Guild Wars 2

I’ve played lots of MMO’s but the set up of WvW in GW2 has got to be the worst I’ve ever seen. I hope the so called changes for the better really do work for WvW because currently, you get nowhere unless you Zerg….it’s a Zergfest! The way it’s set up, you CANNOT make any progress with the exception of supply camps unless you have a zerg. Less than two minutes later…the zerg has retaken the supply camp you just took.

I’m curious why the game makers refer to it as WvW when in actuality it should be called ZvZ (Zerg vs. Zerg). Parties are limited to 5. How many commander tags need to be on a map? What’s the point of them? Your group of 5 can’t do anything useful. If you attempt to do something useful like take a tower or a keep, you’re team is destroyed by an opposing Zerg. People will only fail so often before they just give up. There is no point in trying to fight an obviously losing battle. This isn’t real life where I have to fight to my last breath, it’s a game…and I fight until it becomes a waste of time to do so. I have seen PvP/WvW die so often due to effects like this and they are one of the most enjoyable portions of a game.

If developers want to know why there are not as many people as they had hoped in WvW, they only need to look at their own design. So, if you’re wondering why people don’t go into WvW, it may be time to rethink that design. Not by pitting a server with 50k WvW’ers against a server with 10k WvW’ers. Tactics and strategies only work if you have the people to implement them. If you don’t have those people, you don’t bother in participating. Nothing compels me to be in WvW other than boredom at the moment.

There is a thing called solo WvW roaming. Google it.

Our guild, with a group of 5, built a siege and attacked a tower, we took the tower and held it against incoming zergs.

We also captured all the camps, and had really fun.

I don’t understand what you want? It’s not the mechanics of WvW that promote zerging, it’s human nature. How do you propose Anet fix that?

Jrunyon.3012:

I don’t understand what you want? It’s not the mechanics of WvW that promote zerging, it’s human nature. How do you propose Anet fix that?

I disagree. I do think human nature plays a part, but what will have more success:

A. A group of 5 tries to infiltrate a keep
B. A zerg of 75 tries to infiltrate a keep

The answer is obvious, so that does mean mechanics play a large part. Those mechanics force a zerg strategy. You cannot take an entire castle with 5 players.

floredon.6817:

There is a thing called solo WvW roaming. Google it.

lol…you’re not going to take a supply camp as a solo WvW roamer. You may take a Dolyak…but once you meet up with with the zerg or that group of 3-5…your roaming is over.

Farzo.8410:

Our guild, with a group of 5, built a siege and attacked a tower, we took the tower and held it against incoming zergs.

We also captured all the camps, and had really fun.

Yes…you held it against incoming zergs. You were fortunate that a zerg didn’t interrupt your attempt. That’s not typcially what I see though. I have done the same thing with guildies but it’s a rarity. Most times the zerg makes it to your position before the group can overtake the point. Camps are easy to take with a group of 5….I’ve done it many times.

Should stop given every1 same points, for killing 1 person and splitting them between the killers. Do more on camps maybe change them to towers so there easy to defend.

Last night me and about 6 guild members were able to ram down the outer upgraded gate of DB’s garrison with just one ram. No zerg came to kill us. We only died when a group of random defenders came after us on the inside. No where near a zerg though

(This was in tier 2, where you would expect everything to be zergs)

floredon.6817:

There is a thing called solo WvW roaming. Google it.

Yes, this thing where you end up leaving WvW at the end of your playtime having died ten times as much as anyone else, watched more players run away from fight than finish them, and lost far more currency on repair costs than you gained.

WvW is flawed by design and there is nothing that can fix it. WvW is flawed because combat is flawed in this game, and it’s what makes zerging so attractive. There are too many AoE skills in this game that make large zerg encounters nothing more than a badge farm, because, for the most part, all you need to do is just spam your auto attack and hit a ton of players without even aiming or doing anything special.

People might think that there is some skill involved in WvW, but really, it’s just a numbers game. Numbers are the only thing that matters in large scale PvP. That being said, if you are in a small group of like 3v3 or 4v4 or whatever, then yeah, I would say there is skill involved in not dying.

Commanders are another thing in WvW that is dumb. Commanders are just a rally point for the zerg, and serve no other purpose, yes, people who are commanders feel an enormous sense of entitlement and that people have to listen to them. I think WvW was purest when there were no commanders to rally zergs and bark orders. It wasn’t for very long that commanders didn’t exist because I guess 100g these days is not a lot. People coordinated via map/team chat, formed parties, and actually had to work together. It wasn’t just press [M], find blue icon, and run mindlessly towards it. I hope WvW receives a major overhaul, changing the core mechanics of it and providing a different experience. Right now, it just isn’t fun. I only play WvW to PK and get loot because it is pointless to win.

The utter lack of understanding of WvW in the QQ of this thread is amazing, and I’ll leave it at that.

Don’t like WvW? Go do some PvE stuff and have some fun. It’ll save us from having to see the QQ in map chat. You’re happy and having fun, we’re happy and having fun. Win all the way around.

Edit – congrats on almost ninja’ing DB’s garrison, elite. Wish I could have seen it. xD

Bedazzle.5746:

lol…you’re not going to take a supply camp as a solo WvW roamer.

This is news to me.

Bedazzle.5746:

lol…you’re not going to take a supply camp as a solo WvW roamer. You may take a Dolyak…but once you meet up with with the zerg or that group of 3-5…your roaming is over.

Not sure if serious or just terrible.

I think a big part of the zerging is allowing people to revive so quickly with superior numbers outweighs being able to stomp or aoe them with smaller numbers.

When you are stomped you should instantly be teleported to spawn. Stop people lying there spying abusing corpses, it would also give smaller groups a chance if well played and would remove so much of the fustration that comes with WvW and it just purely being a numbers game. No way to whittle down an opposing force atm and this is why everyone zergs, max reward, if you die you loose nothing at all as you are insta rezzed even when you fail.

Also 20 people killing one person should NOT give potentially 20 bags (one to each zergling) and the same fixed WXP to EACH person who tagged. Split the rewards equally so they get merely 1/20th of the reward each. Where does this extra loot magic itself from? Does Anet feel the need to reward people that don’t really deserve?

Bedazzle.5746:

floredon.6817:

There is a thing called solo WvW roaming. Google it.

lol…you’re not going to take a supply camp as a solo WvW roamer. You may take a Dolyak…but once you meet up with with the zerg or that group of 3-5…your roaming is over.

I have taken several supply camps solo as a ranger.

my 2 cents…

World vs World is just that, large numbers vs large numbers, not elitist groups thinking the maps belong to them. I’ve been playing MMO’s for over 10 years. Zergs happen and will continue to happen.

The maps are too small for groups to be really effective, but it is possible if you don’t travel the common routes the zerg takes and strike targets that can be taken quickly (camps or paper towers).

I think the commander tags should be for guild members or a “battle group” people can join once they enter. I would also like to see this battle group with a private chat, I’ve been noticing far too much lately an upleveled character at waypoints with a name of “xghbrhku” or something to that extent.

To solo roam you must expect at all times to get hit by adds, either another person from the same server as you opponent, small roaming group, or the zerg. If this is happening to often you need to relocate to somewhere with less traffic, but the downside is fights become less frequent.

Anyone that QQ’s about the zerg but still enjoys player vs player fighting should look in to structured PvP.

Do I zerg? Sometimes when my guild is not on. When they are, we’re the pain in the kitten group that stirs up trouble cutting off supply and taking paper towers.

Bedazzle.5746:

If developers want to know why there are not as many people as they had hoped in WvW, they only need to look at their own design.

As far as Im aware, they made WvW to make PvE players get interested into sPvP actually. It was never designed to be so popular as it have became. And this info is only if I recall right, so don’t take it as the holy truth.

And ofcourse its number games, how else could it be?

Make single players more powerful? That would make zergs even more powerful.

Make siege more effective? Did you hear what happened after the AC buff.

If you die, you spawn in base? Good bye roamers, one or two of your group members die, have fun waiting for them to get back. And yes, this also makes zergs more powerful and Waypoint in a keep into win upgrade for defending.

My point is, ANet is doing their best to make WvW as enjoyable as possible for all kinds of approach, but as long as its World vs World, its going to be number games.

PS. Im still enjoying WvW, maybe I don’t play as much as I used to, but atleast I always enjoy every aspect of it when Im playing.

What may look like a zerg to you is well played team work if any thing its the best mmorpg RvR system out there in that way. You have ture team work both movement and building weapons as a team. Numbers dose not make a zerg ideally a zerg is just a random group of ppl playing the way they want with out any regards to the ppl beside them. You can have a 2 man zerg if the 2 ppl are not playing togeater and just happened to be moving the same way.

Tyellock.2697:

my 2 cents…

Anyone that QQ’s about the zerg but still enjoys player vs player fighting should look in to structured PvP.

Do I zerg? Sometimes when my guild is not on. When they are, we’re the pain in the kitten group that stirs up trouble cutting off supply and taking paper towers.

No no no no no. Spvp is not what roamers want.

Roamers want small scale 1-10 vs 1-15 fights, where your build / party is not centered around standing inside a small circle. Where they can feel like they can contribute but not just get rolled over by zergs.

There is a reason thieves are right now pretty much the best class to roam with… 1 of the reasons is because they have the most efficient way of disengaging and running from zergs.

The game cannot handle the huge fights zergers want.. skill lag is caused by these zerg vs zerg clashes, which again penalizes the roamers. So not only are the mechanics of wvw against roamers, so is the actual technology behind the game.

Bedazzle.5746:

A. A group of 5 tries to infiltrate a keep
B. A zerg of 75 tries to infiltrate a keep

The answer is obvious, so that does mean mechanics play a large part. Those mechanics force a zerg strategy. You cannot take an entire castle with 5 players.

5 Players shouldn’t be able to take a keep. It’s a KEEP. When in history, have 5 people ever been able to storm a castle (keep). Granted, that is a real-world example and we’re talking about a fantasy world here, but I think there is a parallel to be made.

With that being said, I have been a member of a 5-man party that has almost taken a keep. North gate of Bay. Knocked it down, then started on inner north. But, then our zerg arrived to help us finikitten. However, the conditions had to be aligned PERFECTLY for the five of us to get as far as we did.

Now towers? Yeah, you can five-man towers with much less effort.

Camps? Absolutely definitely, for sure. Sometimes even with 1.

I guess what I am trying to say is that there are challenges that are specific to group size. Is the challenge to big? Is your group to small? Finding a more appropriate goal may your answer.

(edit: finikitten…really?) lol!

1 man out, 1 man in

Energetik.6471:

1 man out, 1 man in

So spvp?

WvW by design is meant for large numbers of people. Isn’t it like 100 per side is allowed on the map at a time?

Human nature… mob mentality.. you name it. Plus it usually works out to nearly everybody’s advantage to be within a zerg because that’s usually the best and easiest time for people to get loot.

With that being said, Anet could easily stop it if they wanted to.. just put a stacking debuff on that increases in intensity the more players in a given area (similar to agony), except it’s a permanent debuff that activates when a minimum number of players are in a given area.

A portion of hp is lost ever 3 seconds.. for example 10 players = 10% hp loss every 3 seconds; 15 players = 15%; 30 players = 30% and so on. Sure this is extreme, but watch the zergs displace faster than you can blink :P. It’d screw over my game completely, but hey, zergs would effectively be eliminated in the blink of an eye lol

DeadlySynz.3471:

WvW by design is meant for large numbers of people. Isn’t it like 100 per side is allowed on the map at a time?

Human nature… mob mentality.. you name it. Plus it usually works out to nearly everybody’s advantage to be within a zerg because that’s usually the best and easiest time for people to get loot.

With that being said, Anet could easily stop it if they wanted to.. just put a stacking debuff on that increases in intensity the more players in a given area (similar to agony), except it’s a permanent debuff that activates when a minimum number of players are in a given area.

A portion of hp is lost ever 3 seconds.. for example 10 players = 10% hp loss every 3 seconds; 15 players = 15%; 30 players = 30% and so on. Sure this is extreme, but watch the zergs displace faster than you can blink :P. It’d screw over my game completely, but hey, zergs would effectively be eliminated in the blink of an eye lol

That would destroy all types of team work and you would often be asked not to be near any one else. You would be wvwing but wvw vs other ppl and not with any one from on your side.

DeadlySynz.3471:

WvW by design is meant for large numbers of people. Isn’t it like 100 per side is allowed on the map at a time?

Human nature… mob mentality.. you name it. Plus it usually works out to nearly everybody’s advantage to be within a zerg because that’s usually the best and easiest time for people to get loot.

With that being said, Anet could easily stop it if they wanted to.. just put a stacking debuff on that increases in intensity the more players in a given area (similar to agony), except it’s a permanent debuff that activates when a minimum number of players are in a given area.

A portion of hp is lost ever 3 seconds.. for example 10 players = 10% hp loss every 3 seconds; 15 players = 15%; 30 players = 30% and so on. Sure this is extreme, but watch the zergs displace faster than you can blink :P. It’d screw over my game completely, but hey, zergs would effectively be eliminated in the blink of an eye lol

Very bad idea.

There should never be some kind of penalty to players just because they come together in a area.

Besides that, anet has stated that WvW is supposed to involve combat between large numbers of players so thankfully your idea won’t be implemented.

The thing about fantasy games is that you can make up your own rules and just blame it on the gods. Zerging is just human nature that the game encourages. All you have to do is implement things to discourage zerging – like random legendary dragons (with no loot) appearing :-)

oh yeah “how to force players not going togoether” topic again

Bedazzle.5746:

I disagree. I do think human nature plays a part, but what will have more success:

A. A group of 5 tries to infiltrate a keep
B. A zerg of 75 tries to infiltrate a keep

The answer is obvious, so that does mean mechanics play a large part. Those mechanics force a zerg strategy. You cannot take an entire castle with 5 players.

So, you want to be able to take a keep with a much larger number of players defending it? How does that make any sense? If you are being found out and wiped then your tactics suck, you need to know the zergs rotation and when they are engaged and how long you have to get in and out, I do things like this all the time. However, thinking that a small group should be able to take something even with defenders is just crazy, and I don’t see how you think that this line of thinking makes any sense.

Terra Dactyl.2047:

Bedazzle.5746:

lol…you’re not going to take a supply camp as a solo WvW roamer.

This is news to me.

News to me as well, I guess those 10-20 camps I solo in a night were all a dream, I mean after all, my glass cannon guard with only 15k health could never take a camp.

I think things like this show just how most players are, and how little they understand about WvW and how little skill most have, then come on here and QQ about it. Rather than learning how to do things and learning tactics, they just want it to be dumbed down for them. WvW is not hard at all, the basics are very simple really, and if you are having trouble with zergs 24/7 then you might be in to high a tier server and might want to think about moving down the ladder.

Conncept.7638:

floredon.6817:

There is a thing called solo WvW roaming. Google it.

Yes, this thing where you end up leaving WvW at the end of your playtime having died ten times as much as anyone else, watched more players run away from fight than finish them, and lost far more currency on repair costs than you gained.

Because everyone else’s experience WvW solo roaming is akin to yours…

10K Kills, well over 4K badges all told, have good fun with regularity. Rank 36 all Solo roaming/guild small man, no zerging…

playing weeknight 2-3 hours casual play with more on weekends /shrugs

I think realistically there are only two ways ANet can solve the Zerg dilemma.
Obviously they can’t forcibly split groups up, or make a dozen WvW copies so that only ever like 30 people are on map. So the methods are to reshape commanders to make them less overbearing via different, earned commander tiers, more commanders, or rather captains/majors, per map to split the zerg up, etc.
Currently everything but the most highly guild-organized Tier1 WvW boils down to a small blue icon on the map, which is bad, sad design.
Or more importantly, to fix the maps. The current ones seriously lack incentive for solo roamers, duo roamers or small organized groups, particularly such incentives that lead to PvP encounters.
Yes you can go flip camps with your 4-man party for two hours but that is not attractive gameplay for a world PVP format (or any really). Encounters with opponent groups of roughly the same magnitude are a rarity.
The objectives themselves feel very “one-dimensional” geographically, in that from every objective there are is always exactly one closest, next-best cap point up or down the road, the rest being either blocked physically or psychologically (e.g. for the latter, a giant, player-deserted lake). That could easily be addressed by simply having the maps less “choked” and more “airy”.

Always during guild events I make ninja party to flip cams and ram towers when main zerg is fighting on the other side of map. Got rank 54 this way.

Why isn’t camp flipping attractive? Speak for yourself, I, and ppl who volunteer for my party, like it.

lol bloobing-.- yes there is a lot of bloobing but there are also hardcore guilds that beat all bloobing and feed on all bloobing so go ahead and whine:D

The zerg mentality is common because it’s the easier solution and the mindless horde only needs to really follow 1 or 2 people. Separating that 75-man zerg into say… 7 groups of 10-12 people would be the smart thing to do, but the coordination required to be effective between all those groups is much more complicated than organizing a single zerg.

I would like to know the so-called MMO that had better pvp than GW2. Don’t say you dare say that crappy game that had 1 minute 45 second mezzes and 26 second AOE stuns.

oh I dont know…zergs come in handy. Take for instance Fort Aspenwood. We are definitely up against larger numbers, but we do have our zergs. Now lets say we have a zerg or two kitten ing off the enemy. And lets say 10 little FA’ers take stonemist in the process. Id say that there, is good use of a zerg.

Ljiona.9142:

I would like to know the so-called MMO that had better pvp than GW2. Don’t say you dare say that crappy game that had 1 minute 45 second mezzes and 26 second AOE stuns.

Yer either gonna hate me, laugh or be too young to have been there. But Ultima Online had great pvp. Terrible graphics, and it was costly on the person who died. But the pvp was very good. It actually required skill. A man could show up with simple GM crafted(a player crafted item)gear and compete and win in battles. It wasnt a perfect game….it had its flaws. But the pvp worked.

It’s nothing new, my last 2-3 MMORPG guys who take decisions always take wrong and make game more pointless. Maybe game industry has big problem with that.

First off, zerg vs zerg is the way of war. Army vs Army.

The real problem is that victories are shallow and short lived. With the 5 min buff that you have to wait for, once you cap you don’t have to worry about defending until 5 min later. So you go around capping one after another. The defenders have the option to defend what they have or simply go around back capping behind the offending force.

It is also designed so that you can attack any objective anywhere at any time. This only compounds the issue.


WvW would need to under go some serious changes.

There needs to be a sequence to follow and an interconnection between the borderlands and battle ground. So with that, I propose the following changes…

The first priority after a reset should be to take control of your own borderlands. In fact you would have to since you need to have control of your garrison to be able to enter EB. Each one has three keeps, four towers, and 5 supply camps. The first change would be that it should require the use of siege to get into towers, keeps and castles. No amount of beating on the door with your sword or shooting it with arrows should get you in. Therefore the first thing that needs to happen is to get control of some supply camps.

Not only are supplies needed to build the siege weapon but ammo based siege should cost supplies to use.

AC = 1 or 2
Ballista = 2
Cannon = 1
Oil = T
Mortars = 2
Trebs = 3

This makes the control of supply camps much more important.

If we don’t include the garrison that leaves two keeps and four towers. In order to remove the buff on the champ in each keep, it should require control of two nearby towers. Once you have control of both keeps, the buff is now gone from the garrison. Once you have control of the garrison, you either have the ability to go to EB (if it is your own garrison you have control of) or you don’t have the ability to go to EB (if it is the enemy that has control of your garrison).

Once you are in EB, it’s pretty much the same concept. I think there are 4 towers for each keep with there being one keep per faction? You need to capture all the towers to remove the buff on the champ in the keep. Once you have your own keep in EB, you can now sent people to the other faction’s borderlands.

As for the Castle, if you have the castle, you need only have to take control of the two towers closest to the castle to remove the buff on the champ within the associated keep. Instead of having to capture all four.

So to sum in up.

Ammo based siege costs supplies to use. Making supply camps more valuable to both offenders and defenders.

POI need to be captured in a certain sequence creating a “front line” effect but at the same time it is not absolute.

my guild runs around with like 6-8 members quite often and we get things done and don’t fear to attack a keep with such low numbers. we are actually well respected for it.when we field more members like around 15+, the opponent thinks we field 60 people, because we are pretty much everywhere. my point is, that a small number can make a big difference if coordinated.

@OP. You make me lol. In fact, WvW has been way more popular than the devs imagined. They originally thought everyone was going to want to play PvP, but that proved incorrect.

Some of us actually like to zerg. There is nothing better than seeing 20 v 20 on a battlefield. If that is not enjoyable to you, that’s fine. Try PvP or solo a zerg with an arrow cart.

floredon.6817:

There is a thing called solo WvW roaming. Google it.

On T8 servers, I presume?

Farzo.8410:

Our guild, with a group of 5, built a siege and attacked a tower, we took the tower and held it against incoming zergs.

We also captured all the camps, and had really fun.

I think he’s not referring to T8 10-men “zergs”

Jrunyon.3012:

I don’t understand what you want? It’s not the mechanics of WvW that promote zerging, it’s human nature. How do you propose Anet fix that?

DAOC solution was fine, the bigger the group, the lesser the reward. Solo kills were big reward, kills by 8-men groups were much lesser, and rewards for zergs were miniscule

Why do people cry about Zerging in WvW, its natural that people will band together, it offers protection from an enemy attack etc, if you do not want to Zerg go create your 5 man party and run around capping camps etc, we did a 4man run around the server this morning and capped several camps and guess what not a zerg in site, yet we where out manned on the map.

You clearly do not know how the commander tag works, or you have not ran with a decent commander, but going on your post im guess you do not like to listen to others anyway, so maybe your own little 5 man party is best for you,

We wiped a Mag’s Zerg not even an hour ago while they tried to take a keep, it was great fun.

If you still do not enjoy the zergs go play sPvP.

style.6173:

@OP. You make me lol. In fact, WvW has been way more popular than the devs imagined. They originally thought everyone was going to want to play PvP, but that proved incorrect.

Some of us actually like to zerg. There is nothing better than seeing 20 v 20 on a battlefield. If that is not enjoyable to you, that’s fine. Try PvP or solo a zerg with an arrow cart.

Lol 20v20. You in tier8 or something ? XD

Bedazzle.5746:

I disagree. I do think human nature plays a part, but what will have more success:

A. A group of 5 tries to infiltrate a keep
B. A zerg of 75 tries to infiltrate a keep

The answer is obvious, so that does mean mechanics play a large part. Those mechanics force a zerg strategy. You cannot take an entire castle with 5 players.

FYI – I did it with 3 players total after we broke down the wall with a Treb. And to top it off, I was on my up-leveled Ranger (real level 21 with no Elite). So yes, when you are skilled, you can win.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Bedazzle.5746:

I disagree. I do think human nature plays a part, but what will have more success:

A. A group of 5 tries to infiltrate a keep
B. A zerg of 75 tries to infiltrate a keep

The answer is obvious, so that does mean mechanics play a large part. Those mechanics force a zerg strategy. You cannot take an entire castle with 5 players.

FYI – I did it with 3 players total after we broke down the wall with a Treb. And to top it off, I was on my up-leveled Ranger (real level 21 with no Elite). So yes, when you are skilled, you can win.

Two days ago, I started hitting the guards at an enemy occupied Hills just to check out response time. When I killed all the guards, I dumped a ram down because nobody came. Three others joined me and we got the gate down. A month ago, again, five of us took Hills on an enemy BL. It’s entirely possible to be quite effective with small or solo play in WvW. You just have to scout first, then hit. (This is in Tier 2 btw, I’m not sure it would fly in Tier 1 tho, lol). And if you do it the way I do, you have to be willing to die a lot for your experiments, lol. Sometimes they pay off though.

As for the rest, 90% of my playtime in WvW is solo roaming play. I get a lot done.

I think something should be done to supply camps. nobody really guards it. they just flip it if they need supplies.

also make other things in WvW rewarding, like guarding a tower/keep/supply/escort. ATM the only rewarding thing in WvW is joining the zerg.

The lower the tier, the less likely you’ll run into massive groups. Still you wont be able to easily solo a tower. This is a team game, bring at least 5 people, and get good enough that you can handle a group of 10.

Master of Timespace.2548:

style.6173:

@OP. You make me lol. In fact, WvW has been way more popular than the devs imagined. They originally thought everyone was going to want to play PvP, but that proved incorrect.

Some of us actually like to zerg. There is nothing better than seeing 20 v 20 on a battlefield. If that is not enjoyable to you, that’s fine. Try PvP or solo a zerg with an arrow cart.

Lol 20v20. You in tier8 or something ? XD

They’re common in Tier 3.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

So yes, when you are skilled, you can win.

Not just yourself, but others, and working together. I was with a commander, we took bay on another BL, they kept on rushing it, and then set up trebs in garri, so we pushed them, about 30-40 back to garri, where even more joined and they had AC’s out the kitten on the walls and cliff, so here our team was, all 12 or so of us, holding off 2-3 times our numbers even though they had siege as well. They would push out and get no further than the stairs, sure, we could not wipe them, but they didn’t go anywhere either. It really shows what tactics and a commander who half way knows what he is doing can do.

Nerf zergs please. This is absolutely unbearable. Most of the people on my server have stopped playing wvw cause we ended up fighting 2 german servers, and they do nothing but blobbing. ZvZ (blobbing/zerging) has been a problem since day 1 and it needs to get a serious nerf so people stop doing it.

My suggestion: if you have “—-” number of allies in a “—-” radius, all your stats get nerfed for 100 (power, precision, condition damage, toughness, vitality…) and your rewards are lower (10%,20%,30% based on the number of players).
This would actually make zerging a lot less attractive and allow for FAIR number play, what an esport is supposed to be.

Kitten kitten mewl mewl zerging isn’t bad l2 counter the zerg -insert arrow cart joke here- its not hard when u l2 organize

Bedazzle.5746:

lol…you’re not going to take a supply camp as a solo WvW roamer. You may take a Dolyak…but once you meet up with with the zerg or that group of 3-5…your roaming is over.

Welp now I see why Yaks Bend is in last place in our matchup. Oddly enough, my group of 5 took your West Keep just a few days ago by hiding in it after your zerg flipped it back from Kaineng.

Try harder I guess?