Guild Wars 2

I have seen this time and time again and I would love for someone who agrees with this to logically explain it to me. To clarify using an example, about two hours ago I was in TC borderlands when a new player remarked the puzzle was being camped(I know he was new because he asked what badges were later after he finally got the chest), where he was immediately brandished as being a waste of space and that he SHOULD be helping out at DB/BV. As if that wasn’t bad enough, the commander then commented that you should never be doing the puzzle.

Here is where I am quite confused. I could see if the borderland had a que in it and we were getting pushed hard while needing as many bodies as possible to defend, but this was 5am with somewhere around a 0% chance of filling up. My argument is that if it has no que and little chance of obtaining one, then you really have no right to tell anyone what to do. Whether they are standing around at spawn dancing, killing Tequatl, burning through fractals, or ERP’n as a human with a char in LA, it’s all their time and they get to do with it what they decide.

To simplify, if there is no que then they have the right to do the puzzle if they wish. Whether they are in borderlands or in LA they are no different from a node of iron ore until the moment they decide to assist in WvW or the borderlands fills up and they literally become a block for people who are trying to join for WvW.

Some people just take WvW more seriously than other people. I’ll hop on every now and then to help out my server, but I usually like going for the jumping puzzles and getting 100% map completion.

People have a right to do JP at anytime. If someone disagrees it’s on them, not you.

The queue is the main reason why I think the puzzles should be instanced. If they must, keep the WvW aspect in there for ganking (I’d prefer them to be PvE on your respective server but that’s just my opinion) if you have to…just make the puzzle contenders not count towards the server cap.

I think that arguing against people doing something that can reward golems (got a golem print) then they should never complain about people not having siege. Do puzzles to get your badges and get your gear and get siege and screw anyone who isn’t happy about it.

It isn’t about it being PvE or carebear. It is about a puzzle that rewards useful items and with a mesmer takes what? A second or two? Yeah. Totes not worth it. Lol.

I share the view that as long as there is not queue it can not be said that PvE players are taking an space to WvWvW players. PvE players who enter for completing maps or fro the JP, or players entering WvWvW just to do crafting in the BL facilities (either for crafting or for the bank) when they do not have one nearby in the PvE world, or people going to Lion’s Arch (to save waypoint expenses travel).

Another aspect of the problem -in some view- is the distraction that causes the Jumping Puzzle, it seems as if Arena.net designers did not find the game enough fun to play and they got the idea of putting JPs all over the World and in WvWvW (I think there are not JPs in sPvP). My suggestion, take JPs out from the adventuring maps and bring them to the capitals, this would have two effects, in one side designers would have to think out how to make actually game-play to be fun and in the other side JPs would bring life to the deserted capitals. Just for the record, I have not done any JP, but I might like to do them if doing them had some sense for the overall game.

Get a lot of this on Sanctum of Rall especially from our powerhouse guilds. Many players have this ’more holy than thou’ attitude that if you disagree with them then you are wrong and should stop what you’re doing.

Just ignore them

Actually, the jumping puzzle is pretty useless since it only rewards 2 plans and a dozen or so badges for 10-60 minutes of work depending on activity. You can farm the gold for 2 alpha siege golems easily within 30 minutes, and the vast majority of the time you’ll only get a Flame Ram and Arrow Cart blueprint from the chest making it even more trivial.

Back when camping the jump puzzle was in style, we would see the same people attempt the puzzle over and over – and over and over – taking upwards to 2-3 hours trying to make it through for “free” siege. It stupefies me how much people will go through when they think something is free – just like how Chick-fil-A offers a free sandwich and people will wait 1 hour in line for it when they could have just worked to buy 5-20 more.

It takes about 5 minutes to do the JP in EB

for 2 siege BP’s and enough badges for another BP, its worth that time.

If its camped, dont do it. Or do it with a bunch of people that know how to break the camp quickly.

I think the Jumping puzzle is fine and people can do it any time they want even if it is a q and major stuff going on. Its a game right.

What I do hate is when people camp the stupid jump puzzle, I would love to see them kicked from wvw for taking up the spots. I have no problem with ports but I have seen 15 guys camping the stupid puzzle. With that same manpower you could very easily accomplish something in the map. There is only one thing worse then JP campers and that is the people that call out for a large group of people to come and help them clear out the JP of campers. Like we are not busy doing anything else we should send 10 guys over just to help him clear out a JP for him to get some badges/plans.

Its pretty easy to see if the puzzle is camped. Enter the water near the room with the releaseable monsters before you even go into the puzzle. go underwater then surface. press ctrl and look around, enemies names will show up. If camped. dont attempt.

This is one way ArenaNet broke the moldy mold. In WoW and other games, ‘open world’ type of pvp is always cried about and moaned about and whined about whenever someone does anything other than direct pvp. ArenanNet created WvW as an ‘open world’ (still instanced) type of pvp. There’s more than JUST pvp going on. I do my dailies in there too usually. In your own borderland, you can craft too, and pick up purchased items from Black Lion and browse the Black Lion itself. Purists will always kitten about it, and WoW gave into them, removing many non-pvp aspects, thus hurting the depth of their own game. Hurrah for jump puzzles and anything else in WvW, and tough **** to the whiners.

If there is no que then yeah, It is not inherently detrimental to the team. I disagree with your playtime preferences, but thats about it. But people asking for free mesmer portals to the chest in EB only 90 minutes after reset… These people are hurting the team. What is the point of getting the seige from the puzzle when we are losing ground while you get it? If buying seige with badges or silver is too much for you then don’t worry about it. I never see a shortage of blueprints. Just make sure to carry supply with you at all times.

guess, most of the people complaining never did organized runs.
5 minutes work per Bg. all people on the server with free badges and siege..

useless, lol..

You can get the time investment per person down to around a minute pretty easily.

I hope people dont realize that and continue to consider the JP’s a waste of time.

Last thing we need is an extra 320 siege BP’s obtained in less than a minute

Some people will get angry about anything they aren’t directly controlling, no matter what.

I see no problem with doing the jumping puzzle. Even if there is a queue. The only time it would be a real issue if there’s like 20 people flailing around there failing like fools. Let’s be honest, 4 or 5 people aren’t going to be missed.

Likewise I see no problems with camping the jumping puzzles. It’s a pvp zone people, not a freebie that you’re entitled to get merely by logging on. Not only are the people camping it stopping the other teams, but they safeguard the route for their own forces. Again, I’m talking about like 5 people, when you get 20 camping it, it’s a bit excessive.

I see people getting yelled at for trying to finish their maps. I mean really people, loosen up, it’s a game and a few people doing their own thing isn’t going to make us lose. Hell, if you want to yell at someone, yell at the 3-6 people I see idle just inside the camp every game.

I don’t mind the concept of camping the jumping puzzles at all. Thats all and good fun. When I hear about enemies camping it I am glad because it means there is less red on the battle field. Once the match is pretty much decided I say go for it. I just get annoyed with people wanting to do it at reset and through the first day or so.

Jamaz.9837:

Actually, the jumping puzzle is pretty useless since it only rewards 2 plans and a dozen or so badges for 10-60 minutes of work depending on activity. You can farm the gold for 2 alpha siege golems easily within 30 minutes, and the vast majority of the time you’ll only get a Flame Ram and Arrow Cart blueprint from the chest making it even more trivial.

You’re right on the money as far as blueprints go. If you can hop in and get the puzzle done in 10 minutes, great, free blueprints. Conversely, it is good to ensure opponents can’t easily do the same. You completely ignored the fact that “a dozen or so badges” is far more than you’re likely to get in the same timeframe for actually helping your server.

I enjoy having the JPs here as a strategic asset to be fought over, badge-wise they’re definitely worthwhile, even if the siege reward is usually small and the chance of precursors is tiny.

Honestly, I never understood the people that complain about the players in the Jumping Puzzles, telling them they are hampering wvw…but never mention the other people that are “wasting space”. Why don’t you complain about the people that go afk at the entrance portals, or the people that seem to just sit in front of the TP? Why don’t you complain about the non 80s running around…surely they should be replaced by an 80.

Hell, just report me, I’ve been sitting in EB while typing this message…

/sarcasm

Wilow.3061:

Honestly, I never understood the people that complain about the players in the Jumping Puzzles, telling them they are hampering wvw…but never mention the other people that are “wasting space”. Why don’t you complain about the people that go afk at the entrance portals, or the people that seem to just sit in front of the TP? Why don’t you complain about the non 80s running around…surely they should be replaced by an 80.

Hell, just report me, I’ve been sitting in EB while typing this message…

/sarcasm

Whoa whoa whoa. You’re making too much sense. stop it.

marianojc.2965:

I share the view that as long as there is not queue it can not be said that PvE players are taking an space to WvWvW players. PvE players who enter for completing maps or fro the JP, or players entering WvWvW just to do crafting in the BL facilities (either for crafting or for the bank) when they do not have one nearby in the PvE world, or people going to Lion’s Arch (to save waypoint expenses travel).

Another aspect of the problem -in some view- is the distraction that causes the Jumping Puzzle, it seems as if Arena.net designers did not find the game enough fun to play and they got the idea of putting JPs all over the World and in WvWvW (I think there are not JPs in sPvP). My suggestion, take JPs out from the adventuring maps and bring them to the capitals, this would have two effects, in one side designers would have to think out how to make actually game-play to be fun and in the other side JPs would bring life to the deserted capitals. Just for the record, I have not done any JP, but I might like to do them if doing them had some sense for the overall game.

Many players have done and DO enjoy the jumping puzzles. Also, they are directly tied into adventuring and exploring. They aren’t separate from game play. They are a part of it. Their presence outside of cities isn’t hurting your experience since most are hidden off the beaten path, but removing them would hurt the experience of those who have done and enjoyed them. If you actually had done some, you’d see how well they fit into the world, and how visually striking and creative many of them are. Not that they would remove them anyway. I just can’t believe someone would ask them to remove content they worked so hard on and so many other players enjoy just because you haven’t/don’t.

Jumping puzzles don’t prevent them from making the game fun. If anything, it helps them find ways to make conventional MMO content like PvP and dungeons (Fractals is very much informed by jumping puzzles) more interesting and take full advantage of the Z axis. What I like about the WvW jumping puzzle is the added danger of PvP and all the novel booby traps. Someone else suggested PvE only jumping puzzles, but there’s plenty of those. And not everybody who enjoys the WvW puzzle is just interested in ganking. It’s just another fun and challenging piece of content, and the PvP element makes it more unpredictable and exciting.

Jamaz.9837:

Actually, the jumping puzzle is pretty useless since it only rewards 2 plans and a dozen or so badges for 10-60 minutes of work depending on activity. You can farm the gold for 2 alpha siege golems easily within 30 minutes…

But can you farm the gold for it in WvW? I assume not. I am one of those guys that hangs around our own borderland even if we have it fully capped. The jumping puzzle is free 3 blueprints (considering that you get tokens for it too, and I use them for blueprints) for me. You see, Im one of those who stay and defend our own border and give information to our attacking commanders etc. if the enemy presence is starting to grow to something we can’t handle alone.

And for the record, it takes me around 6 minutes to run to jumping puzzle and port back to Bay/Hills, somewhere and continue whatever I was doing.

Meh they’re just a cheapskate way of getting badges of honor in my opinion.
I mean where’s the honor of just jumping around, they should be badges of skill not honor

EnoLive.2367:

Meh they’re just a cheapskate way of getting badges of honor in my opinion.
I mean where’s the honor of just jumping around, they should be badges of skill not honor

follow this line of thought from the www half of the time you should take “badge of zerg”, or you can tell me that there is honor to take a castle defended by 5 npc or blast a group of 10 ppl while your group is 50?

kanikani.2430:

There is only one thing worse then JP campers and that is the people that call out for a large group of people to come and help them clear out the JP of campers. Like we are not busy doing anything else we should send 10 guys over just to help him clear out a JP for him to get some badges/plans.

So people asking for help is worse than people spoiling the fun for others? If someone is busy and cannot or does not want to help out, they won’t. But if someone is asking for help, let them, it’s their own right to do so.

Hardist.3104:

kanikani.2430:

There is only one thing worse then JP campers and that is the people that call out for a large group of people to come and help them clear out the JP of campers. Like we are not busy doing anything else we should send 10 guys over just to help him clear out a JP for him to get some badges/plans.

So people asking for help is worse than people spoiling the fun for others? If someone is busy and cannot or does not want to help out, they won’t. But if someone is asking for help, let them, it’s their own right to do so.

i stopped to asking help for JP when it is camped, cause EVERY time that i asked, i got flamed, some kind of sad ppl also wished my death (the real one, no the char).

Because JP’s are a distraction, any person doing it is a person less defending/attacking/escorting/upgrading. If someone is camping the puzzle then let them stay there and go take camps/towers/…

I honestly don’t get why they have to be in the wvw zones instead of a separate instance but ah well.

xtorma.1283:

People have a right to do JP at anytime.

I agree with this.

Its up to the individual to decide if they want to play for the wider team or not. Getting them off the jumping puzzle isn’t going to magically make them want to play for the server-team as a whole anyway, let them get on with it. If there’s enemies camping the JP it means those same enemies aren’t really doing much thats useful in the larger strategy either.

I don’t really have a lot of time for people crying at the jump puzzle though. Its WvW/PvP and if its camped then take your lumps, move on, or come back with friends that can combine together to kick them out.

JP’s are awesome, I’m a commander and I say everyone should be doing JP’s, Whenever someone says they don’t know about JP’s I teach them. Go JP’s!

JP’s should be removed from WvW. They are a distraction from the purpose of WvW, and forces players who do not wish to engage in PvP into the WvW environment because they are simply seeking endgame content, specifically the legendary item tree.

The jumping puzzles are the only alternative to obtaining the Badges of Honor needed in order to craft the Legendary weapons without having to engage in PvP play.

I enjoy PvP, have done so in other MMOs, but I am not interested in the Siege-PvP (Zerg) affair that I associate to WvW. When I do choose to engage in PvP, it will more than likely will be in the SPvP environment as that play style is more appealing along with Red v Blue.

The jumping puzzle is fine. So is the camping sometimes. The problem is people dropping tons of siege inside it and camping it for days. If anything make the whole thing unable to drop siege weapons. It renders the whole point of traps and stuff useless if they arrow cart the whole place up.

varonecl.4265:

They are a distraction from the purpose of WvW

The purpose you made up?

It’d be like someone unilaterally deciding that “the purpose” of Orr is to farm Orichalcum nodes and the mobs are a distraction from that. You don’t get to pick and choose mechanics that suit your play style and then proclaim entire pieces of content out-of-place because they don’t mesh with your view of how things “should” work.

I understand both side and if you se that its alot off shouting help need at * then you should try to keep jumping puzzle problem out from /map chat.

The puzzle is a source of badges, items and siege for whoever “holds” it just like any other WvW point. It just doesn’t have circle. There are people who dedicate lots of time to hold puzzles for their side and fight against those holding it for their enemies. This is a very fun part of WvW PvP. People need to stop thinking it’s their right to open the chest. If they can’t get to it that’s on them and their server.

People who yell at you for asking for help are just elitist ahats.

Tulisin.6945:

varonecl.4265:

They are a distraction from the purpose of WvW

The purpose you made up?

It’d be like someone unilaterally deciding that “the purpose” of Orr is to farm Orichalcum nodes and the mobs are a distraction from that. You don’t get to pick and choose mechanics that suit your play style and then proclaim entire pieces of content out-of-place because they don’t mesh with your view of how things “should” work.

How does it work to have people building siege equipment within JPs and camping the location in order to prevent others from acquiring badges from a chest that people are farming to use for legendaries? It is my opinion, I think they should not be within the WvW environment. At this rate just to gain 100% map completion I will have to switch servers in order to gain access to POIs and waypoints, then hop my server is not full to get back on. Thats called an interruption in play, not choosing playstyle

Stiv.1820:

The puzzle is a source of badges, items and siege for whoever “holds” it just like any other WvW point. It just doesn’t have circle. There are people who dedicate lots of time to hold puzzles for their side and fight against those holding it for their enemies. This is a very fun part of WvW PvP. People need to stop thinking it’s their right to open the chest. If they can’t get to it that’s on them and their server.

People who yell at you for asking for help are just elitist ahats.

I have asked the opposing players for help getting to them. That has helped in some cases. Your last comment is the heart of the problem. If the WvW were balanced then there would be no issue, but I can not inspire a server to choose to be active participants in WvW PvP, this means that the players who want to play WvW congregate on one server or another that is dominant in WvW and it gains more players as those who are looking to engage in PvE content and obtaining mats for endgame skins join those servers as well creating a lopsided loop.

This weekend I will probably join the opposing server just to farm the mats needed adding to their player base. I will not even attack anyone on the opposing side if possible because I do not care to engage in WvW PvP. After I get the mats I will relog onto the server where my guildies are and continue my play.

With that said is this the type of play WvW was supposed to inspire? Seems ridiculous to me.

varonecl.4265:

Stiv.1820:

The puzzle is a source of badges, items and siege for whoever “holds” it just like any other WvW point. It just doesn’t have circle. There are people who dedicate lots of time to hold puzzles for their side and fight against those holding it for their enemies. This is a very fun part of WvW PvP. People need to stop thinking it’s their right to open the chest. If they can’t get to it that’s on them and their server.

People who yell at you for asking for help are just elitist ahats.

I have asked the opposing players for help getting to them. That has helped in some cases. Your last comment is the heart of the problem. If the WvW were balanced then there would be no issue, but I can not inspire a server to choose to be active participants in WvW PvP, this means that the players who want to play WvW congregate on one server or another that is dominant in WvW and it gains more players as those who are looking to engage in PvE content and obtaining mats for endgame skins join those servers as well creating a lopsided loop.

This weekend I will probably join the opposing server just to farm the mats needed adding to their player base. I will not even attack anyone on the opposing side if possible because I do not care to engage in WvW PvP. After I get the mats I will relog onto the server where my guildies are and continue my play.

With that said is this the type of play WvW was supposed to inspire? Seems ridiculous to me.

What do you mean by farming mats needed for endgame skins in WvW? Are you talking about badges to buy the item for Legendary weapons? What other mat is WvW only? Are you talking about taking advantage of the out-manned buff or something?

If you are talking about badges then going to WvW and farming each JP with sometimes multiple characters per day just to avoid any sort of PvP is sort of going against Anet’s design philosophy and that could be why you are having a problem.

It’s my understanding that in order to acquire a legendary they have designed it so you have to participate in almost everything the PvE side of the game has to offer. Exploration, dungeons, events, crafting and WvW. You get badges even by running with a zerg. The idea is to get the legendary you participate in WvW on some level, not just farm the JP but that’s what a lot of people seem to be doing. That method in my opinion is just sort of counter to what Anet had in mind and that’s why there are so many complaints.

EnoLive.2367:

Meh they’re just a cheapskate way of getting badges of honor in my opinion.
I mean where’s the honor of just jumping around, they should be badges of skill not honor

The fiercest PvP can happen in the JP.

There is no doors and walls to hide behind, just players vs. players. (Arena excluded)

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

Anet wants you to participate in WvW to earn your legendary. The idea is you have “mastered” every aspect of the game. I will never get a legendary. Why? Mainly due to map completion and crafting. My highest crafting skill is 75. I don’t care how easy it is, I hate crafting. I will never do 100% map complete. I hate that too. I don’t complain about it because I understand it’s part of their design I just accept it and do what I like which is WvW. If I do decide to go for a legendary at some point, I do it knowing I will have to participate in parts of the game I find distasteful. Same goes for all of us.

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

Anet wants you to participate in WvW to earn your legendary. The idea is you have “mastered” every aspect of the game. I will never get a legendary. Why? Mainly due to map completion and crafting. My highest crafting skill is 75. I don’t care how easy it is, I hate crafting. I will never do 100% map complete. I hate that too. I don’t complain about it because I understand it’s part of their design I just accept it and do what I like which is WvW. If I do decide to go for a legendary at some point, I do it knowing I will have to participate in parts of the game I find distasteful. Same goes for all of us.

You do realize that there are lot of us who reject the legendary path because LOL legendary weapons are glorified exotics prettied up?

Just because Anet wants players to do x, doesn’t mean x is worth doing for players. And Anet should rethink things like jumping puzzles in WvW.

Carebear things belong in Carebear land.

If WvW took place in the openworld it wouldn’t last because PVE people would complain.

Some of the best pvp can be had in the jumping puzzle. You can use traps and height to your advantage. There are plenty of columns for line of sight. You can knock people off of stuff. There is stealth for everyone so that you can come get in behind people.

And its where the rivalry gets truly intense. You take stonemist from my server, fine, you take our garrison and all our towers, fine, you camp the jumping puzzle when I want my free loot… you will die.

Besides its way more epic feeling to kill the campers who have siege set up at the top of the arena then it is taking towers, garrisons or even stonemist. They have a huge advantage over you.

I think the JP is fine where it is and how it is. I would hate it if they added a capture point in it, and I think it would ruin the small scale pvp in there.

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

Anet wants you to participate in WvW to earn your legendary. The idea is you have “mastered” every aspect of the game. I will never get a legendary. Why? Mainly due to map completion and crafting. My highest crafting skill is 75. I don’t care how easy it is, I hate crafting. I will never do 100% map complete. I hate that too. I don’t complain about it because I understand it’s part of their design I just accept it and do what I like which is WvW. If I do decide to go for a legendary at some point, I do it knowing I will have to participate in parts of the game I find distasteful. Same goes for all of us.

You do realize that there are lot of us who reject the legendary path because LOL legendary weapons are glorified exotics prettied up?

Just because Anet wants players to do x, doesn’t mean x is worth doing for players. And Anet should rethink things like jumping puzzles in WvW.

Carebear things belong in Carebear land.

If WvW took place in the openworld it wouldn’t last because PVE people would complain.

I guess I’m confused so you don’t care about them for “farming mats” for your legendary then? If you don’t like PvP why are you in WvW at all?

If you are just saying it doesn’t belong in WvW then I simply disagree. It attracts smaller scale PvP in an open world environment. It’s a lot of fun for those that participate in it. It is completely optional after all.

IMO there should just be no queue to enter any BG. Let all come but then people would complain about imbalance. In the end the JP won’t be camped unless there are people to kill so it evens out for the servers and has hardly any effect on the overall WvW points for one server vs another if at all.

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

Anet wants you to participate in WvW to earn your legendary. The idea is you have “mastered” every aspect of the game. I will never get a legendary. Why? Mainly due to map completion and crafting. My highest crafting skill is 75. I don’t care how easy it is, I hate crafting. I will never do 100% map complete. I hate that too. I don’t complain about it because I understand it’s part of their design I just accept it and do what I like which is WvW. If I do decide to go for a legendary at some point, I do it knowing I will have to participate in parts of the game I find distasteful. Same goes for all of us.

You do realize that there are lot of us who reject the legendary path because LOL legendary weapons are glorified exotics prettied up?

Just because Anet wants players to do x, doesn’t mean x is worth doing for players. And Anet should rethink things like jumping puzzles in WvW.

Carebear things belong in Carebear land.

If WvW took place in the openworld it wouldn’t last because PVE people would complain.

I guess I’m confused so you don’t care about them for “farming mats” for your legendary then? If you don’t like PvP why are you in WvW at all?

If you are just saying it doesn’t belong in WvW then I simply disagree. It attracts smaller scale PvP in an open world environment. It’s a lot of fun for those that participate in it. It is completely optional after all.

IMO there should just be no queue to enter any BG. Let all come but then people would complain about imbalance. In the end the JP won’t be camped unless there are people to kill so it evens out for the servers and has hardly any effect on the overall WvW points for one server vs another if at all.

You are generally confused altogether.

And, no, it does not belong in WvW. There’s no objective in the JP for the “team”. It takes up space for players who are trying to help the team on some servers. People who have 0 interest in WvW go to the JP and never help the team. Even the Grub fiends on my server are more productive.

And LOL @ no queue… the game would not be playable since this little thing we call Lag still exists…

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

Anet wants you to participate in WvW to earn your legendary. The idea is you have “mastered” every aspect of the game. I will never get a legendary. Why? Mainly due to map completion and crafting. My highest crafting skill is 75. I don’t care how easy it is, I hate crafting. I will never do 100% map complete. I hate that too. I don’t complain about it because I understand it’s part of their design I just accept it and do what I like which is WvW. If I do decide to go for a legendary at some point, I do it knowing I will have to participate in parts of the game I find distasteful. Same goes for all of us.

You do realize that there are lot of us who reject the legendary path because LOL legendary weapons are glorified exotics prettied up?

Just because Anet wants players to do x, doesn’t mean x is worth doing for players. And Anet should rethink things like jumping puzzles in WvW.

Carebear things belong in Carebear land.

If WvW took place in the openworld it wouldn’t last because PVE people would complain.

I guess I’m confused so you don’t care about them for “farming mats” for your legendary then? If you don’t like PvP why are you in WvW at all?

If you are just saying it doesn’t belong in WvW then I simply disagree. It attracts smaller scale PvP in an open world environment. It’s a lot of fun for those that participate in it. It is completely optional after all.

IMO there should just be no queue to enter any BG. Let all come but then people would complain about imbalance. In the end the JP won’t be camped unless there are people to kill so it evens out for the servers and has hardly any effect on the overall WvW points for one server vs another if at all.

You are generally confused altogether.

And, no, it does not belong in WvW. There’s no objective in the JP for the “team”. It takes up space for players who are trying to help the team on some servers. People who have 0 interest in WvW go to the JP and never help the team. Even the Grub fiends on my server are more productive.

And LOL @ no queue… the game would not be playable since this little thing we call Lag still exists…

It was some other guy complaining about farming mats.

Anyway, many games have done no queue for open world PvP and been fine. DAOC and Darkfall off the top of my head. Being outnumbered at times is part of open world PvP.

You think people are wasting space in the JP well I think half of every zerg is a waist of space, half of the time they are fighting nothing but undefended keeps/camps. There are different play-styles in WvW and JP PvP is one of them, sorry you don’t like it.

Stiv.1820:

varonecl.4265:

Stiv.1820:

The puzzle is a source of badges, items and siege for whoever “holds” it just like any other WvW point. It just doesn’t have circle. There are people who dedicate lots of time to hold puzzles for their side and fight against those holding it for their enemies. This is a very fun part of WvW PvP. People need to stop thinking it’s their right to open the chest. If they can’t get to it that’s on them and their server.

People who yell at you for asking for help are just elitist ahats.

I have asked the opposing players for help getting to them. That has helped in some cases. Your last comment is the heart of the problem. If the WvW were balanced then there would be no issue, but I can not inspire a server to choose to be active participants in WvW PvP, this means that the players who want to play WvW congregate on one server or another that is dominant in WvW and it gains more players as those who are looking to engage in PvE content and obtaining mats for endgame skins join those servers as well creating a lopsided loop.

This weekend I will probably join the opposing server just to farm the mats needed adding to their player base. I will not even attack anyone on the opposing side if possible because I do not care to engage in WvW PvP. After I get the mats I will relog onto the server where my guildies are and continue my play.

With that said is this the type of play WvW was supposed to inspire? Seems ridiculous to me.

What do you mean by farming mats needed for endgame skins in WvW? Are you talking about badges to buy the item for Legendary weapons? What other mat is WvW only? Are you talking about taking advantage of the out-manned buff or something?

If you are talking about badges then going to WvW and farming each JP with sometimes multiple characters per day just to avoid any sort of PvP is sort of going against Anet’s design philosophy and that could be why you are having a problem.

It’s my understanding that in order to acquire a legendary they have designed it so you have to participate in almost everything the PvE side of the game has to offer. Exploration, dungeons, events, crafting and WvW. You get badges even by running with a zerg. The idea is to get the legendary you participate in WvW on some level, not just farm the JP but that’s what a lot of people seem to be doing. That method in my opinion is just sort of counter to what Anet had in mind and that’s why there are so many complaints.

how could that be against Anets design philosophy? If you allow me to create 20 characters and I decide to log in with each character to gain BoHs which are account bound by doing jumping puzzles instead of engaging in PVP then how is that against the design philosophy?

Was it in the design philosophy to allow the Thief to Perma-Stealth into one hit kills? To allow people to build siege weapons within the JPs to complete lockout opposing servers from accessing the JPs. By your estimation it was Anets design philosophy to force players to PvP if they wanted access to pretty skins.

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

Anet wants you to participate in WvW to earn your legendary. The idea is you have “mastered” every aspect of the game. I will never get a legendary. Why? Mainly due to map completion and crafting. My highest crafting skill is 75. I don’t care how easy it is, I hate crafting. I will never do 100% map complete. I hate that too. I don’t complain about it because I understand it’s part of their design I just accept it and do what I like which is WvW. If I do decide to go for a legendary at some point, I do it knowing I will have to participate in parts of the game I find distasteful. Same goes for all of us.

Anet also stated they wanted GW2 to be less about grinding like other MMOs which is why they were considering revamps to the dungeon token system, but i Guess you are in their development team and cant tell a mistake from a design flaw?

varonecl.4265:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Stiv.1820:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

The JP should be removed. Sure, you can get siege from it, but how many carebears go in there and never appear in WvW again? I farm and buy my own siege. Most people I know do that.

In times of the Queue it is annoying to see people asking for mesmers in the jp. It handicaps the people actually WvWing if there are lots of people in the jp.

The JP is part of WvW, maybe they should add a capture point at the chest location that ticks the magical pointless point total up to make you guys happy?

It’s a place to find a different kind of PvP. Yea there are carebears there desperately trying to avoid PvP and they are the most fun to kill. On average though, the people that go there for PvP are at a much higher skill level than any other area of WvW. It’s fun, small scale, there is no retreat and there is a small reward at the end if you choose to go for it.

The idea that your side is loosing because 15 people are at the JP is just an excuse just like culling or stacking or Mesmer portals. Every side has to deal with it.

They should just introduce an openworld pvp-enabled map with jumping puzzles. There is certainly enough space on the map for it. But throwing PVE-related fodder into organized mass pvp is silly.

Anet wants you to participate in WvW to earn your legendary. The idea is you have “mastered” every aspect of the game. I will never get a legendary. Why? Mainly due to map completion and crafting. My highest crafting skill is 75. I don’t care how easy it is, I hate crafting. I will never do 100% map complete. I hate that too. I don’t complain about it because I understand it’s part of their design I just accept it and do what I like which is WvW. If I do decide to go for a legendary at some point, I do it knowing I will have to participate in parts of the game I find distasteful. Same goes for all of us.

Anet also stated they wanted GW2 to be less about grinding like other MMOs which is why they were considering revamps to the dungeon token system, but i Guess you are in their development team and cant tell a mistake from a design flaw?

I think it’s pretty obvious that legendaries at the very least are suppose to be a very large time sink. What defines a grind is subjective but I don’t see how obtaining a legendary could not be considered a grind unless they become easily accessible and then everyone will have them making them not so special.