Guild Wars 2

FourTwenty.4268:

Bunzy.8674:

If you want I can get video/picture proof of how much it hits me for, i can also get proof of a thief build that can kill me in 0.5-1 second.

well now you’re just being silly. but thank you, i can disregard all your other posts because you just have no idea what you’re talking about lol

I am getting a video of this.. so be prepared to eat your words.

amiable.4823:

Nilgoow.1037:

When did 5k become a lot of damage? I guess if you have 1700 armor (or was it defense? or maybe toughness?) then that would seem like a lot.

It’s a lot of damage when it can be applied every 0.8 seconds and there is no way to kite. Damage is fine if there were realistic escape options.

My guardian drops AOE 6k bombs every 4 seconds in addition to my AOE autoattack.

Thats 30kdmg on one hit to a group of 5.

My thief cant do that much dmg that fast unless im using slow as cluster bombs which are easily dodged

CRrabbit.1284:

Why ppl still complain about thief?
In MMO history there is NO success sample for stealth class to get well balanced.
It’s simply mission impossible due to its mechanism.
Thief can only be either TOP or BOTTOM. Right now thief is on top, but some day a certain patch comes, thief will become underdog. This is what happened in all MMOs and will happened in GW2 soon.

But thieves are not on top. I see a lot of people in here blaming thief stealth when they have perfectly good counters. Take the d/d ele who was complaining – you are nearly a hard counter to a stealth thief even if played poorly. You are more mobile and have near constant self heal and condition removal. Thief goes stealth > lightning 3, watch them stun themselves on the bs attempt. Follow with lt 2 for blind into updraft into rtl into earth 4 knockdown into churning earth. Glass cannon thief is likely half health by now, and cant move. panics and shadow refuge where he either dies from your continued aoe spam in the circle, flees or resets. Either way your lt cooldowns are up again and you do the same thing.

There are plenty of other ways to deal with the stealth mechanic, and yes there are some cases where it is a hard counter to a particular playstyle. My phantasm/shatter mesmer is hard countered by stealth spam due to targeting requirements for mesmer abilities and a well played thief can mitigate 70% of my damage that way, but that doesnt mean stealth is OP it just means that this is a game with actual variety in classes. Be careful what you wish for in regards to balance or you may end up with sterile depthless combat balanced for 1v1 where everyone can do the same things, just with different animations like weve seen in other mmos.

Best thing i can recommend is if youre having trouble with thieves just play one for a while and learn its weaknesses.

Rinzler.8072:

My guardian drops AOE 6k bombs every 4 seconds in addition to my AOE autoattack.

Thats 30kdmg on one hit to a group of 5.

But that’s not burst…. a 4 second lag time gives your opponent time to respond. listen I don’t think the solution is nerfing every aspect of the thief, it still needs to be viable to play, but something should give, either:

1. make toughness give better damage reduction/critical protection so it makes it reasonable to survive burst if geared properly, or

2. Increase the re-stealth timer so thieves need to think more carefully when they engaged/don’t have multiple get out of jail free abilities or

3. Remove the jump-to ability from HS (or put it on a 4-6 second cooldown)so it becomes reasonable to kite thieves.

Any of those relatively minor changes would go a long way on balancing things out.

papacooldown.9482:

Best thing i can recommend is if you’re having trouble with thieves just play one for a while and learn its weaknesses.

Best advice in this whole thread.

I hope AN is paying attention to this. No matter how much more you nerf thieves, you’ll always have guys like these.

Highest dps, best mobility, stealth. All in one class. Broken.

All I see in this thread is whining and people saying you can’t knock/pull thieves out of stealth which is a lie. Anyone who is having problems with thief in it’s current state, and those who will continue to have problems with thief after culling is fixed.. l2p, change your setup ,get over yourself.

amiable.4823:

Rinzler.8072:

My guardian drops AOE 6k bombs every 4 seconds in addition to my AOE autoattack.

Thats 30kdmg on one hit to a group of 5.

But that’s not burst…. a 4 second lag time gives your opponent time to respond. listen I don’t think the solution is nerfing every aspect of the thief, it still needs to be viable to play, but something should give, either:

1. make toughness give better damage reduction/critical protection so it makes it reasonable to survive burst if geared properly, or

2. Increase the re-stealth timer so thieves need to think more carefully when they engaged/don’t have multiple get out of jail free abilities or

3. Remove the jump-to ability from HS (or put it on a 4-6 second cooldown)so it becomes reasonable to kite thieves.

Any of those relatively minor changes would go a long way on balancing things out.

Dodge is your friend, blind is your friend, snare is your friend… learning your class “skipping the last word for now”

I know what you mean Bunzy, and I’m pretty sure I know which thief you are talking about since I was with you a bit yesterday (playing as a thief). What I find is that there are a lot of full on burst thieves who will down you and there isn’t a whole lot you can do under realistic circumstances.

Being a D/D as you are, you are used to aggroing several people at once and that is the perfect situation for these bursty thieves using heartseeker. They just have to come in pop their quickness and 2-2-2-2-2 to victory. Even if you dodge roll a few of them you are likely dead. Realistically you won’t have your lightning shield up, and you will be in mid fight form without access to a few key cooldowns.

The damage is a lot, but with heartseeker damage that high they have backstabs that do even more, or steals with a little less. The damage is just a result of being full on burst. Is it too much? I don’t personally feel it is because they die a lot more than they successfully kill/stomp in group settings. You will almost never find those heartseeker spammers fighting outnumbered and for good reason — they die.

Columba.9730:

Highest dps, best mobility, stealth. All in one class. Broken.

Yeah that was maybe a few months back. Now, with the exception of stealth, warriors overtake theives by far in mobility and damage.

Freaking hilarious, so many people crying about thieves, but most of the times it sooo gives the feel they don’t even play them themselves, at least to see if the nonsense they’re typing is actually true.

Thieves have the biggest burst, best single target CC, uh sure, but thieves have to CHOSE what they take. Either they go for assassination signet and quickness to have burst, or they go for blinding powder and the agility signet to have double blind. You can’t have both. If you go path 1, you burst and after that you’re squishy as hell. Or you go path 2 and your burst is non existant, you’ll have a hard hitting opener, but your victory will be about making sure you survive long enough for the CD to end on your next big damaging attack.

Complaining about heartseeker spamming is stupid, cause peeps who spam heartseeker are newbs who’ll fail against anyone with a brain, cause using heartseeker over 50% is a complete waste of initiative, the damage you do above 50% is about the same as any other attack, between 25-50% it’s a bit better, it only shines if you toss it on someone as a finisher below 25% health. Learn to either CC, or heal up as soon as a thief opens up on you, so that their massive opener isn’t followed by an attack that will bring you to the danger zone of heartseeker.

As for stealthing to heal up and return… Sorry but that’s bollocks, a thief doesn’t need to stealth to heal up, their instant heal just has a stealth effect to it.

And what most people don’t get, some “single target” abilities can be spammed without a target and somehow actually search for a target if you don’t have 1, and that can include stealthed targets. Although it’s usually melee abilities. If a thief around you stealthed, just spam an ability that will either make you aoe or swing a weapon into the air, big chance you’re actually attacking the thief that just stealthed on you for 1-2 more seconds before he ran out of range. I’ve actually killed a few thieves that way, pop they go stealth and 3 seconds later a downed thief reappeared in the spot i was swinging my weapon.

Columba.9730:

Highest dps, best mobility, stealth. All in one class. Broken.

Sigh. Columba. Is Thief now the new EZMode ?

They have low HP, 2-3 moderate crits drop them already. You can dodge their cloak and dagger, making them waste lots of initiative, which hurts those setups more than anything, especially if you’re dealing with HS spammers that are just plain boring.

Yes, a well-played thief can own, but so can any other class if it’s well played.

Best advice was still to roll one yourself, learn the strengths and weaknesses, learn how their mechanics work and you’ll know how to counter them.

Heartseeker is only dangerous whenever you have <25% health. Before then, thief has a lot better damage options. The fact that people keep acting like Heartseeker can do 6k damage (not even a lot) at any given time, no matter what without any prerequisites is asinine. If you’re dying to Heartseeker spam, you are bad. That’s it.

As for people who think Toughness needs to be better, you have no idea the state of the game right now, do you? Bunker builds dominating tPvP. We should totally buff them. You should join the balance team.

Thief has neither the highest DPS nor the best mobility, by the way.

Bunzy.

How many knock down skills do you have. 2?

How many dots do you have? Gazillion?

Thieves are nothing, You’ll get over it for a week then complain about something else.

Bunzie quotes.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Downed-State-needs-changes/first#post908557

I am sorry but if you die to a glass cannon build it is totally your fault.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Trouble-With-Elementalists/first#post792127

D/D is a counter to Melee thief, stealth and run away is my best advice.

You can go through the rest yourself.

I find Bunzy talking about thieves hilarious. (Or anyone for that matter)

I have both a DD ele and a glass cannon thief.

I kill DD eles on my thief. I kill thieves on my DD ele.

Therefore, this must be a question of skill. Hmm Bunzy?

jaegerx.1693:

Bunzie quotes.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Downed-State-needs-changes/first#post908557

I am sorry but if you die to a glass cannon build it is totally your fault.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Trouble-With-Elementalists/first#post792127

D/D is a counter to Melee thief, stealth and run away is my best advice.

You can go through the rest yourself.

I’m pretty sure he’s also posted about portals and such as well. The question is: what will he post about next?

amiable.4823:

Nilgoow.1037:

When did 5k become a lot of damage? I guess if you have 1700 armor (or was it defense? or maybe toughness?) then that would seem like a lot.

It’s a lot of damage when it can be applied every 0.8 seconds and there is no way to kite. Damage is fine if there were realistic escape options.

you act like it can be spammed forever. initiative doesn’t last forever

hoschi.8693:

Columba.9730:

Highest dps, best mobility, stealth. All in one class. Broken.

Sigh. Columba. Is Thief now the new EZMode ?

They have low HP, 2-3 moderate crits drop them already. You can dodge their cloak and dagger, making them waste lots of initiative, which hurts those setups more than anything, especially if you’re dealing with HS spammers that are just plain boring.

Yes, a well-played thief can own, but so can any other class if it’s well played.

Best advice was still to roll one yourself, learn the strengths and weaknesses, learn how their mechanics work and you’ll know how to counter them.

I can’t dodge what I can’t see. Because of the culling bug, we never see them.

^^ Especially if he would dodge that, which is veeeery easy if it’s spammed… Not that it’s difficult in the first place

Columba.9730:

I can’t dodge what I can’t see. Because of the culling bug, we never see them.

That would only be true for the first heartseeker, not subsequent ones, and let’s not talk about opening with HS out of stealth.

So you just stand there and let them pound you ? Get damage from an invisible foe and never once try to dodge away at all ? I mean.. this isn’t Aion. You actually CAN and SHOULD dodge…

hoschi.8693:

^^ Especially if he would dodge that, which is veeeery easy if it’s spammed… Not that it’s difficult in the first place

He’s an ele too, he could go mist form or teleport.

hoschi.8693:

Columba.9730:

I can’t dodge what I can’t see. Because of the culling bug, we never see them.

That would only be true for the first heartseeker, not subsequent ones, and let’s not talk about opening with HS out of stealth.

So you just stand there and let them pound you ? Get damage from an invisible foe and never once try to dodge away at all ? I mean.. this isn’t Aion. You actually CAN and SHOULD dodge…

Why on earth would you open anything with Heart Seeker, much less blow your backstab and/or 100% crit by doing so from stealth?

That was exactly my point… those thieves are bad and if you die to them, well, you deserve it At least they didn’t backstabbed you for 10k

Guys, guys, relax! Chill!

You don’t have to play other classes, just play thief. That’s what I did after it was apparent that thief is exempted from class balance.

Seriously, got to level 15 without using any trait points, or unlocking any additional skills. In fact, I still haven’t unlocked any skills or spent any trait points. All you need to do is bang your head in the general direction of whatever you’ve bound Heartseeker to. I bound it to my wall, so there is very little chance of me losing any battle, as its unlikely that I would miss the wall. If you’re losing as a thief, its probably because you missed the object you bound the skill to.

Alas, my doctor says I should stop playing thief, apparently its giving me brain damage.

If I stay on topic, I have to say I disagree about Heartseeker damage. I don’t even have a thief.

My problems with the thief?

- ANY profession, immune to stopping a stomp (finishing off a downed player) should have that changed – especially stealth while stomping.

- Stealth should have a diminishing cooldown after used once.

- Culling should be properly fixed in relation to the thief class

I don’t think thieves should be damage-nerfed at all. Otherwise, their class becomes too weak.

Seriously if you are dying from HS spam thieves or BS thieves with a d/d ele , you are doing something wrong.

you have so many skills that can stop their burst after the first hit its not even funny.

As long as you are paying attention, there is no reason to die to one.

One possibility is that you are running damage utilities like arcane blasts and such, but when you start running cantrip survival skills you will never ever die to a HS or BS thief 1v1

hoschi.8693:

Columba.9730:

I can’t dodge what I can’t see. Because of the culling bug, we never see them.

That would only be true for the first heartseeker, not subsequent ones, and let’s not talk about opening with HS out of stealth.

So you just stand there and let them pound you ? Get damage from an invisible foe and never once try to dodge away at all ? I mean.. this isn’t Aion. You actually CAN and SHOULD dodge…

Sure I do dodge. However, I can only dodge so many times. I still can’t see the thief during the entire fight. I constantly move and turn. Still get hit with high damage repeatedly from an invisible enemy. How is this balanced?

I’ve also heard thieves eat their babies.

Just throwing that out there.

@Columba

it seems your issue is with Cloak and Dagger —> Backstab —> Cloak and Dagger … and the culling due to the very short period of “unstealthing” for hitting Backstab.

Those high damage numbers are composed by
a) 100% crit chance while attacking in stealth
b) double-damage from backstab while hitting from behind

Either you should play a CnD stabby yourself, or check the skill descriptions of the ones I mentioned. It should show you how that thief moves to maximize the damage potential, and in turn should show YOU how to move to prevent that from happening.

I would agree with this thread if it was titled: Heartseeker: That Range.

It is absolutely unnecessary for a 3 init spammable damage dealer should have 450 range. S/X only has Infiltrator’s Strike which has a 600 range shadow-step every 12 seconds.

I got BS’d by some scrub with Mug-C&D-BS; no sweat, I withdrawl (healed) and rolled for init. out of the way, yet this idiot spammed his way to me in seconds after I blew two major CD’s and hit me for pretty good damage because the damage he had already inflicted.

Compounded by the fact that it can be spammed as an escape with no target (where S/X infiltrator strike needs a target or else you wasted your SS) I think this ability needs a major nerf to it’s gap closer. No more than 300 range, and that’s still pretty far for what it is…

Okay im getting sick of people saying Thieves are OP. Thieves are meant to be unbeatable 1v1, read the in game description about them, it mentions they are the best for 1v1. I play a thief and i get ate up easily if i go against a group of enemies. Usually if im running with the zerg i pull out my Shortbow and spam long ranged spells. If people knew how to face a thief everything would be okay, but they dont. Example, if thief goes invis with Shadow refuge spell, use your aoe attack in the circle the thief created. Thief is dead within a few seconds. Im sick and tired of people complaining about thiefs, they are perfect how they are, and they are meant to do the most damage out of any class because they are squishy.

sceptus.9415:

- 1) ANY profession, immune to stopping a stomp (finishing off a downed player) should have that changed – especially stealth while stomping.

- 2) Stealth should have a diminishing cooldown after used once.

- 3) Culling should be properly fixed in relation to the thief class

1) This is pretty funny. Every class has a way to stomp without interruption, save from stomping a Thief (although teleports work), Elementalist, or Mesmer.

Let’s just go through the list, shall we?

Elementalist: Can stomp in Mist Form or with Stability, completely invulnerable in Mist Form
Guardian: Can stomp with Stability, immune to CC, still takes damage
Mesmer: Can stomp with both Distortion and stealth, completely invulnerable with Distortion, can still be interrupted while in stealth
Thief: Can stomp in stealth
Ranger: Can stomp with Stability, although I wouldn’t recommend it, as it requires an elite
Warrior: Can stomp with Stability or Invulnerability
Necromancer: Can stomp with Stability
Engineer: Can get Stability or Stealth from Toss Elixir S, unsure if they can stomp with Elixir S itself

So, in actuality, stealth is the weakest form of stomping. Invulnerability is obviously the best, with Stability in second. Immune to CC is better than just not being visible. Nerf all classes, buff all downed states. Downed states aren’t OP enough yet.

2) It already does. Revealed keeps thieves from going back into stealth for three seconds.

3) Completely irrelevant to the thief class. This is the game as a whole. All classes that can stealth or all abilities that teleport you quickly can abuse the culling glitch. Stealth is not a thief-only mechanic.

The thief in GW2 is the most overpowered class in any MMO ever. The reason they implemented a class like the thief in this otherwise brilliantly thought out game must be that it allows people with zero hand eye coordination or any other computer related skills to compete with players who have actual skill. Playing a thief you can become victorious by smashing your fist at the keyboard and that’s what 99% of the thieves out there seems to be doing. There is nothing else to it. The “skilled” ones throw in steal in the beginning of the fight. The close to perma stealth ability the class has allows it to escape every single fight without ever fearing death which in Anet’s eyes is balanced since it has little impact on sPvP. SPvP is all Anet cares about because they have a dream that GW2 will become a huge successful e-sport. I’m guessing they haven’t even thought about the impact this has on WvW.

Re: Krathalos

Don’t forget that thieves, engineers, warriors, and rangers have easy access to quickness.

Still, mesmers probably do win the stomp game, with up to 4 seconds of invulnerability, stealth, time warp, as well as two kinds (blink and portal) of teleportation stomp, all of which can be worked into a single fully viable build. Oh, and we also have a stability mantra and a couple (random) aegis options if you’re into that.

BMW.2951:

Okay im getting sick of people saying Thieves are OP. … If people knew how to face a thief everything would be okay, but they dont.

For the topic, I hate to address anything with thieves until the culling / rendering situation is handled.

What I can’t stand though is the argument I just quoted. Why is it always the defense of the strong class that other folks just don’t know the secret to beating them. Are we to believe the manual on how to kill said OP class wasn’t handed out with the rest of them? People don’t seem to have much trouble figuring out everyone else, so what is it that makes this particular class so difficult to understand?

If it’s blatantly more difficult to “solve” one class than the others, does that not basically prove there is a balance issue?

Mister Mustard.7203:

BMW.2951:

Okay im getting sick of people saying Thieves are OP. … *If people knew how to face a thief everything would be okay, but they dont. *

For the topic, I hate to address anything with thieves until the culling / rendering situation is handled.

What I can’t stand though is the argument I just quoted. Why is it always the defense of the strong class that other folks just don’t know the secret to beating them. Are we to believe the manual on how to kill said OP class wasn’t handed out with the rest of them? People don’t seem to have much trouble figuring out everyone else, so what is it that makes this particular class so difficult to understand?

If it’s blatantly more difficult to “solve” one class than the others, does that not basically prove there is a balance issue?

I’m surprised you didn’t quote the best part of his post.

BMW.2951:

Thieves are meant to be unbeatable 1v1.

Fiction.6418:

Dodge is your friend, blind is your friend, snare is your friend… learning your class “skipping the last word for now”

Yes, because that lets me live a whole 4 seconds longer when they instantly teleport to me. If they get into trouble they will just stealth for a bit and come back all over again. I am well aware of how to use the dodge and blind/knockdown/snare mechanics. (It takes a bit to retarget as well becasue tab targetting in this game is wretched).

/shrug Stick your head in the sand, I’ve played MMO’s since EQ 1, thieves are going to get the nerf bat. It just can’t stand in the current state of play… Whether it is a hard hit or a soft one depends on how realistic the community is.

Honestly, learn to play the game and use counters. Failing that take it to the thief section where there are entire threads where you can indulge yourself in a massive whine fest for failing to understand how the game and the individual classes work.

Thief has been nerfed three times, get over yourselves.

LOL not many of you guys played Aion (before the Sin fix) or Warhammer (before the WE fix) did you?

Aion I had a 30(?I think)sec stealth on a 2min cooldown and a 5min stealth on a 3min cooldown. I could roam around PERMA STEALTHED and kill whoever I wanted. IN a second. YOU COULD DO NOTHING. You would be stunned, in the air and getting killed so fast – all you could do was alt tab and go to the forums and complain.

Warhammer – my WE rr70 (before it was easy.. in the first 3months) I had a long stealth (can’t remember how long exactly) and with the venoms? Forget about it – you were done for.

In those games, I could see how you guys could complain. Aion no stun breaks + long perma stealth. Warhammer – Stuns and venoms with long stealth. This game? 3seconds of stealth – you all act like this is your first MMO.
With culling – yes that does come out to about 4 maybe 5 but there are counters.

Some of them rely on your skill (dd eles are very hard counters) Some of them require you to use ur brain.

Beat culling: Angle the camera somewhat downwards and press tab you can’t SEE the thief but you can target him and see the red kinda circle where he is.
beat backstab: DODGE! Some of you people don’t even TRY to avoid the first hit. You stand there. Activate a Shield skill, wait 1/2 a sec and cast something that does AOE blind something.

Like the guy said above me: The Thief has been nerfed 3 times. Deal with it.

BMW.2951:

Okay im getting sick of people saying Thieves are OP. Thieves are meant to be unbeatable 1v1, read the in game description about them, it mentions they are the best for 1v1. I play a thief and i get ate up easily if i go against a group of enemies. Usually if im running with the zerg i pull out my Shortbow and spam long ranged spells. If people knew how to face a thief everything would be okay, but they dont. Example, if thief goes invis with Shadow refuge spell, use your aoe attack in the circle the thief created. Thief is dead within a few seconds. Im sick and tired of people complaining about thiefs, they are perfect how they are, and they are meant to do the most damage out of any class because they are squishy.

Show us all where they said that thieves are meant to be unbeatable 1:1.

amiable.4823:

/shrug Stick your head in the sand, I’ve played MMO’s since EQ 1, thieves are going to get the nerf bat. It just can’t stand in the current state of play… Whether it is a hard hit or a soft one depends on how realistic the community is.

Excuse me, Mr. MMO Professional. Thieves were already nerfed. A lot, actually. Thief burst isn’t any higher than other classes’ burst.

@subtle
other game being unbalanced means nothing about how balanced this game is. also, i am sure u have time to…turn ur camera downward to try and tab for a thief while ur getting bursted. tabbing to a cull thief works, but tab targeting just fails a good thief is 2 mobile for u to try and turn the camera to tab him through culling most of the time.

theres an annoying issue with ele that because we have 4 attunements, the skill we need to counter a stealth thief popping on u isnt usually available immediately. with a thief burst sometimes u just get unlucky and basically splat before u can realiably respond.

issue mainly with thief right now is mainly culling. if that is…ever fixed we might actually notice their high burst isnt nearly as big an issue since u would have like 200% more time then u do now to kill them.

Krathalos.3461:

amiable.4823:

/shrug Stick your head in the sand, I’ve played MMO’s since EQ 1, thieves are going to get the nerf bat. It just can’t stand in the current state of play… Whether it is a hard hit or a soft one depends on how realistic the community is.

Excuse me, Mr. MMO Professional. Thieves were already nerfed. A lot, actually. Thief burst isn’t any higher than other classes’ burst.

Well, good then you are getting used to it! I will be happy to wager you, say a gold in game (I’m poor), that thieves will get nerfed again within two months time (by Feb 10th). I’m not saying it to make you upset, I’m saying it because I’ve seen plenty of OP classes in the past make the same arguments you are. They will honestly probably get nerfed far worse then they should (devs always over-compensate).

sceptus.9415:

- ANY profession, immune to stopping a stomp (finishing off a downed player) should have that changed – especially stealth while stomping.

There are two professions that can do invulnerability stomps, neither of them are thief. There are several professions which can do stability stomps, thieves cannot realistically do so.

Yes, thieves can stealth stomp, which of the three “special stomps” is the weakest and easiest to counter.

Rinzler.8072:

Why would anyone play a thief if they removed the current stealth mechanic?

I play a thief without using stealth (heal stealth is an exception) and I’m capable enough of putting people in their place. I play a thief because I find its abilities are fun using Dual Dagger & Short Bow combination. Great versatility in melee and range both coupled with escape abilities. I did try the warrior class but I just couldn’t get into it from the get-go like I did with the thief.

If they are going to make it deal so much damage they should make it like 100 blades where you can’t move while using it.

Columba.9730:

Highest dps, best mobility, stealth. All in one class. Broken.

Learn the game before flaming.There are some acceptable some unacceptable flames but this is the only fail and knowledgeless one.

Highest dps = Glass cannon Warrior
Best mobility : D/D Elementalists (do not mix escape mechanics with mobility)
Stealth : Yes Thieves have repeatable stealths but they are not the only one with stealth ability.

papacooldown.9482:

But thieves are not on top. I see a lot of people in here blaming thief stealth when they have perfectly good counters. Take the d/d ele who was complaining – you are nearly a hard counter to a stealth thief even if played poorly. You are more mobile and have near constant self heal and condition removal. Thief goes stealth > lightning 3, watch them stun themselves on the bs attempt. Follow with lt 2 for blind into updraft into rtl into earth 4 knockdown into churning earth. Glass cannon thief is likely half health by now, and cant move. panics and shadow refuge where he either dies from your continued aoe spam in the circle, flees or resets. Either way your lt cooldowns are up again and you do the same thing.

-shortened-

“flees or resets”

Here’s the problem. A hard counter to a thief will only make him flee or reset, not even kill him as long as the thief isn’t stupid. Thus, as the other guy mentioned, the risk vs reward on a thief is broken. As long as you’re good, there is no risk.

Quentin Fields.1295:

Columba.9730:

Highest dps, best mobility, stealth. All in one class. Broken.

Learn the game before flaming.There are some acceptable some unacceptable flames but this is the only fail and knowledgeless one.

Highest dps = Glass cannon Warrior
Best mobility : D/D Elementalists (do not mix escape mechanics with mobility)
Stealth : Yes Thieves have repeatable stealths but they are not the only one with stealth ability.

The stealths on the other classes are pitiful and won’t even stack up to 10 seconds unless you spec as a useless stealth mesmer with a torch.

Also, when he says mobility I believe he actually means escape and chase ability.

Columba.9730:

BMW.2951:

Okay im getting sick of people saying Thieves are OP. Thieves are meant to be unbeatable 1v1, read the in game description about them, it mentions they are the best for 1v1. I play a thief and i get ate up easily if i go against a group of enemies. Usually if im running with the zerg i pull out my Shortbow and spam long ranged spells. If people knew how to face a thief everything would be okay, but they dont. Example, if thief goes invis with Shadow refuge spell, use your aoe attack in the circle the thief created. Thief is dead within a few seconds. Im sick and tired of people complaining about thiefs, they are perfect how they are, and they are meant to do the most damage out of any class because they are squishy.

Show us all where they said that thieves are meant to be unbeatable 1:1.

Seconded.