Guild Wars 2

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

This game isn’t balanced for 1 vs 1. It’s pretty much the opposite of every other games, where they balance the classes in 1 vs 1 before doing the WvW stuff.

I mean seriously, try a 1 vs 1 staff ele vs thief or warrior. There is like a 0.05% chance that the ele win. I can understand the concept of imbalanced classes, but not to that extent.

Staff Elementalist isn’t good at one on one but godly for zerging so I’m not understanding your point? Warrior is useless in one on ones vs good players too and Thieves are not the greatest in zergs.

My point is that no online game should put you in a 1 vs 1 situation where you have absolutely no chance. A certain imbalance is fine, but total imbalance isn’t.

Specially considering that the elementalist doesn’t even have a weapon-swap button and that you thieve are roaming around with permanent invisibility. It’s totally broken balance.

Xillllix.3485:

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

This game isn’t balanced for 1 vs 1. It’s pretty much the opposite of every other games, where they balance the classes in 1 vs 1 before doing the WvW stuff.

I mean seriously, try a 1 vs 1 staff ele vs thief or warrior. There is like a 0.05% chance that the ele win. I can understand the concept of imbalanced classes, but not to that extent.

Staff Elementalist isn’t good at one on one but godly for zerging so I’m not understanding your point? Warrior is useless in one on ones vs good players too and Thieves are not the greatest in zergs.

My point is that no online game should put you in a 1 vs 1 situation where you have absolutely no chance. A certain imbalance is fine, but total imbalance isn’t.

Specially considering that the elementalist doesn’t even have a weapon-swap button and that you thieve are roaming around with permanent invisibility. It’s totally broken balance.

You can walk around with D/D till you get inside the zerg and then switch to staff.

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

This game isn’t balanced for 1 vs 1. It’s pretty much the opposite of every other games, where they balance the classes in 1 vs 1 before doing the WvW stuff.

I mean seriously, try a 1 vs 1 staff ele vs thief or warrior. There is like a 0.05% chance that the ele win. I can understand the concept of imbalanced classes, but not to that extent.

Staff Elementalist isn’t good at one on one but godly for zerging so I’m not understanding your point? Warrior is useless in one on ones vs good players too and Thieves are not the greatest in zergs.

My point is that no online game should put you in a 1 vs 1 situation where you have absolutely no chance. A certain imbalance is fine, but total imbalance isn’t.

Specially considering that the elementalist doesn’t even have a weapon-swap button and that you thieve are roaming around with permanent invisibility. It’s totally broken balance.

You can walk around with D/D till you get inside the zerg and then switch to staff.

Or they could fix the game balance…

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

This game isn’t balanced for 1 vs 1. It’s pretty much the opposite of every other games, where they balance the classes in 1 vs 1 before doing the WvW stuff.

I mean seriously, try a 1 vs 1 staff ele vs thief or warrior. There is like a 0.05% chance that the ele win. I can understand the concept of imbalanced classes, but not to that extent.

Staff Elementalist isn’t good at one on one but godly for zerging so I’m not understanding your point? Warrior is useless in one on ones vs good players too and Thieves are not the greatest in zergs.

My point is that no online game should put you in a 1 vs 1 situation where you have absolutely no chance. A certain imbalance is fine, but total imbalance isn’t.

Specially considering that the elementalist doesn’t even have a weapon-swap button and that you thieve are roaming around with permanent invisibility. It’s totally broken balance.

You can walk around with D/D till you get inside the zerg and then switch to staff.

You can carry every weapon set and Instant Trait Reset, and become the most versatile character ever!

Xillllix.3485:

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

glaphen.5230:

Xillllix.3485:

This game isn’t balanced for 1 vs 1. It’s pretty much the opposite of every other games, where they balance the classes in 1 vs 1 before doing the WvW stuff.

I mean seriously, try a 1 vs 1 staff ele vs thief or warrior. There is like a 0.05% chance that the ele win. I can understand the concept of imbalanced classes, but not to that extent.

Staff Elementalist isn’t good at one on one but godly for zerging so I’m not understanding your point? Warrior is useless in one on ones vs good players too and Thieves are not the greatest in zergs.

My point is that no online game should put you in a 1 vs 1 situation where you have absolutely no chance. A certain imbalance is fine, but total imbalance isn’t.

Specially considering that the elementalist doesn’t even have a weapon-swap button and that you thieve are roaming around with permanent invisibility. It’s totally broken balance.

You can walk around with D/D till you get inside the zerg and then switch to staff.

Or they could fix the game balance…

You mean – they should balance that staff eles are very bad in 1v1 fights? Man, you are right, it’s totally unbalanced that they can’t do decent stuff in 1v1, while being very good in large scale combat. Gasp you know, they reming me of thieves, but reversed.

Solstice.1097:

I’ve been roaming with a condi warrior and thieves are a joke against it. I immobilize them and lay 10-15 stacks of bleed on them in no time, then drop a LB burst in their SR and they either run away or come out of stealth in downed state.

Not saying they are the best thieves out there, but we are talking about thieves as a class in general. The best players will make any class look OP.

A D/P thief who loses to a condi warrior is doing something bad.
And all the Engis who are complaining about thieves should l2p, because stealth thieves are the best prey for engis.

Thieves should just be deleted from the game simple. they take very little skill to play and when the kitten hits the fan they run and stealth then return with a 12k backstab and think they are god. And if you do beat them the majority party invite you to tell you how lucky or nooby you are.

I think what enrages people about my class is our ability to stealth whenever we are in trouble and our ability to hit harder than any other class. Add to that the ability to move faster especially in stealth, and you get rage. Personally, I think it was a huge mistake to allow stealthing while in combat. It makes it so easy for me to kill enemies without any risk. However, I tired of being hated for my class mechanics. All I hear in chat is hatred for my class it gets old.

Sanduskel.1850:

I think what enrages people about my class is our ability to stealth whenever we are in trouble and our ability to hit harder than any other class. Add to that the ability to move faster especially in stealth, and you get rage. Personally, I think it was a huge mistake to allow stealthing while in combat. It makes it so easy for me to kill enemies without any risk. However, I tired of being hated for my class mechanics. All I hear in chat is hatred for my class it gets old.

It’s not just that, Lately i have seen thieves who are hitting 7k cnd and 12-14k backstabs on toons that have 2k+ toughness and a lot of vitality which is understandable if these thieves are total glass canon but they are able to also take a lot of damage too.

Glitch or exploit i dunno but something isn’t right.

snacktime.1082:

Gwen.7619:

You know its just to easy to sit there and say do this do that, not one of you has shown us what to do with a video! showing that yourself has L2P to help and validate what you say in that it is easy to counter a thief, to me you just are know it all with no proof. If your that good then help us by showing how easy it is please. Otherwise I simply don’t believe you and your trolling to make yourself look king

Those video’s exist, should we teach you how to use google as well?

Thanks but no thanks as it not what i asked for?
As a worrier I only have to use the triat when it by a crit hit gain retaliation for 6 secs, more if more +boon duration, thief hits after the first and down he goes! But that is not skill related and sence there are many of you here given the biggy how dame good you are then please sshow me with you own skill how you do it and not put into words what you have seen from OLD videos from someone els on youtube, so if you want to tell me to L2P then show the proof that you can do it and then we know that you are not full off bull and that we do need to L2P, so please prove to i am a bad player otherwise you are no better and unhelpful and full of yourself playing a troll

snacktime.1082:

Gwen.7619:

You know its just to easy to sit there and say do this do that, not one of you has shown us what to do with a video! showing that yourself has L2P to help and validate what you say in that it is easy to counter a thief, to me you just are know it all with no proof. If your that good then help us by showing how easy it is please. Otherwise I simply don’t believe you and your trolling to make yourself look king

Those video’s exist, should we teach you how to use google as well?

can you show me some videos where the opponent wins after getting hit for 20k in one hit, that’d be pretty awesome

I would record for you guys if I could, but my comp wouldn’t be able to handle it : /

If you’re getting hit for 20k you’re too glassy and the thief was glass as well.

I agree man its pretty wack. IMO sigil stacks shouldnt exist in PvP and WvW. All it does is encourage people to throw everything they have at you and expect it to work. My best advice is to play PvP to learn how to counter different classes and specs. Good luck.
Word to the Wise: Stealth Traps.

They said they were working to make it so you couldn’t get stacks and then swap to another weapon. That’s fair imo.

Aberrant.6749:

They said they were working to make it so you couldn’t get stacks and then swap to another weapon. That’s fair imo.

I guess that works for me. As long as it doesnt apply to PvE as well.

Aberrant.6749:

I would record for you guys if I could, but my comp wouldn’t be able to handle it : /

If you’re getting hit for 20k you’re too glassy and the thief was glass as well.

the backstab was 16.9k and flame blast procced from it 3.1k (just my luck), I had at least 1700 toughness at the time, can’t remember exact number.

you are right about them being glass, never saw them again though

You would have killed him just as fast had you noticed him and been prepared.

Bazzoong.7145:

You can find the relevat info on how it is theoretically done here:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/How-is-this-backstab-possible

Mind you I have been seeing “strange” things and very “weird” numbers lately.

so is this a bug?

having 1700 toughness isn’t glass cannon by a far shot.

I generally zerg on my Thief (My ranger is actually my solo roaming toon) cause i’m venom aura build

Every now and again for giggles, I swap to Thieves Guild, then proceed to run around and explode people.

People expect to eat that damage from a Dagger/Dagger or a D/P thief, so they’re prepared..

No one expects to eat all their life in a split second from a P/D Condition Thief.

Thankfully thieves haven’t caught onto how bloody overpowered Venom Aura is yet.

Terravos.4059:

I generally zerg on my Thief (My ranger is actually my solo roaming toon) cause i’m venom aura build

Every now and again for giggles, I swap to Thieves Guild, then proceed to run around and explode people.

People expect to eat that damage from a Dagger/Dagger or a D/P thief, so they’re prepared..

No one expects to eat all their life in a split second from a P/D Condition Thief.

Thankfully thieves haven’t caught onto how bloody overpowered Venom Aura is yet.

It suffers from the same thing that other high burst thief builds do. Long cd’s if they avoid the initial burst. Sure it might be kinda neat to stack 20 torment etc. real fast, but if they have a cond wipe or dodge or block… then you’re not going to be doing much for 180s.

@OP If you have a stun breaker then you will not get burst like that you could also invest in Stabilized Armor and Protection Injection Generally speaking you don’t need these. No thief is going to burst you out of no where. The base range on steal is 900 (increased to 1,500 by Long Reach if traited). At 900 you will see the thif long before they get ner you in most cases. Basilisk Venom looks like a little green and black buff under the thief’s name. If you see it you know its coming. If you run bomb kit with shield or rifle you can stealth using smoke bomb and he will have no target. You can also stop drop smoke bomb let him close the gap only to realize he is blinded. If he runs likely you will not catch him unless you have something like rocket boots and elixir x and can get lucky with a juggernaut proc. Additionally in your “Control Options” under “Camera” bind the “Look Behind” key to something close (shift, caps lock, mouse button etc). If you do this there are 2 things it will do. It will allow you to throw nades behind you while you run. It will also allow you to see if anyone is chasing you in the distance.

This is mostly an issue of players not knowing how to deal with burst builds a full year in. It is not like DD wasn’t nerfed repeatedly until you could barely find a thief not running S/D or D/P. truth is players still think while roaming that stunbreakers and active defense are unnecessary. They still think that for some reason because a thief can run it must be OP. Let me break it down for you all. That type of burst does not happen unless the thief is glass or your in kittenty defense gear (less than 3k for most classes). Most players who have been playing for a while carry a stun breaker and avoid that burst chain all together. I has been more than 5 months since i was burst down by a glass thief on any toon I play and the last time I was on warrior (pre buff) taunting 2 thieves who couldn’t catch up to me. Truth is many players simply do not understand how roaming works vs zerging.

As far as breaking combat the only calls that can do it is necromancer. The sad truth is thieves have been nerfed repeatedly and in the zerg vs zerg environment that is T1 you literally need insane mobility (warrior, ranger, fgs ele /d) or stealth (PU mesmer, heavy stealth thief) to roam.

Aberrant.6749:

You would have killed him just as fast had you noticed him and been prepared.

This was outside SW camp at sentry point, I never saw him. I assume he spotted me while in Bay and stealthed (remember they can do that) down because I didn’t see him until I had 3k health (had 23k at the time, ~ 20k first hit) and my camera was facing that way to watch the sentry while I killed the yak.

TheGuy.3568:

That type of burst does not happen unless the thief is glass or your in kittenty defense gear (less than 3k for most classes).

Less than 3k is kittenty defence gear? That’s ~1940 toughness for med, 2080 for light and and still ~1800 for heavy. By those standards, a large proportion of roamers have kittenty defence gear.

Okay, moment of honesty – how many thieves came into this topic hoping to see that the QQ was from THEIR backstab?

raises his hand

Stealth has signs like SR, puffs of smoke, etc. Since it sounds he was a glass burst build he probably had less stealth uptime than the normal thief. Seems more likely that he came from another direction (like up over the hill to the top of that bridge then down to you or through the camp then behind the wall) vs all the way from bay in stealth.

Regardless at some point he had to have seen you and you could have seen him. When I’m roaming I’m always checking around to see if anything is going on in any direction (fps habit) when I’m taking a sentry I’m constantly moving and scanning. I can’t think of a single time like this when anyone was able to get to me before I saw them.

Kincaidia.3192:

Okay, moment of honesty – how many thieves came into this topic hoping to see that the QQ was from THEIR backstab?

raises his hand

Nah I knew it wasn’t me since I don’t do one min wonder type builds. Too easy to counter.

To be honest last time a full glass thief got me was becouse i saw him but i was too slow. A full glassy can’t stay too much in stealth so if he saw you, you’d have to see him as well. Paying attention is not an optional. It’s like crying becouse a sniper sniped you. He did his job, you were too much uncovered.
Looking at the pic Flame Blast was from an engi not from a thief, so ok you didn’t see the thief, but.. don’t you see a bunch of enemies?! At this point i can assume that everyone can gank you with a glassy build and get you with few hits till you dont pay attention.

Illusions.3108:

i am an engineer, i just find this completely unbalanced that a class can 3-4 shot someone with a tanky build. i am in all rabid,carrion and dire gear.

Swap over to full rabid or run a combo of rabid and dire. Crit is HUGE to a condi engineer. My only piece of non rabid gear is my shield, only be cause I got an ascended carrion drop (and the shield adds toughness as is). Learn to properly use healing turret and blast, you can get up to 10k health if you do it right. Drop bombs and make it painful for the thief to get behind you.

Amurond.4590:

TheGuy.3568:

That type of burst does not happen unless the thief is glass or your in kittenty defense gear (less than 3k for most classes).

Less than 3k is kittenty defence gear? That’s ~1940 toughness for med, 2080 for light and and still ~1800 for heavy. By those standards, a large proportion of roamers have kittenty defence gear.

My roaming engineer 2521 armor, my thief 2682, my warrior 2701, my mesmer 2500, the key difference is I know how to spot a thief. Most people who start these threads get burst so hard due to the fact they don not know how to counter someone you can see coming right at you.

well every thief u face is differnt. ther is the cheesy hs and backstab spammers, that could crit u for 8 – 11k and can be a real pain if played by a skilled player. and than there is terrible thieves that are so predictable that u can destroy them without great effort. but then there are some weird builds out there that can kill u and u dont even know why or how. all i know is that thieves can be very tough to shake off once they target u.

TheGuy.3568:

Amurond.4590:

TheGuy.3568:

That type of burst does not happen unless the thief is glass or your in kittenty defense gear (less than 3k for most classes).

Less than 3k is kittenty defence gear? That’s ~1940 toughness for med, 2080 for light and and still ~1800 for heavy. By those standards, a large proportion of roamers have kittenty defence gear.

My roaming engineer 2521 armor, my thief 2682, my warrior 2701, my mesmer 2500, the key difference is I know how to spot a thief. Most people who start these threads get burst so hard due to the fact they don not know how to counter someone you can see coming right at you.

2500 o.0….hoooow? what build and what power?

We thieves are the only class that can be glass cannons and not suffer the consequences. That’s bad design.

Tested this tonight, Changed my own thief build to full dire gear with 1.9k toughness 20k vitality and took a 7.5k CnD and 12k Backstab from an Sfr thief.

Something is definitely NOT right.

Sanduskel.1850:

We thieves are the only class that can be glass cannons and not suffer the consequences. That’s bad design.

Don’t you mean warriors?

Zacchary.6183:

Sanduskel.1850:

We thieves are the only class that can be glass cannons and not suffer the consequences. That’s bad design.

Don’t you mean warriors?

Lol nope. Glass cannon warrior die quickly. I can easily 3 shot them with my thief.

Sanduskel.1850:

Zacchary.6183:

Sanduskel.1850:

We thieves are the only class that can be glass cannons and not suffer the consequences. That’s bad design.

Don’t you mean warriors?

Lol nope. Glass cannon warrior die quickly. I can easily 3 shot them with my thief.

Sanduskelis is correct, why do you think thieves hits that hard to begin with?

obviously, cause they are glass cannon.

The only class that gets away being a glass cannon is thief; not forgetting their mastery in stealth……

Then you two are apparently not killing fast enough. Perhaps lay off the toughness stacking a little?

EDIT: It would also help to lay off all the bunker traits as well. With some power, pressure and a little knowledge anyone can down or repel a thief easily.

Zacchary.6183:

Then you two are apparently not killing fast enough. Perhaps lay off the toughness stacking a little?

EDIT: It would also help to lay off all the bunker traits as well. With some power, pressure and a little knowledge anyone can down or repel a thief easily.

I think you are confused. I don’t have problems with warriors, lol.

Theif 3 shot you. But you can 2 shot him dead. You sir are op

An actual full glass thief is very easy to take down. We’re talking about the triple signet one-trick ponies here that have insane burst once (the 12-17k backstabs you’re talking about), and are useless afterwards. You can basically win the fight with a single dodge.

Many thieves go 30 points into Shadow Arts which doesn’t make them too glassy and gives them a lot more survivability, but they are still susceptible to burst.

Sanduskel seems to be constantly asking for thief nerfs despite claiming to be a thief player himself. Apparently he owns everything and therefor thief is OP. So either he’s only killing baddies in WvW or just a godlike thief player, and I’m strongly suspecting it’s the former.

lol. Never said i was a great thief. In fact, I am terrible at games like these, but I find my thief quite easy. That should say a lot, lol.

I simply tell the truth. Perma stealth at will is terribly imbalanced, and it drives anet to constantly nerf my class. They should eliminate the ability to stealth while in combat and give us other benefits instead. I am tired of everyone jumping on my corpse and spam emoting me simply because I am a thief. I tire of my own server constantly berating me for playing a skilless class. I cant disagree because perma stealth is ridiculous. Don’t tell me that it’s no longer possible. It is and easier than ever thanks to the init buff Anet gave us.

Sanduskel.1850:

lol. Never said i was a great thief. In fact, I am terrible at games like these, but I find my thief quite easwy. That should say a lot, lol.

That says hardly anything at all because below average/mediocre thieves > inexperienced players. And as there are a lot of inexperienced players in WvW you’ll have an easy time. Especially if you’re one of the thieves that resets a fight as soon as the enemy is somewhat capable.

Duel some good enemies in spvp or even WvW and come here again. Because if you face a strong opponent thief isn’t quite the walk in the park you want to make us believe.

Don’t even try Okaishi. He doesn’t play a thief let alone the game.

EDIT: And fyi, Sanduskel, before you start accusing me of spying on you it was your persistent trolling on a whole community (who was willing to be nice to you i might add) that would make anyone even think about seeking you out.

I just showed those people your post history. They were the ones who got kitten ed off and looked for you.

Well I do hope that they found me! I am not trying to be mean to anyone. I simply speak the truth since I believe in a balanced game.

Aberrant.6749:

Terravos.4059:

I generally zerg on my Thief (My ranger is actually my solo roaming toon) cause i’m venom aura build

Every now and again for giggles, I swap to Thieves Guild, then proceed to run around and explode people.

People expect to eat that damage from a Dagger/Dagger or a D/P thief, so they’re prepared..

No one expects to eat all their life in a split second from a P/D Condition Thief.

Thankfully thieves haven’t caught onto how bloody overpowered Venom Aura is yet.

It suffers from the same thing that other high burst thief builds do. Long cd’s if they avoid the initial burst. Sure it might be kinda neat to stack 20 torment etc. real fast, but if they have a cond wipe or dodge or block… then you’re not going to be doing much for 180s.

I’ve met very few classes that can survive the burst from dumping that on them. Its a whole boatload of damage + that stupid pet likes to pull people down interrupting any sort of heal usually.

are you people still on this? get over it, and learn to counter. Thieves aren’t going anywhere.

Arcuss.6457:

are you people still on this? get over it, and learn to counter. Thieves aren’t going anywhere.

I hope not. I do hope that they fix on demand perma stealth so that our class can be improved in other ways.

Terravos.4059:

Aberrant.6749:

Terravos.4059:

I generally zerg on my Thief (My ranger is actually my solo roaming toon) cause i’m venom aura build

Every now and again for giggles, I swap to Thieves Guild, then proceed to run around and explode people.

People expect to eat that damage from a Dagger/Dagger or a D/P thief, so they’re prepared..

No one expects to eat all their life in a split second from a P/D Condition Thief.

Thankfully thieves haven’t caught onto how bloody overpowered Venom Aura is yet.

It suffers from the same thing that other high burst thief builds do. Long cd’s if they avoid the initial burst. Sure it might be kinda neat to stack 20 torment etc. real fast, but if they have a cond wipe or dodge or block… then you’re not going to be doing much for 180s.

I’ve met very few classes that can survive the burst from dumping that on them. Its a whole boatload of damage + that stupid pet likes to pull people down interrupting any sort of heal usually.

Outside of good evasion timing preventing it from landing in the first place… anyone with lyssa runes could as well as Eng with C, Necro with Consume Conditions, Ranger with Renewal, War with Zerk Stance… it would just be avoiding the scrop wire from the “pet” thief. The hp leech isn’t going to kill anyone. Then that massive 180s cd on the burst. I’m not saying it won’t work, but it’s not that hard to avoid imo.

Sanduskel.1850:

I hope not. I do hope that they fix on demand perma stealth so that our class can be improved in other ways.

If that’s what’s keeping them from helping thieves out in the areas they are lacking then omg yes please do it right now.

I’m pig sick of this:

Svarty.8019:

I’m pig sick of this:

Breakstun if needed and dodge.
It’s not so hard to do…
I’m sick of whines

mrmadhaze.8706:

Svarty.8019:

I’m pig sick of this:

Breakstun if needed and dodge.
It’s not so hard to do…

It IS hard to do, especially given the short timespans involved.
I’m sick of all the L2P.