Guild Wars 2

sminkiottone.6972:

I’m more worried about the build diversity, most people will stick to the current meta.

But then what happens when the meta changes ? will it ever change after Ascended armors ?

And, will we be able to have more than 1 build ? and what about our alts ?

Imho ascended will cripple WvW

This is the real problem. When your build becomes obsolete because of balancing/nerfing or because of new skills being released, are you going to craft a new set of Ascended gear?

It’s not hard,anet. Don’t include ascended weapons/trinkets/armor in wvw. or scale them down to the respective exotics.

Khayoss.2019:

/snip

I on the opposite think that your attitude is totally wrong.

You make it sound like gaming was an epic task, a daily struggle to survive, like you were on a holy crusade for awesomeness.

But this is just a game. A video game. There is nothing epic to it. Nothing you can do or make in here is of any importance. Nothing what you did in a video game before is of any importance either. Same stands for what I did in video games before (your not the only adult in here, although you like to make it sound that way). So trying to make players think they are special when they go out day after day to farm champions is just lying to them.

Games should be about fun, having a good time with a couple of friends on voice communication, some laughs. That’s all what it is about. And that’s why this whole “work” argument in a video game is completely wrong.

Solstice.1097:

If they just gave ascended armor the ability to change stats OOC and maybe add some cool visual effects or even the ability to change the look of it that would be enough to make it worth grinding out as a PvE player without having to add stat bonuses.

Why do PvE players need stat bonuses? It’s not like ANY PvE content is so hard that you’ll need it.

I got a response from Devon when I made this same suggestion some time ago, giving ascended equipment the same stat selection system that legendary weapons have. He flat said no, that’s reserved as a perk for legendaries.

The best we can hope for is maybe, maybe some sort of re-forge system where you can change the stat combo of ascended equipment for a nominal fee like traits. Although that would not be my preferred method, it sure does beat having to grind out even more gear and find a place to keep it in your inventory or bank.

In my view this has to be an option because skill balancing drastically changes how you might want to build your character. It is untenable to ask players to grind out all new equipment and buy even more stuff to transfer over skins and expensive runes when this happens. Mind you, we aren’t even talking about experimenting with new builds without spending massive gold.

Elmo Benchwarmer.3025:

Khayoss.2019:

/snip

I on the opposite think that your attitude is totally wrong.

You make it sound like gaming was an epic task, a daily struggle to survive, like you were on a holy crusade for awesomeness.

But this is just a game. A video game. There is nothing epic to it. Nothing you can do or make in here is of any importance. Nothing what you did in a video game before is of any importance either. Same stands for what I did in video games before (your not the only adult in here, although you like to make it sound that way). So trying to make players think they are special when they go out day after day to farm champions is just lying to them.

Games should be about fun, having a good time with a couple of friends on voice communication, some laughs. That’s all what it is about. And that’s why this whole “work” argument in a video game is completely wrong.

Amen!

Video games are nothing more than a fun waste of time. To say otherwise is foolish.

I never understand the people who say “You gotta earn it.” like it some how makes you a god among gamers cause you spent 100 hours grinding something you did not enjoy to ‘earn’ some stat bonus.

I feel this game is in danger of slipping into old MMO ideas such as grind forever if you want to be on par stat wise with the top players. When we were told during the prelaunch hype that is something the were against.

Will my engi kits be made ascended now that everyone will be able to have ascended weapons and armor and trinkets? When weapons were released, the kits had ascended stats for a day or 2, then it was quickly patched. When can we expect to have them again?

Atherakhia.4086:

Rangers actually don’t gain full benefit from the armor or weapons either.

Rangers, as a class, have the one seriously legit complaint about ascended gear regardless of game mode. Their class design (being that pets derive no benefit from their owner’s gear, plus their own benefit from stats on the armor they wear is scaled down because of the fact that the pet accounts for significant portion of damage and utility) essentially screws them harder and harder each time a new level of gear is added.

Khayoss.2019:

Atherakhia.4086:

Rangers actually don’t gain full benefit from the armor or weapons either.

Rangers, as a class, have the one seriously legit complaint about ascended gear regardless of game mode.

Same with engi as I just posted above. I believe ele conjure weapons have the same issue.

Agreed with most of the stuff posted in here, we dont need extra stats in this game.

My only complaint with the current system is it is needlessly complex and the cost to level the crafting/create the item is extremely expensive for hardcore WvW players. They should have created a simpler system and allowed badges to offset some of the cost.

I have spent far more time grinding for gold than mats. Then you have to follow this 100 step plan to craft a single item. Does anyone think the act of crafting is actually fun in this game?

Solstice.1097:

If they just gave ascended armor the ability to change stats OOC and maybe add some cool visual effects or even the ability to change the look of it that would be enough to make it worth grinding out as a PvE player without having to add stat bonuses.

Why do PvE players need stat bonuses? It’s not like ANY PvE content is so hard that you’ll need it.

second post in a thread actually makes sense. Rest of thread means nothing!!!!!!

(i actually agree entirely and think they shouldve added in ascended armor but just made the pieces nice visual items/effects with the same stats as exotics, but the ability to change your stats on each piece. Thus eliminating the need for multiple armor sets and also gaining new cool visual effects. I also think they shouldve done this with the weapons also. #my2cents)

Elmo Benchwarmer.3025:

Khayoss.2019:

/snip

I on the opposite think that your attitude is totally wrong.

You make it sound like gaming was an epic task, a daily struggle to survive, like you were on a holy crusade for awesomeness.

But this is just a game. A video game. There is nothing epic to it. Nothing you can do or make in here is of any importance. Nothing what you did in a video game before is of any importance either. Same stands for what I did in video games before (your not the only adult in here, although you like to make it sound that way). So trying to make players think they are special when they go out day after day to farm champions is just lying to them.

Games should be about fun, having a good time with a couple of friends on voice communication, some laughs. That’s all what it is about. And that’s why this whole “work” argument in a video game is completely wrong.

If this was an FPS on Xbox I’d totally agree with you. MMO’s and RPG’s in general, are meant to be a bit more long term oriented than that FPS or adventure games though. They are supposed to hold out rewards that take time to get to so that the game isn’t ‘over’ in just a few short hours. I could have gotten my lute over the course of 4 or 5 months, but I wanted it now… so I did what I needed to do in order to get what I wanted. I didn’t ‘need’ an epic weapon in EQ, and I didn’t stay up till 4am to get it… it took me nearly 3 years to finally get that weapon without grinding for it, but it felt all the more rewarding when I finally turned in the stuff to that quest mob.

So let me ask you something…

True story: Personally, I love crafting in MMO’s – it’s one of the first thing I check out when I’m looking at playing a new one to see what kind of systems they have in place and if I think it’s going to be fun or not. I also happen to hate running around and harvesting materials… it feels like a waste of my time and I feel like I’m staring at my GPS mini-map moreso than just playing the game. I know I’m going to need those materials to craft… but I don’t want any part of the most efficient way to get them. Alternate methods exist, like breaking down gear or being rewarded for quests/zone completion, things that I personally find a lot more fun than harvesting. Those ways are not as fast as just going out and harvesting the kitten nodes, though. I can also buy everything I need off of the TP, but that can be prohibitively expensive and lets say I don’t have that kind of money.

Would it be reasonable for me now to complain that I am being forced to engage in a game mode that I don’t enjoy in order to craft, because by not harvesting my mats other people are now achieving the goal I set for myself faster than I can? After all, it’s my free time and this is a video game… I’m supposed to enjoy it, and now by not engaging in some activities that I don’t want to other people are going to get to be master crafters a lot easier than I am.

I understand your argument khayoss, and it’s valid, but for people like me who do some of the non-reward but vital jobs in WvW maps, this just makes those jobs even less appealing than they already were, and pretty much guarantees that if I go farm to get my gear, nobody else will do it either.

This is true. Something I’ve said before (in this thread even I think) is that players have to help other players out. Everyone on the map benefits from you performing the task you perform… they should be kicking back to you for performing it, or take their turn to let you go out and do some other stuff – otherwise this game is just work for you now too. Our guild works this way, I don’t see why others wouldn’t either. If yours doesn’t, they need to re-evaluate their priorities. One of the best things about playing an MMO is the opportunity to play with other people, and part of that is helping them accomplish their goals. Being that you are a team player – as are the many scouts and watchers out there – I’m willing to bet that a lot of other players like you and appreciate what you do and would be more than happy to thank you for your efforts if you would ask for help.

Oh it’s not about appreciation, I get plenty of that, and my server loves loves its scouts. I’m just pointing out the reason why I, and others like me, likely won’t be grinding out ascended gear. And how it affects the WvW maps as a whole. The gear shouldn’t be in WvW. Particularly when it rewards only those who zerg.

No matter how long it will take to get the best gear there will be always ppl who grind and ppl who do not grind. I didn’t like the discussion about “hey it’s not that hard to get this or that, i did it why you can’t do that?”. Many ppl do not have much time to play (work, real life, bla bla and bla) and every layer is onother pain in the axx.The point here is, i guess, adding layer over layer of gear will increase the gap between them. Food was a layer, ascended trinket was as well, but the trend the game is following doesn’t go after the statement of some developer wich the threand opener posted.

Both ways are legit but if we must follow the original idea i have to say no to ascended weapon, gear and even trinkets.

Sororita.3465:

Solstice.1097:

Why do PvE players need stat bonuses? It’s not like ANY PvE content is so hard that you’ll need it.

I dont know about that, i was spamming one for a good few hours, nearly had to press two…very stressful.

Spoken like a true PvE’r who’s never stepped foot in WvW? (except to blob grind out season 1 living rewards of course).

I think he was being sarcastic.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Sororita.3465:

Solstice.1097:

Why do PvE players need stat bonuses? It’s not like ANY PvE content is so hard that you’ll need it.

I dont know about that, i was spamming one for a good few hours, nearly had to press two…very stressful.

Spoken like a true PvE’r who’s never stepped foot in WvW? (except to blob grind out season 1 living rewards of course).

Joke is up here —-————————

Your head is down here —-————————

I play GW2 because of the WvW and the promise “Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game.”

I log in to play wvw for some hours and log off again. T6 mats are rare in wvw, I don’t even get rare items very often. I got 1 exotic drop in wvw after over 1 year in that game.
So I should start grinding now because of a broken promise from Anet?

No thanks, stick those ascended armor up your kitten .

Khayoss.2019:

/snip

As interesting as the discussion could be, I do not have the time nor the will to continue it. You will never change my opinion. I’ll never change yours.

So I’ll just throw this out one more last time in this thread: vertical gear progression is poison to any PvP format. It destroys balance. It destroys competitive play. A friend pointed out yesterday that once Thieves have access to full ascended gear, Bloodlust, Guard Leech stacks and food they will be able to burst you down in 2-3 hits even if you are sitting in a moderatly defensive spec. We will have the same situation as we had shortly after release. The progress made through skill balance will be destroyed by the power creep. Instead of moving on, we are regressing. But it is worse this time since it is essentielly a self created problem. (And please this is no OMG Thieves are OP rant. It’s not the classes fault we have to deal with power creep.)

Anyway have fun and I wish you good luck with all your future projects!

The Anet team has spoken to this issue more than once… I seem to recall comments stating they understand the issue with WvW’rs being able to get the proper mats as easily as PvE’rs without having to PvE. And have said, fixes are being looked at to make WvW for gear near equal to PvE’n for gear.

Frankly, 90% of my Dragonite has come from WvW… >shrugs<

I do agree Badges are pretty useless at the moment.

The insane folks who have been saving mats in huge stacks and plan on getting full ascended armor in the earliest timeframe imaginable; yeah they will have a slight advantage in WvW.

However, I think since the cost of even single pieces of armor are/will be so high that the devs expect this to be a long-term project thing.
Like when they introduced ascended trinkets through laurels (for those that hate FotM like me), they didn’t expect anyone to get any of them right away.
Even those that got their daily and monthly asap and got to the first tier, there was no noticeable power creep in the game. It wasn’t like I started losing to enemies with <100hp left or any noticeable balance thrown off by gear.
The determinator between players remains skill, and the difference between exotic and ascended is small enough that skill > gear.

That doesn’t mean that in ~ 1 month that players with full ascended armor + weapons + trinkets will not enjoy advantages in whatever traits they pursue. However I promise that it won’t make a bad player beat a good player.

Anet still has to figure out what to do with Rangers, right now Ascended anything only effects 60-70% of a Ranger’s damage output. This will compound with Ascended armor, because our Pets do the balance of our damage and aren’t effected by a Rangers gear.

Edit: Oh hey, how about they give us the ability to find Ascended Pets? I always wanted a Dragon pet.

NargofWoV.4267:

Anet still has to figure out what to do with Rangers, right now Ascended anything only effects 60-70% of a Ranger’s damage output. This will compound with Ascended armor, because our Pets do the balance of our damage and aren’t effected by a Rangers gear.

Edit: Oh hey, how about they give us the ability to find Ascended Pets? I always wanted a Dragon pet.

Engineer says hi.

The part that kills me is I run a smallish guild group (8-12) and we’re all pretty skilled with multiple alts. On any given night we might be trying to make a good class comp. with what we have online. All this ascended gear is really locking people into their mains even if we as a team we may need someone to use their alt. (example need a staff ele). That person is at a disadvantage and is going to be less likely to want to use that alt. to help out the team. Long story short it makes our guild way more rigid in our class comp and limits the ways players play the game. If a new player decides they want to switch classes it’s all the grind again. This discourages players from trying classes that might be better suited for their play style. We’re way less able to experiment with new things, and as someone mentioned above does this mean the meta is locked for longer now? What if Anet nerf bats something i just spent months creating? I just made 2 ascended weapons and I’m scared of what Anet is going to do on 10th. What if my build doesn’t cut it anymore I need to spend months reworking it? What if i try a build and it doesn’t work out, I’m punished hard for trying new things.

Maybe this is just another way to push us towards Spvp…

“Hey guys wanna try a new build? Spvp has you covered!”

Banono.4597:

Maybe this is just another way to push us towards Spvp…

“Hey guys wanna try a new build? Spvp has you covered!”

If Spvp offered more than a handful of stat combinations I would use it often to test builds. More often than not it’s like test driving a dirtbike in order to choose what SUV to purchase.

Elmo Benchwarmer.3025:

Anyway have fun and I wish you good luck with all your future projects!

Fair enough man, I’m happy to agree to disagree. It’s so much better than degrading into omgwtfusuxorz arguments.

Zylonite.5913:

Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game

Absolutely signed!

Where have those promisses gone? Will I really have to grind FOTM to have fun WvW??

And where are all those unique skins they talked about? All I can see is skins for money via jewel store. Why not add more interesting looking skins in different distinct stiles for completion of achievements, WvW or special dungeons, PVE instead of the old usual gear grind treadmill for stats? That way everyone could descide himself if he wanted to do the grind or not and HOW he wanted to play the game!

I just wish it wasn’t such an expensive kitten-ache getting up to 500 in a crafting discipline. Orichalcum and Ancient wood is in such a tiny supply in WvW and it’s not as if WvW can truly provide you with the adequate funds to buy those T6 materials in an appropriate time frame. Give us a separate WvW daily section with some T6 rewards for completion or something, just anything to lighten that PvE burden for us WvWers.

Today’s patch is a sad day for WvW’ers….

Why are people complaining? Didn’t the fact that BG “kittened” guilds to their server give you a hint as to the morality of Anet was?

yeah, I refuse to force myself to grind out all this boring kitten, and I won’t spend one minute on it.

if I start to notice that i’m significantly weaker than the other players with ascended gear, i’ll just stop playing this game.

Simonoly.4352:

I just wish it wasn’t such an expensive kitten-ache getting up to 500 in a crafting discipline. Orichalcum and Ancient wood is in such a tiny supply in WvW and it’s not as if WvW can truly provide you with the adequate funds to buy those T6 materials in an appropriate time frame. Give us a separate WvW daily section with some T6 rewards for completion or something, just anything to lighten that PvE burden for us WvWers.

you know you can salvage any items that drop for crafting materials, right? Including T6 mats.

I don’t mind this, except the part that it takes time, now instead of playing with my alts i have to gear my main; so basically it’s like forcing me to ignore my other characters. ;/

TIME TO GRIND FOR A FULL SET NOW <3

You guys all saw how little this armor actually gives you, right? I don’t think a handful of stats are anything to be upset about. Just like with exotic weapons, exotic armor will still get you by.

@OP: Ascended armor should never have been introduced in any part of the game. It added a grind to the game and killed the manifesto for the game.

Unfortunately, now that it is here, it should be available for both PvE and WvW.

Ok throughout this entire thread, all im seeing is people saying that WvW players have no excuse as to explain why they cant get ascended gear. They’re claming all the crafting mats are easy to come by. Basically your right. But please, explain to me how you pull out hundreds of gold from WvW to craft to 500. Iv been playing this game since october last year. The most gold Iv had at any given time is 73. The most expensive gear item iv EVER found was tsunami, which i sold for 7 gold.

The mats are easy to come by. But where the hell are you WvW players like myself, pulling out hundreds of gold to pay for crafting? Im happy with my wallet when I have more than 20g in it. There is just no way to make hundreds of gold from WvW only. Correct me if i’m wrong.

PS: telling me that I need to Zerg 10hrs a day is not a solution to me. The casual player does not have those hours.

Why do you also need to make money in order to craft? If you have the materials from salvaging and drops, the only other thing you need is karma for exotic recipes. Money only comes into play if you are trying to speed level a craft and you do not have the needed materials.

It’s like a boulder sitting on top of a smooth hill. The boulder is where you keep your balance at. Adding gear that has better stats is like kicking that boulder down the hill. Once that ball is rolling you can’t stop it. Players eventually have the gear by the time you add new content so you balance it around the best gear. To reward the players you add gear with higher stats as rewards. Then on the next expansion you have to make it challenging so you make it balanced around the previous expansion dungeon gear. It’s a brutal cycle that was the source of WoW’s power creep. Now GW2 is starting it.

To stop this ball they cannot release any new content that requires ascended gear and they can only reward with that ascended gear. Otherwise they have to update the old content to match the current max gear and make the earlier gear easier to obtain.
World vs World is in that old content.

There are so many people who actually like grinding. Don’t ask me how, don’t ask me why, but this just seems like a therapy for anet to keep their people busy so they don’t get fired.

The only thing i would love to see, is that when you are in WvW your stats should be all be brought down to exotic stats. So when you’re full ascended, you won’t gain benefit of your ascended gear and have the exact same stats on your weapons, trinkets and armor like the hardcore WvW players who mostly run full exotic armor with ascended trinkets and some of them have 1 ascended weapon.

In my opinion this would be something that could help ballancing WvW a tiny bit, everybody has the same stats, that means equal fights.

No zergs full of PvE people that have grinded full ascended gear, everybody same stats.
The differences are small between ascended in exotic, but bringing every player who is level 80 down to exotic would be a good step in ballancing WvW. This will also make sure that players who only play WvW don’t have to go the PvE to do a boring grind for ascended stuff just to get the best stats in order to keep efficient.
Plus doing this would give more equal raids and GvG.

Its just my thoughts about it, i don’t even know if it is possible to code, perhaps it will increase the lagg so much, because of all the downgrading of everybody who is in WvW.

After seeing just how small of a difference there is between exotic and ascended armor I don’t see much reason to craft it. I might get around to it eventually but as a VERY long term goal. For now I will just enjoy all of the money I made with my saved materials.

Hooray for farmers and tp flippers. Please remove it from WvW or find an acceptable way of acquiring it.

Sirendor.1394:

Hooray for farmers and tp flippers. Please remove it from WvW or find an acceptable way of acquiring it.

I second that.

i know I cant keep up with the grind. I choose 1 character and 1 armor set to be locked into and im not even sure i will finish that set in any reasonable amount of time, seems power traders have purchased materials in advance and are spiking prices

The stat boosts on ascended armors aren’t that big of a deal anyway. The full set takes like a month to make due to time-gating and gives 47-60 more defense pts and and 36 more stat pts. Barely a game-changer. The effect on WvW will be so trivial that hardly any players will care much later on.

Sororita.3465:

I dont know about that, i was spamming one for a good few hours, nearly had to press two…very stressful.

Then you should never leave WvW… I hear in Spvp you have to push in the upwards of 5 buttons.