Guild Wars 2

Any Anet dev to confirm this ?
We hardcore WvWers who WvW for countless hours everyday, i’m sure we play WvW More than you Developers do, Before u start working on stuff let us know the plan so we can offer suggestions ?

As an example the waypoints on east and West keeps in the borderlands need to appear when the keep gets to Tier 3 ( JUST LIKE STONEMIST CASTLE IN ETERNAL )

Because it’s a huge advantage to servers who outnumber other servers or servers that are focued on PPT and not PvP

TLDR :::

DO YOU WANT TACTIVATORS ON ALPHINE BLS ? SIMPLY PUT YES OR NO

My answer as someone who Commanded 7+k hours in WvW for 3 years is

NO
NO
NO
NO
NO
NO

Typing the same word in all caps over and over again won’t help you get a faster dev response.

it will
i have faith

Well they are in EB so ofc they will be on alpine too. I asume all upgrades found on eb will be found in alpine borders. I certainly hope the sentries will move there since those were the best thing with the HoT.

Please don’t add auto upgraded on buildings in Old borderland and don’t change when you get WP it should be last in a line off upgrades.
And keep so it require supply to do upgraded, if you want to change do change like I suggested that dolys drop off 50/100supply Tower and half go to upgraded half to what players can use.

A tactivator that roots an entire blob on lords room for 10 seconds, and players affected cant cast.

A tactivator that spreads low agony and poison clouds on gates. (stealth force players to farm ascended FTW,)

Some sorta of Ice keep, that gets a tactivator with Slow 100% uptime for enemies and confusion ticks.

For some reason i think Anet would do this…..for easy blob wipes, but they anonuced some changes to the core system so… theres a beacon of hope.

Well, if they are in EBG, then they will be in ABL’s, sorry to say. I would just like them removed from ALL BL’s.

I don’t have a problem with them if they are being tweaked a bit. It adds a fun bit of tactical play that can surprise your enemy but shouldn’t take away from the main part: fights.

Yes, Tactivators are just part of the Gimmicks that need to be binned. It honestly feels like they completely overlooked the fact that you would have Entire Zerg’s on siege humping and using the tactviators against the few outside… ANYTHING the one can do the MANY can do in mass and then it just gets stupid. Players want LESS environmental nonsense and more SKILL based PvP pls. I wish they would roll back ALL the guild upgrades to the old system, and convert the new upgrades into something much better for all the poor fools who had to spend their hard earned money and work tirelessly to get back what was taken from them in the first place.

At least then those who only had everything they had stolen from them with HoT, and were unable to get anything back would at least get back what was taken, and those who worked their kittens off actually receive a useful and more pleasing benefit for their efforts to return what was taken to their guilds.

They need to remove the tactivators entirely from WvW and never bring them back… just go put them on the head of some statue in LA or something, but get them out of there.

well if they bring the alpine maps back I’m sure they will be added what-ever is said, its the new system sorry.

Angel Heart.6739:

well if they bring the alpine maps back I’m sure they will be added what-ever is said, its the new system sorry.

I wasn’t aware you were their new spokesperson that was designated to come tell the GW Community “sorry”. Would you mind telling us who designated you the person to inform us that they were ignoring the thousands of players that will not return to the game and the many more who will still leave if they put this HoT garbage in Alpine maps? I must have missed the reddit.

As far as I am aware, they have not said what was and was not going to be added for sure in Alpine. IF their goal is to bring more players back to WvW, they would actually listen to them this time, not ignore the masses and tell them " sorry." The primary reason the MAJORITY of players wanted Alpine back was to get rid of the HoT mess, while they went back to the drawing table to go in the actual opposite direction instead. Any less will not have the desired results. If they want results, they have to rework the " system". If they are just going through the motions and not actually going for results, why bother at all? Just EotM alliance system it and call it a day while the game mode dies instead. There is no point wasting the money, time and effort if you are not going to actually try to save the game mode.

its just an observation, why would they alter the system?

spokes-person, lol , leading a guild and enjoying the game is enough for me

no thank you :-)

Angel Heart.6739:

its just an observation, why would they alter the system?

spokes-person, lol , leading a guild and enjoying the game is enough for me

no thank you :-)

Yes leading one of the largest 100% active WvW guilds in the game prior to HoT kept a person busy, however that isn’t much work now since thousands of players stopped playing due to these things being added to the game. If the many were enjoying the game, they would not be bring back Alpine. Sure, they have the few that are left … for now, but as more friends and family sadly give up and walk away from the game they once loved, the remaining friends and family will follow them shortly to join them so they can have fun with those they enjoy playing with most.

If you were observant, you would realize they will change the system to save the game mode.

I disagree with having.. Tactivators in Alpine, let alone existing as a whole. Switching a lever and having supply magically appear just feels.. Wrong. Like no one contributed to it at all. It’s just there now. Surprise.

I felt the same way about auto upgrades. That nice T3 keep got there via AI and no longer was it from someone committed, standing guard and nursing it that far, manual effort. Human interaction with the game mode… I care naught for anything upgraded now. It’s like ANet wanted to put WvW on auto pilot mode.

Please, I pray for no HoT gimmicks in Alpine.

rip no anet respond

you really expected a response within the day? LOL

anyways.. tactivators... meh. i don’t have a strong opinion one way or the other regarding tactivators

i actually like the newer upgrade method... there was far too much drama from the costs involved in upgrading structures and people misqueueing things... either the wrong upgrade at the wrong time, or queueing a superfluous upgrade (like... merchants) when an enemy was attacking, draining all the supply for defense. that being said, i also like the change that made it so that it didn’t auto upgrade no matter what.. that you needed to get a certain number of dolys to the structure. this allows solo/duo and havoc groups to cut off upgrades to structures. the one thing i miss about the new upgrading system is being able to queue doly guards on a freshly flipped camp to make it just a bit more difficult for a solo to reflip. tactics yo! LOL

please please please please PLEASE make the keep waypoints operate the way they used to... and the way SMC currently does. you don’t get a WP till it’s upgraded to that point, but once you have it... IT’S YOURS.

Please NO. I wish they would be removed from Eternal Battlegrounds as well.

Many banners create balancing issues and the air strike at Stone Mist Castle is simply overpowered. Most players want to fight each other, not against the environment. Also please remove the invisibility fountain from SMC.

Thank you!

While it’s likely they will be added,

I really hope they’re not.

I’d like to see them gone in general, frankly.

What is a tactivator? i saw them but what are they suppose to do?

Hey Tyler

Thanks for the response. It’s probably not easy to send this out here, when you know many players are opposed to the mechanic, and we do not all react as reasonably as we probably should (me neither). If I try to detach my feelings about this for a moment, I still have a couple of problems with tactivators at this point though:

1. They’re accessible to only a small portion of players: many smaller guilds do not have any opportunity to use them, and we also lost the guild buffs we had unlocked, like the +5 supply buff etc. without getting anything back for it. So if you’re saying “scribing costs come down” that could be a good thing to allow more guilds with less resources to unlock their , but then I come to my second reason:

2. Some of the tactics are too strong and rather than supporting the battle in a strategic way, and adding more depth to it, they end up dumbing the fight down. Examples are the stealth fountain, the dragon banner and airship. Surely the purpose is not to make the tactics deciding factors in a battle? Does rebalancing mean ‘nerfing’?

3. Some of the tactics favor the winning side of the match-up. It’s probably really hard to make it so that these tactics help the losing sides more than the winning side, but that’s really something that needs to be looked in. For example, SMC is nearly always captured by the strongest server… why give them stealth?

Yes, I could agree with tactivators when they were like the +5 supply buff we had pre-hot. That was not a game-breaking mechanic, but simply added to the use of guilds. So basically if tactics are not dominating the battle but somehow ‘adding to it’, that would really be a great step forward. One way to work to that conclusion is to increase cooldowns as you say, but maybe you could just reduce the efficiency or impact of tactivators so they were ‘helpful’ but not ‘deciding’ in a battle.

Also, sorry for the occasional negativity on the player side. We all just want to see WvW shine.

I do not want them in WvW. If they were to stay, they should only be usable by a guild ONCE every 24 hours, and even then I frown at the idea of it existing.

Why reward someone with extra firepower if they’re able to hold an objective for an extended period of time? The snowball effect is not good, and it is not fair.

I’m afraid bringing back ABL updated with HoT gimmicks will just alienate more WvW players.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Yes.

That said, we’ll be increasing the cooldowns on all tactics by 5-10 minutes. Also, once the scribing costs come down, as part of the april build, we can start looking at rebalancing their actual effects as well.

That said, You can expect NOT to have a return of players if you are bringing in HoT into Alpine and consider it a pretty much waste of time to do so. The entire reason the majority of players wanted Alpine back was to go back to Pre HoT WvW while reversing course on WVW plans to make it Less " Tactivator" focused and more on player skill.

Bringing Hot into Alpine will only ensure the players that left will not be returning, and the rest waiting to hear will be joining them soon. It is a waste of time, money and effort to go through the motions but not actually doing what players asked for. They ARE going to notice.

I can beg players to give it another chance, but they have already made their minds that you guys will never listen so what is the point when you are doing exactly what they requested you not do.

When this doesn’t work due to this decision, you know why.

lil devils x.6071:

The entire reason the majority of players wanted Alpine back was to go back to Pre HoT WvW while reversing course on WVW plans to make it Less " Tactivator" focused and more on player skill.

Spot on. Skill as a player and as a guild should matter in WvW.

I hate the desert bl, more then I hate the hot gimmick crap even if I do want them all gone I would rather have alpine back for now. EB has tactivators and it can be messy at times, especially in sm so they really need to nerf and balance a ton of stuff. Problem with removing them all right now is because they are tied to guild upgrades, and thats just a giant headache for them to deal with if they attemped to remove them.

Tyler I have mentioned this before, I really hope you guys learned a good lesson here. Leave yourself room to maneuver, because you guys basically trapped yourself in a corner with a lack of focus on consequences and anticipation especially with tying this gimmick garbage to guild upgrades.

While we are at it, please rework the out dated and unbalanced siege mechanics, thanks.

Sirendor.1394:

lil devils x.6071:

The entire reason the majority of players wanted Alpine back was to go back to Pre HoT WvW while reversing course on WVW plans to make it Less " Tactivator" focused and more on player skill.

Spot on. Skill as a player and as a guild should matter in WvW.

I have been trying to delay formatting my primary PC to dedicate a new game fresh, as the many before me waiting on the other side.. unfortunately I think that day may have come.

TBH, it would probably save them in the end if they just EotM mega server it and call it a day at this point if they are not going to actually fix it. What is the point of bringing back a map that only insults what they asked for to make them want to burn the place down with fire when they see it?

This was very disheartening news.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Yes.

That said, we’ll be increasing the cooldowns on all tactics by 5-10 minutes. Also, once the scribing costs come down, as part of the april build, we can start looking at rebalancing their actual effects as well.

Alpine won’t be the same then. The only good parts brought by HoT are the scouting system from NPC guards and those related to dolyaks. The rest are all very bad or worse. Even more so because these take away time from the dev team, time that should be spent on measures to save WvW, and not on these things.

I guess hoping that WvW won’t completely die is meaningless now. The time is running out for the last of the last players. “One more battle, before all is over”…

To ArenaNet: Thanks for the good times, was fun once, despite culling and orb hacking, the battles were a joy. It was worth playing it.

To the players who made WvW alive: thanks for being part and making this game mode immensely fun, despite the shortcomings all over since the beginning. See you all in the next RvR game!

I can remember that some devs or community managers had been playing on some servers back in the days to check whats going on in wvw. Is there any list of who from arenanet visited which server?

As im sadly complete confused where the ideas like tactivators came from.

One of the thrills e.g in wvw has always been to arrive a destination before the enemy pumps it down. It gave joy to the players to hurry to the point of attack together.

You will have rather more success with bringing acceptance to wvw if you implement an proper reward system for players who take the role as scout e.g. Like a person who fullfills certain task while scouting a tower is rewarded like a zerg is rewarded invading towers etc. we had a point where tasks where identified to be done by players which always had been the most unrewarding in guildwars.

also wvw needs competition and tournament with proper rewards again.

I would start with reward system for scouts.

Also balancing of siege is important. An arrow cart e.g. Should be able to cause damage to players but less damage to other siege. It cannot be that hours of scout work is instantly destroyed by a attacking zerg putting 2 ac on the ground to clean a building…

Also skills of players is of need to be worked on. There cant be siege and players are instanly put down by 2casters.

One of the success of wvw always has been that groups where fighting over buildings for minutes and minutes.

I cant understand why that all was destroyed as wvw had a good balance. Why was it never further developed when staff has been on tour with players?

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Yes.

That said, we’ll be increasing the cooldowns on all tactics by 5-10 minutes. Also, once the scribing costs come down, as part of the april build, we can start looking at rebalancing their actual effects as well.

Tyler, NO please NO!! This is not what wvw players want at all….it needs to go for once and for all! NO TACTIVATORS for the love of GW2 wvw please!

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Yes.

That said, we’ll be increasing the cooldowns on all tactics by 5-10 minutes. Also, once the scribing costs come down, as part of the april build, we can start looking at rebalancing their actual effects as well.

Mmm, I am on the “No” boat myself but…

The cooldown increase is a nerf to such effects, and scribe costs may help with availability of them, but I think how the re-balancing is done is going to define a lot of people’s experiences.

For example, pre-“invisible water fix/nerf duration” players could kill the fountains (obviously kill them too fast!). I think the premise that the offense has a way to intuitively counter some of the tactivators would help instead of just adjusting numerical values. So instead of making fountains un-killable as a “fix,” make them an objective to kill, and give them a certain amount of HP.

Going along with that idea in another example, if chilling fog is activated…the flying saucers above would each have 25k hp, and could be killed to alleviate that affect in a given area. While I understand such effects are to help with defending objectives, but it’s basically too far in the spectrum with some the effects…it basically becomes a waste of time for those that are aggressive in a balanced situation. Such as some of the passives like iron guard on the lord in conjunction with their current dynamic scaling. Which is probably why people will actively seek undefended objectives, and switch maps to avoid fighting players.

I’m looking forward to seeing a balance pass on some of the tactics. Most of the timers did need an increase.

I am also bemused that anyone thought that tactics wouldn’t make an appearance on ABL.

dubstax.9102:

I’m not big on the tactivators either, but lets not kid ourselves. A lot of people keep talking “skill.” With massive boon spam, massive condi spam, gear discrepancies, and complete cheese build comps (perma stealth roamers anyone?) lets not pretend that ditching tactivators will magically create balanced, skill based World vs. World fights.

There is a difference between using skills and strategy with a build you setup as opposed to relying on gimmicks that encourage people to avoid fighting.

Thank you Tyler for answering in such a clear way.

But I think it’s in Anet’s best interest not to waste time, money and energy in something a lot of players (and especially those who used to go to WvW and don’t do anymore) have allready say they don’t want.

I love the Minor Supply Drop tactic! Why? Cuz it makes up (ever so slightly) for all the folks brainlocked on PPK and not actually taking care of supply lines. Especially when siege (and especially refreshing siege) is held in such disdain… until an objective is being attacked and siege is only put up reactively—instead of preemptively—and thus draining supply very quickly.

I go to WvW to WvW—WvW is much more than JUST PvP.

As for other tactics… allow for Assault Rollers to be slotted in Towers and Keeps also. Assault rollers are another type of Siege Golem, and can be better utilized than banners. (Plus, Assault Rollers are hilarious to watch bounding about.)

Stealth and airship are SM only – they won’t be going to the ABLs. I am meh on the tactivators myself, just surprised any of you thought they wouldn’t be added as they are in EBG. My biggest gripe is how the WPS work.

dubstax.9102:

I’m not big on the tactivators either, but lets not kid ourselves. A lot of people keep talking “skill.” With massive boon spam, massive condi spam, gear discrepancies, and complete cheese build comps (perma stealth roamers anyone?) lets not pretend that ditching tactivators will magically create balanced, skill based World vs. World fights.

I don’t think anyone is " kidding" themselves. This was just supposed to be STEP 1 of MANY to saving WvW. Players just wanted to take back all of the horrible making the game unplayable atm before starting on the right path to nonstop strategic, challenging, fun, large scale PvP action. This was only supposed to be one step in the process to give players hope, when they had none. Then get the Balance, Stabs, PPK all in order while we wait in our Pre HOT WvW anxiously.

What this meant to players was:“They really have changed, they are listening and the players actually matter to them for real this time, not just say they are then do the opposite anyways. "

What they are saying instead is: " Business as usual, we are going to do exactly the opposite of what you asked for and try to tell you this is what YOU wanted."

It is being set up to fail. :/

If this is how it is going to be the over $500 from my bank accounts that were spent on HoT and accessories will be the last time I am duped into thinking this could be good.

WE PAID FOR THEM TO DO THIS TO US! AHHHH!

Put the tactivators outside wvw, we don´t want that crap in wvw.

What a lot of people don’t understand is that Anet want to sell gems….
You want to be able to place those pay2win guild upgrade ? Then or you go to farm for hours, or you can use your credit card…
It’s only this ! In other way why should they add those powerfull pve thing ? Why should they place them behind huge (really huge) grind wall ?

WvW will be dead, the old map with the HoT kitten will be probably the same failure as the deserted borderland ! The failure is not only about the map, all other stuff around are very important too !

Tactivators from HoT are the same as the original Bloodlust. It helps those that have more. It has nothing to do with skill.

Bring back skill to win in WvW and you’ll bring back the players that left.

dubstax.9102:

Sich.7103:

What a lot of people don’t understand is that Anet want to sell gems….
You want to be able to place those pay2win guild upgrade ? Then or you go to farm for hours, or you can use your credit card…
It’s only this ! In other way why should they add those powerfull pve thing ? Why should they place them behind huge (really huge) grind wall ?

WvW will be dead, the old map with the HoT kitten will be probably the same failure as the deserted borderland ! The failure is not only about the map, all other stuff around are very important too !

There are problems and they are many. However, sometimes I feel as though you old vets that refuse to adapt want this game mode to die because it no longer fits your idealistic view of how World vs. World should be…

When you know thousands of players who left and you want them to come back and play with you, it is far from wanting the game to die.. we are BEGGING them to stop killing it. There is a big difference. We want it to be the best Large scale PvP game on the market so we can all have a game we enjoy playing together, not have it die.
Begging them to stop making it worse and making everyone leave is not by any means wanting them to kill the game. When the " noise" goes away that means we all gave up trying and left.

Us “Old Vets” remember back when WvW was active all day every day, when there was actually queues during the day, when there was actually action going on on all maps with all sides.

What we get upset about is the constant neglect and terrible changes from anet over the last several years that have made wvw the giant mess it is today and is responsible for driving away so many players.

It is not that we have a narrow minded idealistic view of wvw. It comes from experience, and comparing and contrasting wvw when it was actually more fun and active, and seeing the changes that created the problems facing it today.

dubstax.9102:

I don’t think objections to the way World vs. World has been handled is noise. Many valid concerns have been raised over time. I just feel as though with some older players ArenaNet is doomed no matter what they do because some people refuse to adapt or compromise at all. It’s like our current political system in the US.

Changing stuff is one thing, the way they go about it is another. One of the problems with the hot additions is that they were all thrown into wvw at once causing mass chaos, instead of being thoroughly tested for feedback and balance and implemented with incremental updates. Even with pve they dont just throw everything in at once because it would cause so many issues for them and the playerbase. Tying gimmicks to guild upgrades just made it much more difficult for anet to make meaningful changes to them. Nerf them to much, and they arent worth making, remove them and decide whether its possible to refund the guild for the mats and gold used to make them which is a nightmare in itself, and doesnt give back the time devoted to that grind.

The main issue is anets mishandling of wvw. You cannot neglect your playerbase, and leave yourself no room to make changes. It’s just a recipe for disaster, many of us predicted this as early as the beta tests, and well…

X T D.6458:

Changing stuff is one thing, the way they go about it is another. One of the problems with the hot additions is that they were all thrown into wvw at once causing mass chaos

Exactly this. If Anet is serious about rebuilding this game mode, then they need to make a serious commitment to monitoring the changes on live, in real time as well as via metrics, and making regular (weekly to bi-weekly) adjustments to bring things into balance. No more pretend beta weekends, no more quarterly changes.

If they can push a patch full of gem store nonsense every two weeks, they can slap in a bit to adjust the stats, cooldowns and durations of some WvW tactics based on actual, widespread use and feedback.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Yes.

That said, we’ll be increasing the cooldowns on all tactics by 5-10 minutes. Also, once the scribing costs come down, as part of the april build, we can start looking at rebalancing their actual effects as well.

Thank you for this wonderful news. Time to dust off my WoW account. No need to wait around anymore…

dubstax.9102:

I don’t think objections to the way World vs. World has been handled are noise. Many valid concerns have been raised over time. I just feel as though with some older players ArenaNet is doomed no matter what they do because some people refuse to adapt or compromise at all. It’s like our current political system in the US.

The thing is that facts are facts.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Yes.

That said, we’ll be increasing the cooldowns on all tactics by 5-10 minutes. Also, once the scribing costs come down, as part of the april build, we can start looking at rebalancing their actual effects as well.

I mean…. are you trying to kill WvW? Seriously what the kitten is wrong with you people.
Leave that kitten in EB if you want, you’ll still get people to give you money so they can grind your kittening pve pay wall, but give us back the alpine map without your stupid kitten.
I know Anet had a serious problem with thinking about long term solutions but here’s a hint, you can’t milk a dead cow.

The system will stay. I hope that the costs for Improvements and Tactics will signifacantly sink. This would enable even smaller guilds to build at least low tier upgrades for claimed objects.

The Improvements are widely accepted. The Tactics seem to cause some severe issues. Some are really too strong if used by dominating servers. Maybe you should restrict the access to certain Tactics to the losing servers. This could be a come-back-feature for them.

dubstax.9102:

Okay okay. Look, I am not trying to tick off you old veteran World vs. World players. I just like seeing issues from all angles when it has to do with a topic I find myself interested in. I like World vs. World… even now. I do agree that a different direction needs to be taken to bring it back to being more immersive and fun for everyone. Tactivators are here to stay. What I would like to see is more of a focus on how they work, when they work, and how they affect not just immediate battles but the overall strategic impact they have on the map where they are deployed. Make lemonade out of lemons folks. It may not be ideal to have them in the alpine BLs, but an adjustment to cooldowns is a start and at least shows that ArenaNet is trying.

Lol dont be scared, we dont bite. The cd reduction is something I agree, the rest, well we will see as time goes on. At least lately they have been making some attempts to get on the right track even if it hasnt been perfect

-reset back on fridays, except an hour later, hope they change that back to an hour earlier
-alpine maps coming back, but with hot mechanics, which are due to get balancing updates and increased cooldowns
-live beta testing to be used
-improvements to the dbl, we’ll see

It’s something at least, even if not the ideal for many players. The important thing is, what will bring back players, and what will keep people playing wvw.

dubstax.9102:

Okay okay. Look, I am not trying to tick off you old veteran World vs. World players. I just like seeing issues from all angles when it has to do with a topic I find myself interested in. I like World vs. World… even now. I do agree that a different direction needs to be taken to bring it back to being more immersive and fun for everyone. Tactivators are here to stay. What I would like to see is more of a focus on how they work, when they work, and how they affect not just immediate battles but the overall strategic impact they have on the map where they are deployed. Make lemonade out of lemons folks. It may not be ideal to have them in the alpine BLs, but an adjustment to cooldowns is a start and at least shows that ArenaNet is trying.

kitten that. If you are driving down the road and realize you went in the wrong direction you turn the hell around. You don’t keep driving hoping somehow you’ll get even more lost and magically find yourself at your destination.

Anet tried something new and it didn’t work. That would be fine if they were willing to learn from their mistakes. Ignoring that they made a mistake and continuing to waste time and money on the mistake is the problem. They need to revert WvW to a playable state, start communicating with WvW players on the forum (not kittening PvE streamers, not kittening reddit) and try out new things.