Guild Wars 2

I am getting sick and tired of the warrior roamers in WvW. Every time I come up against these guys there nearly impossible to beat in solo combat, and anytime they realize there not going to win they run away heal and run back.

Here are the biggest issues with the build.
Outrage – breaks stuns with a ten second recharge. I don’t even know a CC with a 10 second recharge.
8 seconds of invulnerability – with Endure Pain/Defy Pain this also has no downside as they can attack while invulnerable.
Last Stand – Instant stun-breaker and 8 seconds of Stability
1.5k toughness and 20k health
Berserk + Eternal Champion – Berserk effects and stability, fury, Quickness, Swiftness. Plus might when you stun-break.
Healing Signet – No need to even stop to heal.

and the big issue.
3 leaps – allowing to move 2,250 units away in 3.75 seconds. With recharges in 8s, 10s, 20s.

I have seen the warrior win 3:1 I have seen the warrior escape chasing zergs by running half way across the map and back into a tower. This warrior build is pretty much broken in all aspects. I don’t know why this has been allowed to go on for so long.

Hai,

You might find it worthwhile to ask this in the warrior section of the forums….that forgotten place.

Anyways ill help you out since i main warrior. You’ll have to help me/us out a bit though and list what class you want to use and what kinda build you want to use.

IN GENERAL THOUGH:
5 things to talk about: the first 3 are the types of builds meta warriors use, and the other 2 are condi and power warriors damage types.

1. Ur standard melee warrrior is generally either spec’d for countering power, condi, or is a hybrid for countering both (and thus a bit weaker at countering power/condi in general).

As you listed: a warrior built for fighting power users has a ton of heals. Infact this is by far the most OP warrior variant you can run across if you don’t use condi. Best counter, and infact its hardcounter, is condition damage. Failing that though, don’t stun the warrior….since that just gives it ridiculous heals, tank, adrenaline. Kite the warrrior with ranged weapons. ANd above all else: have a stability in ur gearset. These warriors hate stability, it counters a large portion of their gimmick combo’s.

2. If the warrior is spec’d to counter condi damage…..then power builds are best to use against him. It becomes a very similar case to the one stated above. If you are a condition user though you need to be aware of what berserker stance is, the fact it has a 60s cd, and the fact that it applies resistance 3x over 10 or so seconds. The other one is healing signet the main heal of all warriors, know that is can give a 6s resistance on use. The other things some warriors use is signet of stamina, its alot rarer these days, but it means they will dodge alot and it can cleanse all conditions on them upon use (it has a cast time). And the most important thing to be aware of is cleansing ire….which is a trait spec that gets rid of most condition on the warrior each time they use their F1 burst. In general when they enter berserk mode they will have ALOT of F1 bursts in rapid succession. Dodging their f1 bursts will negate the condi clean and their adrenal health heal.

3.The hybrid damage mitigation warriors can be taken down the same way as the others, mainly through kiting and wearing down their invulnerabilities (whatever they chose as their own). Generally this is 2x endure pains, and 1x berserker stance + rousing resilience.

4. Kiting is key to defeating warriors, they have long kitten cd’s on their invulerabilities….and they are only powerful because of these invulnerabilities and their heavy stuns. Make them proc their berserker stance/endure pains and kite them when they do….then move in for the kill once they are used up. In general all warriors have 5 second weapon swaps as well….so they will also be able to condi clear 1 or more conditions on each swap. And in general when fighting a berserker, as soon as they glow red….kite or double dodge. Warriors have access to headbutt on a 20 second cd or 25? (dont remember) which has a shortish range. You can often guess when they will use the headbutt and dodge beforehand. ONce a warrior uses a gap closer towards you….they generally imediately try to headbutt, so just dodge/block/dash from them.

5. Melee warrior also deals either power or condi damage in and of itself.
When fighting condition spec’d warriors….look to see if they are using a bow or not. If they aren’t, kite them. Condition warriors generally have a sword MH on them, so they have a bit more movement speed going on. They have an easier time running away from fights as well as closing the gaps. Bow warriors will generally try to tie you down and get you in their bow’s fire field…..just walk out of it and fight them from a distance if you can (if they are running MH sword you don’t have to worry so much about their melee set’s damage, so you can just melee them generally provided you have a stability to counter their stuns).

my gawd this is taking forever to explain and im not even half way through….alot of information yo.

In terms of preventing them from running/getting away……I don’t really know what to tell you? Thiefs are faster. Mesmers are faster. Druids may be a bit slower in a race but they have larger gap closers and can easily catch warriors in an early race. Kitten, even many revenants ive seen are faster and can catch warriors. Idk what to tell you in terms of that, you should be able to catch them and apply the techniques above to whittle them down till they can be killed.

Warriors that use sword MH have the most mobility but that sword comes at the cost of damage making them lesser opponents in a duel situation. Warriors also might have bullrush which is a 30s cd dash in between gs5 and sword 2 in its distance. Again though, bullsrush will take up a valuable utility slow making them lesser when it comes to defense.

He’s not looking for a how-to, he obviously knows what he is talking about when it comes to warriors.

This post is about how broken the class has become when all others are getting seemingly endless nerfs. There should be no existence of a “rabbit” or “runner” type-spec yet here we see builds popping up allowing players a perceivably limitless amount of escape-and-run opportunities. These builds are highly ignorant of standard MMORPG balance etiquette as they spit in the face of cooldowns and tactics.

Cerby.1069:

…

1. If I have to gear myself to counter one class, then that class is broken. Also not every class has Stability, and most don’t have enough to keep up with the gimmicks.

2.You pretty much said here an anti-condi warrior is immune to conditions.

3.Stuns. Once again few classes have a consistent source of stability.

4.Leaps + stuns + 25% runspeed. You can’t kite warriors.

5.I have never seen any class catch up to these warriors. Yes, Mesmers and druids can keep up for a the initial dash, but with Ancestral grace and bink only giving 1,200u for 18s/30s. The warriors 2,250u every 20s beats them considerably.

and if your wondering. the leap combo is Rush+Whirlwind+Savage Leap.

Lacuda.8543:

He’s not looking for a how-to, he obviously knows what he is talking about when it comes to warriors.

This post is about how broken the class has become when all others are getting seemingly endless nerfs. There should be no existence of a “rabbit” or “runner” type-spec yet here we see builds popping up allowing players a perceivably limitless amount of escape-and-run opportunities. These builds are highly ignorant of standard MMORPG balance etiquette as they spit in the face of cooldowns and tactics.

I know what you mean, but I covered everything he asked for. I just put the running bit last. The fact he can’t catch them is because of the class he’s playing or how he plays it. He/she should be able to close the distance to damage them. Next step would be knowing how to damage them….and i covered that. Put 2 and 2 together…..we have an answer to the OP.

zerorogue.9410:

1. If I have to gear myself to counter one class, then that class is broken. Also not every class has Stability, and most don’t have enough to keep up with the gimmicks.

2.You pretty much said here an anti-condi warrior is immune to conditions.

3.Stuns. Once again few classes have a consistent source of stability.

4.Leaps + stuns + 25% runspeed. You can’t kite warriors.

5.I have never seen any class catch up to these warriors. Yes, Mesmers and druids can keep up for a the initial dash, but with Ancestral grace and bink only giving 1,200u for 18s/30s. The warriors 2,250u every 20s beats them considerably.

and if your wondering. the leap combo is Rush+Whirlwind+Savage Leap.

1. okay….then you need to look at other abilities such as dodges and blocks, and time them to when warriors use thier heavy stuns. you can go on youtube or whatever to see what their heavy stun animations looks like. This is where anti-warrior gameplay shines….warriors have very easy to read moves.
2. Sorry if i made it sound that way. Thats not my intention. Most condi users have access to boonstrips, which are deadly to warriors given their lower boon pool. Anti-condi warriors just have a large amount of resistance and clears, but condi classes also have ALOT of condi attacks lol….its just a case of wwearing the warrior out and dodging their bursts, timing ur attacks so cleansing ire doesn’t clear it, putting enough condition so their weapon swaps can’t clear the damaging ones. Its not hopeless at all imo. Necro go at them and come out on top alot…and the warrior is spec’d to counter the necro!

3. okay just see 1, invulnerabilities or heal from damage taken abilities are great too.

4. you actually can, its harder if they have more than the standard gs+headbutt, and 1 other leap. and most will break immobilize with their weapon movement skills (its glitchy tho so 50% of the time it will make them pause/break). That 25% runspeed is pretty standard for all classes at this time, the fact most meta warrior won’t have their own source of swiftness (33% runspeed) is a HUGE plus to you. You should savour that advantage.

5. I think you’d be surprised if you tried warrior urself, especially against the mesmer and druid. although i can understand what you are saying…..im saying a class with a large number of lesser distance leaps is vulnerable vs classes with small numbers of slightly larger leaps.

Rush whirlwind savage leap, you say? Like I said, if they are running sword they are giving up damage for mobility. The 3 of them together though doesn’t change my argument at all. Now if you added a 4th like bullsrush….then ya you will outrun most of the enemy. I can tell you from experience running all 4 that very few things can keep up after procing all 4…..yet many things can still kill and catchup if you are using just the 3 u mentioned. I’m not saying its not hard lol. If a thief is intent on running away and not fighting they are gonna get away. If a mesmer is spec’d to run away and it wants to its gonna get away. If a warrior is spec’d to run away…..its gonna run away ‘if’ it saves enough of its dashes. The saving grace with warrior is it doesn’t have stealth….you know where its going, the dashes are smaller, and most of the dashes are actually important for its dps/combat. MOst are melee, and NEEED to use those dashes to actually get inrange to hit you lol….if they are saving them from a giant run away burst then its the same as the thief who wants to just run past you and not fight.

I mean if you want me to tell you warriors are OP or ‘too much’ with their current buffs ontop of their normal movement abilities……I can do so. Its gonna be more of a case of me saying: warriors have always had these movement abilities, the only reason its a big deal now is cause of warriors explosively OP defense trait line…which is making them a nightmare to kill in normal fights much less in running fights.

They are really really annoying. You can’t cc them to keep them around. Immob is useless on them. Chill has some potential at least…if resistance isn’t up.

A thief could keep up for a bit but in no real shape to fight at that point. I don’t see any other class keeping up except maybe mes with some f5/mimic/blink hi jinx.

Thing is its kind of fun to play. I’m a terrible warrior and was wrecking things just pushing buttons. 1v2s 1v3s. You feel pretty immortal until you get ganged up on or meet someone that really knows what they’re doing. You can throw marauders + zerk on and be stupid amounts of tanky still.

zerorogue.9410:

Cerby.1069:

…

1. If I have to gear myself to counter one class, then that class is broken. Also not every class has Stability, and most don’t have enough to keep up with the gimmicks.

2.You pretty much said here an anti-condi warrior is immune to conditions.

3.Stuns. Once again few classes have a consistent source of stability.

4.Leaps + stuns + 25% runspeed. You can’t kite warriors.

5.I have never seen any class catch up to these warriors. Yes, Mesmers and druids can keep up for a the initial dash, but with Ancestral grace and bink only giving 1,200u for 18s/30s. The warriors 2,250u every 20s beats them considerably.

and if your wondering. the leap combo is Rush+Whirlwind+Savage Leap.

It could be worse, you could be trying to fight a thief. Haha!

I have the same problem with Thieves and Mesmers. They’re hard to beat solo as well, and if they fear they’re losing they hide in stealth and run away.

Can we please remove all classes from PvP and WvW and replace it with a set of brawling skills which are identical for everyone?

Lacuda.8543:

This post is about how broken the class has become when all others are getting seemingly endless nerfs. There should be no existence of a “rabbit” or “runner” type-spec yet here we see builds popping up allowing players a perceivably limitless amount of escape-and-run opportunities. These builds are highly ignorant of standard MMORPG balance etiquette as they spit in the face of cooldowns and tactics.

Almost every single class has an option for escape though, whether through stealth, speed or a mix. The only ones that don’t are Necros and Guardians- and even then, Guardians can cover some impressive ground.

I’m inclined to agree with the OP in that the combination of stuff like Outrage, Headbutt, Savage Instinct, Last Stand, and Eternal Champion is pretty cheesy. It’s basically near-complete immunity to hard cc without any effort unless the opponent happens to have a bunch of boonstrips handy. If some of these traits and skills were toned down, there would at least be more of a window to cc the warrior before it got away. As for the leaps, they’ve been around since long before the expansion. The only reason they’re viable now is because of powercreep in other areas to make up for the loss in offensive potential.

Cerby.1069:

…

The qualifications for a broken class are not what you can do against it but what it can do in relation to others. Warrior is the only class that is top tier in Damage,Health,Speed. I Have played warrior before, In fact I built this exact build for WvW to see if it was overpowered or if it was skill biased. After pretty much winning any fight I got into there was only one enemy that defeated me, another warrior using the same build.

Sarrs.4831:

Almost every single class has an option for escape though, whether through stealth, speed or a mix. The only ones that don’t are Necros and Guardians- and even then, Guardians can cover some impressive ground.

This is kinda what I’m saying. Necro, Guardians and Warriors are supposed to be high survival but poor escaping. That’s the trade-off hence why Necro’s and Warriors have the highest hp in the game, and guardians can boonspam/heal like crazy.

Warriors are the only one who can both high survival AND High Escape.

You know, on my warrior sometimes 1v1 is so kitten kitten it’s pathetic how easy the battle is, sometimes it’s a 5 min stalemate and sometimes I melt. Additionally I have died dozens of times trying to run and there are a couple classes I can never catch…

zerorogue.9410:

Cerby.1069:

…

1. If I have to gear myself to counter one class, then that class is broken. Also not every class has Stability, and most don’t have enough to keep up with the gimmicks.

No dude, just no

Classes are so dynamic that you are missing the point if you don’t need to set your self up to counter a class, that is why we have 20 different stat combinations, 6 trait trees with 3 options of 3 sets of majors per tree, multiple weapon sets and utilities. You HAVE TO SET UP YOUR CLASS TO COUNTER OTHERS or your setup is already set up to counter themail.

Sometimes I have to run heavy condi clears, sometimes heavy stability and sometimes a combination of then2 but not excelling in either.

And everyone always seems to forget when they talk about warriors being OP, that warriors are literally the worst teammates for a heavy. The class is selfish boon designed and banners are for PvE, compared to rev and guardians that help havoc/guild groups and zergs way better. All a warrior is good at in the group game is cleaving for bags…we bring no support.

This whole post sounds like you are just salty from losing to a warrior. Figure out your weakness and compensate.

Jacion.6302:

You know, on my warrior sometimes 1v1 is so kitten kitten it’s pathetic how easy the battle is, sometimes it’s a 5 min stalemate and sometimes I melt. Additionally I have died dozens of times trying to run and there are a couple classes I can never catch…

zerorogue.9410:

Cerby.1069:

…

1. If I have to gear myself to counter one class, then that class is broken. Also not every class has Stability, and most don’t have enough to keep up with the gimmicks.

No dude, just no

Classes are so dynamic that you are missing the point if you don’t need to set your self up to counter a class, that is why we have 20 different stat combinations, 6 trait trees with 3 options of 3 sets of majors per tree, multiple weapon sets and utilities. You HAVE TO SET UP YOUR CLASS TO COUNTER OTHERS or your setup is already set up to counter themail.

Sometimes I have to run heavy condi clears, sometimes heavy stability and sometimes a combination of then2 but not excelling in either.

And everyone always seems to forget when they talk about warriors being OP, that warriors are literally the worst teammates for a heavy. The class is selfish boon designed and banners are for PvE, compared to rev and guardians that help havoc/guild groups and zergs way better. All a warrior is good at in the group game is cleaving for bags…we bring no support.

This whole post sounds like you are just salty from losing to a warrior. Figure out your weakness and compensate.

we have 20 different stat combinations, 6 trait trees with 3 options of 3 sets of majors per tree for diversity, not counting. Really there’s no way to tell what class the next enemy you fight is, or if their condi/power, or melee/ranged, or Toughness/vitality, etc.. The best you can do is set up your build to counter as much as you can. If you tried to specifically counter one build, you would be incredibly weak against many others.

Also as the title says this is about roaming warriors. This is no team when your by yourself.

zerorogue.9410:

Sarrs.4831:

Almost every single class has an option for escape though, whether through stealth, speed or a mix. The only ones that don’t are Necros and Guardians- and even then, Guardians can cover some impressive ground.

This is kinda what I’m saying. Necro, Guardians and Warriors are supposed to be high survival but poor escaping. That’s the trade-off hence why Necro’s and Warriors have the highest hp in the game, and guardians can boonspam/heal like crazy.

Warriors are the only one who can both high survival AND High Escape.

Unfortunately I think this is the result of the profession being balanced around a different game mode. In pvp some other professions are actually more mobile than warrior due to their ability to take advantage of z-axis teleports, whereas warrior’s leaps mostly just allow it to stick to targets in fights. In wvw roaming most of the action takes place on open terrain without any ledges or capture points to worry about, so the primary factor is the range of mobility skills. That being said, warrior wouldn’t have nearly as much sustain as guardian without its ability to kite using leaps. Necromancer’s “survivability” (more like lack thereof) amply demonstrates that a high health pool isn’t nearly enough in the current meta.

zerorogue.9410:

Jacion.6302:

You know, on my warrior sometimes 1v1 is so kitten kitten it’s pathetic how easy the battle is, sometimes it’s a 5 min stalemate and sometimes I melt. Additionally I have died dozens of times trying to run and there are a couple classes I can never catch…

zerorogue.9410:

Cerby.1069:

…

1. If I have to gear myself to counter one class, then that class is broken. Also not every class has Stability, and most don’t have enough to keep up with the gimmicks.

No dude, just no

Classes are so dynamic that you are missing the point if you don’t need to set your self up to counter a class, that is why we have 20 different stat combinations, 6 trait trees with 3 options of 3 sets of majors per tree, multiple weapon sets and utilities. You HAVE TO SET UP YOUR CLASS TO COUNTER OTHERS or your setup is already set up to counter themail.

Sometimes I have to run heavy condi clears, sometimes heavy stability and sometimes a combination of then2 but not excelling in either.

And everyone always seems to forget when they talk about warriors being OP, that warriors are literally the worst teammates for a heavy. The class is selfish boon designed and banners are for PvE, compared to rev and guardians that help havoc/guild groups and zergs way better. All a warrior is good at in the group game is cleaving for bags…we bring no support.

This whole post sounds like you are just salty from losing to a warrior. Figure out your weakness and compensate.

we have 20 different stat combinations, 6 trait trees with 3 options of 3 sets of majors per tree for diversity, not counting. Really there’s no way to tell what class the next enemy you fight is, or if their condi/power, or melee/ranged, or Toughness/vitality, etc.. The best you can do is set up your build to counter as much as you can. If you tried to specifically counter one build, you would be incredibly weak against many others.

Also as the title says this is about roaming warriors. This is no team when your by yourself.

I know the title, the point was that if a class excels in one mode of wvw they probably aren’t that great in another…Ala warrior roam v. Warrior team game.

Diversity, you act like all the custom stuff is there for the same reason we have armor skins, some kind of weird aesthetic. Builds are to counter what you are facing.

I’d attest that the warrior roam build is similar to other builds and that you countering a design and yes, countering one design would make you weak towards another, that’s called balance.

I always recall when my server was owning the power builds in group game and we got matched up with Magumma and in the first night, we had people melting left and right because we all were setup to counter stuns and no one had more then 1 condi clear loaded becase condi wasn’t an issue. Then Mag came and we all had to edit our builds to counter their condi bomb.

It is true, as you said there is no way to tell what class you will face and their setup in 1v1…and news flash….as I stated…warriors do die in 1v1…

Just…

Apperently…

Not against you

Jacion.6302:

1v1…and news flash….as I stated…warriors do die in 1v1…

Just…

Apperently…

Not against you

Please leave your personal insults out of this discussion. I have chosen to focus on the issue of balance and I hope you would do the same.

Druids are no better, don’t see many qqs about them though

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Druids are no better, don’t see many qqs about them though

True, I have seen may a druid do this same thing in roaming(fight>run away>heal>repeat). The main reason I am not clumping them into this is that Druids have a weakness to either refection or lack of stability/stun-breakers. Two things the warrior does not have.

Additionally the main issue is the problem of fleeing enemies. While fleeing is not peculiarly bad, being able to do this loop (fight>run away>heal>repeat) consistently with high dps and survival, is the big issue.

I find thieves far more disgusting because of their limitless mobility combined with damage and stealth

gebrechen.5643:

I find thieves far more disgusting because of their limitless mobility combined with damage and stealth

I know what your talking about, thieves are very annoying, but they also are very fragile. Anyone who is AoE heavy has a significant advantage against them.

zerorogue.9410:

gebrechen.5643:

I find thieves far more disgusting because of their limitless mobility combined with damage and stealth

I know what your talking about, thieves are very annoying, but they also are very fragile. Anyone who is AoE heavy has a significant advantage against them.

Kay…well couldn’t some1 duplicate ur logic and start a thread bashing thiefs and thier mobility cause they don’t have heavy aoe for their class or the ability to catch a running thief? I mean that was one of ur points: not having access to stability and not wanting to significantly change ur playstyle to address warriors.

And it was already mentioned, but can’t another duplicate ur logic and start a thread bashing druids and their mobility cause they can simply double leap and ooc when things get bad? I mean they shouldn’t have to build nike toons just to prevent the druids from getting ooc, now should they?

and can’t another duplicate ur logic for chrono and their portals and condi/stealth/tele and boonstrip…..for engineer and their stealth and gyro bots….

Complaint threads aren’t really gonna get you anywhere. Focus on what you can do to address the threat, warriors, and you WILL get somewhere. Seriously, I think you will be able to address a good chunk of the issues you seem to be having with warriors after becoming more educated about them. Then it becomes a case of sitting down and coming to terms/counters with what OP thing they have…..and what OP things you have.

Reallly surprised this thread devolved from an education type thing to a spat…..or maybe I just misinterpreted the OP from the start and you weren’t seeking so much help as a place to vent?

zerorogue.9410:

Warrior is the only class that is top tier in Damage,Health,Speed.
….
Warriors are the only one who can both high survival AND High Escape.

Post that on the reddit. You’ll get schooled. It will be educational.

zerorogue.9410:

gebrechen.5643:

I find thieves far more disgusting because of their limitless mobility combined with damage and stealth

I know what your talking about, thieves are very annoying, but they also are very fragile. Anyone who is AoE heavy has a significant advantage against them.

Fragile is a big word for a thief. If you don’t kitten up at least three to four times in a row or fight more than two people you are not fragile as a thief.
Thief is by far better for roaming than a warrior. Warrior tanks more with the right set of runes but thief is by far more annoying.
And it doesn’t matter if you run condi thief or power because both are pretty strong with tons of evade/avoid, condi cleanse and escape options or possibilities to reset a fight.

I prefer running after warriors and fighting them. Why? Because they don’t stealth every few seconds to reset and force me into a permanent defensive playstyle.

Big difference between thief and war is that the thief is the worst class at any N vs N fights (it is better then some for certain N vs M, but never for equal numbers).

If some lose in a duel to a thief (while playing any other class on a roaming build), then said thief is simply miles better skill-wise. The same is not true for a war though.

Torqiseknite.1380:

I’m inclined to agree with the OP in that the combination of stuff like Outrage, Headbutt, Savage Instinct, Last Stand, and Eternal Champion is pretty cheesy. It’s basically near-complete immunity to hard cc without any effort unless the opponent happens to have a bunch of boonstrips handy. If some of these traits and skills were toned down, there would at least be more of a window to cc the warrior before it got away. As for the leaps, they’ve been around since long before the expansion. The only reason they’re viable now is because of powercreep in other areas to make up for the loss in offensive potential.

So running with stabi is considered cheesy now.Dont mind the ton of aoe cc in this game though.

Besides OP “I have seen the warrior win 3:1”…Means the warri knows how to play and those 3 others got outplayed.Got chased by a zerg and he ran into a tower where the zoneblob was pressing 11111 and the warri was actually making good use of his skills to escape ? So they had no thief in their zoneblob able to shadowstep and port towards him ? Thief mobility > warri mobility.

Bring some mobility yourself if you get tired of it.I mean i can kitten about it being dark,but i can also turn on a light.

Yeah, PvP is nothing but warriors rolling face over all the other classes who are unable to turn the tide of… wait, warrior is still barely seen because its a one trick pony that a competent player can counter?

WvW is for team fights, not duels and as such your specific complaints are pointless.

you mean you cant gank kill a single warrior in a 1vs3?

Please rename title to broken “run away”-warriors, “cowardly runaway”-thieves/mesmers, "annoying bunker- guardians and “shroud-survivalist”-necromancers

Amaimon.7823:

Please rename title to broken “run away”-warriors, “cowardly runaway”-thieves/mesmers, "annoying bunker- guardians and “shroud-survivalist”-necromancers

You forgot bunker run away druids

zerorogue.9410:

Jacion.6302:

1v1…and news flash….as I stated…warriors do die in 1v1…

Just…

Apperently…

Not against you

Please leave your personal insults out of this discussion. I have chosen to focus on the issue of balance and I hope you would do the same.

You’re really not though…. You are just asking for nerfs.

Go play the build yourself and learn its weaknesses, that’s the best way to learn how to fight something.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Druids are no better, don’t see many qqs about them though

I’m pretty sure I saw several threads complaining about “10k dmg auto attacks” immortal druids somewhere in this forum not long ago.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Druids are no better, don’t see many qqs about them though

……You’re joking right? There have been multiple threads that have pages of baddies qq’ing about druids in the PvP and WvW forum. And each thread was just like this one, a player that hasn’t bothered to learn the class and is unwilling to adapt their own build comes to the forum to complain instead of learning how to fight it.
So what’s anet’s response? They make stupid nerfs to the profession that do very little to affect the so called “op” build but destroy several others.

Riko.9214:

Big difference between thief and war is that the thief is the worst class at any N vs N fights (it is better then some for certain N vs M, but never for equal numbers).

If some lose in a duel to a thief (while playing any other class on a roaming build), then said thief is simply miles better skill-wise. The same is not true for a war though.

Yep, that’s the mindset of a typical thief player.

Or as a quote from someone translated from German:

It is only superiority of thief players that makes the class playable.

The ability to disengage and “reset” a fight is integral to the game. It is a premise around which entire classes are built. Not all classes can stick in battle and survive so one of their options is disengage.

That ability to disengage and reenter combat on terms that put a given player an advantage is part of what makes combat in GW2 so fluid and dynamic just as those active dodges in combat are. They are a far better form of modeling combat and creating an interactive game then are all of those passives thrown into the game or just dropping AOES blindly in a given area.

If in a battle where the enemy runs away, I feel I have accomplished way more then when in a battle and am vaporized in two seconds to 9500 concentric, cast at distance AOE rings , but I learn to deal with the latter. Such is WvW.

While I concur that there may be too much of a good thing in a given profession in the way of all of the options available to them , the generic complaints over an enemies ability to run away and reset a fight are overblown and unwarranted.

So my thief is trying to hold a tower and on the gates collapse flees and escapes with 20 enemy in pursuit. So what? Where is the problem?

Berserker, Defense, Discipline when built right is hilariously easy to play. But they’re still susceptible to similar thins that base Warrior is. Kite hard, deny headbutt like you would bursts, use vertical movement, and save some sort of stun break for when stuff gets nasty

As a rifle engi, (toolkit, nades, rocket boots) I find fighting warriors really frustrating.

Before HoT powercreep, I used to have no problem getting in close with a warrior and trading hits. Now, I have to kite like my life depends on it and pray they never get within 300 range or so.

• If they get close to me and manage to get a taunt combo off, I lose. That instantly takes me from full health to below 25%. They’re faster than me and have stability, so I can’t cc them or escape.
• If they land any one of their stuns, I lose. Rocket boots isn’t a stun-break.
• If I land any of my cc’s, they just break stun and continue fighting.
• They have stability and resistance for a good portion of the fight, so I can’t use my cc’s. Overcharged Shot, Net shot, Magnet
• They have more sustain – They regen health faster than I can deal damage, considering I have to spend a lot of time kiting and maintaining distance.

If at any time I make one mistake (fail to dodge a stun, be too close and get hit by the unblockable undodgeable taunt, use Overcharged Shot when war has stab, Net shot when they have resistance) I lose the fight right there.

If I do everything right and kite perfectly for 2 minutes while still dealing more damage than their regen, .. they just run away until their stances recharge again, and I can’t catch them because they’re faster than me.

Mesmer,Druid,Revenant,thief, Druid.

Honestly more then half of the classes got the mobility to disenage or chase a motherkittener at will. Heck try running away from a revenant with stealth on cooldown thief. It’s possible but challenging.

I see no reason whatsoever to single out a warrior as if they are speedphantoms. While u have thiefs(albeit decent ones) capable of outrunning entire kittening zergs.

coro.3176:

As a rifle engi, (toolkit, nades, rocket boots) I find fighting warriors really frustrating.

Before HoT powercreep, I used to have no problem getting in close with a warrior and trading hits. Now, I have to kite like my life depends on it and pray they never get within 300 range or so.

• If they get close to me and manage to get a taunt combo off, I lose. That instantly takes me from full health to below 25%. They’re faster than me and have stability, so I can’t cc them or escape.
• If they land any one of their stuns, I lose. Rocket boots isn’t a stun-break.
• If I land any of my cc’s, they just break stun and continue fighting.
• They have stability and resistance for a good portion of the fight, so I can’t use my cc’s. Overcharged Shot, Net shot, Magnet
• They have more sustain – They regen health faster than I can deal damage, considering I have to spend a lot of time kiting and maintaining distance.

If at any time I make one mistake (fail to dodge a stun, be too close and get hit by the unblockable undodgeable taunt, use Overcharged Shot when war has stab, Net shot when they have resistance) I lose the fight right there.

If I do everything right and kite perfectly for 2 minutes while still dealing more damage than their regen, .. they just run away until their stances recharge again, and I can’t catch them because they’re faster than me.

If you choose to run without stun break you kind of forfeit the right to complain about dying to cc…..

babazhook.6805:

The ability to disengage and “reset” a fight is integral to the game. It is a premise around which entire classes are built. Not all classes can stick in battle and survive so one of their options is disengage.

That ability to disengage and reenter combat on terms that put a given player an advantage is part of what makes combat in GW2 so fluid and dynamic just as those active dodges in combat are. They are a far better form of modeling combat and creating an interactive game then are all of those passives thrown into the game or just dropping AOES blindly in a given area.

If in a battle where the enemy runs away, I feel I have accomplished way more then when in a battle and am vaporized in two seconds to 9500 concentric, cast at distance AOE rings , but I learn to deal with the latter. Such is WvW.

While I concur that there may be too much of a good thing in a given profession in the way of all of the options available to them , the generic complaints over an enemies ability to run away and reset a fight are overblown and unwarranted.

So my thief is trying to hold a tower and on the gates collapse flees and escapes with 20 enemy in pursuit. So what? Where is the problem?

That wasn’t a problem before HoT though. I could run without a stunbreak because I could dodge the cc or otherwise avoid it through skilled play.
That’s not possible any more no matter what I do. The taunt is unblockable, undodgeable, instant. If I’m ever in melee range and the warrior activates berserk mode, I lose. From there, they can chain stuns until I’m dead. There’s no counterplay to it aside from staying at range the entire fight (IMO, makes for boring duels and Rifle engi was designed to get in melee range for Jump Shot and Blunderbuss).

I see a big problem with warrior having one heall that everyone runs. If they nerf signet maybe the other nice heall on hit will be used more and they wont be so tanky ungeared for such.

Warrior roamer has been like this long before the expansion. They put on their nike and you will never be able to keep up.

After expansion, more classes can do this now. Thief with dash can disappear in a blink of eye. My own roaming ranger equip GS/Staff and can run super fast as well.

The only thing that gets me is the CC output and CC immunity. This is mostly a Berserker/HoT thing, though.

I can deal with any core warrior with a reasonable/understandable amount of success when on my reaper. Berserker simply just prevents any attempts to kite or stick I try and make. Extra stability and stunbreaks for no reason, extra ridiculously-low-cooldown CC for no reason, and extra skill damage for no reason, either.

And when I burn things to get a clutch disengage with Death’s Charge, it doesn’t matter because Arc Divider has a 450 radius hitbox (Like what the actual hell? That’s most pre-HoT mobility skills’ ranges!).

I think the most infuriating part of it all is that I can’t play it. I’ve been told, repeatedly, that I’m thinking too much when playing it. I can play with fair success an all-in glass core thief that doesn’t reset or stealth that is totally and wildly underpowered, but can’t play a Berserker with double the health, 50% more armor, damage immunities, and better AoE/CC/mobility/cleave with the same damage (facepalm).

nicknamenick.2437:

Mikhael.2391:

I see a big problem with warrior having one heall that everyone runs. If they nerf signet maybe the other nice heall on hit will be used more and they wont be so tanky ungeared for such.

So:

DH issnt tanky?
Engie issnt tanky?
Druid issnt tanky?

Lol dude every spec in this game is OP at some point vs some build in some game mode

Ur a great defender of these builds. if it were up to me i would nerf every single one of these classes build ito forcing people to use other healls traits utilities. ITs boring as it.

coro.3176:

That wasn’t a problem before HoT though. I could run without a stunbreak because I could dodge the cc or otherwise avoid it through skilled play.
That’s not possible any more no matter what I do. The taunt is unblockable, undodgeable, instant. If I’m ever in melee range and the warrior activates berserk mode, I lose. From there, they can chain stuns until I’m dead. There’s no counterplay to it aside from staying at range the entire fight (IMO, makes for boring duels and Rifle engi was designed to get in melee range for Jump Shot and Blunderbuss).

Last time i checked warrior’s taunt was completely dodgeable. Its not an on hit taunt like many classes (i hit a rev and the game instantly applies taunt to me)….its simply an aoe that resonates from the warrior….so if you can’t get hit by it it won’t apply to you.

I apologize if I’m mistaken, but pretty sure a roll dodge or other evade ability negates them. Also resistance, stun break, or condi clear will cancel/negate the taunt completely, something to consider.

I mean I totally rely on taunt to secure kills against thiefs that would otherwise be the end of me. I think thats fair though, the good thiefs always expect it and have something to break the taunt…..or they just avoid being in melee range when you have the ability to use it…..or they perma stealth when i can use it so i typically can’t burst that which i can’t target.

warrior’s run away build while annoying is ok because they have to build for it

now thief on the other hand are definetly broken, not only can stealth indefinetly but can also teleport/shadowstep without cooldowns as well as gaining superspeed while stealthed

Rezzet.3614:

warrior’s run away build while annoying is ok because they have to build for it

now thief on the other hand are definetly broken, not only can stealth indefinetly but can also teleport/shadowstep without cooldowns as well as gaining superspeed while stealthed

Have to build for those as well, Superspeed is only from a rune, if they are spamming SB5 they have no Initiative to attack, if they are spamming shadowsteps they aren’t stealthing, if they are stealthing indefinitely they arent doing any real damage and not shadowstepping. Hard counters exist to stealth 6 out of 9 classes have them.

My main gripe with the class is that Resistance effects mobility conditions along with Warrior’s Sprint is too much. No class should have a high amount of stun breaks and be immune to immobilize without serious trade offs. Thanks to one minor trait and probably the best heal in the game as well as numerous stun breaks, the class is nearly impossible to pin down.

This is not an issue if they have to build for it but most of the time that level of defensive sustain is a byproduct of their offense.

babazhook.6805:

The ability to disengage and “reset” a fight is integral to the game. It is a premise around which entire classes are built. Not all classes can stick in battle and survive so one of their options is disengage.

Except the game was designed around PvP where there is a certain level of balance to being able to disengage/reset a fight, because it comes with the cost that you lose control of a capture point, the score continues to tick away and you’ve just used your time ineffectively in terms of winning the match.

When roaming in WvW however that balance/cost is not there, if I am losing a fight and on a class/build that can easily disengage, not only is there no cost to it, but I can basically get away with screwing up (bar doing so catastrophically) in a way classes/builds that cannot disengage so well are punished with.

Which is of course is why the entire game mes & thief have been so common when roaming, and why currently you also see a lot of druids & warriors, they break the rather fundamental principle of risk vs reward.

But that is what happens when the devs basically ignore a game mode in terms of balance…

Cerby.1069:

coro.3176:

That wasn’t a problem before HoT though. I could run without a stunbreak because I could dodge the cc or otherwise avoid it through skilled play.
That’s not possible any more no matter what I do. The taunt is unblockable, undodgeable, instant. If I’m ever in melee range and the warrior activates berserk mode, I lose. From there, they can chain stuns until I’m dead. There’s no counterplay to it aside from staying at range the entire fight (IMO, makes for boring duels and Rifle engi was designed to get in melee range for Jump Shot and Blunderbuss).

Last time i checked warrior’s taunt was completely dodgeable. Its not an on hit taunt like many classes (i hit a rev and the game instantly applies taunt to me)….its simply an aoe that resonates from the warrior….so if you can’t get hit by it it won’t apply to you.

I apologize if I’m mistaken, but pretty sure a roll dodge or other evade ability negates them. Also resistance, stun break, or condi clear will cancel/negate the taunt completely, something to consider.

I mean I totally rely on taunt to secure kills against thiefs that would otherwise be the end of me. I think thats fair though, the good thiefs always expect it and have something to break the taunt…..or they just avoid being in melee range when you have the ability to use it…..or they perma stealth when i can use it so i typically can’t burst that which i can’t target.

Maybe it is? I can’t remember ever dodging it successfully. In any case, I would have to dodge before the taunt, in anticipation of activating zerk mode. That’s not skilled play. It’s just spamming dodges. I’m pretty sure it can’t be blocked either, since it interrupts my gear shield.

• Condi cleanse doesn’t work because it’s a controlling cc – can’t activate skills.
• My build doesn’t have resistance, and it’s difficult to get on Engi. Same with stability

I personally don’t run a stun break because I like Rocket Boots over Elixir Gun, but IMO Rocket Boots should be a stun break. Rocket Boots helps chase down a Nike Warrior or Thief as they try and escape. Egun Doesn’t.

So that means when fighting a Warrior, I need to keep out of melee range, but that’s easier said than done when they have more mobility skills and can’t be cc’d themselves thanks to high stability and resistance uptime.

Ultimately, the fight just seems unbalanced in the Warrior’s favour. If I do everything right, it’s a stalemate at best. If I make one mistake, I lose. The Warrior can make mistakes all day and not break a sweat thanks to auto-proc stances, better sustain, invuln, stability, resistance, and the ability to run away at any time.

nicknamenick.2437:

Exciton.8942:

Warrior roamer has been like this long before the expansion. They put on their nike and you will never be able to keep up.

-Rev can
-thief can
-Druid can
-DH can
-Mesmer can
-Ele can
-Engi can

Necor can’t

You just have to build for it.. so does the warrior! because not every warrior build is shield/gs you know

Learn to read.