Guild Wars 2

Guard Leech and Applied Fortitude are brokenly overpowered. Like sadly so many other things in WvW.

Sirendor.1394:

I don’t 1v1 people with applied fortitude/guard leech. It’s madness. Just call a friend, stealth, gank them. Done.

Do you and your friend feel like good players after that?

Applied Fort. and Guard Leech is broken, don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. It is the same thing as the Ascended debate.

We can have competitive play in WvW. The argument “it is not balanced…. so lets make it worse” is horrible, at best.

Consider full Ascended Gear (soon including Armor), Applied Fort. and Guard Leech = way to make it more broken for new-player / alt-unfriendly to the extreme. What it does is making the strongest players stronger.

I do like some form of progression too in WvW, but not if it means breaking the balance. There are many ways to reward players that would not affect the stats.

Some PvPers out there don’t care about Guard Leech and Applied Fortitude, true, they don’t see it as ‘mandatory’ for themselves and like challenge, but they understand all too well its power. Saying otherwise is just plain… BS, sorry. In my book, you cannot be a skilled PvPer and not understand the huge impact of a 450 stat increase. What you can do is understand it all too well, but post here and say “it doesn’t make a difference…” because you’d like to keep the advantage.

People spend hours Min-Maxing their builds, food choices are extremely important as people sink a lots gold into it to have ‘the best one’ on at all times, and yet some people post here saying a 450 stat increase is ‘nothing’ ? I don’t think we’re playing the same game.

Don’t be hypocrites. You want to keep an unfair advantage over the new players/casuals/alts? Ok, that’s your call, but it is an unfair advantage on the battlefield. I’d rather have a challenge, and have these unfair boosts removed all together. Don’t even get me started on Ascended.

Last I checked WvW wasn’t supposed to be balanced around 1v1 fights.

GL and AP are two big driving factors in WvW. Some players are driven to get it. Those who have it feel a real sense of loss when they die. Gaining and losing stacks has breathed some extra life into WvW for many.

I see the negatives but IMO the positives out weigh them. Stacks create an extra set of thrills and makes a less experienced character (not necessarily player) think twice before jumping on that Bronze or higher player which is in many ways is as it should be.

I’ve seen this issue both ways. Personally, I think it is fine as is. Rank 115 isn’t that hard to obtain.

Nozdormu.4352:

Sirendor.1394:

I don’t 1v1 people with applied fortitude/guard leech. It’s madness. Just call a friend, stealth, gank them. Done.

Do you and your friend feel like good players after that?

We feel like good players after killing a zerg of 15 with 5 certainly.
My point was just, don’t QQ about them being ‘OP’. If they want to use buffs that give them an unfair advantage, get your own unfair advantage on them. Problem solved?

Didn’t read the whole thread, but to answer OP – it indeed is insane advantage and game changer for solo/small scale. New players however will most probably be joining trains/zergs/raids where on a personal level it is much less of a problem. Eventually they will get there with one buff. And if they will stick for long enough – with second one. But as part of a zerg it is not even noticeable. You are riding the wave, if it dies it dies, if it rocks – the only thing you need to do is not to fall behind. Which is just a natter of discipline, not some wvw buffs.

If people are too lazy to go earn ranks, that’s their problem. There’s nothing wrong with these buffs.

Sanduskel.1850:

If people are too lazy to go earn ranks, that’s their problem. There’s nothing wrong with these buffs.

Nothing to do with being lazy.

Yes there is something wrong with these buffs.

Power creep is bad for the game. Individual stat buffs are bad for the game.

Shonie.5297:

lazorexplosion.9602:

If you honestly cannot notice a stat difference equivalent to several slots of ascended trinkets or think that is ‘slight’ I don’t know what to say. You might be completely oblivious.

WvW is a large-scale team objective based game.
I honestly could care less about your 1v1’ing or how balanced it is.

Soloing objectives while coordinating with larger groups is an important part of fighting on lower population servers.

Here’s a thought, go get Guard leech and applied fortitude.
they put the time in to get those buffs why shouldn’t you?

Zepher.7803:

Here’s a thought, go get Guard leech and applied fortitude.
they put the time in to get those buffs why shouldn’t you?

But that is the problem. There is a difference between putting time into developing your skills so that you win fights and putting time into blobbing for WXP so you can get guard leech and applied fortitude to win fights.

My view is that time should be put into getting better and that getting better should be what wins you fights. Not stat bonuses where the “time” put in could realistically be a bot following a blob.

From what I see, the people defending these stupid mechanics are the same people roaming with cheap builds, trying to gank people and then running to avoid losing their valuable stacks whenever the fight begins to swing in the other direction. Honorable. Esports

Sepreh.5924:

My view is that time should be put into getting better and that getting better should be what wins you fights. Not stat bonuses where the “time” put in could realistically be a bot following a blob.

That’s one view, but why exactly in this computer game time put into it should be inferior to innate skill? What’s the goal of WvW in your view? To be some kind of esports that clearly favors skill over determination? We have sPvP that covers that. WvW is a different beast. It is like large society that has place for everyone and every play style. The idea is to have an environment suited for massive amounts of players so it should be attractive to massive variations of play styles. Least effort route is probably preferable so why it shouldn’t favor that?

Sepreh.5924:

From what I see, the people defending these stupid mechanics are the same people roaming with cheap builds, trying to gank people and then running to avoid losing their valuable stacks whenever the fight begins to swing in the other direction. Honorable. Esports

Esports honorable? Really? The higher competition gets the more prevalent is idea of using anything that is [barely] not against the rules set for competition. Every highly competitive activity is antagonistic to the “honor” idea where you set some social rules and do not cross them no matter what. That’s just two different and conflicting models. Honorable person in highly-competitive activity is by definition a scrub.

Zepher.7803:

Here’s a thought, go get Guard leech and applied fortitude.
they put the time in to get those buffs why shouldn’t you?

Your thought is bad. I have the buffs and you clearly don’t speak for me ’cause I want the buff gone.

The game shouldn’t give an advantage to people who play longer. WvW is a PvP place where you test against people, not spreadsheets against spreadsheets.

Equipment, food buffs, these are things you make choices about and your choices comes up against the choices of people . That’s still PvP (though I’d say maybe the stats can get a bit too high making combat uninteractive in some ways).

Getting higher stats for playing longer is none of that and just invites people who play long to be lazy and bad. No doubt lazy people can post here all day long how they like having things in their favour all the time (with weakass excuses about how they’re more special than anyone else) but I kitten on that.

The buffs are an absolute yes (not to mention unbalanced, 2k hp on guardian is way more valuable than 2k hp on warrior) for everyone in every combat situation and they just create dozens of hours for people to grind for a stat increase.

This is ridiculous. “They put the time in”

A lot of us are working adults who do not have ‘the time’ to put in.

Furthermore, many of us are on losing servers that can’t get out of spawn. Even with ‘time’ you still can’t generate much wxp other then trying to roam in a empty bl and pick up a camp or sentry here and there.

You like having a unfair advantage. Quit trying to justify it, its disgusting.

Lastly, no, wvw is not a dueling mode, nor is it a zerg mode or a roaming mode…its ALL of these things. While leech and fortitude may not matter in zerg fights, its a BIG issue in small team havoc and solo roaming.

In the end this all comes back to the new guy. The guy who, when this game began, had a very small hill to climb to be competitive.

That small hill has become a mountain. Not just with wxp, but also ascended gear and weapons too. I can’t recommend this game to anyone anymore because I know what a grindfest it has become for the newbie.

Johje Holan.4607:

Sanduskel.1850:

If people are too lazy to go earn ranks, that’s their problem. There’s nothing wrong with these buffs.

Nothing to do with being lazy.

Yes there is something wrong with these buffs.

Power creep is bad for the game. Individual stat buffs are bad for the game.

I agree with this in principal but given the classes I mostly play in WvW are the 2 lowest base health classes I just like to look on it as a way of overcoming these balancing problems which it seems are not going to be addressed in the rest of the game.

Lol. 230 ranks are pretty easy to get. I work 60+ hours a week and I am at rank 325. Get over it, life isn’t fair. If you dislike wvw so much that you can’t bother to get your ranks, then do pve.

Sanduskel.1850:

Lol. 230 ranks are pretty easy to get. I work 60+ hours a week and I am at rank 325. Get over it, life isn’t fair. If you dislike wvw so much that you can’t bother to get your ranks, then do pve.

Ahh, I see now. Didn’t notice your sig before.

Both abilities are incredibly powerful.

However neither ability will counter Builds used in the end.

I’ve fought people with the stacks when I didn’t have them, and easily won simply because of the Build i was playing.

What those stacks tend to do is allow you to survive 2v1’s more then it allows you to win 1v1’s against certain builds.

Sanduskel.1850:

Lol. 230 ranks are pretty easy to get. I work 60+ hours a week and I am at rank 325. Get over it, life isn’t fair. If you dislike wvw so much that you can’t bother to get your ranks, then do pve.

Clearly you zerg train on a high pop server then.

I’ve been roaming since beta and only have 90 ranks because I actually prefer small fights…

morrolan.9608:

Johje Holan.4607:

Sanduskel.1850:

If people are too lazy to go earn ranks, that’s their problem. There’s nothing wrong with these buffs.

Nothing to do with being lazy.

Yes there is something wrong with these buffs.

Power creep is bad for the game. Individual stat buffs are bad for the game.

I agree with this in principal but given the classes I mostly play in WvW are the 2 lowest base health classes I just like to look on it as a way of overcoming these balancing problems which it seems are not going to be addressed in the rest of the game.

The low base health is included in the balance. It is the applied fortitude and guard leech that are disrupting that balance

Lorelei.3918:

You like having a unfair advantage. Quit trying to justify it, its disgusting.

^this

You got AF and GL. Congratulations you sunk a lot of time in WvW, and that is your advantage over new players.
Why also add a flat numerical advantage aswell? You should be just fine without it.

Just another thing that deters new players from seriously getting into WvW.

Lol it doesn’t though. I don’t have either and I do just fine

Just like food it’s your choice whether to use it or not. I don’t have it yet because I put the points in something else – so i pay the price and I’m fine with that.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Just like food it’s your choice whether to use it or not. I don’t have it yet because I put the points in something else – so i pay the price and I’m fine with that.

Compared to anything else those stack bonuses give unfair advantage in personal stats. It’s completely different thing to have arrow cart points than extra vitality stacks. Those individual stats matter less when you play zerg wvw where you get all those points to even get those stacks.

In short it all becomes back to this dumb thing that you have to focus playing one character and only do zerg style wvw to obtain enough ranks instead of just having fun roaming in small groups and playing multiple characters.

It is just another thing forcing people to play only one “right” way. I have been playing since betas and my main character has maybe what 85 ranks. I don’t like zerging around and yes I do usually win bad players with those stacks. However it doesn’t mean those stacks bonuses weren’t completely broken mechanic. The amount you get from them and how easy it is to get them is just not sensible.

When you mention food bonuses now, some food buffs would need some nerf bat also. +40% bonus from food is just insane. I’d like to say even +20% bonus is insane but now it’s +40%…

WvW doesn’t need to be completely balanced and it probably shouldn’t, but it sure would help if it wasn’t so ridiculously out of balance either. Especially for smaller group play.

Life isn’t fair. Is it fair that I was born this way?

lazorexplosion.9602:

A 450 stat advantage (5 stacks of 50 vitality, 5 of 20 each of power and condition damage) over new players or characters is just insane. That’s not much less than the stats provided by an entire set of exotic armor!

Fighting someone who has those stacks in a small group or 1v1 on a fresh alt that lacks them is so one sided it’s just demoralizing. It’s practically just a free win for having more playtime and punishment for trying to use an alt.

You could literally halve those numbers and it would still be a pretty crazy advantage. It really needs to me something much more like 20 vitality and 10 each power and condition damage per stack, and start earlier in the tree with say max 1 stack at skill level 3, 2 stacks at 5, 3 stacks at 8, 4 stacks at 9 and 5 stacks at 10 so the bonus isn’t just one lump of win right at the end with little progression for partial progression.

You have exaggerated this so greatly that your point can not be taken seriously. “it’s practically a free win”. Spend more time in game working on your skills and less time on forums.

So all you learn to play types…

you’re telling us that 450 stat points simply don’t matter?

Ok cool, put your money where your mouth is. Take off your exotic gear and put on a set of rare gear (to roughly a 450 stat loss) and go out and do some solo roaming. Let me know how it goes for you.

Lorelei.3918:

So all you learn to play types…

you’re telling us that 450 stat points simply don’t matter?

Ok cool, put your money where your mouth is. Take off your exotic gear and put on a set of rare gear (to roughly a 450 stat loss) and go out and do some solo roaming. Let me know how it goes for you.

A poor comparison, as you’re doing less damage with weapons, taking more from enemy damage from the reduced damage and armor on your gear, on top of the stat boosts. The real comparison is going out with no stacks and fighting someone that has both AF and GL, which is certainly possible. I’ve fought people with both stacks who were using legendary weapons while I had none of those and won. Difference in builds and skill trumps the stat bonus from the buffs.

Its just yet more ‘preparing to have fun’ that ANet said would not be in the game.

I’m karma training to get the 230 ranks needed so I don’t feel at a disadvantage.

But of course once I get them I still have to go and get some kills to charge them don’t I…

This game really is nothing but preparing to have fun.

You guys are fighting a losing battle, especially with so many apologists for stupid, unbalanced crap like this.

The only way to win in this game is not to play.

When Guild Wars 2’s WvW encourages less stupid zerging and grinding for rewards, WXPS and stats and allows you to just “have fun” without worrying about stats, as advertised, then you should you play.

It’s not like there’s a sub. You lose nothing by playing other games that don’t treat you like a hamster on a wheel. When this idiocy is fixed then you can come back.

The more you log in to WvW, the more metrics Anet has that lies to them insinuating you are happy with the state of the game and they have done no wrong.

Just take a leave. The only thing devs understand is numbers. Rational arguments do not work, as the ever increasing amount of stuff you have to grind to be at max stats indicates.

There is no reason to give your free time to developers who so easily ignore the crowd the game was marketed towards in the first place. If they see a big enough dent in numbers, perhaps then, they will realize their folly.

If that never happens then you also win – you get to move on to games that respect your time and intelligence. Being able to avoid the people that actually want to keep this nonsense is just a bonus. They’ll be just as happy to be rid of you, so everyone wins.

I found out that the best way to get all these WXP ranks out of my mind is to not grind for them at all. My GW2 time is now limited to occasionally visiting the forums to see if the PvP in this game ever improves to a somewhat playable state. I’m fine with this, because there are plenty of other games that deserve my time and money until such a time that this game reaches its true, horribly squandered potential.

Johje Holan.4607:

It’s just another form of imbalance in an aready unbalanced system. And don’t be like Anet and say WvW is not supposed to be balanced, that’s just a dumb response.

WvW is naturally unbalanced yes. There is inherent imbalance in WvW yes. That is what they mean when they say its not supposed to be balanced.

But given the natural imbalance, adding MORE imbalance through add on mechanics and content is counterproductive and absolutely ridiculous. And I can’t believe anyone who actually thinks about it for more than two seconds thinks otherwise.

Anet said WvW isn’t supposed to be balanced. That’s not dumb it’s what the devs want out of this game type. Go fight fair in spvp or in the new arena in the obsidian sanctum when it comes out. I play WvW because it is unbalanced. Arrow cart mastery is brokenly OP when defending so they should remove that. Cata mastery is brokenly OP when catapulting walls so remove that too. People who put in the time should have an advantage. Players also are OP in pve so nerf every class so we can have a fair fight in pve

Kaos.9162:

Lorelei.3918:

So all you learn to play types…

you’re telling us that 450 stat points simply don’t matter?

Ok cool, put your money where your mouth is. Take off your exotic gear and put on a set of rare gear (to roughly a 450 stat loss) and go out and do some solo roaming. Let me know how it goes for you.

A poor comparison, as you’re doing less damage with weapons, taking more from enemy damage from the reduced damage and armor on your gear, on top of the stat boosts. The real comparison is going out with no stacks and fighting someone that has both AF and GL, which is certainly possible. I’ve fought people with both stacks who were using legendary weapons while I had none of those and won. Difference in builds and skill trumps the stat bonus from the buffs.

I have so many alts I actively play on that many of them aren’t fully geared properly. That means running with green amulets and incomplete runes/sigils. Don’t even get me started on ascended stuff. I go roaming indiscriminatingly with them, and bad players still die and I still die to good players. The extra edge the extra stats give me really wouldn’t have made any difference to any of the duels I normally have, none of them were so close that an extra 1k worth of damage or 1k healtth would’ve decided the battle. That’s the kind of stats bonus you’re talking about.

The only thing that might be vaguely OP is applied fortitude on a guardian, the 2.5k extra health is a fairly significant % of overall health, and you DO have the means to constantly reheal back to full health in the middle of a fight. In addition, the padding is extra protection against condition damage, which is usually what eats through a guardian eventually.

Kaos.9162:

Lorelei.3918:

So all you learn to play types…

you’re telling us that 450 stat points simply don’t matter?

Ok cool, put your money where your mouth is. Take off your exotic gear and put on a set of rare gear (to roughly a 450 stat loss) and go out and do some solo roaming. Let me know how it goes for you.

A poor comparison, as you’re doing less damage with weapons, taking more from enemy damage from the reduced damage and armor on your gear, on top of the stat boosts. The real comparison is going out with no stacks and fighting someone that has both AF and GL, which is certainly possible. I’ve fought people with both stacks who were using legendary weapons while I had none of those and won. Difference in builds and skill trumps the stat bonus from the buffs.

I have so many alts I actively play on that many of them aren’t fully geared properly. That means running with green amulets and incomplete runes/sigils. Don’t even get me started on ascended stuff. I go roaming indiscriminatingly with them, and bad players still die and I still die to good players. The extra edge the extra stats give me really wouldn’t have made any difference to any of the duels I normally have, none of them were so close that an extra 1k worth of damage or 1k healtth would’ve decided the battle. That’s the kind of stats bonus you’re talking about.

The only thing that might be vaguely OP is applied fortitude on a guardian, the 2.5k extra health is a fairly significant % of overall health, and you DO have the means to constantly reheal back to full health in the middle of a fight. In addition, the padding is extra protection against condition damage, which is usually what eats through a guardian eventually.

Wow. Arguing that stats don’t matter because you beat someone with a build that was a hard counter to the other guys build therefor stats are irrelevant.

Just wow.

I’ve beaten bads with my uplevel too. Yes build and skill are more important by a order of magnitude.

But for anyone who made it out of high school with decent grades, you should know about the scientific method. You test variables one at a time.

So holding skill, and build constant, then yes stats do matter. In a pitched fight, between equal skilled players with equally good builds, stats would decide that match. Yes in reality the match will probably be decided by a misclick or lag or some other stupid thing…

but to say it never happens is to say you have fought nothing but total blow outs or devastating losses and never had one fight come down to the last HP. I don’t know about you but that happens to me a lot. I can even look back at the fight and realize that had I just remembered to eat my food for that fight, I would have won it.

THAT is the difference these stats make, and it is infuriating to lose to someone simply because they’ve played more hours then you on a single character.

With the amount of points needed to get it… I hope it is strong, and I hope it gives some sort of advantages…
As for the “one needs to zerg to get it” thing… Yep, one gets more ranks faster on a “full” server, PvDooring, but ranks can be got without… Yesterday, I decided to get some levels/rank with my uplevels… Got a group of 5, went around doing camps / sentries, somewhat 6 world levels in less than two hours… with pretty much everyone laughing at my mistakes – cause i’m not an “alt” person, and didn’t have a clue about however i’m supposed to play these classes… But we had fun, and all got a few levels… It’s not the end of the world, to get a few ranks, even without zerging (unless you only play scout/defense) it is not that hard to get ranks… but, I repeat, for me, since it is so costly and demands dedication to get, of course, it should be a great advantage – and it is – as it should…

Working as intended

Heta.8629:

Johje Holan.4607:

It’s just another form of imbalance in an aready unbalanced system. And don’t be like Anet and say WvW is not supposed to be balanced, that’s just a dumb response.

WvW is naturally unbalanced yes. There is inherent imbalance in WvW yes. That is what they mean when they say its not supposed to be balanced.

But given the natural imbalance, adding MORE imbalance through add on mechanics and content is counterproductive and absolutely ridiculous. And I can’t believe anyone who actually thinks about it for more than two seconds thinks otherwise.

Anet said WvW isn’t supposed to be balanced. That’s not dumb it’s what the devs want out of this game type. Go fight fair in spvp or in the new arena in the obsidian sanctum when it comes out. I play WvW because it is unbalanced. Arrow cart mastery is brokenly OP when defending so they should remove that. Cata mastery is brokenly OP when catapulting walls so remove that too. People who put in the time should have an advantage. Players also are OP in pve so nerf every class so we can have a fair fight in pve

I stated that Anet said it isn’t supposed to be balanced. And that was a dumb thing to say.

When they said that they were talking about population and “nightcapping”. And they have since realized that it was a dumb thing to say and have backtracked because players finally drilled it into thier thick skulls that the more balanced you can make WvW, the more fun it is for all involved.

And that ’s really the point. The more balance you can achieve in a game or competition, the more fun it is going to be.

Power creep is a problem for the developers to look into for WvW. It’s simply a matter of how things scale. Armor and healing scale poorly, while attack damage scales wonderfully. With every additional point they give us, it shortens fight duration. Which to me, reduces the fun and skill of WvW.

For ranks and the bonus attributes, I’m bothered by the Dev’s decision to make WvW so alt unfriendly. At present, having alts comes with an inherited disadvantage. Not just because of Guard Leech or Applied Fortitude but, all the rank abilities.

Though I am perfectly fine with Guard Leech, Applied Fortitude being a part of WvW. I have to say they do not realy fit in the wvw policy.

Every WvW trait focuses on Getting more dmg on sieges, less dmg from sieges, more dmg against guard, less dmg from guards, bringing more supplies, etc. All these stuff has nothing to do with hand to hand combat which is also a great part of WvW. Before these newer additions you could not really get an advantage by distributing WXP points.

At begining of the game upscaled players had more chance to be a useful part of wvw. Now, due to ascended weapons, trinkets, armors, Guard Leech, Applied Fortitude, consumables. Its getting much easier to win fights with lower numbers if your zerg/team is Buffed up enough with all these stuff.

Is a it a good or bad thing? I don’t know, I always seem to find a way to work with what I got.

Its amazing stat boosting RA abilities existed in DAOC for years without players getting kitten over it….Yet in GW2, you get whine posts from people who think they lost the fight cause of these boosts…

Honestly its the same as the SPvPers whining there is to much AI from Pet classes.

Ok, I’ve only skimmed the second page here, but people are still going back and forth over whether these things are “broken.” Let’s be clear, just because you don’t like grind or vertical progression doesn’t mean that any instance of grind or vertical progression IS broken – it just means you don’t like it. And that’s fine, but they are two separate arguments.

Let’s say that in full exotics / ascended you run around 3000 attack and you hit your average heavy armor opponent for about 600 damage per auto attack. Now you get your 115 ranks invested into guard killer and you get your 5 stacks. Congrats! You have 3100 attack now. What would your damage increase to? Around 620. That’s a 3.3% bonus to damage output.

If you instead had 3500 attack against the same opponent you’d now be hitting for around 700 damage. If you got guard killer at this point and boosted yourself to 3600 attack you’d hit for 720 damage (a 2.86% damage bonus relative to your pre-buff damage).

This leads me to argue that the +100 power is not terribly broken, and certainly shouldn’t make the difference between a new player winning a fight or not so long as they have geared/built properly (which is an issue with or without guard killer).

Let’s look at what +100 condition damage would do for a condition build with 1500 condition damage (I don’t play these types of builds so I have no idea what most of them run) that applies burning/bleeding/poison (let’s say 10 stacks of bleed). With 1500 condition damage, 10 stacks of bleed is 1175 per second, burning is 703 per second, and poison is 234 per second. This provides a total dps of 2112. If you get +100 from guard killer you’re now looking at 1225 from bleeding, 728 from burning, 244 from poison for a total of 2197. That’s a 4.02% bonus from guard killer to your cleans-able condition damage. That’s not looking too broken either, because a 4% damage boost (while useful) should not make or break a new player interested in trying out WvW even in a 1v1.

I’m not sure the best way to deal with the +250 vitality except to restate my argument that it will only really make a noticeable difference for surviving initial spikes. It’s not like having more maximum health provides other benefits than being able to take more damage before you need to heal (since most classes in constant combat will not be healed to full).

You can hate the idea of these trait lines all you want, and you can disagree with their being appropriate for a game that early on promised little to no vertical progression – but calling them brokenly OP is a stretch.

Xsorus.2507:

Its amazing stat boosting RA abilities existed in DAOC for years without players getting kitten over it….Yet in GW2, you get whine posts from people who think they lost the fight cause of these boosts…

Honestly its the same as the SPvPers whining there is to much AI from Pet classes.

What is amazing is that any issue being raised about a mechanic never fails to get people like you coming out explaining that there’s no point even discussing it since the same mechanic was in that other game and we liked it just fine, yessir.

All the pve achievement chasers have higher ranks than me. Having ascended weapons which are a huge deal (don’t let anyone tell you otherwise) combined with higher stats through karma training leaves a very bitter taste in my mouth. I have been playing WvW for almost 1000 hours on my necro and have less to show for it than some pve farmer who put up a birthday bonus and karma trained 1 day. I have no ascended weapons/gear and i dont havent finished getting the PVD karma train buffs. 450 stats for PVD karma train… and people on here defending it PVD reward from already decided thursday matches!?!?!?. A bunch more stats for PVE fractals and farming…. And people have the nerve to come on and say “No big deal”…L2Math guys.

The people on here defending these buffs are the same people who get angry at us on our own server when we ruin the karma train by wiping the enemy karma train…This kind of PVD achievement stat creep is killing wvw. Our own frigging team is telling us not to kill the enemy so they can get their shinies on all their alts…A disgrace to WvW. And the fact that you can buy WXP boosters for stat increases is nothing short of P2W (Pay to win). Come on people and wake up… Too much carrot-chasing makes bad pvp… Is it really necessary or strategically important for a queued map to kill the worm or harpy? Nope but yet you see it all the time. Wake up guys

Both these buffs are just fine considering the amount of WXP they require.

The only change I would make to them is to spread out acquiring of the stacks. So that for example you get 1 stack at rank 2, second stack at rank 5, etc. Not give all 5 at the top.

This would help the balance quite a bit.

Tongku.5326:

Both these buffs are just fine considering the amount of WXP they require.

The only change I would make to them is to spread out acquiring of the stacks. So that for example you get 1 stack at rank 2, second stack at rank 5, etc. Not give all 5 at the top.

This would help the balance quite a bit.

Saying that being unbalanced is fine because it is grindy is nonsense.

The issue is that it’s something like 100 hours between someone having that buff and not and that’s the only difference.

Seriously, someone that gets the game and wants to WvW:
~80 hours to get to level 80
~50+ gold to get exotic gear (assuming you don’t buy expensive runes or sigils and if you want some divine gear, you’re in a lot of trouble, my friend!)
~weeks of guild missions to get ascended junk
~months of laurels to get more ascended junk
~hundreds of gold to craft ascended weapons
~who the hell knows what we’ll have to crawl through to get ascended armour

Hell, when is this person ever going to get to do WvW let alone do it as an equal crafting and farming all this crap?

’Cause on top of that

~100 hours to get these buffs before he can even start looking at the other interesting WvW skills

By the end of this year, what is the difference going to be between someone that’s a fresh exotic gear 80 and someone that’s fully geared with every buff? 30%? 50%? Last thing this game needs is some stat-stacked kittens goin “Ha-ha! My damage, hit points, armour are all 1.5x yours! I am so good at the game”.

You want fresh and healthy PvP communities, don’t gate them so hard. Creating separate WvW builds, making separate WvW gear, and buying consumables regularly is enough of a bother when switching from PvE to WvW, don’t add a wall of grind on top of it.

I repeat. For the love of all that’s good and holy, don’t a wall of grind on top of it.

Daoc was a great game and the rvr was the best ever. The RA gates were huge there. They are trivial here.

When wvw points reset I placed 10 points in supply mastery and then put the rest into defense vs guards until I got applied fortitude. That was fun… no, not really— but of course I play more than 1 character in wvw so I don’t deserve to have anything else fun.

What do the other traits do? :p