It seems like that opinion because I look at it and think if I play this game mode what am I losing/not gaining? I don’t understand maybe others views on it fully.
The intentions of it were pretty cool; play PvP/WvW there while waiting in queue to get in to your map, but then the playerbase turned it into the abomination it is today where people just run in big PvE karmatrains, level their low level characters and some guilds/people go there to either farm bags from these karmatrains or troll them in other ways.
Instead of WvW, it’s a place to… farm. Farm WvW ranks, farm karma, farm champbags, farm xp, farm lootbags and it is highly rewarding.
^ What above posts mentioned.
Although i do enjoy EotM, especially for roaming and messing with enemy karma trains.
I also like the existens of karma trains for when you actually need 100 badges or some karma, or for leveling up those few “boring” levels on some alt.
I did however, compared to alot, dont mind the lvl 80 geared gankers , it was challenging to survive if you got behind your train, and awsome when you managed to pull/knock that elitist roamer down a ledge to his death etc.
Feel the humiliation, elitist roamer, FEEL it ;D
There’s two schools of thought regarding the dislike of EoTM: 1) “I hate EotM. I don’t like to play it.” and 2) “I hate EotM and wish it was gone.”
The first is reasonable, and the second is not. I am of the former school of thought, in that I don’t play it because I don’t like it, but I would never want it removed because I know that a lot of other players like it. I think a lot of folks on this forum confuse the “I hate EotM” people with the “I hate EotM and everyone that plays it” people.
I can feel pro, if I express hate on a game mode widely accepted as shallow
Before EotM they “hated” random’s, non-TS-player, upleveled, rally-bots, … in WvW. Now that most of them left WvW partially towards EotM, they hate EotM for giving their hate-targets a new home, as they need them in WvW to feel great
EoTM is mostly hated for its map design. Long, long runs and a waypoint that dosent do much for you. So much of the map is a tightrope walk over certain death and another long run that will make you find something else to do. Troll bridges everywhere, confusing events and twisting vertical climbs that verge on jump puzzles.
I dont hate eotm, i really enjoy a map where you can actualy go easy kill all those pvers, even if i dont do that very often, i am not so evil.
Sometime i would like those things to happen in pve too, like my guild go raid on SW and kill all that pve blob farming would be fun^^.
So i neither understand why EOTM is so hated.
There’s two schools of thought regarding the dislike of EoTM: 1) “I hate EotM. I don’t like to play it.” and 2) “I hate EotM and wish it was gone.”
The first is reasonable, and the second is not. I am of the former school of thought, in that I don’t play it because I don’t like it, but I would never want it removed because I know that a lot of other players like it. I think a lot of folks on this forum confuse the “I hate EotM” people with the “I hate EotM and everyone that plays it” people.
Wait so my reasoning isn’t acceptable, because you said so ?
I want it gone because the resources used to create it and abandon it have left an ungodly bad design hole where in a new mode was created that is no longer PvE or WvW. Due to this both gameplay modes have suffered as EoTM has more benefit (karma, gold, leveling, wXP) than the modes in which you should be getting those in naturally.
Instead of fixing the problems plaguing both sides of the game leveling, gold gain (PvE) and Population Balance, wXP gain, rewards general (WvW). They with good intentions gave us a mode to be an overflow map, this overflow is now being abused much like the UD farm abuse and the various failing PvE event abuses.
Sad part is Anet seems okay to let this slide for whatever reason.
EoTM in short is a very big reason why we cannot have nice things. It gets abused and prevents Anet from fixing real issues because it still exist.
EOTM was originally supposed to be a queuing map for those waiting for their WvW queues to pop.
Not only that, it was supposed to be a testing ground for new features which could be added to new WvW maps.
Two things happened which ruined everything:
1) PvE players use the map for easy leveling, karma training, champ bad farming. It is so bad that there is a guild, [VotM] that is dedicated to 3-way Ktrains.
They are a multi server guild with commanders on all 3 sides. They regularly set up Ktrains and make it so that none of the 3 servers ever run into each other.
It is pure PvD.
2) Anet has never given much to WvW, and that includes new maps features or updates. Thanks to that nothing has ever been tested in EotM map because no new maps were ever made! (until HoT single replacement map) But even then the WvW devs did not ask for feedback or anything.
Just try going to EotM and try to do real WvW, and then see all the allies on the map shouting at you to stop ruining their Ktrain.
EotM is just a farce of a map now, where bored WvW guild who are bored of the same old matchups or are dominating their matchup to the point there are no enemies, go to EotM to ruin Ktrains and laugh at all those who complain.
I can’t say I hate EotM, I think as a map it could have been used in a better way and I would like to see some real fighting there but as everybody knows, fighting there occurs rarely and 95% of the time it is pure Ktrain…
Which for me is really weird because if I recall correctly Anet was dead against grinding… hence I have no idea why these Ktrains still exist as Ktraining is grinding at its best, and same applies for Ktrains in borderlands/EB in off-hours… If I understand Anet anti-grinding policy these trains should not exist, but then again, I might be wrong…
EotM could perfectly be a good game mode, IF NOT for the attitude of the people playing it. Right now it’s the homebase of people who are not there for PvP but for easy loot. It’s rather disappointing from the point of view of PvP players that this map is being used for farming instead of using it for what it’s been made.
So I would say the “hate” is not so much directed at the map, but at the way it’s used for a farm.
It replaced the Queensdale champ train for leveling, which wouldn’t be bad if the map was just a PvE champ train map.
The problem is that it is supposed to be an overflow map for WvW. So when people want to play WvW and they are put into Q, they have to go there and be abused if they actually try to play WvW.
The devs wanted to kill champ trains because they thought they were too rewarding and detrimental to gameplay. Remember how vicious it got if a group killed a champ outside of the train in QD? Now that is applied to people trying to WvW in a WvW map.
They really just need to accept that people are going to take the path of least resistance for leveling, make a map for champ trains, drastically reduce the rewards for PvD and increase the rewards for player kills in EotM specifically.
Yes I have used EotM for the Ktrain, just like I used QD back in the day. No I don’t get kittened at people doing WvW and will participate there when it happens. I just want them to accept that some people don’t want to go through all the maps for the third/fourth/fifth time and let people grind out levels/gear in a proper PvE setting.
1- NOBODY plays the objectives because there is no reasons to win
2- People avoid combat on all sides to just take free loot from the AI and level up characters
3- It is not part of the PPT rotation (see point 1)
4- You need a “taxi” to get your whole guild there
5- It is not in the servers map rotation, it goes against the main WvW server system
6- It does not serve it’s initial purpose, since in most tiers you are in queue less than 3 minutes (and it takes 5-10 minutes just to catch up to a commander in EotM since there are no waypoints)
7- If you die you have to run all the way back
8- There is no smooth surface to GvG without getting some canons firing on you
That’s pretty much it…
What’s good about it:
1- The designer did an amazing job
2- Graphically it is outstanding
3- Creatures and buffs are really interesting
One thing that isn’t often mentioned is that WvW is a neglected game mode and EOTM was supposed to be a HUGE beneficial feature for WvWers.
It’s been taken over by people leveling toons instead.
Now, there’s definitely a part of me that thinks this feature IS good for WvWers… keep the uplevels and ktrainers out of WvW! But it stinks to see the one major content drop for WvWers go unused by them.
Karaoke – Guild Leader – [MEGA] Super Mega Happy Fun Time
www.getunicorned.com / northernshiverpeaks.org
Atrociously bad map design basically. The reason why people karma train it is because if everyone played it to win you’d just get 4 hours of staring each other down not doing anything.
Because if I waste my time there I’m not helping my server to win.
Because players go there only for bag and karma farm and they learn
nothing about open world fights so when they get to the proper WvW
maps they s@#k.
Because farming players that don’t know how to PvP is more boring and
braindead than boring and braindead.
I would have no problem with EotM if it was in the normal maps rotation
and had less PvE.As a map it’s not that bad.
-Win a pip,lose a pip,win a pip,lose a pip,lose a pip,
lose a pip,win 2 pips,lose a pip,lose a pip…………..-
-Go go Espartz.-
,it was challenging to survive if you got behind your train, and awsome when you managed to pull/knock that elitist roamer down a ledge to his death etc.
Feel the humiliation, elitist roamer, FEEL it ;D
It’s like you don’t even know what the word elitist means… Probably because you clearly don’t.
I think most people (including myself) dislike the simple fact that Anet considers it wvw, when in reality it is full of people who want to farm karma/loot. These people, who largely don’t care for their home wvw, are earning wxp and loot at a faster rate than people who are playing wvw on a higher difficulty level. I’m fine with people having a place to go level and farm. I’m a bit disappointed that these people are wearing “____ Invader” nameplates that they earned in eotm. When I see somebody with a higher rank now, I assume they spent their time in eotm rather than feeling some respect for someone who spent all that time fighting for their home server. And no, I don’t think they should remove these rewards at this point, just wanted to note that I feel like they took a little bit of prestige away from wvw players by rewarding wxp in eotm.
I must admit though, I have used it to farm rank points, and champ bags. I’ve also used it to wind down a bit from a good raid.
When it was first released, and people actually fought in there it was actually really fun. There were multiple guild groups, and actual open field fighting. The biggest problem I see with the map itself is that there are too many terrain issues, but I guess that’s a L2P issue more than anything else.
The issue most have with EotM is that it has become a farm map, and not a WvW map as it was sold to us as.
Hi I’m a new player, I just discovered WvW/EotM recently and am personally really loving it. Perhaps its not what it was created to be or some people hate it for whatever reasons, but for me it has been a nice break from the usual levelling. I love running around in a huge group, it feels really epic. Slowly I have learnt a little about the siege weapons, supplies and building/repairing things and I feel that I still have a lot to learn. So I’m having good fun with it.
If I had to talk about downsides it would be in that in my very short time playing EotM, I haven’t had many encounters against players. Mostly we run around and do the pve (kill x boss) and then every now and then an enemy team shows up behind us and destroys everyone. It would be more fun if there were a few more battles between players. I don’t know though, just a noobs input xD
I hadn’t really been to EOTM since launch, but there was something fun about getting a few guildies together (including a couple on different servers who can’t WvW with us but happen to be the same color) and yoloing into a group of 20-30 uplevels seeing how many we can take out before we go.
We might make it a regular thing. Has anybody ever tried this with Lava Tomb ele?
Karaoke – Guild Leader – [MEGA] Super Mega Happy Fun Time
www.getunicorned.com / northernshiverpeaks.org
You can blame eotm devolving into a giant ktrain mess on the player base, but ktraining provides all the shinies. There is still no incentive to defend and winning the match get you nothing. Its the whole path of least resistance thing.
I personally love it, I just hate the whole mind set of:
“This was made for low levels only gtfo”
or
“why did you kill me? this is meant for low levels only”
Former PvP Forum Specialist 2015-2016
Fort Aspenwood
I’d still argue that the biggest fail of EotM is the fact that it builds absolutely zero sense of teamwork, belonging or “nationality” to a server and each other for the players. Regular WvW manages to keep its sincerity because the players have a home server to feel proud of, to fight for and form a tight community around.
EotM, with its system of throwing everyone into a mix creates nothing for players to actually care for, so it turns into a mindless farm. You know no one around you, the game only lasts a few hours and you’ll have new, unknown and random “team mates” soon again. Why the kitten would anyone do anything but karmatrain in that environment?
WvW relies on server communities. Take that away and you have mindless, meaningless PvE with PvP aspects that no one is gonna bother with no matter how well the map is designed.
I’d still argue that the biggest fail of EotM is the fact that it builds absolutely zero sense of teamwork, belonging or “nationality” to a server and each other for the players. Regular WvW manages to keep its sincerity because the players have a home server to feel proud of, to fight for and form a tight community around. EotM, with its system of throwing everyone into a mix creates nothing for players to actually care for, so it turns into a mindless farm.
To my understanding, EOTM was meant to be a playable queue for players to mess around and earn wvw stuff while they wait. Since it’s a queue with multiple over flow maps, it would make no logical sense to have it award anything of any major importance to normal wvw.
If anything, I do wonder how playable it would be if the Queues were restricted to your current match ups only. But, I think that would make the map unplayable for servers like Kaineng and other low tier servers who have a hard time keeping a queue on EB or their BL.
Maybe remove karma from event completion?
or Restrict it down to tiers?
Former PvP Forum Specialist 2015-2016
Fort Aspenwood
Remove rewards → Farmers leave to farm something else (they are crazy with this, see OS farming or any PvE event they farmed) → WvWers will slowly play eotm as it was meant to be played
Also a reason why WvW can never have too good rewards
Remove rewards -> Farmers leave to farm something else (they are crazy with this, see OS farming or any PvE event they farmed) -> WvWers will slowly play eotm as it was meant to be played
Also a reason why WvW can never have too good rewards
There does need to be some rewards or it becomes pointless.
Maybe get rid of Karma and lower the EXP obtained by 33%
So the only things of value that are earned are random drops, badges of honor and WXP.
Former PvP Forum Specialist 2015-2016
Fort Aspenwood
Instead of removing the karma or badges, why not add the “player kills” to you servers score? Give the WvW players a reason to fight in EOTM. Right now, it only dilutes your server and doesn’t add any benefit.
Tootsie Popa | level 80 Guardian/Dragonhunter
[ODIN] [roam] Tarnished Coast
“The average player believes they are better than the average player”.
To my understanding, EOTM was meant to be a playable queue for players to mess around and earn wvw stuff while they wait. Since it’s a queue with multiple over flow maps, it would make no logical sense to have it award anything of any major importance to normal wvw.
If anything, I do wonder how playable it would be if the Queues were restricted to your current match ups only. But, I think that would make the map unplayable for servers like Kaineng and other low tier servers who have a hard time keeping a queue on EB or their BL.
Maybe remove karma from event completion?
or Restrict it down to tiers?
It might very well have been the idea. As a random overflow it does work as intended, I suppose. I agree that changing it to server specific wouldn’t be a good idea from a population perspective either, we simply don’t have the playerbase to support that. Not even in the top tiers, honestly.
I was replying to why it ‘fails’ as a WvW map. I don’t fully agree that it has to to with players or the map itself, but rather with human psychology, making the map a bit of a catch 22 for Anet. We want a global overflow queue for WvW, but we also – as humans – want it to be ‘national’ and persistant enough to build a community to care for enough to not simply karmatrain the map while semi-afk. It just doesn’t work.
Changing rewards is tricky too. Take away from EotM and the farmers might go back to invading regular WvW because it will once again be more profitabe. Removing all PvE rewards from the entire WvW mode and replace it with something more akin to PvP rewards maybe? None of the serious WvW:ers give a rats about the champ bags and karma anyway, it’s just a nice little bonus we’ve come to live with. Making that little bonus something that benefits WvW more than PvE could perhaps help with the farm issue.
To me it makes more sense too. Why am I gaining 99% PvE loot playing 99% WvW? Hell, throw me more siege, skins, traps or whatever you want instead, I’d have more use for it. Elaborate/rework the badge system and I wouldn’t even need gold for gear.
Instead of removing the karma or badges, why not add the “player kills” to you servers score? Give the WvW players a reason to fight in EOTM. Right now, it only dilutes your server and doesn’t add any benefit.
It would change the equilibrium. There would be more players who come in to kill, leading to less players karmatraining because of the hassle. That would lead to some WvWers leaving (as there’s less to kill).
Overall, the main effect would be less people in EOTM. I think.
Karaoke – Guild Leader – [MEGA] Super Mega Happy Fun Time
www.getunicorned.com / northernshiverpeaks.org
you get some pretty incredible whispers when you and a pal spawn camp them. EotM is for goofing off, and ktraining. why remove it? it’s here and it’s popular, don’t go there if you don’t like it. I hate fractals and LS, but guess what I do buddy? oh yeah, I don’t play them and don’t make forum posts asking for them to be removed.
. Engi & Warr . Beta > 2017 Death of PvP
currently a Boyfriend main :P Waiting To ReRoll Mystic & Forget About Tyria
