Guild Wars 2

WARNING: If you mean that your opinion and yours alone is ALWAYS correct: this is not the thread for you.

This post is indeed made to talk about the current state of the Obsidian Sanctum but to get people to understand – I got this short tale of my experience with it prepared.

To skip the story, press Alt+f and enter “Summary” followed by finding the second word in this post containing that word.

Note: I have never nor would never go to the ARENA zone of OS to get badges / bags seen as that zone and THAT ZONE ALONE is held for duels in OS, but NOWHERE else.

- I recall when I first started Guild Wars 2 about 4-5 months after it’s launch and how a friend of mine had fun bringing his guild down into the Obsidian Sanctum, a cluster of PvP combat – And I enjoyed that!

- It was a bloodbath, a never ending fight to maintain the room under ones Server / Guilds control and keep others from obtaining what they wanted. We fought, we died, we had fun but MOST important – The SPIRIT of PvP was there, it was filling the great halls up to the placeholder for the chest and guess what – We LOVED IT.

Then the months came to pass and one day as I reached the top of the jumping puzzle – After the Arena room I went on and did what we ALWAYS had done, started attacking enemy players. Then I was cussed at, I was badmouthed by people telling me to “kitten off” since they had a duel.

- A once great hall for PvP, bloodshed, fun, and fighting was over the months reduced to a measly playground for those not properly suit for PvP.

- My last day in the Obsidian Sanctum was a day of hate, I did as I always had done – I was standing in the pillar room, pulling all traps, doing my best to prevent others from reaching the chest at the end and gaining some badges on the go – Enjoying the game in a manner that it was set up to be done (Or else the traps would not have been there? Would they not?)

- And USUALLY this one person would not stop, he would keep on. He would bring his friends to try and get past the traps and my arrows to personally be the one to finish me off – But what happened? Hate, whisper chats filled of him getting mad for me playing this part of the game in a manner that the very PRODUCERS of the game set it UP to be played. And he brought his guild, eventually a total cluster of SIX guilds (Three from server Red, Three from Server Blue and me ALONE as the person from server green)

- Battle like nothing before, it was fun, I enjoyed it like I had done before, arrows flying to obtain bags, traps pulled to keep them at bay. It was in PvP spirit, and heck yes – I have had the same thing DONE to me, but that just made it even BETTER:

- But eventually they all withheld their attacks, they realized I was the issue here, valiantly I fought for about ten minutes, holding them off, getting cornered and forcing myself to pull the Charzooka to get them away, I was defeated and it was lovely until the whispers came:

- People telling me that my account should be banned since they all would report me, how i was a kitten, how I was a total kitten, how I did not belong in this game and just should go and die. I had fought battles like these before, months in advance on both sides, being me that held the high-ground or being the one needy to charge up and claim the throne, no complaining, no cussing, no nothing.

- I went offline only to return the next day and would receive close to 30 instant + Whisper chats of people saying how they had reported me, I were to be banned and could just log of and go die underneath a rock. And thus I did, I went offline and left the game, realizing that a once great zone for PvP battle to the ultimate deaths had been conquered by those to weak to fight for real, those who seek to bond with the enemy and play around with these “duels” of theirs.

- I returned today, after a whole year away to the once player filled halls of the Obsidian Sanctum that now was barren and the once great battles that took place had been replaced by friendship between hostile servers in a PvP environment to do measly duels. I started off as I would have done before the great change, by attacking enemy targets to actually play some PvP and I was instantly encountered by hate and people who do not realize what PvP means.

Summary: This is the end for this story, now to the real deal:

We must unite. We must take back what was rightfully ours! Enough with these people who are not fit for fight! I won’t sit back and let that they are in a greater number win over the “community” and hold us real PvPers from doing what we once did inside the Obsidian Sanctum! The zone was not made for duels!

Stand with me now and we shall make it so, for the glory that once was the Obsidian Sanctum – I call for a union to make this possible – Come and let us retake the glory that is rightfully ours, us that still UNDERSTANDS the spirit of PvP!

I don’t get it. I don’t see how you can claim duelers are not real PvPers.

OS is just an empty space, do whatever you like there- the space isn’t big enough for proper fights, has no real terrain, and was only added as a sop to try and convince people they cared.

tldr

he’s having fun ganking pve people trying to get the JP chest, but now nobody goes in there anymore.

I had much fun in the OS and then s1 happened. 9 weeks or rotating matchups broke all the rivalries we had going every night.

Maugrim your goal is noble. I suggest those of us who want the old OS back pick a day, Thursday perhaps, and just gank all enemies who dare set foot inside.

Chaba.5410:

I don’t get it. I don’t see how you can claim duelers are not real PvPers.

Do not get me wrong at this – If there was a own zone for duels I would not go at it in the manner I am currently doing: but in this situations it’s a matter regarding a “great” amount of players that starts to cuss you out for engaging in PvP combat in a still labeled PvP zone. This was never something that would happen before and thus – Yet kinda sadly; I refer to those who “Denies PvP inside the Obsidian Sanctum to have duels” as not real PvPers since they don’t follow the aspect of PvP. See an enemy, kill the enemy, don’t bow in respect in-front of them and play around without finishing one or another off.

When they started giving badges away like candy in the achievement chests, that’s when all the WvW JPs died. There is no restoring them unless some reward is put in that people can’t get any other way.

Lord Kuru.3685:

When they started giving badges away like candy in the achievement chests, that’s when all the WvW JPs died. There is no restoring them unless some reward is put in that people can’t get any other way.

I for one rarely ever went for the chest – Nor did a lot of the others I faced inside the Obsidian Sanctum, rather it be friends or foes: what brought a lot of us there was the entertainment of challenging and fun PvP combat. Traps, rocky terrain, a mash of people and guilds alike locked in combat which rewarded most of them with the sheer joy of fighting inside the halls – And of course some badges from the killing.

I just wish and seek to restore that, why does it always have to be a reward that’s suppose to make people come, for a few months it was but the sheer entertainment of the PvP combat there that brought me and many others back, then it waned as these “Duelers” gained control and people who in overall context not could “handle” to be killed in PvP.

It’s a dream at least to see that happen again, no complaining over that you are getting killed in PvP, you got back up and kept on as long as you could – never-minding the reward at the end; THAT is what I wish to restore.

Rewards are relevant because it’s a snowball effect.

Lots of reward-monkeys going to chest -> lots of true PvPers gankers trying to hunt them -> lots of actual PvPers hunting the gankers.

You take away the bottom tier, and the rest collapses.

True pvp to me is people who are ready for pvp, built for it, facing similar numbers across a battlefield (maybe with some objectives thrown in to stop it getting stale).

Ganking people who were just trying to get to a chest, attacking people from behind whilst they chat to their mates, etc isn’t pvp. It’s not wanting to face the fact ‘you’ might not actually be as good as your ego thinks you are so you avoid real fights in favour of ganking as it makes you feel good.

If you really want decent fights inside OS, then organise some with some guilds and fight on equal terms to your heart’s content.

Duelers duel to find out who is better, not who can run some cheese instgib build that relies on attacking totally unprepared players and pushing/fearing/pulling them off ledges. Beating someone in a duel is an achievement. Jumping on someone without warning isn’t.

The only time I was ever there was to get the JP. Have never been there since.

Victory.2879

It’s this kind of “point of view” that I am also referring to that killed what once was the Obsidian Sanctum, people did not consider it ganking since it was not ganking – it was pure PvP combat between guilds and solo players alike within a type of environment that brought the challenge factor up. Manage your skills, feet in addition to all the thirteen plus players around you – And as for the duelers wanting to test their skills: I will not deny them that but I will not either sit down and NOT attack an enemy inside a PvP zone since he’s about to “duel” someone, no. That’s not how its suppose to be.

If the Obsidian Sanctum was SUPPOSE to be Duel grounds, then option of PvP combat would not have been there + Until a duel system is implemented in Guild Wars 2 there should be no reason for me to stand down and let people breaking the community and ruining what was once a place for entertaining PvP have their way since they cannot properly fight back.

I am rarely the one to “surprise” attack, hell as a Range I like to shot once so that they know I’m there THEN have a real battle. Out on the fields, inside the darkroom, atop where the chest is, the trap room, up the well. All places. All the time. Real battles.

Yet don’t get me wrong – It wasn’t until the later time that people who could not stand ground turned the community into believing that killing someone in the Obsidian Sanctum was ganking, as mentioned: For my first months – half and a year + of gameplay: No-one complained about getting killed there, it was fun, challenging and not to mention REWARDING in the long run – I just wish to restore THAT, what it once WAS.

First of all, i dont get the whole duel-vs-random-pvp discussion here. Duels happen in the newly added arena, random pvp encounters in the jumping puzzle, dont they?

I also dont think the added arena is the reason why the jumping puzzle is dead.

Ragnar.4257:

Rewards are relevant because it’s a snowball effect.

Lots of reward-monkeys going to chest -> lots of true PvPers gankers trying to hunt them -> lots of actual PvPers hunting the gankers.

You take away the bottom tier, and the rest collapses.

Ragnar is right. if you take away the carrot (or if the carrot’s too small), then a lot of people just wont go there.
Badges from achievement chests are on of the issues. And as if that wasnt enough, now there arent even daily and monthly achievements for jumping puzzles anymore.

In addition to that, the pvp in the jumping puzzle was, at least for me, rarely how you described it. For the first few weeks it’s been a lot of fun, a lot of random fights, as people were still figuring out how to get through it.

After that most of the time it werent random encounters between players who want to get through the JP, but just a whole group of kittens camping at the top of the arena (often with arrow carts). And not only was that location the hardest part of the puzzle, but also the best chokepoint by far.
That had nothing to do with challenge, it was just boring and annoying.

If you want to restore what the OS was shortly after release, i think there needs to be a new JP, similar to it.
One that is rewarding, with some sort of incentive to get to the chest.
It also needs to be challenging. The OS hasnt been challenging for a long time anymore. That you could just get ported through most of it also kinda sucked.

Ganking people who were just trying to get to a chest, attacking people from behind whilst they chat to their mates, etc isn’t pvp.

If they chat and dont expect pvp in a pvp zone, then it’s their own kittening fault. doesnt mean that it isnt pvp.

RashanDale.3609

Now I do agree with much of what you are saying – And before people even start thinking so, I have never gone to the ARENA added in the Obsidian Sanctum to do PvP, I keep away from that place but it’s not just there, right by the three door entrance and atop after the chockepoint arena room as well – People doing “duels” and not EXPECTING to be engaged by ENEMY players and thus getting mad since “I don’t respect that they are dueling” A few things on that memo, ONCE again:

1: The ARENA was added for such to happen.
2: The Obsidian Sanctum still ain’t a DUEL Zone and therefore PvP combat is to be expected.
3: If you can’t handle getting killed in a PvP zone within a MMORPG: this is not the game for you.

These 3 points seems to be ignored by most of these “duelers” that ruined the Obsidian Sanctum, making people think that PvP there is wrong since “they use it” as a duel ground.

Be glad that me and those few LEFT like me does not enter the arena part to get free kills since until the Obsidian Sanctum one day maybe gets LABELED as a Duel zone – The entire zone is free play and any PvP action should not be hesitated with.

Then regarding the reward and so on, I still fail to see WHY it should be needed. I as mentioned: I started 4-5 months into the game and 2-3 months before that (Seen as my friend played and told me about events) and up and until about 6-7 months of the game for me (That being about a year in total) there was few that ever mentioned nor goaled for the chest / reward. The fun of PvP combat, killing, some badges when you proved to be the stronger / had the greatest guild and so on was what drove it. At least until – again: Those unfit for PvP gained numbers and cussed out those of us that wanted it.

OP if you want to roleplay I heard the grove and divinity’s reach are good zones for that.

The top of Obsidian Sanctum should have a control point for PPT purposes…would add another element to WvW combat.

SDZz.8260:

OP if you want to roleplay I heard the grove and divinity’s reach are good zones for that.

Sorry, speaking like this is an old habit of mine – Been playing MMORPGS for the past 10 years and well… I KNOW what the RP stands for, not just the “MMO” unlike 90% of the common player-base.

If the community wants OS to be a dueling zone, it’s going to be a dueling zone. Just like behind the windmill. Just because they aren’t specified as dueling areas doesn’t mean they aren’t. You seem to know that OS is considered a dueling area and still interrupt duels. You aren’t someone I’d like to associate with.

In addition, duelists, spvpers and WvWers are the real PvPers of this game, not puzzle campers.

Keira Ferland.5619:

If the community wants OS to be a dueling zone, it’s going to be a dueling zone. Just like behind the windmill. Just because they aren’t specified as dueling areas doesn’t mean they aren’t. You seem to know that OS is considered a dueling area and still interrupt duels. You aren’t someone I’d like to associate with.

In addition, duelists, spvpers and WvWers are the real PvPers of this game, not puzzle campers.

Well that is the issue here, these duelers has driven out us that wanted the real PvP action, the sheer number of those not capable for real fights became so many that the community was “forced” to their will – And I for one won’t sit back and just LET that continue.

And I acknowledged that people USE Obsidian Sanctum as a duel zone, but it is NOT a duel zone, so why should I hold back and not do PvP battle in a PvP area to earn badges? Now as I said, just to be “kind” I don’t SEEK out those dueling in the “arena” and so on to kill them for the bags / badges (Although as they cast us out: probably I should…) But once they start dueling OUTSIDE that zone and gets mad for that PvP suddenly takes place in a PvP environment… THAT is what I find wrong with whats happened to the Obsidian Sanctum.

Edit: Forgot the last part – It’s not about being a “Puzzle camper” heck that word didn’t exist back when Obsidian Sanctum was the REAL Obsidian Sanctum. It was called PvP combat, kill or be killed.

Maugrim.6793:

Keira Ferland.5619:

If the community wants OS to be a dueling zone, it’s going to be a dueling zone. Just like behind the windmill. Just because they aren’t specified as dueling areas doesn’t mean they aren’t. You seem to know that OS is considered a dueling area and still interrupt duels. You aren’t someone I’d like to associate with.

In addition, duelists, spvpers and WvWers are the real PvPers of this game, not puzzle campers.

Well that is the issue here, these duelers has driven out us that wanted the real PvP action, the sheer number of those not capable for real fights became so many that the community was “forced” to their will – And I for one won’t sit back and just LET that continue.

And I acknowledged that people USE Obsidian Sanctum as a duel zone, but it is NOT a duel zone, so why should I hold back and not do PvP battle in a PvP area to earn badges? Now as I said, just to be “kind” I don’t SEEK out those dueling in the “arena” and so on to kill them for the bags / badges (Although as they cast us out: probably I should…) But once they start dueling OUTSIDE that zone and gets mad for that PvP suddenly takes place in a PvP environment… THAT is what I find wrong with whats happened to the Obsidian Sanctum.

Edit: Forgot the last part – It’s not about being a “Puzzle camper” heck that word didn’t exist back when Obsidian Sanctum was the REAL Obsidian Sanctum. It was called PvP combat, kill or be killed.

The road is for driving in.

I assume you would run-over a child, because “road is intended for driving”.

Ragnar.4257:

The road is for driving in.

I assume you would run-over a child, because “road is intended for driving”.

Now I would call that a rather “out of the ratio” way to put it. And no I would not do that. But here it’s not about someone getting killed in real life, fortunately for us – This is deaths inside a game.

And it’s about looking at this in a realistic aspect, the example you just made makes the point but is way to far fetched to be taken seriously. In this case the road is made for driving, yet since children might play in the streets: you’re suppose to keep it at a low speed, and that I would do. But if you EACH DAY get to this road and the kids has filled it from start to end like a wall to wall carpet – No I would not driver over them but I would try to make a change and get all these kids OUT of the road since they should not be there in the first place.

Maugrim.6793:

RashanDale.3609

And before people even start thinking so, I have never gone to the ARENA added in the Obsidian Sanctum to do PvP

If you were explicit about this in your original post, the responses here would not have been what they are.

When you say people are not “real PvPers”, you also are not going to get much of a positive response.

Chaba.5410:

When you say people are not “real PvPers”, you also are not going to get much of a positive response.

Well I would not call them that for cussing out people for doing PvP combat inside a PvP combat zone – it kinda resents itself at that.

And sure, I will edit the original post to say that I don’t mess with people inside the Arena part.

Ragnar.4257:

Rewards are relevant because it’s a snowball effect.

Lots of reward-monkeys going to chest -> lots of true PvPers gankers trying to hunt them -> lots of actual PvPers hunting the gankers.

You take away the bottom tier, and the rest collapses.

Oh my god, it’s an ecological pyramid \o/

Primary producers = Loot chest
Primary consumers = Reward-monkeys
Secondary consumers = Gankers
Tertiary consumers = PvPers

Bertrand.3057:

Ragnar.4257:

Rewards are relevant because it’s a snowball effect.

Lots of reward-monkeys going to chest -> lots of true PvPers gankers trying to hunt them -> lots of actual PvPers hunting the gankers.

You take away the bottom tier, and the rest collapses.

Oh my god, it’s an ecological pyramid \o/

Primary producers = Loot chest
Primary consumers = Reward-monkeys
Secondary consumers = Gankers
Tertiary consumers = PvPers

Well. That’s ONE way to put it indeed. Don’t know if I am suppose to call it sad or not.

Ragnar.4257:

Rewards are relevant because it’s a snowball effect.

Lots of reward-monkeys going to chest -> lots of true PvPers gankers trying to hunt them -> lots of actual PvPers hunting the gankers.

You take away the bottom tier, and the rest collapses.

This guy gets it. The JP was destroyed by Badges of Honor in achievement chests and the introduction of tradable siege.

If ANet wants to breathe life back into OS (I don’t think they do), the solution is simple: give players a reason to loot the chest.

Victory.2879:

OS is just an empty space, do whatever you like there- the space isn’t big enough for proper fights, has no real terrain, and was only added as a sop to try and convince people they cared.

No real terrain? The map has the best terrain in the game:

1) Verticality
2) A dark room
3) Skillful jump sequences
4) A few bottlenecks (that can still be overcome by skilled groups)
5) Just the right amount of PvE (torches, traps, animal cages)

Man, the RP is strong in this one.

Soooo, OP wants Anet to label the JP as a JP and the arena as a dueling/GvG zone and that’s it?

Seeing as how most people I encounter in the JP are PvE players and uplevels, I don’t know any decent duelist that would feel accomplishment killing them. I’ve seen quite a few OS JP videos of killing said PvE players and uplevels and they’re embarrassing and boring to watch.

The time wasted camping in OS looking to fight people not interested or even that great at this game’s combat system would make me stop playing. Luckily, solo roaming in the four maps and dueling/doing GvG’s in the arena area is active enough and challenging enough. Maybe one day I git gud. Any improvement I have in fighting is from tPvP, dueling in WvW/OS or solo roaming and DEF not from playing against PvE players and uplevels.

No need to breathe any life back into OS…it’s quite active in T2 and even T3. Hell, it can be poppin’ on Thursday nights in T4.

cyyrix.6105:

Victory.2879:

OS is just an empty space, do whatever you like there- the space isn’t big enough for proper fights, has no real terrain, and was only added as a sop to try and convince people they cared.

No real terrain? The map has the best terrain in the game:

1) Verticality
2) A dark room
3) Skillful jump sequences
4) A few bottlenecks (that can still be overcome by skilled groups)
5) Just the right amount of PvE (torches, traps, animal cages)

Well you get this part of what makes the Obsidian Sanctum an awesome place for PvP combat and as well with the part about the rewards. Yet back then: there was few that came there for the chest reward, the fun, experience and entertainment of the PvP that took place brought most back for the start time – I just want to see that time return.

If someone heads into the OS arena and starts randomly fighting people engaged in duels, they are going to have the entire arena turn on them, be killed, stomped, and BMd. There is an unspoken rule that you do not interrupt mutually-agreed-upon duels, especially in OS, and you should be prepared for the consequences if you do.

Calypso.2578:

Man, the RP is strong in this one.

Soooo, OP wants Anet to label the JP as a JP and the arena as a dueling/GvG zone and that’s it?

Seeing as how most people I encounter in the JP are PvE players and uplevels, I don’t know any decent duelist that would feel accomplishment killing them. I’ve seen quite a few OS JP videos of killing said PvE players and uplevels and they’re embarrassing and boring to watch.

The time wasted camping in OS looking to fight people not interested or even that great at this game’s combat system would make me stop playing. Luckily, solo roaming in the four maps and dueling/doing GvG’s in the arena area is active enough and challenging enough. Maybe one day I git gud. Any improvement I have in fighting is from tPvP, dueling in WvW/OS or solo roaming and DEF not from playing against PvE players and uplevels.

No need to breathe any life back into OS…it’s quite active in T2 and even T3. Hell, it can be poppin’ on Thursday nights in T4.

It sounds like you didn’t spend much time in OS before the GvG arena was added. The PvE players weren’t the only people being killed. There were roaming guilds dedicated to maintaining control of the top.

If you like solo/small man roaming, that’s exactly what the puzzle used to provide. The only difference was it had a king of the hill twist, less running around, and more fighting.

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

If someone heads into the OS arena and starts randomly fighting people engaged in duels, they are going to have the entire arena turn on them, be killed, stomped, and BMd. There is an unspoken rule that you do not interrupt mutually-agreed-upon duels, especially in OS, and you should be prepared for the consequences if you do.

Well for this to apply (Although it not should as all seen as the Obsidian Sanctum is not labeled as a Duel zone) said duels SHALL take place inside the ARENA room. Outside from that it’s a FFA PvP environment. And just that fact that this has become an unspoken rule is yet again just another sad reason behind why Obsidian Sanctum has been destroyed.

And for all means, I don’t mind it being a 10v1. It makes for even more action and fun not to mention.

cyyrix.6105:

Calypso.2578:

Man, the RP is strong in this one.

Soooo, OP wants Anet to label the JP as a JP and the arena as a dueling/GvG zone and that’s it?

Seeing as how most people I encounter in the JP are PvE players and uplevels, I don’t know any decent duelist that would feel accomplishment killing them. I’ve seen quite a few OS JP videos of killing said PvE players and uplevels and they’re embarrassing and boring to watch.

The time wasted camping in OS looking to fight people not interested or even that great at this game’s combat system would make me stop playing. Luckily, solo roaming in the four maps and dueling/doing GvG’s in the arena area is active enough and challenging enough. Maybe one day I git gud. Any improvement I have in fighting is from tPvP, dueling in WvW/OS or solo roaming and DEF not from playing against PvE players and uplevels.

No need to breathe any life back into OS…it’s quite active in T2 and even T3. Hell, it can be poppin’ on Thursday nights in T4.

It sounds like you didn’t spend much time in OS before the GvG arena was added. The PvE players weren’t the only people being killed. There were roaming guilds dedicated to maintaining control of the top.

If you like solo/small man roaming, that’s exactly what the puzzle used to provide. The only difference was it had a king of the hill twist, less running around, and more fighting.

I enjoy 1v1 – 20v20.

I like being able to fight / reset as fast as possible. That’s why I don’t stomp people when roaming because they’ll need to run back to me all the way from their spawn. I’d hate to stomp someone near the end of OS JP and have to wait until they can make their way back to me (or vice versa). I let them revive so I can fight them over and over.

cyyrix.6105:

Calypso.2578:

Man, the RP is strong in this one.

Soooo, OP wants Anet to label the JP as a JP and the arena as a dueling/GvG zone and that’s it?

Seeing as how most people I encounter in the JP are PvE players and uplevels, I don’t know any decent duelist that would feel accomplishment killing them. I’ve seen quite a few OS JP videos of killing said PvE players and uplevels and they’re embarrassing and boring to watch.

The time wasted camping in OS looking to fight people not interested or even that great at this game’s combat system would make me stop playing. Luckily, solo roaming in the four maps and dueling/doing GvG’s in the arena area is active enough and challenging enough. Maybe one day I git gud. Any improvement I have in fighting is from tPvP, dueling in WvW/OS or solo roaming and DEF not from playing against PvE players and uplevels.

No need to breathe any life back into OS…it’s quite active in T2 and even T3. Hell, it can be poppin’ on Thursday nights in T4.

It sounds like you didn’t spend much time in OS before the GvG arena was added. The PvE players weren’t the only people being killed. There were roaming guilds dedicated to maintaining control of the top.

If you like solo/small man roaming, that’s exactly what the puzzle used to provide. The only difference was it had a king of the hill twist, less running around, and more fighting.

Bingo! I found ONE more that recalls how it used to be! Now it is this that I am speaking about – That time, that era, those battles, that king of the hill system, before the arena was added and so on – Now I do not expect Anet to REMOVE the arena but for:

DUELERS first of all to keep INSIDE the arena if anything.
And of course a desperate try to breathe life back into the Obsidian Sanctum.

And to Calypso.2578: Yeah, I rarely “finished” my opponents, bring them down to show them whose boss – Then let them struggle to get back up for round two, three, five, ten. It didn’t stop and that was part of the magic.

RP TOO TOO STRONK

Calypso.2578:

RP TOO TOO STRONK

As previously stated: 10 years of knowing what the “RP” in “MMORPG” actually stands for has made me chat / talk like this when things are game related.

Calypso.2578:

I enjoy 1v1 – 20v20.

I like being able to fight / reset as fast as possible. That’s why I don’t stomp people when roaming because they’ll need to run back to me all the way from their spawn. I’d hate to stomp someone near the end of OS JP and have to wait until they can make their way back to me (or vice versa). I let them revive so I can fight them over and over.

¯\O/¯ Had to be there, I guess. King of the hill in OS was great fun. Some of the best times I’ve had in gw2.

I too remember those fights to control the top of the JP. But I think you’re trying to point fingers at something that isn’t warranted. Like, the addition of the arena doesn’t explain in itself why no one bothers to be a roaming guild trying to control the JP anymore. I personally think it has a lot to do with rewards as well.

I used to do the OS JP and BL JP’s every day for the badges of honor (ascended trinkets for a solo roamer is a lot harder to get vs if I were a karma trainer). Those stupid badges used to take forever to get! Then, we started getting them handed out like cookies and I had problems with my inventory….until Account Wallet, hngggg. I love Account Wallet.

Anyway, I didn’t have problems with those camping inside. I just GS #5 or Focus #4 the ones that attack me. I always kept my Oh kitten Portal on in case I fell down on my own or someone threw me off. With the creation of EoTM, there’s even more badges being thrown at us. I actually made quite a few enemy friends inside that OS. I helped them finish the puzzle. The dark room seemed to be really difficult to people for some reason.

Why even do the JP now? The only problem I had was recent. There were 2-3 condi PU mesmers, a condi thief, and other cheesy specs camping inside the chamber room. I called in some guildies and we wiped them. They were TERRIBLE, but they were persistent.

I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. The problem is that the subset of players who enjoy the basic premise behind Obsidian Sanctum is very, very small. The typical player who loves doing JP’s (that is, they’ll do them every single day) also hates getting attacked while they’re doing it. Meanwhile, the typical PvP’er also hates being in fights where there isn’t a fair playing field (for a good example, see the widespread hate for Skyhammer against players who had builds specifically designed to punt people to their deaths), and trying to dislodge somebody who is set up in a good location with traps and more definitely falls into that category.

End result, neither group enjoys their time there, and the place is gradually abandoned. It’s not the fault of the OS-fans; they’re doing exactly what the creator of OS intended the place to be. But they also have to realise that their enjoyment comes at the expense of other players who are in OS to do something else, and so until something is done to ensure the other types of players can do what they came to do without hassle, OS will continue to be abandoned.

Well in order to make the creators of a game (Anet in this case) – You need to make them see your point and hopefully, just HOPEFULLY will they see this and do something about it: which is also part of my reason behind this post, any try made to make a change counts.

But then again to respond to you Zaxares.5419: I get what you are saying but this is one of the subjects I just don’t see. If people who does the JP each day hates getting engaged in combat then they should stop instead of whining, a great number of players recently has gone angry when being attacked and I just don’t see why: You can strike back, can’t you? Then do it! Get some spirit and battle going in here, don’t get mad because PvP combat was started in a PvP labeled zone… And about your last segment – To say it again, for the first months or so, what kept OS going was not the “different” types of people who clashed there with different goals in mind, they all came back to kick some * and that’s what had people returning: I am trying to figure out where THESE people went and not at least that spirit of battle. Screw the rewards, the fighting brought most of us back.

And in response to Chaba.5410: I know that the addition of the arena didn’t make the Obsidian Sanctum wane, hell for the start it brought even MORE people, but it was then – THEN came these duelers and gained numbers, defeated in mere two seconds of real combat but willing to “in a friendly manner duel an enemy from another server” No. Kill him. Don’t befriend him, PvP (UNTIL a DUEL zone is added) means on 99% of the matters: Kill the kitten.
Regardless: it was when they (Yes I call them the “Duelers”) started to gain control that OS fell as people were just cussed at and told to **** off whenever they hit someone since the Obsidian Sanctum was a “duel zone” now… No it’s NOT, where the heck they got this from, I don’t know but they got their way back then: yet now I think it’s time for us that not just was there from the start but that actually used the place to what it was SUPPOSE to be used for – To gain back some control.

There was a moment last night in T2 where OS had the biggest queue…

Anet really underestimated the interest for GvG. Even if they are adding PvP Stronghold they should also make OS friendlier for large scale GvG.

Xillllix.3485:

There was a moment last night in T2 where OS had the biggest queue…

Anet really underestimated the interest for GvG. Even if they are adding PvP Stronghold they should also make OS friendlier for large scale GvG.

By “friendlier” what do you mean exactly? Seen as what comes to mind for me when hearing “Making OS friendlier for GvG” would be something like – Easing up on a lot of the “rocky terrain” and traps etc.

IF Anet decides to do something to the OS – I for one hope that it would be adding more achievements or something down there, seen as the rewards officially goes beyond the spirit of PvP. Yet not a direct reward such as the chest, something to give you a reason and go down there to kill or be killed.

Maugrim, I appreciate that you’ve made this thread – but don’t get your hopes up. At least 30 threads asking for something to be done about the state of Obsidian Sanctum have been made (such as mine: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/The-State-of-Obsidian-Sanctum ) and Anet has yet to comment. I doubt they haven’t noticed, so I think they just don’t care. It’s a shame.

Power.2957:

Maugrim, I appreciate that you’ve made this thread – but don’t get your hopes up. At least 30 threads asking for something to be done about the state of Obsidian Sanctum have been made (such as mine: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/The-State-of-Obsidian-Sanctum ) and Anet has yet to comment. I doubt they haven’t noticed, so I think they just don’t care. It’s a shame.

I know, it’s hard to make game creators understand. Yet I am not a person to yield, the good old ways of the Obsidian Sanctum were some of the best… If not THE best experience I had in a MMORPG.

I have seen so much in multiple games wane over years, lost and forgotten – Yet for this I am willing to keep up until noticed. The dream is for Anet so see the situation and do something about it – and I won’t give up til that happens in one way or another.

Maugrim.6793:

But then again to respond to you Zaxares.5419: I get what you are saying but this is one of the subjects I just don’t see. If people who does the JP each day hates getting engaged in combat then they should stop instead of whining, a great number of players recently has gone angry when being attacked and I just don’t see why: You can strike back, can’t you? Then do it! Get some spirit and battle going in here, don’t get mad because PvP combat was started in a PvP labeled zone… And about your last segment – To say it again, for the first months or so, what kept OS going was not the “different” types of people who clashed there with different goals in mind, they all came back to kick some * and that’s what had people returning: I am trying to figure out where THESE people went and not at least that spirit of battle. Screw the rewards, the fighting brought most of us back.

That there in your opening statement is precisely what went wrong, Maugrim.

“If people who does the JP each day hates getting engaged in combat then they should stop instead of whining.”

And since the players who only want to fight are likely heading straight to the Arena for dueling, that leaves only the JP’ers actually doing the puzzle. So once they got their achievement, they stopped coming. Place is abandoned.

Any game mode or map needs a certain critical mass of players in order to keep interest in the area going. This is why the reward tracks in PvP were the best thing to ever happen to that game mode; only a tiny fraction of the people in there will go on to do Unranked/Ranked, but they at least fill the map, and provides a pool from which the people who DO want to step up to the next level can be drawn from.

The difference between OS and sPvP is that while newbie/terrible players can just stay in Hotjoin forever, the pure JP’ers in OS have no choice. If there are hostile players camping inside the JP, then their only option is either to grit their teeth and try to get through, or give up and go away. It’s a bit like being in a random team in Unranked and finding yourself matched up a full 5-man premade on voice comms. It happens on occasion, but it’s certainly not fun.

So again, if you want more people in OS, then you need some way that the JP’ers who don’t want to be attacked at all can get through the puzzle completely unscathed. (I’m talking like a full-on unstrippable Invulnerability buff here, not just a stealth thing which can be removed.) Hopefully then some of these players will be willing to do it the “normal” way. (To help incentivize it, maybe doing the JP with the invulnerability buff will give you the achievement, but you can’t open the chest at the end. That way, it’s purely to allow players who want the achievement to get it.)

Maugrim.6793:

cyyrix.6105:

Calypso.2578:

Man, the RP is strong in this one.

Soooo, OP wants Anet to label the JP as a JP and the arena as a dueling/GvG zone and that’s it?

Seeing as how most people I encounter in the JP are PvE players and uplevels, I don’t know any decent duelist that would feel accomplishment killing them. I’ve seen quite a few OS JP videos of killing said PvE players and uplevels and they’re embarrassing and boring to watch.

The time wasted camping in OS looking to fight people not interested or even that great at this game’s combat system would make me stop playing. Luckily, solo roaming in the four maps and dueling/doing GvG’s in the arena area is active enough and challenging enough. Maybe one day I git gud. Any improvement I have in fighting is from tPvP, dueling in WvW/OS or solo roaming and DEF not from playing against PvE players and uplevels.

No need to breathe any life back into OS…it’s quite active in T2 and even T3. Hell, it can be poppin’ on Thursday nights in T4.

It sounds like you didn’t spend much time in OS before the GvG arena was added. The PvE players weren’t the only people being killed. There were roaming guilds dedicated to maintaining control of the top.

If you like solo/small man roaming, that’s exactly what the puzzle used to provide. The only difference was it had a king of the hill twist, less running around, and more fighting.

Bingo! I found ONE more that recalls how it used to be! Now it is this that I am speaking about – That time, that era, those battles, that king of the hill system, before the arena was added and so on – Now I do not expect Anet to REMOVE the arena but for:

DUELERS first of all to keep INSIDE the arena if anything.
And of course a desperate try to breathe life back into the Obsidian Sanctum.

And to Calypso.2578: Yeah, I rarely “finished” my opponents, bring them down to show them whose boss – Then let them struggle to get back up for round two, three, five, ten. It didn’t stop and that was part of the magic.

I remember it as ‘get to the top and set up a couple AC, maybe a well placed bally’ then a couple mesmers or a ranger or two to push/pull off anyone who managed to survive..which interested me for all of five minutes. Some guilds seemed to enjoy sitting up there for hours killing the odd player trying to do the puzzle, but personally it’s not my idea of fun.

I also remember the calls for help from people doing the JP and the fact they used to count as population on maps, glad they fixed that problem- I even used to go in every now and then with a couple others and clear out gankers but knocking them off a ledge didn’t really feel that great (cheesy mechanic).

I think there is a point being missed here, the OS was one of the harshest pvp settings in the game. The fight doesnt begin when you /bow but the second you load into the zone. There is nothing special in the zone it self, it was the players who saw the challenge before them and accepted.

Youre focused on the zone but its the old rivals that made for great fights. You should be trying to find those who fight for the same reasons as you, the zone was just an accessory.

I think they should add Legendary Defenders in the JP. They are the real PvPers. No mercy!

If it’s red it’s dead. Any other “rules” you bring to the table you better be prepared to enforce yourself.