Guild Wars 2

Yeah, where YB is right now, is where JQ and BG were…. three years ago. Therein lies the problem. We’re way past that stage, and won’t be able to recruit to match that level of coverage unless anet intervenes with population balance. So, of course things are chill and easy on YB. I mean, what’s your competition? Doors for 3 timezones? Who wouldn’t be relaxed dealing with that. You’ve literally got 0 challenge for first place.

zhonnika.1784:

Yeah, where YB is right now, is where JQ and BG were…. three years ago. Therein lies the problem. We’re way past that stage, and won’t be able to recruit to match that level of coverage unless anet intervenes with population balance. So, of course things are chill and easy on YB. I mean, what’s your competition? Doors for 3 timezones? Who wouldn’t be relaxed dealing with that. You’ve literally got 0 challenge for first place.

Pretty much why I left YB. I didn’t mind the server and community, was very nice actually and still is one of the best IMO. But there was little to do as a roamer/havoc player, the entire EB map including bls most of the time would be YB all across and I found myself completely bored wanting to roam or even taking a camp was rare.

I’d rather be on the underdog team BG with the potential to fight the megapowers YB and JQ. I find that BG is much more willing to fight as well.

mulzi.8273:

Siska.8102:

YB is a boring opponent. Basically you have to drain their map of supplies, kill all their siege, get past all Anet’s cheese mechanics THEN you might get a fight. They’re like the guy in the drinking game bragging that he’s still sober at the end of the night. I’m all for sobriety but buddy pretty much missed the point or joined the wrong game. That’s YB, they’re in wvw to pve.

^this. In my experience, JQ and BL go after each other due to some pretty good fights. While these two are battling it out, YB is back capping, ‘stealth sieging’, PvD, etc.

Pointless to fight YB in this environment. When a BG zerg meets a JQ zerg, there is might stacking, pushing, healing, falling back, strategy, players actually hitting each other with class skills, etc. A fight with YB? YB sees another zerg they immediately drop 10+ siege on a choke point and siege hump, hoping to god the other team charges them. Only idiotic teams will ‘charge’ YB like that, zergs looking for fights will go elsewhere and leave YB to their PvD activities.

I can’t count how many times BQ has teamed up to take down YB. When 2 servers will not fight each other and gang up on the underdog what do you expect that underdog to do? YB came up with tactics to win against getting tag teamed. The only reason JQ and BG are fighting each other now is because neither of them want to be in third.

zhonnika.1784:

Yeah, where YB is right now, is where JQ and BG were…. three years ago. Therein lies the problem. We’re way past that stage, and won’t be able to recruit to match that level of coverage unless anet intervenes with population balance. So, of course things are chill and easy on YB. I mean, what’s your competition? Doors for 3 timezones? Who wouldn’t be relaxed dealing with that. You’ve literally got 0 challenge for first place.

To me NA Prime BG and JQ are both sort of stuck in an old school blob mentality in a game that really doesn’t do blob fights well. A fundamental problem with WvW is that on one hand it promotes blobbing via commander tags and PvD but on the other it generates too much lag and less interesting red circle fights.

As for YB being relaxed, I am not referring to when things are going great. I have been on a lot of servers and this is probably one of the most cordial servers to play on while it is being pressured. During NA Prime weekends both JQ and BG often have a much larger organized zerg rolling over anything they can… even then, the map chat and TS on YB are typically calm and low drama.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

I can’t count how many times BQ [BG] has teamed up to take down YB.

YB does this too such as last night when they allowed BG to flip a T3 JQ SM by cutting off JQ reinforcements. This tends to happen when a server gets too far out of line with the norm or holds a key objective that is annoying the other servers. YB is more often the recipient but that is how it should be.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

mulzi.8273:

Siska.8102:

YB is a boring opponent. Basically you have to drain their map of supplies, kill all their siege, get past all Anet’s cheese mechanics THEN you might get a fight. They’re like the guy in the drinking game bragging that he’s still sober at the end of the night. I’m all for sobriety but buddy pretty much missed the point or joined the wrong game. That’s YB, they’re in wvw to pve.

^this. In my experience, JQ and BL go after each other due to some pretty good fights. While these two are battling it out, YB is back capping, ‘stealth sieging’, PvD, etc.

Pointless to fight YB in this environment. When a BG zerg meets a JQ zerg, there is might stacking, pushing, healing, falling back, strategy, players actually hitting each other with class skills, etc. A fight with YB? YB sees another zerg they immediately drop 10+ siege on a choke point and siege hump, hoping to god the other team charges them. Only idiotic teams will ‘charge’ YB like that, zergs looking for fights will go elsewhere and leave YB to their PvD activities.

I can’t count how many times BQ has teamed up to take down YB. When 2 servers will not fight each other and gang up on the underdog what do you expect that underdog to do? YB came up with tactics to win against getting tag teamed. The only reason JQ and BG are fighting each other now is because neither of them want to be in third.

Can’t have a complete WvW thread without a 2v1 accusation.

Map chat can be funny. Someone whines Why did JQ have to AJ that? 15 mins later….. Someone whines Why did BG have to AJ that? HELLO PEOPLE WE DID THE SAME THING 5 minutes ago……

Straegen.2938:

zhonnika.1784:

Yeah, where YB is right now, is where JQ and BG were…. three years ago. Therein lies the problem. We’re way past that stage, and won’t be able to recruit to match that level of coverage unless anet intervenes with population balance. So, of course things are chill and easy on YB. I mean, what’s your competition? Doors for 3 timezones? Who wouldn’t be relaxed dealing with that. You’ve literally got 0 challenge for first place.

To me NA Prime BG and JQ are both sort of stuck in an old school blob mentality in a game that really doesn’t do blob fights well. A fundamental problem with WvW is that on one hand it promotes blobbing via commander tags and PvD but on the other it generates too much lag and less interesting red circle fights.

As for YB being relaxed, I am not referring to when things are going great. I have been on a lot of servers and this is probably one of the most cordial servers to play on while it is being pressured. During NA Prime weekends both JQ and BG often have a much larger organized zerg rolling over anything they can… even then, the map chat and TS on YB are typically calm and low drama.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

I can’t count how many times BQ [BG] has teamed up to take down YB.

YB does this too such as last night when they allowed BG to flip a T3 JQ SM by cutting off JQ reinforcements. This tends to happen when a server gets too far out of line with the norm or holds a key objective that is annoying the other servers. YB is more often the recipient but that is how it should be.

Oh yes, that was definitely a 2v1 team-up right there /s

Although I would have preferred it to be JQ over BG, because all BG did after capping keep was to use it as an escape and fire ACs.
“YB” seige hump is real

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

mulzi.8273:

Siska.8102:

YB is a boring opponent. Basically you have to drain their map of supplies, kill all their siege, get past all Anet’s cheese mechanics THEN you might get a fight. They’re like the guy in the drinking game bragging that he’s still sober at the end of the night. I’m all for sobriety but buddy pretty much missed the point or joined the wrong game. That’s YB, they’re in wvw to pve.

^this. In my experience, JQ and BL go after each other due to some pretty good fights. While these two are battling it out, YB is back capping, ‘stealth sieging’, PvD, etc.

Pointless to fight YB in this environment. When a BG zerg meets a JQ zerg, there is might stacking, pushing, healing, falling back, strategy, players actually hitting each other with class skills, etc. A fight with YB? YB sees another zerg they immediately drop 10+ siege on a choke point and siege hump, hoping to god the other team charges them. Only idiotic teams will ‘charge’ YB like that, zergs looking for fights will go elsewhere and leave YB to their PvD activities.

I can’t count how many times BQ has teamed up to take down YB. When 2 servers will not fight each other and gang up on the underdog what do you expect that underdog to do? YB came up with tactics to win against getting tag teamed. The only reason JQ and BG are fighting each other now is because neither of them want to be in third.

I’m pretty sure underdog’s are supposed to be small and not the obvious pick for the winner consistently. Not the “oh well that guy’s going to obviously win, just look at him” choice.

Sorry bro. Yb isn’t the underdog.

Substance E.4852:

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

mulzi.8273:

Siska.8102:

YB is a boring opponent. Basically you have to drain their map of supplies, kill all their siege, get past all Anet’s cheese mechanics THEN you might get a fight. They’re like the guy in the drinking game bragging that he’s still sober at the end of the night. I’m all for sobriety but buddy pretty much missed the point or joined the wrong game. That’s YB, they’re in wvw to pve.

^this. In my experience, JQ and BL go after each other due to some pretty good fights. While these two are battling it out, YB is back capping, ‘stealth sieging’, PvD, etc.

Pointless to fight YB in this environment. When a BG zerg meets a JQ zerg, there is might stacking, pushing, healing, falling back, strategy, players actually hitting each other with class skills, etc. A fight with YB? YB sees another zerg they immediately drop 10+ siege on a choke point and siege hump, hoping to god the other team charges them. Only idiotic teams will ‘charge’ YB like that, zergs looking for fights will go elsewhere and leave YB to their PvD activities.

I can’t count how many times BQ has teamed up to take down YB. When 2 servers will not fight each other and gang up on the underdog what do you expect that underdog to do? YB came up with tactics to win against getting tag teamed. The only reason JQ and BG are fighting each other now is because neither of them want to be in third.

I’m pretty sure underdog’s are supposed to be small and not the obvious pick for the winner consistently. Not the “oh well that guy’s going to obviously win, just look at him” choice.

Sorry bro. Yb isn’t the underdog.

That is true. YB is so dominant at this point that BG and JQ don’t even try to win. Guilds that want to experience winning drop to tier 2. Even when they have a push week they don’t expect to win … they just want to tweak the glicko and use the week as a diagnostic test to gauge relative activity level.

Cant BG/JQ just buy more guilds? What did you people do with the warchest?

TorquedSoul.8097:

Substance E.4852:

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

mulzi.8273:

Siska.8102:

YB is a boring opponent. Basically you have to drain their map of supplies, kill all their siege, get past all Anet’s cheese mechanics THEN you might get a fight. They’re like the guy in the drinking game bragging that he’s still sober at the end of the night. I’m all for sobriety but buddy pretty much missed the point or joined the wrong game. That’s YB, they’re in wvw to pve.

^this. In my experience, JQ and BL go after each other due to some pretty good fights. While these two are battling it out, YB is back capping, ‘stealth sieging’, PvD, etc.

Pointless to fight YB in this environment. When a BG zerg meets a JQ zerg, there is might stacking, pushing, healing, falling back, strategy, players actually hitting each other with class skills, etc. A fight with YB? YB sees another zerg they immediately drop 10+ siege on a choke point and siege hump, hoping to god the other team charges them. Only idiotic teams will ‘charge’ YB like that, zergs looking for fights will go elsewhere and leave YB to their PvD activities.

I can’t count how many times BQ has teamed up to take down YB. When 2 servers will not fight each other and gang up on the underdog what do you expect that underdog to do? YB came up with tactics to win against getting tag teamed. The only reason JQ and BG are fighting each other now is because neither of them want to be in third.

I’m pretty sure underdog’s are supposed to be small and not the obvious pick for the winner consistently. Not the “oh well that guy’s going to obviously win, just look at him” choice.

Sorry bro. Yb isn’t the underdog.

That is true. YB is so dominant at this point that BG and JQ don’t even try to win. Guilds that want to experience winning drop to tier 2. Even when they have a push week they don’t expect to win … they just want to tweak the glicko and use the week as a diagnostic test to gauge relative activity level.

Seriously, I’d strongly suggest that if a player had left a WvW-focused Blackgate guild that had a minimum participation level of a mere 2 nights a week for 2-3 hours each night, because it was too much to do, the ‘player’ should at least publish a disclosure that what is offered as knowledge about the inner workings of Blackgate or any other server has been obtained largely, if not exclusively, through the use of spreadsheets, and has little if any basis in actual experience with that server, the players on that server, or WvW for that matter.

Players who won’t play WvW for even a mere 2% of the total hours available each week, yet hold themselves out as somehow knowledgeable about all of what WvW is or should be, and of the server they don’t play on, make me think of snake oil salesmen of old: wanted everyone to believe that what they said was the truth about the curing power of the medicine, but didn’t use it themselves.

Alternatively, if anyone wants to know about any WvW server, suggest they roll an account on it and actually play WvW there, get to know other players, understand their perspective on the opposing servers, learn how they coordinate or don’t, what the ‘personality’ of that server is, and then form your own judgement.

And if you happen to roll onto Blackgate, check out the Blackgate server forums to learn about all the awesome guilds we are so famous for: gw2blackgate.com. Our recruitment thread has posts from almost all the active guilds on Blackgate, and I’m sure you’ll find one that you can enjoy being a part of.

If your guild is looking for a new home, I encourage you to consider Blackgate. We are known as a strong, coordinated and cooperative community that supports guild groups with a variety of playstyles and focus, offering both resources, knowledge and experience working and fighting together through both the fun and the tough times.

When you get here, look me up. Will be happy to welcome you to Blackgate or help if I can!

Pensadora.9478:

TorquedSoul.8097:

Substance E.4852:

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

mulzi.8273:

Siska.8102:

YB is a boring opponent. Basically you have to drain their map of supplies, kill all their siege, get past all Anet’s cheese mechanics THEN you might get a fight. They’re like the guy in the drinking game bragging that he’s still sober at the end of the night. I’m all for sobriety but buddy pretty much missed the point or joined the wrong game. That’s YB, they’re in wvw to pve.

^this. In my experience, JQ and BL go after each other due to some pretty good fights. While these two are battling it out, YB is back capping, ‘stealth sieging’, PvD, etc.

Pointless to fight YB in this environment. When a BG zerg meets a JQ zerg, there is might stacking, pushing, healing, falling back, strategy, players actually hitting each other with class skills, etc. A fight with YB? YB sees another zerg they immediately drop 10+ siege on a choke point and siege hump, hoping to god the other team charges them. Only idiotic teams will ‘charge’ YB like that, zergs looking for fights will go elsewhere and leave YB to their PvD activities.

I can’t count how many times BQ has teamed up to take down YB. When 2 servers will not fight each other and gang up on the underdog what do you expect that underdog to do? YB came up with tactics to win against getting tag teamed. The only reason JQ and BG are fighting each other now is because neither of them want to be in third.

I’m pretty sure underdog’s are supposed to be small and not the obvious pick for the winner consistently. Not the “oh well that guy’s going to obviously win, just look at him” choice.

Sorry bro. Yb isn’t the underdog.

That is true. YB is so dominant at this point that BG and JQ don’t even try to win. Guilds that want to experience winning drop to tier 2. Even when they have a push week they don’t expect to win … they just want to tweak the glicko and use the week as a diagnostic test to gauge relative activity level.

Seriously, I’d strongly suggest that if a player had left a WvW-focused Blackgate guild that had a minimum participation level of a mere 2 nights a week for 2-3 hours each night, because it was too much to do, the ‘player’ should at least publish a disclosure that what is offered as knowledge about the inner workings of Blackgate or any other server has been obtained largely, if not exclusively, through the use of spreadsheets, and has little if any basis in actual experience with that server, the players on that server, or WvW for that matter.

Players who won’t play WvW for even a mere 2% of the total hours available each week, yet hold themselves out as somehow knowledgeable about all of what WvW is or should be, and of the server they don’t play on, make me think of snake oil salesmen of old: wanted everyone to believe that what they said was the truth about the curing power of the medicine, but didn’t use it themselves.

It seems you are addressing me directly with that comment … particularly the spreadsheet comment so I will offer a brief defense. But in the future if you want to address me personally, please PM me here or whisper me in game. I don’t think this is the forum these types of discussion.

The reason my play time was low on Blackgate was because I wasn’t having a good time. This was simply a matter of my compatibility with the existing culture on Blackgate.

Your suggestion that I didn’t spend ample time getting to know the community is false. I spent a considerable amount of time on the Blackgate forums trying to understand what the community goals were. When they finally told me that they (as a community) had abandon PPT style play, I apologized for pushing everyone to play PPT and then left for another server. I think I handled it properly.

As for the snake oil salesman comment, using data to reach conclusions is pretty common these days. Science, economics, and even games are modeled systems where our understanding is shaped by data. I don’t think I have to apologize for collecting and analyzing data. Anet provided the API so people could analyze it.

Changes are coming. We will soon know if BG has been making the right decisions to be successful in the long run. I imagine if Anet chooses to considerably boost PPK with an adjustment for KDR, removes siege, and then brackets the WvW playtimes to times to a couple hours around NA Prime, BG will be well positioned to be competitive again.

If you are looking for fights, there’s this button at the character select screen labelled “World Transfer”. It can immediately bring you to a true underdog server. If you enjoy being on a dominant server where fights may be fewer, just stay there. You, and you alone, have the power to choose.

Hey YB was an underdog ! Circa 2013……. Whenever season 1 and 2 was….. And maybe week 1 and 2 in T2…… And maybe when FA got super fat… Not so much sense then…..

TorquedSoul.8097:

Pensadora.9478:

TorquedSoul.8097:

Substance E.4852:

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

mulzi.8273:

Siska.8102:

YB is a boring opponent. Basically you have to drain their map of supplies, kill all their siege, get past all Anet’s cheese mechanics THEN you might get a fight. They’re like the guy in the drinking game bragging that he’s still sober at the end of the night. I’m all for sobriety but buddy pretty much missed the point or joined the wrong game. That’s YB, they’re in wvw to pve.

^this. In my experience, JQ and BL go after each other due to some pretty good fights. While these two are battling it out, YB is back capping, ‘stealth sieging’, PvD, etc.

Pointless to fight YB in this environment. When a BG zerg meets a JQ zerg, there is might stacking, pushing, healing, falling back, strategy, players actually hitting each other with class skills, etc. A fight with YB? YB sees another zerg they immediately drop 10+ siege on a choke point and siege hump, hoping to god the other team charges them. Only idiotic teams will ‘charge’ YB like that, zergs looking for fights will go elsewhere and leave YB to their PvD activities.

I can’t count how many times BQ has teamed up to take down YB. When 2 servers will not fight each other and gang up on the underdog what do you expect that underdog to do? YB came up with tactics to win against getting tag teamed. The only reason JQ and BG are fighting each other now is because neither of them want to be in third.

I’m pretty sure underdog’s are supposed to be small and not the obvious pick for the winner consistently. Not the “oh well that guy’s going to obviously win, just look at him” choice.

Sorry bro. Yb isn’t the underdog.

That is true. YB is so dominant at this point that BG and JQ don’t even try to win. Guilds that want to experience winning drop to tier 2. Even when they have a push week they don’t expect to win … they just want to tweak the glicko and use the week as a diagnostic test to gauge relative activity level.

Seriously, I’d strongly suggest that if a player had left a WvW-focused Blackgate guild that had a minimum participation level of a mere 2 nights a week for 2-3 hours each night, because it was too much to do, the ‘player’ should at least publish a disclosure that what is offered as knowledge about the inner workings of Blackgate or any other server has been obtained largely, if not exclusively, through the use of spreadsheets, and has little if any basis in actual experience with that server, the players on that server, or WvW for that matter.

Players who won’t play WvW for even a mere 2% of the total hours available each week, yet hold themselves out as somehow knowledgeable about all of what WvW is or should be, and of the server they don’t play on, make me think of snake oil salesmen of old: wanted everyone to believe that what they said was the truth about the curing power of the medicine, but didn’t use it themselves.

It seems you are addressing me directly with that comment … particularly the spreadsheet comment so I will offer a brief defense. But in the future if you want to address me personally, please PM me here or whisper me in game. I don’t think this is the forum these types of discussion.

The reason my play time was low on Blackgate was because I wasn’t having a good time. This was simply a matter of my compatibility with the existing culture on Blackgate.

Your suggestion that I didn’t spend ample time getting to know the community is false. I spent a considerable amount of time on the Blackgate forums trying to understand what the community goals were. When they finally told me that they (as a community) had abandon PPT style play, I apologized for pushing everyone to play PPT and then left for another server. I think I handled it properly.

As for the snake oil salesman comment, using data to reach conclusions is pretty common these days. Science, economics, and even games are modeled systems where our understanding is shaped by data. I don’t think I have to apologize for collecting and analyzing data. Anet provided the API so people could analyze it.

Changes are coming. We will soon know if BG has been making the right decisions to be successful in the long run. I imagine if Anet chooses to considerably boost PPK with an adjustment for KDR, removes siege, and then brackets the WvW playtimes to times to a couple hours around NA Prime, BG will be well positioned to be competitive again.

Let’s a get a few things straight here:

1. BG is successful already. They are in tier 1, have won all tournaments (sorry TC/JQ, match fixing for season 2 doesn’t count as a win, ok it does but you get my point). They have been in tier 1 for years, since the first year of launch.

Most importantly, they are enjoying the game in a way that they enjoy it. And except for a few guilds, MOST NA BG guilds from years ago are still around. KnT, SG, GoF, etc. even OnS if you will though they play on YB. All those guilds are doing well. While other servers have risen and fallen, only JQ and BG have really stood the test of time.

2. Your definition and statistics indicate bias. When someone says that WvWvW is declining, and you say “activity was up 1.8% last week”, that’s a data point, but it certainly is not a trend. You can’t play the high ground of “I’m using statistics” and then say something like that. You complete discredit yourself.

Seeing how players that have played for 3 years + have seen a massive decline in WvWvW with an inverted hockey stick turn happening at HOT, it’s down, and that’s it. Now you weren’t around for that, so I get your perspective, but it also means that your opinion is limited and you’re using weak 1 time data points to indicate a trend. Additionally, out of Anet’s own mouth (personally from my talks with them and in forum posts) they have admitted that numbers are down. Stop arguing the point, WvWvW and the game in general is in decline and that is not what you would expect 5 months after an expansion for a game that was very successful with it’s vanilla launch.

3. BG has never said “We only care about fights”, we have many PPT guilds. Right now we have like 1-2 guilds that do GvG scrims, that’s it! That doesn’t sound like a “fight only server”. A lot of players and commanders over the years have spent countless hours doing overtime to pull out the win. Right now, with no SEA left on BG, and YB pulling overtime or generally having players that like to PPT into the late hours of the night, they are going to win. BG in generally doesn’t want to spend the time to do that. We’ve done it. And guess what, we won when we did.

When numbers are somewhat equal (see reset and the weekends), BG generally wins in PPT. It shows that when we put in the time, we can win when forces are equal. And if we don’t, we won’t win and people are OK with that. Your solution is basically, “You guys won’t win unless you pull all nighters, lose sleep and do it non-stop, you’re losers if you don’t”. Unless it’s a tourney, I think a lot of us feel doing the overtime would be a loser decision.

4. Lastly, and most importantly, all of your slander about “BG is stuck in the past and is a server that hasn’t adapted, and therefore is losing” is not only obviously a lie based on our history but it’s also an indicator that you care less about the game surviving and more about just winning each week. Thoughts like that is what has led many players and guilds to operate in ways that destroys the game, doesn’t build it up.

When ANet put in DBL and made the game more bunker/cheese abilities focused, PLAYERS LEFT. They didn’t stay or play more, THEY LEFT. Why would you then support that direction if the direction ANet is going is making the game die?

Frankly, it makes zero sense.

What can I say? Blackgate needs BEAR to rise again in OCX. That is all.

In all seriousness BG need to learn to work together more instead of separate guilds. Most commanders won’t listen to pugs call outs because they are not from a “big guild” which is why BG is losing players.

Ps. Football and Crystal are still my favourite commanders

Tifa Blades
(GVG Necromancer & Veteran wvw player)
(BEAR) 50 Shades of Bear & (DAWN) First Light Gaming

T1 guilds are jumping down to t2 and its ruining the tier. If you look at t2 it has become extremely toxic right now with TC buying up t1 guilds and there is a severe to say the least population imbalance. FA and DB as two servers cannot match TCs numbers and coverage. I for one can not wait for the april update.

Naithe.4271:

When ANet put in DBL and made the game more bunker/cheese abilities focused, PLAYERS LEFT. They didn’t stay or play more, THEY LEFT. Why would you then support that direction if the direction ANet is going is making the game die?

Frankly, it makes zero sense.

This statement pretty much backs up my argument, Finality. So thanks for that.

For some reason the denizens of BG have a problem with me describing my experience and have decided to take it personally. My comments have managed to drum up some hostility. But its not personal. Like everyone else, I’m entitled to my opinion.

Try looking at it from my perspective. I was new to WvW and wanted to learn the game and give it a try. When I did a little research and try to get excited about it, all I got from the community is “ANet broke the game. No point in playing to win.” All would hear in TS was an endless stream of hate spewed at Anet and YB coupled with the occasional we could win if we wanted to.

As a new player to the game, this really isn’t productive. There was a period where I thought I was motivating people but in the end, the only reason they were playing was to avoid falling into Tier 2. You said as much in the BG forums.

If you don’t like people airing BG’s dirty laundry, you shouldn’t heap it upon them when they show up and then assume that they will eventually see it your way. I don’t agree with what you guys are doing there. So I left. And when people ask about the state of servers, I think I am allowed to offer my opinion.

Do you ever think for a moment that the reason people leave the game is because of people like you who seek to intentionally stifle enjoyment so that you can make a case to Anet that they are doing it wrong? Maybe you and people like you are the reason that people have left Blackgate or the game in general.

I left BG because it simply wasn’t fun there. If you can no longer find enjoyment in the game, just leave it behind. Move on. I promise you when you do, that the servers will keep running and people will keep playing.

If you want to stay for the community then stay for that. But don’t make it your duty to trash everyone who is playing the game.

I don’t think everyone on BG shares this ugly perspective, but unfortunately those that lead the WvW on BG have created a culture that chills counter perspectives. It wasn’t worth the trouble trying to change anything there.

Only Blackgate cares how good Blackgate was back in the day. To new players, now is what matters. So play or get out of the way.

TorquedSoul.8097:

(snip cause wall of text)

Ok this is extremely off topic, whatever, I have to call you out on this one. We were rather supportive of your particular efforts to get people to play PPT. The thing is though, that you were also trying to force your perspective on the way the game it should be played onto people who didn’t want to play that way. We never stopped you from playing for the win. There’s plenty of people on BG who indeed do still try to play for the win. They are supported by the rest of us when we are online because we do try nurture these players. The problems you ran into were due to your insistence on us playing PPT while not doing anything yourself.

On BG, we show what we are made of on the maps, whether we play for the points, or we play to slaughter our enemies (usually both). When rallied up, very few servers have been able to match us, even today. We’ve been purposely dialing back our play time outside of seasons (warning each other to not play too much) because we’ve seen what happens when people play too much. It leads to burnout. We’ve lost way too many good players and commanders to burnout and it’s hurt our community each time one of these players leave.

What you’re asking for is essentially people taking time off work/study to try get a win. It’s not feasible and it’s not moral. Blackgate doesn’t play to lose. We play to have fun, however we define “fun” to be.

Reverence.6915:

TorquedSoul.8097:

(snip cause wall of text)

Ok this is extremely off topic, whatever, I have to call you out on this one. We were rather supportive of your particular efforts to get people to play PPT. The thing is though, that you were also trying to force your perspective on the way the game it should be played onto people who didn’t want to play that way. We never stopped you from playing for the win. There’s plenty of people on BG who indeed do still try to play for the win. They are supported by the rest of us when we are online because we do try nurture these players. The problems you ran into were due to your insistence on us playing PPT while not doing anything yourself.

On BG, we show what we are made of on the maps, whether we play for the points, or we play to slaughter our enemies (usually both). When rallied up, very few servers have been able to match us, even today. We’ve been purposely dialing back our play time outside of seasons (warning each other to not play too much) because we’ve seen what happens when people play too much. It leads to burnout. We’ve lost way too many good players and commanders to burnout and it’s hurt our community each time one of these players leave.

What you’re asking for is essentially people taking time off work/study to try get a win. It’s not feasible and it’s not moral. Blackgate doesn’t play to lose. We play to have fun, however we define “fun” to be.

Well thats a bit of distortion. I was never telling anyone to take off work/school to grind. I believe that my argument was centered around being more welcoming to those PvE players that would enjoy the PPT element of the game. The response was that PvE players would hurt BG once the all powerful PPK was implemented. And suddenly even MAS was going to be fight guild and was going to get big. The leadership’s fight elitism reduced coordination with those that played the PPT end of the game. The result was reduced activity overall. Active population is BG’s problem and that was a cultural one. A culture that chased off would be WvW’ers because you had a different vision.

I made a point that the game should not be grind and that increasing active population was the solution to low activity levels. You guys have either a very short memory or a very selective one. I discouraged grinding.

If some people wrongfully interpreted my desire to win as pushing for a grindfest they should have read my entire posts where I talked about increasing active population (i.e. number of players) rather than grinding.

I do not have a win at all costs attitude, but I do however have a play to win attitude. I’m sorry if you don’t know the difference. Running around in blobs looking for blob fights wasn’t done in attempt to win, it was done because you redefined winning in your mind. It was done while you clung to the hope that Anet would shrink the map sizes to a point to make blob fights a winning strategy. Just like your rejection of PvE players was done in hopes that Anet would drastically increase the PPK value and marginalize capture activity. You were building your server community around a game that didn’t exist yet and crying every time Anet didn’t move the game in a direction that was consistent with your community goals.

If you were truly playing just for fun, you would allow yourself to fall out of tier 1. You don’t like fighting YB and JQ is disintegrating. So why does BG want to be in tier 1. Let TC in. drop down. Get out of the way. Servers that want fights only should just drop to the bottom tiers where points can be regulated and more easily manipulated. But for some reason you guys want to be at the top of the pile. Why is that? Is it more fun to be there?

@Torqued, you are beyond clueless and clearly bitter. Lets see you were new, wanted people to play your way, got angry because the whole server didnt rally behind you, left the server, and now your an expert. You know nothing of BG, and throw up walls of text as if your on some kind of vendetta. Funny enough you dont say anything good about your new server.

If you want to go pvd and think this is what WvW is about, and what drives server activity, go nuts, nothing is stopping you.

Torqued, you’re certainly entitled to your play style. I PPT to a degree but really enjoy the fighting engine this game has. I appreciate the dialogue because I still feel that we’re passing ships in the night. I supported your analysis, and I quote “This is a really good analysis, nice work.” on the BG forums. Let me know if you want me to post the screenshots.

You won’t find me saying that BG should stay in tier 1 or fight just to stay in tier 1. I’ve never cared, so frankly, that’s a flat out lie or misconception (maybe you thought I was someone else).

I did say that if there were no fights for our SEA or OCX they would stop playing. Guess what, that’s exactly what has happened. And to that end, if staying in tier 1 keeps people playing because they have competition, then we should care about our SEA and OCX timezones. That being said, there is currently plenty of fights in tier 2 for those timezones it seems, so moving down wouldn’t matter. Please find the quote where I said “BG must always fight to stay in tier 1.” I’ve never cared.

On the note of frustration; heck yes I’m mad. I’ve been interviewed by ANet live, I’ve went into their studio several times, I was in the DBL Beta, I saw the DBL 18 months before it came out, etc. The point is, we constantly gave feedback, most of it was ignored. When HOT hit, GOF had 60 people online, within a month, it was down to 30. That’s not me being negative, that’s the state of the game.

Did I show too much frustration at ANet? Yes, I sure did. And I’ve done my best not to show more frustration even with in TS (you won’t find posts of me on this forum or any forum being overly negative without providing a bunch of suggestions; heck I don’t even think DBL needs to be removed, just tweeked). That being said, it wasn’t out of anything more than caring that players weren’t having fun in my guild; and with no power over it, I got frustrated. As a driver, I see it as my responsibility to make sure people have fun while I lead and my negativity didn’t help with that. That being said, ANet’s position didn’t help either.

You didn’t seem to pick up on it, but ANet has said to me directly, on these forums and by their actions that the numbers are down. They are going to remove DBL that took a year+ to build. If the general player base hadn’t diminished, and there was just an outcry from a crowd about DBL, they wouldn’t make this move. They are making it because they have the activity numbers, and they are down. Hence why they are asking the community what will get them engaged again.

With the current meta (and leaked potential patch notes as an indicator) they are reverting (or going back to a lesser degree) a lot of the changes that have happened, all because they believe those changes influenced a down turn in population (again I assume). If the patch notes are correct, they are cutting the number of servers. Some poor soul on these forums said that tier 8 has sometimes just 1 person on a border land.

Ok so take all of that into account.

Now, YB plays to the strengths of the current meta. But here’s the problem: That said meta (and guild buffs, DBL to some extent, etc.) are causing that downturn. Hence the ANet changes.

And then you say this “Regardless of your perception of my attitude, the fact is that Blackgate is actively driving away PPT players and putting themselves at a disadvantage. Blackgate will never beat Yak’s Bend until they are willing to become like Yak’s Bend.”

It’s on Page 1. You are telling people that it’s more important to play like YB, which that style seems to have influenced a downturn in players. Now you’re saying you never said that. YB wins because the same few set of individuals play ungodly hours. You know it if you are looking around. One of YB commanders will play for several days straight to make sure they win. But now you’re saying not do overtime and yet you’re saying we need to be like YB? I’m confused.

And that’s why I have a concern with it. It’s accelerating the downturn of this game, not the increase. It’s why I don’t agree with a lot of which you have to say. I want the game to thrive, not collapse. I think you want the same, but I think you haven’t taken a good hard look at what’s bringing down the game.

On your note for PvE players, I think you’re 100% spot on that we should try to get them into WvWvW. Some of the best players I’ve played with were originally PvE players before WvWvW (I was PvE for the first 8 months though I’m not a great player). Hence why we’ve been asking for WvWvW rewards to go up for ages, look back 3 years ago and you’ll see posts on it. Unless you learn the game mode and enjoy it, why WvWvW for 1 hour where you make say 2-3 gold compared to 20g in current PvE content. It’s a tough sell. Additionally, the best way in WvWvW to make gold is to fight and get bags, it’s the highest return on time (at least in my experience). Also there are no exclusive finishers, “good” looking armor, etc. that are only in WvWvW. Doesn’t speak to that type of player that wants unique stuff.

Also, I always said we needed more havocs on BG. People that like to cap stuff and fight with more dedicated focused groups not large in size. It’s a weakness, and YB has it in spades. Good for them, but with the player base decreasing, it’s hard to find those small elite teams.

So I think, in the end, we both want the same: WvWvW to survive. You because it’s new and fresh and fun and me because I want people to have fun (guilds in the end are a sort of family and when family leaves, it’s sad).

Let’s just make sure we take into account the situation for what it is.

“The first step in solving a problem, is identifying you have one.”

The way BG works hasn’t caused a decline on JQ, or YB, or tier 2, or tier 8 or whatever. I personally only influenced my guild and some of BG. I don’t have that much power!

It’s the game. Let’s say it for what it is and not promote the wrong direction to solve the problem.

There are clearly people on BG who PPT. However, after near four years of imbalance, crap rewards and seasons burnout don’t be surprised that a lot of the people still bothering with WvWvW PPT only enough to maintain tiers and enjoy the accompanying player activity. I can see how the community’s indifference to the scoreboard creates bitterness in the players who are late to the party.

I am no longer on BG. I still believe if Anet had a WvW tournament right now that BG would win the tournament. YB is full on PPTing right now. BG has many guilds that only form up 1-2 nights a week (including off-hours guilds), and many of them do not even make a hard effort to PPT on those nights. If given a reason to fight, I suspect you’d see a much larger showing from BG across all timezones. Hell, a few weeks back they almost beat YB with only a handful of commanders deciding to do some extra public raids.

Congratulations to YB for winning when everyone else got burned out and disgusted by the changes to the game I guess? It will be interesting to see how YB fares with the upcoming changes to maps (and hopeful fixes to stability).

Naithe.4271:

I did say that if there were no fights for our SEA or OCX they would stop playing. Guess what, that’s exactly what has happened.

SoX is still playing in ocx time on JQ mainly on the desert BLs with usually around 15 players. Yes we try and prop up JQs PPT but we’re always up for fights unless we’re significantly outnumbered.

I miss SEA Time, it was great fighting cA/FUG/HIRE/AHMA with 3 map queues on TC/JQ/BG on EBG.

Nowadays it’s just a ghost town or some PPT stuff ain’t nobody got time for that. You can thank YB for the lack of activity in SEA.

fishball.7204:

I miss SEA Time, it was great fighting cA/FUG/HIRE/AHMA with 3 map queues on TC/JQ/BG on EBG.

Nowadays it’s just a ghost town or some PPT stuff ain’t nobody got time for that. You can thank YB for the lack of activity in SEA.

Sounds like you need some T2. HIRE and ND still raid on TC, decimating the DB SEA forces. Feel free to pop on by if you want lol. I mean, the map queue’s aren’t like they used to be in T1 but there’s still decent SEA play.

Tifa.6473:

In all seriousness BG need to learn to work together more instead of separate guilds.

Id say BG needs the opposite of this, they need some small havoc squads. You have all of BG on 1 tag fighting the YB blob. Meanwhile YB also has 3 or 4 small havoc groups roaming around capping stuff looking for fights outside of the push button 1 blob.

Get off the blob tag and out of EB. I was roaming today and YB pretty much owned all of BG and JQ BL’s. All while EB probably had a 20+ queue.

The other issue is guilds who wont leave spawn without like 20ppl. WvW with less than 20 ppl? Inconceivable. We will just wait an hour until more ppl log in.

Chorazin.4107:

Id say BG needs the opposite of this, they need some small havoc squads. You have all of BG on 1 tag fighting the YB blob. Meanwhile YB also has 3 or 4 small havoc groups roaming around capping stuff looking for fights outside of the push button 1 blob.

Get off the blob tag and out of EB. I was roaming today and YB pretty much owned all of BG and JQ BL’s. All while EB probably had a 20+ queue.

The other issue is guilds who wont leave spawn without like 20ppl. WvW with less than 20 ppl? Inconceivable. We will just wait an hour until more ppl log in.

It’s Thursday… On a week we can’t win in PPT. So we, BG, did a fun event instead. You can’t compare one night to “all the time”. That is drawing from some horrible data.

And you want more roaming groups, but I have been trying to get SG to roam more recently. Yet, when we do meet, YB some how always adds more to any small group fight. What incentive do I have to roam with 2-5 when I know as soon as we see any YB, we will soon be faced against 10-15?

You did this not even 30 minutes ago outside north air keep. It was two trex and one LUN I believe against two SG and one other from BG. We down the LUN guy and you down our random, but then all of sudden 2-3 more trex come out to finish us? What is my kittening incentive to fight small scale if you plus in all the time. I may as well have been on my main force where my supply was useful instead of trying to have a fun skirmish out of north air.

For your records… SG has stopped WvW nights besides reset and the impromptu nights we may have. Many of my guild are getting sick of the game and the feel that Anet will never fix this kitten. The people that log in and play everyday in SG for WvW usually roam till they are being 5v1’ed and then decide to say “kitten it, time to join tag.”

I am all for more havok groups and roamers, love em because they do a valuable job.

Its pretty funny hearing that from someone on YB who runs in a guild known for running nothing more then a gank squad that uses the most cheese builds out there. Spam stealth and gank people from behind by spamming everything, then run through a portal as soon as you get any resistance, so much skill, did you come up with that strategy on your own?.

Here is how yb reacts to small groups, they either run to the nearest structure to build siege, or they wait till they have 2,3 times more numbers before engaging, yea real skill right there.

YB: Hey BG get off the zerg, so its easier to attack you with our zerg….kitten …

Barsity.9408:

I have been trying to get SG to roam more recently. Yet, when we do meet, YB some how always adds more to any small group fight. What incentive do I have to roam with 2-5 when I know as soon as we see any YB, we will soon be faced against 10-15?

You seem to think you have a monopoly on this? This is WvW in T1, if you dont expect this to happen i dont know what to tell you. This is pretty much every fight we have, always amusing seeing like 15-20 ppl run into a tower from our 7man until they can get a safe 25+ or so to roll over us.

Barsity.9408:

You did this not even 30 minutes ago outside north air keep. It was two trex and one LUN I believe against two SG and one other from BG. We down the LUN guy and you down our random, but then all of sudden 2-3 more trex come out to finish us? What is my kittening incentive to fight small scale if you plus in all the time. I may as well have been on my main force where my supply was useful instead of trying to have a fun skirmish out of north air.

Again this is T1, it happens all the time from all servers. You are making out SG don’t do this also, you guys are quite happy to sit safely in a 30man zerg and run over our 7man. We are not going to be salty about it, it’s T1.

Barsity.9408:

For your records… SG has stopped WvW nights besides reset and the impromptu nights we may have. Many of my guild are getting sick of the game and the feel that Anet will never fix this kitten. The people that log in and play everyday in SG for WvW usually roam till they are being 5v1’ed and then decide to say “kitten it, time to join tag.”

Well its ur right to do whatever you like with your guild, if you only want to run reset nights more power to you. But why join the tag, because you got 5v1’d? This is how we run every day, oh its the KnT blob, or the MAS blob, or the XvX blob, GoF blob, RITE, etc etc.

X T D.6458:

I am all for more havok groups and roamers, love em because they do a valuable job.

Its pretty funny hearing that from someone on YB who runs in a guild known for running nothing more then a gank squad that uses the most cheese builds out there. Spam stealth and gank people from behind by spamming everything, then run through a portal as soon as you get any resistance, so much skill, did you come up with that strategy on your own?.

Here is how yb reacts to small groups, they either run to the nearest structure to build siege, or they wait till they have 2,3 times more numbers before engaging, yea real skill right there.

YB: Hey BG get off the zerg, so its easier to attack you with our zerg….kitten …

I like Lireii and he kinda has a point so I’ll give him some slack but usually we run 6-7, so if you’re seeing just 2-3 it should cross your mind that the others might catch up. You’re complaining about us utilizing stealth? That’s little different than using veil to engage on a zerg fight, we just do it better. As for cheese builds, I’m assuming you’re complaining about our recent use of condi Reapers, which I see plenty of XVX utilizing as well as Venomshare in past weeks. Sorry we don’t like crashing face first into your 20+ man groups all the time, and can disengage and keep ourselves safe well. Not sure what your problem is, since I’m on pretty good terms with Moses, so I’m just gonna go with you got caught out, cleaved down, and have nursed a grudge ever since.

Besides, it’s not like we haven’t straight up duked it out with you before.

See examples:

#1: https://youtu.be/lBbNBCxy0dc?t=3s

#2: https://gfycat.com/NervousBiodegradableCony

#3: https://youtu.be/VlvY0mgDLLw?t=5m27s

#4: https://youtu.be/VlvY0mgDLLw?t=13m29s

#5: https://youtu.be/VlvY0mgDLLw?t=2m36s.

If you’re just going to be salty that’s fine, but for Christ’s sake complain about something that matters.

Edit: I forgot this little gem since you decided to bring up ganking. https://gfycat.com/PossibleFatFoxterrier. At least do it right.

EDIT: god I can’t believe cinnafeg and ch beat me to this.

yo Lireil I’ll apologize for that one, you guys were right next to the wp and I saw a downed and didn’t realize it was only 2 of you. Most of the guild is on me so we’re bound to add in. You and I both know it’s not common for us to outnumber and zerg you guys down.

You guys are one of the only bg groups that gives us close to even numbered fights, the rest of bg is either non-existent or popping orange swords on the 6 or 7 of us. You guys are the 1% and the rest of your server is probably the most boring server I ever came up against (and I’ve hopped a dozen servers and fought in every tier). I’ve never seen players take dying in WvW so seriously.

X T D.6458:

I am all for more havok groups and roamers, love em because they do a valuable job.

Its pretty funny hearing that from someone on YB who runs in a guild known for running nothing more then a gank squad that uses the most cheese builds out there. Spam stealth and gank people from behind by spamming everything, then run through a portal as soon as you get any resistance, so much skill, did you come up with that strategy on your own?.

Here is how yb reacts to small groups, they either run to the nearest structure to build siege, or they wait till they have 2,3 times more numbers before engaging, yea real skill right there.

YB: Hey BG get off the zerg, so its easier to attack you with our zerg….kitten …

Im trying to understand your argument, you dont want us to spam our skills to down people? We should maybe not use our skills? Is this how XvX recruits players? Dont spam your skills guys just stack on Moses and push button 1.

Havoc is about hit and run, i dont know what to tell you because you just sound salty. Look [tRex] is running from a 30 v 7, those cowards, rofl, why dont they stick around so we can run them over.

Enjoy XvX, maybe you guys should have brought 40 rather than 30.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxNRs4bKhzA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaJLlTuuZfM

TorquedSoul.8097:

Only Blackgate cares how good Blackgate was back in the day. To new players, now is what matters. So play or get out of the way.

Many/most veteran players no longer find any joy in playing for PPT, as in Points Per Tick, the current scoring system. That doesn’t mean that they don’t want a scoring system… they do (not just “fights”, but fights for wins)
Just the current one is broken. New players have no ideea yet, it’s everything exciting at start, all is new; but we must understand each other, the “why” of the other side.

If you’ve read the upcoming leaked patch proposal – fake or not – there were very good changes, and that’s what WvW needs: a working, meaningful scoring system that has consequences, rewards for participating, makes those fights exciting.

Everyone wants to play for a “win”, or the vast majority at least… Even in the current broken PPT system, great efforts are made by both BG and JQ to keep up with that guy and his crew on YB (let’s not name him and them), who never sleeps or can wake up at any hour, and “PPT you into oblivion” during the times when your servers has no coverage. It’s just very not fun… it’s worse than boring actually. Then even if BG or JQ “wins” a week… what now? Means nothing: no rewards, no consequences.

That’s why most WvW players are looking forward to that patch, those changes promised long time ago, hoped for since forever, that is already far too late for many who moved on to other games. Keeping WvW alive was the “duty” of those veterans; so they did PPT because they had to, but also needed to have some fun too, and they could find that only in fights. Don’t ask them to play your way or “get out of the way”, without them you would stand on completely empty maps.

Waffle.3748:

X T D.6458:

I am all for more havok groups and roamers, love em because they do a valuable job.

Its pretty funny hearing that from someone on YB who runs in a guild known for running nothing more then a gank squad that uses the most cheese builds out there. Spam stealth and gank people from behind by spamming everything, then run through a portal as soon as you get any resistance, so much skill, did you come up with that strategy on your own?.

Here is how yb reacts to small groups, they either run to the nearest structure to build siege, or they wait till they have 2,3 times more numbers before engaging, yea real skill right there.

YB: Hey BG get off the zerg, so its easier to attack you with our zerg….kitten …

I like Lireii and he kinda has a point so I’ll give him some slack but usually we run 6-7, so if you’re seeing just 2-3 it should cross your mind that the others might catch up. You’re complaining about us utilizing stealth? That’s little different than using veil to engage on a zerg fight, we just do it better. As for cheese builds, I’m assuming you’re complaining about our recent use of condi Reapers, which I see plenty of XVX utilizing as well as Venomshare in past weeks. Sorry we don’t like crashing face first into your 20+ man groups all the time, and can disengage and keep ourselves safe well. Not sure what your problem is, since I’m on pretty good terms with Moses, so I’m just gonna go with you got caught out, cleaved down, and have nursed a grudge ever since.

Besides, it’s not like we haven’t straight up duked it out with you before.

See examples:

#1: https://youtu.be/lBbNBCxy0dc?t=3s

#2: https://gfycat.com/NervousBiodegradableCony

#3: https://youtu.be/VlvY0mgDLLw?t=5m27s

#4: https://youtu.be/VlvY0mgDLLw?t=13m29s

#5: https://youtu.be/VlvY0mgDLLw?t=2m36s.

If you’re just going to be salty that’s fine, but for Christ’s sake complain about something that matters.

Edit: I forgot this little gem since you decided to bring up ganking. https://gfycat.com/PossibleFatFoxterrier. At least do it right.

Im glad you and Moses and friendly with each other, I on the other hand have my own opinions from watching you guys and I will call out your garbage. I couldnt care less what you think of me or my opinions, you can post all the edited crap you want, I know how your guild operates. In all honesty I find your complaints rather funny and hypocritical. But to each his own.

@chorazin I meant no disrespect. It’s just I still hold a personal dueling and small scale fights rule from way back. Ask any SG who was with us before YB came to T1. When I was leading the group of our small scale, I ALWAYS left 1 to res his teammates and “tell the tale” after a fight.

I also can not speak for all of BG. You are correct. MAS used to run small numbers. So did SG. So did a few other BG guilds who ended up being assimilated with HoT and the new guild hall need for items to have our old upgrades back. Our two guilds just decided to recruit and get bigger… I actually have to thank my PvE SG-ians for us being able to have our WvW upgrades as they allowed and supported it.

I have noticed tRex does very little claiming as you guys are a small niche group of pvp/WvW small scale fighters. Most BG guilds, unfortunately, do not have that luxury.

But you also say we are safe to sit in a zerg, but then I told you why. Some of us don’t like dying all the time to more than our numbers. And most nights, I have like 3-4 SG out. I have been trying to run more roaming with my guild as I can. But since we recruited some, not all have the builds nor gear to actually roam. Since HoT came, we went to more zerging gameplay… But in doing so, also recruited more to that gameplay. So you can’t even compare our adding in to our current comp as fights happen. It was already said before that SG now runs fat occasionally. Once again, why I am trying to turn us in to a roaming group we once used to be on nights other than reset. I apologize for my heavy handed attack in my first response…

@Wirriam No problem. I knew the person who added in. I did not know they did till
they fight was pretty much in my favor. I would have lost that as about half way through, I kittened up my rotation from alcohol related reasons. That is why I let that person res. It was out of respect they deserved the win. Just the other person thought I stomped and I don’t control over others than myself. I admit… Looking back now, it was fine as that 1 PPK is nothing. But I personally try to let duelers res on the BLs unless I know they are being kittenters and are only stalling for call ins. “Let 1 live to tell the tale!”

X T D.6458:

Im glad you and Moses and friendly with each other, I on the other hand have my own opinions from watching you guys and I will call out your garbage. I couldnt care less what you think of me or my opinions, you can post all the edited crap you want, I know how your guild operates. In all honesty I find your complaints rather funny and hypocritical. But to each his own.

We operate pretty normally when faced with outnumbered situations, though I can’t expect you to understand how that works when you’re safely ensconced in your zerg 90% of your WvW experience, but I can tell you get upset when we disrupt that safety net and you can’t stand on your own two feet.

I mean if you think we’re garbage we can have a nice 1v1, I’ll bring my regular old power build, but if you’re afraid of getting thrashed that’s cool too.

Waffle.3748:

X T D.6458:

Im glad you and Moses and friendly with each other, I on the other hand have my own opinions from watching you guys and I will call out your garbage. I couldnt care less what you think of me or my opinions, you can post all the edited crap you want, I know how your guild operates. In all honesty I find your complaints rather funny and hypocritical. But to each his own.

We operate pretty normally when faced with outnumbered situations, though I can’t expect you to understand how that works when you’re safely ensconced in your zerg 90% of your WvW experience, but I can tell you get upset when we disrupt that safety net and you can’t stand on your own two feet.

I mean if you think we’re garbage we can have a nice 1v1, I’ll bring my regular old power build, but if you’re afraid of getting thrashed that’s cool too.

Barsity.9408:

@chorazin I meant no disrespect. It’s just I still hold a personal dueling and small scale fights rule from way back. Ask any SG who was with us before YB came to T1. When I was leading the group of our small scale, I ALWAYS left 1 to res his teammates and “tell the tale” after a fight.

I also can not speak for all of BG. You are correct. MAS used to run small numbers. So did SG. So did a few other BG guilds who ended up being assimilated with HoT and the new guild hall need for items to have our old upgrades back. Our two guilds just decided to recruit and get bigger… I actually have to thank my PvE SG-ians for us being able to have our WvW upgrades as they allowed and supported it.

I have noticed tRex does very little claiming as you guys are a small niche group of pvp/WvW small scale fighters. Most BG guilds, unfortunately, do not have that luxury.

Honestly we just got our arena and said to hell with this, and DK hit us up with a nice VIP spot in FoW if we needed claims (side benefit of getting guild comms from the ridiculous amount of missions that are ran on the BL’s). Props to you guys for sticking it out, holy crap that was terrible to do.

X T D.6458:

Waffle.3748:

X T D.6458:

Im glad you and Moses and friendly with each other, I on the other hand have my own opinions from watching you guys and I will call out your garbage. I couldnt care less what you think of me or my opinions, you can post all the edited crap you want, I know how your guild operates. In all honesty I find your complaints rather funny and hypocritical. But to each his own.

We operate pretty normally when faced with outnumbered situations, though I can’t expect you to understand how that works when you’re safely ensconced in your zerg 90% of your WvW experience, but I can tell you get upset when we disrupt that safety net and you can’t stand on your own two feet.

I mean if you think we’re garbage we can have a nice 1v1, I’ll bring my regular old power build, but if you’re afraid of getting thrashed that’s cool too.

I’ll count that as a dodge, then. If you’re going to try to talk smack at least back it up, friend.

You amuse me…..

The point about regearing for HoT is something I can identify with. Roaming was already on the decline and it just wasn’t worth jumping through all the PvE hoops for the HoT stuff.

gennyt.3428:

The point about regearing for HoT is something I can identify with. Roaming was already on the decline and it just wasn’t worth jumping through all the PvE hoops for the HoT stuff.

Yeah it was kind of a letdown that it’s such a struggle to get even the most basic guild buffs.

X T D.6458:

You amuse me…..

" Spam stealth and gank people from behind by spamming everything, then run through a portal as soon as you get any resistance, so much skill, did you come up with that strategy on your own?."

Sounds like you’re the salty one, lol. I offered up a fair engagement, which you quickly avoided and say I’m just chest thumping (nice deflection btw). “Class Lead” should have enough game knowledge to fight on an even level, no? If you’re just not going to back up any talk, you’re the one pointlessly chest thumping. Hell, I’ve given Moses general build ideas/strats for roaming when he asked, simply because I’m happy he’s showing interest and enthusiasm in the scene. We’ve come across some XVX roaming groups and while they didn’t fare well, I was happy they even put forth some effort. You’re not even doing that, and it’s honestly disappointing to see.

Waffle.3748:

gennyt.3428:

The point about regearing for HoT is something I can identify with. Roaming was already on the decline and it just wasn’t worth jumping through all the PvE hoops for the HoT stuff.

Yeah it was kind of a letdown that it’s such a struggle to get even the most basic guild buffs.

Putting aside our little love fest. When seeing all the mats, and grind, and gold required for the guild hall, I was absolutely disgusted, and I could not believe how anet stepped over small guilds like that. Taking away upgrades your guild already had and gating them behind a massive gold/mat/pve grind was bad enough, but its even worse for small guilds. I have felt so bad for smaller guilds even yours Waffle, believe it or not. I can only hope the update on the 19th makes it easier for smaller guilds to unlock even the basic stuff, lvl 37 for +5, thats just ridiculous…

Ironic thing is…I remember before HoT anet said when asked about small guilds and guild halls…“small guilds will be treated respectfully”…yikes…

Hes probably the warrior class lead, i guess apart from pushing button 1 he needs to teach his zerglings the mysterious arts of bannering the XvX front line. It happens so frequently, i mean they have downed on inc, you’d think they would have it down to a fine art.

Ope, there goes XvX’s front line again, third banner activate!

BG is just waking up to what everyone else already woke up to PPT is boring.

Chorazin.4107:

Hes probably the warrior class lead, i guess apart from pushing button 1 he needs to teach his zerglings the mysterious arts of bannering the XvX front line. It happens so frequently, i mean they have downed on inc, you’d think they would have it down to a fine art.

Ope, there goes XvX’s front line again, third banner activate!

Jesus let me have my forum 1v1, it’s the most I’ll get.

Waffle.3748:

Chorazin.4107:

Hes probably the warrior class lead, i guess apart from pushing button 1 he needs to teach his zerglings the mysterious arts of bannering the XvX front line. It happens so frequently, i mean they have downed on inc, you’d think they would have it down to a fine art.

Ope, there goes XvX’s front line again, third banner activate!

Jesus let me have my forum 1v1, it’s the most I’ll get.

You guys are cracking me up, and you dont even realize whats happening