Guild Wars 2

Umm… what? While it’s true that high ranks get bonus pips, there are other ways to receive bonus pips that don’t include rank.

I could be playing on a high ranked account to get +3 pips and get +1 for server placement during the tick for a total of +4 pips. A complete WvW noob could walk in and get +5 just for being outmanned, or more if he’s on a server that typically places higher with scores. It’s entirely possible that a noob can earn more just because of time/map/server.

As for the commander bonus, I’d like to see a PvEr tag up and flip a T3 garrison. You know, because we all do the same amount of work.

Get out of here with that nonsense. Lol

Dhemize.8649:

As for the commander bonus, I’d like to see a PvEr tag up and flip a T3 garrison. You know, because we all do the same amount of work.

Get out of here with that nonsense. Lol

/thread

LOL

Actually, i find the current implementation really good. The main reasons are :

• It puts a Long term goal to those players, that truly want to invest time to WvW.

• It puts a barrier on players who come only for the rewards in WvW. Once they get their rewards they disappear again.

• It actually rewards veterans who had invested time to WvW. Players who stayed loyal to WvW, even though the mode was neglected a bit in the past.

Peace

Jaysian.8135:

Turk.5460:

Spoichiche.1290:

Turk.5460:

Parallel to your logic, veteran WvW players should have been given a LARGE amount of claim tickets from the start of this new WvW update. For free, obviously, since the same rewards weren’t given throughout the few years prior.

This wouldn’t be much different than how it is now ….would it?

You really don’t understand the complaints do you?

If when the update dropped every player got x number of skirmish tickets based on their rank, and for every rank gained from this point on, every player would get x amount of ticket, there would be no issue. Because players would be progressing at the same speed.

The problem the current system has and why people are calling it unfair, is because wvw rank affect the rate at which you earn rewards. It’s exponential instead of linear, meaning that not only new players will never catch up with the vets, but the vets will continuously increase their lead until both the new player and the vet get to rank 10000.
And when i’m talking about the reward, i’m not just talking about the skirmish tickets, but all the reward linked to pip aquisition (including the repeatable chest).

Now you’re free to think wether that’s fair of not, but please, at least try to understand what the issue is.

I completely understand the complaints. I’m merely stating that if it happened differently, and X group of players started off with more currency than Y group of players, then Y group of players would still complain to the same extent that is happening right here in this thread.

Nope i would not complain about that, just like i know people who participated in previous spvp seasons are gonna have more pvp tickets and ascended shard of glory than me who just started this season. Because I know everytime time i win a match every hour i spend, our reward progress are still gonna be very similar even compare to people who play spvp since the game came out. But it discouraging when someone who run next to you in wvw doing the exact samething, get 5-6 times faster reward progress.

??

If my theoretical alternative was in place, the vets would already have the rewards they are currently getting “5-6 times faster” right now. They would have gotten what you’re apparently “competing” to get on day 1 of the update.

So if your complaint is that they’re getting towards the rewards faster, logically, you would be more upset by my devil’s advocate system.

Fifth.8169:

A persons WVW rank should not be used for pip acquisition. The rewarding of pips should be fair and equally rewarding to all participants.

+1 Bronze WvW Rank (150-619)
+2 Silver WvW Rank (620-1394)
+3 Gold WvW Rank (1395-2544)
+4 Platinum WvW Rank (2545-4094)
+5 Mithril WvW Rank (4095-6444)
+6 Diamond WvW Rank (6445-9999)
+7 Max WvW Rank (10000)

This is extremely wrong and the most unfair component in the reward system in all of GW2. If this is the case I should be recieving more pips in pvp based on my rank and more gold and rares in pve based on my AP. Extremely discriminating this is . Please make it an avg amount of pips given to all players all remove this entirely. It is immoral and discriminates against new players. Whoever did this needs to give me an explanation. A very good one of why your choosing to discriminate other players.

For my self benefit, I do support the idea of getting more golds and rares in pve because of my ap. Wait, we already do, AP milestone do give you perma golds % gain. We also get luck from ap but luck is accessible to all so I guess it isn’t a strong point but it is still free luck.

On serious note, yes, they can make pip gain same for everyone but most importantly, I do hope they also make ticket max cap comparable to fotm’s while at it.

Turk.5460:

Jaysian.8135:

Turk.5460:

Spoichiche.1290:

Turk.5460:

Parallel to your logic, veteran WvW players should have been given a LARGE amount of claim tickets from the start of this new WvW update. For free, obviously, since the same rewards weren’t given throughout the few years prior.

This wouldn’t be much different than how it is now ….would it?

You really don’t understand the complaints do you?

If when the update dropped every player got x number of skirmish tickets based on their rank, and for every rank gained from this point on, every player would get x amount of ticket, there would be no issue. Because players would be progressing at the same speed.

The problem the current system has and why people are calling it unfair, is because wvw rank affect the rate at which you earn rewards. It’s exponential instead of linear, meaning that not only new players will never catch up with the vets, but the vets will continuously increase their lead until both the new player and the vet get to rank 10000.
And when i’m talking about the reward, i’m not just talking about the skirmish tickets, but all the reward linked to pip aquisition (including the repeatable chest).

Now you’re free to think wether that’s fair of not, but please, at least try to understand what the issue is.

I completely understand the complaints. I’m merely stating that if it happened differently, and X group of players started off with more currency than Y group of players, then Y group of players would still complain to the same extent that is happening right here in this thread.

Nope i would not complain about that, just like i know people who participated in previous spvp seasons are gonna have more pvp tickets and ascended shard of glory than me who just started this season. Because I know everytime time i win a match every hour i spend, our reward progress are still gonna be very similar even compare to people who play spvp since the game came out. But it discouraging when someone who run next to you in wvw doing the exact samething, get 5-6 times faster reward progress.

??

If my theoretical alternative was in place, the vets would already have the rewards they are currently getting “5-6 times faster” right now. They would have gotten what you’re apparently “competing” to get on day 1 of the update.

So if your complaint is that they’re getting towards the rewards faster, logically, you would be more upset by my devil’s advocate system.

You don’t get it do you? This is not about “making up” to the old vet wvw players, this is about making wvw reward system better in general. The fact is, no one care. No one care that you feel neglected, no one give a crab about how you didn’t get enough reward is the pass few years. You could of stop, you could of quit, you could of delete the game. No one point a gun at your head force you to play. No one care that some stranger feel that he didn’t get enough reward for playing a video game. As for us who think the pip is unfair, we are here to voice our opinion, and we think the current pip system is unfair. If anet agree with us then they will change it, if they don’t then nothing will change. Don’t come here to give us your sad story of being neglected. New wvw player don’t owe you anything, Anet don’t owe you anything, you are not entitled to anything for willingly playing a video game.

@Bloodyjoker –
In your own words “Anet don’t owe you anything, you are not entitled to anything for willingly playing a video game.”

ANeT is doing the smart thing and actually recognizing that long time high ranking players have kept the WvW game mode alive. Without it we wouldn’t be talking about pips. The problem here is that players, seemingly like you and others who want everything “equal”, think ANeT actually owes you something.

With the new pip system ANeT is trying to encourage more play in WvW obviously. I’m sure they could up the basic reward – server match up position in a skirmish 1st, 2nd, 3rd. But giving everyone the same pip count makes no sense. WvW rank actually means something now, beyond having cata mastery and such. Once we reached the completion of all the masteries in WvW we got nothing but titles for the enemy to snipe. Now we actually get rewards befitting our time and effort we put into the game. Play long enough and you’ll get there too.

Heibi.4251:

@Bloodyjoker –
In your own words “Anet don’t owe you anything, you are not entitled to anything for willingly playing a video game.”

ANeT is doing the smart thing and actually recognizing that long time high ranking players have kept the WvW game mode alive. Without it we wouldn’t be talking about pips. The problem here is that players, seemingly like you and others who want everything “equal”, think ANeT actually owes you something.

With the new pip system ANeT is trying to encourage more play in WvW obviously. I’m sure they could up the basic reward – server match up position in a skirmish 1st, 2nd, 3rd. But giving everyone the same pip count makes no sense. WvW rank actually means something now, beyond having cata mastery and such. Once we reached the completion of all the masteries in WvW we got nothing but titles for the enemy to snipe. Now we actually get rewards befitting our time and effort we put into the game. Play long enough and you’ll get there too.

First thing of all, I don’t think anet owe me something, i just think the way pips are scale base on rank are way too high… a new player need to play 40+ hours in a week while someone in high rank only need 20 hours. thats 20 hours different per week… so people like me have to spend extra 20 hours more every weeks for just to get the same reward. now i dont know and i dont care what happen few years ago cause it got nothing to me as i dont even play this game, but when i bring this current issue of “unfair effort compare to reward” up to anet, these so call “vets” came out of no where and start dropping their tears on me and start to tell me how they were “neglected,” so I as a new player should just suck it up and being put in the dirt. I just started playing this game and the only mode i have played is wvw, so im not one of those you called pve or pvp er, so plz don’t slap those on me also. My experience so far is I am doing everything these high rank player are doing, caping camps, towers, killing enemies, and i dont see them doing anymore than i am, but i have to spend 3-4 times the hours than them. The reward gap between new and old players is ridiculous, to put it in your word, i feel “neglected” as a new player to game, I am putting the same effort as other while they progress way more reward. And I am not making this complain to “vets” wvw players of this game, I am complaining this to Anet as a new costumer to their company, but somehow you guys drop out of sky and demand that i shouldn’t voice my opinion, that i should keep quiet. The reason I bought this game was my friend telling me the community is nice, but holy Jesus, if i have known this. If anet decide not to change im am not gonna cry, im not gonna stick to wvw and keep being “neglected” for years like some of you have, i will just try other game mode, if i still find nothing, just like i said to you, no one is pointing a gun at my head, i will just move on. No hard feeling, just feeling the current wvw is not worth my time and are just expressing my concern to anet.

Bloodyjoker.4327:

As for us who think the pip is unfair, we are here to voice our opinion

Exactly! Those of us who thought it was unfair that you could go play PvE and gain Power of the Mists bonuses without needing to step a foot into WvW are here to voice our opinions! VIVA! Why should we care that some stranger is here only now to complain about WvW rewards after 4 years? You are not owed anything.

Bloodyjoker.4327:

My experience so far is I am doing everything these high rank player are doing, caping camps, towers, killing enemies, and i dont see them doing anymore than i am

Sorry, but you are not doing more dmg to walls and gates and guards and keep lords, you can’t give protection from arrow cart fire with a shield gen, you’re not applying structural vulnerability to gates, you’re not carrying larger amounts of supply, you can’t use the bubble on catas to prevent getting hit from trebs and mortars and other catas, you aren’t draining supply with the poison cow on trebs, etc.; all the things that contribute to faster performance of WvW activities. The list goes on. You don’t have the masteries if you are lower rank so you aren’t doing the same. Moreover, you don’t have the experience to take a T3 defended keep nor experience in reading “map politics” in order to maximize your kills/WXP gain. You are not doing the same as vets.

Chaba.5410:

Bloodyjoker.4327:

My experience so far is I am doing everything these high rank player are doing, caping camps, towers, killing enemies, and i dont see them doing anymore than i am

Sorry, but you are not doing more dmg to walls and gates and guards and keep lords, you can’t give protection from arrow cart fire with a shield gen, you’re not applying structural vulnerability to gates, you’re not carrying larger amounts of supply, you can’t use the bubble on catas to prevent getting hit from trebs and mortars and other catas, you aren’t draining supply with the poison cow on trebs, etc. The list goes on. You don’t have the masteries so you aren’t doing the same. Moreover, you don’t have the experience to take a T3 defended keep nor experience in reading “map politics” in order to maximize your kills/WXP gain. You are not doing the same as vets.

A try hard pve commander was kicking everyone from squad last night apart from guards revs eles and necros. Even warriors were kicked, and refused to defend any structure that was being attack, he nearly ignored t3 bay until half of his squad went there anyway.

Theres inexperienced people sure know what they are doing and doing as much as vets.

I find that the pip system is a bit unfair but not to new players but those who actually have to work/kids/life out side of the virtual world.
I say keep the rank system and rewards as they are but give the players an opportunity to earn more pips through each maps in general.
-Maybe give 5 for the team holding down SMC (Maybe have it as a tier 3 upgraded)
- 1 for each of the mercenary camps.
-+ 1 for each Garrison (Tier 3 upgraded)
-+ 1 for each bloodlust

Just a thought is all.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Chaba.5410:

Bloodyjoker.4327:

My experience so far is I am doing everything these high rank player are doing, caping camps, towers, killing enemies, and i dont see them doing anymore than i am

Sorry, but you are not doing more dmg to walls and gates and guards and keep lords, you can’t give protection from arrow cart fire with a shield gen, you’re not applying structural vulnerability to gates, you’re not carrying larger amounts of supply, you can’t use the bubble on catas to prevent getting hit from trebs and mortars and other catas, you aren’t draining supply with the poison cow on trebs, etc. The list goes on. You don’t have the masteries so you aren’t doing the same. Moreover, you don’t have the experience to take a T3 defended keep nor experience in reading “map politics” in order to maximize your kills/WXP gain. You are not doing the same as vets.

A try hard pve commander was kicking everyone from squad last night apart from guards revs eles and necros. Even warriors were kicked, and refused to defend any structure that was being attack, he nearly ignored t3 bay until half of his squad went there anyway.

Theres inexperienced people sure know what they are doing and doing as much as vets.

Well it sounds like at least he’s trying to learn meta. “Map Politics” is not an easy thing to learn and even in sPvP with only three capture points there’s minimal information (lots of videos and blogs on it where it is called “rotations” and still is a source of confusion). WvW has more capture points which increases the complexity. IMHO commanders learning map rotations takes quite awhile and is completely dependent upon what their overarching goal in WvW is. Most pugs, especially those who are vets, won’t follow a tag that doesn’t go towards where fights are.

Chaba.5410:

Bloodyjoker.4327:

As for us who think the pip is unfair, we are here to voice our opinion

Exactly! Those of us who thought it was unfair that you could go play PvE and gain Power of the Mists bonuses without needing to step a foot into WvW are here to voice our opinions! VIVA! Why should we care that some stranger is here only now to complain about WvW rewards after 4 years? You are not owed anything.

The last I check I payed for a game call guild war 2, not pve or wvw. So I payed my money for all aspect of the game, So i am going to step my foot in WvW. And i dont care if you care or not cause you really cant do anything about this situation. I just want anet to hear my opinions and im sure they care cause i bring them in more money. O lastly, I do owed something, i owe the game, which give me access the wvw, and you cant do anything about it

Chaba.5410:

Bloodyjoker.4327:

My experience so far is I am doing everything these high rank player are doing, caping camps, towers, killing enemies, and i dont see them doing anymore than i am

Sorry, but you are not doing more dmg to walls and gates and guards and keep lords, you can’t give protection from arrow cart fire with a shield gen, you’re not applying structural vulnerability to gates, you’re not carrying larger amounts of supply, you can’t use the bubble on catas to prevent getting hit from trebs and mortars and other catas, you aren’t draining supply with the poison cow on trebs, etc.; all the things that contribute to faster performance of WvW activities. The list goes on. You don’t have the masteries if you are lower rank so you aren’t doing the same. Moreover, you don’t have the experience to take a T3 defended keep nor experience in reading “map politics” in order to maximize your kills/WXP gain. You are not doing the same as vets.

Then for every percent what you do more you should receive more. I really doubt you a diamond can carry 6 times more supply then a newbies. same goes for damage. And if you really want to use masteries as an excuse into this, then rank 1000 to rank 10000 should receive the same amount since masteries max out at rank 1000

PS: You know the funny thing is, there are time i find myself doing a lot more than most your so call “vets,” its when they stand on there feet afking farming those pips. So unless you can actually get the data from anet that 100% of the vets do more, dont just auto assume, assumption does not equal evidence. Use solid evidence to back your point. currently what you are trying to prove are clear as mud.

Uhg. Again. You guys just lump in and use static numbers to make up invalid arguments. The distribution of pips is NOT solely based off what rank you are. Pips are acquired through a combination of factors as I have previously pointed out and often fluctuate with everyone. The argument “we’ll never catch up to them” is an illusion based off the assumption that every vet qualifies for every bonus all of the time and that noobs don’t qualify for anything all of the time.

Different ways pips are currently distributed:

-Your world’s position during the skirmish (first, second, or third).
-Your WvW rank.
-Whether you’re commanding a squad with at least five people in it.
-Whether you’re fighting while outnumbered.
-If you’ve been playing on the same world for three weeks.

The ONLY one to argue is rank that gives maybe 1-3 extra pips, and even then it’s possible the vets you’re yelling at are only receiving +1 because they aren’t high enough. So again, using the various combinations of pip acquisition you could be earning more than a vet on another server regardless of how new you are.

Those small rank bonus pips are basically paying a professional to get the job done despite PvE build rally bots. And guess what? Those extra pips you’re getting from server position during a skirmish… are very likely because of vets putting in the effort to make your server competitive.

Bite the hand that feeds you.

i would say suck it up.
im rank 1200 so that only gives me 2 pips / tick.
but i really think that people should stop complaining that some people get more than they do.

the few people at 5k+ rank have played countless hours in wvw while having to go to pve just to get gold to play more wvw.
wvw players have been overlooked for so long. even tho it would be better for me if everyone got the same, ill still feel wvw players would have been cheated.

I cant even grasp the logic, that it would be “unfair” that people who have played a gamemode for 2k+ hours should get rewarded more, than people who played the mode for 1 hour.

@Bloodyjoker

Lol noone cares if you play wvw or not, people are just pointing out that why it is wrong to treat vets poorly.
it is fair that people that have played long have some form of benefit, like in pve, if you have played 5k+ hours then you have more gold than somone just starting playing today, thus you can buy alot of the stuff you need to craft new legendary weapons, while the new player who have not spend as much time playing, will have to play a while longer.

This is an MMO. Past achievements/efforts carry over. You’re a new player? Get grinding. Imagine buying GW2/HoT and complaining that vets in PvE have more gold, higher AP, and cool legendaries.

“NOT FAIR!!! I do the same work! I kill the same mobs! Why should that guy get more loot?!”

And by that^ I’m talking about veterans having higher magic find, +% gold from monsters, hellfire/radiant armor skins, zenith/pinnacle weapon skins. At the end of the day, legendaries and the T3 skins are in no way “better” than what you can craft/farm in open world. At the end of the day, they’re skins. There’s nothing “unfair” about it. You don’t kill mobs faster. Face it, you guys want to look like WvW’ers without doing WvW. Well, instead of spending all this time complaining, why don’t you get to WvW’ing and stop QQ’ing?

Very active players always had an advantage over more casual players or newbies. That is certainly nothing new. But it is also something ArenaNet has been trying to avoid as much as possible with their own game.
This makes WvW an interesting case as far as content in this game is concerned. It is as of now the only place where an important part of your rewards is mostly based on your performance and personal time investment.

This outcry seems to be another case of people getting upset over rewards which seem to be out of their reach. Something you will not be able to gain by simply grinding any content for a month or two.
Rewards should be unique rather than a handout. I am not even high rank to take advantage of the system. I still much rather see a few chosen players with that special gear rather than huge numbers who only did WvW long enough to get the rewards and to never touch the content again.

Pwnflakes.2498:

I find that the pip system is a bit unfair but not to new players but those who actually have to work/kids/life out side of the virtual world.
I say keep the rank system and rewards as they are but give the players an opportunity to earn more pips through each maps in general.
-Maybe give 5 for the team holding down SMC (Maybe have it as a tier 3 upgraded)
- 1 for each of the mercenary camps.
-+ 1 for each Garrison (Tier 3 upgraded)
-+ 1 for each bloodlust

Just a thought is all.

There is a big problem especially +5 for holding smc. This only works out for blobs and one sided matches and would even further compound bandwagon mentality.

Chaba.5410:

Bloodyjoker.4327:

My experience so far is I am doing everything these high rank player are doing, caping camps, towers, killing enemies, and i dont see them doing anymore than i am

Sorry, but you are not doing more dmg to walls and gates and guards and keep lords, you can’t give protection from arrow cart fire with a shield gen, you’re not applying structural vulnerability to gates, you’re not carrying larger amounts of supply, you can’t use the bubble on catas to prevent getting hit from trebs and mortars and other catas, you aren’t draining supply with the poison cow on trebs, etc.; all the things that contribute to faster performance of WvW activities. The list goes on. You don’t have the masteries if you are lower rank so you aren’t doing the same. Moreover, you don’t have the experience to take a T3 defended keep nor experience in reading “map politics” in order to maximize your kills/WXP gain. You are not doing the same as vets.

The idea that wvw rank is an acceptable measure of your performance in wvw is absolutely ridiculous.
In the topic of siege mastery, if you’re roaming solo or as a small havoc team, yes, having varied siege masteries maxed out and supply mastery will increase your performance. Outside of this specific context, it doesn’t do anything. A zerg ‘A’ of 25 rank 2000 will have the same performance (siege wise) than a zerg ‘B’ of 25 rank 150. Players in the zerg B just have to follow the obvious principle of letting the siege weapons to the ones having the mastery. And as far a supply goes, unless you’re running around only taking camps, you’ll very rarely hit the supply cap for the squad since the limiting factor is the supply generation at camps or towers.
Now, siege mastery is a thing, having decent gear is a thing, but what is really important in regard to your performance is your skill as a player : the decisions you make, your game knowledge and your mechanical skill. WvW is a massive hotjoin clown fiesta, every roaming video featuring 1vx is a proof of that. You don’t magically become more skilled by just playing wvw. To improve your performance, you have to deliberately practice, find sparring partners, read guides, analyse your own gameplay, learn from your and others mistakes, ect. It’s a process that requires a specific mindset. You’ll never be good at pvp just because you played a ton of pvp, you’re good because you actively tried to improve. But wxp doesn’t care about that. You can get a rank as high as you want by simply playing without ever actually improving.
That’s why spvp has a matchmaking based on skill rating and not on spvp rank.

WvW rank have absolutely no correlation with player performance and is not a somewhat valid indication of player skill.

I can understand why you think that pip aquisition is fair as it is, even though i don’t agree, but saying it’s fair because high ranked players do more is plain absurd.

Equality does not mean all get the same. That said I honestly feel newer players are so important to WvW that they should get Pips more easily than they do currently.

Good luck working out systems to do that so late into the game.

^ what about the + 5 supply capacity? That extra 5 from all them 25 people will give you an extra 125 supplys. That’s like 3 normal rams/catas, a treb or even a golem. Numbers always make a difference but if the numbers dl t have enough supply because they are new then they are not working the as vets.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

^ what about the + 5 supply capacity? That extra 5 from all them 25 people will give you an extra 125 supplys. That’s like 3 normal rams/catas, a treb or even a golem. Numbers always make a difference but if the numbers dl t have enough supply because they are new then they are not working the as vets.

I’ve kind of adressed this point. My logic is that at after a certain threshold of players in one zerg, (actually have no idea what that number would be) the supply generation at camps/towers becomes the limiting factor. You’re not gonna hit the maximum amount of supply your zerg can potentially carry, you’ll get to a camp/whatever to resupply and you’ll empty it before being fully resupplied. At least, that’s my experience as a zergling for the last 2 weeks.
If you’re in a small havoc/roaming team, supply mastery becomes a lot more valuable. In that case, i think the first 400-500 ranks do make a significant difference.

Bloodyjoker.4327:

Heibi.4251:

@Bloodyjoker –
In your own words “Anet don’t owe you anything, you are not entitled to anything for willingly playing a video game.”

ANeT is doing the smart thing and actually recognizing that long time high ranking players have kept the WvW game mode alive. Without it we wouldn’t be talking about pips. The problem here is that players, seemingly like you and others who want everything “equal”, think ANeT actually owes you something.

With the new pip system ANeT is trying to encourage more play in WvW obviously. I’m sure they could up the basic reward – server match up position in a skirmish 1st, 2nd, 3rd. But giving everyone the same pip count makes no sense. WvW rank actually means something now, beyond having cata mastery and such. Once we reached the completion of all the masteries in WvW we got nothing but titles for the enemy to snipe. Now we actually get rewards befitting our time and effort we put into the game. Play long enough and you’ll get there too.

First thing of all, I don’t think anet owe me something, i just think the way pips are scale base on rank are way too high… a new player need to play 40+ hours in a week while someone in high rank only need 20 hours. thats 20 hours different per week… so people like me have to spend extra 20 hours more every weeks for just to get the same reward. now i dont know and i dont care what happen few years ago cause it got nothing to me as i dont even play this game, but when i bring this current issue of “unfair effort compare to reward” up to anet, these so call “vets” came out of no where and start dropping their tears on me and start to tell me how they were “neglected,” so I as a new player should just suck it up and being put in the dirt. I just started playing this game and the only mode i have played is wvw, so im not one of those you called pve or pvp er, so plz don’t slap those on me also. My experience so far is I am doing everything these high rank player are doing, caping camps, towers, killing enemies, and i dont see them doing anymore than i am, but i have to spend 3-4 times the hours than them. The reward gap between new and old players is ridiculous, to put it in your word, i feel “neglected” as a new player to game, I am putting the same effort as other while they progress way more reward. And I am not making this complain to “vets” wvw players of this game, I am complaining this to Anet as a new costumer to their company, but somehow you guys drop out of sky and demand that i shouldn’t voice my opinion, that i should keep quiet. The reason I bought this game was my friend telling me the community is nice, but holy Jesus, if i have known this. If anet decide not to change im am not gonna cry, im not gonna stick to wvw and keep being “neglected” for years like some of you have, i will just try other game mode, if i still find nothing, just like i said to you, no one is pointing a gun at my head, i will just move on. No hard feeling, just feeling the current wvw is not worth my time and are just expressing my concern to anet.

Then why are you basing what you think is fair on what you get VS. what someone else gets? Shouldn’t your argument be more of “increase the base rate of progress” instead of “this person is way faster than me, slow them down so they can suffer with me.”

Do you like comedians?

“The only time you look in your neighbor’s bowl is to make sure that they have enough. You don’t look in your neighbor’s bowl to see if you have as much as them.” — Louis CK

tuvok.7806:

This is an MMO. Past achievements/efforts carry over. You’re a new player? Get grinding. Imagine buying GW2/HoT and complaining that vets in PvE have more gold, higher AP, and cool legendaries.

“NOT FAIR!!! I do the same work! I kill the same mobs! Why should that guy get more loot?!”

And by that^ I’m talking about veterans having higher magic find, +% gold from monsters, hellfire/radiant armor skins, zenith/pinnacle weapon skins. At the end of the day, legendaries and the T3 skins are in no way “better” than what you can craft/farm in open world. At the end of the day, they’re skins. There’s nothing “unfair” about it. You don’t kill mobs faster. Face it, you guys want to look like WvW’ers without doing WvW. Well, instead of spending all this time complaining, why don’t you get to WvW’ing and stop QQ’ing?

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.
WvW players allready have a advantage that the new players dont have, they can use the old WvW tickets from the past tournaments.
People have the right to complain when they see something wrong as this, we all bought this game, so i am just doing my right as a custumer…if you really believe that somone have to play for 40h+ during the week(a second job basically) while other person have to play for way less then 20h to complete the weekely rewards(Wooden to Diamond chest), then theres something really wrong with you.
You say that WvW veterans should be more awarded then new players….as a veteran myself (been playing since 2012) I honestly dont find that to be right or fair, reason is, no other game mode follow that same principle. But if Anet really wanna reward its true veterans and all the Edge of the Mist farmers, then to hell with it, they can do it…but dont do it in a way that gonna affect everyones rewards as well…i dont care if since day one of the patch “vets” would be running around with legend backpack or the new shiny armor, because Anet would think that those players deserve it for whatever reason. But what I do care is when Anet say that my play time is nowhere near as worth as other player.

The drop off in interest in wvw has already started, q’s are getting smaller and soon we can look forward to seeing an outmanned map again.

I’m not motivated by the new pip system. I’ve played wvw more than most, but due to the classes and roles I play/played, my rank is in the low 2000’s. I feel the new pip system punishes me for having been a scout and a healer, as my buddies who have played a similar amount of time in wvw as me now get 3 more pips a tick ( so 4 or 5 against 7 or, or almost 75% more. So in an average week they can play 20 hours less than me and complete the diamond track.

It’s not really very motivating.

The spread on pips means bandwagon servers get 3 for winning matchups, plus more pips per tick for being on a server that allowed them to tick wexp like it was going out of fashion (large 3 way battles or big blob clashes reward huge amounts of wexp). Those who had/have sparser pickings also get less reward from the pip system- hardly a huge motivator to play.

Yesterday I logged in and it took more than 30 minutes before I even started earning pips (after waiting in q for a few minutes) as i was busy helping the server by scouting and defending rather than running in an omniblob..

Don’t worry guys, all the moaning will soon move to the PVP section when the PVP changes drop with some new shinies!!!!

I think the update is great and I believe the vats do deserve the extra pips. This is coming from who is below rank 150 with no extra pips. I think the system is what the WvW needs, reward those who spend their time in WvW more than those who just want the shinies.

You should be doing WvW for fun not for the rewards…..I would love to have the legendary armor but I don’t find Raids fun, rather do overtime at work as it is like work dealing with people etc so therefore no legendary armor for me.

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Because you are relating AFKing and carrying to active participation. This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

WvW also carries new people, each person will still needs to work on their achievement etc to get the main rewards.

Its not about pips its about tickets pips are meaningless with out them. Say if they add in tickets that you say can get from daily in wvw maybe that would help. The thing is you cant make wvw better at getting the best gear then say pve as you can get a lot of pve rewards though wvw with the reward tracks. All top level trinkes ring earring neck even backs items are best gotten though the new LS season 3 reward tracks this has nothing to do with ranks. As for armor and wepons is where tickets come into play BUT you can still get rng drops and you need to have cap crafting to get this armor meaning your still getting most of it though pve where you could craft an armor set much simpler. If any thing tickets are more about skins then any thing else.

If you truly want the best gear in the game out side of just skins pve dose it faster and better and you can still do that pve in wvw. The pip system is more about wvw only skins and it should take a long time and ppl who put time into the game should have a step up from thoughts who did not put the time in.

Blodeuyn.2751:

It’s not discrimination. It is rewarding those who’ve played wvw for years. Why should new players, who might leave wvw altogether when they have their rewards, get the same amount of pips as those loyal to the game mode?

I welcome everyone new to wvw, and hope you find it fun, but you have to earn your ranks and rewards like the rest of us. Wvw has been neglected for ages, so it is past time for those of us playing this game mode to get something from it.

Please remember, someone else’s rank doesn’t take away from your fun and rewards. Stick with wvw and you’ll get there soon enough yourself!

I have to strongly disagree for one very specific reason that Anet hasn’t taken into account at all.

Rank does not always mean ‘time in WvW or EOTM’.

Nope.

Back in the day when WvW was younger and we still had tournaments, we had World Experience Potions [
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Keg_of_Liquid_World_Experience ]

From Drop to Thimble to Taste to Swig to Jug of Liquid Experience, people bought their way up the ranks and did a lot less WvW than many for their ranks.

So, I believe it is fair to say that the system just implemented isn’t fair at all.

And no I am not a new WvW’er or new player, but since I’ve been playing since pre-release, I can see where newer players and those just now being tempted to come into WvW would be and are upset.

And rightfully so.

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Because you are relating AFKing and carrying to active participation. This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Well I said that because you give me a extreme example, a new account wont even know what a hell is a fractal or a raid, godkitten man….and even if he choose to do it, yes he could get carried and would get the same rewards as everyone else…but lets go to other example then:
Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Because you are relating AFKing and carrying to active participation. This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

The clarity of spawn having anything to do or not to do with the score has still not been made by Anet.

And now we really need this clarified.

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Because you are relating AFKing and carrying to active participation. This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Well I said that because you give me a extreme example, a new account wont even know what a hell is a fractal or a raid, godkitten man….and even if he choose to do it, yes he could get carried and would get the same rewards as everyone else…but lets go to other example then:
Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?

Why should a experienced employee get paid more than a new inexperience employee on the same job role?

Jasonbdj.4021:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Because you are relating AFKing and carrying to active participation. This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Well I said that because you give me a extreme example, a new account wont even know what a hell is a fractal or a raid, godkitten man….and even if he choose to do it, yes he could get carried and would get the same rewards as everyone else…but lets go to other example then:
Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?

Why should a experienced employee get paid more than a new inexperience employee on the same job role?

This is GW2, a game not a job, so dont avoid the question…“Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?”

Spoichiche.1290:

WvW rank have absolutely no correlation with player performance and is not a somewhat valid indication of player skill.

I never said it correlated with player skill at “pvp”. It represents time and the acquisition of mastery skills that make WvW easier to play. It correlates with other account-based unlocks and bonuses. The argument that players are “doing the same thing” doesn’t exist because of this.

A new player can go play the “same” full meta in Verdant Brink without gliding unlocked yet. It isn’t easy and they are locked out of being able to finish certain achievements and other activities. Players who already have full masteries will find the meta easier to play. No one is posting how unfair this is to a new player because everyone understands that there is an equal access to progression for all accounts given enough time spent playing (recall that the base rate of progression had to be adjusted in HoT).

You are all basically complaining about the existence of an end-game progression system in WvW. There was a time when this game didn’t have ANY end-game progression. You hit rank 80 and that was it. It was boring and players wanted end-game progression.

WXP masteries were the first implementation of end-game progression before HoT added it to PvE. The only reason it goes up to Diamond is because Anet was trying to design for future expansion of masteries whereas in HoT they found it better to not add levels beyond what masteries were available. And just like in PvE where you hit max level of masteries or run out of mastery points causing additional XP gain to be “wasted”, WvW ranks beyond 1000 are also wasted and a source of complaints. In PvE you get a spirit shard if you are max rank. In WvW you got nothing until now in the form of extra pips. I’m fairly certain those few players who maxed out WXP rank got absolutely nothing from extra WXP gain unless they were still getting a rank-up chest.

Dhemize.8649:

Pips are acquired through a combination of factors as I have previously pointed out and often fluctuate with everyone. The argument “we’ll never catch up to them” is an illusion based off the assumption that every vet qualifies for every bonus all of the time and that noobs don’t qualify for anything all of the time.

It is easier to attack the concept of bonus pips for WXP rank than it is to attack the base pip concept of 1 pip for third place, 2 pips for second place, and 3 pips for first place.

The players on the first place team are doing the same activity as the third place team. Look how unfair it is that they get more pips for doing the same thing!

I dont mind it, easy to get diamond even on low ranks (180) but its a bit strange, the more you like and play wvw, the less you need to? Stupid.

Felipe.1807:

Jasonbdj.4021:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Because you are relating AFKing and carrying to active participation. This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Well I said that because you give me a extreme example, a new account wont even know what a hell is a fractal or a raid, godkitten man….and even if he choose to do it, yes he could get carried and would get the same rewards as everyone else…but lets go to other example then:
Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?

Why should a experienced employee get paid more than a new inexperience employee on the same job role?

This is GW2, a game not a job, so dont avoid the question…“Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?”

There are multiple options to choose from to obtain a logical answer here. They’re just not the answers that you specifically want to hear. Heres a few:

-ANET realizes that Vet’s were not rewarded for a very long time, and rewards them such with extra bonuses towards the new system.

-The system was maybe put in place this way under the assumption that it would compare reward currency from other game modes when new end-rewards were released, such as Raiders already stockpiling LI’s, or PvPers stockpiling shards.

-ANET realizes that angering players new to WvW might stop them from playing the mode, but the WvW vets will continue to play regardless. But if they anger WvW vets, the vets might leave, which in turn deletes the game mode.

Here’s my favorite:
-The reward system was intentionally designed for Veteran Players.

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Not really.

The veteran player who has put in 3000 hours of time and effort is getting more than a non veteran who has put in 10 hours. Perhaps the math I learned in gradeschool is out of date, but they used to teach that 3000 greater than 10.

If the vet and non vet work side by side getting to tier 3 participation on a given day, when the tick comes to earn pips the vet will have put in 3000 hours of 5ime and effort toward that tick while the non vet will have put in 10.

Once the non vet puts in the time and effort to match where the vet is now he will earn the same.

People calling the current system unfair are essentially asking that new players earn the same rewards with less time and effort investment than that put in by veterans.

Ashen.2907:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Not really.

The veteran player who has put in 3000 hours of time and effort is getting more than a non veteran who has put in 10 hours. Perhaps the math I learned in gradeschool is out of date, but they used to teach that 3000 greater than 10.

If the vet and non vet work side by side getting to tier 3 participation on a given day, when the tick comes to earn pips the vet will have put in 3000 hours of 5ime and effort toward that tick while the non vet will have put in 10.

Once the non vet puts in the time and effort to match where the vet is now he will earn the same.

People calling the current system unfair are essentially asking that new players earn the same rewards with less time and effort investment than that put in by veterans.

Yes, really – it is literally the sole reason the OP created this thread. Go read the original post, and while you’re at it please read the few posts leading up to the one that you replied to. I think the system is fair, you are agreeing with me that the system is fair, but your reply is not relevant to the post-grouping you are replying to…

Felipe.1807:

Jasonbdj.4021:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Turk.5460:

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.

Can a new player in rare gear jump right into lvl 100 fractal? A raid?
Please think about the whole picture before posting your incredibly ill-informed bias.

No on Fratals no cause agony, but on raids i am pretty sure that there are groups who made it using only green gear…but still, a group can carry a new player through a Fractal and even if he didnt do anything, in the end he will get the rewards as well. This is very common actually, people even sell spots on groups for players in exchange of gold.

Great, none of those scenarios are relevant to the current discussion here, thanks.

Why not? I said that other game modes(PvE and PvP) reward all players the same, no matter for how long they the game…you said its was false and i proved to you that it is actually true….how is this not relevant?

Because you are relating AFKing and carrying to active participation. This topic is about new and old players putting in the same time/effort.

Well I said that because you give me a extreme example, a new account wont even know what a hell is a fractal or a raid, godkitten man….and even if he choose to do it, yes he could get carried and would get the same rewards as everyone else…but lets go to other example then:
Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?

Why should a experienced employee get paid more than a new inexperience employee on the same job role?

This is GW2, a game not a job, so dont avoid the question…“Someone who plays Fractals since its release wont get more rewards then someone who started playing a year ago. A Dragon rank wont get more pips on PvP just because he played longer then a Dolyak rank. So I ask you, Why a Diamond rank should get more rewards then someone who is new or even someone who allready have all the WvW skills unlocked(Rank 1000)?”

I thought it was a good example but ok –

Fractals – Why should a level 100 get more reward than a level 1 if that person has the gear to complete level 100?

Skill Points – Why should a character who collected all skill points from map exploring unlock full elite spec sooner than a character who hasn’t?

PVP – At start people could unlock better skins with a higher rank but it all was changed a while ago. Rewards could change again when the updates arrive.

Legendary – Why should people who saved gold and collected mats create new legendary weapons sooner than someone who has none?

Raid – Why should people who has 999 LI can find a group easier then someone with only 2 LI?

WvW had a really poor reward system but still the loyal WvW people still continue to play WvW even though they have not been happy with the reward system. This system was needed since day 1 to reward loyal WvW players. Why should all loyal WvW players start back down at the bottom of the rewards scheme when they already put a lot of time into WvW? Loyal WvW should not have to invest double the time more than a new WvW player to gain a higher rewards when those people did not care/bothered about the WvW before. Now they have improved the WvW rewards with unique skins etc and now the new WvW players are moaning that the loyal players should start at the bottom like them.

Jasonbdj.4021:

PVP – At start people could unlock better skins with a higher rank but it all changed a while ago. Rewards could change again when the updates arrive.

Oh right I remember that before wardrobe! You got mystic forge crafting drops related to your PvP rank which could be used to get more skins. And you didn’t get any PvE levels before so all the top level PvP players only had like level 5 toons and couldn’t do high-level PvE content. Gem-store skins you had to choose whether it was for PvE or PvP. Hehe. I kind of miss being able to wear different skins between PvE and PvP.

How unfair it was that all those skins vet PvP players had stored were converted to the new wardrobe system.

Chaba.5410:

Jasonbdj.4021:

PVP – At start people could unlock better skins with a higher rank but it all changed a while ago. Rewards could change again when the updates arrive.

Oh right I remember that before wardrobe! You got mystic forge crafting drops related to your PvP rank which could be used to get more skins. And you didn’t get any PvE levels before so all the top level PvP players only had like level 5 toons and couldn’t do high-level PvE content. Gem-store skins you had to choose whether it was for PvE or PvP. Hehe. I kind of miss being able to wear different skins between PvE and PvP.

How unfair it was that all those skins vet PvP players had stored were converted to the new wardrobe system.

The only good unique skin I had converted is only the dwayna’s longbow that is around 400g now UNFAIR ANET I WANT THOSE SKINS TAKEN OFF THE OLD PVP VETS NOW! :P