Guild Wars 2

My WvW guild uses rangers…
But I wish I could bring them more group utilities

Rangers can roam though http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsl_gOAPqxc

SkylightMoon.1980:

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Rangers are hated for two main reasons:
They draw the worst community of players
and because they have drawn the worst community from day one, people have become used to this assumption therefore if you’re a Ranger you’re automatically bad/useless even if that’s not always the case (although 99% of the time it is.)

I disagree completely that anything the Ranger can do another profession can do better. Although yes, Rangers are lacking in some key areas, that doesn’t make them useless it just means the player behind them has to learn not to neglect the weaknesses and to overcome them.
I have fought many people on my Ranger 1v1 as well as 1v2 and come out the victor. Although it can be a struggle where as on a Warrior or Thief it might not, that doesn’t mean the victory was in vain. I didn’t spam a single attack (Earthshaker/Heartseeker) and I didn’t either facetank everything or spend 90% of my time in stealth where I’m virtually (let me stress virtually for those who play Thief and will freak out to defend this) invincible because all they need to do is side-step attacks and their opponents would be none the wiser.
As a Ranger you need to be constantly aware of your position. And it should be the main thing on your mind when in combat.
Position
If you’re not paying attention to where you’re standing you’re going to get facerolled. And this is why so many Rangers get spiked within 5 seconds of combat. When in ZvZ, duels or roaming, or what ever form of battle I’m in as I enjoy all roles in WvW, I’m always thinking about where I’m standing or where the best place to stand would be. They should be treated like a sniper not a heavy machine-gunner. If I get on a nice hill when zergs clash I can pick people off all day long. Just yesterday in blue keep I was standing on the dome above lord and with max range when the other server broke through I sat up there just watching bags pile around my feet. 3.5k + at make range with Long Range Shot on a squishy enemy… Lol. One Rapid Fire with every arrow hitting, which uninturruped from a good position isn’t hard to pull off, can take half someones health bar out easily.

Ranger’s aren’t useless… If you’re going to war you’re going to want one or two snipers with you to pick off the stragglers. The people behind the Rangers are the useless ones… They’re the ones standing with people 5 feet infront of them and they’re not even looking down their scope.

So although yes; they are lacking in certain areas.
Yes if there are too many in a group they will become more of a burden than a help.
And yes the majority of them are bad players. -
It doesn’t mean they’re all useless it just means you need to try a bit harder to recognize which ones are using the profession properly.

And for the record, if what a Ranger can do any other profession can do better… I feel sorry for all the Longbow Warriors I’ve killed pretending to be a Ranger.

The first part is especially true. A lot of wvw people have been told that rangers are poo, as pve people say, and if you keep repeating it enough everyone else seems to believe it too. Its funny how ive seen some prestigious guilds on here still make somewhat ignorant comments about the status of rangers. Theyve just been used to the meta of not using rangers, and won’t change.

This is ridiculous. Necromancers used to be as much a joke as rangers. Patch buffed necromancers and then they instantly became established and recognized for their value.

The meta changes with every balance patch. Ranger is one of the most popular classes. People want to play rangers and they will be thrilled to dust them off when they’re as viable as other options.

SkylightMoon.1980:

Ragnar.4257:

How many times does it need to be said?

No

A

O

E

.

So? Necro’s dont have a ton of aoe? The best aoe they have are wells which have a super long cooldown, and are hard to land. You’re lucky if a melee train sits in them for 3 seconds. Marks are not meant for damage but for utilities, chill, fear, transfer conditions. Again, a lot of their good damage comes from lifeblasting which is single target but also piercing.

Wow just wow.

Rangers are the best class in the game for rallying enemy players.

Straegen.2938:

Just some of the Ranger hate reasons

• They have no decent stability aside from an elite that is painfully obvious
• Their pets steal boons
• Melee players cannot stand LB Rangers because apparently none of them know when to NOT use knockback
• Pets cannot dodge AoE so they get blown up quick in skirmish or larger fights
• Pets are generally considered enemy cloaking devices by thieves
• Their pets give away their location most of the time

Ultimately rangers are just meh when played well and a disaster with anything less than solid player skill.

These are the only legitimate issues, The rest are not-so-good but works ok. Not that they shouldnt buff those areas, they should, especially the elite and signet activation time needs to be removed. Condition cleanse, few actives (1 trait, 3 active sources, 2 passive sources) and some passives the actives need a serious buff though.

You should differentiate between what works and what is broken. Yes some parts of rangers are utterly broken, in the end, most of the ranger stuff is all but quality of life issues and some things are just illogical when looking at the bigger picture, but most of it works. Quirky, maybe, but it works.
When taking a ranger from PvE to WvW its like going from a tricycle to a bicycle without anyone to help you.

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

Rangers are the best class in the game for rallying enemy players.

actually no, the best rallybots are eles and PvE Heroes with full zerker armor and zero sustain.

Runty Choir.4893:

Rangers can roam though http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsl_gOAPqxc

Here is what this video is showing me… either this server bracket is full of the worst roamers I have seen or the player clipped together fights against low skill players leaving any meaningful fight out. Not a single fight in that video was against someone that was even moderately decent. At least Yishi and similar players highlighting class play make something useful by showing strong fighters. IMO a vanity video.

Umad.7528:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Ragnar.4257:

How many times does it need to be said?

No

A

O

E

.

So? Necro’s dont have a ton of aoe? The best aoe they have are wells which have a super long cooldown, and are hard to land. You’re lucky if a melee train sits in them for 3 seconds. Marks are not meant for damage but for utilities, chill, fear, transfer conditions. Again, a lot of their good damage comes from lifeblasting which is single target but also piercing.

Wow just wow.

Its the truth.

SkylightMoon.1980:

So? Necro’s dont have a ton of aoe? The best aoe they have are wells which have a super long cooldown, and are hard to land. You’re lucky if a melee train sits in them for 3 seconds. Marks are not meant for damage but for utilities, chill, fear, transfer conditions. Again, a lot of their good damage comes from lifeblasting which is single target but also piercing.

Epidemic and Plague Form are both AoEs that are extremely powerful when used properly. Wells and Marks are also very powerful AoE just not big damagers.

Prysin.8542:

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

Rangers are the best class in the game for rallying enemy players.

actually no, the best rallybots are eles and PvE Heroes with full zerker armor and zero sustain.

D/D ele duelists are still very difficult to bring down and certainly no rally bots. Zerk is fine in roaming with the right class, build and skill. Zerk warriors and thieves do very well roaming. I will agree in most instances full zerk has little to no place in group fights.

Zenith.6403:

ParaldaWind.4523:

It’s been explained a million times. Anything a ranger can do another class can do better.

- Do tell me what other class can comfortably go full offensive stats on gear and deliver damage spikes from 1500 range.

Engineer Grenades. Anything rangers can do another class can do it better.

TreyOfBlades.3162:

Zenith.6403:

ParaldaWind.4523:

It’s been explained a million times. Anything a ranger can do another class can do better.

- Do tell me what other class can comfortably go full offensive stats on gear and deliver damage spikes from 1500 range.

Engineer Grenades. Anything rangers can do another class can do it better.

Add Rifle warrior to that list. Rifle built warriors are the hardest hitting spike ranged class in the game. They also can go full zerk AND still have decent defense.

Straegen.2938:

SkylightMoon.1980:

So? Necro’s dont have a ton of aoe? The best aoe they have are wells which have a super long cooldown, and are hard to land. You’re lucky if a melee train sits in them for 3 seconds. Marks are not meant for damage but for utilities, chill, fear, transfer conditions. Again, a lot of their good damage comes from lifeblasting which is single target but also piercing.

Epidemic and Plague Form are both AoEs that are extremely powerful when used properly. Wells and Marks are also very powerful AoE just not big damagers.

Prysin.8542:

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

Rangers are the best class in the game for rallying enemy players.

actually no, the best rallybots are eles and PvE Heroes with full zerker armor and zero sustain.

D/D ele duelists are still very difficult to bring down and certainly no rally bots. Zerk is fine in roaming with the right class, build and skill. Zerk warriors and thieves do very well roaming. I will agree in most instances full zerk has little to no place in group fights.

Epidemic is pretty useless since its just 1 bar of conditions that arnt pulsed, and will probably be quickly removed. Plague form however is really useful because of the blindness that pulses. However its not damage, and I was arguing that necros dont have a lot of good aoe damage skills. That the ones they do have(wells) are extremely limited.

Straegen.2938:

Runty Choir.4893:

Rangers can roam though http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsl_gOAPqxc

Here is what this video is showing me… either this server bracket is full of the worst roamers I have seen or the player clipped together fights against low skill players leaving any meaningful fight out. Not a single fight in that video was against someone that was even moderately decent. At least Yishi and similar players highlighting class play make something useful by showing strong fighters. IMO a vanity video.

Actually the entire video was filmed in roughly a hour and as far as im aware thats every fight he got in. Check the timestamp.

Straegen.2938:

TreyOfBlades.3162:

Zenith.6403:

ParaldaWind.4523:

It’s been explained a million times. Anything a ranger can do another class can do better.

- Do tell me what other class can comfortably go full offensive stats on gear and deliver damage spikes from 1500 range.

Engineer Grenades. Anything rangers can do another class can do it better.

Add Rifle warrior to that list. Rifle built warriors are the hardest hitting spike ranged class in the game. They also can go full zerk AND still have decent defense.

I still prefer engineers for groups because rangers are single target while grenades are AoE

Tongku.5326:

If anyone insists that rangers are good in high end of WvW I have a challenge for them as follows:

Make 2 20 man teams

Team 1:
5 warriors, 5 guards
10 more of any mix of the following classes: Warrior, Guard, Ele, Necro

Team 2:
20 Rangers

The challenge is to have the 2 teams fight in open field combat at least 10 rounds, preferrably more, not necessarily on the same day. Breaks for switching traits, gear, utility skills etc. must be allowed every round.

Record videos of these battles, watch them. You will understand why rangers are left behind when recruiting for serious WvW.

This is as stupid a suggestion as one can get. You’re asking 1 class to fight against all other classes? For equal representation, just have 20 warriors VS 20 rangers, or 20 guards VS 20 rangers etc. would make more sense.

SkylightMoon.1980:

Epidemic is pretty useless since its just 1 bar of conditions that arnt pulsed, and will probably be quickly removed. Plague form however is really useful because of the blindness that pulses. However its not damage, and I was arguing that necros dont have a lot of good aoe damage skills. That the ones they do have(wells) are extremely limited.

Epidemic can straight up murder an entire group of players if they aren’t running very strong condition removal. It transfers ALL conditions from an enemy to all other enemies in a 1200 range. So drop SoS, Corrupt Boon then Epidemic and watch a bunch of players start scrambling. Dhuumfire builds can also wreck poor condition removal groups with Epidemic. Plague drops poison and bleeds in addition to the other conditions.

Runty Choir.4893:

Actually the entire video was filmed in roughly a hour and as far as im aware thats every fight he got in. Check the timestamp.

Those roamers were horrible… I mean really bad. After checking the video the last half is chopped up. It may all be from the same run but it starts at 12:20 then jumps to 11 then jumps to 13 then back to near 12. At any rate, an example of class ability is only as good as the opponents the class is facing. Watch a Yishi video for a good example.

TreyOfBlades.3162:

I still prefer engineers for groups because rangers are single target while grenades are AoE

I prefer the engineer as well but I like the bomb builds better. One of the best roamers I have ever run up against was a Choo engi. Kill Shot warriors are sniping machines which is why I included it in the list. I constantly have to watch the edge of fights for those guys picking people off. They are a top priority in call targeting for our skirmish group.

Noobie.1073:

This is as stupid a suggestion as one can get. You’re asking 1 class to fight against all other classes? For equal representation, just have 20 warriors VS 20 rangers, or 20 guards VS 20 rangers etc. would make more sense.

Nobody would want to see a GW2 reenactment of the Super Bowl with the Rangers (Broncos) playing the Warriors (Seattle).

Straegen.2938:

Noobie.1073:

This is as stupid a suggestion as one can get. You’re asking 1 class to fight against all other classes? For equal representation, just have 20 warriors VS 20 rangers, or 20 guards VS 20 rangers etc. would make more sense.

Nobody would want to see a GW2 reenactment of the Super Bowl with the Rangers (Broncos) playing the Warriors (Seattle).

20 rangers vs 20 warriors would probably end in the ranger’s favour simply due to fields and support. Sure ranger may not have the best support, but it’s better than a warrior’s simply because of healing spring. This is still a bad comparison however, you will never have 20 set classes going against another 20. Although if that were to happen, engi and ranger would probably fight for first place simply because they can do everything.

SkylightMoon.1980:

Umad.7528:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Ragnar.4257:

How many times does it need to be said?

No

A

O

E

.

So? Necro’s dont have a ton of aoe? The best aoe they have are wells which have a super long cooldown, and are hard to land. You’re lucky if a melee train sits in them for 3 seconds. Marks are not meant for damage but for utilities, chill, fear, transfer conditions. Again, a lot of their good damage comes from lifeblasting which is single target but also piercing.

Wow just wow.

Its the truth.

Sure if you say so:)

warriorjrd.8695:

20 rangers vs 20 warriors would probably end in the ranger’s favour simply due to fields and support. Sure ranger may not have the best support, but it’s better than a warrior’s simply because of healing spring. This is still a bad comparison however, you will never have 20 set classes going against another 20. Although if that were to happen, engi and ranger would probably fight for first place simply because they can do everything.

Non-Signet Rangers only have one native stability and it is on a LONG cool down. A pack of rangers is a dinner bell for Hammer warriors.

Warriors have WAY better support than Rangers… it isn’t even close. Shout warriors group heal, remove conditions, convert conditions to boons, have a MASSIVE amount of control, are effectively immune to immobilize, best passive healing in the game, banner group rez, stack might, they don’t have to stop for healing, come to the fight with over 30k HP and nearly 4k armor. Their sustained DPS is impressive as well. There is a reason the backbone of almost every group of players is the Warrior and Guardian.

I like playing my ranger. I’m also not a useless fool with my ranger, but I agree the pets are garbage. The delay and subsequent failure of pet skills drives me nuts, they should just be insta-cast.
I’m right up there in the front with the warriors and guards, crippling and dropping frost traps on the enemy allowing the hammers to bring the pain on even more poor souls.

Just because I am comfortable on my ranger doesn’t mean I don’t think other classes are better suited to WvW though… Rangers definitely need to be fixed. They need a niche that only they can fill, that is useful to the majority. Personally, a buff to their CC would suffice for me, we already have enough big damage dealing classes.

Just my $0.02

Straegen.2938:

warriorjrd.8695:

20 rangers vs 20 warriors would probably end in the ranger’s favour simply due to fields and support. Sure ranger may not have the best support, but it’s better than a warrior’s simply because of healing spring. This is still a bad comparison however, you will never have 20 set classes going against another 20. Although if that were to happen, engi and ranger would probably fight for first place simply because they can do everything.

Non-Signet Rangers only have one native stability and it is on a LONG cool down. A pack of rangers is a dinner bell for Hammer warriors.

Warriors have WAY better support than Rangers… it isn’t even close. Shout warriors group heal, remove conditions, convert conditions to boons, have a MASSIVE amount of control, are effectively immune to immobilize, best passive healing in the game, banner group rez, stack might, they don’t have to stop for healing, come to the fight with over 30k HP and nearly 4k armor. Their sustained DPS is impressive as well. There is a reason the backbone of almost every group of players is the Warrior and Guardian.

Yup. As a ranger…. I get a little jealous… Then I hop onto my warrior

Manbo.5403:

Yup. As a ranger…. I get a little jealous… Then I hop onto my warrior

I am a former Ranger player myself. I enjoyed it in PvE and it is still one of the hardest classes to bring down in that environment, but after playing every other class to 80 the Ranger just needs a lot of ANet love in WvW.

Prior to the shortbow and pet damage nerfs, the Ranger could wreck players. Unfortunately Anet gutted two of the better Ranger damagers and didn’t bump anything up to replace them.

Straegen.2938:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Epidemic is pretty useless since its just 1 bar of conditions that arnt pulsed, and will probably be quickly removed. Plague form however is really useful because of the blindness that pulses. However its not damage, and I was arguing that necros dont have a lot of good aoe damage skills. That the ones they do have(wells) are extremely limited.

Epidemic can straight up murder an entire group of players if they aren’t running very strong condition removal. It transfers ALL conditions from an enemy to all other enemies in a 1200 range. So drop SoS, Corrupt Boon then Epidemic and watch a bunch of players start scrambling. Dhuumfire builds can also wreck poor condition removal groups with Epidemic. Plague drops poison and bleeds in addition to the other conditions.

Epi is countered by Signet of Renewal, Rune of Lyssa, Guardians, Eles if above 90% HP and Diamondskin.

Man there’s a ranger on maguuma named tanbin who is kittening amazing at roaming and duels dunno what people are talking about. id like a good ranger in a wvw roaming group, but yea in a gvg i can see them not being really useful at all compared to warrior/guardian/ele

Bios.1398:

Man there’s a ranger on maguuma named tanbin who is kittening amazing at roaming and duels dunno what people are talking about. id like a good ranger in a wvw roaming group, but yea in a gvg i can see them not being really useful at all compared to warrior/guardian/ele

Yea but tanbin is also one of the best rangers in the entire game and even he dies if focused heavily, thats the problem , if rangers get focused they can get away but not alot of mitigation overall so they become #1 targets immediately in small battles/gvg

Prysin.8542:

Straegen.2938:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Epidemic is pretty useless since its just 1 bar of conditions that arnt pulsed, and will probably be quickly removed. Plague form however is really useful because of the blindness that pulses. However its not damage, and I was arguing that necros dont have a lot of good aoe damage skills. That the ones they do have(wells) are extremely limited.

Epidemic can straight up murder an entire group of players if they aren’t running very strong condition removal. It transfers ALL conditions from an enemy to all other enemies in a 1200 range. So drop SoS, Corrupt Boon then Epidemic and watch a bunch of players start scrambling. Dhuumfire builds can also wreck poor condition removal groups with Epidemic. Plague drops poison and bleeds in addition to the other conditions.

Epi is countered by Signet of Renewal, Rune of Lyssa, Guardians, Eles if above 90% HP and Diamondskin.

Briefly, so as not to venture off topic. Epidemic, and conditions in general, are countered by the things you mention. However, relatively few people mitigate condition damage particularly well in WvW. And those that do are able to do less damage and survive less direct damage because of it. Epidemic is an extremely useful skill if used appropriately.

Straegen.2938:

warriorjrd.8695:

20 rangers vs 20 warriors would probably end in the ranger’s favour simply due to fields and support. Sure ranger may not have the best support, but it’s better than a warrior’s simply because of healing spring. This is still a bad comparison however, you will never have 20 set classes going against another 20. Although if that were to happen, engi and ranger would probably fight for first place simply because they can do everything.

Non-Signet Rangers only have one native stability and it is on a LONG cool down. A pack of rangers is a dinner bell for Hammer warriors.

Warriors have WAY better support than Rangers… it isn’t even close. Shout warriors group heal, remove conditions, convert conditions to boons, have a MASSIVE amount of control, are effectively immune to immobilize, best passive healing in the game, banner group rez, stack might, they don’t have to stop for healing, come to the fight with over 30k HP and nearly 4k armor. Their sustained DPS is impressive as well. There is a reason the backbone of almost every group of players is the Warrior and Guardian.

Warriors, even IF they spec of it, has 300hp/s less then a ranger that specs for passive heal. So well, shush. You got zero knowledge of rangers, and are extremely biased towards warriors.

Warriors aren’t the only ones with good shouts, albeit they are by far better then ranger shouts, that’s for sure.

Even with Melandru, Lemongrass, Dogged March and Cleansing Ire, 20v20 Warrior v Ranger, the rangers can provide more immob, cripple, chill, bleeds, burning and poison then the warriors can handle. This is not a “maybe”, it is a simple fact.
5x trap rangers, 10x shout+spirit bunkers, 5x Celestial BM CC builds and your warrior army aint moving one frikkin inch. Sure if the ranger zerg makes a mistake and don’t pay attention, they can get wiped, but for the warriors to win, the ranger side must commit several grave mistakes. Also, in the case of rangers. its more like 20v30. Because once you factor in pets and their DPS/Utility, you get more utility then most professions. Including, but not limited to;
Large poison fields, large AOE chill cripple immob healing regeneration fury protection. Add in say 5x Stone spirit, 5x Sun spirit and you got AOE blind spam all over the place. Add say 5 water spirits and you got passive heal on attack (about 1k) + 10k burst AOE heal (14k for the spirit users themselves). 4 Spirit of Nature and you got condition cleanse, 320hps passive healing, reviving downed players. Add in the fact that with 10x shout rangers, if all use apoth+dire bunkers, they can all apply around 290hp/tick regen permanently. Meaning the WHOLE ranger zerg will have around 510hps passive heal. That is more then a normal warrior build, infact, the warrior gotta have 600 healing power to get that passive, because of how the current warrior meta is (burn adren, dont save it).

If 5 of 20 rangers carry a warhorn and a drake (marsh drake applies bouncing poison) you got 10x blasts. Coupled with 10 firefields, and 15 waterfields.

I expect that celestial CC builds use Longbow + krytan and ice wolf alongside sword + axe for evades and projectile reflection, that reflection will send the warriors own combustion shot/arcing arrow/pin down back in their own face. Trap rangers is Sword+Torch and Axe+Dagger. Shout-spirit bunkers is Sword+warhorn and greatsword.

In the end, if rangers spec for it, and group together, they bring more to a table then warriors. The downside to rangers is that you have to have many of them for their group utilities to shine in a normal zerg, too many for the meta to allow it to happen. Same with venomshare thieves. You need quite a few to make a reasonable difference. However if we go by the notion of a mixed zerg, then i’d take 15 trap rangers and 5 venomshare+boonsteal thieves vs 20 GWEN groups any day. The amount of immobilize, stun, boon ripping (all your stability belongs to us) poison, torment, chill, burning, bleeding, cripple, weakness and crit damage is simply going to overwhelm any party not running 20 seconds + of immunity skills.

Oh and Straegen, do you know sanduskel?

Prysin.8542:

Warriors, even IF they spec of it, has 300hp/s less then a ranger that specs for passive heal. So well, shush. You got zero knowledge of rangers, and are extremely biased towards warriors.

Many warriors do not actually have to use an activated skill to heal. Nothing… zero… they can just stand there and heal… all the time… no cool downs. I think you are referencing Troll Ungent which is an ACTIVATED heal and not passive. So unless the Ranger has some magic passive healing skill that is better than the Warriors signet… then my point stands and you are in fact quite wrong. If we are talking about peak healing, nothing beats a Guardian.

As for Rangers holding any warrior in place with immobilization especially in a group is laughable. You left out some pretty important Warrior abilities including Charge which is up every 12s and is a GROUP immobilize remover, Mobile Strikes and the myriad of condition removal a warrior has at his disposal. Unless you have condition duration food running they can easily attain a passive 98% immobilization reduction.

Lastly, I have clocked over 400 hours on a Ranger most of it in WvW. I also have all classes to level 80 and fully geared with 2.2k hours most of in WvW so I have seen both sides of this class. If that isn’t enough, posts like this make my point. Few want a Ranger around in WvW. They are almost always a hindrance more than a help. It isn’t the players fault but a poor WvW design of the Ranger.

I just love how everyone complaining about how bad rangers are never actually play as rangers. the Ranger class can be good, but due to the devs absolutely screwing the class over, there is no real knowledge about the class.

zoidberg.7801:

I just love how everyone complaining about how bad rangers are never actually play as rangers. the Ranger class can be good, but due to the devs absolutely screwing the class over, there is no real knowledge about the class.

The absolute best Ranger builds in the hands of extremely skilled players are still not awe inspiring. Take a really skilled player that plays a Ranger and give him a Warrior, Mesmer, Thief, etc and he will be MUCH harder to beat. This isn’t a question of player skill, it is a question of poor WvW design mechanics on the Ranger class. I have well over 10k WvW kills from my Ranger and more than 40k on my other classes but the pet and SB nerfs drove me off the Ranger class. Didn’t take long to realize I can be more effective with any other class in WvW and so can other Rangers.

Ranger is bad, ranger pet sucks, ranger doesnt support, ranger cant damage, ranger cant control, ranger cant eat damage. Only good skill is water field which is your heal (bad, eles give it easier) and entangling roots (long cd, warrior does it with 10x less cd . ). You can always say “you just gotta learn to play ranger”, no its wrong. Ranger will never be viable for <5 man groups, unless they revamp the class and remove their pets and give more powers for the class itself.

Kaiser.9873:

Personally I would like to see a total revamp of Rangers. Take the pets away, buff the Ranger itself, and make them more of an Archer or Skirmisher type. That would eliminate much of the complaint about pet AI, and allow Rangers to build themselves to be more useful.

Couldn’t agree more. Ranger is a broken pvp class and is only really viable in pve. In a nutshell, rangers were designed with spvp balance in mind, not wvw balance (although the fact that rangers are extremely rare in spvp would imply they are not well-balanced there either). Pets are borderline useless and should be optional like necro minions.

zoidberg.7801:

I just love how everyone complaining about how bad rangers are never actually play as rangers. the Ranger class can be good, but due to the devs absolutely screwing the class over, there is no real knowledge about the class.

I played ranger and engi in wvw for the first 6 months of GW2 and felt like I was an average player at best. Then I started playing my warrior and never looked back. I was amazed at how much more damage I could do and still be more survivable. Now I unconsciously target rangers in wvw because I know they are easy kills (unless they are bunker rangers in which case it takes to long).

Zweet Kont.4278:

Haralin.1473:

No leather wearing class is wanted in a zerg fight no zerg wants engis, rangers or thiefs in it zerg.

These classes are good at roaming or 5vs5 but not in zerg fights. Play a warrior and look how easy it is to survive in a zerg compared to the 3 leather classes and do also good damage or cc. I have a engi and a warrior in zerg warrior is way better than the engi.

Engi’s are hard to play; but once mastered an engi can be a pain in the kitten , and a great help to your team.

Yeah, my engie helped keep an enemy zerg from taking a camp by buying enough time and doing enough damage that the rest of the people that wp’ed back could help finish them off. Engies are beasts in zerg play.

Its not that Rangers are bad, there are just better options when zerging.

Straegen.2938:

Prysin.8542:

Warriors, even IF they spec of it, has 300hp/s less then a ranger that specs for passive heal. So well, shush. You got zero knowledge of rangers, and are extremely biased towards warriors.

Many warriors do not actually have to use an activated skill to heal. Nothing… zero… they can just stand there and heal… all the time… no cool downs. I think you are referencing Troll Ungent which is an ACTIVATED heal and not passive. So unless the Ranger has some magic passive healing skill that is better than the Warriors signet… then my point stands and you are in fact quite wrong. If we are talking about peak healing, nothing beats a Guardian.

As for Rangers holding any warrior in place with immobilization especially in a group is laughable. You left out some pretty important Warrior abilities including Charge which is up every 12s and is a GROUP immobilize remover, Mobile Strikes and the myriad of condition removal a warrior has at his disposal. Unless you have condition duration food running they can easily attain a passive 98% immobilization reduction.

Lastly, I have clocked over 400 hours on a Ranger most of it in WvW. I also have all classes to level 80 and fully geared with 2.2k hours most of in WvW so I have seen both sides of this class. If that isn’t enough, posts like this make my point. Few want a Ranger around in WvW. They are almost always a hindrance more than a help. It isn’t the players fault but a poor WvW design of the Ranger.

If i add in troll ungent over a time period of 60 seconds, thats like 3-400 HPS.
Oh and i NEVER use TU, i prefer burst heal over a short duration sustained heal.

In my guild you get kicked if you are seen getting stomped by a Ranger in WvW. That’s how bad they are. So far nobody has fallen to one. The best ranger I have met in WvW gave me a stale mate, I couldn’t kill him but he never got my health down past 70%.

To all you Ranger folk, quit trying to defend your profession. Instead, pressure the Devs to fix you horribly broken class.

Straegen.2938:

warriorjrd.8695:

20 rangers vs 20 warriors would probably end in the ranger’s favour simply due to fields and support. Sure ranger may not have the best support, but it’s better than a warrior’s simply because of healing spring. This is still a bad comparison however, you will never have 20 set classes going against another 20. Although if that were to happen, engi and ranger would probably fight for first place simply because they can do everything.

Non-Signet Rangers only have one native stability and it is on a LONG cool down. A pack of rangers is a dinner bell for Hammer warriors.

Warriors have WAY better support than Rangers… it isn’t even close. Shout warriors group heal, remove conditions, convert conditions to boons, have a MASSIVE amount of control, are effectively immune to immobilize, best passive healing in the game, banner group rez, stack might, they don’t have to stop for healing, come to the fight with over 30k HP and nearly 4k armor. Their sustained DPS is impressive as well. There is a reason the backbone of almost every group of players is the Warrior and Guardian.

That’s great and all, but you would have nothing to sustain yourself long run, relying on shout heals will only simply delay the inevitable. You WILL need that condi cleanse if a few trap rangers were running in the mix, which would sacrifice melandru runes, meaning you are no longer nearly immune to cripple/chill/immob.

If it was 20 rangers by themselves you would have signets in the front which if traited correctly, don’t have an issue with stability. Spirit rangers in the back providing the passive buffs will mean an extremely high uptime of protection due to dodge rolls and spirit of stone. Little known fact, but ranger’s elite spirit acts as a war banner too.

As mentioned before trap rangers would provide excellent condition support forcing you to be cleansing constantly or pay the price. A shout ranger can apply very high uptime of regen, and when in conjunction of decent healing power and signet of the wild the passive regen won’t be as good as a warrior’s but still be there.

Warrior’s may be able to just facetank their way through trouble, but you are trying to place warrior’s alone against the class that is literally the jack of all trades. Ranger’s can fill all the roles, not the best for the job, no, but they can still do a lot more than a warrior.

This of course is all just theoretical and isn’t really related to the topic, but if you still disagree try and arrange something in spvp of warriors vs. rangers and see how well that ends for you

Sanduskel.1850:

Lol, rangers either have to bunker spec to survive my thief, and thus they can never kill me. If they spec dps, I can two shot them. Let’s not even discuss their laughably broken pets. ANET basically admitted that they cannot fix pets since pet moves are tied to the coding of all mob moves, lol.

While they cannot fix their pathing and melee hitting issues, they sure as heck could fix their WvW survivability. All they have to do is give them a massive AOE damage resistance buff and an always on minor regen buff while in a WvW zone. In WvW zone? Pet has da buffs. Not in WvW zone? Pet no has da buffs.

Because most people don’t know jack about most classes.
Same reason they only go for Warrior, Guardian, Necro and Mesmer.
They believe those are the best classes when they’re not necessarily.

For instance, Rangers can be pretty tough (mine has 3k2 armor), have access to low cooldown stability via signets, can do a great amount of CC (cripple, chill, immobilize notably), can run good condition builds, have a water field that sticks for a long time (great for blasting it) and also have pets which allow for more CC (cripple, fear, immobilize, chill, etc.).

It doesn’t help that most rangers run Zerker LB builds… With a little diversity and creativity, the ranger can be a very good class…

Covis.6037:

Ranger is bad, ranger pet sucks, ranger doesnt support, ranger cant damage, ranger cant control, ranger cant eat damage. Only good skill is water field which is your heal (bad, eles give it easier) and entangling roots (long cd, warrior does it with 10x less cd . ). You can always say “you just gotta learn to play ranger”, no its wrong. Ranger will never be viable for <5 man groups, unless they revamp the class and remove their pets and give more powers for the class itself.

Ok let’s see…
I’ll skip the “ranger is bad one”, so let’s start at ranger pet sucks.
Here are the conditions that can be applied by our pets:
Chill, Immobilize, Fear, Poison, Daze, Bleeding, Confusion, Vulnerability, Weakness.
Our pets can also grant:
Regen, Might, Fury, zone condition removal.
Obviously, they also do some dps, even if they die fast. You need to be aware of where your pet is going, you can also keep him by your side to grant buffs / conditions easily if you’re uneasy with it dying too fast. Pets can also heal btw.

Ok, let’s move on to the other points.
Ranger support. Several options here…first, there’s a trait that gives 150 precision to allies. We also have spirits that can grant buffs to people along with other effects (CC).
Warhorn grants swiftness/might/fury (and has a blast finisher). We have a fire field with torch (blasted => might).

Ranger damage. Let’s not talk about zerker build that would die too fast in wvw. Rangers can do good damage with other builds. First we have the trap/condition build. It’s a bit hard to play because of the lack of stability in the build (elite but long CD) but it does crapload of damage. Axe/Torch + Shortbow grants a lot of ways to apply bleeding, burning and poison.
Another good build is the GS/Axe axe signet build i’m using atm in wvw. You do a bit less damage but Maul does around 3k5 dmg when it crits so it’s pretty good still. And this build has very high survivability.
There are obviously many other builds that can do pretty good and consistent damage…the LB can be effective with eagle eye and piercing arrows.

Ranger cant control.
Ok let’s see…Entangle, muddy terrain, spike trap/frost trap. Along with the pets CC and the weapons CC…hmmmm i’m starting to ponder your ability to use logic here. The ranger might be one (if not THE) best class for cripple/chill/immobilizing the enemy. This makes us VERY effective at cutting tails or preventing zergs from entering towers/keeps.

Ranger cant eat damage.
Stability with signet of the wild (8s stability). Immune to attacks with signet of stone.
Block with GS #4. Evade with third hit of GS #3. More armor with signet of stone.
Regen with signet of the wild.
My ranger has only 20k hp but 3k2 armor and he survives just as well as a warrior most of the time.
You can blast/leap your own waterfield.
Imo rangers, while not the best at survivability, can be pretty good at taking damage.

Also, our waterfield is probably the best in the game. Of course we can’t put it down as much as ele but still, it stays there for a long time and can be blasted a lot.

So yeah…next time you want to criticize a class, learn to play it first.

Fenrir.6183:

Covis.6037:

Ranger is bad, ranger pet sucks, ranger doesnt support, ranger cant damage, ranger cant control, ranger cant eat damage. Only good skill is water field which is your heal (bad, eles give it easier) and entangling roots (long cd, warrior does it with 10x less cd . ). You can always say “you just gotta learn to play ranger”, no its wrong. Ranger will never be viable for <5 man groups, unless they revamp the class and remove their pets and give more powers for the class itself.

Ok let’s see…
I’ll skip the “ranger is bad one”, so let’s start at ranger pet sucks.
Here are the conditions that can be applied by our pets:
Chill, Immobilize, Fear, Poison, Daze, Bleeding, Confusion, Vulnerability, Weakness.
Our pets can also grant:
Regen, Might, Fury, zone condition removal.
Obviously, they also do some dps, even if they die fast. You need to be aware of where your pet is going, you can also keep him by your side to grant buffs / conditions easily if you’re uneasy with it dying too fast. Pets can also heal btw.

Ok, let’s move on to the other points.
Ranger support. Several options here…first, there’s a trait that gives 150 precision to allies. We also have spirits that can grant buffs to people along with other effects (CC).
Warhorn grants swiftness/might/fury (and has a blast finisher). We have a fire field with torch (blasted => might).

Ranger damage. Let’s not talk about zerker build that would die too fast in wvw. Rangers can do good damage with other builds. First we have the trap/condition build. It’s a bit hard to play because of the lack of stability in the build (elite but long CD) but it does crapload of damage. Axe/Torch + Shortbow grants a lot of ways to apply bleeding, burning and poison.
Another good build is the GS/Axe axe signet build i’m using atm in wvw. You do a bit less damage but Maul does around 3k5 dmg when it crits so it’s pretty good still. And this build has very high survivability.
There are obviously many other builds that can do pretty good and consistent damage…the LB can be effective with eagle eye and piercing arrows.

Ranger cant control.
Ok let’s see…Entangle, muddy terrain, spike trap/frost trap. Along with the pets CC and the weapons CC…hmmmm i’m starting to ponder your ability to use logic here. The ranger might be one (if not THE) best class for cripple/chill/immobilizing the enemy. This makes us VERY effective at cutting tails or preventing zergs from entering towers/keeps.

Ranger cant eat damage.
Stability with signet of the wild (8s stability). Immune to attacks with signet of stone.
Block with GS #4. Evade with third hit of GS #3. More armor with signet of stone.
Regen with signet of the wild.
My ranger has only 20k hp but 3k2 armor and he survives just as well as a warrior most of the time.
You can blast/leap your own waterfield.
Imo rangers, while not the best at survivability, can be pretty good at taking damage.

Also, our waterfield is probably the best in the game. Of course we can’t put it down as much as ele but still, it stays there for a long time and can be blasted a lot.

So yeah…next time you want to criticize a class, learn to play it first.

Please post a build that shows me what a ranger can do, why it is usefull and why any other class cant do that better. The spirits are useless the pets are useless and pretty much anything else i can think about what a ranger can do some other class will be able to do that better. Nothing personal its just a broken class.

SkylightMoon.1980:

In excess they are pretty annoying, but having 1 or 2 running with you can be extremely useful. They can cleave pretty heavily with the greatsword or keep up pulsing cripple with spike trap, muddy ground, or barrage. Not to mention the immobilize on entangle and muddy ground is probably the most annoying situation to be stuck at in game, since they pulse.

everyone just jelous cause rangers got pets

Hvaran.6327:

SkylightMoon.1980:

In excess they are pretty annoying, but having 1 or 2 running with you can be extremely useful. They can cleave pretty heavily with the greatsword or keep up pulsing cripple with spike trap, muddy ground, or barrage. Not to mention the immobilize on entangle and muddy ground is probably the most annoying situation to be stuck at in game, since they pulse.

everyone just jelous cause rangers got pets

Im not jealous. I got a mini Mr. Sparkles. Its as usefull as a ranger pet.

Fenrir.6183:

-snip-

What is this magical 30/30/30/30/30 ranger build, that can have 10 pets, 20 utilities and 5 different weapons?

Rangers are great for 1v1 through to 5v5, but their usefulness rapidly decreases in larger fights. Nearly everything in your post is about conditions, and conditions plain suck when facing 20 warriors blowing traited warhorns and 20 guardians with pure-of-voice shouts. Nevermind the fact that pets and spirits will melt within seconds.

So if you’re talking about roaming, then yeah, rangers are good. But I think this topic is more focused on 20+ guild groups, where rangers are definitely not good enough.

IMO the main problem with rangers is everything good about them, and everything useful they bring, is tied to their utility slots. Their weapon-skills are mostly useless. Their utility skills and traits actually compare pretty favourably with GWEN, the difference is GWEN also bring useful weapon and profession skills.

Umad.7528:

Please post a build that shows me what a ranger can do, why it is usefull and why any other class cant do that better. The spirits are useless the pets are useless and pretty much anything else i can think about what a ranger can do some other class will be able to do that better. Nothing personal its just a broken class.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fMAQNAR3XjEVJ2xVOWo2Bi1DCt/B1UwJLxUwfHdytaUL-jECBofERzEEwEIBK1sIaslhFRjVrETDjIq2cuIa1yAwsAA-w
Better immobilize / cripple / chill than other classes. Very resilient build and good damage while staying in the pain train. Ability to pull enemies with axe #4.
You can swap traits and use a LB with piercing arrows / 1500 range with the same build.

This is my current build, it’s very good in wvw but maybe you could enlighten me as to how the class is “broken” instead of trolling ?

Ragnar.4257:

Fenrir.6183:

-snip-

What is this magical 30/30/30/30/30 ranger build, that can have 10 pets, 20 utilities and 5 different weapons?

Rangers are great for 1v1 through to 5v5, but their usefulness rapidly decreases in larger fights. Nearly everything in your post is about conditions, and conditions plain suck when facing 20 warriors blowing traited warhorns and 20 guardians with pure-of-voice shouts. Nevermind the fact that pets and spirits will melt within seconds.

So if you’re talking about roaming, then yeah, rangers are good. But I think this topic is more focused on 20+ guild groups, where rangers are definitely not good enough.

Yep they are. Read my post again. They’re not guardians, they’re not warriors, they’re rangers. They require good mobility and can do a great amount of CC through skills AND pets. Check the build i just posted and come back again to discuss.