Guild Wars 2

Aaaaay, forum bug.

FogLeg.9354:

Swagger.1459:

PPK has to be an important thing, sorry. Everything else should be secondary.

To reduce whole WvW into PPK would be extremely silly. PPK is based on population, you could as well give up any scoring and simply reward most populated server with first place. It would be, in 1 word, boring.

PPK also assumes there is always enemy to fight. Have you considered situation where there is not? What will players do when they show up and they have nothing to do? They quit.

Whole PvE aspect of WvW is what makes possible to fight back when you have less players. It is what keeps the WvW interesting and unpredictable because winning or losing is not just about bringing more people and running over the enemy.

But Fog, PPT is generally also a matter of having the most population, so what’s the difference? Server with most coverage is guaranteed to win, because they will be capping everything while other servers are weaker in numbers. Example: my current match-up (Deso/Elona/Riverside). During primetime Desolation ticks for max 300, usually around 200-250. Then in the offhours 5am it ticks 600. That has everything to do with having more population at that time.

Proposed suggestion: debuff blobs – 10% – 20% – 30% speed debuff based on group size.
How to? Register number of players in an area around the commander.

I’ve been thinking about how PPK could be added more meaningfully to the score and how we allow for the very different number of kills at the top the league and the bottom.

Originally I thought we should have 50% of the points in any 24 hrs allocated to PPK and to have a running estimate of what that might mean at any point during the day – adding 1/(24*4) of the points to the “pool” each tick and adjusting points for each server based on the % of kills that server has made so far that day (NB: the score could go down, as well as up, in the evening, when primetime kills may significantly sway the percentage of kills over the day). I still think that might work. But then it occurred to me, if ANet want to give lagging servers something to fight for and potentially add some spice to a “final day” Saturday or even Sunday, PPK could be calculated over the whole week and only locked in at the end. If the matchup ended on Sunday the early part of the matchup would be quieter and there might still be everything to turn up and play for in the last 2 days as those days (and Friday evening) would be by far the busiest and contribute mostly to the overall number of kills and hence PPK score! All without messing around with ppt at the end of the week.

Sirendor.1394:

Proposed suggestion: debuff blobs – 10% – 20% – 30% speed debuff based on group size.
How to? Register number of players in an area around the commander.

I suggested something a couple of years ago. My logic was this:

There is something odd about WvW, vs real combat. In real combat, moving large armies around is hard they are slow and vulnerable to much more mobile small havok squads. They find it difficult to move through chokes – they don’t fit and they are a big target.

In WvW we turn this on its head – big groups have access to unlimited speed buffs, the cap on targets mitigates damage and they can move through the eye of a needle as easy as pie.

In the interest of breaking the zerg it seemed fair to me that a big group have some kind of debuff to somewhat offset, as in the real world, it’s otherwise overwhelming advantages.

I have to say though this was “not one of my more popular ideas!” In fact it was pretty much universally reviled as just being “not fun”(!) and I kinda get that. This is a game and sometimes what sounds realistic, or even fair, is not in the interest of playability. But it is an interesting thought!

I am all for QoL at this point, it will take some time still for the dust kicked up by the previous patch and the upcoming return of Alpine borderlands to settle. Let them collect data on these changes properly before they start mucking about with scoring or further population changes.

We have yet to experience Alpine with the guild upgrades too. I could see given a bit more time for my opinions about the current problems with the matches themselves to change. Which is why I voted for QoL, and hey cross map server chat absolutely sign me up right now.

I sort of hope there was an option for bit of both, so we could have the best from both categories.

Sirendor.1394:

But Fog, PPT is generally also a matter of having the most population, so what’s the difference? Server with most coverage is guaranteed to win, because they will be capping everything while other servers are weaker in numbers. Example: my current match-up (Deso/Elona/Riverside). During primetime Desolation ticks for max 300, usually around 200-250. Then in the offhours 5am it ticks 600. That has everything to do with having more population at that time.

Sure but consider options from one player point-of-view. Without PPT you are left with 2 options: go and fight enemy that is outnumbering you, so you die and enemy increases PPK. Or quit.

What PPT provides, is third option. While you may not be able to battle enemy face to face, you can still avoid them and take objectives somewhere else, increasing your server score. You can outsmart the enemy by not fighting them when you have no chance of winning. And you still help your server.

For a match result this may look like same thing (and yea, server with more people will and should win most matches), but for each player it is huge difference.

My reward is having fun and entertaining play. Being part of something bigger without feeling my actions are ruining it for a large portion of other players. Nor their actions, ruining mine.

I’ll like to see scoring improvments. I think that’s where the fun exists.

I can’t vote in that poll, it’s binary with about 8 things in each of the options? Come on, ridiculous.

You need to do some of the things in both of those choices. Quality of life is important, and so is scoring.

Both poll options are small enhancements and totally “who cares really”…

I have played and worked / tested some of the biggest titles out there for the last 15 years and I have never seen such confusion in the PvP/ WvW aspect of a game. This is solely my opinion of course. Focus on serious stuff please. There have been and still are some great pvp games out there to get ideas on creating a great pvp environment / mechanic. Who cares about nameplates and xp aura…………..? WvW or PvP should endorse people to get into a fight, not run from it.

Focus on things that will distinguish the game and make it special.

1. Decrease all the object clutter that exists in WvW. Much less vertical maps, less of everything (trees, monsters, mountains, random cube object etc). It adds ridiculous more lag and promotes running for your life when in fact it should promote people to actually fight. Practicality > Fashion

2. Introduce a pvp dungeon controlled by the server with most keeps captured. No need for special bosses in there, just add a few blinky blinky merchants with perhaps nice skins or materials only accessed there. This way you promote more keep taking and actually giving a purpose to it.

3. Introduce a small island map with very minimum clutter that soloers / small groups can go there and enjoy fighting each other. We dont want to run 1 hour to find action only to get killed or die and run again for another hour. It makes it boring and people simply prefer to do something faster.

4. PvP has dishonor buff already, why not in WvW? Introduce a negative buff for people that abuse factors such as teleport in an out of a keep door constantly to avoid death.

5. Add some REAL acknowledgement for people actually dedicating their game time doing pvp or wvw. In PvE you award someone by giving him better gear / master abilities / legendaries by dedicating time into that. Why not the same principle in WvW? Introduce something like WvW master abilities or pvp abilities acquired through fighting and killing other players. How does the game distinguish a player thats been killing 4 years with someone that just rolled yesterday? By allowing him to have feather wings backpack? Or perhaps by doing more dmg to keep npcs? More PvE flavor? Oh wait this is WvW…..

6. Decrease the size of keeps / towers / temples. How can a 5 man team or 2 man team even guard – protect a keep or a tower? Its impossible. Dont promote zerg fights. Promote all aspects to cater as many different playstyles as possible.

7. Waypoints. Current system is utter crap. Introduce something more interesting. We dont want to run for an hour if we get killed to get back in action again. Make it more appealing.
Example: Your world controls 3 keeps? get 1 waypoint. 6 keeps? 2 waypoints. 9 keeps? 3 waypoints. If our world is doing the best it can and conquering the WvW map why not get rewarded for it? Who cares about crafting bonuses, gathering bonuses and all that. This is WvW. We want WvW related things.

8. Introduce kill spam. When someone dies its nice to see where roughly he died. Its rewarding for someone to see his achievement over on public chat and also understand where the fight is happening. Seeing swords is just too vague and not helping at all.
Some food for thought.
Voted: No preference.

For the love of the everything and anything, please… please build templates. The most impacting single QoL change not just for WvW but for the entire game would be build templates.

Swagger.1459:

This is why pvp in this game will never grow… I’m not sure where the disconnect happened with gamers, but the core and spirit of pvp zones is players fighting other players… This is a 101 concept.

Again, WvW is not PvP. WvW is… WvW, which includes various types of gameplay, to include PvP, but WvW is not only PvP. The disconnect is the folks thinking WvW is supposed to be purely PvP.

Swagger.1459:

PPK has to be an important thing, sorry. Everything else should be secondary.

All facets of WvW—PPT and PPK, for instance—are important. No one aspect of WvW should be “secondary”.

All facets of gameplay in WvW are valid and are there to work together, and none should be disregarded—collectively, they are what makes WvW.

FogLeg.9354:

Sirendor.1394:

But Fog, PPT is generally also a matter of having the most population, so what’s the difference? Server with most coverage is guaranteed to win, because they will be capping everything while other servers are weaker in numbers. Example: my current match-up (Deso/Elona/Riverside). During primetime Desolation ticks for max 300, usually around 200-250. Then in the offhours 5am it ticks 600. That has everything to do with having more population at that time.

Sure but consider options from one player point-of-view. Without PPT you are left with 2 options: go and fight enemy that is outnumbering you, so you die and enemy increases PPK. Or quit.

What PPT provides, is third option. While you may not be able to battle enemy face to face, you can still avoid them and take objectives somewhere else, increasing your server score. You can outsmart the enemy by not fighting them when you have no chance of winning. And you still help your server.

For a match result this may look like same thing (and yea, server with more people will and should win most matches), but for each player it is huge difference.

Of course I agree with you that PPT has some merit in trying to encourage strategy. And I think PPK and PPT both have a place in WvW, but maybe we need to see some changes to the way PPT works. In general I am not really in favor of the current ‘coverage wars’.

How to change how PPT works?

• The current situation looks like this: passive ticks over time that generate ‘points’ over time no matter if there are players contesting camps/towers/keeps.
• What to change: generate points based on activity!
  - There needs to be more rewards for successfully defending objectives
  - There also should be more points awarded for capturing a defended tower/keep
  - I don’t think we need to do away altogether with the passive mechanic of holding objectives to generate points for them… however they should be supplemented.
  - And the points awarded should scale somehow with the amount of people on the map per side. For example; defending a tower with 5 against 20 – defending a tower with 20 against 20?

It makes sense that a bigger group wins against a smaller one, and that’s okay because if 5 people win against 20 equally skilled players that would just be broken. However, there could be some mechanical work done to split up zergs.

An idea I have is “structural integrity”. For example: if you hit a keep at one gate only, that should be less effective than hitting it at 3 sides at the same time. However currently it isn’t. Maybe they could add something to keeps that makes defending easier when the attackers do not spread out.

lil devils x.6071:

If you focus scoring on PPK instead of PPT and stop rewarding PvE, PvD kill NPC get rewarded system and instead make it so the score is more based on PPK while fighting over objectives you solve numerous problems at once rather than make more.

- Problem with PPK scoring is that is encourages zerging even more than currently. Stand with big enough zerg and you’re practically invulnerable. I’m all for more fights, but scoring is the wrong way to do it.

The biggest problem with WvW at the moment is lack of information. We need to know where our side players are playing and we need to have more means to track enemy movement also. False positive sword signals need to be corrected and scouting rewarded. This requires automatic detection system similar to what sentries have currently.

I’ve seen it a couple of times now that big zerg has ported to enemy borderlands, ran straight to their tier 3 garrison and captured it before the enemy could even know what’s happening, how big the threat was and where they could get reinforcements to defend. Information is a good tool to level the asymmetric playing field and even better when players are involved in gathering this intelligence.

QoL change – Remove the Crafting Tables from Borders so those cheap PvE players eager to not waste 1s stop using the WvW as free bank/free crafting TELEPORT.

Every WvW player enters wvw already stocked on crafted consumables so those are not needed and serve as QUEUE creating tool – specially now that we have World Linking.

Thank you.

Need to do a better job of evening out the player numbers. T1 and T3 are dominated by BG and FA who have an overwhelming numbers advantage.

If numbers are extremely uneven the undermanned side just stops logging in. Which makes the situation worse and creates a vicious downward spiral.

This has been the main problem with WvW from the beginning. Combining servers like the last reset is a good solution, but it was very poorly implemented and created even worse disparities in populations.

Not sure where we are and going with World linking but here are my top two.

1: We need home world server chat or a home world location.
2: Scoring- PPT value should increase for T3 structures held and defended. Lower the capture value unless the structure is T3 value. Increase the value of PPK on initial kills and set the limit to say 30 minutes before PPK is awarded again since last kill.

Sirendor.1394:

Of course I agree with you that PPT has some merit in trying to encourage strategy. And I think PPK and PPT both have a place in WvW, but maybe we need to see some changes to the way PPT works. In general I am not really in favor of the current ‘coverage wars’.

Absolutely agree. I have posted many times about changes in scoring, how and for what points could be awarded. And I think we will see some changes in the future anyway

This discussion started from the comment that PPK is all that matters (probably not even posted by you).

I voted for scoring changes but nothing in the list sound good.

1) I have read the papers on Glicko. It is a system intended for rating individual against each other. It makes the assumption that a player doesn’t change in skill quickly.

This is not true in WvW. At the levels Dragonbrand has played we see 4-5 whole guild moving from world to world weekly. Guilds will move during matches. Population and skill can fluctuate massively during the week. So having a Glicko term for past performance is bogus. The constant c should probably be tied to population but that isn’t constant during the matches.

2) I’ve setup my own private site to pull average points per tick via API. Last week TC had 680, DB 420. That shows the match was being determined by blob combat. You can’t score 680 on PPT. TC’s was usually under 280 on the non kill tick. So all you people that think there is not enough influence from PVP action – wrong. 100 DB’ers getting killed every 15m all day adds up.

3) WvW players can be divided into (a) giant PvP battle lovers, (b) strategic conquest lovers [Havoc] and © those that like both. A and B are unhappy. WvW is not fully wonderful for either. Is there is a solution to this division? The players have solved it (in past) by moving to top tiers for bigger blobs. Maybe ANET should set up a massive blobs PvP league – like Guild v Guild. Of course, blob guilds would want 1000 member guilds then. Basically, the A and B types drift apart – mostly B’s will stop playing.

Definitely QoL.

~ Kovu

I voted for scoring issues.
Scoring directly effects the server-rating and so the matchups.
A fair and challenging matchup is more fun to play than a having some nice graphics i dont see cause i am not playing WvW caused by facing no enemy or masses of players i cant fight with only a bunch of teammates.

So first fix the Balance then the Style/Display/Comfort/… .
(cross-map chat is overrated. You have Teamspeak )

gloflop.3510:

Both projects in the survey sound nice. However, I have some doubts that they actually work as planned. E.g. nightcapping leads to the question what a fair distribution between day and night is. I mean, if a world captures a tower at 3 am, is it actually worth less than a tower at 3 pm? What shall we say to the players who work hard at 3 am to capture the tower? “Thank you for your effort. However, what you have done was unimportant”?“You dont have to go to WvW at night. It doesnt matter anyway”?

It is similar with the area control. It sounds really nice on the paper. However, I have some doubts that it works as nice in reality as on the paper… I wish arena-net all the best.

I want to chime in here and say I totally agree with what gloflop is saying. Is anyone who is not on during one of the 3 major prime time worth less? If I fight just as hard at 2am vs someone at 6pm is my time and dedication worth less? One thing to keep in mind that wvw is a 24hr thing and as such respect needs to be show equally throughout that 24 hr period. Certainly hope we don’t lean to far one way and devalue off hour players enough that they no longer wish to play.

What’s the score now?

scoring changes are all nice and fine but it’s kinda pointless if there is nothing behind winning a match other then winning itself. so, i would suggest some kind of" WvW weekly" that rewards individual players, that have enough participation, based on the servers placement. it doesn’t need to be a huge reward but just something to give wining a “meaning”. i mean somewhat like the WvW tournament a while back, just automated and recurring on a weekly bases.

Btw, is the population balancing finalised to begin with? The “linking” solution is rather amateur. Then jumping onto something else which is relative to the population balancing is unwise.

I have very little time to play, so I spend it playing and not posting, but one of my guildies mentioned the WvW poll and it was important enough to me to take the time to provide some input. Just my opinion, but one of the biggest challenges seems to be that many players get discouraged when the sides are lopsided. I cant count the number of times I have seen a fairly “balanced” time in WvW ended when an entire “map blob” shows up and just runs over everyone. When that happens many of the players just drop off and go do something else. What we need are ways to keep people engaged in the fight. No one likes to constantly get wiped over and over or feel like there is no way to compete.

I am sure there are a lot of players much smarter than I that can come up with good ideas, but since I dont like to bring up a topic without trying to help resolve the problem I will put my lame ideas out there for everyone to throw stones at. Hopefully this spurs some good thoughts and discussion.

1) Scoring absolutely needs to change. In the “off hours” one side can rack up a lot of points. For example, last night when I left WVW our score was close (~1K difference) between two servers (fun fights and a cahllenges that kept us engaged including several guidl members staying way later that expected to help keep the score close). The problem is when I logged in this morning (~7 hours later) the score was a 23K difference. As a result, the losing side just gives up and doesn’t bother trying to play because they don’t see a way to complete. The most fun I have had in WvW is when the scores are close and the teams are battling it out to trying to pull ahead. Once the score goes lopsided, the fights end and so does participation. I have heard lots of good suggestions on score balancing but here are a few more:

1a) We need to encourage players to join in when they are behind. Give more points, exp, rewards when the losing side takes an objective. The further behind they are the better the reward for that server.

1b) I am not sure PPK is really a solution. I can see how PPK can leading to farming (e.g., blob just keeps wiping smaller groups to get the “bags”). In fact this type of behavior can make the score differential even worse. After all, the side that is losing usually has less players and therefore is more likely to lose a fight against the blob. It encourages more “blobbing” because it increases the chance of winning a fight. Thus the blobbing gets worse and the score differential gets worse and even less people come and play for the losing side. This is the opposite of what we want.

1c) Give diminishing returns when an objective constantly flips. This may help reduce the constant “flipping” of a single objective (e.g., the “karma train”).

1d) Give more rewards the longer the fight lasts in taking an objective. Players should be rewarded for the persistence in taking an objective. This of course should only occur if there is a fight ongoing (e.g., I should not be able to kill the NPCs and just sit there to get a better reward, but I should get a better reward for staying in the fight).

1e) If the defender has even numbers, the team capturing the objective should get even better rewards because they really had to fight to get the capture.

2) We need to penalize the single large “blob”.

2a) Siege is not really effective against the blob. I cant count the number of times we have had an AC or two up and they amounted to nothing. Because of the number of players in the concentrated area, the seige damage doesn’t really do much because the damage is spread out. Maybe the seige damage should scale with the number of enemy players in the immediate area to make it more effective against the blob and force people to spread out more and not rely on staying safe because they have a lot of friends in the area.

2b) How many times have you seen a map blob show up and turn the whole BL one color in a very short time? This gives one side a fairly large “PPT” that is solely based on the fact that they can flip things fast. Rewards should diminish the more objectives get flipped in a short amount of time. At the same time the amount of points for “holding” an objective needs to be adjusted.

3) PIN/Commander watching. Many of our commanders no longer want to tag up because of enemy scouts on the server. This is a very difficult problem to solve. One suggestion is to only make commander pins visible to the available to the squad. This way the person scouting for the enemy needs to be in the squad. This approach will prevent the person from joining the BL to spy since if they sit at spawn the commander can just kick them from squad (i.e., it would force the spy to actively follow the commander). At the same time we need a way for players to know there is a commander on the map so they can figure out who to follow. Thus we need something like looking for group that enables people to see that a commander is on the BL, but without figuring out exactly where the commander is on the map. of course this does not prevent a spy from joinging the squad and following the commander around and reporting the commanders location, but it would reduce people who “dual box” on different accounts and use one account to spy.

I am sure there are lots of issues with these suggestions. They will need careful thought and input from others to see what may be viable and what is not.

I am encouraged that Anet recognizes that WvW needs some work and is willing to do something to help fix it.

Gilgax

Bring back the old maps

I wonder if you could do a combination of the two lists of ideas.

The ones that I liked from the poll (Revised List):

- Add cross-map team chat.
- Add a display effect for Righteous Indignation on map markers.
- Add floating indicators when gaining points toward war score.
- Add a WXP-gain sparkle trail.
- Add a territory-control map overlay.
- Adjust score for capturing objectives.
- Rebalance the score awarded for activities that don’t reward points per tick.
- Take suggestions from the community! (Obviously)

The ones that I didn’t like from the poll (Not So Important):

- Add an option for reduced nameplate clutter.
- Add objective-summary tool tips.
- Reduce the impact of night capping.
- Lessen the gap between winning scores and losing scores so losing teams can still recover.
- Adjust objective score relative to upgrade level.

As an avid WvWer, I find that this revised list is better suited to what’s important to make WvW even greater. I tried to be as concise as possible in my preferences, just my 2 cents.

Thanks Anet

I don’t care about the score. The Germans can nightcap all they want for all I care. I’m not here to fight them then, so what do I care.

I am only interested in fights, and all these QoL changes mean very little when the class balance is a joke.

Run in a zombie horde of HoT elites, collect reward track. That’s what this game has been reduced to. It’s a blame equally shared by the developers for completely dropping the ball on balancing, and the community for turning it into Queensdale 2.0.

But sure, fix tooltip typos.

Bjyoric Orcstone.1728:

2) I’ve setup my own private site to pull average points per tick via API. Last week TC had 680, DB 420. That shows the match was being determined by blob combat. You can’t score 680 on PPT. TC’s was usually under 280 on the non kill tick. So all you people that think there is not enough influence from PVP action – wrong. 100 DB’ers getting killed every 15m all day adds up.

Is this a total match points/total ticks? Just curious, because PPD (Points Per Dolly) has a major impact to overall score (a while ago someone noted it was ~30% of final score) yet its not seen in the PPT count.

It’s part of the reason why runaway points can go to extremes at max PPT – the more keeps/towers and camps you have, the more your server points rise expontentially because not only do you get PPT, your dollys from those camps going to the keeps/towers literally poop out score by the thousands.

Chaba.5410:

Can you guys just throw in cross-map team chat with the scoring changes? Please?

this would be nice

QoL changes sound nice, but the one really broken thing from day 1 (ok, with the exception of the rampant culling we used to have) has been the scoring system.

Thank you for listening to the community and getting community feed back. But literally everything you guys want to implement will still only help the blobby servers. Maybe find ways to minimize or discourage groups of more than 20-25.
And maybe skill balance should be the major thing worked on. Seriously, when a non glassy scrapper can take out a player wearing the pvt armor and stuff in 3 hits there is something majorly wrong there. You essentially made this game p2w with having the elites overpowered compared to the non elite specs. Skill balance is one of the major reasons why you are losing players in hordes to other games. Maybe that should be the priority.

Luna.9640:

QoL change – Remove the Crafting Tables from Borders so those cheap PvE players eager to not waste 1s stop using the WvW as free bank/free crafting TELEPORT.

Every WvW player enters wvw already stocked on crafted consumables so those are not needed and serve as QUEUE creating tool – specially now that we have World Linking.

Thank you.

Get rid of the crafting tables, sure. But please dont get rid of the bank or the trading post! There are so many times we use those items because we are either changing our builds around last minute based on core comp of group, or we are changing up our food, ran out of catas/rams/ac, etc.

Thanks for the poll Anet. Nice to see you’re listening and asking. I look forward to more polls in the future.

I chose the scoring option. As a small team ops and roaming commander that focuses on strategy and efficiency, I would like to see such scoring changes reward strategy over brute force or imbalanced coverage.

The thing about scoring in WvW is that it comes from multiple sources. That’s part and parcel of the overall strategic of the game mode. Always has been. Always should be. Those sources of score should have different weights and values depending on the situation — such as the suggestion that upgraded objectives give more points when controlled.

There are enough different play styles in WvW that any scoring improvements must take into account that those wishing to play in their preferred style — or any style for that matter — all see that their actions positively and powerfully contribute to the overall team’s success. And that no one play style — ppk, ppt, blobbing, zerg-busting, roaming, scouting, defending, etc — is any more or less effective than the other. Every play style is valid in WvW and every play style should be able to make an impact, not get stonewalled/steamrolled by another style and be rewarded, both on a team and individual player level.

On a small QoL but oh so important tangent..PLEASE give us an option to run a tagless squad, so that commanders have access to all the great squad features — like organizing sub groups, setting participation sharing, having lieutenants, checking supply, etc etc — without having to tag up temporarily, drop group and get invited back, subsequently losing the squad powers. This is SUPER essential for small team roaming groups, closed guild groups or other groups that don’t want random followers tagging along simply because they see a tag on the map. Thanks

Reduce the in-combat delay on healing, so us healers can do our jobs.

DippyDragon.3180:

Reduce the in-combat delay on healing, so us healers can do our jobs.

What delay? Anet cant make slow people blast waterfields any faster. Its not like they can make your 1000hp/s passive AoE tick faster than once a second either. I dont get it.

msalakka.4653:

I don’t care about the score. The Germans can nightcap all they want for all I care. I’m not here to fight them then, so what do I care.

I am only interested in fights, and all these QoL changes mean very little when the class balance is a joke.

Run in a zombie horde of HoT elites, collect reward track. That’s what this game has been reduced to. It’s a blame equally shared by the developers for completely dropping the ball on balancing, and the community for turning it into Queensdale 2.0.

But sure, fix tooltip typos.

So much this. The two options in the poll are utterly meaningless until more balance changes come to WvW so the actual minute-minute gameplay is as fun as it used to be. You can still whack players for 15K using Coalescence of Ruin – a ground targeted, 3 impact, 5 target, 1200 range skill on a 4 second CD with an energy cost of just 5. This skill just needs to be redesigned completely. Then there’s Spear of Justice that still provides a nigh on uncounterable 1200 range pull to your death. Needs far more opportunity for players to react (think magnet pull and Into the Void). How about the utterly broken boon stacking potential? Was it intended that a group can easily stack 25-30 seconds of resistance? It’s funny to do, but really it’s not good for the game.

Changes to stability, max field CC limits, Hunter’s Ward, True Shot and Gun Flame have reduced the dominance of ranged attacks, but there are still so many skills and traits that need to be addressed as soon as possible for any sort of normality to be restored.

Brown Fang Thump.9482:

What I’d like most in WvW are rewards scaled to opposition faced. For example, if a solo player engages 3 enemies and wins, that player’s loot should be greater than that of one of the 3 enemies if they win.

I think a single player who can capturer a map objective such as a camp or tower should be rewarded more than a player who is simply following a zerg of 30+ players who can’t help but win against undefended objectives. This kind of reward system would encourage players to approach the territory capture aspect of the game with more strategy without completely ruining the zerg experience for those who enjoy that sort of thing.

As an aside, I love that this type of feedback is being used to improve the game. Of course, I think the poll should be in the game (as they were during beta), where the maximum number of players can vote. There is a large population of players who don’t watch the forums; but, are interested in helping improve the game.

Sounds good. I hate zerg-surfing, but my WvW rank reflects it all too clearly. Having about one third the rank of a player who only plays WvW when their is a zerg to run with.

An in-game feedback system seems like one of those “too good to be true” type ideas. No matter how nice it would be, it simply won’t happen. Although, I do wish for it.

I like both the ideas and I hope they both receive attention eventually. However, I’m not sure if some of the Scoring Improvements will be implemented properly. When you say “night capping” does this take into account your time zone or the servers time zone when you capture something? I’d assume it’s the server time zone or perhaps even server peak time? So then will this discourage, for example Asia/EU time zone players from playing on US heavy servers? Is that a good thing? If those players are drawn away from those servers, then night capping will ultimately become more of an objective even if it is weakened.

I wonder if perhaps adjusting the WvW ticks based on the overall WvW population would work though. For example if the map allows 80 players per team (idk the real number), that would make for a max of 960 players across 4 maps. At that level, all objectives would tick at 100% their normal tick. A tower would tick 10 points, for example. If the total population dropped to, say 50%, a tower might give 8 points. If the total population dropped further to 25%, a tower might give 6 points. Of course, these numbers are rough, as is the idea. This way, though, it doesn’t matter what time of day it is. As long as you have people to attack/defend objectives, the objectives would be more worth having.

Kitiara.2706:

Luna.9640:

QoL change – Remove the Crafting Tables from Borders so those cheap PvE players eager to not waste 1s stop using the WvW as free bank/free crafting TELEPORT.

Every WvW player enters wvw already stocked on crafted consumables so those are not needed and serve as QUEUE creating tool – specially now that we have World Linking.

Thank you.

Get rid of the crafting tables, sure. But please dont get rid of the bank or the trading post! There are so many times we use those items because we are either changing our builds around last minute based on core comp of group, or we are changing up our food, ran out of catas/rams/ac, etc.

The crafting tables are there so WvW players have somewhere to craft without leaving for PvE. They’re also more conveniently spaced so it’s not such a faff getting the pieces together.

They don’t have any impact on queues, because like everyone else, crafters get locked out, and people who only use WvW for crafting aren’t going to be in there for hours at a time.

Plus the borderlands have never been as popular to begin with. Might see a blip when Alpine comes back, but that will lose interest even faster.

“Reduce the impact of Night Capping”

Please do not do this, you have already made WvW easy enough. It’s not fair for people in different time zones. I mean common guys! If this happens then I know myself and most people on our server will quit WvW.

WvW should not be Super Adventure Box INFANTILE MODE.

Until you achieve balance by fielding three equal-size teams, so that skill matters, WvW will be fundamentally flawed. All other ‘features’ are mere distractions from this failure.

You should do something to divide the blob as much as possible without penalize it. you simply have to add more stuff to do for them so they will have to split. Here some ideas that could help the WvW experience and divide the Zerg

Add PVE element
Boss like the sandstorm giant… that give something ( reward track bonus for 15 minute for the server, or some point but wait, don’t give it right away. Let’s say you kill a boss it drop something on the ground and you need to click it and run back to your home starting point ( No tp allowed) and Why Giant, because there is not enough in the game and they are nice to fight and can destroy a zombie blob.

More event that need people to run back to get bonus more you divide the blob.

Dynamite at border spawn point
The dynamite can be brought if (add requirement of your choice). The dynamite can explode a wall one shot, 2 shot if fully upgrade maybe… You cannot use any skill while transporting it. If you are kill with it, it explode and do enough damage to kill any ally and only ally. (no good with a lot of people to protect it) So it help to take stuff near your border spawn point but it’s really hard to go in enemy territory with it.

Return of the orb
The orb was a great idea but not how it was working, but now with the reward track it could really work. The orb should despawn every hours and give a reward track bonus for each keep that have it. People will want to defend more. When you have the orb you are like a beacon in the map. A big source of light so enemy can see you miles aways.

Be the Dolyak
You can take some upgrading supply at a camp and go to a tower, keep or castle with it. While transporting you cannot run or attack. it’s too heavy.

Add some bounty like the guild mission.
Call them traitor or spy. When you capture a traitor, he give some wvw token or he can be use to sabotage there respective keep or tower…

Escort
You can escort a npc to a tower or keep and that npc will help to defend with the keeper. Maybe it can help night capping.

The 3 heads boss
Like the wurm, you need to kill the boss in the same time but there is a head in every Keep. It only spwan in the keep and when you have the 3 keep.
or
The hidden Dungeon
When you have the 3 keep you have acces to a hidden small dungeon. That dungeon there is a sleeping wywern and you can kill it for loot and chest it you kill it under 20 minutes. If the map is EB it give you a secret acces under the castle so you can invade the castle from inside.

Blasting Arrow cart or arrow
that is specially designed to kill faster blob. It slow every enemy without cap and every time it touch someone it make a blast small aoe.
Ice arrow cart or arrow slow peoples and give chill on explosion. Maybe it could only be acquired with wvw mastery.

Dont’ die!
For each 15 minute you are alive you get 2% more HP and Toughness up to 10%.

Help low pop and imbalanced realm
Buff HP and toughness for realms behind in scoring by 25 000 point.it give the opportunity to the losing realm to get better at playing Wvw to and get back in the game.

Why not buffing DPS? because nobody like to be one shot by a buffed realm… It’s not fun…

Daily reward and weekly reward for participation.

All those thing could give new aspect to the WvW, creating more small skirmish fight, ganking some people trying to kill a giant or escorting, so helping to get a healthy WVW and solve some problem in the imbalance by dividing the zerg and giving the losing team a chance to come back in the game.

That it for now.
PS: sorry for my english isn’t my first language.

LOL @Ghaste.2419 we dont want PvE in WvW!

Anet already tried adding a big PvE event in WvW, it lagged the kitten out of the map!

The Ventari Ele.5812:

LOL @Ghaste.2419 we dont want PvE in WvW!

Anet already tried adding a big PvE event in WvW, it lagged the kitten out of the map!

Good point, I understand your fear,but it don’t need to be BIG event. Well in fact, I didn’t write BIG event. As you already know, every objective in wvw are a mix of pve and pvp conquest. Dynamic event or scaling event produce lag in the past, just don’t do those. They add some beast at some choke point, it kinda work but thoses beasts don’t give enough to stimulate players to hunt them like the grub in EB or the wurms in AB. These are already in the game but don’t contribute enough to the war effort or aren’t enough rewarding to make people stop and kill them, maybe they have to much hp too. So the boss I write about earlier they don’t need to be BIG event, in fact it would work better if they were just small wandering boss killable by 5 to 15 peoples and not a zerg cause if it need a zerg to kill it you don’t solve the problem, you add to it .So no BIG event. You need stuff like sentry to stop and split a zerg.

So adding more objective(PVE) work in the past. Just look at sentry. Nearly every time a zerg pass near a sentry 5 to 20 peoples stop, kill it and wait there to turn the objective while the zerg keep is way to the larger objective. I’m a roamer, and with other roamers we always waiting for thoses people to make that mistake and kill them. So it work already, it just need more of those to split the zerg. More small fight = more healthy wvw.

My idea aren’t 100% PVE either. This game mode is about strategy and conquest. Huge zerg is not healthy for the game but it will happen anyway, you just need to make them less effective by adding more objective, so they need to split. And there is the imbalance problem, when bigger server face a lower pop server, the fight isn’t challenging. And it’s bad for everyone, less fun and less fight.

So yeah, more objective(pve element and conquest) will result in more strategic fight and less zerg, proven in the past already.

again sorry for my english.

I don’t see population fix on that poll.. Couldn’t balance 8 tiers and you sure can’t balance 4 tiers

Voted for scoring changes however I’d also like to see Commander tags to appear in front of character names again. Having the nameplates cover the commander tag can sometimes be hard to follow for newcomers in WvW.

briggah.7910:

I don’t see population fix on that poll.. Couldn’t balance 8 tiers and you sure can’t balance 4 tiers

What do you think this beta is for?

If you really want, they could just fix all of this tomorrow by going 3 sided eotm megaserver style right?

We could even have tournaments on 8 hour timed matches too and run them biweekly or something… This way we won’t have to worry about scoring issues between prime and off hour ppt…

I think scoring should be more of a concern. More so if you want to keep your NA players happy and not feeling like their massive work is completely negated by a few in their native servers off-peak hours.

main thing for me is that WVW should be more about fighting groups of players rather than cycling through maps taking empty keeps. boring!

i also hate the term nightcapping. it implies some players’ time/contributions are less than others, yet we all pay the same amount. scoring should reflect achievement-to-player-number ratio, that is all. scaling score by a simple moving average of (current WVW pop / active WVW pop) for example.