Guild Wars 2

Every tier seems to have 1 server that completely blows everything out in absurd proportions? Is this caused by bandwagoning or something else?

Are there any tiers/servers that seem to get good matchups worth recommending? Completely crushing the other side is no fun and neither is being able to do absolutely nothing.

Who cares,
Go crazy and have fun.

Justine.6351:

Who cares,
Go crazy and have fun.

Completely crushing the other side with little/no resistance is no fun and neither is not being able to do anything vs overwhelming odds. I’m assuming you read only the title.

Shadow Bane.9362 close matchups are irrevelant WvW was suposed to be big server VS smaller server VS smaller servers, reason green was the winners, blue for 2nd place and 3rd as red color for the smaller and weaker server.

i gues now wvw is fixed. :}

As WvW population drops holes in coverage and population imbalance grow creating more lopsided matches.

And until Anet takes a more proactive stance on balancing population it is only going to get worse.

Shadow Bane.9362:

Justine.6351:

Who cares,
Go crazy and have fun.

Completely crushing the other side with little/no resistance is no fun and neither is not being able to do anything vs overwhelming odds. I’m assuming you read only the title.

Not being able to do anything is a self pity lie.

In the 2 weeks hod fought mag I was playing solo on mags side of ebg while mag was spawn camping the “we can’t do anything” hod players. Talking capping towers/camps/sentries and then defending them for some good clean messy fun.

Players tend to only blob vs. blob, so the bigger blob stomps the whole match-up. Commander coverage is a big factor too.

However, never say there’s nothing you can do. Even if you can’t win a particular week, promoting havoc on your server will push you towards victory in the long term. It doesn’t take a huge population difference for a blob to beat a blob, but it’s nearly impossible for a blob to beat several havoc teams at once when it comes to scoring.

Because some servers are not playing their “tier” which their population is suppose to be balanced to through links.
Look at the matchup this week
Tier 1 = rank 1 3 4
Tier 2 = rank 2 5 11(lol)
Tier 3 = rank 8 9 12
Tier 4 = rank 6 7 10

Between 5th and 12th there’s only about 100 point difference in glicko ratings, so you’re going to see jumps like that.

Caliburn.1845:

As WvW population drops holes in coverage and population imbalance grow creating more lopsided matches.

And until Anet takes a more proactive stance on balancing population it is only going to get worse.

I agree and will add;

When servers are also forced out of their “Tiers” it causes many not to play that week at all.

Links need to be completely dropped and the servers allowed to fall where they will.

Any server without a link is just a target of opportunity for any who do have a link.

Enough of the linking – it failed. Now bring back WvW before it’s completely destroyed.

Justine.6351:

Shadow Bane.9362:

Justine.6351:

Who cares,
Go crazy and have fun.

Completely crushing the other side with little/no resistance is no fun and neither is not being able to do anything vs overwhelming odds. I’m assuming you read only the title.

Not being able to do anything is a self pity lie.

In the 2 weeks hod fought mag I was playing solo on mags side of ebg while mag was spawn camping the “we can’t do anything” hod players. Talking capping towers/camps/sentries and then defending them for some good clean messy fun.

That was a good couple weeks. My server with that “we cant do anything” attitude due to being spawn camped, leaving out the side GASP YOU CAN DO THAT? and taking camps and the occasional tower. Coming back behind the blob thats camping us and taking out 4 or 5, allowing our nay sayers an opportunity to push as after I got 4-5, some chased me (imagine…kitteny groups hate it when you can surprise down a bunch of them solo).

Teef mobility ftw

This is the thing that drives me to not care that my server linking is vs blackgate and where some of my linking is sworn off WvW for the next week or 2, I went in and beat groups of 3-4 and even 7-8 with me and 2 friends

Close matchups are all in the attitude of the server and commanders…and how much you care (o rin my case, not care lol). Server blobbing? See how fast they scatter when a well placed portal bomb from the back happens.

Spawn Camping? All spawn points have more than 1 exit, if you can’t figure that out then thats why you are losing. Communication is key there.

its kind of funny because EU T1, T2 and T3 seems pretty even to me. But of course, still early in the week. Some servers will pull ahead as others give up instead of trying to fight.

When you got a tool that changes the way people think, let me know. I need it. For… uh… scientific purposes… yes thats it.

Xenesis.6389:

Because some servers are not playing their “tier” which their population is suppose to be balanced to through links.
Look at the matchup this week
Tier 1 = rank 1 3 4
Tier 2 = rank 2 5 11(lol)
Tier 3 = rank 8 9 12
Tier 4 = rank 6 7 10

Between 5th and 12th there’s only about 100 point difference in glicko ratings, so you’re going to see jumps like that.

i thought the word tiers died few months ago?
can see the matches?
is there a tier boundary?

now anet have to do is balance the matches per skirmish ofc

even number is even game
except for this one: https://youtu.be/PUnfzWb9huY

more fun now

not bad

Erm, close matchups have always been a rarity in this game, the number of matchups throughout the history of this game where all three servers were close at the end of the week is tiny, as a competitive game mode WvW has always been a bit of a joke.

Caliburn.1845:

As WvW population drops holes in coverage and population imbalance grow creating more lopsided matches.

And until the players take a more proactive stance on balancing population it is only going to get worse.

FTFY

Norbe.7630:

Xenesis.6389:

Because some servers are not playing their “tier” which their population is suppose to be balanced to through links.
Look at the matchup this week
Tier 1 = rank 1 3 4
Tier 2 = rank 2 5 11(lol)
Tier 3 = rank 8 9 12
Tier 4 = rank 6 7 10

Between 5th and 12th there’s only about 100 point difference in glicko ratings, so you’re going to see jumps like that.

i thought the word tiers died few months ago?
can see the matches?
is there a tier boundary?

now anet have to do is balance the matches per skirmish ofc

even number is even game
except for this one: https://youtu.be/PUnfzWb9huY

What are you going on about?

More and more and more I see people standing around in keeps and spawn with commander(s) trying to get things done and asking again and again for help on tag. Prime example today with people hitting two sides of fully upgraded SM. About 10 people hanging around inside red keep, another handful at spawn.

Frankly I believe a lot of this has to do with this huge unbalancing that’s happened mostly due to the current way the score is handled. (don’t ask me for a scoring solution because I don’t have one). I have heard reports of a server or two “sandbagging” to get to lower tiers then pounding the lower servers. 3rd party information with no proof, but it’s being talked about and possible.

People wanted more population on maps and have now got it. They have also got a lot of apathy from many seasoned players as well. ANet, with these reward track changes, has made it so that once people are finished with WvW for the day/night many of them just sit at spawn moving their characters around now and then while the reward track winds down and get all the points they can while doing nothing.. until it’s not worth standing there any longer then they free up a slot on the map.

and so on and so on…

WvW is definitely more broken than before and as the OP says… “are there no close matchups anymore?”. I’ve seen a couple here and there… but mostly as presented, it’s one and sometimes two servers pounding the ‘h’ out of the lower servers with double and sometimes triple points by the end of the week.

Xenesis.6389:

What are you going on about?

because you still define tiers as population, why not define population as population
and balance the linkings based on https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World not “tiers”

forget about tiers for a moment and lets be real, if we want close match ups then population should be balanced

now the tiers can kick in if the population per skirmish is balanced

got it?

before facebook there is a site called friendster in sea unrivaled, then fb made the move and puts icing on its cake that made friendster said:

On June 14, 2015 Friendster, citing “the evolving landscape in our challenging industry” and lack of engagement by the online community, suspended their services.

everyone from friendster bandwaggoned to fb and brought newbies along with them

i hope anet makes that mistake

no cause its trash anyways…..
but do what i do go on to troll people and make them wish they would never play wvw again this is the main fun part of it. STRIKE FIRST STRIKE HARD SHOW NO MERCY!

The inflated numbers are due to PvErs.

Most seasoned vets who played this game mode for the PvP element & honest to god fights have left due to lack of developer focus. The numbers, to which devs allude to when they want to proclaim that the game mode is healthy, remain the same only thanks to the reward tracks bringing in PvE players.

I’ve played WvW for four years now, and one thing I have observed is that the militia is seemingly a lot less intelligent than they were before. I am constantly finding myself fighting alongside people who have not even the most basic grasp of fighting against actual human players. Is it because they are less intelligent? No, but fighting humans for the thrill of the fight and fighting cron scripts for rewards are two very different animals and those players are here only for the latter.

You can see it particularly well when there is no commander on the map. The map can have a queue but if there’s no commander, nothing at all is being accomplished.

Or if you are a commander yourself, do me a favour: the next time you have a squad on you, ask everyone who is carrying siege disablers to ping them. I can guarantee you it will be 2 out of every 10 people at maximum.

They’re not there for the fights, and we can thank Anet for that. The development they’ve done with the “WvW rework” and the work afterwards has been nothing but slapping bandaids over kittenous growth. Trying to play this game mode as a competitive one is like peeling back that bandaid.

Ironically, the biggest problem has always had little to do with map design, but class balance, which isn’t even the purview of the WvW team. They can make whatever maps they want, but if the fights themselves aren’t fun, it won’t make any difference.

Coverage and numbers, are usually the top two reasons why a server in a match-up does the best.

And people I am sure will say, “No dude, it’s great guilds and skilled commanders”, it has and will always be, a coverage and numbers game, if you have the coverage to maintain your ppt, and the numbers to maintain your kdr, you’re golden.

Sure there are skilled guilds out there, but 9 out of 10 times, they’re not contributing towards anything (No offense.) because they’re holding some GvG action somewhere.

What if 2 servers are outnumbered, they are immune to each other attacks but they can hit the other server? I personally don’t like this idea but it is a “solution” I guess? It’s probably not something that’s going to be implemented ever but I’m hoping it ignites another alternative from someone who’s more creative.

Justine.6351:

Shadow Bane.9362:

Justine.6351:

Who cares,
Go crazy and have fun.

Completely crushing the other side with little/no resistance is no fun and neither is not being able to do anything vs overwhelming odds. I’m assuming you read only the title.

Not being able to do anything is a self pity lie.

In the 2 weeks hod fought mag I was playing solo on mags side of ebg while mag was spawn camping the “we can’t do anything” hod players. Talking capping towers/camps/sentries and then defending them for some good clean messy fun.

Nailed it.

Norbe.7630:

because you still define tiers as population, why not define population as population and balance the linkings based on https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World not “tiers”

forget about tiers for a moment and lets be real, if we want close match ups then population should be balanced now the tiers can kick in if the population per skirmish is balanced

got it?

Because they said they balance worlds to the tiers, while it would be nice to balance every world to each other, it’s not possible.

McKenna Berdrow”

Hello everyone,
I know a lot of EU players are asking why Far Shiverpeaks is linked with Whiteside Ridge and Fissure of Woe so I figured I would clear up why this link was made.

Our goal with World Linking is good matches. This doesn’t necessarily mean that worlds in tier 4 are intended to be competitive with worlds in tier 1, but ideally every world in tier 4 should be competitive with the other worlds in tier 4 and likewise every world in tier 1 should be competitive with the other worlds in tier 1. It would be nice if worlds in tier 4 were competitive with tier 1, but it’s not realistic since the distribution of players across worlds is not consistent.

The issue is compounded in EU, due to the fact that we are avoiding linking worlds with different languages. For example, there is only one Spanish world, so they’ll never be linked and thus might never be competitive in tier 1 worlds. Similarly making each set of German worlds have equivalent populations has proved equally impossible because if we were to link them they would have a much higher population than other worlds, making match-ups against them not competitive.

Far Shiverpeaks was linked with two worlds because we needed a third world that would have similar population to the French worlds, specifically Jade Sea and Vizunah Square so that the matchup could be competitive. Far Shiverpeaks, Whiteside, Ridge, and Fissure of Woe linked together gave us the best population to create competitive match-ups for that tier.

It is also important to keep in mind that this is the very first week of match-ups and it will take time before glicko adjusts worlds into their correct tiers.

Obviously it would be great if they could match every world to each other, and they even proposed a plan with adding smaller worlds to add more pieces to the puzzle of linking those worlds together to similar sizes, but the community said no. Also there are still players who prefer lower populations or higher one than the general medium ground.

Now, do you get it?

Choppy.4183:

Justine.6351:

Shadow Bane.9362:

Justine.6351:

Who cares,
Go crazy and have fun.

Completely crushing the other side with little/no resistance is no fun and neither is not being able to do anything vs overwhelming odds. I’m assuming you read only the title.

Not being able to do anything is a self pity lie.

In the 2 weeks hod fought mag I was playing solo on mags side of ebg while mag was spawn camping the “we can’t do anything” hod players. Talking capping towers/camps/sentries and then defending them for some good clean messy fun.

Nailed it.

x2 nailed it.
2-3 players can be more efficient than an entire zerg at times. Hence why individuals should stop complaining and form a havoc or roaming guild, break away from your zerg for once. Yes you’ll get blobbed down and outplayed at times, but really is that anets fault? Put the feelings on the shelf and just play wvw.

The matchups are fair and balanced, please stop spreading “unfounded claims”!

Just lost a tier 3 keep in ebg. Real fun having 30 against 70. Been kitten on all week due to this pairing.

scrap the server rank/tier , make it invisible to players, and randomize the match up … everyone will be happy….

XenesisII.1540:

Because they said they balance worlds to the tiers, while it would be nice to balance every world to each other, it’s not possible.

how come its not possible?
can be more specific bout that?

XenesisII.1540:

Obviously it would be great if they could match every world to each other, and they even proposed a plan with adding smaller worlds to add more pieces to the puzzle of linking those worlds together to similar sizes, but the community said no. Also there are still players who prefer lower populations or higher one than the general medium ground.

Now, do you get it?

who in the low population want that?
WHO

its not a choice for players to want low populations because of lag, its not even the players fault
but i do know one thing, its kitten fault to have that outnumbered buff in the first place

Norbe.7630:

XenesisII.1540:

Because they said they balance worlds to the tiers, while it would be nice to balance every world to each other, it’s not possible.

how come its not possible?
can be more specific bout that?

XenesisII.1540:

Obviously it would be great if they could match every world to each other, and they even proposed a plan with adding smaller worlds to add more pieces to the puzzle of linking those worlds together to similar sizes, but the community said no. Also there are still players who prefer lower populations or higher one than the general medium ground.

Now, do you get it?

who in the low population want that?
WHO

its not a choice for players to want low populations because of lag, its not even the players fault but i do know one thing, its kitten fault to have that outnumbered buff in the first place

Read McKenna’s post and figure it out. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/New-Worlds/first#post6390324

There are people from ET that complained about being shoved into T1 in the first links, there are people every once in a while come to remind us in here they prefer lower population servers because they don’t get blobbed or zerged down. I personally don’t, but they exist. If they want to give a shout out now that would be great, but I’m not going to track every WHO out there, read the forums often and you see what’s going on.

I have played WvW since the games release and here is what i can tell you. These suggestions would be the only real and honest way to balance the game/scoring and match ups.

First.. every server has a prime time window of about 6 hours. The rest of the day (unless your on a stacked server like BG/MAG/JQ you will see a dramatic lack of coverage simply because of the time zone differences.

The only way to alleviate the differences in coverage and scoring during these times would be to close down the servers during off hours (which they would never do) or by simply adding a player cap for all sides allowing equal numbers for all teams on all maps at the same time.

Think of it as a flow regulator in population that lets say.. team 1 has 1 person log in, then team 2 and team 3 are allowed 1 each to enter the match for example.

I know this would be a programming nightmare, but it is honestly the ONLY way they will regulate the population enough to keep off hours even and fair. I know it can be done however.

Honestly, it would be great to see something like this in all hours of the wvw game mode. Players waiting to get in would be shunted to EOTM sort of like a waiting room… which is what it was intended for in the first place.

If all sides have 30 players and 10 log out of team 2 for example.. team 3 and team 1 would get a message that 10 players have 20 seconds to volunteer to move to EOTM or someone will be removed at random. Volunteering would maybe get you a better MF buff or something like it does when a map closes in PVE.

Lets face it.. outmanned never pops when it should.. and any stacked server is going to crush lower servers in any match up, no matter how they change the scoring system.

Look at the 5 4 3 scoring system we have now. It is exactly the same as 3 2 1 which they started changing because it created gaps in scoring that players were not able to overcome.

Right now.. server tiers mean nothing because anet has said there will never be another season, but that hasnt stopped people from using the old adage, if you cant beat them.. join them. Mag, BG and JQ are the most overstacked, well covered band wagon servers in the game and they are almost always open on the world rotation accepting more people and honestly i cant see how this is even possible.

I think these changes would make it a moot point about which server you moved to because entry into wvw is based on participation by all sides using the lowest server as the throttle.

BG/MAG/JQ simply wouldn’t be able to dominate by sheer numbers and i may actually force the game to revert to more skilled play once again. I would love to see this because getting blobbed by 70-80 players when you only have 30 or less on at a given time is just killing wvw for most people right now.

Thoughts?

XenesisII.1540:

Read McKenna’s post and figure it out. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/New-Worlds/first#post6390324

Snip 8<

there are people every once in a while come to remind us in here they prefer lower population servers because they don’t get blobbed or zerged down.

McKenna’s proposal at its core attempts to ceate “Fair & Balanced” Match-Ups by allowing ANet to move players around based on “_______________” please fill in.

Ok…you pointed out that people prefer lower population servers, but I feel that you cited a secondary reason.

I believe one of the Primary reason why most of these eccentric players prefer a lower population server…is for the unique community that used to exist under their care.

World Linking constantly & consistently errodes these unique communities. This WvW ecosystem that took years to develop is constantly under pressure to survive.

World Linking was done to help “Balance” population/match-ups by allowing ANet to move players around to where they were needed to create large scale zerg battles that makes WvW “exciting”.

World Linking worked great in the beginning, but the side effect was that it destroys the small communities within the ecosystem that fueled players to migrate from the Low Population Worlds to the Top Tier Worlds.

World Linking is like dumping the small fry directly into the main fish tank. Eventually the source gets exhausted & we loose all diversity.

WvW population levels are dropping without a solid ecosystem that naturally replenishes the Top Tier Worlds…imho

Don’t balance population. Let players stack on any server as much as they want to.

Instead…We need a solution that leverages & makes use of these huge population differences between servers as “bait & target”.

We could seriously resolve this problem if a 2 King of the Hill Match-Up design is used instead.

Make the Highest Ranked World Server in NA & EU to be the “target” for each region.

1. Assign only 1 Map to each World Server.
2. Re-purpose the 3 Spawn Points on all these re-assigned maps…that basically allow Players to enter the map through their (Single Red-Home Spawn), OR enter on All Other Enemy Server’s (Green or Blue-Enemy Spawn).
3. Re-purpose Server Guesting & tailor it to keep track of server fight choices of Players & Drop them into Maps using these Re-purposed Spawn Points with Weekly Limits on How many & Which servers that they can fight on.
4. Adjust Player Rewards based on their Home Server Rank & the Rank of the Server that they attack. Reward More if Enemy Server Rank is Higher. Reward Less if Lower.
5. Re-purpose WvG Panel to randomly display every time it’s viewed the Top 3 Servers attacking a Player’s Home Server…aka…“bait”.

Match-Ups are uniquely Player Driven…yet ANet Controlled.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Btw.. my suggestion would also fix the server lag in EB… because it triggers usually when all 3 maps are qued and the servers cant handle the load of spells/actions from all 3 massive teams. There is always someone outnumbered, even on reset usually and this would at least make the server side action lag a more rare occurrence dont you think?

Dynamic map caps has been suggested many times, but forcing players to leave maps to eotm for a magic find buff? won’t go over well with players sorry, especially if a commander is one of those that are randomly ported lol. 10 people logging out of wvw to boot 20 enemies would be some nice trolling.

If you want to do the cap you have to set it to middle population currently on, setting it to the lowest might be too low, and then that triggers the queue for the highest population. You don’t kick people out of maps, you just don’t let anymore in on the highest side until they get under the cap or the other sides come up. There should still always be a minimum to the map cap before the queue kicks in of like 20, so that a decent sized guild can jump in.

Blame the commanders, always. Players following them can only get as good as the commander is. If the comm doesnt actually teach players instead of being happy dappy ppt log inner or rager, the servers will stay unbalanced.

Amount of knowledge/experience you need about the game for being great in WvW is super small. Of course to carry fights you need a better computer and deeper knowledge about enemy classes and gamemode but that isnt necessary for enough melee sustain/range pressure.

Well whatever, its too old of a game to have enough great positive players to teach others so you cant do much about it, maybe make your server stronger for 6+ hours a week by tagging up. You will be stuck with comms that should be in PvE :p Maybe in 5 years they realise that stacking on tag and running in straight line with PvT guards is not enough anymore

Shadow Bane.9362 come to SFR, we have cookies. evilish laugh

XenesisII.1540:

Read McKenna’s post and figure it out. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/New-Worlds/first#post6390324

There are people from ET that complained about being shoved into T1 in the first links, there are people every once in a while come to remind us in here they prefer lower population servers because they don’t get blobbed or zerged down. I personally don’t, but they exist. If they want to give a shout out now that would be great, but I’m not going to track every WHO out there, read the forums often and you see what’s going on.

it doesn’t mean McKenna said so doesn’t mean its impossible to do so…

take for example trueanimus post above on how to balance using dynamic queue, instead of kicking people make the skirmish shorter (about 1 hour more or less), then use the eotm kicking all people out when the skirmish is over

also, i read forums often but i only read the post of i can think will help WvW as a whole not by the server,

and you do know the forum search is functioning properly right? i cant find the WHO your referring to

Eotm kicks players after 4 hours, which is more than an average play session. Now you all want to kick players after 1 hour? yeah that’s going to get disruptive and annoying to players, especially on a reset night. It still doesn’t cover the changes that happen within that hour, 5 mins into a match of 50v50v50, 20 could leave one side and then what?, it goes 50v50v30 for next 55mins. In trueanimus method that kicks 40 players out from the other 2 sides to eotm, your method kicks everyone after an hour. Kicking players is not the answer.

Also the search doesn’t work properly, lol, that’s been broken for years, it’s one of the reasons why this forum sucks, and they apparently can’t/won’t fix it. Go input some simple wvw terms or hell even terms from your own post into the search and you get a couple post from today or none. You have to use external searches.

Also I said I’m not going to track them for you, if you have been reading you would see them every once in a while, it’s like desert bl lovers, they come out of the woodwork every once in a while in the desert bl threads.

Quite a bit of people transfer from cheap link to cheap link every time relinks happen, so normally by the time of week 3, relinking becomes imbalanced again. Factor in haywire rng for matchups and….

XenesisII.1540:

Eotm kicks players after 4 hours, which is more than an average play session. Now you all want to kick players after 1 hour? yeah that’s going to get disruptive and annoying to players, especially on a reset night. It still doesn’t cover the changes that happen within that hour, 5 mins into a match of 50v50v50, 20 could leave one side and then what?, it goes 50v50v30 for next 55mins. In trueanimus method that kicks 40 players out from the other 2 sides to eotm, your method kicks everyone after an hour. Kicking players is not the answer.

well, atleast that 30 pop server can still get players within 55 mins
that means on the next hour that 50vs50vs30 isnt possible anymore, it would be a 30v30v30 on the next hour, we should think ahead

a pvp match average 15 mins, a moba match is like 30min to 1 hour
we cant do match system for that gameplay in WvW because its 5v5, we just have to tweak a little bit to that in order to match the WvW system massive player battles instead of the 24/7 non stop action on 1 server and no actions on other servers.

the downside of that is the stacked servers won’t be able to play as they like because their server is full and cant enter because off massive queues so they will forced to destack if they still want to play WvW and transfer to a medium pop one

a server can buy as many guilds as they like, but they cant use all of them to their advantage all at once, its like you only have a 20 supply max you can carry while your camp can provide you with 100/100 supply

for me, thats how you balance WvW matches

wait, is it really a downside to destack….? i wonder…..

so, if kicking people every skirmish like eotm doesn’t work, what do you think should be the next move to a more close matchup?

Norbe.7630:

a pvp match average 15 mins, a moba match is like 30min to 1 hour
we cant do match system for that gameplay in WvW because its 5v5, we just have to tweak a little bit to that in order to match the WvW system massive player battles instead of the 24/7 non stop action on 1 server and no actions on other servers.

the downside of that is the stacked servers won’t be able to play as they like because their server is full and cant enter because off massive queues so they will forced to destack if they still want to play WvW and transfer to a medium pop one

This would hurt any guild that runs the WvW guild missions, especially if they do it at prime time to be able to get the max number of people so most can run the missions. How many guilds would actually move as a whole to another server so the members could run together? The other question is whether the overall desire to play is greater than the desire to run in WvW with their guildies. How many would go ahead and transfer and potentially not play with guildies (assuming guild doesn’t move) versus just quitting the game?

I already posted my compromise to the suggestion Norbe. You prefer to kick people, I don’t, and that’s that.

Join maguuma and enjoy the karma train who cares about close matcheup when you can be the entire MATCHEUP!

giggle giggle YAY YAY giggle giggle pompadour

its not kicking to be honest its just a word, think of it as a reset, every hour is a reset, every last minute is a reset, every hour is a prime time for NA EU SEA OCX etc…
im not just talking bout NA its about every primetime

then this sums up the op question is there a close matchup anymore
the answer is no and forever will be no
lol