Guild Wars 2

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

WvW is about what players want it to be. Different people play WvW for different reasons. There is not only sieging and open field combat. There is GvG, roaming, fight clubs, duels, balla ball, ZvZ, dolyak parades, karma trains, commander rollete, etc.

If you want to make the ppt game more interesting, do it! But you don’t need to kill GvGs to make it so. Give the ppt people buffs that will help their game, supply capacity and siege weapon damage were just two things I said out of the top of my head, I’m sure a professional dev team can come up with more stuff.

Don’t kill the things that make people enjoy your game.

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

GvG is open field combat…

ParaldaWind.4523:

GvG is open field combat…

GvG is structured combat in the open field. Semantics to a degree but not quite the same thing.

Vena.8436:

ParaldaWind.4523:

GvG is open field combat…

GvG is structured combat in the open field. Semantics to a degree but not quite the same thing.

Even if “Open field combat” was random groups vs random groups, a stat bonus would still make that diluted and even more meaningless.

Pinko.2076:

Vena.8436:

ParaldaWind.4523:

GvG is open field combat…

GvG is structured combat in the open field. Semantics to a degree but not quite the same thing.

Even if “Open field combat” was random groups vs random groups, a stat bonus would still make that diluted and even more meaningless.

New and improved open field: now the unorganized zergballs will win every fight.

GvG’ is a side meta-game created by players not supported by Anet. Duels are a meta-game created by players not supported by Anet.

My guild is very serious about GvG’s and we do them alot and practice but to think that Anet is making changes to support GvG’s and Dueling in WvW is false assumptions when they have never said anything of the sort.

You can make a GvG match but there is nothing stopping a random guild of 20 players coming to ruin it.

If you care so much about GvG’s ask Anet to make it a mode in game or make some imaginary part of WvW to GvG or a zone inside eternal jump puzzle. If they make changes to WvW it will be in line with their vision/intent of WvW. Anyone with reason should know that.

The almighty will have to help these forums and balance if there is actually a mode implement called duel’s (press enter) forums are already crazy with balance whines about what is OP and what isn’t in what game mode and in what context. “This is OP in solo roaming” “This is OP in duels” “This is OP 1v2” “This is OP in Zerg vs Zerg”

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

It really makes me sad how little you understand about how wvw should be and what people really need. 20vs20 organized groups its the best thing that can happen in wvw. It’s not only extremely fun, it’s also creates a very nice community through good fair fights. Keep buffing the 80ppl blobs and in a couple of months almost nobody will be playing wvw.

Please, please, please don’t ruin roaming either. I suspect any sort of major stat discrepancy between small man groups is going to favor those with stat bonuses. Since most roaming groups tend to circle cap camps and sentries, roamers contribute to your ideal WvW scene of capturing/holding objectives. PvEing guards and supervisors obviously isn’t the fun part of roaming, though – it’s the small scale pvp battles. I’m worried that any major stat bonus is just going to encourage those without the buff to join the zerg, though.

Please, please, please don’t do anything to potentially upset roaming…

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

Well at least we’ve got that clarified.

We’re now clear that the hardcore/dedicated/veteran WvWers who want fair, balanced and interesting competition will continue to be 2nd class citizens, and that no support for GvG or small-scale-roaming is planned, at least not within the next 2 years.

We can rest easy now and stop speculating/hoping.

EDIT: I come across as more scathing than I mean to be there. I appreciate you dropping in and giving us some insight and feedback on the direction of WvW, rather than getting “the silent treatment”. But its difficult not to be disappointed by statements like that.

Los Re.4607:

and in a couple of months almost nobody will be playing

Said at least once in every video game forum ever.

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

Good.

GvG fans need to accept this, and push for a separate GvG mode, instead of trying to have WvW changed into something is isn’t.

I don’t want a buff that’s going to give one side a huge damage advantage. That’s just not fair for any open field engagement.

HOWEVER I wouldn’t mind buffs that are for like keeps guards etc.

The MAIN REASON me, and practically my entire guild play the game is for open field fights that are even. I mean maybe a buff wouldn’t effect it severely since we usually roll most people but it could easily make us lose.

Same with GVG and Roaming and everything else its no fair if someone has an extreme advantage. Something like this may make me leave the game..

kitten anet sometimes I just wonder.

The problem is that anet devs probably haven’t ever even tried playing wvw with an organized group . I have seen players with the anet icon a couple of times in wvw and they just cap camps and place siege in towers. Of course they won’t realize that open field fighting is by far the most fun part of their game. It would be nice if ~20 people from anet created alts and tried fighting guilds of the t2-t4 eu servers.

If there’s no way of stopping orb buff from coming back I hope it will affect only players inside towers and keeps. This way the people who enjoy sitting on their arrow cart all day will get their buff back but the people who play this game only for the fights won’t have to start searching for a new game.

My 2 cents on the “GvG” argument would be that WvW is about WvW, it was not designed to cater to “structured GvG” combat. It’s supposed to be about a large scale meta of siege and capturing bases. Just because some people enjoy GvG doesn’t mean they should compromise the integrity of what could be interesting WvW developments to cater to “GvG”. If you want open field structured GvG content, ask Anet to implement a way to play like that, don’t beg them not to put in WvW changes because they could ruin the unintended way you are playing the gamemode.

Perhaps we could ask them to not put in such changes until they give us a GvG mode then. That’d be the least they could do. Thing is that it’s actually a bit serious. GvG is all that’s keeping some of us here. Get rid of that for a month or more and a lot of us are gone and not coming back. If that doesn’t sound like a problem, you underestimate that population and/or how much they contribute to a server.

Benjamin.6235:

Perhaps we could ask them to not put in such changes until they give us a GvG mode then. That’d be the least they could do. Thing is that it’s actually a bit serious. GvG is all that’s keeping some of us here. Get rid of that for a month or more and a lot of us are gone and not coming back. If that doesn’t sound like a problem, you underestimate that population and/or how much they contribute to a server.

Well, that’s not selfish or anything.

Less people in WvW because QQ GvG? Less que for me. Bye.

More interesting fights with serious game changing objectives and consequences? Yes plz. Gives us more to do in WvW, something else to fight over/win back.

It’ll be much appreciated it.

Ragnar.4257:

Well at least we’ve got that clarified.

We’re now clear that the hardcore/dedicated/veteran WvWers who want fair, balanced and interesting competition will continue to be 2nd class citizens, and that no support for GvG or small-scale-roaming is planned, at least not within the next 2 years.

We can rest easy now and stop speculating/hoping.

It is also quite funny how the “hardcore/dedicated/veteran WvWers” apparently don’t have a clue about what WvW is supposed to be.
They have NEVER advertised it as fair or balanced, so why are you surprised they won’t support people wanting those kind of fights?
There already is a game-mode for people that want fair fights. It is called sPvP.

You guys need to separate WvW from GvG. They are two very different things. Yes, you currently might GvG in WvW but that’s because there is no other place for it.

As for WvW itself, I do think the balance has swayed too much in favor of siege and less in favorite of open field combat.

Might be fun to replace the lake in the BL maps with a large center point. Do not allow any siege to be placed there. It would be purely open field PvP combat. See if people enjoy that or not.

Roaming is still WvW. That’ll get ruined by combat buffs. That’s my main complaint with this idea.

How about reduced damage from aoe (including arrow carts) as a potential buff? Wouldn’t kitten up roaming and would still be a boon for the holding side in terms of keep siege.

@ Devon
Okay, you’re gonna balance stuff for points, keeps, etc. We get it, but at the same time, you’ll be killing one of the main reason any decent guilds still play this game. So, for the love of god, add something, ANYTHING, that can let us do our GvGs in peace.

We’re not asking for much, just add a 5th map on that dropdown menu. It doesn’t need to have anything in it, just BLANK FLAT TERRAIN. We don’t need a UI, ranking system, or anything. We just want fights. Heck, if you can’t add it to the dropdown, add a little portal on the BLs. It doesn’t have to be a shiny portal, an interact button will do. Something similar to the JP also works, we don’t care, anything. For a company that adds a new arena/map every 2 weeks, that goes away so fast, and yet are so polished, are you sure you can’t add something of the sort in any time, and that would save the rest of your competitive community still standing?

Before I say anything I just want to thank Devon for actually trying to tease a bit of information at us. I also want to thank the forum users that tried and warned Devon about the consequences that would’ve happened to the community if they implemented them as a stat buff.
However, we still don’t even know what kind of a buff it will be? Did you guys fail to notice how they thoughtfully placed the wvw skills in the game not affecting open field combat. They knew what to do then and we didn’t even think about how it could affect open field combat because siege bonuses and keep stuff and guard stuff doesn’t affect open field combat. Notice how I use the word open field combat when I could just say GVG. Because thats what this is. If they are not smart they will not affect open field combat in wvw because, really, you guys that do gvg just enjoy the fighting in open field without any siege weapons.
I wouldn’t even mind a orb that gives some form of a buff to help the server that has the orb. Sure it may harm gvg but gvg actually isn’t in the game guys. If they really care about the gvg community we would already have arenas for it. I’m sure they know they would lose players if they killed of gvg so if they ever put in gvg it would be at the same time as the orbs i’m sure.
If you already want gvg in the game so badly sign this: http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/official-gvg-setup-in-gw2/

I don’t even want to mention gvg in this thread and just say instead of killing of gvg, killing of fair open field combat.
PEACE OUT!

SomeoneElse.3685:

Before I say anything I just want to thank Devon for actually trying to tease a bit of information at us. I also want to thank the forum users that tried and warned Devon about the consequences that would’ve happened to the community if they implemented them as a stat buff.
However, we still don’t even know what kind of a buff it will be? Did you guys fail to notice how they thoughtfully placed the wvw skills in the game not affecting open field combat. They knew what to do then and we didn’t even think about how it could affect open field combat because siege bonuses and keep stuff and guard stuff doesn’t affect open field combat. Notice how I use the word open field combat when I could just say GVG. Because thats what this is. If they are not smart they will not affect open field combat in wvw because, really, you guys that do gvg just enjoy the fighting in open field without any siege weapons.
I wouldn’t even mind a orb that gives some form of a buff to help the server that has the orb. Sure it may harm gvg but gvg actually isn’t in the game guys. If they really care about the gvg community we would already have arenas for it. I’m sure they know they would lose players if they killed of gvg so if they ever put in gvg it would be at the same time as the orbs i’m sure.
If you already want gvg in the game so badly sign this: http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/official-gvg-setup-in-gw2/

I don’t even want to mention gvg in this thread and just say instead of killing of gvg, killing of fair open field combat.
PEACE OUT!

" Are the orbs coming back? No. Are we bringing back the buff? Yes, although the way you get it and hold it is going to be drastically different. Are you going to see a major map change in concert with this? Yes. Is it coming soon? Most definitely." -Devon Carver

Jamais vu.5284:

Los Re.4607:

and in a couple of months almost nobody will be playing

Said at least once in every video game forum ever.

I don’t know what it is said in every mmo forum and i maybe was wrong about the 2 months thing. But Arena net and all the people that defend the blobs and speak bad about organized guilds, don’t realise that organized guilds are the only thing that keep wvw alive atm. Blobs NEED the organized 25man guilds because they are the ONLY opponent that can hit them and keep the PVP in wvw.

Seriously what do you think will happen when guilds decide that they are wasting their time and move along? WvW will be dead. You will only see midnight karma trains that have no intention of pvp and they will just farm karma/loot. I’m every day in wvw from the beginning and no matter what devs say i can assure you guilds are leaving and losing interest one by one. Even blobby german servers are losing ppl and they all gather to a few for maximize their karma/loot train profit (Elona, RS, Abba).

Arena Net must realise that if they want to keep wvw alive must give something to the guilds and must buff the organized gameplay NO the spamming 1 pve’s that come to wvw only because they want to farm. For the last time listen to the people that actually PLAY wvw. We don’t need better siege, we don’t more siege skills, we don’t need buff to the blobs, we don’t even need fairness in wvw. We just need PvP in WvW.

Crazy right?

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

You might aswell say “We want wvw to be the coverage-laggy-siege-blob wars those gvg’ers dread so much” (just like it’s now in NA and some EU servers – VS i’m watching you).

Well, thanks to be honest, at least we can stop hoping for updates discourgaing that, pushing to a different wvw meta.

Hint: you’re doing the worst thing for wvw longevity with this line. Guilds are the soul of wvw. Guilds play the best wvw. The game mode as you made it and as you pushed it now to this meta is terribly boring and bad. It’s plenty of suggestions to revert this trend. Ignoring the backbone of skilled wvw play and the whole bunch of suggestions to punish the current meta and push it towards more small scale figths across map, you’re actually killing any future of decent wvw. And you’re killing 1/3rd of your game.

It is funny how the GvG:ers claim that they are the “backbone of skilled WvW-play” and yet they do not actually WvW…

AndrewSX.3794:

Key words: “backbone of skilled WvW-play”

If “playing wvw” means doing it “effectively”, thus blob 80+ players 24/7, run from any fair fights or when you’re not outnumbering enemy 3:1, then bunker up all day in T3 keeps with ACs, then yes.

I do not want to play – that – wvw.

But GvG is not WvW at all, so I can’t really see how you can claim to be the “backbone of skilled WvW-play” since you don’t actually do WvW-play at ALL.

@lordkrall: That’s utter nonsense. The vast majority of guilds who GvG spend 6 days a week playing WvW “properly”, that is taking, defending and upgrading keeps/towers, and then set aside 1 evening per week for GvG/training/skirmishes/dueling.

If you think GvG guilds do nothing other than GvG, then you simply display your ignorance of the community.

lordkrall.7241:

AndrewSX.3794:

Key words: “backbone of skilled WvW-play”

If “playing wvw” means doing it “effectively”, thus blob 80+ players 24/7, run from any fair fights or when you’re not outnumbering enemy 3:1, then bunker up all day in T3 keeps with ACs, then yes.

I do not want to play – that – wvw.

But GvG is not WvW at all, so I can’t really see how you can claim to be the “backbone of skilled WvW-play” since you don’t actually do WvW-play at ALL.

Where i said i’m a gvger?

Only gvgers should want fair fights?

I’m a normal wvwer. I just despise and consider terrible current meta of coverage and blob wars and ridicolous that anet is fine with it to the point of pushing it even further patch by patch.

I want a better wvw and more incetives to current meta is the opposite we need.

Also, what ragnar said.

Ragnar.4257:

@lordkrall: That’s utter nonsense. The vast majority of guilds who GvG spend 6 days a week playing WvW “properly”, that is taking, defending and upgrading keeps/towers, and then set aside 1 evening per week for GvG/training/skirmishes/dueling.

If you think GvG guilds do nothing other than GvG, then you simply display your ignorance of the community.

I couldn’t agree any more. About every skilled WvW guild does GvGs.
→ http://www.gw2gvg.com

Simply because it helps you improve the same way a good roamer duels a lot. You learn from your opponents, you learn how to counter certain situations or what or what not to do. GvG should be a part of this game.. I really do hope at some point it’ll be there.. :/

GvGs provide you with the best and most fair fights and yes, most of those guilds are backbones of their server. You’d be naive saying they aren’t, just look at the website, I know about every single one of those guilds.

GvG is sPvP with more number. Go talk about it on sPvP forum and ask for your deathmatch arena with spectators.

Gudradain.3892:

GvG is sPvP with more number. Go talk about it on sPvP forum and ask for your deathmatch arena with spectators.

WvW is zergballing for karma and loot. Might as well just to PvE and farm some champions or dragons.

Halo.8976:

Gudradain.3892:

GvG is sPvP with more number. Go talk about it on sPvP forum and ask for your deathmatch arena with spectators.

WvW is zergballing for karma and loot. Might as well just to PvE and farm some champions or dragons.

Only for those that don’t know how to play WvW…

WvW is strategic and intensive use of siege weapon as well as complex community organization in order to achieve total domination against the opposing servers!

Gudradain.3892:

Halo.8976:

Gudradain.3892:

GvG is sPvP with more number. Go talk about it on sPvP forum and ask for your deathmatch arena with spectators.

WvW is zergballing for karma and loot. Might as well just to PvE and farm some champions or dragons.

Only for those that don’t know how to play WvW…

WvW is strategic and intensive use of siege weapon as well as complex community organization in order to achieve total domination against the opposing servers!

And in the same way, GvG is only sPvP to those that don’t know how to play GvG.

Your petard, sir; you appear to have hoisted it.

GvG is sPvP…

If you want a guild fighting against other guilds and climb in the ranking, ask it to the PvP dev, not WvW.

Gudradain.3892:

WvW is strategic and intensive use of siege weapon as well as complex community organization in order to achieve total domination against the opposing servers!

I see…

GvG, siege, roaming, large scale battles, sporadic duels, zergs, blobs and mainly PvP is what made WvW what it is today, not perfect by any means, but not completely kitten broken as other put it. However, changes that only include one part of the gamers community and needs while alienating further another I don’t think is wise – we can have space for all, and not sure buffs is the answer.

See I help you with GvG, I created a thread on the PvP forum for all of you :

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/GvG-Deathmatch-Arena-with-Spectators/first#post2651022

Not having really high hope and counting the minutes until it get shut down but seriously it makes more sense to ask for an arena to the PvP team. So, if you ever want to see it in game, start asking to the right people.

SomeoneElse.3685:

However, we still don’t even know what kind of a buff it will be? Did you guys fail to notice how they thoughtfully placed the wvw skills in the game not affecting open field combat. They knew what to do then and we didn’t even think about how it could affect open field combat because siege bonuses and keep stuff and guard stuff doesn’t affect open field combat.

Have you seen the guard defense tree? That’s a ridiculous 2500 extra health. There’s no reason to pretend that Anet knows what they’re doing. Practically every change to WvW shows that they don’t. If they did by some chance actually know what they were doing, we wouldn’t have every decent organized guild grouping up at some corner of a map for interesting fights. We go there to hide from all the mistakes they’ve done in the past year, so forgive us for being nervous.

Vena.8436:

mjharrison.3209:

DAOC’s Darkness Falls was a masterstroke on multiple levels.

GW1 had the same concept and, to put it lightly, it was a terrible idea and was shelved.

PvE’rs don’t want to have to wait/deal with PvP to do PvE.
PvP’rs don’t want PvE’rs clogging up queues to “get the leet dungeon!”.

If you put anything of worth inside of said dungeon, you exasperate the problem (OS is bad enough with all the tears and q.q it produces over simple things like kites). Considering that GW1 is years younger than DAoC and existed amongst the modern generation of gamers… well, you get my point.

DAOC was released 4 years before GW1… In DAOC, DF was a massive success, no reason to think it would be any less successful in today’s market.

GW2 already has the foundation of a Darkness Falls – just extend the existing jumping puzzle instance.

lioka qiao.8734:

I like that idea up there that Orbs are a bonus to siege damage or supply capacity. A king of the hill objective that provides that kind of buff would break up zergs. Whoever owns the buff becomes a serious threat on the map. To defend it the zerg would have to leave behind x number of players to outnumber anyone trying to Ninja the orb shrine.

+1

I like anything that will break up zergs without interfering in roaming play. If Anet introduce stat bonuses, for me, that’s a clear sign that they don’t understand the WvW players.

shadowraith.9124:

lioka qiao.8734:

I like that idea up there that Orbs are a bonus to siege damage or supply capacity. A king of the hill objective that provides that kind of buff would break up zergs. Whoever owns the buff becomes a serious threat on the map. To defend it the zerg would have to leave behind x number of players to outnumber anyone trying to Ninja the orb shrine.

+1

I like anything that will break up zergs without interfering in roaming play. If Anet introduce stat bonuses, for me, that’s a clear sign that they don’t understand the WvW players.

This is NOT going to break up zergs…I don’t understand what these developers are thinking… I believe their heart is in the right place, but as always they continue to do things they clearly don’t understand the ramifications for…

This is how it’s going to play out in reality….the 80 person zergball is going to steamroll the “Easy” to obtain objective….then proceed to stack swiftness steam roll the map and the other zerg’s because they have +50 all stats and increased damage to everyone in their group…they will roll the map like they would have normally and everytime someone in roaming group flips the king of the hill objective or tries to take it…(they will probably leave a scout there to watch it… I know I would…) said zerg ball is going to run over and retake or defend the objective….rinse and repeat over and over and over.

The only thing you can hope for is that your server has a high enough population to match their zerg ball…otherwise … welcome to stomp fest 2013! Enjoy!

I hope Anet devs learn from this thread that unless you stop something early it’s going to grow and spin out of control. WvW is supposed to be about servers and not about guilds. GvG, duels or whatever else should be considered griefing especially in maps where people are on a queue to get in WvW. If you want this to happen make different maps like the jp one and let the rest enjoy WvW.

From some of the replies I actually get the impression that some of the 111 zerg ballers actually want the game to be that way as opposed to they are just taking advantage of the most effective way to farm stuff……. Maybe the solution to everything is to have PVE and PVP servers .. On the PVE servers they could all zerg ball together to their hearts content and sell the other 11 number keys on their keyboards. And the PVP servers could do roaming and guild group play amongst each other.

I really really dont want to see any stat buffs. Sure bring back orbs or whatever just dont touch peoples stats. Give it something like outmanned buff if you wish or something else to give you a strategic edge just no stats please. As it is now i always stay away from the brakeout event already. Stat bonuses dont add to the fun in any way, just the opposite.

Its not only a bad mechanic, giving someone some better numbers, its just not new in any way and doesnt solve any problems. Give us something new instead. The one controlling the orbs can get some new siege or simular. Not just 1100 instead of 1000. Thats so boring and gamebraking.

DevonCarver.5370:

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

GvG related Show with no advertise and no backup from devs : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM3BvFqP_Rw / 4500 viewes and still rising.

Spvp video with every backup it could get!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7oXvUHqgnY / 2500 viewes ….

When is Anet goin to see at last whats popular inside their game? GvG system/area/etc only has to offer more to the game than take.This is wrong,i m sorry Devon but it is…

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

Then I will encourage you to reconsider your focus in regards to WvW because the only thing that has kept it alive for a majority of guilds, despite anything and everything you do to ruin the mechanics, is the attempts by guilds and their members to organize open-field combat and GvG.

If you’re honestly trying to look at what you could do to keep players hooked and interested in your game, you need to start realizing the potential that Guild vs. Guild has, and stop worrying about your silly siege mastery additions and wxp.

WvW isn’t about the karma train and PvE experience anymore. A lot of us are PvPers. We want to fight against heavy odds, and test our mettle in a fair, organized fight. We don’t all look at the map and think of how we can utilize siege for effective objective capture, we’re looking at how we can use the terrain to our advantage in a combat situation.

The level of neglect for the guild system has been vast since launch, and now you’ve suggested to me that you want to continue to encourage karma training, and not open-field combat and GvG, where you can actually shine as a guild and become recognized.

There are other games releasing, and you still have the opportunity to drive your playerbase away.

Don’t read this comment as me trying to complain at you. Criticize? Maybe, but mostly I’m trying to warn you. Maybe Open-field combat and GvG wasn’t your intention for what WvW would become, but that’s how the scene has evolved, and I’m being honest when I tell you that you should try to evolve with it, or provide us with another medium; an actual GvG arena.

However, I highly doubt we will see any kind of GvG format within the next two years, since you can’t even bother to fix how the Guild Message of the Day is edited, which is why I’m encouraging you to consider how your WvW changes will impact this level of play.

If you really don’t believe me about WvW guilds and GvG/Open-field combat. I’m on the Tarnished Coast server, the Unofficial RP server and a heavy PvE server. Our WvW guilds are very fight-centric. Even all of our PUG Lords love open-field. Guilds such as EP, TSL, RE, ZN, CERN, and KH all GvG, and all of these guilds and others are more interested in finding fights on maps than actually taking objectives.

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

First off, <3. Just making an argument, don’t wanna bash.

However, I think you’re completely missing your target here. You’re trying to make WvW appeal to the transient casuals here. The problem is: the WvW casuals and fairweathers aren’t the ones who keep WvW alive. It’s the dedicated, hardcore audience that comes back every day and plays.

You alienate your core, and you won’t have it anymore. PLEASE remember that. Adding stat buffs based on objectives is blind, not only in the way it affects the actual gameplay, but also in how it affects the player activities such as GvG.

Your core right now? They play WvW for pretty much one reason: Large scale PvP. The objective game of PPT has become a means to an end. That end is fighting. You keep trying to make it the reverse. People don’t WANT to fight to gain property. People want the property so they can fight… If you succeed in killing off the players’ ability to do the things they WANT to do, you will lose those players, I absolutely guarantee it.

Equinox.4195:

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

Then I will encourage you to reconsider your focus in regards to WvW because the only thing that has kept it alive for a majority of guilds, despite anything and everything you do to ruin the mechanics, is the attempts by guilds and their members to organize open-field combat and GvG.

If you’re honestly trying to look at what you could do to keep players hooked and interested in your game, you need to start realizing the potential that Guild vs. Guild has, and stop worrying about your silly siege mastery additions and wxp.

WvW isn’t about the karma train and PvE experience anymore. A lot of us are PvPers. We want to fight against heavy odds, and test our mettle in a fair, organized fight. We don’t all look at the map and think of how we can utilize siege for effective objective capture, we’re looking at how we can use the terrain to our advantage in a combat situation.

The level of neglect for the guild system has been vast since launch, and now you’ve suggested to me that you want to continue to encourage karma training, and not open-field combat and GvG, where you can actually shine as a guild and become recognized.

There are other games releasing, and you still have the opportunity to drive your playerbase away.

Don’t read this comment as me trying to complain at you. Criticize? Maybe, but mostly I’m trying to warn you. Maybe Open-field combat and GvG wasn’t your intention for what WvW would become, but that’s how the scene has evolved, and I’m being honest when I tell you that you should try to evolve with it, or provide us with another medium; an actual GvG arena.

However, I highly doubt we will see any kind of GvG format within the next two years, since you can’t even bother to fix how the Guild Message of the Day is edited, which is why I’m encouraging you to consider how your WvW changes will impact this level of play.

If you really don’t believe me about WvW guilds and GvG/Open-field combat. I’m on the Tarnished Coast server, the Unofficial RP server and a heavy PvE server. Our WvW guilds are very fight-centric. Even all of our PUG Lords love open-field. Guilds such as EP, TSL, RE, ZN, CERN, and KH all GvG, and all of these guilds and others are more interested in finding fights on maps than actually taking objectives.

…and its not like WvW guilds who GvG in a GvG system will be in GvG matches 24/7. They need places to practice blob busting- and WvW can satisfy that even with the GvG system implemented.

If you want to create an E-Sport- this is how it starts. With crews from all over the world, from the few pioneers to the now 80+ active crews.

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

I am exceptionally disappointed to see how narrow-minded and ignorant a developer can become. Rather than supporting an emergent game-play style you respond to this topic with what must be one of the worst possible responses I have seen from you yet.

Let me correct you on your glaringly obvious mistake and possibly educate you in the way you require. World vs World is what the players want it to be, not what it may have been designed for, not what you believe it to be, not what you scream from the top of your lungs what you wish it to be… it is what PLAYERS want it to be. If players didn’t want there to be GvG then guess what? There wouldn’t be GvG but there is a large scene for it now and to what must be your utter disbelief – huge swathes of servers actually have pride in the guilds that represent them in both WvW and GvG.

If you understood the above and actually realised that we, the players who focus on World vs World and want to actually fight other players (not bunker inside keeps), are not happy at all with the way we have been dealt with for quite some time then you may actually begin to build bridges, however with the above statement it is quite obvious that you are oblivious to much of what is occurring in the world of World vs World at the moment (Oh I’m sure you can read your metrics, well done).

You may also wish to understand that with the lack of any direct competition with other games at the moment GW2 does hold dominance in this area but that is not through great support for the WvW community, it is because as I said, there is a dire lack of competition and I can assure you that once said competition comes out you may wish to hold onto your seat because I can assure you that your community will shrink and quite drastically.

I have kept off the forum for quite some time, ever since your complete disaster of implementing Arrowcart changes and so on but I simply couldn’t help myself in responding to this reply. Hopefully you will see the light – I wont hold my breath however.

Yours faithfully,
Aneu

Aneu.1748:

DevonCarver.5370:

Equinox.4195:

So, in regards to GvG and openfield, I don’t see a lot of “rampant speculation” going on. If nothing else, you chose your words poorly. The complaints about this new system potentially killing the GvG scene is entirely grounded.

This forum and this topic in particular are about WvW. WvW is about sieging and controlling objectives and about open field combat. All our changes are with that totality in mind and will continue to be.

I am exceptionally disappointed to see how narrow-minded and ignorant a developer can become. Rather than supporting an emergent game-play style you respond to this topic with what must be one of the worst possible responses I have seen from you yet.

Let me correct you on your glaringly obvious mistake and possibly educate you in the way you require. World vs World is what the players want it to be, not what it may have been designed for, not what you believe it to be, not what you scream from the top of your lungs what you wish it to be… it is what PLAYERS want it to be. If players didn’t want there to be GvG then guess what? There wouldn’t be GvG but there is a large scene for it now and to what must be your utter disbelief – huge swathes of servers actually have pride in the guilds that represent them in both WvW and GvG.

If you understood the above and actually realised that we, the players who focus on World vs World and want to actually fight other players (not bunker inside keeps), are not happy at all with the way we have been dealt with for quite some time then you may actually begin to build bridges, however with the above statement it is quite obvious that you are oblivious to much of what is occurring in the world of World vs World at the moment (Oh I’m sure you can read your metrics, well done).

You may also wish to understand that with the lack of any direct competition with other games at the moment GW2 does hold dominance in this area but that is not through great support for the WvW community, it is because as I said, there is a dire lack of competition and I can assure you that once said competition comes out you may wish to hold onto your seat because I can assure you that your community will shrink and quite drastically.

I have kept off the forum for quite some time, ever since your complete disaster of implementing Arrowcart changes and so on but I simply couldn’t help myself in responding to this reply. Hopefully you will see the light – I wont hold my breath however.

Yours faithfully,
Aneu

Your post is nice, i can sign on it, but we know that speaking with Anet will not change even single things. We just need to wait for new game.