Guild Wars 2

GW2 is the best at wvw in all mmo… but game developers think living story is what players want and that spvp will become a E-sport (lol)

Im warning the game developers if the wvw wont improve like in every big patch of pve boredoom a new wvw map to compensate… me and my friends wont buy any expantion…

You know, at least you can try to make a logical threat.

Like, ESO is going f2p and Cyrodiil is in direct competition of GW2 WvW. In many ways, its superior. What ultimately killed it was population issues and very poor handling by Zenimax (such as letting vampires run rampant, sigh). With ESO going f2p, it might just take people away from GW2.

Your boredom is only a threat when they know you wont come back because there is nothing quite like WvW. Right now… you know you’ll be back.

You do realize that making maps takes a long time right? The Devs have said as much. So churning out new maps on a regular basis for WvW as well as PvE just isn’t feasible. We also don’t know how long the PvE maps were in production before they went live. My guess would be months in advance.

And also it would seem that PvE IS what the players want. Just look at the WvW tournaments. While a few servers had long queues, many of them did not. Also during non tournaments, little to no servers have ANY map queues. Which leads players to believe that WvW is dying, as there isn’t enough of a WvW population to even begin to do anything. So if those players aren’t playing WvW, or PvP, then where are they? They either are not logging in, or playing PvE.

Of course buying, or not buying, the expansion is totally your choice, but I highly doubt that Anet really cares if a few people don’t buy it. It’s not going to cause them to go bankrupt or anything. Also you want new WvW maps, but don’t want to buy the expansion which contains a new WvW map? That doesn’t really make much sense….

I wouldn’t say every big patch, but it would be nice if we get some new stuff every 6 months. I’m not talking anything big, just little things to play around with and figure out how to implement into the gameplay. they are coming out with a new map, which I am very happy with. I mean 6 months later, maybe they give us reward tracks, or a way to get skill points through WvW. Than 6 months later maybe we get a few new types of siege. Than 6 months later, maybe something else.
I wouldn’t be opposed to stuff coming out at a faster rate, but 6 months seems like something reasonable, not that this really matters, just what I would personally like

kefro.9312:

GW2 is the best at wvw in all mmo…

No its not, Dawdler has it right about ESO. The ESO design is clearly superior.

morrolan.9608:

No its not, Dawdler has it right about ESO. The ESO design is clearly superior.

I plan on giving ESO another chance (I played it in beta) when the subscription fees end, but I thought the combat in Beta seemed a lot more static and boring than GW2. I have higher hopes for Camelot Unchained and dumped some money into funding that. GW2 WvW has some great elements and it could be better, but each time they announce a change, it just seems to move further away from what I really want, rather than closer. Maybe I’m just not the demographic they are trying to attract. Also looking forward to Black Desert, which seems to be heading to North America and Europe. But we’re probably talking about 2016 or later for those challenges to become real.

pdavis.8031:

You do realize that making maps takes a long time right? The Devs have said as much. So churning out new maps on a regular basis for WvW as well as PvE just isn’t feasible.

First of all WvW should really have come with 3 borderlands to begin with!

Second it takes 6 months to make a map. If they really had a WvW team working on WvW, we should have a minimum 3 extra maps by now! Fact is there was no WvW team meaning there was noone to make any new maps. This is again should to be the case as WvW barely got any updates since launch.

Copy and pasting maps and making tweaks are signs of someone trying to finish something quickly, so this again proves the game was released early.

So the game wasnt ready 2 years ago, it hasnt been ready over the past 2 years either; question is will it be ready with this “expansion”?

Pinkamena Diane Pie.8054:

So the game wasnt ready 2 years ago, it hasnt been ready over the past 2 years either; question is will it be ready with this “expansion”?

Funny, people say that about almost every game that is released ever.

pdavis.8031:

You do realize that making maps takes a long time right? The Devs have said as much.

yah this was a lie. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9LacRwbNxE

my ex girlfriend taught me how to do it you can create maps like this in a couple hours then a few hours of dropping your towers on a few more hours of placing your npc and then drop some foliage rocks what have you then a few days of running around the map looking for possible fall thru points whalla perfect map made using free to use programs. your point is invalid and their excuse is a lie.

Any questions?

Berk.8561:

I plan on giving ESO another chance (I played it in beta) when the subscription fees end, but I thought the combat in Beta seemed a lot more static and boring than GW2.

Boring indeed. I stand by what I said, in many ways its superior. The map itself and its ridiculous size, the siege mechanics etc… Everything just oozed WvW on a grand scale. But the way they designed it pretty much demanded a large and very active population which organised itself. When the numbers wherent there, it was impossible to get started, unlike GW2 where 5 people can easily cap a keep (and is in no danger whatsoever when taking a camp). In short, GW2 scales from about 1-50 players, ESO scale from 20-200 players. And that’s not good design. It ignore bugs and other small things too but lets not look at that lol. When it was max populated and everyone clashed around a castle… oh boy was it fun. When you where nearly alone and had to run for 30 minutes… uuuuugh.

Sometimes I wish ESO had just taken GW2 and made it… 100% bigger. Maybe 200%. Not 5000%.

Yep, ESO just made the maps too big so it took too long to get anywhere, otherwise it would have been awesome.

The highlights of my week used to be PW 80v80 matches but they usually didn’t last long and max was 3 hours once or twice a week.

Rangerdeity.5847:

pdavis.8031:

You do realize that making maps takes a long time right? The Devs have said as much.

yah this was a lie. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9LacRwbNxE

my ex girlfriend taught me how to do it you can create maps like this in a couple hours then a few hours of dropping your towers on a few more hours of placing your npc and then drop some foliage rocks what have you then a few days of running around the map looking for possible fall thru points whalla perfect map made using free to use programs. your point is invalid and their excuse is a lie.

Any questions?

Makin the map itself is quick, texturing custom parts, npc pathing, npc events, event zones, event triggering, mobile events (dolly), fort upgrade (massive texture swap, globally), not to mention siege placenent and exclusion. This stuff takes time, lots of it. Especially when events are local, and doubled up (2× attack + 1×defend)

GW2 WvW is actually very kittenty compared to open world/conquest based pvp modes in other MMOs.

On top of the one and only holy grail of open world pvp; Eve Online, even games like Aion have better system than GW2.

Prysin.8542:

Rangerdeity.5847:

pdavis.8031:

You do realize that making maps takes a long time right? The Devs have said as much.

yah this was a lie. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9LacRwbNxE

my ex girlfriend taught me how to do it you can create maps like this in a couple hours then a few hours of dropping your towers on a few more hours of placing your npc and then drop some foliage rocks what have you then a few days of running around the map looking for possible fall thru points whalla perfect map made using free to use programs. your point is invalid and their excuse is a lie.

Any questions?

Makin the map itself is quick, texturing custom parts, npc pathing, npc events, event zones, event triggering, mobile events (dolly), fort upgrade (massive texture swap, globally), not to mention siege placenent and exclusion. This stuff takes time, lots of it. Especially when events are local, and doubled up (2× attack + 1×defend)

Also making the map to support hundreds of players at any given time, seige equipment, special map mechanics, mobs, nodes, etc.

Sure while making the initial map may only take a few hours, you have to also count in all the other stuff that comes along with it, most of which remains unseen by many, but has a large impact on the map.

As far as lying? If you choose to believe that, thats quite alright. However, I see no reason for the devs to lie about anything. As an Anet respresentative (the devs, not me) their careers could very well be at stake if they are lying. It’s not in thier, or any businesses, best interest to lie. In fact lying to your customers is a terrible way to conduct business, and thats why it’s not widely practiced. And in fact there are US laws prohibiting businesses from lying to their customers. (False Advertising/fraud, obstruction, etc.)

morrolan.9608:

kefro.9312:

GW2 is the best at wvw in all mmo…

No its not, Dawdler has it right about ESO. The ESO design is clearly superior.

IF ESO does go F2P, I’ll most likely be one of those people that change games.
Very big fan of Elder Scrolls.

Wake up! We’re here!! We’ve reached MORROWIND!!!!! I’m sure they’ll let us go. Quiet here comes the guard!

You know games are good when you can easily recite stuff in the game. And someone talking to you about a game and you can visually picture it and play it in your head.

uberkingkong.8041:

morrolan.9608:

kefro.9312:

GW2 is the best at wvw in all mmo…

No its not, Dawdler has it right about ESO. The ESO design is clearly superior.

IF ESO does go F2P, I’ll most likely be one of those people that change games.
Very big fan of Elder Scrolls.

Wake up! We’re here!! We’ve reached MORROWIND!!!!! I’m sure they’ll let us go. Quiet here comes the guard!

You know games are good when you can easily recite stuff in the game. And someone talking to you about a game and you can visually picture it and play it in your head.

It has already been announced, ESO is going Buy to play, same model as GW2.

OP: I agree wvw is lacking updates, and the ideas such as falling/ jumping maps like EoTM will only anger people further rather than gain players. It has a lack of good battle maps, EBG is the only good wvw landscape they have currently. I have heard so many say they are leaving GW2 if WvW doesn’t get updates so I know you are not alone in this sentiment. WvW has been not only neglected but I think they fail to understand what wvw players actually want with the stuff they are implementing.
Players want to kill each other and want more ways and tools to do so. Players want to capture stuff and want more ways and tools to do so, and yea reward people for defending.

That is what the different types of WvW players want, and not to die from some lame falling death or by a giant worm instead of at the hands of another player or having to run around aimlessly not getting to do anything. More action and less time to get to it.. and keep the PvE in PvE pls. People who dont want players attacking them are not going to come here anyways.

Playing WvW on the borderlands is a kind of sandbox. We don’t need huge changes but even the smallest adjustment can alter the game experience. I want more “events” like the Sneak Attack… Make more ANET!

Like:
Frozen Dollies: dolyaks cannot move without swiftness or a fire field layed under them.
Fog of War: ranged siege equipment has 50% reduced range and damage.
The living wood: gates have retaliation.
Revenge of the dolyak: Dolyaks give 5 stack of might and fury to allies in 1200 radius.
Diplomacy: every mercenary camp now adds a Siegerazor to their forces.
Marker’s Trap: activating this trap shows an icon on the minimap with the number of the enemies triggering it for 30 seconds.

And so on… These are little things but they can contribute to the WvW feeling very well… ANET does not even have to balance it since every event would last like 2 weeks or so. I think I don’t need big changes every 6 month… but some spice would be awesome…

My 2 coppers

Aggrostemma.1703:

Playing WvW on the borderlands is a kind of sandbox. We don’t need huge changes but even the smallest adjustment can alter the game experience. I want more “events” like the Sneak Attack… Make more ANET!

Like:
Frozen Dollies: dolyaks cannot move without swiftness or a fire field layed under them.
Fog of War: ranged siege equipment has 50% reduced range and damage.
The living wood: gates have retaliation.
Revenge of the dolyak: Dolyaks give 5 stack of might and fury to allies in 1200 radius.
Diplomacy: every mercenary camp now adds a Siegerazor to their forces.
Marker’s Trap: activating this trap shows an icon on the minimap with the number of the enemies triggering it for 30 seconds.

And so on… These are little things but they can contribute to the WvW feeling very well… ANET does not even have to balance it since every event would last like 2 weeks or so. I think I don’t need big changes every 6 month… but some spice would be awesome…

My 2 coppers

You are really focusing on those yaks.. LOL
Cant you already bind yaks? Most servers do not even have enough people escorting yaks to be able to do that, so I am not sure focusing on slowing yaks when getting supply into keeps is already hard enough as it is since anyone can gank a yak easily even when it is guarded. HAHA

Some servers do not even have enough people on them to kill siegie as it is. LOL

I would rather them add ways to fight players and really not have to fight NPC’s at all.. Most PVE players dont come to wvw to actually play it, they just come to K train and do dailies.

Dawdler.8521:

Boring indeed. I stand by what I said, in many ways its superior. The map itself and its ridiculous size, the siege mechanics etc… Everything just oozed WvW on a grand scale. But the way they designed it pretty much demanded a large and very active population which organised itself. When the numbers wherent there, it was impossible to get started, unlike GW2 where 5 people can easily cap a keep (and is in no danger whatsoever when taking a camp). In short, GW2 scales from about 1-50 players, ESO scale from 20-200 players. And that’s not good design.

I would say more like from 10-200. However it was primarily an issue cause of factors outside of the design of Cyrodiil itself: too many campaigns; the ability to guest to any campaign; not enough widespread support from gaming guilds; class balancing and being too slow to rebalance…………

uberkingkong.8041:

IF ESO does go F2P, I’ll most likely be one of those people that change games.
Very big fan of Elder Scrolls.

They have announced it will be buy to play from 17 March 2015 ie no sub required.

pdavis.8031:

Prysin.8542:

Rangerdeity.5847:

pdavis.8031:

You do realize that making maps takes a long time right? The Devs have said as much.

yah this was a lie. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9LacRwbNxE

my ex girlfriend taught me how to do it you can create maps like this in a couple hours then a few hours of dropping your towers on a few more hours of placing your npc and then drop some foliage rocks what have you then a few days of running around the map looking for possible fall thru points whalla perfect map made using free to use programs. your point is invalid and their excuse is a lie.

Any questions?

Makin the map itself is quick, texturing custom parts, npc pathing, npc events, event zones, event triggering, mobile events (dolly), fort upgrade (massive texture swap, globally), not to mention siege placenent and exclusion. This stuff takes time, lots of it. Especially when events are local, and doubled up (2× attack + 1×defend)

Also making the map to support hundreds of players at any given time, seige equipment, special map mechanics, mobs, nodes, etc.

Sure while making the initial map may only take a few hours, you have to also count in all the other stuff that comes along with it, most of which remains unseen by many, but has a large impact on the map.

As far as lying? If you choose to believe that, thats quite alright. However, I see no reason for the devs to lie about anything. As an Anet respresentative (the devs, not me) their careers could very well be at stake if they are lying. It’s not in thier, or any businesses, best interest to lie. In fact lying to your customers is a terrible way to conduct business, and thats why it’s not widely practiced. And in fact there are US laws prohibiting businesses from lying to their customers. (False Advertising/fraud, obstruction, etc.)

laws are for the povertish if you live in america you know that well. also npc pathing isnt really hard npc behavior a little harder but that already exists new maps would just copy paste that siege placement/exclusion is literally placing circles on the map ….. drag and click and done GG you worked so hard you deserve a raise. events are also always done in a circular fashion where participation of the event which again is copy pasted from existing events is based on your position inside our outside the circle. you guys really think these games are more complex than they really are the majority of the data in these games are simply the texture files. and swapping textures on something is pretty easy doing it without making players reload the map thats pretty impressive but they already have that feat accomplished so good for them.

Aggrostemma.1703:

Playing WvW on the borderlands is a kind of sandbox. We don’t need huge changes but even the smallest adjustment can alter the game experience. I want more “events” like the Sneak Attack… Make more ANET!

Like:
Frozen Dollies: dolyaks cannot move without swiftness or a fire field layed under them.
Fog of War: ranged siege equipment has 50% reduced range and damage.
The living wood: gates have retaliation.
Revenge of the dolyak: Dolyaks give 5 stack of might and fury to allies in 1200 radius.
Diplomacy: every mercenary camp now adds a Siegerazor to their forces.
Marker’s Trap: activating this trap shows an icon on the minimap with the number of the enemies triggering it for 30 seconds.

And so on… These are little things but they can contribute to the WvW feeling very well… ANET does not even have to balance it since every event would last like 2 weeks or so. I think I don’t need big changes every 6 month… but some spice would be awesome…

My 2 coppers

One of my fondest memories of WvW suggestions was remaking the borderlands into “weatherzones” (and tweak EB to have a little of each towards respective border).

You got the desert border, jungle border and tundra border. Each would have local and random weather systems to match. Sandstorms, fog, snowstorms. it would still be the same base terrain, just… different. Frozen rivers, dried up rivers and regular rivers, for example.

But its always too late to dream. I look towards Guild Wars 3 instead. GW2 has always been a great game, now imagine it on a modern engine with lots more detail.

Arkinos.7245:

GW2 WvW is actually very kittenty compared to open world/conquest based pvp modes in other MMOs.

On top of the one and only holy grail of open world pvp; Eve Online, even games like Aion have better system than GW2.

Eve Online lol. If I want to “play” by watching small dots on the screen swarming around the screen and a table on the right side I’ll play excel, thanks.

Eve might have the most open world and the best framework, but the gameplay itself is way too detached for the wider audience.

morrolan.9608:

uberkingkong.8041:

IF ESO does go F2P, I’ll most likely be one of those people that change games.
Very big fan of Elder Scrolls.

They have announced it will be buy to play from 17 March 2015 ie no sub required.

Nice I just needed a reason why to play it. Knowing that I can play it whenever and not have to pay a monthly upkeep is enough of a reason to play it.

The 3 big WvW/RvR MMO’s is DaoC,WaR and Gw2 and yea its improved both in gameplay and map-quality (tho EotM was a setback) and well atm Iam just getting Expansion to stretch out the time to Camelot Unchained tbh.

ESO WvW may have a good concept however with the worst UI ever seen in a MMO it wont help.

Ravezaar.4951:

The 3 big WvW/RvR MMO’s is DaoC,WaR and Gw2 and yea its improved both in gameplay and map-quality (tho EotM was a setback) and well atm Iam just getting Expansion to stretch out the time to Camelot Unchained tbh.

ESO WvW may have a good concept however with the worst UI ever seen in a MMO it wont help.

I wont be going to ESO strictly for WvW.
That games looks more like a traditional MMORPG, and if everything is free, (none of this silver memebership restricted this and that unless you pay $15 monthly fee for gold membership… what everquest does). As long as its buy it once, and don’t pay anything else except for expansions, I’ll play it.

To be honest I don’t consider GW2 traditional MMORPG style. Not because you don’t have healers and tanks, but because everything is so far away, so much 3rd person. Traditional MMORPG, is more 1st person, or you are really up close and feels more 1st person in 3rd person view than in 3rd person in 3rd person view. Feels like I’m playing a strategy game due to how far away the look is. Not only that but other stuff too, I actually do having 2 different sets of gear, raid gear and group gear.

But what WoW and EQ do, its free but limited, that’s just stupid, you gotta be everything free (cept expansions) after purchasing the game.

GW2 is like confused to whether it wants to be a RPG or MMORPG. Its like Diablo 2 and 3, so much 3rd person you don’t really have the connection with your character like the feeling you get with real MMORPGs, which is a more 1st person view type feeling.

Also, like I said I have more love/brand loyal towards elder scrolls than I do to arenanet/guild wars whatever they call themselves.

Elder Scrolls actually I feel like I know what’s going on lore wise, this game GW2, its like all over the place, I try to pay attention but its not clicking.

I feel like with there lore/theme, it went from young adult storyline type mode (original game), didn’t play episode 1, but this episode 2 or living story 2, it feels so much kid mode. I highly doubt the GW2 population is a bunch of kids, they should really relook that.

morrolan.9608:

kefro.9312:

GW2 is the best at wvw in all mmo…

No its not, Dawdler has it right about ESO. The ESO design is clearly superior.

Design doesn’t help much if the game is about as responsive as a drunk elephant chained to the bottom of the ocean for many players.

morrolan.9608:

uberkingkong.8041:

IF ESO does go F2P, I’ll most likely be one of those people that change games.
Very big fan of Elder Scrolls.

They have announced it will be buy to play from 17 March 2015 ie no sub required.

Ooo awesome.