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Posted by: inthewoods.8237

inthewoods.8237

Just wanted to say that this is an interesting suggestion! The team is interested in feedback on this idea and will continue watching this thread. However, just because we are following this thread doesn’t guarantee we will add it as a feature.

:) oh please, I am on my knees for this one.. do NOT even consider this. As my previous post says, (and others have noted), this kind of change would pretty much obliterate the WvW population in a huge way.. imo.

I agree with this!

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Posted by: Swamurabi.7890

Swamurabi.7890

While the idea is interesting, I feel that trying to balance this would be difficult.

If you add frontline damage reduction to a frontline build that already has damage reduction or add healing utility to a class that is already best at healing you could push certain classes into and out of WvW.

Would you look at roles and subdivide them into heavy, medium, and light armor classes? We all know that medium classes are the least played in WvW.

Are you looking to add this as another level like WvW masteries? Would this further separate the veteran WvW player from the new player?

Would this be added to existing skill tree so that you limit the choices by profession?

Lastly, the current WvW meta makes it difficult for smaller groups to defeat larger groups, how would this improve WvW if it both reduced the number of new players to WvW as well as reduced the players that are playing when outmanned?

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Posted by: Aeolus.3615

Aeolus.3615

This sounds like a skillbar replacement, like banners or mechanical devourers type stuff? I strongly dislike those being added to WvW. It’s nothing the trait and profession system shouldn’t be able to handle, and just complicates/obliterates balance.

The less weird fluff* that is added, the better. See: EotM.

*Myself exlcuded.

Nah, its an enhancement to focus playing a specialized role.

“Archers” would have increased range while standing in defended objectives.
Ranged AoE casters would have larger AoE.

I didn’t read all of his stuff but that is the idea behind it. Probably power creep but not in a +MOAR DMG kind of way.

Pretty much, still power creep could be solved gamewide (sincepower creep is just the result of overstacking damage+condis), and that is easilly fixed.
Funny this could be added for pve events as well where stuff needs to be fixed, destroyed,defended, raided etc, they could as well use this new mechanics to improve the game overall…not only wvw.

and once again… remove cleaves damage output from autos, and make some cleave skills just hit 2 targets if they are way to close that would reduce the power creep in this game.
This would make aoe classes more valuable, and could lead to better designs in future w/o overstacking to much cleave aoe like we have now.

1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.

(edited by Aeolus.3615)

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Posted by: grave of hearts.7830

grave of hearts.7830

Also add Driver to this,theres a ton of sweet looking charr tanks on pve parked that could be repurposed to work on wvw.
And i believe it would break the monotony of golems.

SoS Defence and Emergency commander
If you see a gear above my head……run
If you see me Offline,its totaly not a trap

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Posted by: Aeolus.3615

Aeolus.3615

Also add Driver to this,theres a ton of sweet looking charr tanks on pve parked that could be repurposed to work on wvw.
And i believe it would break the monotony of golems.

they look like small controlled rc cars than actually siege LOOOOL even that was AWFULLY added to the game as usual…

reason:
they are transmogriffers to a very small vehicle and very clunky and useless.. as usual…

Sugestion:

ANET should give access to guilds to build 1 and with a ton of materials, actually a slow large vehicle that behave like a golem but with more range and offensive while golems could be the shield/domes melee or lesser range options.
Even if this is builted only in desert BL, and guild need to control the siege factory <— see what i did there, theres actually a necessity of having that struture???
And after siege is builted if they want to use that siege they need to pay a transport to change that vehicle siege to the other map, and take arround 5-10 minutes.
As in animation i could imagine several helis or a ship deploying the siege in the spawn of that server.

Also siege vehicles could not be portedby mesmer portals

there is so much things that could make game fun and balance at the same time… it bites me how gw2 is so dull and reduntant… Anet is really making what i tough it would be impossible.
Sorry guys at Anet but i had to be a bit blunt on this point, alot of stuff u guys add to the game it make no sense and quality is far from a AAA game…

this job structure is actually good model to get the game straight and see if is possible to indroduce content features over time.

1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.

(edited by Aeolus.3615)

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Posted by: vesica tempestas.1563

vesica tempestas.1563

love the idea of some behemoth tank/boss that is triggered by some kind of map wide resource collection (perhaps only available to the server in last place?) that results in a huge lumbering tank/boss that trundles slowly towards the a given garrison. Encourages pve players to dabble in pvp and could create a great focus content/melee fights.


“Trying to please everyone would not only be challenging
but would also result in a product that might not satisfy anyone”- Roman Pichler, Strategize

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Posted by: Aeolus.3615

Aeolus.3615

vesica tempestas.1563 i would prefer player controlled :\ not as an npc, WvW needs more player content than actually… more npc or stale changes..

1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.

(edited by Aeolus.3615)

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Posted by: vesica tempestas.1563

vesica tempestas.1563

vesica tempestas.1563 i would prefer player controlled :\ not as an npc

Even better


“Trying to please everyone would not only be challenging
but would also result in a product that might not satisfy anyone”- Roman Pichler, Strategize

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Posted by: Spurnshadow.3678

Spurnshadow.3678

So, I already responded to this post, but it got my creative juices flowing. I’m working on something that I think is really great. In the meantime, a few thoughts that I think everything from here on out should adhere to.

I think there should be one rule for anything: No mastery or new addition would affect any player vs. player combat. No stat increases, no extra revive speed, no extra range, etc. All that currently exists in the game through class selection, build selection, stats, and runes/sigils. What the current masteries do is effect how we interact with WvW. This is where any new masteries should be focus on. With this in mind, I think having a tree or trait system of masteries is a great idea as it would limit our roles and force us to make choices. See my previous post for more on this.

Blackgate Native. It takes tremendous strength and skill to pull a lever.

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Posted by: Chaba.5410

Chaba.5410

i think the “jobs” idea should be fullfiled by the classes and builds themselves.

Agreed. This suggestion reminds me of the “Campaign Skills” that one can trait into in ESO. It wouldn’t fit the Mastery system we have because a player could spend all their points on all those jobs and become way too over-powered. There would have to be some sort of limitations placed on which job you can have in your build at any one time.

Maybe along similar lines, there could be some sort of traiting that becomes unlocked by participating in WvW in the different playstyles, although it isn’t clear if playstyles could be differentiated through the data too well.

Chaba Tangnu
Founding member of [NERF] Fort Engineer and driver for [TLC] The Legion of Charrs
RIP [SIC] Strident Iconoclast

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Posted by: Sviel.7493

Sviel.7493

There’s room for something of this nature, but I don’t think this particular idea works. Making certain things stronger would easily break the game without adding any more gameplay—you’d just have an expanded meta with everyone doing the thing they did before better. As a result, you’d have less variance in acceptable approaches because one role would do it so much better than anything else. Any implementation would also have to take into account that some roles will be more desireable than others.


That said, allow me to try to contribute something constructive too.

Rather than new skills and buffs to class mechanics, this system should focus on WvW specific things. Players should be able to choose a focus for each character and be able to reset it by paying a certain amount of some WvW resource (perhaps excess wexp points?). There should also be a cooldown between switching. The focus should not affect combat abilities as there’s no way to do this without being dragged into a whole new can of worms. Finally, there should be multiple viable options for each player.

I’ll try to create some examples, but it would be helpful if people could point out what sort of things could be affected. I’m sure I don’t know them all.

Crusader
+1% repair efficiency per 10 WvW ranks.
+1% starting build % on siege per 10 WvW ranks. Capped at 50%.
+1 supply per 100 WvW ranks delivered by Yaks you escort for at least 30s. Does not stack—uses highest bonus from all escorts.

Scout
+1% movement speed per 30 WvW ranks while in aura range of an allied structure. Stacks additively with haste and shrine buffs.
+1% capture rate for camps, shrines, ruins and outposts per 30 WvW ranks.
+1% siege damage versus structures on your BL or in your corner of EB per 30 WvW ranks.

Assassin
+1% movement speed per 30 WvW ranks while in aura range of an enemy holding. Stacks additively with haste and shrine buffs.
+1 point per enemy player or Yak killed per 300 WvW ranks.
+1% damage to enemy NPCs per 30 WvW ranks.

Marauder
+1 supply capacity per 10 people in your squad. Caps at 5, effectively.
+1% damage reduction from enemy siege per 50 WvW ranks. Caps at 70%. Stacks additively.
-1% falling damage per 20 WvW ranks. Caps at 50%. Stacks additively.

Vanguard
+1% chance per 50 WvW ranks to recover +5 supply when building siege. 30s cooldown. Caps at 50%.
+1 supply capacity per 200 WvW ranks for 30s after capturing a camp.
+1% damage to enemy siege per 30 WvW ranks.

Saboteur
+1% effect strength/duration to your traps (supply/stealth, not class abilities) per 5 WvW ranks.
+1% damage reduction per 100 WvW ranks for nearby allied NPCs (but not player summons). Stacks with other players but caps at 50% total.
+1% movespeed while in combat per 30 WvW ranks. Stacks additively.
-1% falling damage per 20 WvW ranks. Caps at 50%. Stacks additively.

Treasure Hunter
+1% Magic Find per 5 WvW ranks.
+1 item from Resource Nodes per 500 WvW ranks.
+10% Wexp.

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Posted by: Taobella.6597

Taobella.6597

What if we made it so at start of week after every reset it set the score to 0. treat this arc class type as classes in term of say a Moba where we have to level up trait tree threw out week.

But to do something like this have to very careful to avoid using % in any of these tree. because % easy way to break a game.

i think if you wanted to do something like medic line for example. each time you fully rez a player you gain +50 healing for for 30 seconds.

Or something like front line build Each time you get hit you gain +10 toughness for 10 seconds.

i also design skill point UI like “path of exile” where you can learn everything if you put enough time in to it at cost of insane stat loss.

In term of leveling up skill point tree. i make it based on arc type you picked to level up.

So def line you gain exp threw healing / rezing allies
dps line you get exp threw killing players dealing dmg
Seige line you gain exp threw using seige that deal dmg.

hope that not to messy to read x.x

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Posted by: Hexalot.8194

Hexalot.8194

Other than the aforementioned balancing issues that would have to be sorted out, the OP might have just saved WvW !

(edited by Hexalot.8194)

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Posted by: Hexalot.8194

Hexalot.8194

There’s room for something of this nature, but I don’t think this particular idea works. Making certain things stronger would easily break the game without adding any more gameplay—you’d just have an expanded meta with everyone doing the thing they did before better. As a result, you’d have less variance in acceptable approaches because one role would do it so much better than anything else. Any implementation would also have to take into account that some roles will be more desireable than others.


That said, allow me to try to contribute something constructive too.

Rather than new skills and buffs to class mechanics, this system should focus on WvW specific things. Players should be able to choose a focus for each character and be able to reset it by paying a certain amount of some WvW resource (perhaps excess wexp points?). There should also be a cooldown between switching. The focus should not affect combat abilities as there’s no way to do this without being dragged into a whole new can of worms. Finally, there should be multiple viable options for each player.

I’ll try to create some examples, but it would be helpful if people could point out what sort of things could be affected. I’m sure I don’t know them all.

Crusader
+1% repair efficiency per 10 WvW ranks.
+1% starting build % on siege per 10 WvW ranks. Capped at 50%.
+1 supply per 100 WvW ranks delivered by Yaks you escort for at least 30s. Does not stack—uses highest bonus from all escorts.

Scout
+1% movement speed per 30 WvW ranks while in aura range of an allied structure. Stacks additively with haste and shrine buffs.
+1% capture rate for camps, shrines, ruins and outposts per 30 WvW ranks.
+1% siege damage versus structures on your BL or in your corner of EB per 30 WvW ranks.

Assassin
+1% movement speed per 30 WvW ranks while in aura range of an enemy holding. Stacks additively with haste and shrine buffs.
+1 point per enemy player or Yak killed per 300 WvW ranks.
+1% damage to enemy NPCs per 30 WvW ranks.

Marauder
+1 supply capacity per 10 people in your squad. Caps at 5, effectively.
+1% damage reduction from enemy siege per 50 WvW ranks. Caps at 70%. Stacks additively.
-1% falling damage per 20 WvW ranks. Caps at 50%. Stacks additively.

Vanguard
+1% chance per 50 WvW ranks to recover +5 supply when building siege. 30s cooldown. Caps at 50%.
+1 supply capacity per 200 WvW ranks for 30s after capturing a camp.
+1% damage to enemy siege per 30 WvW ranks.

Saboteur
+1% effect strength/duration to your traps (supply/stealth, not class abilities) per 5 WvW ranks.
+1% damage reduction per 100 WvW ranks for nearby allied NPCs (but not player summons). Stacks with other players but caps at 50% total.
+1% movespeed while in combat per 30 WvW ranks. Stacks additively.
-1% falling damage per 20 WvW ranks. Caps at 50%. Stacks additively.

Treasure Hunter
+1% Magic Find per 5 WvW ranks.
+1 item from Resource Nodes per 500 WvW ranks.
+10% Wexp.

BOOORRING !

I like the OP’s thought process MUCH better.

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Posted by: MomentofWeakness.1246

MomentofWeakness.1246

Please do NOT spend development time on something like this. This will further fragment the already existing balance issues (Condi’s namely bleed and burn, Condi-scaling, Coalescence of Ruin, Sup. Arrow Cart damage OP, overly defensive structure abilties, etc.) plaguing WvW.

Its Choo – 250,000 Kills in WvW and Counting…
WvW Commander – NA PST
Sexiest Level 80 Charr Guardian In The Game

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Posted by: Nothing.4953

Nothing.4953

Please do NOT spend development time on something like this. This will further fragment the already existing balance issues (Condi’s namely bleed and burn, Condi-scaling, Coalescence of Ruin, Sup. Arrow Cart damage OP, overly defensive structure abilties, etc.) plaguing WvW.

+1, I agree with @MomentofWeakness.1246, we should be addressing the current needs of the game mode before adding in new features, and it should be realized that WvW balance is probably the most fragile in all of Guild Wars 2 due to scaling (i.e. what works in PvE and/or PvP may not be suitable for WvW).

(edited by Nothing.4953)

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Posted by: Timelord.8190

Timelord.8190

This is clearly not a good thing. More powercreep/limitations. No thx.

Far ShiverPeaks (EU)

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Posted by: Baldrick.8967

Baldrick.8967

One thing I would really want to see:

Better scouting. Where are enemies going? Where are our guys going? This is a vital piece of information that makes or breaks the game mode. All too often there’s a group of players sieging a tower and capturing it without any opponents coming to defend it. That’s because none of the opponents know what’s going on. White swords pop out if you do as little as engage the guards (without even killing any) and last for a long time. Boy cries wolf and invalidates the message.

Then, after fifteen minutes or so the tower is recaptured again with no resistance. It makes WvW have this “player vs. door” type of gameplay that is not very interesting.

Scouting needs to be made into a role. Individual takes up a spot and relays accurate information automatically. It could work like a sentry feature. Marking enemies should stop contribution loss.

What about the part of playing with other people? I suggest that players should be able to highlight their presence at their own discretion on map, similar to how squad members are highlighted. Maybe just to tell other players on their side that they are not alone on the map and without leadership burden that comes from showing a commander tag.

I’d prefer if NPCs took up the job of scouting. You could still send an ele up to kill them and it only ‘sees’ the ele (or whatever) if you position your attack right. If you just bulldoze up to the door then you SHOULD be visible on the map, as in RL signals would be sent, etc.

The idea of jobs would have been a good one if was here at the start, so they could ahve adjusted them by now to even out advantages.

Bringing them in now would just make things even more unbalanced. And let’s face it, hardly anyone wants to scout anyway as the loot is poor, contribution zero.

wvw would be a much more interesting place if you had to think about attacks, positions etc if you don’t want to be detected.

A thundering herd of 40+ should be visible on the map all the time.

WvW player. Doing another world completion for my next Legendary. Hater of mini-games.

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Posted by: Raolin Soulherder.3195

Raolin Soulherder.3195

Not a good idea. Anet has already shown that they do not place much of a priority, if any, in balancing things in WvW (understandably since it is an incredibly complicated gamemode to balance with a wide range of encounter types). Adding more ways to min/max stronger would only exasperate things. It’s just not practical to implement correctly with the limited resources of anet.

This would exponentially increase the number of build combinations the balance team would have to test, even if they did make an attempt. We already have more than enough power creep. That’s not to mention that it would widen the gulf between new players and vets and discourage new players from entering wvw. Time spent in wvw/eotm or exploiting OS kill-trade xp farm should not confer a combat advantage over other players whether statistically or through different skill/trait combinations.

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Posted by: neven.3785

neven.3785

Personally i think going to the extent the OP suggests is way overkill and heavily risks more power creep in wvw. At the moment it already is suffering from that so these kind of changes really need to be done carefully. We also don’t want to water down classes that already specialize in utility over raw damage. Justine.6351 is on the right track with revamping the system instead. Roll wvw rank points into a hero point like format to invest to obtain trait line abilities. So here’s my take on how to improve the system……

Split up the Trait lines into several categories with the same format as professions: 3 selectable traits and 3 locked traits per line. Only 3 full lines can be selected at a time. You need to go to spawn in order to reset your traits (must be determined), but it will not reset what traits you have unlocked with your rank points.

Assault Siege mastery: Treb, Cata, Ram (Interchangeable traits related to these)
Defensive Siege Mastery: Arrowcarts, Ballista, Shield Generator (Interchangeable traits related to these)
Fortification Defense Mastery: Oil, Mortar, Cannon (Interchangeable traits related to these)
Supply Mastery: Build, Repair, capacity related to supply.
Environment (i have no idea waht to call this): Guard/mercenery related, immunity to sentry immob, Golem can fit in here too i guess….

I know people are asking for Kits, but i think a single skill would suffice, the skills become available once you unlock and equip a full traight line. The reason i say just this one skill, is because the skill slot has already been implemented in living world 3. We can call it a WvW Elite Skill, all have 30 minute cooldowns to prevent it from being overabused. So this means with trait lines fully equipped, you have 3 wvw elites to choose from the available 5. They all share a cooldown. Not a huge deal by themselves, but a few people coordinating their wvw elite can help add a huge punch to their small force.

Assault Siege Kit: Skill bar replaced with each of these three superior siege type, Placing 1 siege from this kit will put it on cooldown for 30 minutes.
Defensive Siege Kit: Skill bar replaced with each of these three superior siege type, Placing 1 siege from this kit will put it on cooldown for 30 minutes.
Bubble: The current Siege you are on gets immunity from damage and disables for 30 seconds, you also get this immunity while on the piece of siege. Cannot be rotated between players, 30 minute cooldown remains. If becomes overpowered, adding a short duration disable after the immunity can help balance it out.
Personal Supply Drop: +15 Supply to the supply you are currently carrying.
Under the Radar: Sentries and Watchtowers won’t reveal you for 5 minutes. Stealth traps and reveal skills will still remove you from stealth. mesmers can use this to hide in keeps once more.

I know people want more done to wvw and will complain it doesn’t fix the problems they see are more important, but it can improve one small aspect of wvw and help reduce the grind needed for new players to have a more efficient wvw experience. Even unlocking one tree only to get that elite helps. Some Categories like provisions master can remain always enabled once you invest the wvw hero points, but there should be very limited number of categories that don’t get the trait line treatment.. A map full of tier 3 objectives is often a dead map, giving havoc squads even a little bone like this will entice them to be more active against these hard to crack objectives. In the past there was a lot more action but the automated upgrades, tactivators and lord scaling really affected the ability for small guilds to make quick efficient strikes.

Remember that this system im suggesting doesn’t remove any wvw abilities from people, everything can still be done by everyone. But as an experienced player, you will no longer be able to have every single wvw siege skill unlocked at one time, nor will you get every single passive bonus, you will need to pick and choose according to what kind of wvw you plan to play and must go back to citidal or spawn to change wvw traits out. Yea thats a draw back to a veteran, but atleast you will be getting a skill to use in return.

(edited by neven.3785)

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Posted by: Zanixo.1708

Zanixo.1708

Love the suggestions in this thread but i feel if something like this was done it would have to stay away from player damage and have other benefits because of the much needed balance in WvW.

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Posted by: Chorazin.4107

Chorazin.4107

Some progression would be good, i never even bothered looking at my rank when i played. It is totally meaningless, gold, mithril, platinum, the only use for ranks is to identify drivers for sniping. Without logging into my account i have no idea what rank i am. You dont even need to be high rank to max out all those siege skills that see very little use outside the blobs. Struggling to think of a time i poured oil.

As for balance, Anet balance around PvP. You can pick out any number of things in WvW that doesnt make sense from a balance perspective. These become less noticeable as you add numbers to the scrim. They become more prominent as you scale down to 1v1.

I agree on one thing and that is making it inclusive for new players. The early purchases in a tree or such should hold the larger gains, diminishing as you progress through the tree. Maybe have a special skin or title if you master out the whole tree as a carrot at the end.

This way buying into the tree early on as a new player would sees some (mad)gains. Sure the player with more points has higher (mad)gains but on a diminishing returns scale. So the balance isnt too far skewed that good play can overcome it.

You dont want it turning into we have x abilities because we are all Gold/Platinum+ rank, we win.

Chorazin
[lion]~ riperonis
[tRex]

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Posted by: Zephyra.4709

Zephyra.4709

Would be nice to see some progression features regarding WvW.

Not sure how it would be implemented – would it benefit veterans more so than newcomers if the root of the feature is ranks e.g; someone with 4k ranks has tonnes left over, obviously, therefore funnelling all those ranks into a specific role line leaving newcomers feeling left out? I don’t really like that idea… ESO has a similar system and the grind is absurd yet once you have it – it’s character wide which is a relief.

I’d be happy with things that aren’t insanely damage modifying/OP – we have enough powercreep in the game. Things would definitely need to be monitored/balanced if we ever get additional perks to play around with.

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Posted by: joneirikb.7506

joneirikb.7506

Some progression would be good, i never even bothered looking at my rank when i played. It is totally meaningless, gold, mithril, platinum, the only use for ranks is to identify drivers for sniping. Without logging into my account i have no idea what rank i am. You dont even need to be high rank to max out all those siege skills that see very little use outside the blobs. Struggling to think of a time i poured oil.

As for balance, Anet balance around PvP. You can pick out any number of things in WvW that doesnt make sense from a balance perspective. These become less noticeable as you add numbers to the scrim. They become more prominent as you scale down to 1v1.

I agree on one thing and that is making it inclusive for new players. The early purchases in a tree or such should hold the larger gains, diminishing as you progress through the tree. Maybe have a special skin or title if you master out the whole tree as a carrot at the end.

This way buying into the tree early on as a new player would sees some (mad)gains. Sure the player with more points has higher (mad)gains but on a diminishing returns scale. So the balance isnt too far skewed that good play can overcome it.

You dont want it turning into we have x abilities because we are all Gold/Platinum+ rank, we win.

+1 very much.

On the whole I wouldn’t mind a new system to replace the WXP with diminishing returns and to select one at the cost of other options. But at the same time, I really think they have a mountain of other things I’d rather see them fix first. Class/Combat balance for one, that this would directly affect.

Elrik Noj (Norn Guardian, Kaineng [SIN][Owls])
“Understanding is a three edged sword: your side, their side, and the truth.”
“The objective is to win. The goal is to have fun.”

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Posted by: Bridget Morrigan.1752

Bridget Morrigan.1752

I think this is going to be a balance nightmare if implemented as described. I’m not saying you couldn’t have certain…I dunno…rewards or marked responsibilities and slight changes to mechanics for players with “jobs,” but even just scanning down your list, I was like…so which one of these makes sense for X class? Are there three that work for Y class? Only one for Z class? B class is well designed for SEVEN of them???

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Posted by: Jski.6180

Jski.6180

Could we have a real siege mages that is power dmg aimed because staff ele is not that any more.

Main : Jski Imaginary ELE (Necromancer)
Guild : OBEY (The Legacy) I call it Obay , TLC (WvW) , UNIV (other)
Server : FA

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Posted by: kiwituatara.6053

kiwituatara.6053

I was thinking: “What if you had a function, like a mastery, like a job, on WvW”.
You equip it like a espec maybe in a exclusive slot and BOOM! You have special utilities and traits. What im talking about?
Look:

Defender: They defend they’r allies with a giant shield or shield bubbles (or something else), the concept is that you keep behind them as they walk to the front line, you cant pass through they’r shield and it blocks projectiles but he takes the projectile damage (maybe or partially), they also have some resistense ans sustain traits.

Battle Mage: If you running a elemental, a condi necro or something alike, this is for you, increase all ground targeting range and radius and they do more damage. Basically
you’re the guys thats keep behind everyone using area spells.

Marksman: All your single target skills have high increased range, and a bit of damage maybe. Just imagine a line of marksmans on a wall or a back line (long bow rangers rifle engis and war) shooting at a high distance.

Médic: You can revive allies even in combat, you have increased healing power and when you get up a downed allie he starts with more HP and buffs. Also, you can heal special condition from…

Trapper: Can put special traps to slow down or bait enemy squads, some of them alert enemy location, some take supplies, some inflict special conditions that can only be removed by a médic (you have médic NPCs on keeps) like a poison that keeps you in combat or a small slow debuff. Works good with…

Scout: Can either follow enemy squads steps to see where they’re hitting next or stay next your squad watching for enemy ambushs while they storm a keep, they have a (maybe) perma out of combat stealth and area revealed, they can also see nearby enemies as red dots on minimap. Only another scout or a assassin can a scout, as they have a strong revealed skill, but you can also reveal them with normal profession skills.

Fighter: The front line warriors, they get increased resistence and damage the more enemies nearby and get a % of damage as healing (works good with that warrior and guard build with lots of blocks going berserk diving on enemy squads).

Builder: The only one who can build siege in combat, if a ally interact with siege site while in combat, they just drop they’r supplies on the siege site and when the build interact with it they use the supplies dropped there to build. They also have some improved siege use and build faster and more effectively.

Assassin: They can get on the enemy back line and kill the marksman or the commander, with a high backstab skill and a stealth that looks like a scout, they make the other guys need a trapper trapping around they’r back line to catch a assassin or a scout to warn them.

Bomber: Destroi siege faster, and alone without using any siege do a nice damage to walls and gates deploying bombs on them (but the bombs can be destroyed by enemies maybe?). You want some bombers on your squad so you take a keep more faster as they are a dps to buildings.

General: I was thinking a concept of a guy that keeps buffing allies and just a general presence make allies inspired and stronger, like a special buff like outnumbered, only used by the commander (and when them die… well… you’re not inspired anymore!)

Just imagine, the fighters fighting on front line, you look to your right a médic reviving a dead guy, back there a line of marksmans and battle mages, at they’r side a builder building some arrow carts that he will use after building it, and a scout keeping a eye on they back for any assassins while your assasins are trying to sneak on enemy backlines

In the other side of the map a small squad, some scouts following enemy squad and some trappers putting traps on they’r way to slow them down.

Those are supposed to be passives and utility skills, working like the ones you already have on WvW but more specific and more present on the mode, you still using your profession skills on this sistem, as it works good for you to be a druid/ele médic a thief/ranger trapper or scout and a engi builder or bomber as some profession traits may work with the job skills.

Sorry for bad english

I don’t like the idea since it can interfere with roaming. Here’s my alternative idea.

We can have the roles still, but you have to make your build adjust to those roles and your WvW reward increases if you fulfill your chosen role.
E.g. Marksman – Finishing a player with a single target skill – increased karma, increased reward track %, increased magic find, increased wxp for 1min.
E.g. Healer – For every 10k heal on others – " "
And you would use your WXp upgrades to unlock increased karma, increased in magic find, etc for each role.

(edited by kiwituatara.6053)

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Posted by: Eypheha.5831

Eypheha.5831

I like the OP’s idea. Very innovative. Would take a good amount of work and further dev to institute something like this. Adjusting skills upon entry into WvW would cause a massive shift in play. A lot of people don’t like change and would yell regardless of it being good or bad. And the dev’s realize that.

Still, change is what drives things…and this sounds like a fun idea.

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Posted by: Draeyon.4392

Draeyon.4392

Not a bad idea actually, being able to have some “general/specific” skills for the purposes of WvW.

I would not add any skills that result in power creep like upping damage or things like that and the skills shouldn’t overshadow the abilities of classes catered to that role already.

Examples:
*A scouting skill that could mark one target up for a period to track groups (exactly how watchtower/sentries mark people). Either a utility skill or a special new skill next to your F skills

*A medic skill that allows you to revive people in combat (max 2 revivers per dead person and you get a big animation tell for counter-play)

*A movement buff that requires visiting an owned objective to reactivate. Touching a owned supply depot (dont need to resupply) gives the movement buff for x seconds, removed when you enter combat.

You could also only have 1 new skill slotted at a time and a 20-30min cooldown before you can change it over.

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Posted by: BaskingLight.4365

BaskingLight.4365

I think something along the lines of OP’s idea would be pretty cool and refreshing. However, I wonder if something like this is eventually worked on; if there could be a trial borderland added with these kind of idea’s to see if people in WvW would like this.

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Posted by: DanAlcedo.3281

DanAlcedo.3281

What we need:

1. Reward for playing
2. The ability to get good/competitive gear by only playing WvW.
3. Reward for playing over long times.
4. Balance
5. The ability go get all the stuff you need for the Scriber Upgardes (no need to pve)
6. Veteran Player reward. ( + 20% WvW track Points amulett infusion if you have 12/16 of the WvW ap)
7. More Ap for WvW

What we dont need:

1. Powercreep
2. More month of experiments
3. Gimmiks

(edited by DanAlcedo.3281)

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Posted by: Threather.9354

Threather.9354

Seems like an horrible idea. Whoevers left in the game, plays it because they like current class options. Making it completely different snowballmayhem would kinda ruin it which is not good….

What we need is ingame recommended builds tab for WvW like in BnS. 3 different trait settings for each class or so.

New nongear 5 amulet system would also be interesting. 5 to make it waaaay more statvariant from pvp

Diamond Rank Copyrights [CR]
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Posted by: Nihevil.8024

Nihevil.8024

Just wanted to say that this is an interesting suggestion! The team is interested in feedback on this idea and will continue watching this thread. However, just because we are following this thread doesn’t guarantee we will add it as a feature.

Oh god, please no. These are some awful suggestions.

Elitism in Guild Wars 2. http://i.imgur.com/ZGnzBCI.gif

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Posted by: Kiroshima.8497

Kiroshima.8497

I think rather than purely combat jobs, WvW jobs would be better focused to mutually exclusive (but respeccable) game style roles.

Examples:
~ Zerg ~
Rout the Enemy – Gain a stacking magic find and stat buff per enemy player killed in a short time. Stomps grant 5 times the boost. All stacks are lost when downed.

Conquerer’s Momentum – Gain a stacking bonus damage to gates/walls per enemy cc’d in a short time (Rams/Golems). All stacks are lost if you exit the siege (no swapping to catas).

Suppressing Fire – Arrow cart radius increased by 50%, damage reduced by 50%. Catapult shrapnel round projectiles increased by 200%. Damage reduced by 50%. Shield generator 1 (force ball) bounces a MINIMUM of 3 times but no longer grants aegis and does 66% reduced damage.

~ Havoc ~
Saboteur – Spend 100 supply at a camp to send a saboteur yak that destroys supply at enemy structures. Destroys 35 at towers, 70 at keeps, doubled if the camp is upgraded, stacks with Packed Yaks (so 140/280 at towers/keeps if upgraded and packed).

Behind Enemy Lines – On camp capture WITH 5 OR LESS PLAYERS, gain the “Behind Enemy Lines” buff. You are immune to mark, disable watchtower with siege damage, and prevent contest swords from appearing on towers (not keeps) when attacking guards, walls, or gates. Taking player damage immediately ends the buff. Allied players without the buff dispel the tower debuffs if they contest the tower in any way (hit guards or the structure).

~ Scouting/Defense ~
Overwatch – Can replace scout npcs or patrol npc groups, gaining pulsing boons. Can mark enemies with the special action button (has a cooldown). Gain bonus magic from marked enemies. Must stay within designated scout zones or patrol areas or lose all bonuses and get “Deserter” penalty reducing all stats by 20% for a time. If you mark at least 15 enemies with one cast, the special action button turns to “Return to Base” and allows you to cancel the scout job.

Yak Walker – Gain a stacking magic find boost per yak escort mission, with an increased boost if you kill an enemy during the escort. Share defensive boons (like the ranger pet boon share) with nearby yaks and their guards.

Pack Yak – Gain the ability to carry supply to structures by talking to a camp npc. Movespeed is reduced while carrying supply and endurance is set to 0. Costs 35 supply at a camp to deliver to a tower, 70 to deliver to a keep. Scout npcs and Overwatch players cripple you on hit and do bonus damage.

Not that these lines would be used but these would offer more depth/rewards to the main gamestyles of wvw, rather than things like boosting their direct combat prowress (which will be a huge hassle to balance between all the classes).

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Friendly environment, no question is too basic. Enroll Now!
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Posted by: Hexalot.8194

Hexalot.8194

Seems like an horrible idea. Whoevers left in the game, plays it because they like current class options. Making it completely different snowballmayhem would kinda ruin it which is not good…

This is why we can’t have nice things. Yes, it’s likely that those left playing the game mode are indeed some what comfortable with the way things are right now. So your solution then is to make as little changes as possible so as to not risk upsetting this group… all the while ignoring the fact that even these die hards will eventually grow bored with the stagnation in WvW and eventually move on, thus ensuring the game dies a slow death ?

Or maybe we could drastically shake/overhaul things up to see if we could bring new blood into the game instead ?

This is why we can’t have nice things…

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Posted by: Gorani.7205

Gorani.7205

What the OP (AquaBR.9250) describes sounds a little bit too much like it would add power creep and balance issue.

I like the idea of a “role” though that helps you do a certain task better.

I would use the existing special action key, we see in use in e.g. LS boss fights and raids.

e.g.
Scout – puts a revealed de-buff on the enemy (like Sentries do) at 3000 range for 30 sec; 180 sec recharge

It would be easier to follow a roamer and get others to help catching them, although you would still have to stay in persuit

Steward – refreshes targeted allied siege at range; 2000 range, ground targeted; 5 sec recharge

Makes lives of defenders on low population servers and during off-hours more tolerable

Medic – revive a downed player to full HP; 180 sec CD

Emergency rezzes for commanders and squad leader would be easier

Herder – supply dollies get their “bubble” when you are within 1200 range and not only when you are in their melee range + registers as participating in “Defend you supply caravan”; should be re-appllied (I don’t know how long those are up when you are not close right now)

Makes lives of dolly escorts easier and gives them a chance to engage the roamer trying to kill the dolly

Trickster – After activating the special action hot key, traps and disables only cost 5 supply; CD 60 sec

Encourages the use of traps and disablers

Builder – After activating the special action hot key spending supply on building and repairing counts as “monument” in terms of participation; CD 30 sec

People staying behind and repairing + siege’ing up are rewarded for their efforts

PS: Fix current issues first, before adding something completely new

Member of The Guildwars Online Guild [GWO]
Still keeps a volume of Kurzick poems ;)

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Posted by: DanAlcedo.3281

DanAlcedo.3281

Seems like an horrible idea. Whoevers left in the game, plays it because they like current class options. Making it completely different snowballmayhem would kinda ruin it which is not good…

This is why we can’t have nice things. Yes, it’s likely that those left playing the game mode are indeed some what comfortable with the way things are right now. So your solution then is to make as little changes as possible so as to not risk upsetting this group… all the while ignoring the fact that even these die hards will eventually grow bored with the stagnation in WvW and eventually move on, thus ensuring the game dies a slow death ?

Or maybe we could drastically shake/overhaul things up to see if we could bring new blood into the game instead ?

This is why we can’t have nice things…

Because we need more Gimmicks….
How about…. idk… Asc. Armor like in Pvp or a Leg. Back Pack like in Pvp?
Or maybe more Ap like in Pvp?

How about Balance like in Pvp?
How about Reward for Playing like in Pvp (Season)?

How about we finish the LONG list of things that should have been fixed a long time ago , before we start to think about more gimmicks.

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Posted by: Spurnshadow.3678

Spurnshadow.3678

K, I’m done working on my little project. This is by no means perfect or finished. This is mearely an example of what I’m thinking of combined with some of the ideas of others in this thread. I think there are some cool, fun ideas here. Being able to use a special action key is something that opens up a lot of possibilities. I’m sure there have been some other good ideas since I started this, so sorry If I wan’t able to incorperate them.

As previously stated, I don’t believe any mastery should directly effect another player and not effect any pvp combat. That is handled with class choice, group composition, trait choices, equipment stats, runes, and sigils. Masteries should only effect how we interact with the game mode of WvW.

Some main features to my idea: You can only choose from two trees. You can only spend 10 (this is totally arbitrary. It can be any number, maby 12, but it should be fixed and small. This would be up to the balance and WvW team) mastery points in the two trees. There are base masteries that are always active.

As you gain WXP, you gain rank points. Rank points can be spent to increase the effectiveness or unlock a mastery. In order to distribute mastery points to choose what you will master in, you will need a minimum of 10. You can reset your mastery choice at any time as long as you have 10 spare rank points.

You can spend your rank points at any time to increase the effectiveness of masteries, regardless of whether you’ve chosen them as a mastery. At any time, you may re-allocate all rank points as long as you have 10 extra rank points to do so.

While many veterans, like myself will be able to max the ranks in all masteries right away, We can still only pick 2 trees to spend our mastery points in. This means if we want to do something different that may better benefit from different masteries, then we would need to spend 10 rank points to re-master. This would give mastery points that veterans like us gain have value.

Here is a link to a spreadsheet outlining what I’m talking about:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1564E0ke9017sy25F8VuKMH5O9yIDePqy61XwU41DLpU/edit?usp=sharing

This outlines ALL the ideas in my head and some of the ideas in this forum. Please check it out.

Here’s an example of what the WvW panel might look like with only one mastery showing. I appologize right now for it’s crude nature. I could have made it much more artistic, but I really don’t want to put much more energy into this as I’m not getting paid for this.

It amazes me that It took me only a couple of hours to come up with some of these original ideas and to create this. Why has nothing like this been done yet in the years since the WvW mastery system has become stale?

Attachments:

Blackgate Native. It takes tremendous strength and skill to pull a lever.

(edited by Spurnshadow.3678)

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Posted by: Sviel.7493

Sviel.7493

@Spurnshadow

Commerce Tree:
I think you should move more abilities into the base tree. Players shouldn’t have to respec to buy things from a vendor. Practically, they’re going to spec to do that then spec to back into the field and do w/e else they do. It’s an artificial drain on mastery points.

Siege Tree:
Bunker and Protector are pretty much required to make any use of wall siege in the first place…and even then, they likely aren’t enough. Other than that, I’m not thrilled about increasing siege damage but another tree reduces by the same amount so…no change? Anyway, this is a solid tree but is probably too narrowly focused to be good. Siege warfare in WvW revolves around non-interaction, but this could work if that area was fixed. If not, there’s no occasion for it.

Scout Tree:
This one seems ok except for the stealth from sentry. Imagine if a Zerg took that 20s of stealth. Sure, they’d have to flip a sentry first, but that’s not a high bar. It would probably be better not to introduce more stealth into WvW.

Supply Tree:
The supply stuff is nothing new. For Yak Escorter, people are just going to move in and out of range to reset it. It would be better to make it a scaling movespeed buff rather than duration based. For Yak Defender, the size of the bubble is just aesthetic. Making it bigger wouldn’t do anything. Are you suggesting that players inside the bubble should also have damage reduction?

Defence Tree:
Revealer is nice, but it’s a fix for a problem that really shouldn’t exist in the first place. None of the rest of the tree amounts to anything. Buffing guards and giving them regeneration isn’t going to make them useful in a real fight. Also, Lords already live longer than players so the buff there will be short-lived and without practical effect. Finally, Capture Resistance does nothing because circles don’t tick down when you’re contesting them. The only time this tree performs is when there’s a fight between 1 or 2 people at an objective.

Offence Tree:
Conversely, everything in this tree is useful. Since it’s just flat damage boosts/reductions, though, it’s not really interesting. It’s also just flat out the best for zerglings, so expect virtually everyone to run it.

General:
This is miles better than the OP, but it doesn’t avoid all of the pitfalls. There aren’t real choices as to what to take so it won’t increase variety. You won’t have people picking based on their class, which is good, but they will pick basically the same trees based on their playstyle. Finally, people will have to amass ranks just to benefit from special vendors. There’s no further benefit so if they don’t have enough points to respec without going out into the field, they’re just at a disadvantage.

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Posted by: Sartharina.3542

Sartharina.3542

Defender: They defend they’r allies with a giant shield or shield bubbles (or something else), the concept is that you keep behind them as they walk to the front line, you cant pass through they’r shield and it blocks projectiles but he takes the projectile damage (maybe or partially), they also have some resistense ans sustain traits.

Already in the game. It’s called Guardian.

Battle Mage: If you running a elemental, a condi necro or something alike, this is for you, increase all ground targeting range and radius and they do more damage. Basically
you’re the guys thats keep behind everyone using area spells.

Already in the game, called Elementalist. We don’t need Range increases.

Marksman: All your single target skills have high increased range, and a bit of damage maybe. Just imagine a line of marksmans on a wall or a back line (long bow rangers rifle engis and war) shooting at a high distance.

Changing how range works (Allowing it to be useful from walls) is the only thing I can see. Rifle Warriors and Longbow Rangers otherwise already fill this job. (Rifle Warriors need their pierce on AA back!)

Médic: You can revive allies even in combat, you have increased healing power and when you get up a downed allie he starts with more HP and buffs. Also, you can heal special condition from…

This is possible with all sorts of classes.

Trapper: Can put special traps to slow down or bait enemy squads, some of them alert enemy location, some take supplies, some inflict special conditions that can only be removed by a médic (you have médic NPCs on keeps) like a poison that keeps you in combat or a small slow debuff. Works good with…

We already have traps.

Scout: Can either follow enemy squads steps to see where they’re hitting next or stay next your squad watching for enemy ambushs while they storm a keep, they have a (maybe) perma out of combat stealth and area revealed, they can also see nearby enemies as red dots on minimap. Only another scout or a assassin can a scout, as they have a strong revealed skill, but you can also reveal them with normal profession skills.

Thief can do this already?

Fighter: The front line warriors, they get increased resistence and damage the more enemies nearby and get a % of damage as healing (works good with that warrior and guard build with lots of blocks going berserk diving on enemy squads).

Warriors and Guardians already have all but the scaling defenses.

Builder: The only one who can build siege in combat, if a ally interact with siege site while in combat, they just drop they’r supplies on the siege site and when the build interact with it they use the supplies dropped there to build. They also have some improved siege use and build faster and more effectively.

This is the only thing I see working, but not really necessary.

Assassin: They can get on the enemy back line and kill the marksman or the commander, with a high backstab skill and a stealth that looks like a scout, they make the other guys need a trapper trapping around they’r back line to catch a assassin or a scout to warn them.

Thieves and mesmers can already do this.

General: I was thinking a concept of a guy that keeps buffing allies and just a general presence make allies inspired and stronger, like a special buff like outnumbered, only used by the commander (and when them die… well… you’re not inspired anymore!)

Warriors, Guardians, and Chronomancers already do this.

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Posted by: Spurnshadow.3678

Spurnshadow.3678

First off, thank you very much for taking the time to read my work and respond to it. I appreciate that.

@Spurnshadow

Commerce Tree:
I think you should move more abilities into the base tree. Players shouldn’t have to respec to buy things from a vendor. Practically, they’re going to spec to do that then spec to back into the field and do w/e else they do. It’s an artificial drain on mastery points.

Exactly. That’s the point. How often do you really use the merchants to get special stuff. If you wanted to, then you need to respec and spend the 10 (or whatever) mastery points to get it. Yes, it is a point sink.

Siege Tree:
Bunker and Protector are pretty much required to make any use of wall siege in the first place…and even then, they likely aren’t enough. Other than that, I’m not thrilled about increasing siege damage but another tree reduces by the same amount so…no change? Anyway, this is a solid tree but is probably too narrowly focused to be good. Siege warfare in WvW revolves around non-interaction, but this could work if that area was fixed. If not, there’s no occasion for it.

You’re objections already exist today in WvW. But people will have to make choices, so maybe not everyone is specced to increase/reduce siege damage. Maybe not eveyone is specced to take full advantage of siege. This would give people more of a role to play.

Scout Tree:
This one seems ok except for the stealth from sentry. Imagine if a Zerg took that 20s of stealth. Sure, they’d have to flip a sentry first, but that’s not a high bar. It would probably be better not to introduce more stealth into WvW.

I did imagine the zerg thing. That’s why I put in the description that if anyone does attack another player, then they would receive a debuf that prevents them from doing anything for 3 seconds. Maybe 5. That would basically nearly wipe you if you tried to do that.

Supply Tree:
The supply stuff is nothing new. For Yak Escorter, people are just going to move in and out of range to reset it. It would be better to make it a scaling movespeed buff rather than duration based. For Yak Defender, the size of the bubble is just aesthetic. Making it bigger wouldn’t do anything. Are you suggesting that players inside the bubble should also have damage reduction?

Yes, there’s nothing new in many of these things. I was trying to incorperate what exits in the game, and consolidate many redundant items.

Making the bubble bigger is helpful as the bubble protects you and the yak. As it is now, it’s very easy to knock someone out of the bubble and kill them. This would give someone who wanted to escort yaks increased protection. The duration of superspeed is so that a yak may get away while you run interference. If you are on a fast class, you could catch up and give you and the yak more super speed. Some people actually like escorting yaks sometimes. Sometimes, it’s very important to get that last yak in.

Blackgate Native. It takes tremendous strength and skill to pull a lever.

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Posted by: Spurnshadow.3678

Spurnshadow.3678

Defence Tree:
Revealer is nice, but it’s a fix for a problem that really shouldn’t exist in the first place. None of the rest of the tree amounts to anything. Buffing guards and giving them regeneration isn’t going to make them useful in a real fight. Also, Lords already live longer than players so the buff there will be short-lived and without practical effect. Finally, Capture Resistance does nothing because circles don’t tick down when you’re contesting them. The only time this tree performs is when there’s a fight between 1 or 2 people at an objective.

I thought there was some good stuff here. Being creative and trying to give a small advantage to outmanned players. Combine some of the things in the tree with things like Iron Guards, it could give outnumberd defenders a leg up. I’m trying to come up with new ideas that don’t effect players directly, so… whatever.

Offence Tree:
Conversely, everything in this tree is useful. Since it’s just flat damage boosts/reductions, though, it’s not really interesting. It’s also just flat out the best for zerglings, so expect virtually everyone to run it.

Not everyone wants to be a zergling, so no, not everyone would run this.

General:
This is miles better than the OP, but it doesn’t avoid all of the pitfalls. There aren’t real choices as to what to take so it won’t increase variety. You won’t have people picking based on their class, which is good, but they will pick basically the same trees based on their playstyle. Finally, people will have to amass ranks just to benefit from special vendors. There’s no further benefit so if they don’t have enough points to respec without going out into the field, they’re just at a disadvantage.

What? There are very real choices to make. If you can only pick 2 trees and limit yourself to a certain amount of masteries within, then yes, you must make a choice as to what kind of role to play. Some people just love sitting inside keeps and upgrading them, refreshing siege, scouting, etc. Someone like that would pick scout/defender. Some people love siege humping and hiding in keeps. They’d pick defence mastery/siege mastery. Zerglings would pick attacker/siege mastery. Maybe it’s not prime time anymore and things are slowing down. You’re now running in a group of 5 instead of 50. Time to retrat to something more appropriate. Of course, there are real choices.

Also, as I’m not getting paid for this, and neither is anyone else in this thread, I didn’t want to spend any more of my time coming up with new ideas. I’m sure there are some very creative people that could think of things very outside the box that I didn’t. Not my job.

Regarding the special vendors, yes, they will need to get points to access them. That, again, is already in the game. Nothing new here.

Thanks again for taking the time to read my post and check out the spreadsheet. It is by no means perfect, but a good jumping off point that may need tweeks.

Blackgate Native. It takes tremendous strength and skill to pull a lever.

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Posted by: Sviel.7493

Sviel.7493

Spurnshadow

I did imagine the zerg thing. That’s why I put in the description that if anyone does attack another player, then they would receive a debuf that prevents them from doing anything for 3 seconds. Maybe 5. That would basically nearly wipe you if you tried to do that.

I was more concerned about zergs suddenly appearing at a building with all of their siege built, or just giving the slip to anyone trying to keep tabs on them. It would, ironically, make scouting a bit of a nightmare.

Spurnshadow

Making the bubble bigger is helpful as the bubble protects you and the yak. As it is now, it’s very easy to knock someone out of the bubble and kill them. This would give someone who wanted to escort yaks increased protection. The duration of superspeed is so that a yak may get away while you run interference. If you are on a fast class, you could catch up and give you and the yak more super speed. Some people actually like escorting yaks sometimes. Sometimes, it’s very important to get that last yak in.

That’s a good reason, though I’d run it just for the free superspeed w/e an allied Yak walked by.

As for walking Yaks, I’m probably the matron saint of that q_q

Spurnshadow

I thought there was some good stuff here. Being creative and trying to give a small advantage to outmanned players. Combine some of the things in the tree with things like Iron Guards, it could give outnumberd defenders a leg up. I’m trying to come up with new ideas that don’t effect players directly, so… whatever.

The problem is that NPC guards are so weak to begin with that buffing them isn’t a huge deal. The Iron Guards upgrade is only noticeable on lords if the structure is being attacked by 5+ people. We must remember that guards haven’t been updated since day 1. Meanwhile, players have all this new, shiny gear, food, elite specs, etc. Conceptually, it’s a cool tree. Practically, you’re better off going into the siege tree and dying in a blaze of glory on an arrow cart.

Spurnshadow

What? There are very real choices to make. If you can only pick 2 trees and limit yourself to a certain amount of masteries within, then yes, you must make a choice as to what kind of role to play. Some people just love sitting inside keeps and upgrading them, refreshing siege, scouting, etc. Someone like that would pick scout/defender. Some people love siege humping and hiding in keeps. They’d pick defence mastery/siege mastery. Zerglings would pick attacker/siege mastery. Maybe it’s not prime time anymore and things are slowing down. You’re now running in a group of 5 instead of 50. Time to retrat to something more appropriate. Of course, there are real choices.

So, basically, you make a choice that’s dictated by what you’re doing then swap as necessary. So everyone who’s on offense will have the same thing and everyone on defense would have the same thing. There’s no point mixing it up because the other trees don’t have anything you might want at that moment.

Sounds to me like an illusion of choice—there are options, but one of them is the right option depending on what you’re doing.

Spurnshadow

Also, as I’m not getting paid for this, and neither is anyone else in this thread, I didn’t want to spend any more of my time coming up with new ideas. I’m sure there are some very creative people that could think of things very outside the box that I didn’t. Not my job.

I get paid to be critical of other people’s work, but that often means I come off as a jerk when I’m actually interested in something. I chose to respond to your post because I think you were close enough to the mark that it was worth talking about. Sorry for focusing on the things I think I bad.

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Posted by: Blockhead Magee.3092

Blockhead Magee.3092

Not a fan of this suggestion – I do not want a role, I just want the population more balanced throughout the day. I don’t see anything in the OP that would help overcome this huge obstacle.

SBI

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Posted by: Mysteriax.6049

Mysteriax.6049

What the OP (AquaBR.9250) describes sounds a little bit too much like it would add power creep and balance issue.

I like the idea of a “role” though that helps you do a certain task better.

I would use the existing special action key, we see in use in e.g. LS boss fights and raids.

e.g.
Scout – puts a revealed de-buff on the enemy (like Sentries do) at 3000 range for 30 sec; 180 sec recharge

It would be easier to follow a roamer and get others to help catching them, although you would still have to stay in persuit

Steward – refreshes targeted allied siege at range; 2000 range, ground targeted; 5 sec recharge

Makes lives of defenders on low population servers and during off-hours more tolerable

Medic – revive a downed player to full HP; 180 sec CD

Emergency rezzes for commanders and squad leader would be easier

Herder – supply dollies get their “bubble” when you are within 1200 range and not only when you are in their melee range + registers as participating in “Defend you supply caravan”; should be re-appllied (I don’t know how long those are up when you are not close right now)

Makes lives of dolly escorts easier and gives them a chance to engage the roamer trying to kill the dolly

Trickster – After activating the special action hot key, traps and disables only cost 5 supply; CD 60 sec

Encourages the use of traps and disablers

Builder – After activating the special action hot key spending supply on building and repairing counts as “monument” in terms of participation; CD 30 sec

People staying behind and repairing + siege’ing up are rewarded for their efforts

PS: Fix current issues first, before adding something completely new

I personally like this idea. It uses an existing in-game feature (action key) and provides some QoL improvements without excessive powercreep.

Perhaps unlocking these additional slotable skills could be added to current WvW mastery trees. For example, the “Builder” skill would be added to the end of “Build Master” in the current system for somewhat of a steep cost (perhaps 50-60 points?). “Herder” could be added at the end of “Supply Master” etc. and a menu to select a slottable skill or role would be added to the ability panel.

Bad Axxe
Blissful Epidemic [Blis]
Gate of Madness

(edited by Mysteriax.6049)

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Posted by: Pelto.9364

Pelto.9364

What happened to Ele as healer in zerg: last I heard they complained about not making damage. No damage, no loot. How many want play defender, or like that?

If anything comes as WvW abilities, add Reset button at the same time.

Edit: Lately I have been guarding ABL NC. My job title “NC Guard”. Nobody else stands there or in any other camps. Only working jobs are those which add more damage abilities. Troll abilities (like reveal) could be fun for brief moment but soon forgotten. If we want more utils, better have them as additional profession skills, and used in builds.

(edited by Pelto.9364)

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Posted by: spartan.9421

spartan.9421

Personally, I feel as though a change like this would be good. When you think about it, WvW is more about who has the bigger zerg and who can follow the blue Dorito better, rather than being about large scale battles with strategy.

I used to play WvW non-stop, and i got really into it. I enjoyed scouting for zergs, and defending keeps while heavily outnumbered, it’s what made the gamemode so fun. But after the server merge, that went away. now all it really seems to be is a game of follow the leader. (At least when I enter WvW.)

Something like this may not fix the “follow the leader” play-style people have adapted, but I believe if there were actual roles to fill it would give the gamemode more depth to it, and perhaps make it more fun.

That’s just my thoughts. I doubt Arenanet will add something like what the OP suggested, everyone seems so against it. But hey, everyone has their opinions.

Worrying is like a rocking chair: You go back and forth but never get anywhere.

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Posted by: Nightshade.2570

Nightshade.2570

What if, as a new person in WvW you just loaded into a map and you were given roles to accept. You select your role. The skills, armor and traits are preset for you. Each time you select a new role, you armor will simply switch instead of stacking tons of useless armor on a player.This continued to happen until you reached a certain level in WvW and once you reached that level your build was opened up to allow you to run what you want, or continue to select a premade build.

As a veteran, If you didnt select the premade build you would have to build and craft the suit necessary like normal and set up your abilities. However letting new inexperienced people have a good suit and build upon entering WvW is really no different then pvp.

(edited by Nightshade.2570)

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Posted by: Sviel.7493

Sviel.7493

@Nightshade
I’m all for a bit of hand-holding, but gear-fixing is going too far. If you load into WvW as a new player you should definitely get a tutorial which highlights what kind of things you may want in gear, but you should still have choice.

This is probably the most critical ignored area. No number of shiny updates mean anything if new players have no idea what’s going on.

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Posted by: Seed.5467

Seed.5467

Very interesting ideas for sure. From the top of my head i would propose a rework on the “Places of Power” and “Bloodlust – Effect”. A simple example would be :

  • Bauer’s Estate : Capturing and holding it, will grand to all the Dolyaks leaving the camp a +10% increase of Speed.
  • Orchard Overlook : Capturing and holding Orchard Overlook, will periodically reveal the position of all enemies currently on the map.
  • Battle’s Hollow : Capture and hold Battle’s Hollow and earn 15% damage mitigation for all the defensive siege and 10% damage increase to all the offensive siege.
  • Carver’s Ascent : Capture and hold Carver’s Ascent to gain a +300 extra supply capacity on all the keeps and towers your realm holds on the current map.
  • Temple of Lost Prayers : Capture and hold Temple of Lost Prayers to earn +60 bonus points to power, precision, toughness, vitality, condition damage, and healing power while the “Outnumbered buff” is active. If the “Outnumbered buff” is not active then you earn +30 bonus points to power, precision, toughness, vitality, condition damage, and healing power instead.

The above are the minor buffs that those “places of power” will grant to the realm that owns them. The major buffs could be :

  • Minor Defense : Capture and hold 2 places or power to grant a +10% damage mitigation for all the players on the map.
  • Minor Offensive : Capture and hold 2 places or power to grant a +10% damage increase for all the players on the map.
  • Major Defense : Capture and hold places or power to grant a +15% damage mitigation for all the players on the map.
  • Major Offensive : Capture and hold 3 places or power to grant a +15% damage increase for all the players on the map.
  • Superior Defense : Capture and hold 2 places or power to grant a +20% damage mitigation for all the players on the map.
  • Superior Offensive : Capture and hold 2 places or power to grant a +20% damage increase for all the players on the map.

Regards

Seed