If your commander it getting sniped why not protect him/her better if it’s so important?
Pugs think they need a tag to organize.
Pugs by their very nature tend to be generally disorganized, and they will not be organized enough and responsive enough to protect the tag.
Pugs need a tag to be alive and active for them to rally around. If tag dies, some will run, some will keep fighting, and some will be confused, which leads to many being wiped.
If commander focusing didn’t work, people would generally not do it. Stability changes have made this easier to do.
All of the above listed points are just some of the factors at play. It is likely this situation will remain til after HoT. Hopefully though no one class will be relegated to bodyguard expectations.
You cannot fix a “meta”; it is something designed by players. In this case, it’s the act of focus firing someone down which is a completely legal move that is needed to make combat viable in the first place, especially on a large scale; yes people can be nuked down; that’s just part of it. There is no concept that can be put in place that makes commanders unable to be targeted down- without making weird exceptions- why is the commander getting special privileges that would require 300g to purchase? Any fix would require inconsistencies— such as the very assumption a group even needs a tag.
For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards,
for there you have been and there you will long to return.
I’m not a military expert, but don’t sergeants to the immediate short-term directing with officers handling the longer range planning?
Appoint a sergeant to serve as zerg pin and take directions from the commander. If he goes down, the commander can take immediate control till the sergeant is back.
[edit: my point, which I didn’t make very well, is that this is not an issue due to a problem with the game. It’s an issue because removing the enemy’s leadership is a good strategy. As such it should be countered not by Anet ‘fixing’ but by players developing counter-strategies.]
When I used to play WvW that is exactly what we did. We always had 2-3 commanders runing, if one got killed and it wasnt viable to rezz, the 2nd one tagged up immediately and the fight continued.
Also, keeping down the commander is a very valid tactic and can at times be difficult to accomplish for various reasons, you can get him/her down 1-2 times, but keeping them down is a different story entirely. Double or triple this when you’re on the outnumbered side.
Hence I disagree with the O.P. its the focused commander and his/her team that needs to L2P, there is no adjustments needed here.
There is no need to “fix” this, it’s not broken, have a secondary ready to tag up, change your tactics, change your class, don’t play a giant neon glowing norn, there’s plenty of things you yourself can do to help tone down the driver sniping.
So many squishy Commanders out there because they feel the need to do damage, tank up to the fullest extent possible, hit like a wet noodle and let your minions do the damage, your job is to lead and survive.
Pin sniping gives some, otherwise useless classes a role.
If i’m on my ranger and I happen to come across the commander I will target hit, since Rangers are only good at targeting one.
It increases the pressure on the commander, and he will need to call more reflects to prevent it (guardian and mesmer use their reflects)
If i’m in my guardian I wont even try and attack commander, but instead cleave everybody and anybody.
That shouldn’t be the issue most have. Random people targeting the commander and attacking them is going to happen regardless. The complaint as far as I know is that dedicated groups essentially have a team composition specifically to separate the commander and spike them down.
There are ways to completely shut down pin sniping.
In BG T1 the commander will call out guardian walls or mesmer bubbles when he is taking heavy fire. Also if commander goes down people place walls in front of him to prevent him being ranged down, followed by a banner to pick him back up.
For once I actually agree with everyone defending this. Do you think Alexander the Great would have complained about pin sniping? Seriously, this is war, war is dirty, and it’s definitely not cheating, so deal with it.
“Kitten pirateship pin-sniping scrub blob.”
– Alexander the Great, 330 BC
For once I actually agree with everyone defending this. Do you think Alexander the Great would have complained about pin sniping? Seriously, this is war, war is dirty, and it’s definitely not cheating, so deal with it.
“Kitten pirateship pin-sniping scrub blob.”
– Alexander the Great, 330 BC
I think we’re forgetting he wouldn’t have been able to respawn to complain about it :P
Kurodaraku – Necromancer | Kuroshikon – Ranger
Officer of [DEX] Deus Ex Machina Eu and [Fus] Fus Ro Dâh
Ruins of Surmia
to make it fair for roamers: IF YOU HAVE LESS THAN 3 PEOPLE ON YOU THEN YOU ARE INVULNERABLE – this is to prevent commanders using 50 man zergs to chase roamers.
I mostly play for the new Free-For-All arena in PvP lobby.
….. And Elementalist.
to make it fair for roamers: IF YOU HAVE LESS THAN 3 PEOPLE ON YOU THEN YOU ARE INVULNERABLE – this is to prevent commanders using 50 man zergs to chase roamers.
nah its your fault if you run around alone in a game mode about large fights and battles.
to make it fair for roamers: IF YOU HAVE LESS THAN 3 PEOPLE ON YOU THEN YOU ARE INVULNERABLE – this is to prevent commanders using 50 man zergs to chase roamers.
nah its your fault if you run around alone in a game mode about large fights and battles.
Last I checked you don’t decide what this game is about. In fact that is a pretty ignorant statement considering how many different game modes are within this game.
Considering it depends on which Dev you ask as to which answer you get, not even Anet can say what WvW is about, one will tell you siege, one will tell you epic battle, one will tell you community, one will tell you to bridge PvE/PvP, one will tell you to test your skill ….. you get the point I hope.
One could say, it’s your fault for being a bad commander that keeps getting sniped when it is avoidable.
to make it fair for roamers: IF YOU HAVE LESS THAN 3 PEOPLE ON YOU THEN YOU ARE INVULNERABLE – this is to prevent commanders using 50 man zergs to chase roamers.
nah its your fault if you run around alone in a game mode about large fights and battles.
I hear that all the time… “killing people doesn’t help your server, flipping camps and killing yaks does nothing to help your server”…
Cant wait for auto upgrades to be in effect where roamers will be forced to zerg to “help their server” instead of playing the game mode the way they enjoy it
I mostly play for the new Free-For-All arena in PvP lobby.
….. And Elementalist.
Its what anet said around the time GW2 was released not my own definition.
It wasn’t a definition fullstop, they’ve also mentioned small scale at various times, they specifically introduced bloodlust/ruins to encourage small scale for example.
to make it fair for roamers: IF YOU HAVE LESS THAN 3 PEOPLE ON YOU THEN YOU ARE INVULNERABLE – this is to prevent commanders using 50 man zergs to chase roamers.
nah its your fault if you run around alone in a game mode about large fights and battles.
I hear that all the time… “killing people doesn’t help your server, flipping camps and killing yaks does nothing to help your server”…
Cant wait for auto upgrades to be in effect where roamers will be forced to zerg to “help their server” instead of playing the game mode the way they enjoy it
camps? kitten it, solo their keeps np, lol
auto upgrades wont stop me, only another player will
JQ: Rikkity
head here to discuss wvw without fear of infractions
imo the trouble is that really good drivers are few and far between, especially as the competitive veteran players leave the game. For many servers even two or three good commanders/drivers are available on the server across all time zones, let alone two at once.
By relatively skillless spamming corrupt boon, moa, ranger snipe etc on the remaining commanders it puts terrible stress on experienced commanders- when commanding and managing a zerg is already a stressful exercise.
Running with a blob with a pin who only knows how to push 1 is completely different than running with pug zerg under a good commander who uses their head to create surprising and exciting fights. Guild vs zerg is the same- if the driver is good, incredible things can be done and the sense of camaraderie and cooperation is impossible to get anywhere else in the game. It’s fun. For those who believe only in solo roaming, maybe it’s not your type of fun. But many people enjoy being part of an exciting battle. Good commanders make those happen instead of just standing 900 range apart and pewpewing until something dies.
Driver sniping against brainless pug zerg and inexperienced driver also discourages green drivers. It’s bad for morale to work hard to “get good” and then be smashed by a cheesy wombo combo that only required seven people pushing one button.
Honestly the only salvation possible to prevent total brainless blobspam are good drivers who can shift the tides of battle with experienced understanding of the field and strategy.
Pushing good commanders out of the game will only make zerg fights stupider and spammier.
Maybe it’s too late to save large scale battle in gw2 but with HoT veteran players may return.
If commander gets buffs can the squishies get a defiance bar too as we will then get more focus? Then the rest of the melee train starts getting focused so they will need +100 toughness for each alive party member.
Being commander sniped sucks, try to get a second in command to take over or use it to your advantage by getting people to follow someone else and you lead a feint.
If commander gets buffs can the squishies get a defiance bar too as we will then get more focus? Then the rest of the melee train starts getting focused so they will need +100 toughness for each alive party member.
Being commander sniped sucks, try to get a second in command to take over or use it to your advantage by getting people to follow someone else and you lead a feint.
TLDR: Man up and deal with it.
What will servers with only like 1-2 good commanders per time zone do? There are very few good pug commanders nowadays who can take over on the fly.
Average and bad commanders would make no difference if the good commander died already.
If commander gets buffs can the squishies get a defiance bar too as we will then get more focus? Then the rest of the melee train starts getting focused so they will need +100 toughness for each alive party member.
Being commander sniped sucks, try to get a second in command to take over or use it to your advantage by getting people to follow someone else and you lead a feint.
TLDR: Man up and deal with it.
What will servers with only like 1-2 good commanders per time zone do? There are very few good pug commanders nowadays who can take over on the fly.
Average and bad commanders would make no difference if the good commander died already.
I would question why you’re calling a commander good if he got himself killed and didn’t organise delegating commanding if/when he died.
While I personally don’t enjoy commander focusing, I do enjoy the added level of strategy it creates for us to actively try to counter it. So for the greater good of the game I don’t want it “fixed”. Dumbing down is bad.
Focusing squishy targets is broken and cheesy, it allows people to kill the most damaging classes without having to deal with the nomad pug warriors, I think eles/necros/rangers should be invulnerable to damage until every warrior/guardian in the zerg is dead and waypointed.
If you’re on EU and need help to get into dungeons, pm me.
If commander gets buffs can the squishies get a defiance bar too as we will then get more focus? Then the rest of the melee train starts getting focused so they will need +100 toughness for each alive party member.
Being commander sniped sucks, try to get a second in command to take over or use it to your advantage by getting people to follow someone else and you lead a feint.
TLDR: Man up and deal with it.
What will servers with only like 1-2 good commanders per time zone do? There are very few good pug commanders nowadays who can take over on the fly.
Average and bad commanders would make no difference if the good commander died already.
I would question why you’re calling a commander good if he got himself killed and didn’t organise delegating commanding if/when he died.
Because if the enemies really want you dead there is not much you can do to prevent it, other than making the fights more boring and tedious.
Focusing squishy targets is broken and cheesy, it allows people to kill the most damaging classes without having to deal with the nomad pug warriors, I think eles/necros/rangers should be invulnerable to damage until every warrior/guardian in the zerg is dead and waypointed.
if a squishy dies its not the end of the zerg (unless it was a very close fight already), if the commander dies the fight is lost in almost every case (everyone goes cloud formation or runs ooc to waypoint)
Stop comparing apples and oranges all the time.
A living commander is essential to pug fighting, everyone else is replaceable if they die.
It’s a legit tactic and people will come up with countertactics.
Will they? I have been waiting for a decent anti commander sniping tactic for months now. The only thing I see happening is that people contact the enemy commander and make a “contract” to not snipe each others commander.
The moment groups start running a backup driver tag is the moment your months-long problem becomes solved. Welcome to metagaming.
It’s a legit tactic and people will come up with countertactics.
Will they? I have been waiting for a decent anti commander sniping tactic for months now. The only thing I see happening is that people contact the enemy commander and make a “contract” to not snipe each others commander.
The moment groups start running a backup driver tag is the moment your months-long problem becomes solved. Welcome to metagaming.
Its often hard enough to find one commander (eg no commander at all on the map). Expecting to have a backup one is unrealistic.
It’s a legit tactic and people will come up with countertactics.
Will they? I have been waiting for a decent anti commander sniping tactic for months now. The only thing I see happening is that people contact the enemy commander and make a “contract” to not snipe each others commander.
The moment groups start running a backup driver tag is the moment your months-long problem becomes solved. Welcome to metagaming.
Its often hard enough to find one commander (eg no commander at all on the map). Expecting to have a backup one is unrealistic.
ive never seen it happen anywhere else… but in t1, higher player density = more commanders around, and theres a pretty good chance that a ts pug zerg has someone else who can command it in a pinch, and will be willing to while the main commander is walking back.
JQ: Rikkity
head here to discuss wvw without fear of infractions
Its rare to see it happening. 90%+ of the time the commander orders people to port back to waypoint as soon as possible here on SFR. And we are the #1 EU server.
nah its your fault if you run around alone in a game mode about large fights and battles.
The game is about whatever you want to make it about within the rule set provided.
As for the complaint how about some counter play? fake pushes, pushes with veil, switchbacks, flanks, sub commanders, banners, rezzers, reflects, smoke fields(stealth). Seems like a legitimate tactic to all focus on that guy with the pink saiyan hairstyle at the front of the zerg pushing.
When I’ve been on my guardian (I main ele) I make sure I’m at the front of the pack, right on the commander as much as possible. Often I end up being mistaken for the commander and focused. Do I whine? No. I think of it as a job well done.
Once again though, I question why you’re calling the commander good if he went and got himself focused and killed without leaving a contingency for if/when he died.
In tier 1 it is not that big of a problem. If you are constantly running pin snipe you will probably get ridiculed not only by your opponents but by your own fellow servers guilds. Pin snipping is not looked very highly upon as it just ruins fights and makes them generally unfun. Super chessy. I guess in the lower teir it could be a problem though as the wvw communities are not as developed.
In tier 1 it is not that big of a problem. If you are constantly running pin snipe you will probably get ridiculed not only by your opponents but by your own fellow servers guilds. Pin snipping is not looked very highly upon as it just ruins fights and makes them generally unfun. Super chessy. I guess in the lower teir it could be a problem though as the wvw communities are not as developed.
Oh no ridiculed by some trashy gwen players who cares?
Ur just a slave to a guild leader who tell u exactly what build to run exactly what to do all the time. I pity u they are usually the worst pvp players.
… I guess in the lower teir it could be a problem though as the wvw communities are not as developed.
Oh hahaha, good one, oh my. Maybe you should every now and then stop to think what you are about to say so that you don’t spit out stuff like this.
Sounds like you talk about lower Tier servers like they would be some third world servers where people throw each other with rocks and sticks without any knowledge of the game mechanics or anything.
A Pink scumbag of [FACE] and deep inside a [GuM]ster
Mouggari – Warrior – Candy cane Avenger
In tier 1 it is not that big of a problem. If you are constantly running pin snipe you will probably get ridiculed not only by your opponents but by your own fellow servers guilds. Pin snipping is not looked very highly upon as it just ruins fights and makes them generally unfun. Super chessy. I guess in the lower teir it could be a problem though as the wvw communities are not as developed.
What ya mean with developed. Stacked with zerglings that cant think on their own and have to have a commander to do the thinking for them resulting in topics like this?
Quite a narrowminded opinion on the lower tiers you have man.
Big Babou, Ranger for life.
Madness Rises [Rise] – Banners Hold.
Don’t argue with idiots, they pull you down their level and own you with experience.
Commander sniping is an important part of dismantling a zerg that outnumbers you greatly. It’s a valid tactic that is reliant on a group having no autonomy outside of commander orders. Therefore it is up to the commander and the following group/zerg as a whole to ensure that this is not the case.
Basically, if your commander dies, but you all know how to play in the event of a central command role being absent, you shouldn’t be having any problems.
Again that does not work with random people. You cannot expect random people (pugs) to move as a unity as soon as the leader is dead. It just turns instantly into a cloud formation and most people will try to get ooc to waypoint. The rest will die helplessly.
To profit from the 5 people aoe cap you have to stick together or are you heavily disadvantaged.
additional commanders are also no solution (not to mention very few people are good enough to start commanding on the fly) since you will not see their tags if you joined the squad of the 1st commander.
Again that does not work with random people. You cannot expect random people (pugs) to move as a unity as soon as the leader is dead. It just turns instantly into a cloud formation and most people will try to get ooc to waypoint. The rest will die helplessly.
To profit from the 5 people aoe cap you have to stick together or are you heavily disadvantaged.
additional commanders are also no solution (not to mention very few people are good enough to start commanding on the fly) since you will not see their tags if you joined the squad of the 1st commander.
^ that is exactly why they are killing your commanders.
. Engi & Warr . Beta > 2017 Death of PvP
currently a Boyfriend main :P Waiting To ReRoll Mystic & Forget About Tyria
Sorry but this makes absolutely no sense.