One thing is for sure, they will have a lot less people to worry about causing imbalance in the not so distant future so most servers should be open at that point.
As I posted a few days back to another of your crying compadres, you guys obviously grossly overestimated those that hated the dbls. So you’re most likely also grossly overestimating the numbers that will leave.
I have no doubt that the game will carry on for several more years, with or without you.
Hopefully the rest of us that are still here will continue to see good communication and positive changes continuing in wvw from Anet. Frankly, I am looking forward to it.
(edited by Teon.5168)
If you’re not prepared to accept 2 ABLS and 1 DBL then you’re being needlessly unrealistic. I highly doubt there will be mass departures in such a case.
I have to completely agree with this. It is a good compromise. Sure, some people might leave…..but it will hardly even be noticeable to most, I bet.
Hopefully never…
Guess you didn’t see the poll…..
Guess you never saw the empty desert BL’s and EBG queued to the gills before?
Lol. Man, you guys are really sore about getting stomped in the poll, huh?
Not so much that as much as that this is the popular opinion among people who did leave and came back.
For example, and I know well I’m not the only one in this situation, my guild left because of DBL, came back because Alpine did, and has repeatedly said they will leave for the next DBL addon and come back when Alpine returns.
A ton of people who cared and would have voiced their opposition have already left. The people who liked the DBL or didn’t mind it are obviously the ones still here, so the entire prospect of the poll is biased and the results genuinely mean next to nothing; the damage has largely already been done.
Hopefully never…
Guess you didn’t see the poll…..
Guess you never saw the empty desert BL’s and EBG queued to the gills before?
Lol. Man, you guys are really sore about getting stomped in the poll, huh?
Not so much that as much as that this is the popular opinion among people who did leave and came back.
For example, and I know well I’m not the only one in this situation, my guild left because of DBL, came back because Alpine did, and has repeatedly said they will leave for the next DBL addon and come back when Alpine returns.
A ton of people who cared and would have voiced their opposition have already left. The people who liked the DBL or didn’t mind it are obviously the ones still here, so the entire prospect of the poll is biased and the results genuinely mean next to nothing; the damage has largely already been done.
You do all realize that ABLS is here to stay, yes? It is not being taking away because of this poll. Most likely it will end up being in a 2abls, 1 dbl config, depending on the results of the next poll.
So not sure what your point is. Abls is STILL in the game. And it will continue to be.
And, as you claim…..if the damage is already done, then there is no need to be worried about others leaving because of this or the next poll.
/shrug
(edited by Teon.5168)
One thing is for sure, they will have a lot less people to worry about causing imbalance in the not so distant future so most servers should be open at that point.
As I posted a few days back to another of your crying compadres, you guys obviously grossly overestimated those that hated the dbls. So you’re most likely also grossly overestimating the numbers that will leave.
I have no doubt that the game will carry on for several more years, with or without you.
Hopefully the rest of us that are still here will continue to see good communication and positive changes continuing in wvw from Anet. Frankly, I am looking forward to it.
Mhmm.. see if you will be singing that song when CU comes out. I mean if PvD is your thang more powa to ya.
Sure the game carries on .. LOTS of games carry on with low population.
Mhmm.. see if you will be singing that song when CU comes out. I mean if PvD is your thang more powa to ya.
Sure the game carries on .. LOTS of games carry on with low population.
CU will be about an ever changing environment, if you can’t handle that in GW2, you are in for a very bad time in CU. I recommend practicing now.
Mhmm.. see if you will be singing that song when CU comes out. I mean if PvD is your thang more powa to ya.
Sure the game carries on .. LOTS of games carry on with low population.
CU will be about an ever changing environment, if you can’t handle that in GW2, you are in for a very bad time in CU. I recommend practicing now.
I know exactly what CU is about.. Ever changing environment isn’t the problem. Only a bad PvP environment where all classes are not even playable is.
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
Seriously, a mix up is good for the game, the re-vamped DBL is not only playable but allows for the same open field fights that everyone loves. Embrace a bit of change.
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
Seriously, a mix up is good for the game, the re-vamped DBL is not only playable but allows for the same open field fights that everyone loves. Embrace a bit of change.
Not all classes can even use their skills in some of the important areas due to the topography and keep design. For it to be playable, all classes need to be able to use their skills on all of the map in a PvP game mode. Change is great, when it is good change. " Old guard" learned the map and found it was broken and lacking. Asking for a map designed for Nonstop challenging, strategic, fun PvP action the entire time you are on it is not the same as not wanting change.
Players asked them to take the broken PvE gimmicky bouncy mess back and bring them an actual PvP map designed for player experience and PVP action instead. That is definitely wanting change, just in the right direction. Being okay with them just making a broken map somewhat playable, is not the same as wanting them to design a good map from the ground up that focuses on player experience of all classes and all combat styles bringing players together in nonstop PvP action the entire time they are on it. BIG difference.
(edited by lil devils x.6071)
The map got fixed, I’m assuming you already had it boycotted by then.
What a shame.
The map got fixed, I’m assuming you already had it boycotted by then.
What a shame.
Nope I played the map, part of ti is fixed, now they really need to work on the keeps..
THOUGH: That still doesn’t make a it a good map. That still just makes it a broken map that was made somewhat playable,. not a map designed from the ground up to keep players in PvP action. It doesn’t make it a good map designed specifically for nonstop PvP action.
(edited by lil devils x.6071)
Yeah, keeps are a buggy mess. We showed A-Net how to glitch into both keeps, but went live anyway.
Snowfall runes FTW.
(edited by Trajan.4953)
In any case, DBL should not return until ANet can decide or re-poll the community on rotation versus mixed. One question that remained was how many people voted for rotation thinking that meant DBL would not return. Does the current poll change peoples thoughts on rotation versus mixed. That and give the decision that is made some time to sink in. They have said rotation and quarterly but based on feedback that seemed to be the least favorable course. The reason I say let it sink in is that people do take some time to adjust and the recent polling is probably leaving questions in peoples minds. Would be better to have a date versus just getting a Tuesday note that WvW is shutting down for maintenance and now maps are different.
I believe the next poll up is the reworded one about mixed bls. Will be interesting to see how they reword it. Hopefully we end up getting something like a 2abls/1dbl sort of setup, unless a lot of the dbl haters try to screw the poll over just out of spite. (Although I doubt if they have the numbers to do that)
And I am not sure about the rotation schedule. If it ends up a mixed bls, then what would be the need for it to be on a rotation schedule? Just my thoughts on it.
And please Anet, continue to make positive and useful tweaks to the dbl.
(edited by Teon.5168)
I wonder if they have done anything more to the DBL since it’s been in Lala land or if it’s coming back as when it was removed?
I wonder if they have done anything more to the DBL since it’s been in Lala land or if it’s coming back as when it was removed?
Sure would be nice if they had continued to work on it while it was in mothballs.
I wonder if they have done anything more to the DBL since it’s been in Lala land or if it’s coming back as when it was removed?
Sure would be nice if they had continued to work on it while it was in mothballs.
There have been two sets of changes we have yet to play on live… first with the patch that rotated it out and then with the patch previous to the last raid wing if memory serves —- the changes are in the patch notes
I wonder if they have done anything more to the DBL since it’s been in Lala land or if it’s coming back as when it was removed?
Sure would be nice if they had continued to work on it while it was in mothballs.
There have been two sets of changes we have yet to play on live… first with the patch that rotated it out and then with the patch previous to the last raid wing if memory serves —- the changes are in the patch notes
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
Edit: Or at least I was.
(edited by Loosmaster.8263)
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
DBL is supposed to be coming back with the next relinking. So, you’ll have a map that alot of people don’t like and be paired with teamates that are probably enemies this week. It’s going to be interesting to say the least.
DBL is supposed to be coming back with the next relinking. So, you’ll have a map that alot of people don’t like and be paired with teamates that are probably enemies this week. It’s going to be interesting to say the least.
If all 3 BL maps are Desert BL, that will be the end of my guild raiding until Alpine is back, or maybe even permanently.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
I know Rev CoR doesn’t work on kitten near any unlevel ground. Unless that’s been fixed within the last couple of months.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
I know Rev CoR doesn’t work on kitten near any unlevel ground. Unless that’s been fixed within the last couple of months.
sounds like something that the wvw team doesnt need to be held responsible for. specifically, that is the realm of the balance team. and they seem more interested in pvp, where this is easily also an issue.
time to make the hitbox fully 3d.
I wonder if they have done anything more to the DBL since it’s been in Lala land or if it’s coming back as when it was removed?
Sure would be nice if they had continued to work on it while it was in mothballs.
There have been two sets of changes we have yet to play on live… first with the patch that rotated it out and then with the patch previous to the last raid wing if memory serves —- the changes are in the patch notes
And even then it’ll need some play time to work out the rest of the kinks. I posted about the shrubs and rocks and stairs being a menace to foot space hopefully that was worked on.
I also know of a spot near northeast tower that seems to have an invisible wall which shouldn’t be there, but didn’t get a chance to report it before it left, it’s the first thing I’m reporting when it comes back.
I’m sure changes will go faster now if we continue to give detailed postings of the problems, since we have a wvw team that’s actively reading the forums… I think… lol.
Too many weeks wasted complaining to get rid of it than to fix it.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
I know Rev CoR doesn’t work on kitten near any unlevel ground. Unless that’s been fixed within the last couple of months.
sounds like something that the wvw team doesnt need to be held responsible for. specifically, that is the realm of the balance team. and they seem more interested in pvp, where this is easily also an issue.
time to make the hitbox fully 3d.
So, you’re saying everyone involved in making the DBL and all 4 HoT maps and creating a new class was oblivious to this?
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
I know Rev CoR doesn’t work on kitten near any unlevel ground. Unless that’s been fixed within the last couple of months.
sounds like something that the wvw team doesnt need to be held responsible for. specifically, that is the realm of the balance team. and they seem more interested in pvp, where this is easily also an issue.
time to make the hitbox fully 3d.
So, you’re saying everyone involved in making the DBL and all 4 HoT maps and creating a new class was oblivious to this?
yeah prolly. balance isnt their department.
maybe the proper people with the knowledge or connections dont even play rev in a zerg. maybe it works on the dev client. maybe its been addressed for the next quarterly update but theyre tightlipped as usual, especially if its a thing on the known issue tracker. maybe not.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
Yea, that is what I have understood. Small tweaks and adjustments. The ones they made before dbls was yanked were good changes…..am hoping that continues. I don’t expect huge changes, and not even sure that I want huge changes. Opening up the center area some for larger open field battles that some posters and myself have suggested….I suppose that might be considered a large change…..maybe not. Overall, I am happy with the direction the current changes done to dbl were taking.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
Give it a rest. The poll is now closed. DBL will be part of the live game along with ABL. The majority, by almost a 2-1 margin, have spoken.
All that is left to figure out is whether it will be a mixed bl or on a quarterly rotation with abl.
But, DBL will be in the live game, as per the poll results. End of story.
(edited by Teon.5168)
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
Give it a rest. The poll is now closed. DBL will be part of the live game along with ABL.
End of story.
Why would anyone give it a rest? It took them how many years to work on spawn trebs for ABL? If the map is broken, the more you should hear about it, not less.
END of story is: Dur Hur let’s put a map in the live game in a PvP mode that all classes cannot even use their skills on and not be able to fix it now because it is in the live game and pretend it works..
Why should you care? You’re not going to be playing the one dbl that is out there when there are 2 abls and EB that you can play.
(edited by Teon.5168)
Why should you care? You’re not going to be playing the one dbl that is out there when there are 2 abls and EB that you can play.
I play on all maps in the game because oh yer I don’t just stay on one map when I play. You pull players from one map to the other by targeting key objectives and forcing them to choose which they keep. You do this by utilizing all maps in play and make sure you prevent all teams from upgrading their structures on all maps. You force their hand by making them make hard choices to which keep they choose to defend and which they allow to go by ensuring they have to lose something important for every decision they make.
That is how you play WvW…
I mean sure, I could run around mindlessly goofing off , but why would I I do that on this game when there are better games for running around mindlessly on? This game was supposed to be one to play for strategic WvW…
(edited by lil devils x.6071)
Why should you care? You’re not going to be playing the one dbl that is out there when there are 2 abls and EB that you can play.
I play on all maps in the game because oh yer I don’t just stay on one map when I play. You pull players from one map to the other by targeting key objectives and forcing them to choose which they keep. You do this by utilizing all maps in play and make sure you prevent all teams from upgrading their structures on all maps. You force their hand by making them make hard choices to which keep they choose to defend and which they allow to go by ensuring they have to lose something important for every decision they make.
That is how you play WvW…
LOL. Thanks for the simplistic tutorial that I didn’t need.
But, I thought that you guys weren’t going to play dbl if it was still going to be in game?
Or has that changed, now?
Why should you care? You’re not going to be playing the one dbl that is out there when there are 2 abls and EB that you can play.
I play on all maps in the game because oh yer I don’t just stay on one map when I play. You pull players from one map to the other by targeting key objectives and forcing them to choose which they keep. You do this by utilizing all maps in play and make sure you prevent all teams from upgrading their structures on all maps. You force their hand by making them make hard choices to which keep they choose to defend and which they allow to go by ensuring they have to lose something important for every decision they make.
That is how you play WvW…
LOL. Thanks for the simplistic tutorial that I didn’t need.
But, I thought that you guys weren’t going to play dbl if it was still going to be in game?
Or has that changed, now?
Like I said, many will leave. I never left, I was the one who talked them into coming back last time. There will be some who remain for a while.. Time will tell how long that while is.
Why should you care? You’re not going to be playing the one dbl that is out there when there are 2 abls and EB that you can play.
I play on all maps in the game because oh yer I don’t just stay on one map when I play. You pull players from one map to the other by targeting key objectives and forcing them to choose which they keep. You do this by utilizing all maps in play and make sure you prevent all teams from upgrading their structures on all maps. You force their hand by making them make hard choices to which keep they choose to defend and which they allow to go by ensuring they have to lose something important for every decision they make.
That is how you play WvW…
LOL. Thanks for the simplistic tutorial that I didn’t need.
But, I thought that you guys weren’t going to play dbl if it was still going to be in game?
Or has that changed, now?Like I said, many will leave. I never left, I was the one who talked them into coming back last time. There will be some who remain for a while.. Time will tell how long that while is.
Yup. It remains to be seen how many actually will leave.
Why should you care? You’re not going to be playing the one dbl that is out there when there are 2 abls and EB that you can play.
I play on all maps in the game because oh yer I don’t just stay on one map when I play. You pull players from one map to the other by targeting key objectives and forcing them to choose which they keep. You do this by utilizing all maps in play and make sure you prevent all teams from upgrading their structures on all maps. You force their hand by making them make hard choices to which keep they choose to defend and which they allow to go by ensuring they have to lose something important for every decision they make.
That is how you play WvW…
LOL. Thanks for the simplistic tutorial that I didn’t need.
But, I thought that you guys weren’t going to play dbl if it was still going to be in game?
Or has that changed, now?Like I said, many will leave. I never left, I was the one who talked them into coming back last time. There will be some who remain for a while.. Time will tell how long that while is.
Yup. It remains to be seen how many actually will leave.
Even if it is 1/4 to 1/2 that left last time, it will be bad. The bigger issue is as soon as another game comes out, those holding on because they haven’t found anything else to play yet will leave all at once and then.. *crickets+ due to low player satisfaction levels.
That is what happens in all MMORPGs though when every update doesn’t : increase population numbers, increase player satisfaction and increase game longevity.
Updates are not supposed to make players leave, they are supposed to bring more players to the game and keep the players they have at the same time. If they had focused on making great maps instead of ones that made players rage, everyone would have been cheering rather than bickering about “well it is not that broke and I hope they fix ____”, “It is atrocious and completely unplayable” or “if they did _ it would not be as bad.”
That is a sure sign it was not a great map..
" better than nothing" =\= “Best large scale PvP game on the market”
(edited by lil devils x.6071)
I like how the most popular thread I make is also the dumbest thread I’ve ever made.
1. Ask stupid question on controversial issue
2. …….
3. Profit
I hope this thread gets tossed into a secret above-ground facility where its boxed and ….. like the arc of the lost convenant. even i have no motivation to finish the joke thats how dumb pointless this thread has become.
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
I don’t seen why mixed: 1 DBL and 2 ABL doesn’t provide that. And rotation has the severe drawback that players will probably leave the game for the duration that DBL is there.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
I know Rev CoR doesn’t work on kitten near any unlevel ground. Unless that’s been fixed within the last couple of months.
sounds like something that the wvw team doesnt need to be held responsible for. specifically, that is the realm of the balance team. and they seem more interested in pvp, where this is easily also an issue.
time to make the hitbox fully 3d.
So, you’re saying everyone involved in making the DBL and all 4 HoT maps and creating a new class was oblivious to this?
yeah prolly. balance isnt their department.
maybe the proper people with the knowledge or connections dont even play rev in a zerg. maybe it works on the dev client. maybe its been addressed for the next quarterly update but theyre tightlipped as usual, especially if its a thing on the known issue tracker. maybe not.
I would have thought it was the fault of both, class designers for making aoe abilities that don;t work when the topography changes and map designers for not designing maps in accordance with the was the combat engine works. The PvE maps must have similar issues due to their complex topography.
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
I don’t seen why mixed: 1 DBL and 2 ABL doesn’t provide that. And rotation has the severe drawback that players will probably leave the game for the duration that DBL is there.
1) Players do not just all play on one map when they play due to strategic play. They hop maps and use all maps as “one battlefield.” You have to be able to keep all keeps paper on all maps to be able to force your opponents hand as to which targets they choose to save and which ones they have to let go making them have to make hard choices to control the battlefield. You hop from map to map taking out their keeps and controlling the battlefield.
2) In addition, every week whoever’s home BL is the DBL, you are going to have people refusing to play or quit the game due to those that Only play “Home BL Defense”. There are players that is all they actually do every week is defend, scout, recap and upgrade their Home BL. They are the ones that were most vocal about not playing at all if the DBL came back.
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
I don’t seen why mixed: 1 DBL and 2 ABL doesn’t provide that. And rotation has the severe drawback that players will probably leave the game for the duration that DBL is there.
1) Players do not just all play on one map when they play due to strategic play. They hop maps and use all maps as “one battlefield.” You have to be able to keep all keeps paper on all maps to be able to force your opponents hand as to which targets they choose to save and which ones they have to let go making them have to make hard choices to control the battlefield. You hop from map to map taking out their keeps and controlling the battlefield.
2) In addition, every week whoever’s home BL is the DBL, you are going to have people refusing to play or quit the game due to those that Only play “Home BL Defense”. There are players that is all they actually do every week is defend, scout, recap and upgrade their Home BL. They are the ones that were most vocal about not playing at all if the DBL came back.
So you would rather DBL is the only BL for 3 months?
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
I don’t seen why mixed: 1 DBL and 2 ABL doesn’t provide that. And rotation has the severe drawback that players will probably leave the game for the duration that DBL is there.
1) Players do not just all play on one map when they play due to strategic play. They hop maps and use all maps as “one battlefield.” You have to be able to keep all keeps paper on all maps to be able to force your opponents hand as to which targets they choose to save and which ones they have to let go making them have to make hard choices to control the battlefield. You hop from map to map taking out their keeps and controlling the battlefield.
2) In addition, every week whoever’s home BL is the DBL, you are going to have people refusing to play or quit the game due to those that Only play “Home BL Defense”. There are players that is all they actually do every week is defend, scout, recap and upgrade their Home BL. They are the ones that were most vocal about not playing at all if the DBL came back.
So you would rather DBL is the only BL for 3 months?
No I would rather them fix the DBl before putting it back in live game so hopefully no one will leave.
Rotation = Working game part of the time
Mixed BL= Broken game all of the time.
With the rotation, they only have to leave the game for 3 months at a time instead of not come back at all.
With the rotation, they only have to leave the game for 3 months at a time instead of not come back at all.
You are assuming that none of those people are willing to compromise… I think it is a safer bet to count on the fact that majority of the DBL hating minority will be satisfied with mixed borderlands (I would say the previous, no void, poll on the subject is at least some indication to that effect).
Even if that is not the case, having a three month rotation does not guarantee they will in fact return… staying away from the game for three months every three months makes it in my opinion far more likely that they will not come back, because they find new games whereas with mixed borderlands they will have the option to keep playing on the map they love so much without a need to leave in the first place if they can be reasonable and accept a compromise.
With the rotation, they only have to leave the game for 3 months at a time instead of not come back at all.
You are assuming that none of those people are willing to compromise… I think it is a safer bet to count on the fact that majority of the DBL hating minority will be satisfied with mixed borderlands (I would say the previous, no void, poll on the subject is at least some indication to that effect).
Even if that is not the case, having a three month rotation does not guarantee they will in fact return… staying away from the game for three months every three months makes it in my opinion far more likely that they will not come back, because they find new games whereas with mixed borderlands they will have the option to keep playing on the map they love so much without a need to leave in the first place if they can be reasonable and accept a compromise.
No, I am specifically talking about the ones who already said they will leave, and have already left before. I am not actually assuming anything. Multiple guilds have already left before and are going to leave again. Some have already posted that on these forums. I am not making any assumptions, just going by what actually already happened and has been stated by players they are leaving again when it happens again.
Many guilds in this game play Many games together. Guilds go from game to game and play the ones they enjoy most more than the others. My first big guild ( over 2000 members now) was formed on campus at UT Austin. We play here on multiple servers /guilds here and have a section on our forums just for GW2.. Sadly, much of the talk hasn’t been positive for a while and numbers on here have been declining for quite some time. Many smaller guilds just hop from game to game together as well, but yea, it is more about being able to play a game everyone enjoys than what game that actually is. It is fun when we take rivalries from one game to another.
(edited by lil devils x.6071)
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
I don’t seen why mixed: 1 DBL and 2 ABL doesn’t provide that. And rotation has the severe drawback that players will probably leave the game for the duration that DBL is there.
1) Players do not just all play on one map when they play due to strategic play. They hop maps and use all maps as “one battlefield.” You have to be able to keep all keeps paper on all maps to be able to force your opponents hand as to which targets they choose to save and which ones they have to let go making them have to make hard choices to control the battlefield. You hop from map to map taking out their keeps and controlling the battlefield.
2) In addition, every week whoever’s home BL is the DBL, you are going to have people refusing to play or quit the game due to those that Only play “Home BL Defense”. There are players that is all they actually do every week is defend, scout, recap and upgrade their Home BL. They are the ones that were most vocal about not playing at all if the DBL came back.
So you would rather DBL is the only BL for 3 months?
No I would rather them fix the DBl before putting it back in live game so hopefully no one will leave.
Rotation = Working game part of the time
Mixed BL= Broken game all of the time.With the rotation, they only have to leave the game for 3 months at a time instead of not come back at all.
I highly doubt many people will leave the game because DBL is 1 BL in a mixed situation.
Hopefully never…
You know you could at least make an effort to provide something ontopic that adds something of value to the conversation. Anet needs a pit they can dump all these wasteful postings. I mean you took a min to read the thread, take a minute to respond next time. I know the crybaby meta is strong, but its time to man up.
The empty DBL maps spoke quite well for themselves…
Simply because the “Old Guard” refused to learn it, the same guys that complained endlessly about the old Alpine Map.
I want the DBL back but in a rotation so you “comfort zone” guys still have that safe little place.
I don’t seen why mixed: 1 DBL and 2 ABL doesn’t provide that. And rotation has the severe drawback that players will probably leave the game for the duration that DBL is there.
1) Players do not just all play on one map when they play due to strategic play. They hop maps and use all maps as “one battlefield.” You have to be able to keep all keeps paper on all maps to be able to force your opponents hand as to which targets they choose to save and which ones they have to let go making them have to make hard choices to control the battlefield. You hop from map to map taking out their keeps and controlling the battlefield.
2) In addition, every week whoever’s home BL is the DBL, you are going to have people refusing to play or quit the game due to those that Only play “Home BL Defense”. There are players that is all they actually do every week is defend, scout, recap and upgrade their Home BL. They are the ones that were most vocal about not playing at all if the DBL came back.
So you would rather DBL is the only BL for 3 months?
No I would rather them fix the DBl before putting it back in live game so hopefully no one will leave.
Rotation = Working game part of the time
Mixed BL= Broken game all of the time.With the rotation, they only have to leave the game for 3 months at a time instead of not come back at all.
I highly doubt many people will leave the game because DBL is 1 BL in a mixed situation.
I am sure the ones who said they will are going to. Then of course the one’s who want to play with those players will follow.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
I know Rev CoR doesn’t work on kitten near any unlevel ground. Unless that’s been fixed within the last couple of months.
sounds like something that the wvw team doesnt need to be held responsible for. specifically, that is the realm of the balance team. and they seem more interested in pvp, where this is easily also an issue.
time to make the hitbox fully 3d.
So, you’re saying everyone involved in making the DBL and all 4 HoT maps and creating a new class was oblivious to this?
yeah prolly. balance isnt their department.
maybe the proper people with the knowledge or connections dont even play rev in a zerg. maybe it works on the dev client. maybe its been addressed for the next quarterly update but theyre tightlipped as usual, especially if its a thing on the known issue tracker. maybe not.
I would have thought it was the fault of both, class designers for making aoe abilities that don;t work when the topography changes and map designers for not designing maps in accordance with the was the combat engine works. The PvE maps must have similar issues due to their complex topography.
its the fault of whoever designed the skill’kittenbox. they didnt take topography into account, they made the hit box 2d, and they made it end at walls (good) OR when the terrain at a certain elevation ends (bad). had they made it a rectangular prism instead of a line, it could be more resilient, but would prolly need some upgrade in tech on the back end to actually show the ground animations properly.
the map designers have nothing to do with that, they are making the world prettier and more interesting by adding slopes or different levels to play on and doing their jobs exceedingly well, but prolly need to converse with hardcore wvw players and or the wvw dev team about how to incorporate the elements that make a map fun to fight other players on instead of just to wander around and look at.
I like how the most popular thread I make is also the dumbest thread I’ve ever made.
1. Ask stupid question on controversial issue
2. …….
3. ProfitI hope this thread gets tossed into a secret above-ground facility where its boxed and ….. like the arc of the lost convenant. even i have no motivation to finish the joke thats how dumb pointless this thread has become.
LMAO!!!! Well played……well played.
We’re talking about the map structure itself.
There isn’t going to be any intrusive work done… if I recall correctly their methodology for DBL was to make low cost changes with big impact. This was justified by “because it is a live game”.
I’d wager that if we want a larger overhaul, which takes more than a trivial amount of dev time, it will not happen before bulk of the priority changes we voted are well underway, released or close to being released. Even then if they stick to their mantra it would not happen unless there was a poll and it was voted for. Structural overhaul of the map certainly qualifies as a major change.
So, until such a time the kind of changes we will likely see are the sort of stuff we have already seen or already know about.
THAT was why players wanted it to go back to Beta. The topography had to be made playable for all classes in all zones and that isn’t going to happen if it stays in the live game. Now it isn’t going to go back to beta because that was never an option to actually make the map playable for a PvP zone for all classes…
what classes arent playable cuz of topography?
I know Rev CoR doesn’t work on kitten near any unlevel ground. Unless that’s been fixed within the last couple of months.
sounds like something that the wvw team doesnt need to be held responsible for. specifically, that is the realm of the balance team. and they seem more interested in pvp, where this is easily also an issue.
time to make the hitbox fully 3d.
So, you’re saying everyone involved in making the DBL and all 4 HoT maps and creating a new class was oblivious to this?
yeah prolly. balance isnt their department.
maybe the proper people with the knowledge or connections dont even play rev in a zerg. maybe it works on the dev client. maybe its been addressed for the next quarterly update but theyre tightlipped as usual, especially if its a thing on the known issue tracker. maybe not.
I would have thought it was the fault of both, class designers for making aoe abilities that don;t work when the topography changes and map designers for not designing maps in accordance with the was the combat engine works. The PvE maps must have similar issues due to their complex topography.
its the fault of whoever designed the skill’kittenbox. they didnt take topography into account, they made the hit box 2d, and they made it end at walls (good) OR when the terrain at a certain elevation ends (bad). had they made it a rectangular prism instead of a line, it could be more resilient, but would prolly need some upgrade in tech on the back end to actually show the ground animations properly.
the map designers have nothing to do with that, they are making the world prettier and more interesting by adding slopes or different levels to play on and doing their jobs exceedingly well, but prolly need to converse with hardcore wvw players and or the wvw dev team about how to incorporate the elements that make a map fun to fight other players on instead of just to wander around and look at.
That is a problem with how they are designing the maps then. When designing a map for a PvP game mode, they need to think about how every inch of that map works to benefit each of the classes play styles and skills to enhance the player experience and game play. That is how you make a great map rather than just a “meh” map. The " pretty skin" is the after thought for enhancing game play for a PvP game mode. They should bring in the " pretty skin team" after they already have the topography and objectives of the map designed to benefit the game play. The aesthetics should only be added as long as they do not interfere with game play in any way. Otherwise they are designing the map backwards.
(edited by lil devils x.6071)
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