Guild Wars 2

Again i dont really have trouble with Power necros if they use lich form its to my advantage i use signet of stone and i can just burst him cause he wont have the life form to shield him and his dmg wont touch me

Adean.3702:

Again i dont really have trouble with Power necros if they use lich form its to my advantage i use signet of stone and i can just burst him cause he wont have the life form to shield him and his dmg wont touch me

And again I said zerg fight. L2Read….
Power Ele and Necro are much more impactful than ranger in a group fight because they do way higher AOE damage.

I also said as a ranger they are preffered for roaming thats atleast what i worry most about killing dollys killing dolly escorters and clearing back tails

Adean.3702:

I play Ranger myself the only ranger i have and i never had as much fun as i have atm in WvW i do 18-21k dmg on ppl with light armor 14-17k dmg on ppl with medium armor and 11-14k dmg on ppl with heavy armor even some berserker warriors i attack i can get my dmg up on 18k and simply just use my skill 3 for stealth dodge in and finish him in my opinion ranger is the most usefull class for killing back tail in a blob and i love to do it i die sometimes too yeah i have trouble against eles but sometimes i can even outplay them cause alot of WvW players have no idea how to play 1v1 i see alot of thieves even jumping me and using everything they have when i have signet of stone on xD its funny as i turn around with my greatsword and do 9k crit with skill 2 its funny as hell

Oh my god are the punctuation keys broken on your keyboard? -_-

Well i never use them i have the feeling its easier for ppl to read and then stop the sentence when they want to instead of when i force them to when i read ppls messages i ignore their punctuations also so i can read it like i want to instead

Adean.3702:

Did i say mean thieves? i say thieves are as good as rangers just alot of thieves have no idea of their enemy skills thats has nothing to do with how overpowered rangers are. if a thief teleports to me i change to greatsword turn around and hit 9-10k dmg with Maul on him i cant disagree saying that isnt Op but on same time ranger is the only class i ever played in 2 years of GW2 so i really like to master it

That’s the thief that just stunned and rooted you so you cannot move or use any skills at all while their macro unloads everything in their combo in 0.25 seconds and then disappears with you at 25% hp?

Good to hear you can magically instantly remove all those and be able to switch weapons and use maul all in that .25 seconds (if you can even see anything and the server isn’t laggy and you have a decent ping).

Not to mention his venom sharing buddies and taking turns stealthing and healing each other…

Yeah thats what im saying if a thief really knows how to place himself i have no chance/time to use signet of stone and then im gone but on same time if he makes 1 mistake i can turn it to my advantage and win fight easily which is why i find it fun to 1v1 thieves in WvW

i think most/all of the arguements against ranger skills are closer to reasons to nerf Ferocity or Air/Fire Sigils more than reasons to nerf the skills themselves. The only way those skills do that much damage is with the aforementioned things (full zerker and Air/Fire). Anyone not running full zerk (because they want to live when a guard gets over there and sneezes) will never do that much.

As for RF requiring more than 1 skill to use, it used to require hunter shot to apply the weakness. I miss applying those 10 stacks of weakness BEFORE even starting to use RF. Wonder how many QQ RF OP threads would show up if they went back to that.

Jana.6831:

choovanski.5462:

one of my alts is a 44600 signet ranger with LB GS. i play its super in your face and aggressive, basically treating it like a static discharge engineer. perhaps I’m not a ‘ranger’ but I definitely dodge and have back up plans, as do all of the ranger mains i know. i have not noticed rangers being worse than players of any other class.

sure you get a lot of bad rangers, but most players of every class are bad because most players are bad. it’s not exclusive to ranger.

Good for you, but that wasn’t my point – my point is that the class is broken and doesn’t really fit into this game, unless you go all melee ranger which is “stupid” given that LB is that strong – again my point.

I do not think broken means what you think it means. Nor is playing a melee ranger “stupid”. It appears you are confusing your confuse your subjective opinion, with that of objective fact.

Jana.6831:

You seem to refuse to get my point, so I’m not so sure it makes sense to answer you any further.

You appear to have difficulty distinguishing the difference between someone getting your point and someone disagreeing with it.

Jana.6831:

A good ranger is “ridiculously OP” as they have a lot of useful skills but the regular ranger doesn’t know them as he doesn’t need them as his #2 burst is good enough.
Finally get my point?

I am not entirely certain OP means what you think it means. As well, I feel you associate LB ranger with “skilled player”, which is definitely inaccurate.

Jana.6831:

I never said ranger was easy to play just that the class itself promotes bad gameplay which leads to people calling ranger underpowered which leads to buffs which leads to good rangers being completely overpowered as they know how to play, unlike the usual ranger. And that is wrong. Make rangers use two or more skills to get their rapidfire, maybe that is a start.

Yeah, well you say a lot. yet you offer no reasoning or logic to support it. When you just toss out your opinion, pretend it is fact, yet avoid supporting it or even offering any reason to it, you are just spinning your wheels.

coglin.1867:

Jana.6831:

choovanski.5462:

one of my alts is a 44600 signet ranger with LB GS. i play its super in your face and aggressive, basically treating it like a static discharge engineer. perhaps I’m not a ‘ranger’ but I definitely dodge and have back up plans, as do all of the ranger mains i know. i have not noticed rangers being worse than players of any other class.

sure you get a lot of bad rangers, but most players of every class are bad because most players are bad. it’s not exclusive to ranger.

Good for you, but that wasn’t my point – my point is that the class is broken and doesn’t really fit into this game, unless you go all melee ranger which is “stupid” given that LB is that strong – again my point.

I do not think broken means what you think it means. Nor is playing a melee ranger “stupid”. It appears you are confusing your confuse your subjective opinion, with that of objective fact.

also, considering ranger was in Guild Wars 1 and had Rapid Fire I’d say it fits in the game perfectly.

sounds like you got owned by rapid fire. why not just, dodge, LOS, block, reflect, invn, interrupt, or rotate around the range to break facing and cause the skill to miss?

coglin.1867:

Jana.6831:

Adean.3702:

I always use knockback as my first skill before fight and then rapid fire cause i use quickening zephyr i wanna finish my rapid while the enemy is knock backed so they wont be able to stealth or dodge it

And that’s exactly what I meant.

Oh and btw: Please get rid of sic em or don’t allow rangers and engis to stealth, or give thieves the ability to destroy the healing, burst and defense of rangers and engis.

And that is all. Just wanted to back up the OP and have said all I’ve said now in other threads as well- I hope anet will listen some day.

Ahh, there it is. The true reason your here. Jaded personal bias, combined with being jealous of engineers and rangers. I am only guessing, but it would appear to me that you are upset that rangers and engineers use reveal skills that prevent your personal abuse of stealth. Which causes you to post here in agitation, in a effort for some type of forums retribution.

It might serve you better to develop the ability to succeed beyond using stealth. That way you will not be so solidly countered by anti stealth skills.

“someone used a cc on me then burst me plz nerf”

sadking.9625:

Yes another ranger QQ post.

Why Anet? Why can I not find a decent fight before some no-skill longbow ranger bursts me down from 1500 range on a wall. IT MAKES NO SENSE. There is no movement in their strategy, no thought in their skill usage and no variation in their builds.

It’s a kittening disgrace to a game that used to have fun combat.

This needs to change.

2x dodge is enough to mitigate 90%+ of the rangers core dps cycle. Timing is everything.

If you’re a thief, try running with withdraw. Wait for them to do the first 4k (or so) damage, then use the ability to heal it all back and dodge the rest of their pewpew attack. Ezpz.

Shadow stepping behind cover is also a good idea.

I play LB glass ranger in WvW and without a doubt, other rangers are my easiest kills as well as my weakest adversaries. This holds true for every other class I play as well, making rangers only truly effective against other rangers or players with all CDs blown. If you are having trouble with glass rangers, you’re going to have a rough go with unkillable necros or thieves who can both do more damage from the downed state to me then I can to them when they’re downed.

Toxsa.2701:

For rangers at least you can see them coming. L2P.

Ever heard of a Siamoth?

I don’t mind the Thief burst as much as a Ranger’s Burst.
If I get bursted by a focus party which consists of thieves, they actually have to get really kitten close to me which they can only do if I’m playing as a backline (out of position), or horribly messed up in the melee train. Actually, if you get bursted down by thieves in a GvG or ZvZ, you know you messed up.

A group of rangers however can set a target and burst it down while never having to worry about anything, except for potentially an enemy focus party which really isn’t that much of an issue either if you got half-decent situational awareness.
So sorry to burst your bubble, but there’s really more counterplay to thieves in ZvZ/GvG than there is to Rangers. For the reasons stated, Thieves do also require more skill to play in those situations, which is why they do pretty much deserve to burst a target down that 1 second quicker (risk vs reward and all).

And that’s without even getting started about how Thieves really cannot get any immunities at all (no, invisible doesn’t equal invincible…) while a Ranger can quite easily link 12 seconds of complete immunity (Signet of Stone, Protect me).
Where’s the counterplay to that? Atleast a Thief can be hit while in stealth.

But you’re completely right for enjoying Ranger and abusing all the benfits it brings, I have a lot of fun with it myself too.
But really… You don’t even have to learn to play Ranger to be efficient with it, the only issue that you might run into is your positioning. So how exactly is having to face someone in a big-scale fight who should be at the other end of the enemy melee train and who would (if you’d manage to get through the enemy melee train by a leap or deep push) just go immune for 6-12 seconds a L2P issue?

So really man, keep enjoying your Ranger but don’t go around making all those claims that there’d be more counterplay to Rangers in these kind of situations.
Your hate towards thieves is warranted aswell if they are one of those P/D Ebola Builds and/or run 6 in Shadow Arts to endlessly reset fights. But in general, your commentary is very flawed and biased. It’s biased for the good reason that Rangers are a hell lot of fun to play, but it’s biased nonetheless.

@Vornollo
While i think Toxsa may not be factually right, you are also wrong in some cases.

Thieves cannot get immunities, true, but they can do the second best thing – evade everything.
Just 3 points into acro and you are set.

The different in burst is not comparable.
A ranger got ONE rapid fire pr 8-10 seconds, ONE. If that rapid fire is negate the they got NO rapid fire and are quite ineffective at anything but chipping away small chunks. If the rapid fire misses, the ranger isnt any greater threat then a staff ele spamming auto attacks.
The thief can teleport into your face, while invisible, do 5-7k damage, then keep dishing out 3-5k attacks in rapid succession. There is little you can do to stop this assault as the thief got enough damage, and enough initiative to kill you twice before needing to pull back, in most cases.

Thieves can use simple tricks to avoid damage, people just plain refuses to USE them.
In a GvG scenario, all you need to do is isolate the ranger, stay behind the guardians in your team until ranger has wasted RF on a wall of reflection, then port and burst it down.

No, ranger CAN NOT get 12 seconds of immunity, that is only a theory.
6 seconds from signet of stone
6 seconds from Protect Me, however with glassbow, your pet, even a bear, has no toughness and low HP. So that bear or wolf will realistically melt in 2-3 seconds, sometimes faster if the ranger is bit by a strong attack.

Protect me “mitigates” 12k HP if Feline or Bird, 15k ish if wolf and 20k ish if drake/bear.
After that, pet is dead, ranger has lower total DPS, less utilities, less CC, less defense.
Protect me IS NOT VIABLE. It is the second worst skill a ranger have avaliable to it short of Search and Rescue.

I main a ranger myself, and you people who complain gloryfies the rangers WAY too much. It is easy to beat rangers, way too easy. If anything, rangers, even power rangers, are so underpowered (NOT their damage, that is NOT underpowered), that it is not even funny.
WvW is more forgiving to rangers then say PvP. If you brought a pewpew ranger into PvP then you would have 1 hour of fun (first 3-5 matches) then as you got paired with players that are not complete noobs you would get wrecked every game onwards.
WvW, as i said, is more forgiving because it is more OPEN. The easiest way to destroy LB rangers is simply NOT TO FIGHT IN THE OPEN FIELD.
Fighting a ranger in open field is like trying to dragrace a rocket in a straight line. You just never going to win. Add a few corners, aka some obstacles or some bottlenecks, and that ranger is no harder to beat then any other build you can imagine.

Now thieves need a buff. But not their stealth and not their damage. They need better utilities.
Traps – a great idea, but they fit more to the ranger then the thief.
Signets – just underwhelming
Trick – Good, but needs minor improvements
Venoms – needs HUGE quality of life improvements.

GROMIT.7829:

Rangers are an old/out of date and redundant class/proffesion type.

Just delete it and be done with it for goodness sake.

“Old/out of date”?

How are they “old/out of date” any more than any other class in a fantasy game like this?

Ridiculous.

Hunters/Rangers are one of the most popular classes (where they are available) in games like this, especially for newer players, partly due to the pet.

…and not just newer players, either – there are a lot of established players who only really enjoy playing hunters/rangers.

Admittedly, most of them probably don’t play this game (or don’t play it for long), as Ranger is such a relatively bad class, here.

Which is why threads like this are so ironic…

Most of them go back to WoW, I would imagine? Where it is pretty mid-pack in PVP.

That doesn’t mean they should be deleted here, though.

You don’t delete a popular class, even if it isn’t as popular in your game, as it is in games where it is done better.

You make it better in your game and/or you (re)design your game, so it’s more flexible and accommodating to a wide range of classes, playstyles and weapon types etc..

I don’t normally like it when people say to people “Just play the class you think is so OP/ easy, then”,

As I realise, more than anyone, that it is not just about how easy a class is, or isn’t; it is about how fun it is.

However, in this case, I’m the one who is going to say it, here.

Because Ranger IS fun, so that part isn’t an issue.

So, if you think it’s also easy/OP, why don’t you just play it yourself?

Seriously, these threads are all the same, on every forum, for every game.

Made (and agreed with) by the type of people who only ever play classes they have been specifically told are OP; because they simply cannot handle the fact that they will die in a game, even occasionally.

Games companies should look only to the people who choose to play the classes that are, generally, considered to be underpowered and/or who don’t switch to the new meta, all the time, for honesty.

The only people who moan about rangers are the ones who saw us as an easy kill before we got upgraded. I have used longbow and sword/dagger since the start, if you feel the need it be bitter then go complain about AoE else lol they can wipe siege on top of wall

Is this thread really still going?…

UmbraNoctis.1907:

GROMIT.7829:

1- Get close then knocked back
2- Rapid fire.
3- I dodge/evade/block (evades and blockes have a huge cooldown).
4- I close the gap and get the ranger to 20%.
5- He pop signet of stone and repeats his damage rotation that i can’t block as it’s all .on cooldown, i dodge half of it and go to 2/3 hp and then to 1/2 from auto attack.
6- He heals up to full.
7- Binding Roots.
8- I’m usually dead as he hits me again with that rapid fire.

Solution: Use your heal skill (every class has one).

Yes i will use my Healing Signet Slow clap………

GROMIT.7829:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

GROMIT.7829:

1- Get close then knocked back
2- Rapid fire.
3- I dodge/evade/block (evades and blockes have a huge cooldown).
4- I close the gap and get the ranger to 20%.
5- He pop signet of stone and repeats his damage rotation that i can’t block as it’s all .on cooldown, i dodge half of it and go to 2/3 hp and then to 1/2 from auto attack.
6- He heals up to full.
7- Binding Roots.
8- I’m usually dead as he hits me again with that rapid fire.

Solution: Use your heal skill (every class has one).

Yes i will use my Healing Signet Slow clap………

Stab and CC.
Done. Most rangers will be screwed after that (I main Power LB Ranger so your aware)
And for Entangle, all I can say is dodge.
Reason I never engage a guard or war if they run Hammer unless I get the jump.

I assume you run Warrior? Run Hammer + Axe/Shield. Trait for reflect on block and done. Shield reflect rapid fire. Stab + Hammer cc chain and game over, most lb rangers would be downed by then.

Extreme.8350:

hobotnicax.7918:

Vermillion.4061:

It’s amusing watching people defend 3k auto attacks from 1500 range.

Thieves 10k+ backstabs

no… on full zerk staff ele idiot yes but the average backstab is in the range of 5,5- 7k
So many quit playing thief after crit dmg nerf cuz they cant get the job done before they have to bail which is the whole point of the build.

I think lack of dmg on my thief eventually make me play ele/guardian more. Especially ele has some crazy dps that combined with the aoe nature of most ele skills means I can flip camp/towers a lot faster. The only problem with ele is, being ele is like having an auto-target over my head the moment a fight happens. The enemy focus on eles is real.

I think the ranger has a good use in wvw. Culling people that won’t adapt, look around, learn, or move away from walls. They are also killable, catchable and outplayable.

Most of the angry whispers I get are from players that defeat themselves, I just collect the bag.

GROMIT.7829:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

GROMIT.7829:

1- Get close then knocked back
2- Rapid fire.
3- I dodge/evade/block (evades and blockes have a huge cooldown).
4- I close the gap and get the ranger to 20%.
5- He pop signet of stone and repeats his damage rotation that i can’t block as it’s all .on cooldown, i dodge half of it and go to 2/3 hp and then to 1/2 from auto attack.
6- He heals up to full.
7- Binding Roots.
8- I’m usually dead as he hits me again with that rapid fire.

Solution: Use your heal skill (every class has one).

Yes i will use my Healing Signet Slow clap………

i dont have trouble fighting lb rangers on open field with mace shield/ shouts since i also use sword and focus i got the gap closer and the blind & blocks for that wall of reflection is mostly useless in a small fight since most know how to avoid it or ignore focusing other target, and there are extremely stronger builds in WVW in ranger than the newb lb pew pew to win at melee range, i think when anet reduced thr cool down on ranger lb skills it alienated even more the ranger player making them leech in one skill .
All the guard need is a sword focus in the bag for when its needed.

<side note>
i fear condis will get strong in the next metas , being the cleans underpowered, since while fighting some builds on wvw actually a players needs to heal and uses 2-3 condis cleanses at the first 5- seconds of the battle, and fighthing classes with high mobility and huge pressure of condis migh not be a healthy gameplay most will get macroed for sure if to strong.

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Extreme.8350:

hobotnicax.7918:

Vermillion.4061:

It’s amusing watching people defend 3k auto attacks from 1500 range.

Thieves 10k+ backstabs

no… on full zerk staff ele idiot yes but the average backstab is in the range of 5,5- 7k
So many quit playing thief after crit dmg nerf cuz they cant get the job done before they have to bail which is the whole point of the build.

I think lack of dmg on my thief eventually make me play ele/guardian more. Especially ele has some crazy dps that combined with the aoe nature of most ele skills means I can flip camp/towers a lot faster. The only problem with ele is, being ele is like having an auto-target over my head the moment a fight happens. The enemy focus on eles is real.

on wvw p/d with high mobility thiefs are nasty, but yeah eles stole mostly of the Dagger role from thief, high sustains, waterfields, more boons and better damage at long term.
I would say D\D has to much compared with most classes, but for gw2 player what is op is balanced, what becomes more balanced they start QQ becouse they cant kill in the first 3-4 seconds of the fight, this is what i feel when read the whines about some skill that gets “nerfed”.

Guys I found the OP and recorded him! He clearly had no time to dodge or use skills before I bursted him down with my 20k rapid fire.

vespers.1759:

Guys I found the OP and recorded him! He clearly had no time to dodge or use skills before I bursted him down with my 20k rapid fire.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6E7C7i2KQ0

pitty u didnt had a mesmer time warp rapid fire.

migh some say its to much damage, the only problem ic is the lack of bow mechanics like we had in gw1.

Issue: Rangers can kill other players
Priority: Critical
Solution: There is currently no solution because damage can prove fatal to your character, especially if the enemy is located on a wall.

Workaround: Walls are meant to obstruct your progress and the enemy can use higher ground against you. It would be a bad idea to go attack a wall by yourself as you cannot damage a wall without siege weapons. I would suggest not approaching the wall.

Workaround 2: There is also pve. Player damage cannot kill you there.

Hope that helps! I will apologize that currently that rangers are indeed exploiting the game by being able to kill players. Now if you excuse me, I’m just going to stand on a wall for a bit.

I’d also like to apologize to necros, because they really don’t have much to fight a pew pew ranger actually.

The ranger longbow buff was overdone by about 15-20%, but until Anet realize that for themselves all we can do is complain and be told to dodge, even if our classes take 3 times more effort to do 75% of the same damage.

^ Really?

As I say, play a ranger, then and make sure you enjoy standing on that wall, because that is pretty much all they’re good for in this game.

in this meta now its less Melee blob blob ,its much more on even ground though what most inexperienced players and those that don’t have a clue how much a ranger sacrifices to get that so called op damage (is everything into glass, even traits not even any support traits unlike other zerg stat classes dogged march anyone I’d love that as a ranger)

and you can still do a lot of damage melee hits faster and has less chance of failing , if you can’t get close dont go face to face vs a Ranger (don’t be a idoit) trying to take somthing that has open ground advantage while yourself using this old Zerker WvW warroir stuff , nothing is going to change that if you go full glass and power you’ll be a pointless weight to where you can’t join team fights and all your able to do is pick off newbies and shooting from a wall.

ranged is 1.5 attacks to a 3 melee attacks with in the same time length your attacks maybe 600 points less per ranged attack but over the end result melee attacks do More over time thust a increase in dps vs range.

get more toughness / spec some healing too and stop using this 100% zerk gear in WvW and use some decent weapons for a change not just hammer/gs…for me to come across one of those players in WvW its all too easy for me to keep you away from me and that is what is killing you Not the damage…preventing you from closing the gap = you’re death.

play melee classes like they should be played tough Brutes not skimping on armour just to improve the numbers on the screen for bigger numbers , bigger numbers are not always better.

if you can not be bothered to practice because WvW is pretty much Pvp don’t expect it to be easy or faceroll vs good players..

If u get killed in a Rangers opening burst and you are paying attention (not looking at Hero/guild panel, looking at world map, etc….even than) and cannot close the gap without dieing, it is either a learn to play issue or you are running 66200 with full zerk gear and absolutely no toughness or stunbreaks.

oscuro.9720:

If u get killed in a Rangers opening burst and you are paying attention (not looking at Hero/guild panel, looking at world map, etc….even than) and cannot close the gap without dieing, it is either a learn to play issue or you are running 66200 with full zerk gear and absolutely no toughness or stunbreaks.

well deppends on the class maybe, on sturdy guard like a 3.4k ar mor with prot will take like 1.7-2k auto atacks from lb, and its needed to save dodges for the 8 second burst skill probably , guardian with mace/shield – staff he cant do much against ranger (or high mobility classes), it will always need the sword and focus for extra block and blinds other wise he wont be killed on the inital burst but will never get close to the ranger or kill hit due low damage and no existent pressure on target.
As example if fighthing lb rangers / ls on open field, if i have sword focus equiped my health wont drop mostly over the 80%/60%(if im distracted and get the burst) and can get full with some ease, if not using sword/focus its a completelly diferent story.

ArchonWing.9480:

Issue: Rangers can kill other players
Priority: Critical
Solution: There is currently no solution because damage can prove fatal to your character, especially if the enemy is located on a wall.

Workaround: Walls are meant to obstruct your progress and the enemy can use higher ground against you. It would be a bad idea to go attack a wall by yourself as you cannot damage a wall without siege weapons. I would suggest not approaching the wall.

Workaround 2: There is also pve. Player damage cannot kill you there.

Hope that helps! I will apologize that currently that rangers are indeed exploiting the game by being able to kill players. Now if you excuse me, I’m just going to stand on a wall for a bit.

I’d also like to apologize to necros, because they really don’t have much to fight a pew pew ranger actually.

This might actually be the funniest kitten thing ive read in weeks. thank you.

Rangers like me prey on the weak, the panicked, the cheesiest of glass builds with no defenses, and above all else people with big egos. Everyone hates to lose to a “crappy ranger” so I count on it to get my advantage. I roam LB almost exclusively and take my kills using every underhanded no good dirty bit of trickery I can muster. If you don’t like it please send me a rage whisper so I can add it to our guild message of the day. I especially appreciate being called cheesy. – BG – Cheesy Louisy

FWIW – T1 roamers have gotten much better about countering Rangers. Makes for a better and more fair environment in my opinion. I still kill dozens roaming every day though so please keep chasing down crappy Rangers.

vespers.1759:

Guys I found the OP and recorded him! He clearly had no time to dodge or use skills before I bursted him down with my 20k rapid fire.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6E7C7i2KQ0

The only thing this proves is how OP rangers are. I mean… he killed a player from 1500000000 range in basically 3 auto attacks. Auto attacks. Three. 3. Auto attacks. The whole ordeal barely lasted longer than 3 seconds.
Had he actually pressed a button (#2) that would have ended 2 seconds earlier.
That damage was also without food or any kind of stacks (sigils + guard stacks).

I’m sorry but this video backfired.

Whoa what? OP? this thief went down with 12K of attack and didnt take any evasive action at all. Who goes down with 12k of damage? LOL – 12k of attack in 3 seconds is OP? if you cant do the same in 1/2 that time with your guard, mesmer, or ele than you need to look at your builds.

Marthindon.6429:

Whoa what? OP? this thief went down with 12K of attack and didnt take any evasive action at all. Who goes down with 12k of damage? LOL – 12k of attack in 3 seconds is OP? if you cant do the same in 1/2 that time with your guard, mesmer, or ele than you need to look at your builds.

Yup…. because guardians, mesmers and eles sit at 1500000 range and press 1 button once (the auto attack).

I don’t know. Try standing in a meteor storm and lava font as full glass and see what happens. It’s technically 1200 range but the radius increases the reach.

I know of a button that would have prevented the ordeal from happening, though. Well, it’s actually 2 and a click.

If you get killed by a single player when you’re a thief in the open, it is always your fault unless they are hacking.

The problem with the OP comments is that it lacks context. I can possibly accept “rangers are OP when attacking from a wall that protects them” The problem is where does this really fit in the grand scheme of things? Are hardcore wvw guilds posting rangers everywhere to blow away would be attackers in towers and keeps? Why is there no GWENR?

MethaneGas.8357:

vespers.1759:

Guys I found the OP and recorded him! He clearly had no time to dodge or use skills before I bursted him down with my 20k rapid fire.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6E7C7i2KQ0

The only thing this proves is how OP rangers are. I mean… he killed a player from 1500000000 range in basically 3 auto attacks. Auto attacks. Three. 3. Auto attacks. The whole ordeal barely lasted longer than 3 seconds.
Had he actually pressed a button (#2) that would have ended 2 seconds earlier.
That damage was also without food or any kind of stacks (sigils + guard stacks).

I’m sorry but this video backfired.

A glassy ranger kills a glassy thief (a class that only has 11k HP by default at level 80 – 13K with the WvW stacks if I recall correctly) who doesn’t even dodge or teleport away.

“YES! Let’s take this video to the forums and hope people are stupid enough to agree with me!”

(lol)

ArchonWing.9480:

I don’t know. Try standing in a meteor storm and lava font as full glass and see what happens. It’s technically 1200 range but the radius increases the reach.

You can walk out of a meteor shower or lava font (not to mention meteor shower has an insane cast time). Landing combos with a staff ele is 10 times harder than clicking on a target and pressing a button. Eles also don’t have a 2000 range 6-second reveal which essentially shuts down one of thieves’ only modes of escape/survival (stealth).

ArchonWing.9480:

If you get killed by a single player when you’re a thief in the open, it is always your fault unless they are hacking.

The only problem is that WvW is not 1v1. You will be roaming / fighting and sure, you can handle certain situations but when a ranger (like in the video) comes along, click on you from miles away, pushes a button and you die… it surely is thrilling that you got so out-skilled.

ArchonWing.9480:

The problem with the OP comments is that it lacks context. I can possibly accept “rangers are OP when attacking from a wall that protects them” The problem is where does this really fit in the grand scheme of things? Are hardcore wvw guilds posting rangers everywhere to blow away would be attackers in towers and keeps? Why is there no GWENR?

WvW is a lot more than just zerg fights… and I’ve been all over Bronze and Silver tier. WvW is infested with Rangers. The last time Necros were OP (beginning of Dhuumfire) you saw condi Necros everywhere. Last time Warrior’s were OP, all you ever saw was warriors. Now all you ever see is rangers. It’s a common pattern.

Annoying and skillless as massive damage rapid fire and long range shots are, if you look at the upcoming mesmer changes, that will pretty much be the end of the pew pews as far as solo roaming and small groups go (small groups of mesmers). Evasive mirror gives you reflection for 1.5s seconds (with a 1.5s cool down) for simply dodging one attack, distortion reflection is easier to access, and other sustain options make the healing skill mirror more viable. There’s also a trait in chaos that gives you mirror when using using manipulation skills.

MethaneGas.8357:

ArchonWing.9480:

I don’t know. Try standing in a meteor storm and lava font as full glass and see what happens. It’s technically 1200 range but the radius increases the reach.

You can walk out of a meteor shower or lava font (not to mention meteor shower has an insane cast time). Landing combos with a staff ele is 10 times harder than clicking on a target and pressing a button. Eles also don’t have a 2000 range 6-second reveal which essentially shuts down one of thieves’ only modes of escape/survival (stealth).

Oh, you mean those aren’t instant killers if you avoid them? Because anything can kill if you make no effort to evade them.

The thief took 3 seconds to die. There were zero dodges. Even if he was caught off-balance, which happens to everyone, it’s simply their fault. You can get your heal off in that time, much less dodge or use shadowstep.

I mean, maybe the thief had a bad day, but they would have to blame themselves. At least I would if I’m wandering next to a wall.

MethaneGas.8357:

ArchonWing.9480:

If you get killed by a single player when you’re a thief in the open, it is always your fault unless they are hacking.

The only problem is that WvW is not 1v1. You will be roaming / fighting and sure, you can handle certain situations but when a ranger (like in the video) comes along, click on you from miles away, pushes a button and you die… it surely is thrilling that you got so out-skilled.

I find the “miles away” thing to be incredibly disingenuous. They have which is 300 more than the projectiles of most classes. And if you are distracted, a lot of classes can guarantee you die.

If 3 people are distracted on one guy, I can hit something like lich form and faceroll them all. Nobody outskilled anyone; it’s just how the game works.

And again, it’s just silly to use someone on a wall as an example of any form of balance. You usually aren’t winning a fight vs someone on top of a wall unless you pull them down. It means very little when you take in account game design.

Yes, I do understand rangers make a lot of +1 scenarios a lot worse, but honestly, that’s sort of the point of the entire class. Though I am glad to note that wvw isn’t just 1v1, so you can’t just nerf rangers based on these cases, especially when large scale combat is a factor.

MethaneGas.8357:

ArchonWing.9480:

The problem with the OP comments is that it lacks context. I can possibly accept “rangers are OP when attacking from a wall that protects them” The problem is where does this really fit in the grand scheme of things? Are hardcore wvw guilds posting rangers everywhere to blow away would be attackers in towers and keeps? Why is there no GWENR?

WvW is a lot more than just zerg fights… and I’ve been all over Bronze and Silver tier. WvW is infested with Rangers. The last time Necros were OP (beginning of Dhuumfire) you saw condi Necros everywhere. Last time Warrior’s were OP, all you ever saw was warriors. Now all you ever see is rangers. It’s a common pattern.

[/quote]

People go for easy kills. But honestly, I’ve only seen mass rangers since the initial month when they buffed rapid fire,

In pretty much all cases except for necro, I find condition rangers a far bigger threat because they seem unkillable. Bow rangers are generally pretty much one trick, most of them. On a thief, I’d rather complain about engineers or medi guardians because if you want lopsided….

How anyone could possibly justify 3k auto attacks from 1500 range is beyond me. With Fire and Air, one auto attack can take out 1/3-1/4 of your total HP. Simply broken.

Yeah, the thief in the video failed to dodge. Maybe he was autorunning, maybe he wasn’t paying attention, maybe he was bad. It doesn’t really matter. The video demonstrates the ridiculous damage one can deal with absolutely no effort from a completely safe distance. Whether you’re on a wall or in a zerg, it’s just not acceptable.

ArchonWing.9480:

MethaneGas.8357:

ArchonWing.9480:

I don’t know. Try standing in a meteor storm and lava font as full glass and see what happens. It’s technically 1200 range but the radius increases the reach.

You can walk out of a meteor shower or lava font (not to mention meteor shower has an insane cast time). Landing combos with a staff ele is 10 times harder than clicking on a target and pressing a button. Eles also don’t have a 2000 range 6-second reveal which essentially shuts down one of thieves’ only modes of escape/survival (stealth).

Oh, you mean those aren’t instant killers if you avoid them? Because anything can kill if you make no effort to evade them.

You can walk out of ele’s aoe and you’ll end up with way more health than if you got AA-ed by a ranger. Wasting dodge for AA …. AUTO ATTACK … skill 1 is just plain kittened (same goes for power necro in shroud of lich but that’s out topic)

AA shouldnt kill you in 2sec. AA should pressure to neglect sustain like regeneration or passiv heals

ArchonWing.9480:

MethaneGas.8357:

ArchonWing.9480:

If you get killed by a single player when you’re a thief in the open, it is always your fault unless they are hacking.

The only problem is that WvW is not 1v1. You will be roaming / fighting and sure, you can handle certain situations but when a ranger (like in the video) comes along, click on you from miles away, pushes a button and you die… it surely is thrilling that you got so out-skilled.

I find the “miles away” thing to be incredibly disingenuous. They have which is 300 more than the projectiles of most classes. And if you are distracted, a lot of classes can guarantee you die.

No it’s not 300. Ranger can perform 2K range (for instanc elook at the video linked. All spell are touching the thief while beeing supposedly out of range (red line under the skills)
Why ? Cause projectile doesnt have a travel distance survivability, but a travel TIME survivability. When Anet buffed velocity, they didnt nerfed time survivability accordilingly. Making projectile going further than described in the tooltip. Add to this the fact that you can be higher than your target, you reach the 2K range AA 4K damage ….
Dare tell me there is counter play to this. Gap closer ? Get bumped. dodge roll ? Get killed by the GS switch.

The fact that almost all sort 1V2 are winnable if you’re quite skilled EXEPT ones including one or 2 ranger tells a lot.
I won a 1V2 including a ranger ONCE! Because he was with the worst thief ever (i was focusing the ranger, the thief managed to die to my PBAOE that were aimed to the ranger…. )

ArchonWing.9480:

If 3 people are distracted on one guy, I can hit something like lich form and faceroll them all. Nobody outskilled anyone; it’s just how the game works.

So that your basic AA hit as hard than an ult AA is balanced according to you ? …. no comment

ArchonWing.9480:

And again, it’s just silly to use someone on a wall as an example of any form of balance. You usually aren’t winning a fight vs someone on top of a wall unless you pull them down. It means very little when you take in account game design.

“on a wall” is just an exemple, its very common to be fighting while roaming, then suddenly a wild ranger appears (cause of insane mobility on GS or Sword) and destroy you from 2K range.
You can see a blob running at you due to the “mass” effect, but a mere loner in a 360° radius …….

Davey.7029:

MethaneGas.8357:

vespers.1759:

Guys I found the OP and recorded him! He clearly had no time to dodge or use skills before I bursted him down with my 20k rapid fire.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6E7C7i2KQ0

The only thing this proves is how OP rangers are. I mean… he killed a player from 1500000000 range in basically 3 auto attacks. Auto attacks. Three. 3. Auto attacks. The whole ordeal barely lasted longer than 3 seconds.
Had he actually pressed a button (#2) that would have ended 2 seconds earlier.
That damage was also without food or any kind of stacks (sigils + guard stacks).

I’m sorry but this video backfired.

A glassy ranger kills a glassy thief (a class that only has 11k HP by default at level 80 – 13K with the WvW stacks if I recall correctly) who doesn’t even dodge or teleport away.

“YES! Let’s take this video to the forums and hope people are stupid enough to agree to me!”

(lol)

The overall attack speed is 1 shot / 1 sec with long range shot. Thief can kill you with 2-3 hits but attacks much faster. If you cant react in this time go to doctor. Avarage human reaction time is ~0.2 sec.
In games hard to react 0.5 sec skills, because you have lag, you must to move your fingers etc… But everything more than that is slow. In gw1 rangers used interrupt skills. 0.5 cast time (+lag +fly time). A good one interrupted 3/4 skills min in 50% and 1 sec skills all the time. Dont try to tell me its hard to reagate to this slow skills.

Mattmatt.4962:

You can walk out of ele’s aoe and you’ll end up with way more health than if you got AA-ed by a ranger. Wasting dodge for AA …. AUTO ATTACK … skill 1 is just plain kittened (same goes for power necro in shroud of lich but that’s out topic)

AA shouldnt kill you in 2sec. AA should pressure to neglect sustain like regeneration or passiv heals

Oh, we’re dragging those necros in this now? But you really have to consider if everyone dies in 2 seconds to it. I mean, if it’s glass vs glass, you don’t need much to get through, plus glass is built around killed or being killed.

And my point of course was that there were a number of methods to survive this kind of thing. And besides, as a thief, there’s no real such thing as waste in an infinitely large battlefield where you can reset the fight. If you IA twice away, your endurance is going to come back really fast anyways. Can the ranger do the same on open ground?

ArchonWing.9480:

ArchonWing.9480:

MethaneGas.8357:

ArchonWing.9480:

If you get killed by a single player when you’re a thief in the open, it is always your fault unless they are hacking.

The only problem is that WvW is not 1v1. You will be roaming / fighting and sure, you can handle certain situations but when a ranger (like in the video) comes along, click on you from miles away, pushes a button and you die… it surely is thrilling that you got so out-skilled.

I find the “miles away” thing to be incredibly disingenuous. They have which is 300 more than the projectiles of most classes. And if you are distracted, a lot of classes can guarantee you die.

No it’s not 300. Ranger can perform 2K range (for instanc elook at the video linked. All spell are touching the thief while beeing supposedly out of range (red line under the skills)
Why ? Cause projectile doesnt have a travel distance survivability, but a travel TIME survivability. When Anet buffed velocity, they didnt nerfed time survivability accordilingly. Making projectile going further than described in the tooltip. Add to this the fact that you can be higher than your target, you reach the 2K range AA 4K damage ….
Dare tell me there is counter play to this. Gap closer ? Get bumped. dodge roll ? Get killed by the GS switch.

Yes, unlike a lot of people I have played a ranger beyond shooting down uplevels and people out to dailies, and yes it is of course longer than the tooltip. Although my experience with multiple classes suggests that ranger projectiles aren’t unique in that sense and I haven’t seen any godly ranger that’s been able to kite away from 1200 ranged weapons so easily. Any videos welcome though.

“GS switch”. Well, it’s not like there’s no disadvantage to the ranger doing this. First off, suddenly he loses his ranged advantage. Second, it is powered by the most utterly telegraphed move in the entire game. And yes, I’ve gotten smacked by it, and again, that’s only because I was an idiot. Of course, a good ranger might use it to run away and block your attacks instead of trying to 1.) use that crappy AA, 2.) gamble with bashmaul ,but don’t worry, everyone loves big numbers!

Mattmatt.4962:

ArchonWing.9480:

If 3 people are distracted on one guy, I can hit something like lich form and faceroll them all. Nobody outskilled anyone; it’s just how the game works.

So that your basic AA hit as hard than an ult AA is balanced according to you ? …. no comment

Well, that’s a fair note, but before you gloat lich can allow you to overpower multiple people which is not something I can find on a ranger. Lich is also really strong compared to most elites—so I still think it’s fair.

And you’re sort of missing my point. Point is I can mash buttons, and kill people, and it’s really just as mindless.

ArchonWing.9480:

ArchonWing.9480:

And again, it’s just silly to use someone on a wall as an example of any form of balance. You usually aren’t winning a fight vs someone on top of a wall unless you pull them down. It means very little when you take in account game design.

“on a wall” is just an exemple, its very common to be fighting while roaming, then suddenly a wild ranger appears (cause of insane mobility on GS or Sword) and destroy you from 2K range.

And well, since we have a lot of situations, it’s only fair to examine it in different contexts. And if you fail to see someone on a wall that must go to the edge to attack, then you would most likely be toasted by a number of classes anyways.

Besides, I’ve been killed more by thieves +1’ing a fight against me far more than a ranger. The special situation is when they kite me into something else.

I think Archonwing is winning this thread with his sensible comments/tips how to deal with a longbow ranger.

@Mattmatt.4962 You make it sound so easy playing a ranger calling out whats supposedly broken, but have you tried playing a power variant yourself when focused by a competent opponent? You would be amazed at how mortal this build is, and I wonder what makes you think GS has “insane mobility”. It’s just too much focus on the AA damage and rapid fire damage than every context, like a competent thief/mesmer/ele/guard with right build or condi can deal with this so called death from afar class.

nacario.9417:

@Mattmatt.4962 I wonder what makes you think GS has “insane mobility”.

Swoop: 1K1 gap closer, 12sec cd, even warrior’s rush is weaker (and since the end is litteraly a “leap” its faster than a rush)

Sword have a bit less range but greater evade frame (cause yes, swoop even include an evade frame

“GS switch”. Well, it’s not like there’s no disadvantage to the ranger doing this. First off, suddenly he loses his ranged advantage. Second, it is powered by the most utterly telegraphed move in the entire game.

Disavantage of going melee when your opponent finnaly closed gap after you bumped him with your lb forcing him to dodge and/or use all his gap closer ? GS is very strong contrary to what you seems to say. Maul might have a great activation (dont complain about it unless you want to become the ennemy of warrior) but you need dodge to be able to dodge it, remember that you had to use some to close the gap with the ranger. Or you can also use your daze to prevent ennemi to block or blindyou and land it ? :x

About the range, i’m not complaining about the high use, every class can (even tho only the ranger has such a ridiculous AA dps at 1K2+ range). I’m complaining about the bug with the travel time of arrow. Try to AA in a perfectly plane area, you’ll see you can hit further than the tooltip. You totally skiped that part, no worry accidently forgetting argument that you can’t contest is normal in an argument ^^

EDIT:
forgot this:

Point is I can mash buttons, and kill people, and it’s really just as mindless.

Every class have to some extend “masshing button”, but ranger do not need, it just have to target and press 2, the AA will do the rest
Kappa

Mattmatt.4962:

Every class have to some extend “masshing button”, but ranger do not need, it just have to target and press 2, the AA will do the rest
Kappa

well yeah… If your opponent stands perfectly still and allows you to beat on them you can easily kill anyone with auto attacks. You don’t have to be a ranger to beat someone that’s afk…