Guild Wars 2

In light of the inaugural World versus World season, a troubling issue has come to my, and others’, attention. Namely, a large influx of players, who normally participate in non-WvW game activities and types, are struggling to enjoy the gameplay which many of us have had several months to learn and master. Perhaps the greatest issue which interferes with these players’ enjoyment of WvW is the current meta of high-player count “zergs” (also known as “blobs”) which dominate combat. With this in mind, many players who are not prepared for the state of gameplay find themselves in the downed state quite frequently, without much of a chance to rejoin the large-scale battle that is WvW.
Quite frankly, if something is not done to help these players, the state of WvW will be placed in jeopardy – the developers cannot neglect these players if they expect long-term growth and stability.

Now, with this problem outlined, I now bring a potential solution to discussion: Downed State Mastery

The intention of this WvW Ability Mastery Tree is to balance the current disparity present in WvW for newcomers, both PvE veterans and under-leveled players alike. In other words, this line of abilities seeks to strengthen these players’ chances to stay in the fight!

Below are my preliminary ability suggestions:

Level 1: Gain 300% more hp while downed.
Level 2: All down state skill cooldowns are reduced by 70%.
Level 3: You transfer 1 condition to your attackers once per second.
Level 4: Once downed you will be rendered invulnerable for 2 seconds.
Level 5: Instant rally once downed on a 180 second cooldown. Once rallied you will recieve: protection, regeneration, retaliation and swiftness.

It’s a problem that people die in PvP?

Shucks.

Kind of moot point with finishers don’t you think? Most commanders would scream at people to spike rather than dps because of the points available from bloodlust.

It would be better to encourage people to invest in Knights/Invaders armor and survive longer rather than band-aid patch the problem. I mean, they’re pretty cheap to get. Around 20 gold (not including badges) will get you a whole runed up set.

Omne.4603:

many players who are not prepared for the state of gameplay…

… should either not join WvW until they are prepared, or stop complaining and admit that it is their responsibility to get their kitten together, not Anet’s to guide them by hand.

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

many players who are not prepared for the state of gameplay…

… should either not join WvW until they are prepared, or stop complaining and admit that it is their responsibility to get their kitten together, not Anet’s to guide them by hand.

Yeah, cause when I joined WvW I was totally prepared and knew everything there was to know about WvW even though I had no prior experience. Reading post and watching video’s can only do so much. But you need to chill out ether way, I’m pretty sure this is a joke post.

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

Keiel.7489:

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

many players who are not prepared for the state of gameplay…

… should either not join WvW until they are prepared, or stop complaining and admit that it is their responsibility to get their kitten together, not Anet’s to guide them by hand.

Yeah, cause when I joined WvW I was totally prepared and knew everything there was to know about WvW even though I had no prior experience. Reading post and watching video’s can only do so much. But you need to chill out ether way, I’m pretty sure this is a joke post.

Yeah and you were asking Anet to make it easier for you by wrapping you in pillows, right? Or you were excited to learn this new huge (as it looked then) open world and was aware that until you get used to it you will probably act sub-optimally and die more than you should? Nothing wrong with that.

If it was a joke then meh, not quite funny.

P.S. Also, I was mainly referring to required stat-builds which you can pretty good idea about without having any experience on WvW. So at least you don’t die a lot because you are being so squishy.

Totally agree with the OP on all his points, except maybe a little more invuln would be nice for us newer folks. I don’t know why Anet is so surprised that so many newer people are so reluctant to try WvW. NEWSFLASH: Its really really really hard to get into. Anyways this is something alot of people will be looking forward to them implementating.

Omne.4603:

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

In that case I would say keep them up is better than bringing them up from the downed state. I say we should add in “Together We Stand” Mastery. It only activates when you are within proximity of others who have the Mastery and tears.

Tear 1: Grants stability as long as there are 4 with the Mastery. 300yd radius.
Tear 2: Grants protection when you have 80% or less health and 4 others are around you wit the mastery and tier. 300yd Radius.
Tear 3: Boons are shared. If one person gets the boon it replicates itself with everyone who has this tear unlocked. Radius 300. No max targets.
Tear 4: Power and condition damage is increased by 10 for each other person with this tier unlocked. Radius 600.
Tear 5: Damage is now even distributed amongs everyone with this tear unlocked by percentage of damage recieved (everyone will take damage based the damage dealt and their max HP, that way if one person dies, everyone dies together). Radius 600.

To help out as these are newbies we will only require a total of 40 WvW rank points to unlock T5. Players who already have WvW Rank of 40 or more before the season started cannot spec into this Mastery.

5 should be amended with “and all your enemies get insta-downed in a 360 feet circle”. That would do it, it wasn’t cool enough.

I mean, are you kidding me? With 5 alone you are basically rewarding players for getting downed. Nah, nothing wrong with that…

Did you consider how it will affect WvW dynamics?

WvW veterans would get much more value from this line than newbies. Since they do not die that often, you are basically giving them eternal life with this line. Many of them would be probably able to get this line maxed immediately, too. While rookies will have to farm WEXP to get that.

Keiel.7489:

I say we should add in “Together We Stand” Mastery

Now THAT got to be a joke

I hope we can get a dev response in this thread to address the OP, I know a lot of other people have these same concerns.

Don’t hold your breath. The idea is just too outlandish.

Yaro.3251:

Don’t hold your breath. The idea is just too outlandish.

How so? This is something that can really help players, REAL people, customers. How does this not deserve even 5 minutes of there time? Something like this would have made all the difference in the world to a player like me when I started out.

honestly, those archives are not even that hard and can be collected while mindlessly running with commander

once pve’ers got their archives, they will leave anyway…ppl who stays in wvw don’t need guides nor any specific help… we all were new to wvw at some point, we didn’t get any privilegues… why should pve’ers get any? they already get most love from anet

if your suggestions would actually get implemented, ppl will just abuse them and pve’ers and uplvs will just have even less motivation to adapt to wvw

hey, i am wvw veteran, i want to be able to do 500% more dmg to tequatl and be immune to poison, yeee

skgstan.9687:

Yaro.3251:

Don’t hold your breath. The idea is just too outlandish.

How so? This is something that can really help players, REAL people, customers. How does this not deserve even 5 minutes of there time? Something like this would have made all the difference in the world to a player like me when I started out.

The fact that something would help players doesn’t warrant attention by itself. It would really help me to have invulnerability and insta-kill on demand, but it doesn’t mean devs should consider bringing it into game.

I dont think buffing downed state is a good idea. I would rather see it removed.Because some profesions have good abilities in downed and other dont.

Cynz.9437:

honestly, those archives are not even that hard and can be collected while mindlessly running with commander

once pve’ers got their archives, they will leave anyway…ppl who stays in wvw don’t need guides nor any specific help… we all were new to wvw at some point, we didn’t get any privilegues… why should pve’ers get any? they already get most love from anet

if your suggestions would actually get implemented, ppl will just abuse them and pve’ers and uplvs will just have even less motivation to adapt to wvw

hey, i am wvw veteran, i want to be able to do 500% more dmg to tequatl and be immune to poison, yeee

You WvW elitist disgust me. What makes you a better person than the Pve community. These downed state ideas are amazing. They would give the non-wvw community a chance in a fight. “hey, i am wvw veteran, i want to be able to do 500% more dmg to tequatl and be immune to poison, yeee” You really think that would help you with Tequatl. DO you even know who Tequatl is! All im saying is Pve isnt easy, it takes time and dedication. I’ve put in so much work, and all I want is a chance. If only WvW gave me something meaningful like Fractals or the Living story. It is your hate towards Pve that is putting us down and not giving us a chance.

This is the funniest suggestion I have heard in a long time….thanks for the laughs. He even said it with a straight face. Good work troll troll troll la la la.
Oh and can I 1 hit everything in an instance using my WvW gear to help balance the PvE field? Thanks in advance.

stormcrow.5412:

This is the funniest suggestion I have heard in a long time….thanks for the laughs. He even said it with a straight face. Good work troll troll troll la la la.
Oh and can I 1 hit everything in an instance using my WvW gear to help balance the PvE field? Thanks in advance.

This type of attitude is so typical of these forums. It’s an idea that YOU don’t like so therefore it must be a troll right? this is ridiculous, a forum is supposed to be a place where people can freely discuss ideas WITHOUT being ridiculed. If you have a better idea of how to tackle the problem, why don’t you post them? I’m really looking forward to hearing your brilliant ideas O enlightened one.

I think the Op has some great ideas! maybe the level five skill could give a legendary weapon if stomped!!
LMAO I think I have seen it all now, common guys troll obvious troll!!

Jrown.2049:

You WvW elitist disgust me. What makes you a better person than the Pve community. These downed state ideas are amazing. They would give the non-wvw community a chance in a fight. “hey, i am wvw veteran, i want to be able to do 500% more dmg to tequatl and be immune to poison, yeee” You really think that would help you with Tequatl. DO you even know who Tequatl is! All im saying is Pve isnt easy, it takes time and dedication. I’ve put in so much work, and all I want is a chance. If only WvW gave me something meaningful like Fractals or the Living story. It is your hate towards Pve that is putting us down and not giving us a chance.

You do realise that you bemoan wvw players putting down pve players in a post that you started by saying we disgust you, right?

You also kind of made cynz’s argument for him. You said you’ve put so much work into pve and just want an advantage in wvw. Well, the entire point of the post you quoted was that while you were in pve getting phat lootz, we were in wvw getting rubbish lootz, but honing our skillz. If the idea of a pve boost for wvw’ers is so abhorrent to you, then what makes you think a wvw boost for pve’ers is a good idea?

Omne.4603:

In light of the inaugural World versus World season, a troubling issue has come to my, and others’, attention. Namely, a large influx of players, who normally participate in non-WvW game activities and types, are struggling to enjoy the gameplay which many of us have had several months to learn and master. Perhaps the greatest issue which interferes with these players’ enjoyment of WvW is the current meta of high-player count “zergs” (also known as “blobs”) which dominate combat. With this in mind, many players who are not prepared for the state of gameplay find themselves in the downed state quite frequently, without much of a chance to rejoin the large-scale battle that is WvW.
Quite frankly, if something is not done to help these players, the state of WvW will be placed in jeopardy – the developers cannot neglect these players if they expect long-term growth and stability.

Now, with this problem outlined, I now bring a potential solution to discussion: Downed State Mastery

The intention of this WvW Ability Mastery Tree is to balance the current disparity present in WvW for newcomers, both PvE veterans and under-leveled players alike. In other words, this line of abilities seeks to strengthen these players’ chances to stay in the fight!

Below are my preliminary ability suggestions:

Level 1: Gain 300% more hp while downed.
Level 2: All down state skill cooldowns are reduced by 70%.
Level 3: You transfer 1 condition to your attackers once per second.
Level 4: Once downed you will be rendered invulnerable for 2 seconds.
Level 5: Instant rally once downed on a 180 second cooldown. Once rallied you will recieve: protection, regeneration, retaliation and swiftness.

What you are suggesting is this: make PvE players stronger than WvW players so that they don’t die because they are total morons? No thanks.
The winner should be the skilled, not the one with the most buffs. Go home PvE’r.

Omne.4603:

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

Dude how can you be serious about that? Why should a PvE player get an edge in stats on a regular WvW player. If they want to get better at WvW, they should train on it, like we did.

Sirendor.1394:

Omne.4603:

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

Dude how can you be serious about that? Why should a PvE player get an edge in stats on a regular WvW player. If they want to get better at WvW, they should train on it, like we did.

Typical elitist attitude. I guess you’ve never been new at anything and just been amazing all the time. Why don’t you actually suggest something as opposed to coming in here and flaming?

skgstan.9687:

Sirendor.1394:

Omne.4603:

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

Dude how can you be serious about that? Why should a PvE player get an edge in stats on a regular WvW player. If they want to get better at WvW, they should train on it, like we did.

Typical elitist attitude. I guess you’ve never been new at anything and just been amazing all the time. Why don’t you actually suggest something as opposed to coming in here and flaming?

I’m not flaming. The suggestion is just horrible. I’ve trained on WvW for months to master it and I’m still not at top level, why should anyone skip that?

Omne.4603:

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

I have a suggestion. For new players to learn like the rest of us did. Charging out into the battlefield, going down, falling off the wrong cliffs, dying all over the place, finding builds on the forums, discussing “MOAR PVT” on the channels, and generally getting out kitten together through learned experience. We’re stronger players for it today.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Omne.4603:

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

I have a suggestion. For new players to learn like the rest of us did. Charging out into the battlefield, going down, falling off the wrong cliffs, dying all over the place, finding builds on the forums, discussing “MOAR PVT” on the channels, and generally getting out kitten together through learned experience. We’re stronger players for it today.

Exactly! You can only learn from experience that you shouldn’t do some things. Let them learn. The process shouldn’t even be boring, it was quite entertaining for me.

Cameron.6450:

Jrown.2049:

You WvW elitist disgust me. What makes you a better person than the Pve community. These downed state ideas are amazing. They would give the non-wvw community a chance in a fight. “hey, i am wvw veteran, i want to be able to do 500% more dmg to tequatl and be immune to poison, yeee” You really think that would help you with Tequatl. DO you even know who Tequatl is! All im saying is Pve isnt easy, it takes time and dedication. I’ve put in so much work, and all I want is a chance. If only WvW gave me something meaningful like Fractals or the Living story. It is your hate towards Pve that is putting us down and not giving us a chance.

You do realise that you bemoan wvw players putting down pve players in a post that you started by saying we disgust you, right?

You also kind of made cynz’s argument for him. You said you’ve put so much work into pve and just want an advantage in wvw. Well, the entire point of the post you quoted was that while you were in pve getting phat lootz, we were in wvw getting rubbish lootz, but honing our skillz. If the idea of a pve boost for wvw’ers is so abhorrent to you, then what makes you think a wvw boost for pve’ers is a good idea?

I do not think you understand how hard it is to be a Pve player in WvW. The challenges we face every day to just fit in, to branch out of our community. I am not saying you should not buff WvW players in Pve I understand and can see how hard that must be to meet the standards, but instead of mocking this amazing idea, why not embrace it and possible implement a downed state buff for PvE also.

The attitude that you guys have to new players really is despicable. Learn by falling off cliffs? Again why don’t present some of your own actually ideas instead of just putting others down with sniping comments?

skgstan.9687:

The attitude that you guys have to new players really is despicable. Learn by falling off cliffs? Again why don’t present some of your own actually ideas instead of just putting others down with sniping comments?

There is no easy solution. You don’t get victory without a price. And the price is effort and dedication from the player’s side. If you don’t want to go through that, you aren’t worth coming into WvW and better stay out altogether.

Sirendor.1394:

skgstan.9687:

The attitude that you guys have to new players really is despicable. Learn by falling off cliffs? Again why don’t present some of your own actually ideas instead of just putting others down with sniping comments?

There is no easy solution. You don’t get victory without a price. And the price is effort and dedication from the player’s side. If you don’t want to go through that, you aren’t worth coming into WvW and better stay out altogether.

See post above. Thanks.

these suggestions are terrible,

tell you what, when you run arah or fractals for the first few times in pve you gonna get your kitten kicked hard and shoutet at from your party for beeing a noob,
only once you got some experience it will become manageable and finally “easy”.

In comparison when you join wvw for the first time you maybee get your kitten kicked (not if your running with the bigger zerg), and you usually dont get shoutet at for playing poorly .

once you got the experience where to position and tweaked your build + equip it becomes easier.

Why would you want to take away the learning curve from new players and give them some kind of idiot buttons?
When i am joining something new i expect to be bad at it and try to improve.

the people who are not willing to invest energy into improving their play are simply in the wrong place in wvw (as well as in any one of the harder dungeons / instances) and should stay with doing the other stuff anet provides (living world, world exploration, easy dungeons, events, jumping puzzles whatever).

Its the same everywhere, I also expect my pug in COF to learn the basic dungeon mechanics and not die on every mob 2 times.

I dont have any “attitude” toward new players and am happy to explain wvw to any one who asks and am happy for any new joines who wants to play it, but i dont want to cater the game towards some zerker who expects to rampage through wvw the same as in pve and crys for buffs once he gets outplayed.

skgstan.9687:

Sirendor.1394:

Omne.4603:

I’m quite serious, about what i’ve posted. If others have suggestions they feel that are better i’d like to hear their ideas also.

Dude how can you be serious about that? Why should a PvE player get an edge in stats on a regular WvW player. If they want to get better at WvW, they should train on it, like we did.

Typical elitist attitude. I guess you’ve never been new at anything and just been amazing all the time. Why don’t you actually suggest something as opposed to coming in here and flaming?

There is nothing to suggest use a build for WvW there are loads on every class forum! Buy the gear and off you go to learn your craft unlike PvE if you do X, Y won’t always happen you need to learn to adapt quickly, it’s very rare you encounter a fair fight as 95% of the time there will always be more or less of you than the opponent. Watch you tube videos to learn tactics, use you server Team Speak, what you are asking for is just ridiculous all of us WvW’ers have spent a long time with a spike in us and running back from our spawn when learning (and still do now) it’s part of the game, accept it and move on.

Oh and by the way can us WvW’ers get a buff of 1000 agony resistance so we can do Fractals easier as you know we don’t want to have to grind for it!!

Tankvieh.5796:

these suggestions are terrible,

tell you what, when you run arah or fractals for the first few times in pve you gonna get your kitten kicked hard and shoutet at from your party for beeing a noob,
only once you got some experience it will become manageable and finally “easy”.

In comparison when you join wvw for the first time you maybee get your kitten kicked (not if your running with the bigger zerg), and you usually dont get shoutet at for playing poorly .

once you got the experience where to position and tweaked your build + equip it becomes easier.

Why would you want to take away the learning curve from new players and give them some kind of idiot buttons?
When i am joining something new i expect to be bad at it and try to improve.

the people who are not willing to invest energy into improving their play are simply in the wrong place in wvw (as well as in any one of the harder dungeons / instances) and should stay with doing the other stuff anet provides (living world, world exploration, easy dungeons, events, jumping puzzles whatever).

Its the same everywhere, I also expect my pug in COF to learn the basic dungeon mechanics and not die on every mob 2 times.

I dont have any “attitude” toward new players and am happy to explain wvw to any one who asks and am happy for any new joines who wants to play it, but i dont want to cater the game towards some zerker who expects to rampage through wvw the same as in pve and crys for buffs once he gets outplayed.

That’s what I’ve been trying to state here, but the guy who’s replying just doesn’t listen to reason.

You say I don’t listen to reason, but none of the nay sayers in this thread have actually explained the process by which they arrive at there conclusion. Simply yelling troll or telling people to get better is not an arguement. Make a valid point or concede that many valid points have been made by the OP. Know when yo admit your wrong, do not let your ego best you just because you think you know more than others.

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

skgstan.9687:

You say I don’t listen to reason, but none of the nay sayers in this thread have actually explained the process by which they arrive at there conclusion. Simply yelling troll or telling people to get better is not an arguement. Make a valid point or concede that many valid points have been made by the OP. Know when yo admit your wrong, do not let your ego best you just because you think you know more than others.

Getting better IS an argument. The OP is wrong, there’s no free ticket to winning in WvW. Most PvE people have the advantage that they have more money than WvW players aswell, so I don’t see the need for any boost on their part.

skgstan.9687:

You say I don’t listen to reason, but none of the nay sayers in this thread have actually explained the process by which they arrive at there conclusion. Simply yelling troll or telling people to get better is not an arguement. Make a valid point or concede that many valid points have been made by the OP. Know when yo admit your wrong, do not let your ego best you just because you think you know more than others.

I was giving you the benefit of a doubt before, but now i think your are really just trolling,

the process how we arrive at the conclusion is called Logical thinking, we make our arguments and i belive they are better than the OPs.

Lets list the problems the OP sees:

- people are just now joining wvw and struggeling keeping up with players who have been playing the content for several months

now my question is, how are these players different from the ones who start out new in wvw every day? actually its easier now for new joines as the opponent servers also have much more "new players with them, so the chances to confron only veteran players are much slimmer currently

- the players get downed quickly and cant participate in fights any longer

well after getting killed several times fast and seeing alot of other characters running around just fine i would guess its me after all who is not up for the challenge and ask/read/watch what wvw veterans have to say, maybee switch out that zerker gear for PVT, maybee get some defensive utility spells, maybee dont stand in the way of a 30 man zerg while yours is moving to the side.
Giving them a survivability boost would just make it so they survive 4 seconds longer while playing badly, while on the other hand resulting in them never beeing able to kill anyone, as their opponents will get the buff as well.

i really dont understand what is the problem with telling someone to get better, this is done everywhere in life as well as in this game,
do you ask for some additional players on the field or a smaller goal because your team is getting defeated every week in soccer?
or do you try to improve your stamina (equip) or teamplay (tactics) or position in order to win?
its unfair for new soccer players as well when they have to play against people with more experience and better stamina,
so what, do you want to put weights on better players so the new player has it easier?

wtf seriously i just dont get your point and think the whole discussion is ridicoulous

skgstan.9687:

The attitude that you guys have to new players really is despicable. Learn by falling off cliffs? Again why don’t present some of your own actually ideas instead of just putting others down with sniping comments?

We won’t get anywhere if you will dismiss anything that involves challenge an dedication. The guys are telling you how they’ve become veterans. And they enjoyed the process. That’s what this game mode is all about.

I understand that you may be into WvW just for AP and probably will be gone for good as soon as you finish your achievements. And that’s fine. But if you want to “have a chance” in tough fights, the only way is to dedicate time to get better at it.

Otherwise just don’t get into tough fights and tricky positions. There’s a lot to do on WvW that does not involve your PvP skill that much, so learning curve is totally in your control.

Tankvieh.5796:

Giving them a survivability boost would just make it so they survive 4 seconds longer while playing badly, while on the other hand resulting in them never beeing able to kill anyone, as their opponents will get the buff as well.

^^ This.

You guys talking to skgstan are talking to a brick wall. It’s painful to see.

Came to the thread hoping to see some good suggestions about balancing server populations… leaving thread thinking ‘wtf’.
Don’t come into a gamemode unprepared, unskilled, and not properly geared and not expect to get destroyed.
Nobody needs to be carebeared. The amount of people I’ve seen go down this week under single arrow cart fire is funny. That should be a sign to do something different, if those people don’t take it upon themselves to improve and learn, they deserve to get killed over and over and over.

Yaro.3251:

skgstan.9687:

The attitude that you guys have to new players really is despicable. Learn by falling off cliffs? Again why don’t present some of your own actually ideas instead of just putting others down with sniping comments?

We won’t get anywhere if you will dismiss anything that involves challenge an dedication. The guys are telling you how they’ve become veterans. And they enjoyed the process. That’s what this game mode is all about.

I understand that you may be into WvW just for AP and probably will be gone for good as soon as you finish your achievements. And that’s fine. But if you want to “have a chance” in tough fights, the only way is to dedicate time to get better at it.

Otherwise just don’t get into tough fights and tricky positions. There’s a lot to do on WvW that does not involve your PvP skill that much, so learning curve is totally in your control.

Tankvieh.5796:

Giving them a survivability boost would just make it so they survive 4 seconds longer while playing badly, while on the other hand resulting in them never beeing able to kill anyone, as their opponents will get the buff as well.

^^ This.

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying. Your post is way out of context man. Like please chill out with the forum warrioring and actually try to contribute to the thread please.

Omne.4603:

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying.

I’m not sure which assumptions do you mean. Care to elaborate?

Omne.4603:

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

It would help if you’d explain what is subjective and why exactly you are dismissing comments coming from WvWers and calling them not serious.

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying.

I’m not sure which assumptions do you mean. Care to elaborate?

Omne.4603:

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

It would help if you’d explain what is subjective and why exactly you are dismissing comments coming from WvWers and calling them not serious.

Why are you getting so defensive?

Omne.4603:

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying.

I’m not sure which assumptions do you mean. Care to elaborate?

Omne.4603:

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

It would help if you’d explain what is subjective and why exactly you are dismissing comments coming from WvWers and calling them not serious.

Why are you getting so defensive?

Pot meet kettle.

I don’t know, does it sound defensive? That wasn’t my intention. I’m just trying to have a rational conversation.

UnrepentantProcrastinator.7420:

Omne.4603:

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying.

I’m not sure which assumptions do you mean. Care to elaborate?

Omne.4603:

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

It would help if you’d explain what is subjective and why exactly you are dismissing comments coming from WvWers and calling them not serious.

Why are you getting so defensive?

Pot meet kettle.

Kettle [Nay-Say] definitely right.

UnrepentantProcrastinator.7420:

Omne.4603:

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying.

I’m not sure which assumptions do you mean. Care to elaborate?

Omne.4603:

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

It would help if you’d explain what is subjective and why exactly you are dismissing comments coming from WvWers and calling them not serious.

Why are you getting so defensive?

Pot meet kettle.

How has OP been defensive? He’s just asking for a coherent, reasonable, objective argument against his post. I think he’s entitled to it.

gladiator.5367:

UnrepentantProcrastinator.7420:

Omne.4603:

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying.

I’m not sure which assumptions do you mean. Care to elaborate?

Omne.4603:

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

It would help if you’d explain what is subjective and why exactly you are dismissing comments coming from WvWers and calling them not serious.

Why are you getting so defensive?

Pot meet kettle.

How has OP been defensive? He’s just asking for a coherent, reasonable, objective argument against his post. I think he’s entitled to it.

… the OP said “Why are you getting so defensive?” because he doesn’t have any arguments anymore. Open your eyes.

Omne.4603:

Yaro.3251:

Omne.4603:

I get what your saying about the process to becoming a veteran in WvW, but you can’t make those kinds of assumptions about what he’s saying.

I’m not sure which assumptions do you mean. Care to elaborate?

Omne.4603:

The responses seem typical so far, i’m wrong because of insert some subjective reasoning here. All the while no one seems to have a serious response, criticism or suggestion to my initial post. Pretty disappointing, but I guess this is to be expected.

It would help if you’d explain what is subjective and why exactly you are dismissing comments coming from WvWers and calling them not serious.

Why are you getting so defensive?

how about you answer his question, i would really like to see a rational reasoning on why our arguments are “silly”
He is not getting devensive he is just asking you to explain your reasoning, which is something you are expecting of everyone else, but so far do no provide yourself.