Guild Wars 2

I instruct you to refer to the title.

Do you all think that EotM could cut it on a weekly rotation with the vanilla map and HoT map? Why or why not? Could EotM sub for EBG if they balanced the ppt on EotM?

Do you think the added gimmicks of EotM would harm the WvW game?

Does EBG or EotM do a better job of enabling meaningful open field encounters?

Which map has better longevity for player interest?

The issue isn’t so much the PPT..its the rewards. EOTM is FLOODED with people only interested in farming mats or leveling up there alts. Only a small portion of people actualy go there in an attempt for a WvW like experience. If there was a way to swap maps while keeping the farmers seperated from the WvWlders for a week id be more than okay with trying it as a test.

However if EOTM became the center map for a week. Im almost certain the majority of WvWlders would NOT be able to enter the zone at all due to ques ramped up by uplevelds and farmers trying to make money.

I am in favour for adding EotM to the WvW map rotation, but never to replace EBG.

Longer explanation (Because I seemingly love walls of text):

First of all I think that EBG forms the core of WvW, and should never ever be replaced or removed. It forms a basis that the rest of the mode is built around, without that map we would lose the focal point of the game-mode. Hmm, difficult to explain exactly what I mean, it’s a bit like cutting the heart out of the mode. (Even though personally I don’t like the map and avoid it).

Secondly I think the EotM map is a very interesting and different map, new concepts, ideas, styles, terrain etc. So it would be great to play on in WvW just for the sake of variation. The map does need a few small changes for balance, notably something about the Scorpion form, and probably more but I’m no expert on the map. But I am very curious how the map would play out in a proper WvW scenario with actual PPT over the PvD/Karma-training that the EotM-mode has become so famous for.

One main concern is the sheer size of it, it would dwarf the existing Borderlands, so replacing a borderland with EotM could become problematic, as one server would have that much more to defend. There is also the fact that a lot of people hate it on sheer principle because they associate it with the EotM-mode and would just flat out avoid it (and rather go to other maps, could make it easier for you to defend it, or harder for you to defend it as team mates refuse to stay). There is also the fact that many people just hate the instant death drops everywhere, and would just leave the map. From what I hear on the forums, Badlands need some help as it is supposed to be the weakest side on the map, but I really don’t know (Give it to green).

Edit: Good point about the rewards, I thought of them as part of the EotM mode and not as inherently in the map. Hmm, if we said the rewards stuck with the mode and not the map, then everything I said above still stands from my pov.

eotm cannot replace a BL for the simple reason that the spawn for each side is already within a keep. If you want the eotm map to become a BL map, then it needs to be changed first.

I see no reason why the map of EotM couldn’t be rotated with the EB map layout from time to time (maybe in a 3 way rotation with the new HoT map). IMO it would only need the center aetherblade section to be converted into some kind of capture point. An open capture point worth the same as Stonemist would be hella fun to try and defend, maybe something like 3 caps within that all have to be controlled to take and aetherblade vets converting to your faction when you hold all 3 to help with the defense.

ANET could leave the current version of the EotM map to function as a the overflow map for karma level farmers so I don’t see how the map itself would cause people to play stupidly. If the EotM map layout was in the EB map position WvW players would defend their keeps and it would become an entirely different dynamic. EotM can actually be pretty fun when you comms on all three sides going at it for the fights but for sure would want the option to WvW elsewhere from time to time or the choice to hit the borderlands for a break from fear of falling and stability builds.

EotM in the wvw rotation would be bad IMO. Blue keep could never be capped, red keep would be very easy to cap and the green side would have a huge advantage for map movement/scouting from the Altar…

Nate.3927:

eotm cannot replace a BL for the simple reason that the spawn for each side is already within a keep. If you want the eotm map to become a BL map, then it needs to be changed first.

what? the spawns are definitely not inside of a keep

I think it would be great to put the EotM map in rotation. In fact, do it now before the expansion comes out.

Only tweaks would be needed. Like make the keeps more balanced. Get rid of all the breakable walls in the Red Keep, etc.

They don’t need to keep all the rewards an NPC’s either. I don’t really care about the NPC’s but the rewards would be the same as any other map in WvW proper.

No, and I know people would leave GW2 over it if it happened, it is far too linear of a map. People want to be killed more by players, not falling off the world. People want to be creative with commanding and be able to choose what they attack, when and where. being able to attack anything from any point is much better game play and adds a level of unpredictability that is lacking in linear maps like this.

lil devils x.6071:

No, and I know people would leave GW2 over it if it happened, it is far too linear of a map.

This is why I don’t want it to replace EBG. EBG is to important for the mode and a huge part of the players. Even my server have people that near refuse to leave EBG, and we’re a very roaming heavy server with very little zerging.

But yes, putting EotM in instead of a single Borderland would cause problems with the “home map” system. Which is also part of why I suggested in another thread to remove the “home map” idea, so we could have more variety in the the three non EBG maps.

But yes, make a slight change to the existing Borderland map so its a stand alone single map, and then put in EotM as a second map, and the new Ziggurat map as a third for example. And naturally EBG in the middle. I think that would be a really fun week.

joneirikb.7506:

lil devils x.6071:

No, and I know people would leave GW2 over it if it happened, it is far too linear of a map.

This is why I don’t want it to replace EBG. EBG is to important for the mode and a huge part of the players. Even my server have people that near refuse to leave EBG, and we’re a very roaming heavy server with very little zerging.

But yes, putting EotM in instead of a single Borderland would cause problems with the “home map” system. Which is also part of why I suggested in another thread to remove the “home map” idea, so we could have more variety in the the three non EBG maps.

But yes, make a slight change to the existing Borderland map so its a stand alone single map, and then put in EotM as a second map, and the new Ziggurat map as a third for example. And naturally EBG in the middle. I think that would be a really fun week.

We need MORE maps where you can attack from any direction though is the issue, with better landscape for large battles like EBG. . It is the landscape of the map that is the issue as to how the map actually plays, on BL you spend more time running around than actually in the action. Right now EoTM with it’s mega server would be ideal for GvG battles because guilds could fight so many more guilds from different servers that way.. but they don’t do that. You know why? The landscape is horrible for GvG , too much PVE implemented and it is just used as a leveling fast map so people can Ktrain. The problem is current wvw lacks more maps with good landscape like EBG, and with EB running the highest ques, people often rather sit in Lion’s arch waiting to go in than go to one of the other maps instead because they hate the landscape of the maps themselves. Anet adding more maps they hate isn’t going to help the situation.

The eotm map sucks. If you had eotm in the rotation during a season when people actually cared about winning it would become superior arrow cart hell and it would be beyond cancerous.

Map is good wvw players bad.

lil devils x.6071:

joneirikb.7506:

lil devils x.6071:

No, and I know people would leave GW2 over it if it happened, it is far too linear of a map.

This is why I don’t want it to replace EBG. EBG is to important for the mode and a huge part of the players. Even my server have people that near refuse to leave EBG, and we’re a very roaming heavy server with very little zerging.

But yes, putting EotM in instead of a single Borderland would cause problems with the “home map” system. Which is also part of why I suggested in another thread to remove the “home map” idea, so we could have more variety in the the three non EBG maps.

But yes, make a slight change to the existing Borderland map so its a stand alone single map, and then put in EotM as a second map, and the new Ziggurat map as a third for example. And naturally EBG in the middle. I think that would be a really fun week.

We need MORE maps where you can attack from any direction though is the issue, with better landscape for large battles like EBG. . It is the landscape of the map that is the issue as to how the map actually plays, on BL you spend more time running around than actually in the action. Right now EoTM with it’s mega server would be ideal for GvG battles because guilds could fight so many more guilds from different servers that way.. but they don’t do that. You know why? The landscape is horrible for GvG , too much PVE implemented and it is just used as a leveling fast map so people can Ktrain. The problem is current wvw lacks more maps with good landscape like EBG, and with EB running the highest ques, people often rather sit in Lion’s arch waiting to go in than go to one of the other maps instead because they hate the landscape of the maps themselves. Anet adding more maps they hate isn’t going to help the situation.

Perhaps I’m not understand what you are saying or what you mean by “linear”.

I would say we don’t need another map where you can attack from any direction. Because what happens is it promotes PvD. If you lose a fight somewhere or fail at taking an asset, well lets just go somewhere else and attack where the enemy isn’t.

We do need a progression. It forces confrontation. It leads to more fighting with other players and less with doors and NPC’s.

That’s why I like the sound of the new map. It sounds like you can’t just run somewhere else and attack an unmanned asset.

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

joneirikb.7506:

lil devils x.6071:

No, and I know people would leave GW2 over it if it happened, it is far too linear of a map.

This is why I don’t want it to replace EBG. EBG is to important for the mode and a huge part of the players. Even my server have people that near refuse to leave EBG, and we’re a very roaming heavy server with very little zerging.

But yes, putting EotM in instead of a single Borderland would cause problems with the “home map” system. Which is also part of why I suggested in another thread to remove the “home map” idea, so we could have more variety in the the three non EBG maps.

But yes, make a slight change to the existing Borderland map so its a stand alone single map, and then put in EotM as a second map, and the new Ziggurat map as a third for example. And naturally EBG in the middle. I think that would be a really fun week.

We need MORE maps where you can attack from any direction though is the issue, with better landscape for large battles like EBG. . It is the landscape of the map that is the issue as to how the map actually plays, on BL you spend more time running around than actually in the action. Right now EoTM with it’s mega server would be ideal for GvG battles because guilds could fight so many more guilds from different servers that way.. but they don’t do that. You know why? The landscape is horrible for GvG , too much PVE implemented and it is just used as a leveling fast map so people can Ktrain. The problem is current wvw lacks more maps with good landscape like EBG, and with EB running the highest ques, people often rather sit in Lion’s arch waiting to go in than go to one of the other maps instead because they hate the landscape of the maps themselves. Anet adding more maps they hate isn’t going to help the situation.

Perhaps I’m not understand what you are saying or what you mean by “linear”.

I would say we don’t need another map where you can attack from any direction. Because what happens is it promotes PvD. If you lose a fight somewhere or fail at taking an asset, well lets just go somewhere else and attack where the enemy isn’t.

We do need a progression. It forces confrontation. It leads to more fighting with other players and less with doors and NPC’s.

That’s why I like the sound of the new map. It sounds like you can’t just run somewhere else and attack an unmanned asset.

Maybe you misunderstand. being able to attack from anywhere means you can cata from all sides, treb from camps and other strategic location.. how would that promote pvd?

The new map sounds like how they have the choke points on EoTM where you have to control that zone to access another part of the map. That does 2 things offensively 1) lets the enemy know where you are ruining any possibility of stealthy movement on the map and 2) Makes it so Roamers are null and void.

Defensively it 1) Removes unpredictability of where they will attack 2)makes it so you can kill box it making it virtually impossible to get through via siege.

Defense is EXTREMELY easy currently and boring already and no one does it because they want personal player loot.

“Towers are located at chokepoints in the new borderland map, and have walls around them that guard those chokepoints, so holding a tower actually helps you control movement in the map.” ~Colin Johanson
http://www.pcgamer.com/guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-interview/#page-1

On populated servers, this means you are going to have that choke point a battle shipped sieged up choke point that is going to be near impossible to get through. No unpredictability.. defense is the easiest part of wvw, not the hard.

Nothing should be unmanned if they are playing the game properly. The problem is they are not rewarding tower scouts and players are resorting to pay them gold to babysit towers.