if you’re running with a decent train. If you need to heal, then run away and reset. After all you can just WALK away from a fight without being CC’d

When Endure Pain procs, get out and reset/re-rally with train. If you have a good commander and train, there’s no way to die on a warrior now.

I think this is something warriors needed. Don’t forget it’s huge stat/gear investment to get condition immunity.

I would much rather stick with soldier runes and shouts to make my condition removal AoE.

Also, you guys failed to notice that Ele’s had that trait all along.. they just didn’t need it because they have effective cleanses.

Moleless.1462:

Pretty true. I’d say warriors are atm the most killable class in WvW. No harm giving them a bit of extra escape

This makes me feel even better about running full melee and surviving for 7-8 hours at a time.

Personally I don’t even find Dogged March necessary between Melandru, Lemongrass, and my warhorn conversion. If only it reduced stun duration by a small amount also…

thievery.2701:

I don’t run this setup but I find it funny that people think warrior is the most killable class. I wont go too much into my build but I have mostly pvt gear and I run sword/shield & greatsword. I don’t die unless I decide I’m going to go down with the ship so to speak. Even then, I’m one of, if not the last man standing in a losing fight, not counting those who ran away of course :P The most killable class is the one with the worse person playing it.

This. And I’m pretty sure we’re using the same build.