Guild Wars 2

After playing it quite a bit, I give it a 8/10.

Map is great. Good balance between open spaces and more closed spaces.
Love that towers are larger, makes for much greater fights.
I like the shrine stuff. The stealth, the no fall damage.
The auto upgrades is good, though I’m sure people who used to enjoy upgrading things are upset. They don’t realize that yaks getting into the keep will cut down the upgrade time significantly. Small groups also have greater incentive to go yak slapping for this same reason.
Finally fortified gates and lords that don’t melt in seconds against blobs. More time for defenders to respond.

However, I feel that the keeps are too large and impossible to properly scout and siege up.
Shield generators are really really strong, and too many can be placed in an area. Cap needs to be lowered for them.
Is the constantly reapplying cripple around the earth keep intentionally supposed to screw with condi clears? If not, it needs to be fixed.

Now if people can stop playing pve and come to wvw, that would be great.

Deli.1302:

After playing it quite a bit, I give it a 8/10.

Map is great. Good balance between open spaces and more closed spaces.
Love that towers are larger, makes for much greater fights.
I like the shrine stuff. The stealth, the no fall damage.
The auto upgrades is good, though I’m sure people who used to enjoy upgrading things are upset. They don’t realize that yaks getting into the keep will cut down the upgrade time significantly. Small groups also have greater incentive to go yak slapping for this same reason.
Finally fortified gates and lords that don’t melt in seconds against blobs. More time for defenders to respond.

However, I feel that the keeps are too large and impossible to properly scout and siege up.
Shield generators are really really strong, and too many can be placed in an area. Cap needs to be lowered for them.
Is the constantly reapplying cripple around the earth keep intentionally supposed to screw with condi clears? If not, it needs to be fixed.

Now if people can stop playing pve and come to wvw, that would be great.

Map is quite balance you say….and open spaces …where are this open spaces? and if people will stop playing pve…did you ask youre self why they playing pve, maybe because they hate new bordelands or they are queued to EB?
And lord that not melting in seconds….well maybe not in sec but for sure they dont take more than 3 min to solo it….wich make me laugh now anyone can solo it. i hope they really gona change something to it because is claustrophobic this borders.

Nephar.3746:

the big dimension is a plus to discourage zerging, cause it is no more efficient to zerg when small groups spread around can achieve something and the zerg take too long to reach and disrupt them.
the vertical layout is too confusing.
my feeling atm when i enter is that i need a mount and a gps…

That might be true, except now it takes 3 superior rams to take a tower without boring yourselves senseless waiting for the fortified gate to get knocked down.

A huge map is great for small groups if the intent is avoiding fights, which I don’t think is really the goal. But even if you made a bunch of small groups, they can’t take anything that matters in a reasonable timeframe because everything is upgraded.

I swear they were thinking, we’ll get people to fight by making capping slower, which is a reasonable concept at least. The problem is they made response even more slow by making a huge map and taking so many waypoints away. So now the pace of the game is absurdly slow and boring because you spend so much more time running and/or trying to find the enemies.

The only positive for WvW I can find so far are the sentries marking dots on the map. That is the only thing that makes finding fights easier I can think of.

The maps are too big as is, and there’s three of them… There are no servers to fill even one, it seems :/

Cut the servers by half, and the maps will be great, with actually people to play with.

I hate the new maps they are nothing but PvE… WvW as we knew it is dead. I’m so disappointed.

As a wvwer, I really do not like this 3 new WvW map, they just like new EOTM.
now only EB we can play, if I knew this should not buy HOT…..

Also, why can not use autopickup in wvw ? This is really a bad design
Also, 1 hour to ceash game 3 times, really really disappointing and sucks

FOKOZUYNEN.8206:

Map is quite balance you say….and open spaces …where are this open spaces?

Entire south side of the map. On top of fire keep. The oasis. The NW and NE region. I suggest you actually play on the map.

and if people will stop playing pve…did you ask youre self why they playing pve, maybe because they hate new bordelands or they are queued to EB?

They are playing pve because they are unlocking their elite specializations, unlocking their guild hall, playing through the HoT story, playing the Halloween content. Once they get done with that they’ll be back in WvW. Those who chose WvW over all of that congregated in EB during the 1st week.

yanniell.1236:

Cut the servers by half, and the maps will be great, with actually people to play with.

Fully queued borders doesnt fix their design flaws, they wont be any more great than they are empty.

The map is beautiful no doubt about it just not good for WvW, i played some today and its bad, too big, confusing, empty and even tho i didn’t saw that but by the comments i have read there is some magic laser that helps the team which have more people in the map and the advantage in numbers already, seriously? who tough that.

This is bad for wvw, sadly, i consider myself a wvw player. WvW is what interested me most in GW2, is sad to see it go down like this, boring and empty. The idea of wvw, server in battle with other servers is amazing on paper but sadly anet have turn it into some raid content (pve) i really dont know what there end goal is.

The new Map is TOO big for a “Borderland” map with 3 copies..Borderlands should promote more skirmishing and medium sized group play and not the big server crippling blob clashes of EB.

Switching the new map to rotate with EB would give it the population it needs to be enjoyable by the WvW community. Spending 40mins wandering around a map uncontested is not fun its basically EOTM that point and that’s not a good place to be.

I think they should add a lot of more events for points and bring back the ppk. King of the hill events, capture the point, capture the flag, defend the npc… 1 event in every 20-30 mins with a solide reward.

I really dislike the new borders. It’s way too big. Actually no fun at all to wait for fights and run your legs off. No wonder people queue for eb all the time to get out of that new borders. This wvw border project is way over the top……

it’s not that bad in my opinion. biggest mistakes are: keeps and towers to big, fortified gates, keeplords to strong. For the rest mapsize should’ve been smaller, but on the other hand it offers us new content after 3 years of alpine bl, promotes tactical gameplay and most chokepoints have a decent size (not to small).
I won’t argue that the new map is better then the old one, but atleast it would be nice if ppl would actually give it a try instead of complete desolation.

the krytan assassin.9235:

promotes tactical gameplay and most chokepoints have a decent size (not to small).

At the cost of total loss of strategical gameplay due to towers and keeps being completely disconnected from each other.

A trade I dont quite see the worth of.

For a low population server like Vabbi, the new borderlands can not be defended. Before, the average number of persons in the map was 5-10 but right now I am usually alone and outbumbered when I enter the map. Even with everyone back from playing HoT, those numbers are highly insufficient to defend the map. It might become better, but right now, even finding the attackers in one of the keeps is a challenge. When you do find them, there’s a good amount of siege present, but without the players to use it, it doesn’t help. Also low population servers are hit harder by the distances because there’s usually just one emergency response team taking care of all three keeps.

When it comes to suggestions on what to do: Especially on small servers, people just stay out of principle. I believe a merge of servers would rather make them leave than enjoy the game again. What could be a possible help is to rotate the old maps with the new maps in a ratio depending on server population. (The rotation was promised before HoT anyway)

tl;dr
- Before 5-10 defenders of the BL map were enough, now it feels like 15-30
- Reasons: map size, too large keeps, more siege structures than defenders
- Proposition: enable map rotation and give small population servers more frequent access to the alpine BL (but always 3x the same one)

At the cost of total loss of strategical gameplay due to towers and keeps being completely disconnected from each other.

If you’re talking about trebing from one objective to another, actually I really hated that in the old borderlands.

The new borderlands map is really cool since it’s new and I’m having fun learning the shortcuts, siege placement for attack and defense, etc.

yesterday had some 20-50 ppl (per group per server) fights on the new maps (ppl coming back to wvw), after learning the ways arround it became better and you can cross the map from SW spawn to NE tower actually faster then on old maps.

For small groups – oasis event is one of the ways to go and hiding in enemie keep is much easier now + it’s harder to spot at keeps (even at towers) wich wall/gate are attacked. camps are soloable Ez. If you got mobility, it’s much more ways to runaway from zerg then before. Server that has less population if they want to defent their stuff, not it’s much easier for them to do then before. All those excuses right now that it’s harder to deffend is all BS.

People still haven’t use much from the guild upgrades such as banners, no pvd gates etc, but i haven’t looked into it much, from what I heard that part is way too grindy and it needs some toning down because havoc defending guilds are ussually insanly unrewarded and cannot afford yet super upgraded guild hall to get good upgrades.

Open spaces for fights? Hm…i wouldn’t say there are that many as on old bls, but there are plenty of space specially near towers and inside structures to make tactical play more efficient and not only – “big and strong get and on that acs”©. What makes it more fun for smaller smarter groups where in open space vs bigger enemie number you could just get swarmed easily.

The marked enemies on the map IS AN AWESOME thing to have. If you have only 3 groups on the map (1 each side) now it’s easier to spot where the enemies not just by the orange or white swords, but you can see on mini map orange dots then open your map and you see whole group and can aproximate their numbers.

Overall the expirience was very positive for me and alot of other ppl who where with us, let’s see how it goes further in the week and I belive in 2-3 weeks people will come back and I would like to see them on bls testing stuff together and not showing their esportz skills in 3-way 11111 sm fight.

EBG was always meaningless map for wvw as it’s very selfsustainable, easy understandable for handicapated people and militia crowded on any server, while the strongest server was decided of their actions on BLs. All “only ebg guilds” and “ebg scouts” are 80% amatures that never had much clue of the wvw. They could spent 3,5 or 10k hours in wvw but still hasn’t tasted the gamemode as it is and went for smth that is easy defend, scout and udnerstand “it’s our side we def, it’s their side we attack”, almost no tactical play included as it was in bls where you think to abandon 1 map and ugprade keep on another or attack one side then run to old garri (now rampart) etc.

Lack of ppl due to no real server pride and unefficient wvw overall that’s what we got due to anet’s action (ofc together with HOT, heloween etc beeing farmable/fun etc), but it’s all on ppl right now to give the new maps a try and not only listen to one sceptic guy that has 10000 SM captures that “NEW MAP IS PURE kitten,kittenANET, I CAN’T FIND ANYHING OMG RIP WVW RIP WVW”. On another hand wvw is an endgame that if it would be more rewarding then pve then it you would get silverwastes army exploding population in wvw.

I like the new map:

-Map design is really good. I like the choke points. I like the fact that you can use the terrain to your advantage. The player with map knowledge finally has an advantage. Learn the passages, learn the jump spots. More power to you.
-I like the keep buffs. Yes they are powerful. The boon you get gives you a serious advantage. But shrines can be captured before starting a siege. Splitting up finally makes sense.
-Defending is finally possible. On several occasions my server has successfully defended a keep against vastly superior numbers.
-I like that the map is big. If you take out enemy players it takes very long for them to join the fight again. A defeated player will not reengage 30 seconds later. This favors the defenders. It punishes all out offense. You need to actually plan before moving on.
-I like the Marked effect.
-I like automatic upgrades. As a player I can focus on siege building, scouting, taking out stragglers, making blobs miserable.
-I love the removal of the Guard stacks. You can still enjoy WvW build diversity but you are now forced to make a choice.

All in all an excellent upgrade over the old WvW map. Too bad we did not have this earlier.

Catalin.5341:

At the cost of total loss of strategical gameplay due to towers and keeps being completely disconnected from each other.

If you’re talking about trebing from one objective to another, actually I really hated that in the old borderlands.

The new borderlands map is really cool since it’s new and I’m having fun learning the shortcuts, siege placement for attack and defense, etc.

Let me ask you this. What benefit does a tower give? What benefit causes a server to defend it, and what benefit causes a server to want to capture it? What relevance does it have to the other structures on the map?

The answers are: Points, an artificial incentive. And fights, which can be handled in an empty arena. So the tower has zero strategic purpose. holding it doesn’t put your server in a stronger position. Losing it doesn’t put your server in a weaker position. The only thing that changes is PPT. The fights in the other areas will be completely unaffected by that tower. Making each area completely irrelevant to each other, rather than a series of strategically placed defensive structures. The entire map is just one useless area after another.

If you want to know what actual strategic purpose would be, since you seem to be under the impression that it’s…. trebs? then I’ll explain. Real strategic purpose for the towers would be to place them on the road to the keep, blocking said road, so that attackers need to deal with the tower before they’re able to strike at the other server’s heart. Not directly in front of the keep, and not even necessarily within treb distance at all. Just a semi-defensible forward outpost designed to act as a front line. And the keeps should be heavily fortified compounds designed to act as the nucleus all the surrounding areas are assisting. So you want to hold those towers to keep pressure off of your keep. And you want to attack those towers so that your next move will be pressuring the keep. Think of it like this. The keep is the heart, the camps are the veins and blood, and the towers are like the ribcage, muscles and skin. You can’t stab someone in the heart without dealing with the skin, muscles and ribcage. You shouldn’t be able to attack a keep without dealing with the towers.

Instead, we get our hearts on the outside, our ribcage up by our ears, and our blood spurting all over the place. A complete lack of strategic design.

Phantom.8130:

If you want to know what actual strategic purpose would be, since you seem to be under the impression that it’s…. trebs? then I’ll explain. Real strategic purpose for the towers would be to place them on the road to the keep, blocking said road, so that attackers need to deal with the tower before they’re able to strike at the other server’s heart. Not directly in front of the keep, and not even necessarily within treb distance at all. Just a semi-defensible forward outpost designed to act as a front line. And the keeps should be heavily fortified compounds designed to act as the nucleus all the surrounding areas are assisting. So you want to hold those towers to keep pressure off of your keep. And you want to attack those towers so that your next move will be pressuring the keep. Think of it like this. The keep is the heart, the camps are the veins and blood, and the towers are like the ribcage, muscles and skin. You can’t stab someone in the heart without dealing with the skin, muscles and ribcage. You shouldn’t be able to attack a keep without dealing with the towers.

kitten I would love to see this in WvW…..

Dislike. Painful to play, too much pve, stealth, no tactics involved between structures, ladders? ,lava?, ……

I really like it.
All the problems are WvW problems:
- Fix the population problems, merge tiers or find a better system
- Make waypoints show up in towers as soon as you capture them
- Fix the PPT-PPK systems

Phantom.8130:

Catalin.5341:

At the cost of total loss of strategical gameplay due to towers and keeps being completely disconnected from each other.

If you’re talking about trebing from one objective to another, actually I really hated that in the old borderlands.

The new borderlands map is really cool since it’s new and I’m having fun learning the shortcuts, siege placement for attack and defense, etc.

Let me ask you this. What benefit does a tower give? What benefit causes a server to defend it, and what benefit causes a server to want to capture it? What relevance does it have to the other structures on the map?
(…)

^touche.

Being towers just PPT, in that i agree, they improved the map but the core problem stayed behind, do you think that if Anet improved also the importance of the towers besides the boon they provide, players would want that or QQ that would be a pve element boosting other guild that owns the tower?

ex: Like towers and open field camps would serve to control territory that would provide more drops, raw materials etc..

sorry the bad english

Aeolus.3615:

Phantom.8130:

Catalin.5341:

At the cost of total loss of strategical gameplay due to towers and keeps being completely disconnected from each other.

If you’re talking about trebing from one objective to another, actually I really hated that in the old borderlands.

The new borderlands map is really cool since it’s new and I’m having fun learning the shortcuts, siege placement for attack and defense, etc.

Let me ask you this. What benefit does a tower give? What benefit causes a server to defend it, and what benefit causes a server to want to capture it? What relevance does it have to the other structures on the map?
(…)

^touche.

Being towers just PPT, in that i agree, they improved the map but the core problem stayed behind, do you think that if Anet improved also the importance of the towers besides the boon they provide, players would want that or QQ that would be a pve element boosting other guild that owns the tower?

ex: Like towers and open field camps would serve to control territory that would provide more drops, raw materials etc..

sorry the bad english

If they fixed the layout, and provided real incentive to hold the keeps, it would fix half of the problems in WvW. Even problems that don’t seem related to the layout at all.

Keep is important, have to attack them, have to defend them: Actual purpose behind doing things in WvW.

Towers in front of the keep: Defense isn’t a futile effort and actually crucial for any form of success.

Towers are set in choke points, so they MUST be dealt with to get to the keep: paths lead to the towers, people follow the paths. Fights are VERY easy to find.

Not only that, but it would help mitigate population imbalance too. Instead of needing to try to spread a thin force even thinner, defenders can consolidate in the towers, backup can waypoint into the keeps, and rush to respond. Big battles ensue. Roamers would be perfect for cutting off/defending supply lines. Attack/defend the camps, or just focus on the yaks if there’s only 1 or 2 roamers available.

Open field battles would happen naturally, by opposing forces meeting naturally in the field, as the groups advance towards each other. So the areas between the territories would need to be set up for that. Preferably, chasm/corridors near the towers that lead out and open up into a large, relatively flat open field.

Oh, and the original orb could be brought back, and made into the purpose of the center area. Do an even there, the orb shows up. Run the orb back to the keep. Your server gets a waypoint in the center of the map. Could even take the waypoints out of the structures if that’s done.

The layout itself is the foundation everything else is built on. If the foundation is faulty, a lot of cracks will happen as a result of it. Trying to fix those cracks will be impossible, since the foundation is what’s causing them. If the foundation is fixed, most of those cracks never appear.

I like the new maps, but they’re so big I feel like I’m playing alone now…

ITT: bad wvw zergers discuss about the map.

Xillllix.3485:

I really like it.
All the problems are WvW problems:

No they aren’t there are inherent problems with the map. To paraphrase the feedback from a guildie of mine there is no flow to the map. There are lots of different choke points but they don’t funnel groups from different servers into the same open areas for fights or as someone else said above make towers and keeps organic obstacles to be taken before proceeding forward. They have overdosed on the choke points and paths leading to groups just bypassing each other completely.

Then there is the way the new mechanics downplay scouting and the overabundance of artificial PvE crap.

DeusVI.7942:

ITT: bad wvw zergers discuss about the map.

This map is zergers paradise. Blockades stopping roamers but cut thru like butter by zergs, snakey valleys funnelling smaller groups and soloists (roamers, respawners,…) directly into the zergs maw without the ability to evade, vast mountain ridges making it comfortably impossible for opposite zergs to intercept you so you can focus on your PvE raid …

Those same valleys and paths make for superb chke points to fight large forces. I see the new maps as much better at funneling players together for good fights.

I’d like them if they were populated or gliding was incorporated somehow. As a roamer it’d make getting around quite a bit easier, as I have little to no interest in steamrolling keeps.

coglin.1867:

Those same valleys and paths make for superb chke points to fight large forces. I see the new maps as much better at funneling players together for good fights.

That doesn’t make a good fight, it just reinforces the god awful pirate ship meta.

Jim Hunter.6821:

coglin.1867:

Those same valleys and paths make for superb chke points to fight large forces. I see the new maps as much better at funneling players together for good fights.

That doesn’t make a good fight, it just reinforces the god awful pirate ship meta.

Naw it potentially can lead to some epic last-minute saves from inside keeps. Before it was break down outer gate, go directly to inner gate, do not pass go, collect $200 from dead Lord.

It will make guilds rethink how they surprise/attack/retreat.

Certainly if you have tunnel vision you’ll pirate ship and stand there waving at each other. But smarter guilds/players will find ways to surprise and utilize the new verticals.

Perhaps the portal bomb will make a massive comeback (go mesmers!).

Per the OP. I finally had a chance to play the map all day today. Only thing I really could do without was the laser show in the center. I mean if there’s not a rock show, I don’t want to see lasers and dry ice.

That aside, I think the rest of it is interesting. I know tons of people are protesting the size, and I agree, everything feels massive massive. But I’m wondering if that just isn’t a learning curve thing — that over time the big big towers will feel “normal” — right now they feel like keeps on their own, and subsequently the entire map feels huge.

However, it takes a long long time to break down a gate now, even with a decent blob at your back — so while the map has grown, you are now given more time to respond; instead of the insta-gibbed gate door down the minute you see white swords.

I’d like to see a human-interaction NPC for upgrades. Keep the upgrades free, but don’t reward the last player to keep their eyes open before they turn out the lights with unmanned upgrades. At the very least, force a team to talk to an NPC to upgrade.

Was surprised by the stealth stuff, I can see that being used strategically too. Very interesting.

The hardest thing most of us WvWers struggle with is change. It just means this game is much beloved. And after three years to have that kind of passion is a good thing. But I honestly feel the rest of the stuff is just experiential — that it will become “normal” with time and use. At least I hope so.

Jim Hunter.6821:

Those same valleys and paths make for superb chke points to fight large forces. I see the new maps as much better at funneling players together for good fights.

We had plenty of great fights yesterday. You get the fights you make. The new map has much more varied results, not every fight is the same.

Xillllix.3485:

I love the new map, but they need to remove the 2 copies because the population can’t fill it.

This, this, this, a million times this. Even in tier 1, no server has the pop to put a presence on all 4 maps. The best we can swing is 1.5 maps, and that’s only on a good night.

I don’t know why they made a gigantic map when the WvW pops are this low. I hope it’s because they’re planning to do something about the pop and wanted maps to be ready when they do. I feel like they can track WvW populations per server and merge low pop with high pop until maps start getting filled. But whatever the plans are low populations are the number one problem with WvW, not the maps.

Let me ask you this. What benefit does a tower give? What benefit causes a server to defend it, and what benefit causes a server to want to capture it? What relevance does it have to the other structures on the map?

If the barricades were actual walls, then the zerg would have to take those walls down or go the other way around which takes a really long time especially circling the academy tower.

I’d not say R.I.P. to the WvW map change (although the new one does need to be made into an actual WvW map), but rather l think we should have three different borderland maps (and servers cycle through them, as usual). That way people can choose which map suits their preference or playstyle most and assault or defend it. This would also give more character and drive to WvW gameplay. (What would inspire me to assault someone else’s desert/ice/grassland/lava/jungle borderland when mine looks exactly the same and gives me exactly the same benefits and dolyaks and everything?) I was hoping for a WvW update, but apparently Anet decided to chop down the WvW beanstalk altogether :/

Catalin.5341:

Let me ask you this. What benefit does a tower give? What benefit causes a server to defend it, and what benefit causes a server to want to capture it? What relevance does it have to the other structures on the map?

If the barricades were actual walls, then the zerg would have to take those walls down or go the other way around which takes a really long time especially circling the academy tower.

My guess here is that you’re confusing tactics with strategy. Things like knowing which wall to attack, and which combo fields to roll at what times, are tactics. They’re small scale, and only really affect the individual immediate area. Strategy is knowing which towers to push, triggering 2v1’s, which areas to defend and which to hit and run. Very large scale things that affect the whole map, or series of maps, and have long lasting impacts and consequences.

As it stands, there are tactics involved with the new maps. No matter what they put out, knowing the best way to attack an individual area is always going to be a thing. However, the areas don’t relate to each other. They’re completely separate, individual events. Meaning, strategy has been completely sacrificed.

Let’s use EB as an example here. The keeps are positioned directly in the center of the 4 towers. If we hold all 4 of our towers, it actually makes defending the keep quite a bit easier, since those towers can assist in the defense. However, if one of our towers gets taken, that tower (for the most part) can immediately be used to start attacking the keep. So the reason you want to defend the towers is because they help defend your keep, and the reason you want to take an enemy tower is because it can then be used to as a staging post to attack the keep. Don’t get me wrong, most of the time, you’re making a push, driving in as far as you can on the side closest to your third and you’re not holding those areas or continuing the attack. This pressures that server into falling back to defend, because if the attack isn’t countered, the attack will continue. This pulls the enemy server off of other important areas elsewhere on the map, and it also feels out their defenses and response times. And this is all strategy, the mental chess match. And it’s all because the actual layout of the areas not only allow all of these possibilities to happen, but actively promote them.

Whereas, on the new borderlands, if a tower gets flipped…. oh well. Nothing can happen beyond that. Which is why the new maps are laid out far closer to a PvE map than a strategic battle field. Look at any of the actual PvE maps. They’re just a series of individual events all spread out that don’t relate to each other in the slightest bit. And tactics are basically all you’re dealing with in PvE dungeons/fractals as well. “Everyone stand over here. When the boss does this, everyone do that. At stage 2, blah blah blah” But there’s never any thought of which bosses to attack in what order, how taking out one boss would affect another boss, or anything of the sort, because it’s all irrelevant. You take out the bosses in the order they’re presented to you, and taking out one has no affect on the rest of them. There’s no strategy involved, since it’s all basically on rails. The new borderland isn’t much different. Sure, you can decide which tower you want to attack, but… there’s nothing to be gained or lost from that tower that has any significant meaning. You’re not in a stronger or weaker position depending on which ones you hold and which ones you don’t. Holding the NW tower and SE tower is functionally the same as holding the two northern ones, or the two eastern ones, or the two western ones. Or even holding none on your own borderland, and just holding all 4 on an away borderland. It’s the same amount of PPT, no matter how you slice it. And that’s the only relevance the areas have, PPT, but that’s an artificial incentive. People pretty much have to force themselves to pretend to care about it. There’s no territorial relevance. And that’s the problem.

1 word D I S L I K E. starting to give up on this game, pve is not for me.. I play this game for WvW and Anet killed it.

Like or Dislike is not the matter here anymore.

Anet should change the maps ASAP or wvw will be gone for good.

It’s already dying with fast speed.

I am also a WvW player. Its 90% of the game for me. the new maps seem desigend for PvE. To large.
Keeps and towers should be connected and support each other in siege to some extent, roaming needs to be very important and camps reachable in a considerable time not running 1001 stairs.
No one needs the laser …
It´ss bloated. A WvW map must be simple to handle and fast to play (beside keep siege)
Whoever designed it.. Its not a WvW player and even less a WvW roamer. Good design but failed purpose and this can kill a huge part of the community. Especially now at chrismas time. They get something else under the tree and are gone …
So act now or you loose Anet.

New map is beautiful, and it is nice to explore but it is PvE map not WvW. Things could be different if it was battle 1k ppl vs 1k vs 1k. Now it is simply ghost town. I’m on Far Shiverpeaks, today i tried roam for 1h and meet one enemy. Not fun at all

I don’t like the BL map at all. It’s an obvious example of “too many cooks”, with all of the cooks being dirty pve’ers. I hope something is done soon.

It’s a very beautiful map with some interesting choke-points and open areas, but it doesn’t quite fit the current situation WvW is in, if population was double-triple what it is maybe it’d work out better.
The maps are also quite confusing and gimmicky at times, but the confusion will probably fade out over time.

Xillllix.3485:

They should have EotM as a third borderland map with Alpine. Then we would have 4 maps instead of 1 and 3 copies of the other. Before doing anything with the new map (which is fine btw, it only needs more waypoints) they should change the server system and PPT/PPK scoring mechanics.

This is interesting, I like it. Isnt eotm too big for a bl map though?
Based on this good idea, have any for PPT/PPK scoring mechanics? :3

I had a comment that was removed… It may be the entire thread was dropped for other reasons. <shrugs>. Here’s the gist of my criticism/suggestions.

1) Great maps, great ideas, too big. Even with speed boosts, it takes much to long to get to objectives and find fights. Getting back into fights takes far, far too long.

2) Reduce keep complexity. Some people like jumping puzzles. Some of us went to WvW to avoid them. Their complexity should be somewhere between what you have currently and what we had. When it takes 5 minutes just to find your way from one side of a keep to the other, you have been given a clue.

3) You wanted to add verticality? Here’s another way to excite people about it – consider adding glider to WvW, both for speed of transit and coolness factor. Folks without HoT get very basic. With HoT, you get your enhancements.

4) add back more player control over what/how improvements are made in structures.

5) Give back smaller guilds the ability to apply enhancements to structures they claim. There’s a lot of stuff they worked VERY hard for which is pretty much inaccessible, either by way of new mechanics or complexity/lack of understanding.

6) Better tune siege weapon damage against structures or provide ways for players to increase it. (Potions? More WvW skill unlocks? Borderland unlocks like bloodlust? WvW trait line? Lots of options…)

7) Loose the super gun in the middle of the map. I’ve not yet once heard of it being used. It seems a white elephant, bloating the map, hard and time consuming to activate and adding unnecessary complexity. If you have enough to activate it, you have enough to just go take the structures, so, why bother?

Key take away… A positive attribute of the game, guiding principle in fact, is simplicity of features, stacked by players in ways which suits them. I think the new maps have strayed from that, trying to do too much at once, in much too big a way, while taking away many things people like.

I suggest pulling them, rethinking a bit, and taking another pass at it after absorbing our feedback.

Too large, too gimmicky, too much PvE.

Sanity Points.8073:

Too large, too gimmicky, too much PvE.

How do you suggest it is too large, when is literally the same size land mass as the old borderlands?

The new map is far more vertical than the old one.

Yes, the New Borderlands are dead and everyone is in EB and this is not good in my opinion.

Well my thoughts on this is.

I do agree too much PvE content and needs to be at least toned down a bit.

Maps need to be reworked a bit to get people to go to the borderlands more often.

I think this will be a cool idea for maps below.

1. Desert Map and make this resemble life like desert environment with cliffs and rolling desert dunes and so on.

2. Jungle Map and make this resemble life like jungle environment with cliffs and waterfalls and so on.

3. Mountain Map and make this resemble life like mountain environment with cliffs and small lakes and so on.

4. Island Water Map and make this resemble life like island environment with islands surrounded by water where camps, keeps and towers are the islands.To get to these islands you have swim to them which promote underwater battles and so on. But have small skinny roads between camps to towers and keeps for dolyaks to transport supply.

5. Volcanic Map and make this resemble life like volcanic environment with cliffs and running lava everywhere and so on.

One idea is to replace garrisons to be like smaller castles like SM in EB and have them in the middle of the maps.

Still makes challenging but make them fun to be on.